Saturday, 2012-10-20

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lbtphaeron: pong in the morning :)00:45
lbtJake9xx: too00:46
phaeronlbt: it's ok , I was just annoyed someone suddenly rebooted a couple of machines00:46
lbterr - yeah - so I see00:46
lbtthought it was tomorrow00:46
phaeronyeah I kept double checking the email00:47
phaeronbut I guess someone got impatient00:47
lbtwell, bedtime - zathras is up00:48
lbtcobs looks like it may need tlc00:49
lbtmmm no... the post-release rebuild looks fine00:49
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lpotterhmm.. new release03:43
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CosmoHillmorning iekku09:25
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lbtmorning all10:27
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vgrademorn lbt10:36
lbthey vgrade - long time, no chat :)10:37
vgradeon a 4 week sprint at the day job (more of a marathon really)10:37
lbtah :)10:37
vgradejust finished10:37
lbthe niqt10:37
lbtvgrade: my gertboard arrived this morning10:37
vgradeoh, electronics project?10:38
lbtgarden lighting10:38
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lbtwhat's that?10:39
lbtI've been neglecting Pi for a bit10:40
vgradeimage for Pi10:40
vgradewith Qt5 platform plugin10:40
lbtlook out for QtCreator/SDK too10:41
lbtdon't get it yet - still broken10:42
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vgradelbt: I did try an older version, just looped on boot in systemd10:43
lbtyep - I built the image with a development addition10:43
vgradelbt, nice match QtCreator/SDK and Pi10:43
lbtvgrade: yep - certainly good proto stuff10:44
vgradelbt, will we be able to deploy from QtCreator to Pi10:44
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lbtvgrade: yes10:44
lbtthe only issue atm is that QtC is 4.810:45
vgradelbt, I think I've seen something in the QtCreator menus of how to setup ssh10:45
lbtdon't know how it handles Qt510:45
vgradeah ok10:45
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Jake9xxlbt: ping10:46
lbtvgrade: we'll find out!10:46
lbtJake9xx: hey10:46
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lbtJake9xx: read page, wait a minute10:46
lbtjust need to push some buttons10:46
lbtactually image takes ~10m to build10:46
Jake9xxlbt: ok, I'll go make some coffee10:46
Jake9xxlbt: but I'l like the wiki to be a)up to date b)have the quick-guide and the in-detail one, let's see what I come up when doing the sdk stuff10:47
lbtJake9xx: this is SDK install?10:48
lbtwhat's the scope of your review10:48
Jake9xxlbt: install from scratch i.e. new developer getting started10:48
Jake9xxlbt: like "I've read about the #merproject in twitter, how can I dive into it?"10:48
lbtso the SDK/QtC is very much for Nemo App development on top of Mer10:49
vgradelbt "As an example we currently have Qt Creator compiling and running against Qt 4.x and Qt 5 using the same code base."10:49
Jake9xxlbt: pretty much yes10:49
lbtvgrade: good - that should work in this setup10:49
Jake9xxvgrade: can you deploy from QtC as well?10:50
lbtJake9xx: OK - you *could* use it for full on platform SDK too10:50
lbtand.... cobs is playing up...10:51
Jake9xxlbt: right you are, sir. But IMHO we're lacking the getting started quick guides. Our people mostly will and can figure out the needed steps and try out various combinations if they want but if we plan to take on android developer ecosystem we're a long way from that10:51
lbtJake9xx: yep ... good. Just verifying we're on the same page. We are.10:52
vgradelbt, Jake9xx details deplying to Pi from QtC10:52
Jake9xxvgrade: sysroot mentioned10:53
lbtJake9xx: we'll be using git HEAD QtC10:53
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lbtis cobs webui working for anyone?10:55
vgradelbt, ok here10:56
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Stskeepslbt: ok here10:56
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Jake9xxlbt: at least can login and browse projects10:56
lbt ?10:56
Stskeepsworks form e10:56
lbtwell, good I suppose :)10:56
* lbt stops looking at backend logs and looks at LAN10:57
vgrademorn Stskeeps10:57
Stskeepsmorn vgrade10:57
Jake9xxlbt: reboot your router(s)10:57
* Stskeeps takes a look at electrical plan of his new apartment10:58
lbtJake9xx: hehe ... lets just say the LAN here is a bit organic and many years old10:58
lbtI was also playing with PAC recently to test Mer proxy handling10:58
Jake9xxlbt: I was saying to my wife the other day that one my friend has similar hobbies like me in UK, can I pay him a visit - she was like "sure, go" :)10:59
