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| shmerl | Any idea if QTMLocationProvider is missing somehow in the Mer SDK (Vivaldi target)? | 00:19 |
|---|---|---|
| shmerl | I got this error: | 00:19 |
| shmerl | ../../dom/src/geolocation/nsGeolocation.o: In function `nsGeolocationService::Init()': | 00:19 |
| shmerl | /home/hillel/build/mozilla/mozilla-central/dom/src/geolocation/nsGeolocation.cpp:554: undefined reference to `QTMLocationProvider::QTMLocationProvider()' | 00:19 |
| shmerl | collect2: ld returned 1 exit status | 00:19 |
| shmerl | qt-mobility-devel is installed. | 00:21 |
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| shmerl | Found this: http://mer.bfst.de/logs/%23mer/%23mer.2012-02-27.log.html | 00:48 |
| shmerl | Looks like QTMLocationProvider is missing in Mer's qt mobility. | 00:49 |
| shmerl | Is there any way around this? | 00:49 |
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| iluminator105 | i guess my question got answered | 01:09 |
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| iluminator105 | is there way to install mer on maemo n900 without having to lose your /home and data | 01:31 |
| wmarone | if you consider keeping it on an SD card acceptable, yes | 01:33 |
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| iluminator105 | wmarone, permission to pm | 02:12 |
| wmarone | no need to PM, I'm sure | 02:12 |
| iluminator105 | well i was thinking of puttin meego 1.3 on it , instead of nemo b/z its more tested | 02:13 |
| wmarone | I don't know if it's more tested... | 02:13 |
| iluminator105 | nokia just released 1000 fixes for it meego 1.3 | 02:14 |
| wmarone | that's for the N9 | 02:14 |
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| wmarone | which isn't "meego" proper | 02:14 |
| wmarone | and won't work on the N900 at all | 02:14 |
| iluminator105 | i am not following can you explain | 02:15 |
| wmarone | the PR 1.3 release that Nokia just did | 02:15 |
| wmarone | was not for the N900 | 02:15 |
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| iluminator105 | cant i install uboot-pr13 on maemo and install nemo while maemo is running? | 02:21 |
| wmarone | no idea, but if it's to the internal memory I doubt it. | 02:22 |
| * wmarone plays around with nemo on SD cards | 02:22 | |
| iluminator105 | so you dont recommend nemo as daily use on internal sd card | 02:23 |
| wmarone | I still use maemo 5 on my N900 | 02:23 |
| wmarone | no pressing reason to change, might if this JollaMobile things produces a replacement :) | 02:23 |
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| iluminator105 | how stable is nemo? | 02:30 |
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| wmarone | dunno, haven't looked at the latest releases | 02:33 |
| wmarone | best thing to do is load it on an SD card, boot the kernel via USB, and try it out | 02:34 |
| fosstux | Hi! Does Nemo come with a calendar app and sync with google calendar? | 02:34 |
| wmarone | don't think so | 02:35 |
| wmarone | Nemo is very much a demonstration on how to use Mer in a product | 02:35 |
| shmerl | Nemo lacks decent e-mail client, which is critical (at least for me) | 02:35 |
| shmerl | So without one I wouldn't recommend it for daily use, | 02:36 |
| wmarone | it is not, itself, a full-fledged product and I don't see it really being pushed that way (unless someone wants to actually do that, and I imagine they'd be welcomed...) | 02:36 |
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| fosstux | okay. | 02:42 |
| fosstux | thanks | 02:42 |
| shmerl | You can give it a try in x86 VM (in VirtualBox) too see for yourself, before installing on any ARM devices. | 02:43 |
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| iekku | morning | 03:33 |
| Ken-Young | evening | 03:43 |
| iekku | :) | 03:45 |
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| dm8tbr | moaning | 04:15 |
| Bostik | matt groe.. | 04:17 |
| Stskeeps | zz | 04:18 |
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| Stskeeps | good morning sonach | 04:19 |
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| sonach_ | Stskeeps: good morning :) | 04:19 |
| sonach_ | have not been on this irc for several days :P | 04:20 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 04:20 |
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| Stskeeps | sonach_: got an url for you, sec | 04:23 |
