Tuesday, 2012-11-13

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sonachmorning all00:43
chriadamgmorning sonach00:45
w00tthe only good morning is a dead one00:47
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chriadamw00t: or one when you can sleep in ;-)01:16
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situMorning all05:55
chriadamgmorning situ06:02
situchriadam: What's up ?06:07
chriadamnothing, just saying good morning ;-)06:08
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Bostikgood morning06:15
chriadamgood morning Bostik06:16
StskeepsBostik: i kind of wonder how they get gold working on ubuntu latest06:17
Stskeepswell, as in, there must be the linker-plugin setting or something in use06:17
Stskeepsthe -fuse-ld=gold patch is not applied06:17
Bostikoh great06:18
Bostika really quick test...06:19
Stskeepsso i think there's a gcc ./configure setting missing06:20
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Bostikhmh, tested with wrong gcc version, this _was_ 4.706:22
Stskeepsok, 4.6 is the one i'm wodnering about06:22
Bostikapt-get source ...  already going06:23
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BostikStskeeps: you're right; the primary build file (debian/rules) calls into debian/rules2, and _that_ file has the gold switches ("--enable-gold ... --with-plugin-ld=ld.gold") commented out06:28
Bostiklooks like a late regression06:33
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Stskeepsso if i enable those, i'd likely get the -fuse-linker-plugin working?06:36
BostikI can oly hope so06:37
Stskeepsworth a shot06:38
Bostikremember to use --enable-ld=default just in case, so gold won't go as default linker06:38
Bostikthat broke things, right?06:39
Stskeepsnot as much as i had thought06:40
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Stskeepsmorn zchydem, how did sdk go?06:51
zchydemLet's see if the little elves have fixed my  problems during the night06:51
zchydemStskeeps: baby steps06:51
zchydemthe new vdi fixed a lot problems06:51
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zchydemthen I found a solution for the rsa key problem and documented it to the wiki06:52
zchydemNow I'd like to compile my app, but it complaints about that Qt is installed wrong...06:52
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zchydemthe QtC+SDK's qmake script tries to run ssh binary from the target is that right?07:06
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kontioAard, https://github.com/nemomobile/buteo-mtp/pull/1 can you please check it out? and if possible make soon a new release in osc?07:41
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zchydemlbt: already awake?08:00
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Stskeepsqt5 beta2 is out08:42
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BostikStskeeps: tags in qt5.git still WIP (found in qtbase and qtdeclarative, missing from the rest)08:54
Stskeepswell, i personally use tarballs08:54
BostikI want to run the script :)08:54
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Stskeepsso far so good for qtbase..09:00
StskeepsBostik: qt_*.pri -> qt_lib_*.pri09:04
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Stskeeps(in %files)09:05
Bostikgood to know09:06
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* Stskeeps hugs tmpfs builds09:08
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Stskeepsweren't qmake supposed to be renamed in this one09:11
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niqtStskeeps: when will be qt5 b2 in mer?09:28
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Stskeepsniqt: not the coming release but next one probably09:29
StskeepsBostik: http://releases.merproject.org/~carsten/qt5-beta2-changes.patch09:32
StskeepsBostik: the qdoc stuff is a bit hazy09:33
Stskeeps(qtbase builds with that)09:33
BostikStskeeps: looks nice and clean, changes really are just cleanups since b109:34
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Bostik(yeah yeah, mkspecs churn happens all the time)09:34
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CosmoHillhi Bostik09:34
Bostikhello nate09:36
lbtzchydem: morning09:38
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zchydemlbt: morning.. gonna go for a lunch now09:50
lbtsure - ping when ready09:51
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sledgesgood mornan!10:44
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CosmoHillhi sledges10:50
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CosmoHillbye sledges10:52
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sledgescu :)10:53
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kontioAard, https://github.com/nemomobile/buteo-mtp/pull/2 new request, please check, would be nice to have that soon released, since old tests.xml makes some troubles...11:02
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kontiovesse, ping11:09
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zchydemlbt: Just compiled stuff and deployed it on the device,but theme stuff doesn't seem to work11:16
zchydemlbt: What's the correct user for the device? Now it ran it as root, but sw is being ran as a nemo11:18
zchydemI mean for the device settings11:18
zchydemin QtC11:18
lbtzchydem: device should be nemo11:20
zchydemis there a default password for nemo or do you use keys?11:21
zchydemkontio: thanks! works now11:22
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zchydemlbt: still bothering you with the few things12:28
lbtplease do12:28
zchydemSo now I can deploy my app on the device, but I created a new project, which is a simple main.cpp + main.qml. It compiles ok, but when it tries to upload it to device, it gets permission denied12:29
zchydemlbt: it uses the exactly the same device than the one that is working12:29
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zchydemdoes it require rpm packaging? IIRC it just copies stuff defined in pro file?12:31
lbtwell, WIP12:31
lbtI think we need at least 2 moded12:31
lbtpackage, copy rpm, install, launch12:31
lbtand copy binary, execute12:32
lbtI'm actually just doing a bit of a status review12:32
lbtto see where we are12:32
lbtso ... you're using generic linux device?12:34
lbthenrik_: ping12:35
zchydemlbt: yes and it works with other app12:35
zchydemthis new app is very simple, like mentioned above and just tested, it compiles, packaging works and it runs on device if installin it manually12:37
lbtso .... any error at all ?12:37
zchydemUpload of file '/home/marko/Work/demo/demo' failed. The server said: 'Permission denied'12:37
