Monday, 2012-11-19

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CosmoHillnight night00:29
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sonachmorning00:53
chriadamgmorning00:54
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stevewphello anyone here ?02:07
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Stskeepsmorn04:07
chriadamgmorning04:10
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iekkumorning04:14
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situMorning everyon05:42
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Stskeepsmorn situ, ljp05:54
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sniffingrattyhey guys, I just posted on this blog and I think it sums up my thoughts.  what are your reactions/advice?  http://post404.com/2012/07/my-nokia-maemo-story-2/    I am just looking for a easy to use device that can sync my contacts and calendar, mass storage, and qwerty. I don't want to give my life to google's cloud, use windows, or Apple- is that too much to ask (apparently)  After scouring forums, finally I heard about N900 and06:05
sniffingrattyeven put up with the epoxy fix, but looking a bit deeper into syncevolution it seems that this is not going to be a solution for a non-developer like me.  It's just so sad to see people giving up on something that is so close to what I (and I assume thousands of other people like me) need. I guess I am stuck with windows and my palm :(. Or maybe I'll switch to apple and try to figure out typing on a screen.  Is there a solution o06:05
sniffingratty Maybe a thread on maemo.org with a way to setup PC/N900 syncing that someone like me could understand? Maybe a different device? Heck, I have been getting by with the Palm Treo/outlook 2003 winXP setup I have now for 5 years; the linux world must have something better than that!06:05
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Stskeepssniffingratty: talk.maemo.org might be a good place for you06:06
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Stskeepswe work on a software core here, so it's a bit far from end user devices06:07
sniffingrattyoh, sorry.  i have been on talk.memo.com but they don't have a user friendly syncevolution solution.  what do you guys use?06:09
Stskeepsthat's more likely to be in a higher layer, like the ui06:10
sniffingrattyso what would I search for?06:12
Stskeepswell, for me n9 works pretty nicely06:13
sniffingrattyisn't n9 windows?  and no qwerty?06:16
sniffingrattyI really suck at typing on screens06:16
Stskeepsnah06:16
Stskeepsit's maemo606:16
Stskeepsthe on screen keyboard is quite good06:17
sniffingrattyso what is all this about the unholy marriage between noika and windows?    so the n9 can sync with evolution and it's easy to setup?06:17
Stskeepsyou'd have to research that :)06:18
* Stskeeps has to go, boarding plane06:18
sniffingrattyhave a nice flight06:19
Stskeepsgood luck in finding a good device06:19
sniffingrattyty, when i do I'll post my discovery for all to see!06:20
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sniffingrattywhat devices do other people use for USB-PC syncing?06:23
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sniffingrattywhat do you do for mobile device-PC syncing?  I'm trying to figure out something better than the Palm Treo/outlook 2003 winXP setup I have now06:44
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jeremybandre__: how do I edit http://merproject.org/ ?08:40
jeremyb(or submit a pull req or whatever)08:40
andre__jeremyb: that's a good question. Stskeeps should know08:41
andre__dgreaves doesn't seem to be around...08:41
* jeremyb points to http://www.w3.org/QA/Tips/noClickHere08:41
andre__what's wrong?08:41
jeremybhttp://merproject.org/about.html also needs fixing08:41
jeremyb> Click here to participate in our mailing lists - any questions about Mer welcome - or you can join us on irc for live chat08:42
andre__hmm, I should keep that page open. I also always do that wrong (using too much "click here")08:42
jeremybheh08:42
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slaineBig week09:47
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Stskeepsyup09:51
Bostikah yes, should get the train tickets to Hki already09:52
slaineStskeeps: Good luck to you all, exciting times waiting in the wings :)09:54
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sledgesI thought that will be a picture of a car |)10:35
sledges:D good morning10:35
sledges(still speaking while sleeping ;))10:35
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Stskeepsafternoon11:50
Bostik'noon11:51
Stskeepsfinland is surprisingily nice today11:51
* Bostik peeks out11:52
Bostiknah11:52
JvD_oh.. sun is shining11:53
sledgesis all because of slushy Slush!11:55
r-Aseems to be raining11:56
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timophnot that bad in Tampere11:59
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kontiovesse, fyi I created a new request: https://github.com/leonidas/qa-reports/pull/1712:30
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auri__lbt_: ping13:47
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lbt_auri__: pong14:16
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auri__lbt_: got 5 min?14:28
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lbt_auri__: sporadically, yes14:39
lbt_talk at me :)14:39
auri__well, in the Virtual Machine options page in Creator, we have fields for username and private key14:40
auri__I am thinking of removing them since messing around with them may break Creator completely14:40
