Sunday, 2012-10-07

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Stskeepsmorn05:22
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Stskeepsgood morning sonach05:40
sonachhey Stskeeps! Still at work on sunday?05:40
Stskeepssonach: i think it's safe to say that i never really stop working, i just take long breaks ;)05:41
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sonachcool :P at least I play basketball everyday...05:42
sonachand mer IRC is one part of my life, so after I boot my computer, i will join this channel :P05:44
Stskeepshehe05:44
Stskeepsi should do more sports.. i like to play badminton but i'm not really a sporty type05:44
Stskeepsbut am starting to feel that working from home and constantly isn't good for my health05:45
sonachStskeeps: hmm, yes, in my POV, doing sports everyday is very important. Otherwise, someday in the future, you will suddenly find that you are less productive than before, and it is hard to recover from this bad state...05:46
* dm8tbr rediscovered his tennis racket yesterday in one of the moving boxes...05:46
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Stskeepssonach: yeah05:48
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specialStskeeps: bah, buy a nice chair, there's no reason to do anything extreme05:50
special(such as "exercise".)05:50
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Stskeepswhen i get my new apartment, i'll have space to put my bike in parking lot underneath, hope to start cycling again..05:50
sonachStskeeps: from the irc log, it seems that openwebos guy are paying attention to mer and even do something based on mer?05:53
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Stskeepssonach: i think he's just exploring :) personally i think openwebos would have a lot of use of mer, but i think that there's probably a software programme that we don't know details of, in HP itself05:54
Stskeepsand hence they'd have difficulties changign build systems05:54
Stskeepsunless also that software programme changed05:55
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sonachStskeeps: hmm,yes.  and another question. Since most chip vendors only support android-hw-adaption, and mer can work on these chips by libhybris, what does this mean to X11 and wayland?05:58
Stskeepssonach: the idea is to enable wayland on top of libhybris05:59
Stskeepssonach: when we say wayland in practice we mean structured sharing of buffers and composition anyway06:00
sonachStskeeps: ok, maybe it is better to discuss this later when running mer on my TV/STB platforms :P06:03
Stskeeps:nod:06:03
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kulvevgrade: with a first look, I don't understand where it states that it would need that..06:19
dm8tbrStskeeps: btw, I asked one of the TI guys and he said that getting wayland up on an android driver would still need considerable work all over the place06:19
kulvevgrade: I did upgrade those yesterday but didn't have time to properly test them06:19
Stskeepsdm8tbr: full wayland yes06:20
Stskeepsdm8tbr: qml compositor wayland, less so06:20
dm8tbrok06:21
Stskeepsi've done it with my own WSEGL in the past, so06:22
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kulvevgrade: arm-none-linux-gnueabi-ld lib/libmmal.so06:48
kulvevgrade: arm-none-linux-gnueabi-ld: warning: libmmal_vc_client.so, needed by lib/libmmal.so, not found06:48
kulvethat's why it complains about it. Looks like it actually is an upstream bug and not mine this time06:49
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Stskeepsmorn SfietKonstantin, sivang07:08
timophmorn all07:08
* timoph ponders how to automate mer installation to raspi07:09
kulvehmm.. why is my package in "finished" state so long? It doesn't switch to "succeeded" state07:09
Stskeepskulve: we imported new mer release07:09
Stskeepskulve: cobs is probably a bit busy07:10
kulveok, thought something like that07:10
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kulvetimoph: didn't linaro have a hack for that.. I'll google07:13
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SfietKonstantinmorn Stskeeps07:13
SfietKonstantinlove your wise words on the TMO thread about Jolla / Sailfish07:13
Stskeepsmm, thanks07:14
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SfietKonstantinat least, it makes everybody stay calm and code on07:15
SfietKonstantininstead of fud07:15
kulvetimoph: can't find it. But some linaro guy (iirc) did a hardware hack that allowed him to use the same SD card slot for both as target hardware card slot and as card reader for PC. There was some programmatic way for choosing which one it was07:17
kulvetimoph: basically it allowed him to shutdown target hw, write new image to SD from PC, boot up target hw with new image07:17
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kulvetimoph: I would certainly like to see some automatic RPi testing as I usually upgrade packages and test later..07:19