henrik_lbt: here12:39
lbtzchydem: see if the upload dir exists  - iirc it uploads to /opt12:39
lbthenrik_: hey - so what's happening webapp side?12:40
henrik_mostly testing that things work so far.12:41
henrik_next should be the css and more checks12:41
zchydemlbt: I guess there should be a dir with app name? in /opt I mean12:42
henrik_i was thinking should the webapp have simple page that does checks that for example dir permissions are correct etc.12:42
lbtzchydem: yes12:42
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lbtzchydem: I need to reset my environment to something clean :)12:43
zchydemlbt: nope, there isn't that12:43
henrik_zchydem just had today cryptic error message "protocol error" which was actually because of /srv/mer/targets was now ownded by $USER12:43
lbtzchydem: bug?12:43
lbthenrik_: yes, I was thinking we may need to do some stuff12:43
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zchydemlbt: makes me wonder why the other project still works12:44
lbtzchydem: did you do it as root sometime?12:44
lbtor maybe the app dir existed12:44
lbtor ... :)12:44
zchydemI ran it as nemo12:44
zchydemand I can stil run the other app12:44
zchydemI'll try to solve this12:45
zchydemhenrik_: please add there "Credentials" field to webapp?12:45
lbtzchydem: ?12:46
lbtcredentials ?12:46
zchydemusername &  password fields12:46
zchydemmight be usable sometimes12:46
henrik_zchydem: what about .netrc approach. credentials in home dir12:47
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w00tlbt: is COBS flaking at all? i'm trying to run osc build, but it keeps sticking on "Preparing download ..."12:48
lbtw00t: will look12:49
zchydemhenrik_: maybe, but that might not be the easiest way ....12:49
lbthenrik_: I'd like to have a 'veryify target' button too - checks for things like mersdk user in etc/passwd12:49
lbtdon't worry too much about login for the SDK manager12:51
henrik_hmm. so what is the biggest item in the wish list?12:52
henrik_lbt: btw, i sent you a pull req for sdk-setup for file:/// urls12:52
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zchydemlbt: so how did you setup the deployment on the device? I have now device working, but do you have any custom deployment steps in QtC?12:56
zchydemfor the device12:57
lbtnope - although I think I cheated and used root/nemo12:57
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zchydemok, but we can't go with that..12:57
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lbtno, I see in the latest git that aportale has refactored the build/deploy code to support multiple steps13:00
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w00tlbt: it finally proceeded13:01
lbtw00t: I think it's just spiking with updatestorm13:01
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zchydemlbt: as root it deploys it13:03
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lbtzchydem: bug :/13:03
zchydembut it can't get any theme + etc because it should be ran as nemo13:03
lbtoh, I see13:05
lbtssh to device and chown /opt to nemo?13:05
lbtand then see if that's the issue?13:05
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zchydemlbt: I'll try that13:06
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zchydemlbt: Looks like it can be make to work if the first deployment is done as a root and after that as nemo13:17
zchydembut the app is installed as defined in qmake e.g. binaries to /usr/bin and qml files to /usr/share/myapp13:18
Bostikis there a "chown" somewhere in that chain?13:18
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zchydemthis like black magic13:18
Bostikthat would be an easy explanation why it works in later runs13:18
zchydemI have no idea what happens in the background. Logging is quite minimal13:19
* zchydem wonders if that can be enabled somehow13:19
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lbtzchydem: don't forget that this is in active development and pre-alpha; be happy it works at all :)13:29
lbt(mine doesn't - my HOME confuses it)13:29
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zchydemlbt: sure:) I didn't expect one-click-installation:)13:33
zchydemlbt: I think it's just cool when after banging head to the wall for 1.5 days, things start to work13:33
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lbtOK, good13:34
lbtright, lunch13:34
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vessekontio: yes13:43
kontiovesse, hi, you are qareports upstream, aren't you?13:44
vesseyes, you could say so :)13:44
kontiook, I created a pull request last week, and wanted to ask if it can be merged? I'm about to set up a new instance for us, and would like to have the feature already upstream :-)13:45
vesseoh, sorry, for some reason I don't get notifications from that repo and havent thus noticed the pull request13:46
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vessei'll take a look tonight, now i got to run to the bus. seems simple though.13:49
kontiook sounds good, thx13:49
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sledgeshow to workaround nfs halt when running mer-connectivity ?14:36
lbthenrik_: did I actually ask about css for Desiner integration ?14:36
sledges(nfs rootfs)14:36
henrik_lbt: what do you mean by that?14:38
lbtit could be a touch more space efficent :)14:39
lbtsledges: no idea - how are you doing nfsroot?14:40
henrik_lbt: i'm not good with css at all14:40
sledgeslbt, via kernel cmdline14:40
lbthenrik_: OK - maybe see if you can get some assist?14:41
lbtsledges: simply not tried -14:41
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sledgesStskeeps, ^ ? :)14:41
henrik_lbt: i can also shrink the current design a bit. less margings etc.14:42
ScriptRipperHi David14:43
ScriptRipperping lbt14:44
lbthey ScriptRipper14:44
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sledgestrying to compile a new imx video driver on COBS, it curses: vivante_gal/vivante_priv.h:36:24: fatal error: HAL/gc_hal.h: No such file or directory16:02
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sledgeswould anyone know a dependency to that?..16:03
Sage_sledges: you might want to check my cubox compile as it uses similar driver16:04
sledgesok, it looks like we need libglx16:05
Sage_libglx of libgfx?16:05
sledgesthanks was about to go searching :)16:05
sledgeslibgfx ;) ta16:05
sledgesis it in Mer?16:05
sledgesyup, should be as your .yaml says libgfx16:06
sledgeshmmm lol nothing provides pkgconfig(libgfx), nothing provides pkgconfig(libEGL-devel)16:07
* sledges is looksing at Sage's yaml/repos :)16:08
