Tuesday, 2014-12-02

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chriadamJuuba: SK_work: it can be due to a variety of reasons (eg, xmpp connection failing due to lost network connectivity, Google server-side fault in the way it handles token refreshing, etc) which will automatically correct itself.  We need to detect the case that it automatically corrects, and unflag the account as needing sign-in.01:11
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sj_mackenzieI want to get the SailFish SDK running on NixOS, this means I need to create a Nix package. Where are the sources for the SDK? Ta05:23
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stephgmorning guys07:17
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suysj_mackenzie: https://github.com/sailfish-sdk  good luck packaging that. Seems a huge amount of work for little gain, IMHO07:20
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sj_mackenzie*jam hits the ground*07:20
sj_mackenzie*jaw07:21
salyavinMaybe run linux vm then SDK in that.  vm in vm07:22
sj_mackenziethis is a better approach indeed07:22
sj_mackenziebtw neat project - really like the direction of sailfish07:23
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suyWhy? Isn't the point of distributing a VM as build environment the whole idea of not needing a VM for *everything*? I mean, the SDK should work fine on windows with the work jolla has done on the installer07:23
suywhy a vm inside a vm?07:24
sj_mackenzieNixOS is .... special07:24
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sj_mackenzieit changes the RPATH of every single application.07:24
sj_mackenziehmmm I suppose I could create a nix-shell around it.07:25
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sj_mackenziethat'll work best I think.07:25
sj_mackenziethat makes bash and any other dependencies available07:25
suysj_mackenzie: So, the SDK installer doesn't work at all on NixOS?07:26
sj_mackenzienope.07:26
sj_mackenziebut this is normal unless you create an environment for a package then nothing works not even bash.07:27
sj_mackenziein other words the only thing in /bin is sh and that's it.07:27
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sj_mackenzieso the Nix way would be to create a package for the sdk and not rely on the installer supplied with sailfish07:28
sj_mackenzieone could create an environment similar to the way a nix chap created for steam.07:29
salyavinhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nix_package_manager  Nix depends upon having its own directory structure for installing the packages. All packages are installed in sub-directories of the nix directory. In naming the folders, different versions of a package are identified by prepending the hash to the package name.07:29
salyavinhttp://nixos.org/nixos/about.html07:30
suySo, you just can't execute a random binary fetched from the internet?07:30
sj_mackenziewell you need to create a small script which isn't hard to do.07:31
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sj_mackenziebut essentially yes07:31
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sj_mackenzieto be honest I've never looked back after moving to Nix07:31
salyavinWhat's the biggest advantage for you?  Being able to boot previous configurations?07:32
suyOnce the installer has done its thing, you'll end up with some executables around. YOu maybe need to create such environment for both the installer and the executables left after it installed.07:32
sj_mackenziesalyavin: okay, biggest advantage is configuring the entire system with one configuration file that  can easily be put under scm.07:34
salyavinHe's in an environment that protects from bad installs and upgrades07:34
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sj_mackenziesalyavin: essentially yes07:34
sj_mackenziealso, every package goes through hydra.nixos.org07:35
sj_mackenzieIt can be limiting to be honest, but it's powerful once you learn the nix way.07:35
salyavinIf you do try to install it remember SDK depends on VirtualBOX07:35
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sj_mackenzieI'll take a look at it. It seems Sailfish is the only real OS that gives me a 'raw' linux on my phone.07:38
salyavinThat actualy ships on a device at the moment I guess so.07:38
salyavinThere's also Ubuntu touch07:38
stephgwell there's always ubuntu *badoomtish*07:38
stephg;)07:38
sj_mackenziehmm too much bloat07:38
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salyavinUbuntu doesn't ship preinstalled on a product just yet07:38
sj_mackenzieyeah I'm looking at buying a jolla07:39
sj_mackenzie(available here in Hong Kong actually)07:39
sj_mackenziebut I heard SailFish on Nexus is good too)07:39
sj_mackenzienot actually sure about what is the best phone to run it on.07:39
salyavinhttps://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Adaptations/libhybris07:40
salyavinTake a look at that link to get an idea of hardware compatability.07:40
sj_mackenzieoh that's really neat! Thanks!07:40
salyavinInstructions https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Adaptations/libhybris/Install_SailfishOS_for_hammerhead07:41
Jonniit runs pretty nicely on n507:42
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salyavinNo camera yet as far as I know.07:42
salyavindepends on what you what your phone to do right now07:43
stephgcamera kinda works on the n4, but as to which it's best to run, well that depends what you want to do07:43