lbtwe have a spare room...10:59
Jake9xxlbt: what's the nearest track?11:00
lbtwales, even11:00
Jake9xxlbt: she was more concerned that I'll bring another 928 from the trip as the n___a severance package money just came in11:00
lbtpfft - get a proper car11:01
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Jake9xxlbt: RHD's over here don't have much value you know11:01
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lbtI'm not sure it'd cope with the winter either11:02
Jake9xxlbt: we don't drive with our loved ones during winter -  that's the maintenance/rebuild time11:02
Jake9xxlbt: usually 928's stand on jack stands a year or two now and then :/11:03
lbtyou're only making the case for a Sag then11:04
Jake9xxlbt: actually a TVR is on my list when mortgage is done (and no new house is bought)11:04
lbtwell, being sensible you should probably arrange to experience one....11:05
phaeronStskeeps: what needs python-urlgrabber in core ?11:05
lbtStskeeps: phaeron suggested yanking ...11:05
lbtwow ... mind reading11:05
Stskeepsphaeron: lookin'11:05
phaeronlbt: hehe11:05
Stskeeps.. i don't have such a package?11:05
phaeronStskeeps: then why is m2crypto in core11:06
lbtm2crypto too11:06
phaeroncome on11:06
* Stskeeps looks11:06
Stskeepsno reason, file a bug to have it removed11:06
phaeronlbt: you or me ?11:07
lbtphaeron: your idea11:07
lbtphaeron: check the patches on it though11:07
lbtI'm not sure what's going on there11:07
* lbt wonders what it would take to get fbdirect on Mer11:09
Stskeepsdirectfb, you mean?11:10
lbtI do11:10
Stskeepsnot much, probably11:10
Stskeepsbut what for/11:10
lbtpretty screen for vbox SDK :)11:10
MerbotMer bug 615 in m2crypto "Remove m2crypto from core" [Normal,New]11:10
Stskeepsis it a task?11:10
phaeronlbt: use plymouth11:10
lbtphaeron: after boot11:10
phaeronStskeeps: dunno , it is broken , so I thought bug11:10
lbtmay just launch X11:11
phaeronlbt: Xvfb11:11
* Stskeeps ponders idly how best to lay cables11:11
lbtStskeeps: is it plastered?11:11
Stskeepswell, some of the walls are11:11
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lbtit's easier than you think to channel plaster, lay cable and plaster/paint11:12
lbtjust to bear in mind11:12
lbtalso putting coving into the upper wall/ceiling corner of the room provides a duct behind it11:12
lbtpolystyrene coving covered in the paper that plasterboard is covered in is cheap/easy/durable11:13
* Stskeeps ponders how much cabling he truly needs11:14
phaeronI did ducts all around the home so I can add cables easily11:15
Stskeeps is new apartment, btw - i'm going to change the colours for sure11:16
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phaeroncongrats. pink!11:17
lbtis it on a boat?11:17
RaYmAnOther than the colors, it looks pretty nice :)11:17
Stskeepsno, thank god :P11:17
lbtit keeps moving up and down11:17
Stskeepslbt: pokaz slajdow button11:18
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Jake9xxlbt: image ready?11:22
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lbtJake9xx: watch log :
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Jake9xxlbt: ok, so we go with this. Wiki to describe steps is Platform_SDK as before?11:29
phaeronStskeeps: can you kick that so I can know if it is a real failure11:29
Stskeepsyes, let me bring up reviewagain11:29
Jake9xxlbt: do we still support old Platform_SDK's chroot approach?11:30
lbtJake9xx: yes11:30
Jake9xxlbt: ok, should it be updated at the same time too?11:30
Stskeepsphaeron: kicked11:31
lbtplatform sdk page is more about mer core package builds slightly different audience11:31
Stskeepsqtc is 'application sdk' angle11:32
Jake9xxlbt: ok, then we just need to introduce the Platform_SDK_on_VirtualBox to be the "first stop"11:32
phaeronah I know why it failed11:32
phaeronstupid spectacle11:32
Jake9xxlbt: because that's where people usually end and are the quite confused :)11:32
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lbt is actually a bit ligt11:34
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Jake9xxlbt: 'Again, good luck. ' LOL11:36
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phaeronStskeeps: how to submit on top of old change ? (log is still 404 btw)11:42
phaeronlbt: ^11:44
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phaeronnm found docs11:47
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lbtJake9xx: try the image now12:03
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Jake9xxlbt: 10-412:12