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Sage_sledges: nothing of those is in mer but only there16:09
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sledgesyou are building against Testing16:10
Sage_sledges: -next and -latest16:11
sledgescan I build against ordinary (stable) Mer target?16:11
sledgesi see that I will need to copy your libgfx under my project16:12
Sage_-latest is latest stable16:12
sledges-latest says in your repos: latest_armv7hl (armv8el)16:12
* Sage_ checks16:12
Sage_oh... ffs :D16:12
* Sage_ fixes that16:13
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Sage_fixed :)16:14
sledgesnice thanks!16:14
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sledgesI'll just build against your building repo and will continue to love OBS :D16:15
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sledgesor not :D16:16
sledgespity repos are not inheritant :)16:16
sledgesSage_, I cannot add Mer:fake:Core via https://build.pub.meego.com/project/add_repository?project=home%3Asledge%3AMer%3AHA%3AiMX16:20
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Sage_sledges: do it manually with meta prj -e ;)16:23
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sledgeshaven't yet delved into the cmdline of OBS/osc16:24
sledgeshmm just built libgfx: and it still says nothing provides pkgconfig(libgfx), have choice for libEGL.so.1 needed by mesa-llvmpipe: libgfx-libEGL mesa-llvmpipe-libEGL16:25
Sage_hmmp... I think this libgfx is something different :)16:30
sledgeslibgfx is built16:30
sledgesthe package which depends on it is https://build.pub.meego.com/package/show?package=xorg-x11-drv-imx-viv&project=home%3Asledge%3AMer%3AHA%3AiMX16:31
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Sage_sledges: libgfx that I have doesn't provide pkgconfig(libgfx)16:35
sledgesok, i hink i found a problem: added libgfx under PkgConfigBR instead of PkgBR ;)16:35
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sledgesyup, looks fixed now; and so now it curses on many more other such as libdirectfb16:36
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sledgesSage_, could you crashcourse me in how to add mer:fake:core with meta prj -e ?16:39
sledgespleaase :D16:40
Stskeepslook at topic16:40
Stskeeps"Building against mer in cobs"16:40
sledgesalready found shortcut: copy meta xml via OBS web intefrace from Sage's project :)16:41
* sledges runs and hides again16:41
sledgeslooking positive: just branched libdirect from Sage's, too; toes crossed16:46
sledgesok Sage_, all deps satisfied, last error: have choice for libEGL.so.1 needed by mesa-llvmpipe: libgfx-libEGL mesa-llvmpipe-libEGL, have choice for libEGL.so needed by libgfx: libgfx-libEGL mesa-llvmpipe-libEGL-compat16:52
sledgesall .specs look equivalent to yours16:52
Sage_sledges: https://build.pub.meego.com/project/prjconf?project=home%3Asage%3Amer%3Acubox16:53
sledgesyou're the man!16:53
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sledgesyou live you learn, i wonder how thick OBS book is16:55
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sledgescan't believe it: same HAL/gc_hal.h no such file or dir error :{16:57
sledgesin need of libgfx-devel..17:01
sledgesok, grabbed straw17:02
sledgeshow to include rudimentary archive file (not compile output) in final RPM (in spec/yaml language) ?17:12
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Bostiksledges: copy file at end of %install to %{buildroot}/path/to/somewhere and then just have the file or path in one of the %files sections17:21
Bostiksledges: I've abused that to build easy-to-install media demo packages, and dropped large movie clips in /usr/share/FOO/...17:22
sledgesthank you Bostik17:25
Bostiksledges: if you want to include real .a "archives", that's another matter as rpmbuild goes to great lengths to ensure you don't accidentally ship such libraries :)17:28
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Bostik(it removes them from %{buildroot} behind your back)17:28
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* CosmoHill is round his cousin's17:29
Bostikand the best general advice all week: http://tonyarcieri.com/all-the-crypto-code-youve-ever-written-is-probably-broken17:30
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kulveI'm trying to create a sparse filesystem with ext4_utils' make_ext4fs but the kernel can't mount that. The kernel doesn't seem to recognise the partition being anything sane (ext2/3/4/etc) and stops there. Any hints about using that?17:46
Stskeepskernel version differences?17:47
kulvedifferences between what?17:47
Stskeepswell, host making fs'es your target kernel can't understand17:48
Stskeepsalso, there's a CONFIG_ that we noticed recently.. hmm17:48
kulveI don't see how my host kernel could mess this up, but I guess everything is possible :)17:48
Stskeepswhat's the error?17:49
kulvecan't cut'n' paste that because I have no serial connection but it's the usual what happens when you try to mount e.g. a partition that doesn't have anything17:50
StskeepsCONFIG_EXT4 in kernel? (have to check)17:50
kulveyes, that's on17:50
kulveeither the kernel doesn't somehow understand this "sparse" filesystem, or that make_ext4 does something odd (e.g. file command doesn't recognise the image, but the ubuntu image still works) or the fastboot flash -S doesn't work properly. I'll try to narrow which one could it be..17:51
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vgradeevening all17:53
Stskeepsevening vgrade17:53
kulvebasically my problem is to flash bigger images that can fit to the memory and that's not so common use case with fastboot..17:53
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vgradekulve: this on N717:56
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kulvethe problem is the "fastboot flash -S". I if flash a small image without, it works but if I flash it in two pieces, the kernel can't mount it17:59
kulvewierd sentence but maybe you got the point..17:59
sledgeseve vgrade18:01
vgradeso you have a boot.bin with kernel and dummy initrd which you flash to boot part, then a rfs which goes to another part?18:01
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vgradesledges: \018:01
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vgradeor is the N7 different layout to normal andriod18:02
CosmoHillhi vgrade18:03
kulvevgrade: normal android layout but I'm skipping the initrd because I don't like it. But it seems that it wouldn't affect the situation anyway18:03