stephg(and whether you have one of the compatible devices already, or a device that you're willing to port to)07:44
salyavinlibhybris is also used by Ubuntu Touch as I understand07:44
stephg(and if you need android support, then it's a no-brainer)07:44
stephgyep07:44
salyavinif you need Android support you should buy a Jolla to get alien dalvik07:44
salyavinYou can get things like a keyboard "The other half" as well07:45
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salyavinMaybe sj?mackenzie will make a phone version of NixOS07:55
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sj_mackenziesalyavin: that would be _ideal_07:56
sj_mackenzieyeah the galaxy nexus looks relatively good actually07:57
locusfyeah galaxy nexus is the cheapest + most compatible07:57
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salyavin5 image is linked right from https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Adaptations/libhybris/Install_SailfishOS_for_hammerhead07:58
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sj_mackenziehas anyone tried sailfish on the nexus 9?08:04
sj_mackenziehttp://www.amazon.com/HTC-Nexus-Tablet-8-9-Inch-Black/dp/B00M6UC5B408:04
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locusfwe're not that rich yet us porters :p08:15
locusfand we don't yet have hybris-12.008:16
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locusfas is cyanogenmod 1208:16
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zGrrmoin :)08:20
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sj_mackenzielocusf: :) no worries hehe08:41
locusfnexus 6 would be great too08:42
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gogetamoo09:06
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SK_workgogeta: moo09:06
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daithefluhi !09:14
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aironeoushey sledges you asked me on Sunday if Linux Action Show mentioned Jolla tablet again in their Sunday show. The show is up now and yes they did. They also interviewed Mark Shuttleworth at the 42.30 mark so why can't we Get Marc on there11:01
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aironeoushere is the link to the show on youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9qeQ7o33GE11:01
aironeousI am watching the interview now, when I get to the part where they mention the Jolla tablet I give you the time link to that11:02
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aironeoussleges: you there?11:02
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aironeousalso when the Jolla tablet launched they had a show labeled holla for Jolla here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYXMtZusg-o11:04
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sledgesaironeous: much thanks for this info, great!11:10
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aironeousgood interview with Shuttleworth about systemd and mir11:16
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RavenholmDXwhat's a good unit test framework for Sailfish/Qt/JS?11:21
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SK_workRavenholmDX: I use qttest for C++ side11:29
SK_workfor sailfish it helps a lot11:29
SK_workfor JS side, no luck11:29
SK_workthere are nice js test frameworks11:29
SK_workthere is even a test module for QML11:29
SK_workaironeous: source ?11:29
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aironeousSK_work: link is above ^11:30
aironeoushere it is again11:30
SK_workgot it11:31
SK_workthanks11:31
SK_workdidn't read backlog11:31
aironeoushttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9qeQ7o33GE skip to 42 and a half minutes start of Mark Shuttleworth interview11:31
aironeousshow titled holla for Jolla is https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYXMtZusg-o11:32
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RavenholmDXSK_work, how much more performant is C++ over JS on Jolla?11:34
RavenholmDXI haven't touched C++ since first year in college11:34
RavenholmDX(I haven't touched JS until last week)11:34
Nicd-C++ is a lot faster. but it probably won't matter11:34
leszekDoesn't it depend on what you want to do11:34
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RavenholmDXI suppose, I'm not really doing anything that requires a tonne of perf11:34
leszeklets say accessing a database. I think its easier in js at saves a lot of time. And performance wise it should be on par11:35
leszek*and11:35
meklufor databases you're mostly restricted by I/O anyway11:35
RavenholmDXsure11:35
meklurather than computational factors11:35
RavenholmDXOf all the mobile SDKs I've used11:35
RavenholmDXSailfish is by far my favourite11:35
RavenholmDXmost of the native apps being open source really helps11:36
leszekalso when it comes to webaccess and parsing stuff from websites I don't see any difference between js and c++11:36
leszekRavenholmDX: and if you really want to learn javascript. I am still searching for someone converting the youtube-dl plugins for various websites to js to use it in webcat or lls video player11:37
SK_workRavenholmDX: use JS in your case11:37
Nicd-leszek: did... did you just hyphenate your text on IRC?11:38
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RavenholmDXleszek, doesn't lls have YT functionality already?11:38
leszekRavenholmDX: yes it has youtube capability already11:38