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auri__now I wanted to know if and why would a developer log in to the VM with an username other than mersdk14:41
lbt_no reason14:41
auri__for eg: why would anyone want to build/deploy as root?14:41
auri__or would anyone want to do that14:41
lbt_sudo solves that14:41
lbt_and not really part of QtC14:42
auri__the other thing is that devs need not worry about the private key file14:42
lbt_ie the target update is done via the webapp14:42
lbt_agree - the stated requisite is that the user's account should be able to ssh to itself14:42
auri__I will generate an ssh pair for QtC and add that to authorized_keys so that the workflow is smooth for them14:42
auri__no more strange ssh connection errors14:43
auri__you ok with that?14:43
lbt_well - if you mess with a users ssh setup then you take all responsibility for security breaches :D14:43
lbt_which is the problem :)14:43
lbt_I agree that would make it simple14:44
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lbt_but that ^^ is my concern14:44
lbt_so lets see if I'm being paranoid14:44
Bostikdedicated SSH key, under its own name; then use 'ssh -i $KEYNAME' to connect to vm?14:44
Bostikthat way you wouldn't accidentally touch the usual ssh keys14:45
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lbt_Bostik: the VM mersdk user is mapped to use your $HOME14:47
lbt_via shared folders14:47
Bostikaha14:47
lbt_so essentially this sets up localhost ssh equivalence14:47
lbt_auri__: I think having a button that does that for you and allowing the user to push it would be OK14:48
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lbt_personally I'd hate it - I have a complex ssh setup that I need to have confidence in for secure infra support14:49
Bostik$something going behind my back and doing things to ~/.ssh/* ?14:50
lbt_so I suggest leaving it as it is but providing a 'create new ssh key (.ssh/id_rsa_mersdk) and ad it to authorised_keys ' button that also14:50
Bostikew, I'd be pretty badly put off14:50
lbt_s/that also//14:50
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lbt_Bostik: but having a button with explanation? (which you and I wouldn't use)14:51
lbt_off to rehearse ... o/14:52
Bostikbetter way certainly, as then it's an informed decision14:52
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linux_tomhey, how do I specify arch for cortex A8?17:55
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linux_tomFigured it out. It's armv7el/armv7l ( I'm new to arm )17:59
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linux_tomhi, I'm trying to compile an image for armv7. I keep getting this error : "Error <config>: Invalid arch armv7hl for repository. Valid arches: i486"18:32
linux_tomany help?18:32
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linux_tomsorted. for future reference change i486 to armv7hl in ks file.18:38
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Stskeepslinux_tom: yup18:47
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antarcticianhi everyone, sorry if the question is a bit irrelevant: anyone has some knowledge about the sailfish os's license?19:25
Stskeepsyou'd have to ask Jolla about that, but it's based on Mer, so you can pretty much assume the Mer part is open source :)19:25
antarcticianI can't find much info about the Mer's license. Is Jolla able to close source the Mer core?19:27
antarcticianI understand that the Jolla's UI is proprietary, but can't find anything about the core(Mer)19:27
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StskeepsMer's fully open source19:32
andre__guess that needs fixing of https://bugs.merproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=181 to get a complete list of licenses of all components19:32
MerbotMer bug 181 in .Release-tools "Publish listing of package licenses along with each Mer release" [Task,New]19:32
Stskeepsand there's no good benefit from closing sourcing it anyway, you loose the benefit of collaboration19:32
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StskeepsMer's an independent project from Jolla :)19:32
Stskeepsantarctician: how do you hope to use Mer?19:35
antarcticianIdk, I'll try to install it on my n900 and later on a raspi if I can, and see what I can do... Just to play around for now.19:36
antarcticianI'm really interested in contributing to open source mobile os's other than android19:37
antarctician:)19:37
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ali1234Stskeeps: as a native english speaker i read that as "Mer is an independent project and is from [made by] Jolla" - which i guess is the opposite of what you meant19:43
Jopehe meant the opposite yes :-)19:45
Jopejolla didn't make mer19:45
Stskeepsali1234: yeah, sorry :P19:45
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* Stskeeps should get some sleep19:46
ali1234yeah, it just made me do a double take and wonder if i missed something :)19:47
vgradeStskeeps: and Jolla folks good luck for tomoorrow19:49
faenilStskeeps, just be sure to get some rest the day before SLUSH :P no mistakes that day :D19:50
ajalkanemistakes are okay in a live performance. You'd not want to go to a concert where it's all playback without the human element of mistakes :P19:51
faenilajalkane, sure I didn't mean that :)19:51
faenilajalkane, but mistakes like leaking info because you're tired could be a problem :D19:51
ajalkanethen join me in saying, sleep little, be a bit hangover, and deliver an awesome event :-D19:52