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vgradekulve: I've never used on but had to provide a dummy one in the past with init deleted to get a valid boot.img18:06
kulveit works with -S 512M (where 256M < sizeof(rfs) < 512M) but not with -S 256M18:06
kulvevgrade: boot.img works, rootfs not18:06
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vgradekulve: and you don't have a bigger part to copy the rfs to18:08
kulvevgrade: fastboot puts the rfs image first to memory and only then flashes it to the emmc. That limits the size quite a bit..18:08
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vgradekulve: ouch18:11
kulvethere is a system around that but the ubuntu guys are saying that it failed 30% of the attempts. It's been 100% for me so far, but I'll do more thorough testing18:12
vgradehow does the ubuntu untility work18:12
Stskeepskulve: perhaps a system where you can export the emmc over usb..18:13
Stskeepswith a kernel and initrd18:13
vgradeI'm assuming they are tying to load more than ram18:13
vgradeStskeeps: nice idea, like the n95018:13
kulveubuntu has packaged all the android tools as debs. Their fastboot (or just newer fastboot?) can send the rootfs in pieces18:13
vgradeso we could do the same, with a minimal mer then zypper up18:14
kulveStskeeps: booting from usb would be a decent option, yes. Assuming the OTG port works properly in the host mode too18:14
Stskeepskulve: i mean, fastboot takes a kernel or boot image to load into ram18:15
Stskeepsand who said anything about host mode, just do g_file_storage gadget :)18:15
kulvehmm.. I'm not that familiar with g_file_storage. How does one configure it? What would the host side see?18:16
Stskeepsa usb disk18:17
Stskeepsi presume this is a emmc deep down anyway?18:17
Stskeepswhat we do on n950 is basically to export the partition over usb18:17
kulve(I think so at least)18:17
Stskeepsor the whole disk18:17
vgradehttps://build.pub.meego.com/package/show?package=moslo&project=home%3Amarquiz%3An950 n950 moslo18:17
Stskeepsand just write ;)18:17
RaYmAnyou really don't want to export whole disk on n718:18
RaYmAnthere is no way to recover if you mess up the first ~8mb of the eMMC18:18
Stskeepswell, a partition then18:18
kulveStskeeps: how do I select what to export?18:19
RaYmAnkulve: sysfs entries18:19
kulveI can flash the kernel without a problem so I can modify that freely18:19
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Stskeepskulve: the magic happens in the initrd.. sec18:20
Stskeepskulve: modprobe g_file_storage file=/dev/mmcblk0p1 stall=0 removable=1 nofua=118:21
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Stskeepsfor example18:21
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RaYmAnI suppose that works too =P Alternatively, it is possible to set it up dynamically through sysfs :)18:21
kulve"Posted by Angana Ghosh, Product Manager in Android: Today we are making Android 4.2 (Jelly Bean) SDK platform available for download"18:22
Stskeepsfirst now?18:22
RaYmAnthey also have factory images for 4.2 nexus 718:22
RaYmAnand the AOSP sourcecode is being pushed :)18:22
kulveStskeeps: and how do I actually create the initrd..?18:22
vgradetools in the link above to moslo18:23
Stskeepskulve: a initrd is practically a cpio.gz18:23
kulveStskeeps: yeah, I actually did extract the ubuntu one to see what it has eaten..18:24
Stskeepshmm, should probably charge my touchpad..18:27
vgradekulve: what about nvflash, apx mode is that not supported on N718:28
RaYmAnvgrade: it's locked down.18:28
RaYmAnyou can get in apx mode, but it's no use given it requires knowing the SBK18:30
vgradeRaYmAn: been there before eh18:30
RaYmAnvgrade: indeed. Sadly, the methods used to get nvflash on tf201, tf300 and tf700 didn't pan out on nexus7 :(18:31
kulveI have tried now flashing with "fastboot flash -S" several times and it seems to fail always. So maybe I'll hack some initrd image and try that. Or then I'll just pass the g_file_storage in the kernel command line? Although can I somehow tell the kernel that it doesn't need the rootfs at all..18:32
RaYmAnso uhm, why are you wanting to flash it as a sparse image? issues with size?18:32
Stskeepskulve: CONFIG_DEVTMPFS_MOUNT may come in handy then18:33
Stskeepsyou probably need some mini fs for it to mount /dev at though18:33
Stskeepskulve: other insane possibilities involve NFS boot18:33
RaYmAnStskeeps: that option doesn't work with an initrd, heh.18:33
StskeepsRaYmAn: arh18:34
RaYmAnthrew me off last time I used that,lol18:34
RaYmAnbut tbh, you can just use a small statically compiled binary as /init18:34
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RaYmAnif all you need is to setup e.g. a partition for writing18:34
Stskeepsyeah, true18:35
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kulveI think I'll modify the ubuntu initrd and replace the init shell script to do what I need. It already does some initialisation, so I could just run a modprobe after that and sleep forever.18:36
RaYmAnone of the "nice" (as well as annoying) features of g_file_storage, is that it exports the raw partition..meaning it's possible to create filesystems etc18:37
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kulveUbuntu kernel has this built-in: "The Android gadget driver supports multiple USB functions"18:39
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Stskeepsi typically disable the android gadget driver18:39
kulveI think I tried but then I failed to compile the kernel.. I'll try again18:40
kulvewould g_mass_storage be better than g_file_storage?18:41
Stskeepsmight be same thing but different name18:41
kulve"This driver is an updated replacement for the deprecated File-backed Storage Gadget (g_file_storage)."18:41
Stskeepsi guess so then18:41
kulvelet's try18:41
faeniloh come on w00t I deserve an answer to the vibration comment :D18:43
faenilas harsh as that might be :D18:43
w00thehe, not sure what to say18:44
w00tnaming is a fun game, anyway18:44
faenilsay that, you like my name ;) don't be shy ;)18:45
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kulveStskeeps: yeah, won't compile..18:51
Stskeepsyay :/18:51
kulvesomething depends on the symbols provided by the android gadget and I think that something is important..18:52
Stskeepsok then18:53
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kulveI think the android gadget provides mass storage as well, but I wonder if it's suitable for this use case..18:56
lbtandroid gadget has slightly different semantics in a few calls afaict18:57
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kulve#include "f_mass_storage.c"18:58