timophyep07:25
timophI was thinking running test images against -next, etc.07:25
timophto get a heads up early if something brakes07:25
timophbut yeah. I was thinking something like that but currently don't know how to do it :)07:26
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* timoph googles07:26
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dm8tbrshouldn't be hard to do that07:27
timophhints welcome :)07:28
dm8tbrthere might be even ready packaged parallel switches07:28
dm8tbron the other hand it might also work as an ugly hack07:28
dm8tbras in: just cut the power on either device07:29
dm8tbrand wire in parallel07:29
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dm8tbrI'm sure the guys in #beagle would know some pointers. but better label this generic and not just rpi. will save you some ridicule07:30
timophyep07:30
timophcurrently googling for generic solutions07:31
dm8tbron a beagle/panda btw I'd just serial-boot the device07:31
dm8tbror USB boot. same thing basically. shove in kernel, let it boot from NFS. do stuff. reset07:32
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timophcom port to the pi would require soldering07:32
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dm8tbrtimoph: http://www2.electronicproducts.com/Switches_expand_SD_SDIO_MMC_connection-article-ICDJH12_Dec2009-html.aspx07:34
dm8tbrso will a port multiplexer07:34
dm8tbrthat IC I just linked is _exactly_ what you asked for. allows you to switch over a SDIO peripheral from one host to the other07:35
timophyep07:35
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dm8tbrshouldn't be too hard to design such a thing now (if that doesn't exist yet)07:36
* dm8tbr thinks of a short PCB. both ends shaped like a SD card, with traces/pads for contact. In the middle a perpendicularly mounted SD-slot. small connector for switch-control.07:37
timophusb boot, do stuff, test. might be easier for me to implement since I'm not a hw hacker :)07:38
dm8tbrdoes the RPI usb-boot?07:38
timophdunno yet07:39
dm8tbrgiven the amount of black voodo magic it takes to boot the cpu...07:39
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dm8tbrthey have an irc channel, so you could go and ask them.07:40
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timophfound some guy's instructions for usb boot07:43
timophrequires booting from sd first07:43
timophso the control logic would be in the sd card and tested image in the usb drive07:43
timophmight be doable07:43
kulvetimoph: com port on rpi doesn't need soldering, if you just have a usb serial dongle that gives the pins out (like my self-made does)07:43
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kulvenot sure if any of the ones sold in shops do that though..07:44
timoph:)07:44
dm8tbrumm, you guys seem to be confusing some stuff here...07:45
dm8tbrby USB-boot in the embedded context one means that the device acts as SLAVE and gets data to boot from a master (PC)07:46
timophdm8tbr: you're coming to the hackday, right?07:46
dm8tbrwhen is it?07:46
timoph3 Nov07:46
dm8tbrI think that's during ELCE07:46
dm8tbrah, no that's between LinaroConnect and ELCE07:47
* dm8tbr can't promise07:47
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kulvedm8tbr: I didn't talk about USB at all, just about getting the serial connection from RPi to PC (which is done using USB dongles as modern PCs don't have a serial port anymore)07:52
iekkumorning07:52
dm8tbrkulve: timoph was07:56
timophyeah. was thinking about different possibilities07:57
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dm8tbrkulve: also I can't find any indication that the UART-booting is publicly documented for the BCM CPU.07:57
dm8tbrand there is no TRM to check that AFAICT07:57
kulvedm8tbr: yeah, the documentation is quite bad. And because the GPU does the booting I doubt it's as flexible as a cpu boot would be08:00
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dm8tbrin the 200 page PDF that there is I found vague indication that you might be able to boot it over I²C08:03
dm8tbrThe BSC slave controller has specially built in the Host Control and Software08:03
dm8tbrRegisters for a Chip booting.08:03
dm8tbrbut most likely no documentation available08:03
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dm8tbrtimoph: btw, another chip that would work for what we discussed initially: MAX499608:09
dm8tbrmaxim might even provide free samples08:09
dm8tbrand jury-rigging such a thing with bread-board shouldn't be too hard08:09
dm8tbrbasically a weekend project08:09
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dm8tbrbonus points if someone knows a place to fab some small one-sided PCB at e.g. TTY (maybe telok?)08:13
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vgradekulve, I thought it was upstream and reported it there yesterday08:50