Jake9xxlbt: image.gz.tar  ?12:13
lbtnah - as per wiki page12:13
Jake9xxlbt: oh, so not from your dir :) ok, I'll follow wiki12:13
lbtI converted the raw image in that tarball to a vdi and then bz212:14
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lbtthat was just a boredom removal log12:14
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Jake9xxlbt: ok, fail - on this x230 at least ; complains about VT-x features eventhou they are on in settings.12:45
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Jake9xxlbt: I have been running nemo vm image on this computer. I'll check some stuff12:47
lbtshould be the same kernel :)12:47
Jake9xxlbt: things to check: only one core12:49
Jake9xxlbt: now it boots12:49
Jake9xxlbt: or not12:50
lbtdoes it start to boot?12:51
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Jake9xxlbt: it starts but boot fails12:52
lbtok - how?12:53
lbtOK - that's not the image :)12:55
Jake9xxlbt: what do you mean, that's the screenshot - also cannot ssh into it12:56
lbtso the SDK runs at console level12:57
lbtno clue what's happening there12:57
lbtwhat version vbox?12:58
Jake9xxlbt: ii  virtualbox                             4.1.12-dfsg-2ubuntu0.112:58
lbtI use that version on my laptop12:58
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Jake9xxlbt: I'll try with older image13:08
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Jake9xxlbt: my laptop enforces memory to me at least 4MB, could that be an issue?13:28
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lbt4Mb ?13:29
Jake9xxlbt: yes, 4Mb13:29
lbtRAM or GFX ?13:30
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Jake9xxlbt: RAM13:30
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lbtI know we're doing mobile/embedded but that's a bit tight :D13:31
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lbttry 512Mb13:31
Jake9xxlbt: oh, how silly .. misread the M to G. hah. I'll try next13:32
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CosmoHillthat's a bit of a difference13:33
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CosmoHillhey vgrade13:34
vgradehey CosmoHill13:34
CosmoHillI'm only here between working on my car13:35
Jake9xxlbt: booted [x]13:36
vgradeCosmoHill: how far did you get with the Pi image?13:36
Jake9xxlbt: I'll add these mistakes to wiki13:37
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Jake9xxlbt: ok, what about QtC stuff then?13:42
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CosmoHillnot very far, it booted and I got those three demos to work13:43
CosmoHillcouldn't figure out how to change the resolution of them tho13:43
CosmoHillthen went to bed13:43
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Stskeepsvgrade: bored?14:38
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vgradejust tidying the office up a bit14:39
Stskeepsvgrade: i have some idle time for getting qtwayland going14:39
vgradeI wanted to get a bit of background on that14:40
Stskeepssure, what do you want to know?14:40
vgradewell I've read a bit about wayland14:41
vgradeand weston14:41
vgradebut how does that relate to qtwayland14:41
Stskeepsweston is an example compositor as such14:41
Stskeepsqtwayland is both a wayland plugin and a compositor toolkit14:41
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Stskeepson r-pi we don't use weston, we only use qtwayland14:42
Stskeepsas it has less needs from the egl/gles stack14:43
vgradeyou say a compositor toolkit, so we sill need a compositor14:44
Stskeepsright, and there's some example ones, like qml-compositor14:44
Stskeepsqwidget-compositor, et14:44
Stskeepsi've made a fork also that is zephyr-compositor which integrates as a systemd user service14:44
vgradeok so we will be able to use that to have multiple windows of qml apps14:45
vgradeok so first qtwayland plugin?14:47
Stskeepson it :P14:47
Stskeepsit might be very simple so checking that atm14:47
Stskeepsyou'll act as tester?14:47
vgradesure, Pi is armed with eglfsrpi14:47
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* Stskeeps ponders14:53
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lbtdo I *really* need to explicitly Requires(pre): /bin/rm when I use 'rm' in a %post section?15:08
vgradeStskeeps: has some notes on this15:08
Stskeepslbt: i personally hate it but it may matter in ordering15:08
Stskeepslbt: what level are you doing it?15:09
Stskeepsie, mer base packages, or stack above?15:09
lbtabove : it's for the sdk-vm package15:09