lbtrndis_bind_config() needed extra USB  id information18:58
kulvealways looks good..18:58
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shmerlHi. There is a current questions list for Jolla which community pland to send them shortly after the Slush event.19:07
shmerlCan we use some page on the Mer wiki for collecting answers (in Q&A form)?19:07
shmerlThere were concerns that Maemo.org wiki can be decomissioned. Meego.com wiki doesn't seem reliable as well.19:08
shmerlThread about the questions is here: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=8776419:08
Stskeepslet's try to keep the mer wiki as kinda vendor agnostic :) i'm sure jolla will find a good way to answer and send them19:08
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shmerlSure they can send the answer, but community has no place to publish stuff ATM, except the Maemo.org infrastructure.19:09
shmerlAnd it's becoming not reliable in the long term.19:09
Stskeepswell, there's the tmo thread..19:09
shmerlI wouldn't mind if something like forum.merproject.org would come up.19:09
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shmerlSure, I can post answers there, but it's not as presentable.19:10
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shmerlMer wiki can have a page for community relations with vendors.19:11
shmerlI don't think it's too much offtopic for Mer site.19:11
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shmerlI.e. list communication channels, common FAQs and etc.19:11
shmerlThere is this already: https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Main_Page#End_Users19:12
shmerlWe can just extend it a bit with brief info and references about those vendors and may be Q&A data.19:13
shmerlI wouldn't mind if Jolla could publish the answers on their site - but they have none :)19:14
Stskeeps#jollamobile exists too btw :)19:14
shmerlPlus maintaining the list on the wiki is better, since we can add more info when we'll find out more.19:14
shmerlWell, they know people wait for their site, I won't bug them about it :)19:15
vgradekulve: were you using something similar to http://www.mattfischer.com/blog/?p=28519:16
shmerlIs there capacity on the merproject server to set up a forum by the way (I mean hosting wise)?19:16
shmerlvgrade: Oh, by the way. How did Ubuntu pulled it through? They got all drivers?19:17
dm8tbrthere are mailing lists19:17
Stskeepsshmerl: we use mailing lists as that's what is appropiate for our goals19:17
shmerldm8tbr: Mailing list are fine. Forums are other medium of communication, they aren't the same.19:17
shmerlStskeeps: They suit for vendors relation better. But not always as good for working with the community.19:18
shmerlAt least having forums won't hurt I think. It can only help.19:18
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Stskeeps:nod: i do agree, but there's no common mer app story and communities are more likely to revolve around devices (hw adaptations) and uis (plasma active, sailfish, nemo, etc)19:19
shmerlWhat concerns me is that TMO will probably just disappear at some point.19:19
* dm8tbr would certainly not want to see the TMO crowd waltz into Mer...19:19
wmaronethere's nothing for them in Mer19:20
dm8tbrthey just have no real overlap19:20
shmerlStskeeps: That's possible, and that's why it's also good for them to have one conergence palce like forum.merproject.org19:20
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shmerldm8tbr: Who "they"?19:20
shmerlDevelopers and end users have a lot of overlap.19:20
shmerlI'm not talking about vendors - Mer relations.19:21
Stskeepsshmerl: i'll be honest here: i delimit mer very intentionally as it's one that needs to survive through shifting user communities, vendors, devices19:21
shmerlWell, forum is not a palce to direct Mer. It's just a place for people to communicate.19:22
dm8tbrshmerl: neither developers nor users have direct stake in Mer. they are down stream behind the 'vendors' (which can be also OSS projects like Nemo or plasma)19:22
shmerldm8tbr: This doesn't preclude a benefit of having a common communication medium for all of them.19:22
dm8tbrshmerl: it neither does force merproject to provide it19:23
Stskeepsshmerl: what i do hope will happen is many different ui projects, like maui, plasma active, stb, etc.. i liked talk.maemo.org but it became troublesome when it got overloaded19:23
shmerlNo one forced it. I was asking if it has a capacity.19:23
dm8tbrespecially if it would possibly lead to confusion or misunderstanding19:23
Stskeepsshmerl: i do encourage places like opentablets though19:23
shmerlCommunity can work on making the forum and etc.19:23
shmerlStskeeps: I tried to encourage those.19:24
shmerlDidn't really attact people because it looks too external.19:24
Stskeepsinternettablettalk was external :)19:24
shmerlThose I didn't even see.19:24
shmerlforum.merproject.org will be more solid just name wise.19:25
shmerlConfusion can be resolved - it's not an issue.19:25
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shmerlIt can have sections explicitly for vendors relation, Mer derivatives communities and etc.19:25
Stskeepsi don't see a need for a mer forum, sorry, but i do hope to see vendors that share a common app story work on these things together19:26
shmerlI'm just telling you that it'll increase the mess.19:26
shmerlEspecially if TMO won't be migrated.19:26
shmerlAnd will just evaporate.19:26
shmerlIf you worry about TMO cluttering - just encourage more moderation.19:27
Stskeepsthis is my own private opinion (and sometimes controversial), but i doubt tmo will last beyond the year19:27
Stskeepsand in destruction there's new life19:28
shmerlI expect it to last even less.19:28
vgradeshmerl: nvidia are one of the best SoC vendors when iy comes to linux support unlike their desktop offerings19:28
shmerlAnd here are concerns about Wiki disappearnces: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=8781519:28
Stskeepsand for many of us we had the feeling we had to go out and start fresh, to avoid having the baggage, and create good communities from bottom up19:29
Stskeepsso there's ability for people to participate in mer in the ways we've set out in order to have a healthy community19:29
Stskeepsgoing forward, people can collaborate and work in mer, nemo, plasma active, sailfish, etc19:30
shmerlvgrade: So in theory one should be able to run PA on Nexus 7 with accelratino and all bells & whistles?19:30
Stskeepsprobably yes19:30
shmerlThen I wonder why they don't use it for Vivaldi.19:31
