Wednesday, 2012-12-12

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CosmoHillnight night00:47
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timophiekku: 5am ?06:00
timophthat's early even for you06:00
timophor is it the case where others walk in their sleep you type into irc :p06:05
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situMorning all07:09
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iekkutimoph, meeting at helsinki 9 am07:15
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rcgdoes anyone have a clue why connecting via ssh might fail?07:39
rcgi.e. it hangs after entering the password07:39
rcglast debug output i get is: debug2: channel 0: open confirm rwindow 0 rmax 3276807:40
rcgi tried from different systems..07:40
rcgalso connecting to different systems work07:40
rcgthere is just that one system that constantly refuses to work07:40
rcgalready tried if name resolution is the culprit but this issue still persists07:41
rcginterstingly, ssh'ing out from the affected device also hangs at the very same point07:41
rcgssh'ing to localhost works though07:42
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kulvercg: have you tried it in a different wlan network?07:46
kulvee.g. at home and at office?07:46
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rcgkulve, yep07:47
rcgeven this07:47
rcgnever had such a strange issue before07:47
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rcgadmittedly, i am pretty clueless right now and try all the stuff on google i can find about this problem but so far nothing worked07:48
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rcgbtw, i also have two different devices of the same type here and get the issue with both07:50
rcgand also generated two images from .ks file with the same result07:50
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rcgam just trying everything to narrow this problem down07:51
niqtmorning all07:51
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rcgmorning niqt07:52
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kulvercg: I'm passing your moslo instructions also to the ubuntu guys as some of them are also blocked by this 700M flashing limit08:04
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rcgkulve, sure :)08:18
rcgi wrote them down in that blog post08:19
kulveyeah, that's the "instructions" I mean :)08:19
rcghehe alright :)08:19
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rcgthen you also know the gitorious project :)08:20
kulveyeah, but didn't really check it. I've been happy with the ready made binaries08:21
rcgas long as everyone's happy things are fine ;)08:22
rcgbtw keep your fingers crossed... moving into a new flat tomorrow :)08:23
kulvemore space for devices08:25
rcgthx :)08:26
rcgwell, devices maybe, but of course for our child :D08:27
rcgestimated birth date is next year may :D08:27
kulvethen ends the nightly hacking then :)08:28
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rcgwell, i still have the hope that i can coordinate nightly hacking and nightly taking care of baby somehow :)08:30
rcgi am up very late at night anyhow ;)08:30
rcgi'll see.. but i am really looking forward to it :D08:31
rcgeven if i need to cut down on occasional hacking08:32
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zuhkulve: It's quite clear you don't have kids if you think that they sleep through the night ;) One can bottle-feed with one hand so just learn to type fast with one hand and you're all set for combining nightly feeding with hacking :)08:45
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Stskeepsmorn slaine08:52
slainemorn Stskeeps08:52
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lbtmorning all09:27
zchydem_lbt: morning09:30
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lbtniqt: did I understand you got your problem resolved?09:42
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niqtyes, resolved09:42
lbtit was an issue enumerating the SDK name in the vbox XML?09:42
lbtqmake wrapper executability?09:44
niqtthere was a bug, but I do not think it was that. Yesterday there were many commit and at the end of  day was ok09:45
niqti don't know which commit has resolved my problem09:46
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lbtniqt: OK - I tried it on HEAD yesterday and it was OK too09:48
niqtthe bug was on search of qt version, i fixed it on my code but the problem the problem did not disappear, then there was also another09:48
lbtyeah - I want to make a semi-stable branch in the code09:48
lbtmore of a temporary tag that says "checkout this branch as it's known to actually run"09:49
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sledgessounds good, morning!10:04
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sledgesStskeeps, there was a discussion about mer on non-mer mailing list, and you or lbt had to explain what it actually is. You mentioned vendor use-cases as in "car parking machines to (something bizzare, e.g. nutcracker lcd interface)" from "companies to hackers in a cellar" - I can't remember where you posted it, any refreshments? :)10:31
Bostiksledges: I used the phrase "we're Jolla's basement" while at Slush to explain what we were :)10:32
Bostikah well, back to cracking my head with code I really don't understand...10:33
sledgesi refer to an email ~6 months ago10:33
sledgestime flies..10:34
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Bostik...and no, it's not webkit this time10:34
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sledges:} what's it?10:36