Stskeepsshouldn't matter much then15:09
lbtit seems to15:09
lbtI'd have thought autoprovreq should spot it tbh15:10
lbtwhich I thought was default15:10
Stskeepsit only does that for #!/ stuff15:11
lbtOk - well, if I'm not doing anything blindingly stupid I'll just live with it15:12
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Stskeepsadd that repo15:23
Stskeepsand install:15:23
Stskeepsqt5-qtwayland-rpi , qt5-qtwayland-rpi-examples15:24
Stskeepsand go for /usr/lib/qt5/examples/qtwayland/qml-compositor/15:26
Stskeepsand ./qml-compositor -platform eglfsrpi &15:26
Stskeepsdo this over ssh, btw15:26
Stskeepsand then try qmlscene -platform wayland15:26
Stskeepsthink i spotted why keyboard isn't working in yat properly meanwhile15:30
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faenilStskeeps, you using yat?15:33
Stskeepsin zephyr, yes15:34
vgradeStskeeps: warning: group root- does not exist - using root15:34
faenilStskeeps, we were thinking about using it for Nemo15:34
faenilas default terminal15:34
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vgradeStskeeps: when installing examples15:35
Stskeepsvgrade: intruiging15:35
faenilMSameer tried porting it to Qt4. but he got stuck at a crash (only tried for an hour or so though :)15:35
Stskeepsvgrade: thanks, fixed in main qtwayland15:36
vgradeStskeeps: nice blue background15:36
Stskeepsgood that it comes up15:37
vgradeStskeeps: and qmlscene also15:38
Stskeepsvgrade: \o/15:38
Stskeepsthat deserves a photo doesn't it15:38
Stskeepstry minimer too?15:39
vgradeUsing Brcm-EGL  getExtendedOutput  This plugin does not support propagateSizeHints() has fullscreen window: true15:39
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vgradefile:///usr/lib/qt5/examples/qtwayland/qml-compositor/WindowContainer.qml:55: TypeError: Cannot set property 'clientRenderingEnabled' of undefined - for qmlscene -platform wayland main.qml (minimer)15:43
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vgradeStskeeps: scratch that , I get the same error on plain qmlscene now. Stopping compositor and starting again15:46
faenilStskeeps, is yat ok for Nemo? I haven't tried it yet15:49
faenilI mean feature-wiseĆ¹15:49
vgrade\o, minimer running transparent over the blue background15:49
Stskeepsvgrade: woo \o/15:49
Stskeepsvgrade: video or photo :)15:50
vgradethen goes fullscreen when clicked15:52
vgradeneed to get another monitor in here15:54
vgradeSo second run of qmlscene reports the error above15:57
vgradeand you need to stop start the compositor15:57
Stskeepsprobably just some apis that are misaligned or whatever15:58
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* faenil wonder if his question was out of place :P16:08
Stskeepsfaenil: nah, just not sure how to answer :)16:08
faenilStskeeps, ok ;)16:08
faenilan ack would at least tell me that :D16:09
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vgradeStskeeps: file:///usr/lib/qt5/examples/qtwayland/qml-compositor/main.qml:113: TypeError: Cannot read property 'parent' of null file:///usr/lib/qt5/examples/qtwayland/qml-compositor/WindowContainer.qml:55: TypeError: Cannot set property 'clientRenderingEnabled' of undefined . When trying to start minimer from running qmlscene16:14
Stskeepsrpm -qa | grep qt516:14
Stskeepslooks fine16:16
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* lbt pushes another SDK VM image16:19
rcghmmm.. the most recent versions of pvr-omap4 are all armhf :/16:29
Stskeepsrcg: mer armv7hl should work fine with that nowadays16:29
rcglast armel build is from some time around february16:29
rcgStskeeps, cool, i see16:30
Stskeepsvgrade: good work16:30
rcgbut Stskeeps if i want, say plasma active in arm7hl i would need to build the entire image myself right?16:30
vgradeStskeeps: your work :)16:30
Stskeepsrcg: correct16:31
Stskeepswhich isn't really difficult16:31
rcgi think i would start off with the .ks file from the official distribution?16:31
vgradeSo is qt5-qtwayland Pi specific with bcrm_egl?16:31
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Stskeepsrcg: if you're lucky you can probably just s/armv7l/armv7hl/16:32
rcgStskeeps, well, i'll give it a try.. but i am not too optimistic right now16:33
vgradeStskeeps: so needs to live in CE:A:Rpi16:33
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rcgStskeeps, do you happen to have a link that explains on how to build images from .ks files?16:33
vgradercg, this is what you want ,
Stskeepsvgrade: yeah, i want to clean it a bit first though16:35
vgradeStskeeps: no probs16:36