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shmerlStskeeps: Sure. Some fresh start will benefit TMO which is stagnating. But so far there is no single point of convergence. OpenTablets didn't pick up.19:32
shmerlYou look at things from working with vendors perspective. But it's not the only one.19:33
Stskeepsshmerl: i'm aware - we have a limited purpose here and we can work together if we're very different goals19:34
Stskeepsand frankly, if we got tmo into here, we'd loose, not gain contributors19:34
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Stskeepsso i'm just guarding something precious here, really19:34
shmerlHm. May be. I'm not really proposing to "move" the whole TMO.19:35
shmerlJust to offer an alternative.19:35
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shmerlWhen Meego.com came up (the forum) - it was very good.19:35
Stskeepspeople will regroup as needed, many do'ers are already in mer, nemo and other places19:35
shmerlAlas, Meego just died.19:35
shmerlI.e. Meego.com forum was development oriented, technical and to the point.19:35
Stskeepsthis is, fwiw, my own opinion19:36
shmerlWell, I'm not proposing to dilute Mer as a focused project. Just thinking what should work as a "better TMO".19:37
Stskeepsand i'll have to say: no, forum isn't a good idea and i don't see a need for it currently - and that's my decision to make19:37
Stskeepsand the good thing about tmo wasn't tmo itself, but the fact people could get into areas and collaborate - here we have a similar feeling, people work together on efforts19:37
shmerlI guess when TMO will close, they'll naturally be forced to come up with something else.19:37
Stskeepsanyhow, we're drifting in topic19:37
Stskeepskulve: maybe there's a mass storage thing in the android gadget?19:38
Stskeepsif it's anything like g_multi19:38
Stskeepsshmerl: https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Zephyr is next thing i'm ramping up19:39
shmerlIs it a combination of DE + session manager?19:40
Stskeepswell, think next generation nemo19:40
Stskeepsbuilding blocks for the future19:41
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shmerlI see. And Jolla might use it as well?19:41
shmerlOr it's still in alpha state?19:41
Stskeepsi don't know :) let's see where it goes19:41
Stskeepssaw maui project btw?19:42
shmerlNo, searching it now :)19:43
shmerlLooks interesting - it seems to be a whole distro with focus on using Qt for UI. Are they using Mer?19:44
Stskeepstheir own thing atm, it's qt5+wayland19:45
shmerlAh, they have some other architecture - no packages they write.19:45
shmerlBundles approach.19:45
shmerlI.e. everything is always bundled I guess. How do they overcome the bloat though?19:46
shmerlI feel it's kind of extreme.19:47
shmerlAndroid leans towards bundling, and it's not the best thing there.19:47
shmerlMay be some hybrid approach is best.19:48
shmerlI.e. packages with dependencies with optional bundles of certain versions of packages.19:49
shmerlI saw RedHat uses something of that sort.19:49
shmerlThey call it "collections"19:49
shmerlI.e. bundles isolate packages, so they don't collide.19:50
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shmerlStskeeps: So do you think that hawaii desktop can share some effort with Zephyr?19:57
Stskeepssame with kde on qt519:57
Stskeepsvery similar challenges to solve19:57
shmerlSpecifically with Kwin or in general?19:58
Stskeepsin general19:58
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Stskeepsjust to make it a lot easier to make interesting systems20:00
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kulvevgrade: yeah, that's the page I started from20:00
kulveI might actually try a different approach now that I know I can (maybe) create a big filesystem with little data on it. I only need to get the wifi working (assuming it will work) to install more stuff20:00
shmerlvgrade: I wonder if PlasmaActive are secretly working on their release for Nexus 7 now, as Vivaldi :)20:07
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vgradeshmerl: they are working on this20:13
shmerlOn Nexus 7? It's exciting then.20:13
vgradevgrade_: no sorry this20:13
shmerlYou mean on Vivaldi in general?20:14
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shmerlYeah, I know they are working, but they didn't share any details about the hardware choice since their shift.20:14
shmerlIf Nexus 7 can be fully functional - then it's probably the best option around.20:15
shmerlVery interesting, thanks!20:17
shmerlLooking at that it seems that "Identify manufacturer of tablet" step isn't completed.20:18
shmerlAaron on the other hand said before that they did make a choice already. That's confusing.20:19
vgradeI'm sure they are looking at more than one solution20:19
shmerlI see. I sure hope they won't abandon 7" size because it's "small".20:20
vgradeN7 woud be a good target20:21
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kulveubuntu is working on n7 so it will most likely have nice momemtum20:22
shmerlWell, if it has drivers, Mer/PA should run there? May be Basyskom can release some images.20:24
shmerlI'd prefer PlasmaActive to Ubuntu.20:24
kulveyeah, I don't see any reason for Mer not to run on it with all the candies20:25
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kulveit's *really* annoying to debug a device that has no serial connection, no ethernet, no keyboard and no touchscreen20:32
Stskeepskulve: that's part of the fun ;)20:32
kulveI'll continue the fun on some other day..20:33
lbtkulve: tell me about it ... do you have a screen?20:34
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[ol]Hi! I want to build Mer for x86_64. I'm trying to find instructions how to setup build environment to build all packages for that architacture, but I found nothing so far. Am I missing something obvious?20:38
Stskeepsif you can promise me you won't need multilib, i'm happy to help20:40
[ol]I want to build everything on my computer, not relying on external OBS and stuff. My build host is Fedora 17 x86_64.20:40
Stskeeps[ol]: francois or something like that did a build for SH4 lately20:41
[ol]Stskeeps: So far I don't need multilib. I just want to build Plasma Active on my netbook. As it's based on Mer, I'd like to try building Mer first.20:41
Stskeeps[ol]: and he started out by bootstrapping utilizing scratchbox2 in sdk20:41
Stskeepsand then fed it into his OBS20:41
Stskeepsdo you have a toolchain and sysroot for x86_64 already?20:42
[ol]Actually, I'd like to have build environment to build for any architecture from scratch, like "make world" in FreeBSD.20:42