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kulveI noticed. There is something wrong in the upstream but it may not affect anything. But I don't know what that lib is so I can't know for sure08:56
kulvevgrade: ^highlight08:56
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kulveMer got a new release, so did RPi and I also re-arranged the gst components a bit (and they are still building). So, everything can be quite broken currently09:01
vgradekulve, I have to work today so might try removing libmmal later tonight09:01
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kulveI went all libs and binaries through with ldd and nothing linked against it. Of course something could still use dlopen but I doubt it09:02
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kulveso I removed the libmmal from the Mer RPi HA09:02
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vgradeok, thanks, I'll try my image again later09:03
kulveif people are using CE:Adaptation:RaspberryPi even occasionally, I would like to know about it. Currently I'm assuming there's not much use to it and therefore I keep changing and breaking things at will..09:05
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Stskeepsthink it's understood it's not stable just yet09:05
Stskeepsideally branch and sr though09:06
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kulvewe agreed to start using that if there will be need for a stable release in the future. For now we are assuming it's not needed :)09:08
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Stskeepsalright09:10
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* Sage_ ponders what is wrong with his sdk setup and prelink10:00
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kulveI did a quick test with the latest RPi HA and it seems to at least boot. And gst decoding and encoding seems to work15:06
kulvegst decoding and omx encoding, that is15:06
Stskeepscool15:06
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amjad_so any work on mer port  to ppc?17:32
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CosmoHillsounds interesting17:33
Stskeepsamjad_: not really, any targets in mind?17:33
amjad_well first of all i have one question, is scratchbox the preferred  cross compilation toolkit for Mer ? or can i use something use ?17:35
Stskeepsyou can use the cross compiler straight17:35
amjad_ok17:35
Stskeepsyou can do it but you need to bootstrap a few packages17:36
Stskeeps~100ish17:36
amjad_ok , sb ppc port is wip and no suppor tthere, though Scratchbox allows foreign toolchains17:38
Stskeepswe use sb2, not sb1, btw17:38
Stskeepssb2 you just need a cross compiler to match17:38
amjad_ya, thought so17:39
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amjad_regarding  targets , i am not sure which targes are there  in embedded world, i have build Yellow Dog Linux for Apple G3,G4's (32 bit PPC) and CELL B.E (Qs22.JS22) for Server market17:45
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* Sage_ eagerly waits when we get new mer snapshot 18:19
Stskeepshmm?18:20
Stskeeps:P18:20
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Stskeepsi'm still pondering if we should do a followup of .1 though18:20
Stskeepswith prelink fixes18:20
Stskeepsmaking a .218:20
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Sage_well, if you want. Not personally seeing huge issue with it as it is mainly small performance hit, right?18:22
Stskeepswhat else would we need to fix?18:22
Sage_well, something is off with the exopc nemo image but I really want to get xorg update in soon as it is probably cause for many similar issues.18:24
Sage_bug I haven't noted anything else than prelink18:25
Sage_s/bug/but/18:25
KeltesethHey Stskeeps pycage told me you work on wayland for Mer  ;)  How far did you get yet?18:25
StskeepsKelteseth: http://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Zephyr  , http://releases.merproject.org/~carsten/qmlcomponentgallery.png18:26
Sage_Stskeeps: I was hoping to get new release out like on 16th or so already with the ~50 +1 reviews from gerrit.18:26
Stskeepsok18:26
Keltesethty18:27
Sage_Stskeeps: there isn't really anything that destructive in the review atm. so should be quite simple release to do ;)18:27
StskeepsSage_: until we get QA i won't take those kind of promises18:28
Stskeeps:P18:28
Sage_;)18:28
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StskeepsKelteseth: quite easy to get started with qt and wayland with Zephyt18:36
Stskeepsr18:36
Keltesethokey i will try it18:40
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ali1234Stskeeps: Zephyr != Xephyr right?18:51
Stskeepscorrect18:51
ali1234not related at all?18:51
Stskeepshttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zephyr18:52
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Stskeepsunrelated, i don't use xephyr18:53
Stskeepszephyr's an effort to make it easy to build next-gen device platforms18:53