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vgradeneed to go do some housework now before guests arrive tonight. Thanks for the help16:37
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rcgvgrade, Stskeeps cool thanks :)16:38
vgradeStskeeps: kulve cristi zuh
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Jake9xxlbt: ping17:12
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kulvevgrade: you got wayland working? sounds cool. I haven't ever tried that, I guess it's about time as soon as I get back to home17:19
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Jake9xxalterego: is '' the latest sdk story ? On the current VM approach it might not work as $PWD translates to $PWD of the current user in host, not the VM17:25
vgradekulve: Stskeeps loaded the gun I fired the bullets, well tested it on top of my eglfsrpi plugin17:28
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vgradekulve: builds on work done by Qt guys already on Rpi, sroedal dcarr etc17:29
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vgradekulve: uses your pc files :)
Jake9xxalterego: this way it works on the MerSKD, I'll play around with the nemo VM stuff now:
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Stskeepslo crevetor17:40
crevetorI see nice things happening with rpi :)17:41
vgradecrevetor: |o17:43
crevetorvgrade: \o17:43
vgradecrevetor: I did an image, linked from the wiki17:44
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crevetorvgrade: gonna try it right now :)17:52
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rcggot a question wrt the SDK: is the chroot method preferred?18:15
Stskeepsfor platform sdk yes18:15
rcgi cant find the chroot tarball for the SDK18:15
Stskeepsthat doesn't sound good.. :P18:15
rcg i assume that's the url?18:16
rcgwell it's not there18:16
Stskeepswe have some trouble with the img host, so18:16
Stskeepslbt: ^18:16
lbtrcg: try now18:17
Stskeepslbt: feel free to put sdk on too18:17
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lbtyep - I need a 'release this ks to this location' boss process18:18
rcglbt, it works :)18:18
rcgthanks :)18:18
lbtrcg: yeah - I typo'ed an rm18:18
lbtit's a symlink though so it's fine18:18
lbtif anyone wants to try the Vbox SDK install I'd appreciate feedback18:19
lbtyou can actually share targets with chroot SDK too18:20
rcglbt, i tried the bzipped vdi but couldn't start properly18:20
Stskeepslbt: or, 'hmm, let me run this scp to this location' ;)18:22
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Jake9xxlbt: is the chroot image up-to-date?18:30
Jake9xxlbt: it's about 1m old18:31
lbtJake9xx: it kinda is - the VM SDK is pre-release/rollnig18:31
Jake9xxrcg: memory : 2024Mb , port forwardings and VT-x stuff in order?18:31
lbttechnically it could be redone with later Mer - but I'll do that when I do SDK release I think18:32
lbtrcg: we're interested in what issues people face gettng it going18:32
Jake9xxlbt: here's one of our problems currently.. there are quite too many 'sdk's out there18:33
lbtwell, there are 218:33
Jake9xxlbt: and what people want is a nemomobile (or any VM with ui) where they can build and deploy apps with qt creator18:33
Jake9xxlbt: with two alternatives you have a risk of 50% to go wrong18:34
lbtnot really - there will be different communication channels and routes to discovery18:34
Jake9xxlbt: I hope that you're right :)18:36
* Jake9xx has seen quite many developer stories go south18:36
lbtthe wiki is not related to an app developer story18:36
lbtwe need to be clear about that18:36
lbtthe mer wiki vbox SDK is a solution to provide to a vendor18:37
lbtthey then distribute it18:37
lbtdoes that make more sense?18:37
Jake9xxone question ; in this context what is 'vendor' ?18:38
lbtnemo or jolla or PA18:38
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lbtgotta go out ... bbiab18:39
lbtrcg: detailed feedback would be good if you have time18:39
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Jake9xxlbt: later18:39
phaeronlbt: merds died ?18:39
phaeronlbt: it doesn't come back up after reboot ? (cf. maintenance)18:41
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rcglbt, sure, ping me or drop me a mail with what kind of detailed feedback you need18:42
phaeronrestarted it with nohup18:44
phaeronThe system is going down for system halt NOW!18:46
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nemolbt: wrong nemo? :-p18:54
nemolbt: I'm just here due to some thing about GLES2 for RPI18:54
vgradenemo ,.