leszekwatching and downloading aswell as searching11:38
RavenholmDXso what's the problem?11:39
leszeksearching by using simply the mobile site with webview and redirecting the clicked result to the stream parser and then the stream to the player11:39
leszekRavenholmDX: youtube-dl has dozens of plugins for other sites aswell. Vimeo, ARD Mediathek, bbc, ...,11:40
RavenholmDXI was considering porting Livestreamer11:40
RavenholmDXit supports a bunch of hosts too11:40
leszeknice11:41
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leszekyeah I am not sure which codebase is easier. I just took a quick look at the youtube-dl script and it has every website it can extract from as seperate python file in a plugins directory11:41
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leszekeasier = easier to read11:41
RavenholmDXhttps://livestreamer.readthedocs.org/en/latest/index.html11:42
leszekok its the same11:43
leszekthough on first sight the youtube-dl source provides more plugins11:43
RavenholmDXexcept it's mainly for livestreams11:43
RavenholmDXideally11:43
RavenholmDXI'd do something that would combine both11:43
RavenholmDXyoutube-dl for hosted video11:43
RavenholmDXlivestreamer for livestreams11:43
leszekI guess it includes some live streams aswell: https://github.com/rg3/youtube-dl/tree/master/youtube_dl/extractor11:44
leszekit supports even youporn :P11:44
mekluit had quite a few... adult plugins11:45
RavenholmDXlol11:45
RavenholmDXI don't actually have a Jolla11:45
Nicd-well what do you think video on mobile phones is used for?11:45
RavenholmDXbut does Sailfish have an Android-style 'Open Link with...'11:46
RavenholmDX?11:46
pp_xbmc/kodi has quite a few plugins as well for various bits11:46
pp_... unfortunately code quality is often very low :(11:46
pp_but quick & dirty parsing for just about any service exists, which is nice11:46
RavenholmDXi.e if you click a link for a recognized site, it automatically detects compatible apps11:46
leszekRavenholmDX: it uses the xdg standard from linux but there is no graphical tool to set applications for certain mimetypes11:48
leszeka graphical tool is still on my todolist11:49
leszekbut first I need to finish webcat and lls video player11:49
leszek"finish" = bring out version 1.011:49
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RavenholmDXleszek are you ll?11:50
leszekyep11:50
RavenholmDXah cool11:50
RavenholmDXI was looking at the code for lls for my app11:51
leszek:)11:51
RavenholmDXHave you considered updating the icon? :P11:51
RavenholmDX(no offense of course)11:52
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leszekthe icon came from one of the community members. Usually I don't like changing it too much11:53
RavenholmDXunderstandable11:54
leszekas when it becomes known changing it is a bad marketing move11:54
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RavenholmDXof course11:55
RavenholmDXI'm just a bit OCD when it comes to UI guidelines is all :P11:55
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RavenholmDXStarted using Gradle in work12:40
RavenholmDXamazing stuff12:40
RavenholmDXI don't think I can go back to Ant12:40
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tbrPSA: open source & jolla - meeting on #mer-meeting in 1h 10min13:46
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anand_Hi Folks - Am an Indian Jolla user.14:14
Armadillohi14:14
Armadillotbr good reminder, thanks14:14
anand_I really hate to barge here on report a trivial issue but seems to affect me daily.14:14
anand_I posted in TJC but it could take ever to gather all votes and garner dev. attention so thought will just report here once14:15
Stskeepsjust remember that irc isn't a bugtracker.. what's your issue?14:16
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anand_i know :-) am a regular in the Linux Mint community14:16
anand_https://together.jolla.com/question/62789/bug-punctuation-restricts-click-dial-options-for-phone-numbers/14:16
Stskeepsthat sounds like a real bug indeed14:17
anand_yeah :-(14:17
Stskeepsnazanin: can you reproduce that?14:18
nazanin*checking*14:18
anand_international sms's cost a lot else would forward the sms ;-)14:19
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Stskeepshttps://together.jolla.com/question/68125/official-announcement-current-status-of-update10/14:21
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nazaninanand_: Stskeeps right, it's a bug...14:23
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tbrnazanin: don't forget to mark he TJC item :)14:23
anand_nanzanin: thanks for confirming, will be grateful if you could have it added in your tracker :-)14:23
ernestiworks if there is a space before the num14:23
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nazaninanand_: sure. thanks for reporting it :)14:24
anand_ernesti - yeah, unfortunately dont have control over the format received :-(14:24
nazaninernesti: I think that's the point of the bug14:24
ernestinazanin, yeah, but at least it works this way14:24
ernestianand_, unfortunatelly14:25
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anand_cheers guys, thanks for your time14:26
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pp_heh, and I was hoping for a few kernel config options being enabled in the future :P14:45
pp_CONFIG_AUDITSYSCALL and whatnot14:45
pp_(tho it seems to have some memory usage issues :-)  )14:46
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tbrmeeting starts soon!14:51
