Monday, 2012-12-03

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Ken-Youngmorning, iekku04:09
iekku-20 degrees04:18
ljpthats not good for skiing04:21
ljp33 here04:22
ljpnot good for skiing either04:22
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iekkuljp, i have 2km walk to bus stop, not so eager to leave home...04:37
ljpdont forget your ski goggles04:40
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situMorning everyone05:42
situStskeeps: When's your flight ?05:50
Stskeeps2 hours 55 min or so05:52
Stskeepsit has snowed outside05:55
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Bostikit's also something like Dante's Hell outside05:58
timophnah. only about -20C06:00
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* ljp will refrain from mentioning the 33c outside his office06:02
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* Stskeeps ponders idly to spend the winter months in brisbane..06:03
ljpif you can call it winter06:04
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Asema_good morning here in Nigeria>>>>it should be afternoon in finland10:03
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sroedalAsema_: midday actually10:03
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Asemaircchati want to develop apps for sailfish10:08
Asemaircchatcan anyone help me please10:08
dm8tbrI believe that there are two wikis that should cover this10:09
Asemaircchatyes but not detailed enough10:10
dm8tbrdo you have specific problems?10:10
Asemaircchat not yet10:11
Asemaircchatjust liked the OS and wanted to start writing apps10:11
Asemaircchatam a newbie to it10:11
dm8tbrsure, there are virtual machines and also device images with Nemo-mobile10:12
Asemaircchatso how du i got about starting to write apps10:13
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dm8tbr has all sorts of links10:14
sledgesgood mowning10:15
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dm8tbr too10:17
dm8tbrsledges: good moaning10:17
kulveFor a question like "How do I start writing apps?" there should be a really straightforward wiki about Qt Creator in proper environment. Giving a bunch of links with also really low level stuff could be quite scary10:17
dm8tbrkulve: you just volunteered ;)10:18
kulveI don't know anything about Qt Creator or IDEs in general..10:19
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Bostikkulve: which makes you the perfect guinea-pig for this one :D10:21
Bostikjust annotate your gripes as a braindump and you have an auditable "setup log" which the documentation can be based on10:22
kulveI'm happy to test/review if somebody comes up with the instructions. A Nemo based VM image with proper device-side tools for Qt creator and then some simple instructions for installing Qt Creator with the right settings. Although I understood that that's not ready yet..10:25
kulveand also I think there should be clear distinction in the documentation for platform developers and application developers10:26
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lbtStskeeps: pre-release started10:38
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* lbt -> bed before 3am :)10:43
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AkkumaruAnybody knows the status of Sailfish SDK?11:07
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Stskeepsmight have better luck in #jollamobile or twittering @JollaMobile11:08
Stskeepswhat do you hope to do with it, out of curiousity?11:08
AkkumaruI hope11:20
Akkumaruactually try to build something on the emulation of jolla os11:20
AkkumaruMost of me just want to play around in the Jolla OS emulation :P11:21
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sledgeskulve, slush SDK presentation was a good source of "how do I start writing apps"11:35
sledgeshope it is possible to obtain a video with _both_ demo screens visible (or at least the qtcreator hi-res screencast)11:36
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sledgessomeone with QML knowledge and Mer-patched QtCreator installed could reproduce that screen cast and share it with us is no time.. (how to build QtCreator is already on sailfish wiki)11:37
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sledges(that's how I learned the good old Java Spring Roo ;))11:41
kulvevideo is good addition, but you need written instructions and examples to cut'n'paste11:42
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HazardousWasteris anyone using mer + something for ivi right now?11:45
sledgesif there was a video, I could write down that to wiki in no time as I go (as anyone who watches vide would first write it down to their dev envs to try out)11:52
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iekkumer bug triage starting soon11:55