nemovgrade: heh. no so much mer, but someone here did a writeup on building GLES2 apps on RPI :)18:58
Stskeepsvgrade: looks good18:58
nemoI'm hanging out for when I get around to trying to cross-compile hedgewars properly18:58
nemosince it runs at about 5fps in software rendering18:58
faenilStskeeps, no libmagic in Mer?19:00
rcghmm.. seems like the obs has some hickup: "connect to shell :8001: no route to host"19:00
rcgor did i break something in a very funny fashion?19:01
Stskeepsthere's upgrades on tday19:01
Stskeepsfaenil: in file-libs19:02
Stskeepsand file-devel is devel headers19:02
faenilStskeeps, roger, thanks19:03
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faenilstill getting "No connection to dbus manager" or smthg like that when updating packages in MerSDK...19:08
faenilwasn't that fixed time ago?19:08
faenilgot to "ignore" every time bluez, sensorfw and the whole family are updated19:09
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faenilignores are actually related to "erase failed" errors, which still happen19:11
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lbtrcg: [20/10/2012 19:20] <rcg> lbt, i tried the bzipped vdi but couldn't start properly  <= so what happened?19:27
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Jake9xxI'm downloading a nemomobile image at 25kB/s.. only 50min remaining19:35
* Jake9xx just loves finnish broadband operators... thanks to their "competence" I got cut off and they'll reconnect on monday19:36
Jake9xxso, Joikuspot on my N701 and wifihotspot on my N9 are in use :/19:37
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rcglbt, well, to start i am not even sure if i have the correct vm configuration. e.g., i chose generic linux 2.619:54
cat_x301Jake9xx: consider LTE? i just took 4G usb stick for trial and combined it with tp-link 3020 -- so far looks good.19:54
cat_x301Jake9xx: ah, forgot to mention that it is sonera.19:54
lbtrcg: did you read the wiki page?19:55
rcglbt, my bad.. apparently not :/19:55
lbtyou missed the small and subtle screenshot? :D19:55
fk_lxhi everyone - I often forget to greet people on IRC ;-)19:55
Stskeepslo fk_lx19:56
lbthey fk_lx19:56
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fk_lxfinally I've found time to try Nemo on N90019:57
fk_lxand what I've saw is that a lot of hard work has been done19:57
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rcglbt, ah well, i am already using linux 2.6... and yes, the screenshot is really subtle ;)19:58
lbtrcg Jake9xx I'm changing the NAT mappings on the wiki19:59
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rcglbt, ah, i missed the shared folder... now it got further20:01
lbtrcg: important20:01
lbtdid it complain in the console in a meaningful way ?20:02
lbtif not then you may have too old a VDI (ie not this afternoon's)20:02
rcgit said that /home/mersdk failed to mount and then spammed lots of other errors20:03
rcgi guess that's what had confused me20:03
lbtok - that's an old image20:03
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rcgi see20:03
lbtsorry but it's very active development at the moment :)20:04
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rcglbt, np :)20:05
rcgi think active development is actually very good :)20:05
rcgbtw is it safe to share the targets directory among different vms?20:05
rcgnot at the same time of course20:05
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rcgjust in case things get updated in newer vms20:06
lbtrcg: the targets are safe to share20:07
lbtand actually, yes, at the same time too20:08
lbtthey're read-mainly20:08
lbtso as long as you don't update them in 2 places at once you're OK20:08
rcgnice :)20:09
lbtalso since your $HOME is shared then .sb2 is also shared20:09
rcgi see20:09
lbtthat *could* cause issues though - we'll see20:09
lbtright now I like that my platform SDK and my Creator SDK are very similar indeed20:09
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rcgwell, honestly, for me it is the first time i mess with the mer sdk20:11
rcgup to now i just compiled in my harmattan scratchbox and then used the obs to package rpms20:11
lbtthe Mer Platform SDK is primarily for working on Mer and Nemo packages (and vendors will use it too)20:12
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lbtthe VM one you're playing with will be integrated with QtCreator and used for Qt Apps20:13
rcgi see, sounds cool :)20:13
lbthope so20:13
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rcghehe, right ;) i'll keep my fingers crossed20:14
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CosmoHilllbt: I got carried away a bit:
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