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mhall119where is the meeting?16:08
chem|st#mer-meeting16:10
mhall119thanks16:10
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zbenjamincoderus: hey, mitakuulu just entered a reconnect loop to the whatsapp servers16:12
zbenjamincoderus: did they finally switch off the old protocol?=16:12
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zbenjaminis there already a workaround for the android layer not seeing any contacts synced from exchange?16:15
zbenjaminthat should work already but it is not for me :/16:17
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VDVsxtbr, are you the one running the sailfish planet ?16:31
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mhall119I thought Whatsapp killed mitakuulu's access to their servers some week sago16:31
zbenjaminmhall119: no, it worked until a few hours. They just randomly banned free accounts16:32
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VDVsxso if you pay is ok to use unofficial app ? :P16:32
zbenjaminVDVsx: not anymore :D16:33
mhall119zbenjamin: I recall something a while back about people having their accounts banned if they were using Mitakuulu16:33
VDVsxok, then fair16:33
zbenjaminmhall119: yes. But since i had a paid acc it worked for me16:33
tbrVDVsx: correct16:33
mhall119zbenjamin: should have used Telegram instead ;)16:34
zbenjaminmhall119: which would normally mark the time for me to step away from WhatsApp, sadly everyone i know uses it ... and not telegram :/16:34
javispedroand that won't change unless _you_ stop using it!16:35
mhall119javispedro: we said that about MS Office and Facebook, it didn't work out in practice though16:35
zbenjaminjavispedro: theoretically16:35
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VDVsxtbr, is there some rss feed ? I normally subscribe to planets via a global feed, but don't see one there, just individual ones16:36
SK_workIIRC telemgram is pretty badly secured, but interesting to see16:36
SK_works/to see/to have/16:36
tbrVDVsx: yes there should be one16:36
javispedroVDVsx, http://planet.devaamo.fi/sailfish/atom.xml16:36
* VDVsx is blind16:36
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javispedroit's just the same as in on the other devaamo planets :)16:37
zbenjaminSK_work: i think telegram is using some custom encryption algorithm right?16:37
javispedromhall119, zbenjamin, it's not theoretical. if you don't stop using it then certainly nobody else will. if you stop using it then someone else _may_16:37
tbrseems its only in the HTML <link rel="alternate" href="http://planet.devaamo.fi/sailfish/atom.xml" title="" type="application/atom+xml">16:38
SK_workzbenjamin: some pretty bad one IIRC16:38
mhall119javispedro: for very small values of "may" in practice16:38
javispedrowell, I'm repeating myself, but I've seen the fall of the "mighty" MSN protocol16:38
mhall119javispedro: in practive, most people find it easier to just not talk to you than not talk to everybody else they know16:38
zbenjaminmhall119: thats the problem16:39
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zbenjaminjavispedro: yes but it took ages and it fell only because there were better alternatives16:39
javispedrohardly16:39
javispedroit took ages, but the alternatives still don't have say, "chess games"16:40
daithefluzbenjamin: better alternatives ?16:40
* mhall119 isn't sure MSN was ever "mighty"16:40
javispedro(which MSN client _did_ allow in its glory)16:40
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zbenjaminjavispedro: hmm ICQ can do that ;) but i'm not sure it is better16:40
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locusfhttps://together.jolla.com/question/68182/whats-open-and-whats-not-in-saillfish-apps-from-a-community-point-of-view/#post-id-68209 <- please help out, see the header for description :)17:04
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ottulojavispedro: did you ever try Yahoo! Messenger? it had plenty of games18:04
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lukedirtwalkerM4rtinK: thanks for taking my topic for next meeting ;)18:11
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M4rtinKno problem :)18:12
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M4rtinKI need pretty much the same thing for my apps :)18:13
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Yanielwhich is?18:39
Yanielsdl2?18:39
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M4rtinK_jolla_Yaniel: pickers18:52
coderuszbenjamin: show me logs18:53
coderuszbenjamin: and mitakuuluu using new protocol of course18:53
coderusjust not all features are implemented18:53
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M4rtinK_jolla_BTW, SDL support would be also nice a topic for the meeting18:53
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Yanielah18:56
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Yanielthe sdl2 packages seem to be there18:56
Yanielthe question is if/when they qualify for harbour18:57
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xavinuxHi people19:22
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xavinuxhow are you...19:23
sledgeshey xavinux welcome back:)19:26
xavinux:) thanks19:27
xavinuxsomething to start workin on with Sailfish OS ?19:27
sledgestoday we had OSS meeting where a documentation effort was kicked off19:27