Stskeepsyou and me both, but we're not nearly there yet20:43
[ol]Stskeeps: I have nothing so far.20:43
StskeepsOK, start out by getting a cross compiler and sysroot with glibc and glibc headers in it + kernel headers20:43
Stskeepsyou'll have to feed this into a OBS at some point for a clean port though20:44
[ol]Stskeeps: Can I have local OBS?20:44
Stskeepsmer's designed to let anybody rebuild it locally if they want20:44
[ol]Stskeeps: Could you please point me to instructions how to install local OBS?20:45
Stskeepslbt, where was the link to set up a mer obs?20:45
Stskeeps[ol]: btw, this is a substantial effort but it's possible to do by one person20:46
[ol]lbt: And while you're here, could you please allow me access to https://api.pub.meego.com ?20:47
lbtsure, username?20:47
lbtdone, have fun :)20:48
[ol]lbt: Thank you!20:48
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[ol]Stskeeps: OK, do in order to cross-compile packages, I need OBS, right?20:49
Stskeeps[ol]: grab mer platform sdk, set up a sb2 target with your toolchain and sysroot, and build these packages: http://pastie.org/5373683 manually with rpmbuild -bb for x86_6420:50
Stskeeps[ol]: this gives you the self-consistent set of packages that you can load into a obs20:50
Stskeepsand ask a lot of questions20:51
[ol]Stskeeps: The only SDK available on https://img.merproject.org/images/sdk/ is for i486. Can I use it to build for x86_64 target natively?20:52
shmerlShould SB2 in theory support x86_64 targets?20:52
Stskeepsshmerl: sure20:52
Stskeeps[ol]: yes, just get a binary toolchain built for x8620:52
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lbtmeego wiki is back btws20:55
Stskeeps[ol]: else, you can probably start with a mer cross compiler spec, dump in, let's say, debian's kernel headers and glibc/devel into a sysroot20:58
Stskeepsand go from there20:58
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Stskeepsthat might be cleaner20:58
rZrlbt, yes so are harmattan-dev docs20:59
[ol]Stskeeps: OK, now I'm in SDK chroot. Where is sysroot?20:59
rZrlbt, in case  of https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/MeeGo20:59
Stskeeps[ol]: sysroot is practically just a place that contains stuff for your target21:00
Stskeepsso it's any path you choose21:00
lbtrZr: I have a full DB level backup of the wiki - no worries21:00
[ol]Stskeeps: If I was building for armv7hl, where sysroot would be located?21:00
Stskeeps[ol]: https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Platform_SDK_and_SB221:01
lbt[ol]: go through http://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Platform_SDK and ... ^ url21:01
Stskeepsprobably good background21:01
shmerlHehe, I just wanted to post the same link.21:01
rZrlbt, good but could those snapshot be downloaded ?21:02
Stskeeps[ol]: did you have a mer gerrit account?21:02
lbtrZr: ?21:02
rZrlbt, wiki dumps ? to be used offline by anyone21:03
[ol]Stskeeps: Yes, I have.21:03
lbtno, I think I'd need to sanitise them and don't currently have time21:03
Stskeeps[ol]: ok, as a start, let's make a cross compiler21:04
rZrwell thx anyway to all21:04
Stskeeps[ol]: git clone ssh://yourusername@review.merproject.org:29418/mer-core/gcc21:04
lbtit was Adam at intel who fixed it21:04
Stskeepsthat gets you the gcc packaging21:04
rZris he on irc ?21:04
Stskeeps[ol]: btw, are you going for x86_64 or x32?21:06
[ol]Stskeeps: x86_6421:06
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[ol]Stskeeps: Do I understand correctly that SDK is just a Mer in chroot with development packages installed?21:07
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Stskeeps[ol]: correct, it has a tools dir beyond that21:07
Stskeepserr, repo21:07
Stskeeps[ol]: it makes sure we have right tools and versions on any distro21:07
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Stskeeps[ol]: also clone /mer-core/binutils21:09
Stskeeps[ol]: so the first thing you'd want to do is to build a binutils for your target, you don't need sb2 for that21:13
Stskeepsyou can just rpmbuild inside the mer sdk21:13
Stskeepsyou modify precheckin.sh to include x86_64 and run it, then edit binutils.spec http://gitweb.merproject.org/gitweb?p=mer-core/binutils.git;a=blob;f=binutils.spec;h=813a309b79fd899f46d5fae55468caaaea4534e9;hb=master#l40 to add cross-x86_64-binutils , as well as http://gitweb.merproject.org/gitweb?p=mer-core/binutils.git;a=blob;f=binutils.spec;h=813a309b79fd899f46d5fae55468caaaea4534e9;hb=master#l36621:15
Stskeepsand re-run precheckin.sh21:15
[ol]Stskeeps: Like "rpmbuild --target x86_64-pc-linux -bb PACKAGE.rpm"?21:15
Stskeepsnah, this is for the mer sdk at first21:15
Stskeepsrpmbuild'ing for target is possible later21:15
Stskeepswe want to have a cross toolchain first (gcc, binutils, glibc headers/libraries and kernel headers)21:15
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Stskeepsthat runs on top of mer sdk21:16
[ol]OK, so I need to build another cross-compiling toolchain, like cross-armv7hl-binutils and cross-armv7hl-gcc packages, right?21:16
Stskeepsyes, that's what i was describing :)21:16
Stskeepsso we'll first build cross-x86_64-binutils as gcc needs that21:17
Stskeepsand install it into our sdk21:17
[ol]Those Git repositories are quite large... GCC was already cloned, Binutils are in progress...21:19
[ol]Binutils done.21:19
Stskeepsonce you've done cross-binutils, you'll want to add http://gitweb.merproject.org/gitweb?p=mer-core/gcc.git;a=blob;f=gcc.spec;h=c8830fec00b01fa6bb1bbfe874f54558303f9851;hb=HEAD#l21 to have x86_64 too, add a section like http://gitweb.merproject.org/gitweb?p=mer-core/gcc.git;a=blob;f=gcc.spec;h=c8830fec00b01fa6bb1bbfe874f54558303f9851;hb=HEAD#l75 matching x86_64 needs and again, precheckin.sh modification and run it21:19
Stskeepsyou'd want to put a glibc devel and so on into /opt/cross/x86_64-meego-linux-gnu/sys-root at that point21:20
Stskeepsbut let's take binutils first21:20
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Stskeepssudo zypper in rpm-build meego-rpm-config gcc gcc-c++ glibc-devel make21:21
Stskeepsat least21:21
Stskeepsinto sdk21:21
* lbt burns *another* kernel21:21
Stskeepsthen you can attempt a rpmbuild -bb cross-x86_64-binutils.spec21:22
Stskeeps(you may need to set up ~/rpmbuild/{BUILD,BUILDROOT,SPECS,SOURCES,SRPMS,RPMS,OTHER} and put the binutils sources in SOURCES and do rpmbuild in there)21:24
Stskeepstime to sleep, bbl21:27
Stskeeps[ol]: feel free to ask any questions, i've done this before for armv7hl21:27
Stskeepstook ~week21:27
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sledgesevening chaps22:11