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lbtsledges: sorry, I don't recall seeing that email specifically10:49
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sledgescheck KDE PA mailing list history through, no hits..10:52
sledgesI believe it was some community readying to adopt Mer, but had many misunderstanding which you/Stskeeps then clarified10:52
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sledgesStskeeps, lbt, then could you please brainstorm a couple of (ridiculous) Mer use-cases: fuel drilling machines, Dick Tracy 2-Way Wrist Radio, <insert your craze>11:07
sledgesas I 100% remember you are good in this (recalling that forlorn email)11:08
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Bostiksledges: I'll tell you in a few days, once the pain is no longer this acute11:08
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sledges^ will go into Nemo's ad text (though stemming from Mer, that's why I write here)11:08
sledgesok Bostik :))11:08
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sledgeshmmm, my memories have just been scrambled:
sledges"It could be a small business that makes bus displays. It could be a hobbyist at home who doesn't want to bother making his own distribution and just want to show a clock on his LCD."11:25
Bostikit could be me, taking mer+qt5+wayland to build a touch-screen computer for my daughter...11:27
sledgesyou mean, taking an existing touch-screen computer and porting mer+qt.. ?11:28
Bostiksledges: taking a small, independent screen that happens to have touch film, and using that with, say ... RPi11:29
sledges\o/ :)11:29
Bostiksledges: things that usually are sold for in-car use :)11:29
sledgesneeds a good enclosure ofc11:29
sledgesever heard of Lilliput ?11:29
Bostikyeah, that's the make11:29
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Bostikthe box I have here says "Lilliput 669GL"11:30
sledgesgreat :) I asked them around, if you go complex, might have driver issues11:30
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sledgessome of them operate via USB and sport the whole video card in themselves, I hope I'm mislead :))11:30
Nicd-does lilliput sell to private persons?11:31
Bostikthey were the only one that were reasonably cheap, had HDMI input and were supposedly reliable11:31
Nicd-that looks just like something I was looking for11:31
BostikNicd-: not directly, but sports some retailers who do11:31
sledgesbut those with hdmi should pose only touchscreen craze, and configging Xorg for a good modeline11:31
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Bostiknow I just need roughly two weeks of spare time to make it all happen...11:32
Nicd-I'll store those links in memory, currently I'm thinking of something else for my RPi11:32
Nicd-but an RPi tablet would be cool to make sometime11:32
sledgeslol CosmoHill :))11:32
CosmoHillthey have lilliput11:33
Nicd-hm, pretty expensive :/11:33
CosmoHillsledges: hehe, how did you find that?11:33
BostikCosmoHill: aye, that was one of the links I came across; and if I lived in UK would have used them certaily11:33
CosmoHilli thought you were in the uk11:33
sledgesI am, hence11:33
CosmoHillmy friend spent £1000 on his head unit11:34
CosmoHillduno why, his car is garaged more than driven11:34
BostikCosmoHill: .fi, ~40km from Russian border11:34
sledgesand you can compatibly put them with ByByte black box, then goes straight to your car ;)
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CosmoHilli like the way you need to buy a monitor and then void the warranty to fit it11:35
Nicd-I'm currently thinking of buying a bunch of sensors and collecting sensor data + video from my car with the RPi during driving (the like you see in formula races)11:37
CosmoHill"Raspberry Pi Compatible 10.1" HDMI touch screen monitor"11:38
CosmoHillNicd-: you mean like using the OBDII port?11:38
Nicd-no, my car is from 1991 :P11:38
Nicd-more like connecting sensors to the steering wheel, pedals, gear stick and stuff11:39
Nicd-I have some plans here:
CosmoHill"1024×600 native, up to 1920×1080"  how does this work :/11:39
Nicd-currently it's all just in my head11:40
Nicd-CosmoHill: discarding data :P11:40
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CosmoHilldon't advertise is as a 1080p monitor then >.<11:41
Nicd-it's "HD Ready"! ;)11:41
CosmoHillit's not even that11:41
CosmoHilli should probably take my car off charge11:46
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slaineCosmoHill: Hardware Scaling12:14
slaineWe'd a 20" TV that was basically a large 640x480 panel with hw scaling for TV resolutions and supported "up to 1024x768" for PC inputs12:14
slaineI still have to manage about 600 of them across london, the bloody things won't die12:15
CosmoHilli thought tv was 576 vertial?12:16
CosmoHilli remember a staduim in the us just installed a massive monitor12:17
CosmoHillone of the guys plugged a xbox 360 into it12:17
sledgesNicd-, rpi is 8 × GPIO, UART, I²C bus, SPI bus with two chip selects12:21
sledgesso SPI - two devices; how many can you wire up on IIC ?12:22
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Nicd-sledges: actually that is one of the things I don't know :P12:24
Nicd-so far I've been finding suitable sensors, but I'm not sure if I can connect them all12:24
sledgesyes, I saw your document and questions below ;)12:24
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Nicd-my experience with I2C for example is short, we did one implementation in VHDL at my uni12:27
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Nicd-so I'm not completely sure this is feasible12:28
Nicd-but at least I'm going to try :P12:28