ajalkaneooh... I wouldn't mind a little leakes personally :)19:52
faenilI'm sure that won't happen though :)19:52
faenilStskeeps, oh and about that, what about publishing something like a little piece of a corner of the UI before SLUSH?19:52
faenillike tomorrow19:52
faenilpeople would start going crazy thinking about all the possibilities :)19:53
faenilmaybe I should talk to jukka about that19:53
ali1234implying there is some juicy information to be leaked?19:53
antarcticianI +1 to that :D19:53
ajalkanemaybe, like, one pixel of the UI?19:53
ajalkane:)19:53
faenilajalkane, yeah something like that :P19:53
faenilthe icon of the clock? :)19:53
faenilStskeeps, okay I won't go on, I'm just too excited, sorry man ^^19:54
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antarcticianthere is still a possibility that someone, somewhere forgets a phone or something :P19:55
antarcticianFinns won't get drunk that easy though19:55
faenilantarctician, I hope that won't happen...I hate leaks :P19:55
ali1234it never hurt apple19:56
ajalkaneFinns only drop accidentally their phones to toilets and flush them while drunk. If you want leaks, go to the end of the sewer to fish19:56
antarcticianbecause they keep on doing the same things, so it's not that "new"19:56
antarcticiansewerfish os19:57
iekkuantarctician, i don't think that's a possibility19:57
iekkuleak i mean19:57
antarcticianYeah I know i'm just kidding :)19:58
faeniliekku, I'm going crazy, can you please set the clock 24h later ? :D19:58
iekkufaenil, i can do that tomorrow :P19:58
faenillet's say at least 24h :P19:58
faeniliekku, alright...thanks XD lol19:59
CosmoHillhi iekku19:59
iekkutomorrow evening...19:59
iekkufaenil, so you miss the launch19:59
faeniliekku, grrrr19:59
iekkuCosmoHill, ahoy19:59
iekkufaenil, Stskeeps is too nice to tease, so i'm helping :P19:59
faeniliekku, hahaah20:00
faenilthough I noticed Stskeeps got a lot nicer in the last week20:00
faenileither he's super excited, or... :P20:00
faenilor I don't know xD20:01
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shmerlHi!23:05
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CosmoHillhi23:06
CosmoHillwb SouL_23:06
SouL_Hi friends23:07
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shmerlAny idea how easy it will be in Mer derivaties to switch between busybox and binutils?23:11
shmerlMer can ship both.23:11
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CosmoHillare you thinking of busybox in an initramfs and binutils once mounted?23:12
shmerlI mean to replace one for the other. Or can they coexist?23:12
shmerlOn Harmattan it was a mess.23:12
CosmoHilliirc busybox is a single binary23:13
shmerlLet's say Jolla's Sailfish on their device will come with busybox.23:13
shmerlI'm not really a fan of it. Will it be possible to replace it with binutils safely?23:13
CosmoHillif you like something like "ls" to busybox it knows what action to do23:13
CosmoHillbut you can also provide it as an argument23:13
shmerlI mean from Mer perspective are they flexibly changable?23:13
shmerlI think busybox uses its own ls.23:14
CosmoHillyes23:14
shmerlAnd it's not the same as binutils ls.23:14
shmerlThat's what I'd like to avoid.23:14
CosmoHill/bin/ls as a link to busybox, not as a binary23:14
shmerlYep23:14
CosmoHilli think you could install binutils and busybox23:14
shmerlI mean dependencies wise, is there a safe path to remove busybox and put binutils isntead?23:15
CosmoHillyou';d have to run busybox as "busybox --ls" or something23:15
CosmoHillwait, what do you want to replace with what?23:15
shmerlOr if the system comes with busybox hardwired it won't work?23:15
shmerlI want to avoid using busybox23:15
CosmoHilloh okau23:15
shmerlSince I prefer binutils.23:15
CosmoHillsorry, i thought you wanted to replace binutils with busybox23:15
shmerlBut if some Mer derivative comes with busybox - that's what I'm trying to figure out.23:16
CosmoHilli think if you install binutils it will replace all the links used by busybox23:16
shmerlHopefully. In Harmattan it wasn't possible.23:16
CosmoHillso the /bin/ls link to busybox will be replaced with the binutils binary23:16
shmerlI worry more about some hard dependencies in the derived systems.23:17
CosmoHilliirc busybox is designed to be compatible with binutils23:18
shmerlSine bysbox and binutils aren't 100% compatible.23:18
CosmoHilloh oay23:18
shmerlAh, I see.23:18
shmerlbusybox is surely more narrow.23:18
CosmoHillwhat's not compatable23:18
CosmoHillI';m thinking busybox supports less than binutils, and binutils will support all busybox does23:18
shmerlIf so, than it's good.23:18
shmerlThen it should be replaceable without any breakage.23:19
CosmoHillit's the dependancies you need to worry about now23:19
CosmoHillcan you do a static build of binutils?23:20
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shmerlProbably possible. Since Sailfish is an unknown - I worry about potential issues.23:21
CosmoHillsailfish?23:21
shmerlThat's Jolla's OS name.23:21
shmerlThe one they are putting on their upcoming handset.23:21
shmerlOr "codename".23:21
shmerlThey are going to talk about it on Nov 21.23:22
shmerlIt's uses Mer as a core.23:22
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CosmoHillcool23:29
shmerlFeel free to add some questions which will be sent to them after the event: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=8776423:30
shmerl(just avoid duplicates)23:30
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CosmoHillI'm not on the forum, only irc23:51
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