sledgescheck here, we have seemingly volunteered tadzik for that :) http://merproject.org/meetings/mer-meeting/2014/mer-meeting.2014-12-02-15.00.html19:28
sledgeswhere is he though.. wanted to shake hand and try to help what i can19:29
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sqrrli'm developing an android app and i want to run it on jolla. i use a navigation drawer (thing that appear when i swipe from the side of the screen), but jolla overrides that gesture. how should i deal with it?19:30
Nicd-sqrrl: weechat-android?19:32
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sqrrlyup19:32
Nicd-ooh :)19:32
sqrrlsomeone reported it works fine except that one thing19:32
Nicd-you can make the drawer appear if the user drags from the center of the screen19:32
Nicd-unless that is for switching channels19:32
sqrrlyeah that one's already taken19:33
Nicd-well, if you want to keep the drawer the only way is to enlargen the drag area so that it can be opened by dragging from inside the screen19:33
Nicd-since dragging from outside the screen is for the OS gesture19:33
r0kk3rzsqrrl: you cant really19:34
sqrrlthis os gesture, does it make sense disabling it? and, is it possible at all?19:34
Nicd-it can't be disabled19:34
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Nicd-and it doesn't make sense to disable it, it's for minimizing the app19:34
xavinuxsledges: ok19:34
r0kk3rzthe silica ui gestures arent really compatible with material design apps19:35
xavinuxthanks for information19:35
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sqrrlNicd-: dosn't swiping from the other side does the same action?19:35
Nicd-sqrrl: your best bet is for me to release my weechat app which will make weechat-android on sailfish irrelevant, hopefully19:35
Nicd-sqrrl: yep, but you cannot disable them19:35
sledgesxavinux: tadzik is on #jollamobile channel, the news are still hot and shaping ;) also lbt will know things about autodoc, what would you like to help?19:35
Nicd-sqrrl: also it would make for bad UX to have the drag edge change per app19:36
sqrrlyeah, i'm just... exploring possibilities19:36
sqrrlthere are some apps that use those drawers without any buttons19:36
Nicd-android apps have very limited API to work with anyway19:36
sqrrli thought sailfish deals with that in some way19:36
Nicd-it doesn't. I've had problems in some apps but you just need to be careful where you drag from :P19:37
Nicd-should go for native apps for the best UI anyway19:37
xavinuxsledges: yes very interesting en Help yo Jolla and sailfish19:37
sqrrlwell, weechat-android has a button for the navigation drawer so it's usable19:38
sqrrlother than that weechat uses are relying on you Nicd- :p19:38
Nicd-:D19:38
Nicd-christmas is coming...19:38
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Tegusomebody somewhere suggested holding another finger when swiping (can't rembember which app it was or did it actually work)19:43
Tegumy workaround was trying to swipe along the side to discard the sailfish gesture and then swipe in19:44
Teguneeds retries :P19:44
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swift110_hello all20:47
swift110_how do I put sailfish os on a tablet20:47
Nicd-I guess you want to download the HADK and read the instructions20:48
swift110_ok its a samsung galaxy tab 4 lite20:50
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beidlare there any recommendations on how to display a notification popup application-wide?21:19
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ryanleesipesHey guys, anyone have a link to a list of devices Sailfish OS has been ported to?21:24
ryanleesipes(I apologize as I'm sure you get some version of this question all the time)21:24
swift110_ryanleesipes: thats an awesome idea21:25
ryanleesipesswift110_, does it exist? Lol.21:26
swift110_not to my knowlwdgw21:28
swift110_i was hoping someone would answerr you21:28
ryanleesipeslol21:28
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ryanleesipesI have a OnePlus One and was hoping to try it on an actual device vs playing with an emulator.21:29
ryanleesipesswift110_, Sold my Nexus 5, which I hear there was actually a build for.21:29
swift110_ryanleesipes: I am trying to see if I can put sailfishos an a samsung galaxy 3 lite21:30
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ryanleesipesswift110_, Well maybe if we troll around for a while we will get an answer :)21:35
swift110_lol21:35
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ryukafalzryanleesipes: https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Adaptations/libhybris21:51
ryukafalzhardware with similar chipsets to those devices may also be supported, but no guarantees :)21:51
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ryanleesipesswift1102, See this ^22:00
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ryanleesipesvgrade, Hey, I see you are doing the port for Oneplus One. Is that still happening?22:02
swift1102ok cool22:04
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r0kk3rzryanleesipes: there is a big doc on how to build your own22:25
r0kk3rzryanleesipes: and the #sailfishos-porters guys to help you22:25
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ryanleesipesr0kk3rz, Thanks for the info.22:31
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phaeronlocusf: I can probably provide a dump of the webhooks for the open packages, easier than reverse mapping them23:32
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