sledgesmaximum number of I2C devices used at any one time is 11212:28
Nicd-but wikipedia states that often the amount of slave devices is limited to 812:29
Nicd-even that would be enough for me12:29
Nicd-the problem is how to connect them to the same bus if they are around the car12:29
Nicd-and fitting the other sensors with their own communication interfaces12:30
sledgesto the same bus? wires12:30
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sledgesyou got 2 more SPI12:30
sledgesand 8 GPIOs12:30
Nicd-but the wires will be pretty long then12:31
sledgesIIC is limited to several meters12:31
Nicd-I don't know enough about electronics to say if that is a problem or not12:31
sledgesso is the car :)12:31
sledgesyou'll surely learn a lot12:31
Nicd-my ultimate goal is to create software which would take the sensor data and the camera feed and render a video with virtual instruments12:32
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Nicd-something like this: (except uglier)12:33
Nicd-and more suited to everyday driving maybe12:33
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sledges~off-topic: I would like to see a rendering of instruments when car is doing 180/360/drifting/etc12:35
sledgesprobably there is one already12:35
sledgeshandbrake sensor please! :D12:35
Nicd-just another rotation sensor12:35
sledgesshere should be some such interactive car stunt tutorial videos :D12:36
sledges(when they film ones feet+pedals, is still not that clear)12:36
Nicd-also, an idea I had was that if this could be made easy (maybe tap into OBDII in modern cars), we could have people posting their driving online to be rated by others12:36
Nicd-how they use the clutch and so forth12:37
Nicd-or on rally trackso fc12:37
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sledges:) and ways of 180 ;D ;P12:39
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Nicd-maybe. I'm a boring driver though, my test videos will probably be dull as hell12:40
sledgesnot dull for those who want to learn proper elegant driving (fuel econ etc)12:41
sledgesincluding me, sometimes :)12:41
Nicd-well yeah12:41
Nicd-"How to drive carefully and efficiently, by Nicd"12:41
Nicd-anyway, I'm off. see you12:42
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mountainHi, I can build a Mer rootfs image and running it with QEMU on my laptop now, it shows a Window with a 'Qt quick' box, how does this app get started? how can I get information for developing an app with Mer? so I can replace this default app13:05
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sledgesmountain, which kickstart (.ks) file did you use?13:24
sledges(not that it's wrong, I'll just point you the right direction :))13:25
mountainsledges:this one: mer-core-armv6l-xorg-basic-qmlviewer.ks13:25
sledgesah, ignore that, it's been a while since I used them, and they looked different back then :)13:27
sledgesso mountain, the starting app is pointed by /usr/share/xsessions/default.desktop13:27
sledgesand that app is called qmlviewer (hence the .ks name)13:27
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mountainsledges: thank you for pointing out :) .13:28
sledgescan you access shell prompt in any way?13:29
mountainsledges: no, I can't, it shows this 'qmlviewer' at startup13:30
sledgesso you can make your own (simple) .desktop file and Exec whatever you want (e.g. xterm, after you install it first ofc with `zypper in xterm`) - but your .ks has no connectivity, so you don't have sshd running nor you can access external repositories13:30
sledgesthere we are13:30
sledgesyou should build -connectivity- .ks file13:30
sledgesas on QEMU probably you can't press Ctrl+Alt+Fx to access virtual terminals, can you?13:31
mountainsledges: ok, now I see how it works. :)13:31
mountainno, I can't13:31
mountainCtrl+Alt leaves qemu...13:31
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sledgesif it was i586 you could mount the virtual disk and chroot ;)13:34
sledgesbut best get-out-of-jail card is compile connectivity kickstart13:34
mountainsledges: sure, I will give that a try13:35
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Nicd-sledges: seems like I can't use the rotation sensors I wanted to as they are analog :P13:55
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Nicd-don't know what to use for measuring rotation relative to the car now13:56
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sledgesNicd-, all sensors are analog, and eventually get discretised14:37
sledgesyou need an ADC in between, if sensor does not offer on itself (wish RPi offered one, but some other EVM boards do, old 8-bit Freescale one ;))14:38
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Nicd-sledges: yeah, just looking at the datasheet of an ADC14:44
Nicd-since it has 4 inputs, it's cheaper than buying a gyro for each pedal (and gyros aren't relative)14:44
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kulvegyros have drift14:54
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sledgesand gyro would work only when your pedal is in motion, so summing deltas might carry you away :)15:10
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kulvethat's why you need also accelerometers15:25
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AardSuperpelican: I'd go for transcend class 10 cards16:08
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Cosmo[PB]fecking internet18:27
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lpottersensor fusion20:47
lpotteryou need both gyro and accel, and then apply some matrix fu20:48
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