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Sfiet_KonstantinStskeeps: ping ?12:37
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brad_qqqqqWill the mer-qt-creator support Qt5?13:34
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Sagebrad_qqqqq: I would think so as qt5 is already in Mer core, but when that will be is probably another question.13:50
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Bostikbrad_qqqqq, Sage: this is just my educated guess, but I would guess upstream QtCreator to support qtquick2 shortly after qt5.0 release, with _possibly_ one intermediate release before the full Quick2.0 support is in place14:12
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sledgesbrad_qqqqq, Sage, Bostik: I've already built a simple qt5 app with the help of
sledgesdefinitely will be possible so14:17
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Bostiksledges: I somehow suspect people are curious about getting QtQuick2 directly usable from within QtC :)14:19
Bostikbut getting binary builds against qt5 is damn good to have already14:20
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situBostik: Hey14:43
sledgeshaven't tried opening qtquick2 directly in designer ;) thanks Bostik may give it a go14:43
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sledgesBostik, QtCreator 4.8.3 curses on not being able to find qml2puppet, it means it's already trying its best to open QML2 (Qt Quick 2.0) wysiwyg design14:50
sledgestime to compile that puppet :))14:50
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sledgesQtCreator 2.6.0 that is (4.8.3 was host's Qt version it was built/based on)14:53
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faenilo/ guys15:00
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sledges\o faenil15:01
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CosmoHill\o/ sledges15:07
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sledges /°\ CosmoHill15:12
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jonwilAnyone know who is in charge of PulseAudio in Mer/Nemo?15:17
jonwiland who has done all the recent work on it?15:18
w00tjusa_: ^ you were involved in that weren't you?15:19
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jonwilmostly I am curious as to how the guys doing it replaced the pulseaudio-modules-nokia package that was used on the N900/N9/N95015:22
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w00tit wasn't15:22
w00t(as far as I know)15:22
jonwilwell I cant find pulseaudio-modules-nokia on obs anymore where it used to love15:23
Sagejonwil: the pulseaudio-modules-nokia was removed as it didn't work anymore with the new pulseaudio (those were binary modules only and nobody has sources to recompile)15:23
thopiekarlbt, X-Fade: ping15:24
Sagejonwil: there was discussion in mer-general mailing list just a sec15:24
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jonwilWhat I am wondering is how people are still able to use new pulseuaudio on N9xx given that its missing important stuff like speaker protection and cellular speech algorithms or whatever15:25
jonwilor are they just putting up with the lack of speaker protection and crappier audio?15:25
Aardjonwil: there is no crappier audio.15:25
Sagejonwil: have you noted some difference in there? :)15:26
jonwilI thought some of the algorithms in pulseaudio-modules-nokia were to do with cellular speech15:26
jonwile.g. sidetone or whatever its called15:26
Aardjonwil: yes, that's true. but additionally, the binary modules that were in the old pa version where not included in the configuration15:26
Aardi.e., they were just sitting there, but were not used15:27
jonwilfair enough.15:27
Aardwe thought they were used until we updated it as well ;)15:27
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jonwilso you mean old MeeGo/Mer/Nemo with old PulseAudio version never actually pulled in pulsaudio-modules-nokia binary blobs?15:28
jonwilThat would be wierd15:28
StskeepsAard: what?15:28
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StskeepsAard: man, there's some people that need an asskicking15:28
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AardStskeeps: what, you didn't know that? :)15:28
jonwilI guess if things work without Nokia binary blobs and there are no unwanted side-effects its all good :)15:29
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Aardjonwil: I don't know about 'never', but at least at the time of going from the old pa-version it was not used15:30
Bostiksledges: I call that "good news"15:32
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jonwilok, looks like its time to update my "[mer-general] N900 hardware adaptation and closed source blobs" mailing list post from before with the latest news15:35