sledgescould anyone put me back on track having had a glance: https://build.pub.meego.com/package/live_build_log?arch=armv8el&package=xorg-x11-drv-imx-viv&project=home%3Asledge%3AMer%3AHA%3AiMX&repository=latest_armv7hl22:12
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vgradesledges: nothing I've seen before22:21
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sledgesvgrade, it looks like kernel headers are required22:30
Sage_lbt: is the .0.2 already pushed to cobs?22:30
sledgeswill be a challenge porting from ltib to obs :)22:30
lbtSage_: yes22:31
* Sage_ creates nemo snapshot for -next22:32
Sage_Warning: Package liberation-mono-fonts- is damaged: /home/sage/git/daily-image-builder/mic-cache/nemo-kickstarter-configs/packages/mer-core/liberation-mono-fonts-
Sage_I've always pondered what is the cause for that (cc: phaeron)22:33
phaeronwhere is that ?22:41
Sage_locally when I build image with mic22:42
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Sage_it happens from time to time22:44
phaeronI only see this when same package name and version has different checksum in latest vs. next. best is to have the repo names in the kickstart different so the cache is separate22:44
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phaeronrepo name="mer-core-latest" and repo name="mer-core-next" so that they cache separately22:45
Sage_well I'm building many .ks files with same cache so maybe that is it22:45
Sage_Info: Retrieving xorg-x11-filesystem-7.3-1.3.noarch.rpm [344/173] ... ;)22:46
phaeronpackages in latest and next can have same name and version but different md5sum22:46
Sage_ah, well that makes sense.22:50
Sage_whyt the warning is caused. Though I'm not sure I understand why so many packages differ in md5sum22:51
Sage_is there -next indicator added to the rpm's or something?22:51
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sledgesok chaps, pls help, I'm close to solving: I just added kernel-adaptation-...-devel package as dependency, still getting same 'gceTILING undefined' error. But gceTILING is defined under kernel's arch/arm/mach-dove/gc6000_driver_dove/galore_ko_src/hal/gc_hal_enum.h - how to tell OBS to look there for includes ? (my spec: https://build.pub.meego.com/package/view_file?file=xorg-x11-drv-imx-viv.spec&package=xorg-x11-drv-imx-v23:05
phaeronSage_: no indicator unfortunately23:05
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sledgesjust found again in Sage's exactly the bit: -I/usr/src/kernels/%{kernel_version}/arch/arm/mach-dove/gc600_driver_dove/galcore_ko_src/hal/inc/" aaa I thought all the bits will be generic instructions and not hardcoded snippets :D23:09
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lbtwmarone: ping23:39
wmaronewhat's up23:39
lbtthe nook...23:39
lbtnot getting very far :/23:39
wmaronewhat are you hitting?23:39
wmarone(and in retrospect, I should have done all of this via OBS....)23:40
lbtnah - it's not that23:40
lbtI downloaded 'nooter' 0.2 ... it got me a bootable system23:40
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lbtthe problem is that I can't reproduce that kernel at all23:41
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lbtthe wiki page is a tad vague on what kernel to build23:41
lbtand I'm not quite sure what I should expect to see23:42
lbteg the screen has never even flickered on23:42
lbtno bootload image, no console23:42
lbtbut I do get (with nooter kernel) ssh to cdc_ether23:43
lbtso ... should uboot actually put stuff on the screen ?23:43
wmaroneit should23:43
lbtand should I see a textual console?23:43
wmaroneit depends, sorta, on how you boot it23:43
wmaroneI admit that the first thing I did when I got it was put CM7 on it23:43
lbtwell, pushing the power button23:43
lbtah, I've not done that23:43
wmaroneand they did extensive modifications to the u-boot, which I leveraged23:44
lbtit's a vanilla nook23:44
lbtyeah, I pulled your u-boot23:44
lbtthe nook boot env is... convoluted23:44
lbtso I replaced it with the one used in nooter - to try to boot the nooter kernel ... nothing23:44
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wmaroneI think I hit something like that23:45
lbtI was doing that since I had a system that booted to ssh23:45
lbtand thought I'd replace one component at a time23:45
wmaroneI can't look at it now, but I will dig up what I was doing previously and see if I can't work my way back23:45
lbtno need for that - just some notes on expectations23:46
lbtI don't really want to flash CM723:46
lbtsince it may affect the boot stuff23:46
wmaroneI imagine it does23:46
lbtso, I think step 1 is making u-boot write to the screen23:47
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lbtI just got the B&N source to try that23:47
lbtall the guides point to git repos without mentioning which tag/sha1 to use23:48
lbtalso they rarely mention which config to use with which patch set23:48
wmaronethe nook guide in the meego wiki?23:48
lbtI'm currently aiming at android gadget with rndis23:48
lbtyeah, it's a bit vague23:49
sledgesfellows, when directory surely exists, why OBS spits still the error: vivante_gal/vivante_priv.h:59: error: unknown type name: 'gceTILING' (vivante_priv.h has #include "gc_hal_enum.h" which defines gceTILING and is under CFLAGS -I/usr/src/kernels/3.5.3-4.1-cubox/arch/arm/mach-dove/gc600_driver_dove/galcore_ko_src/hal/inc/, which is provided by BuildRequires: kernel-adaptation-cubox-devel )23:49
wmaronelbt: yeah, it wasn't a very organized effort on my part23:49
lbteg "Building the kernel"  : "The Nook Devs instructions will suffice for building a proper uImage. "23:49
wmaronelbt: oddly they did work, assuming they didn't change everything up since then23:50
lbtB&N kernel just built23:50
lbtoh, the uRamdisk is MIA too23:50
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lbtthat didn't help23:50
wmaroneyeah, I lost that when my external disk went out23:51
wmaronethat said23:51
lbtagain, the nooter one is a simple debian affair that runs ssh over cdc_ether23:51
lbtso I'm kinda hoping to use that23:51
wmaronedon't believe so23:52
wmaronemostly CONFIG_CMDLINE23:53
* wmarone tries to remmeber23:53
lbtyeah - makes sense - it has /init23:53
lbt*g* I know that feeling23:54
lbtwell, if you do get any flashbacks... my main desire is to see something onscreen during boot23:54
wmaroneI'll have to pull up my VMs, I should have an SD card raw image that should work23:55
lbthmm - well, the u-boot has a 'loading' image - but vanilla nook doesn't use it23:59

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