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ali1234why does the sdk need all that bind mount stuff?18:59
ali1234especially /parentroot?19:00
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Stskeepsali1234: in order to give you /home, if you don't want it, you don't have to mount19:01
Stskeepsbut it makes development easier19:01
Stskeepsit's possible to just enter, so19:01
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Superpelicanali1234, stskeeps: Did I ready tell you the Pythom 3 ASCII issue is fixed?19:12
StskeepsSage_: nop?19:12
Stskeepser19:12
StskeepsSuperpelican: nop?19:12
SuperpelicanGuys at #python helped me19:12
Stskeepscool19:12
SuperpelicanIt had nothing to do with Python19:13
SuperpelicanIt was the Mer SDK that caused th problem19:13
Stskeepsinteresting - what was the cause/19:13
SuperpelicanEvery 'normal' linux distro gives locale information to python, also encoding format19:14
SuperpelicanMer SDK doesn't do that19:14
Superpelicanjust type in the command "locale"19:14
Stskeepshmm19:14
Stskeepsah, right19:15
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SuperpelicanBut you can set that informationstring for Mer SDK19:15
Stskeepsso you're not getting en_US.UTF_8 there?19:15
Superpelicanstskeeps:yes19:15
StskeepsSuperpelican: i think you could probably file a bug at http://bugs.merproject.org )19:15
Stskeeps:)19:15
Superpelicanyou can set that with  a command19:15
ali1234i had a feeling it would be something like that with the environment, but no idea what to check. that's why i suggested to ask #python :)19:16
SuperpelicanI can't remember the command and I'm currently on my phone19:16
SuperpelicanSo I can't check what it was19:16
ali1234export LANGUAGE=...19:17
ali1234something like that19:17
SuperpelicanI will check tomorrow19:17
Superpelicanali1234:yes something like that19:17
Superpelicanfirst something like C_TYPE........19:17
Superpelicanand then export .........19:18
StskeepsLC_ALL also helps, probably19:18
ali1234thisoh, and LANG19:18
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ali1234so this is probably due to the chroot being... well, a chroot19:18
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Stskeepsyeah, though it should keep env stuff like that though19:19
SuperpelicanI will create Mer Bugs account and file the bug when I have timd19:20
SuperpelicanProbably next weekend :(19:20
SuperpelicanSo when I have time again I will continue reading Max RPM19:21
SuperpelicanAnd create the spec file19:21
SuperpelicanStskeeps: I have also thought of putting the 2 set locale utf-8 commands in the .spec file19:24
SuperpelicanAnd let the .spec set the locale on install of .rpm19:24
Superpelicanstskeeps:I've also noticed that all .spec files run rmdir -rf and delete some build dir19:25
SuperpelicanWhy is that?19:25
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SuperpelicanIs that necessary?19:25
SuperpelicanIt doesn't make any sense to me? To me it seems it deletes the sources of the software before build19:26
SuperpelicanHow can it install then?19:27
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StskeepsSuperpelican: build dir vs buildroot19:33
Superpelicanstskeeps:Don't understand19:34
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Superpelicanstskeeps:what does that mean19:34
StskeepsSuperpelican: bit tired, i'll explain another day :)19:35
Superpelicanstskeeps:thx, in that case I won't bother you now anymore19:37
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ali1234Superpelican: the spec file "installs" the software into a fake filesystem, from which it then builds the rpm19:42
ali1234so in this case it is deleting stuff that it doesn't want to go into the rpm19:42
ali1234the install section in the spec file isn't what is done when you install the rpm19:43
ali1234to run commands when the rpm gets installed you need pre- and post-install scripts19:44
ali1234but you shouldn't mess with the locale in those as it will break other stuff19:44
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Superpelicanali1234: thx, for your explanation19:49
Superpelicanali1234:I had already thought of if changing locale won't mess up other software19:50
ali1234the locale should be set by the startup scripts but when you chroot into the SDK, they don't necessarily get run19:51
SuperpelicanYou of course don't to destroy everone's device ;)19:51
ali1234so in that case it should inherit from the host system19:51
ali1234but it seems something is going wrong there. and that's a bug.19:51
SuperpelicanBut it doesn't inherit from my openSUSE install19:51
Superpelicanrunning locale on my system outside chroot gives all the information19:52
SuperpelicanIt doesn't leave anything blank19:52
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rcghttp://ruedigergad.com/2012/10/07/enabling-umts-on-archos-g9-in-plasma-active/19:55
rcgjfyi as well19:55
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