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JBBERLINI've a question about mer on arm15:36
JBBERLINis there are any openjdk for mer on15:36
JBBERLINso that I can run jitsi on an arm tablet ?15:37
Stskeepsnot currently but it isn't impossible15:37
JBBERLINand for mer at x86 ?15:37
Stskeepssimilar story15:37
Stskeepsnot ported yet15:37
JBBERLINokey... other try ;) how u think about the timeline and can we speedup it with donation ?15:39
Stskeepsyou probably need to do it yourself15:40
JBBERLINno we are an IT company and need it for a client project15:41
AardJBBERLIN: I did java packages to run on meego a while back, it's rather messy15:41
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sledgesgood news indeed15:54
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jonwilok, new "N900 hardware adaptation and closed source blobs" post made to the list with updates covering the latest items16:09
jonwilWould be interesting to see the use of closed blobs on Mer/Nemo for N9xx reduced as much as possible :)16:10
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lbt_thopiekar_: pong17:20
thopiekar_lbt_: I wrote you last week to add me to the COBS :)17:21
thopiekar_did you get the message?17:21
thopiekar_lbt_: ? ^17:26
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lbt_thopiekar_: sorry - in a meeting17:29
lbt_yes - you should be done17:29
lbt_I'm not on my desktop atm - let me know17:30
lbt_hopefully .... have fun :)17:30
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thopiekar_lbt_: doesn't work :(17:48
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lbt_thopiekar_: my bad, I'd not done it17:52
lbt_try now - and *then* I can say "have fun" :)17:52
thopiekar_:D ok17:52
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thopiekar_great! many thanks!17:53
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Stskeepsevening all18:35
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thopiekar_Stskeeps: evening :)18:52
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thopiekar_I haven't got Mer installed, but is there a way to find a list of available packages? it seems that they are called a different way in Mer as I tried to use my spec which I created for OBS:
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lbtor, in a Mer SDK or VM, zypper search18:56
lbtthat may make more sense for that usage18:56
thopiekar_found it :P18:57
thopiekar_lbt: are there also if's in COBS, like in OBS? see in line 29 ..18:58
thopiekar_I would like to add something without breaking builds in OBS..18:59
lbtI don't quite know why not ... Stskeeps?18:59
thopiekar_I mean with the same spec..18:59
thopiekar_ok thanks18:59
lbtwe should have one but we don't18:59
thopiekar_would be a great if you could add it :)18:59
lbtplease file a bug19:00
lbtcheck if there is one19:00
lbtsee topic19:00
lbtmeh - bugs.merproject.org19:01
thopiekar_hope I added the bug right :P
Merbot`Mer bug 644 in Mer OBS "Switches to make spec distribution-independent" [Normal,New]19:09
dm8tbrlbt: are you aware that seems b0rken?19:09
thopiekar_dm8tbr: was working 10mins before :/19:10
thopiekar_the wiki works19:10
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lbtdm8tbr: erm ... damn19:13
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dm8tbrthe http version seems to work fine though19:13
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faenilis there anything else I can try when zypper ref19:16
faenilbrings a segmentation fault? :D19:16
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rcgkulve, ping19:30
rcghow did you flash the root fs on nexus7?19:30
rcgthe ubuntu guys are using some kinda strange approach.. seems like the "flash" a tarball which they extract via some automatism in an initrd on first boot19:31
rcgwhich, uhm, seems like to be artificially complicated to me19:32
kulvesudo fastboot flash userdata rootfs.img19:32
rcgand how do you create the rootfs.img?19:32
rcgsorry for the possibly stupid questions19:32
kulvewith an android tool called make_ext4fs19:32
rcgah ok..19:33
kulveyou can't flash over 700MB files but with that make_ext4fs you can create e.g. 4GB image and then zypper install more stuff in it19:33
rcgi see19:35
rcggot myfirst kernel running yesterday but then was stuck as i couldn't boot into rootfs19:36
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kulveyou can flash rootfs made with the normal tool but you need to have it <700MB (as it's first loaded to memory and only then flashed)19:37
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rcgi see19:40
shmerlKulve: Do you plan to publish Mer/PA images for Nexus7 at some point?19:44
shmerlAnd would it be maintained for the future or it's an experimental project?19:45
kulveshmerl: yeah, I'm planning to do it. And I'm hoping to find the time to maintain it19:46
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shmerlThanks, sounds great. So do you think it's already stable enough to get the Nexus 7 itself?19:46
kulvewell, hard to say that. Many things work, but imo Nemo needs a bit more work to be stable and more usable..19:47
shmerlAlso, did PA create some Mer related repos, so it could be updated, or it'll require reflash every time?19:48
rcgshmerl, pa can be updated. the repositories are on cobs19:49
shmerlAnd hw adaptations bits are placed to repos as well, or they are usually outside?19:50
rcgcobs too ;)19:50
shmerlSo in theory it should all be updatable over the air. Neat.19:50
shmerlUnless of course some update breaks ;)19:51
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rcgwell, on archos g9 you still need to flash the kernel19:51
rcgexcept this everything is updatable ota19:51
dm8tbryou could also flash from userspace :)19:52
shmerlI see19:52
rcgi assume this would be the same for nexus 719:52
rcgdm8tbr, well, afaik this automatism still needs to be implemented ;)19:52
rcgbut it's nice to know that it is possible :)19:53
shmerlkulve: Where do you plan to publish flashing instructions when it'll be ready, to Mer wiki or somewhere else?19:53
kulvemer wiki19:53
shmerlThanks. I'll wait for that. And it'll be armv7hl? Vivaldi was armv7l.19:54
shmerlThat's good. Interesting to test if some build for nemo would work on it without recompilation.19:54
kulveI'm using all nemo hl binary packages on it without recompiling anything19:55
shmerlI hope official Vivaldi are going to switch to hl too.19:55
shmerlkulve: Nice.19:56
shmerlBtw, give a try to Firefox if it even works. It's a bit of an older build, I'll make another one soon:
shmerlI don't have any Nemo / PA device now. So hopefully Nexus 7 would be a good testing ground.19:57
kulveshmerl: create a mer repo in cobs and build an rpm for it..20:00
shmerlIt's not so straightforward to build it with cobs.20:00
shmerlIt can't use default tools - i.e. it has missing deps to build.20:00
shmerlSo I built it with SDK itself.20:01
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shmerlBut I can make an RPM - didn't get to it yet.20:01
shmerlThat's just a tarball as regular Mozilla release.20:01
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shmerlI.e. put it to /opt for testing or something.20:02
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shmerlWhat's a procedure to build something in cobs with missing build deps like yasm and etc.?20:03
shmerlTo put those in cobs themselves?20:04
kulveyasm should be there..20:05
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kulvebut yes, add those deps to your project and they are used automatically20:05
shmerlAh, last time I checked it wasn't. I'll check again.20:05
shmerlIt also uses historic autoconf 2.1320:06
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shmerlAnd libidl which was missing.20:06
shmerlThe rest was fine.20:06
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shmerlCan Nexus 7 work in USB host mode btw?20:18
kulveI think I saw something about that in the ubuntu pages but I'm not sure20:19
RaYmAnyeah, it can20:19
shmerlPorts look rather scarce. Vivaldi had a whole bunch of ports in comparison (HDMI, 2 USBs and etc.)20:21
RaYmAnyou need an otg plug/cable20:21
shmerlI.e. it uses Micro-B port instead of Micro-A?20:23
RaYmAnI suppose20:24
shmerlThere was something like this:
shmerlIt's a non standard connector to Micro-B to use it in host mode (of course the kernel should support such thing in the first place)20:25
RaYmAnI'm 99% sure the ubuntu devs doing ubuntu for nexus 7 uses that kind of thing.20:26
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shmerlI see20:27
shmerlOne port makes it tight. With 2 you could plug in power in case you need to, while using the second port.20:28
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shmerlBesides ports it looks like a good tablet though. I guess that's why Vivaldi didn't go with it - they wanted HDMI and 2 USBs.20:32
* lbt waves to mord20:40
mordoh, i seem to have ... made a strange face, probably in attempt to suspend ssh20:44
* mord waves back20:44
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rcgbtw, thx for the hints kulve :)21:10
rcgam so freaking busy these days :/21:10
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rcgkulve, btw, i read that you are preparing armv7hl. i already built an plasmaactive armv7hl image for my archos gen9 from .ks using the sdk22:54
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