| Stskeeps | sonach_: http://chinese.engadget.com/2012/07/08/jolla-promises-meego-will-live-on-plans-new-smartphone/ | 04:23 |
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| Stskeeps | hope that'll help convince people about mer too | 04:24 |
| Stskeeps | sonach_: http://chinese.engadget.com/2012/07/08/jolla-promises-meego-will-live-on-plans-new-smartphone/ | 04:24 |
| sonach | Stskeeps: Good news :) | 04:25 |
| Stskeeps | notice 'mer core' mention :) | 04:26 |
| sonach | Stskeeps: "他們的 MeeGo 將會結合 Qt、Mer Core 和自家的技術去開發" means: Their MeeGo will integrate Qt, Mer Core and there own technology, | 04:27 |
| Stskeeps | yep | 04:28 |
| sonach | yes, so this 'MeeGo' is based on Mer core, | 04:28 |
| Stskeeps | meego is an idea/dream anyway | 04:28 |
| sonach | Stskeeps: I think there are some members of Jolla on this IRC? | 04:29 |
| Stskeeps | sonach: me, sage, iekku.. etc. jolla has been contributing in stealth for a while | 04:29 |
| Stskeeps | and will continue to contribute | 04:30 |
| sonach | Cool :) | 04:30 |
| Stskeeps | as a vendor for mer, making sure it's a sane mobile core for many companies to use | 04:30 |
| sonach | so NEMO is the UX? | 04:30 |
| Stskeeps | jolla has it's own UX | 04:31 |
| Stskeeps | more specific about technologies i can't say yet | 04:31 |
| sonach | ok, hold on :) | 04:31 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, wait and see. but mer a nnd qt are core technologies | 04:34 |
| Stskeeps | has been amazing feedback on it, around the world | 04:36 |
| * Stskeeps stretches | 04:48 | |
| Stskeeps | another day coming :) | 04:48 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: now wiki has started stalling | 04:56 |
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| iluminator105 | Stskeeps, PR 1.3 what does the PR stand for | 05:11 |
| Stskeeps | iluminator105: public release? | 05:11 |
| Stskeeps | dunno, ask nokia :) | 05:11 |
| iluminator105 | i thought it meant peer review...LOL | 05:11 |
| Kypeli | Good morning. | 05:15 |
| Kypeli | Things are moving fast for Mer... | 05:15 |
| Kypeli | Now that weekend is over, the speed might even increase. | 05:15 |
| iluminator105 | this is good news this jollamobile, meego was too good to be a ronin | 05:18 |
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| iekku | is wiki down? | 05:40 |
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| Stskeeps | iekku, yes | 05:59 |
| jrayhawk | Huh, that Jolla thing is pretty cool. | 06:04 |
| jrayhawk | Nice to see the former Nokia employees still believe in the product line even if management doesn't. | 06:05 |
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| Stskeeps | hello wrea, imunsie :) | 06:31 |
| jrayhawk | And if push comes to shove, I'm sure you guys can kickstarter up some funding. | 06:37 |
| Stskeeps | jolla has investors, it's not just a hippie commune :) | 06:37 |
| jrayhawk | Haha | 06:37 |
| Paimen | hmm why do I have hippie in hilite, but well Jolla is really exiting new start for open phone platform | 06:38 |
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| Stskeeps | Paimen: and given it's mer-based and contributing to mer, it is a very good foundation for other projects too | 06:39 |
| Paimen | indeed, making Mer known to world is never bad thing | 06:39 |
| Paimen | getting visibility will tell people that mer is viable option as core also good for Qt too | 06:40 |
| Paimen | bit bafled about tdriver and qa, there seems to be spot to fork that and make it better with qt5 | 06:40 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 06:41 |
| Stskeeps | still work to be done in Mer, like with any software | 06:41 |
| Stskeeps | some things more glaring than others | 06:41 |
| Paimen | yup, QA and benchmarking has won my heart so I'll look into that and I'm thinking that I'll talk to my bosses that could we do something with tdriver as it seems Nokia has abandonned it | 06:43 |
| Paimen | well it is not official, but last update is from april and no comments to our commits to memorysize bug | 06:44 |
| Stskeeps | we're integrating it in mer atm, ruby's a bit of a pain | 06:44 |
| Paimen | it is | 06:44 |
| Paimen | also qtquick 2.0 support is really behind. we have some dirty fixes to that but nor committed to anywhere | 06:45 |
| Stskeeps | contributions welcome | 06:45 |
| Stskeeps | we have similar qtquick2 stack as nomovok because of bostik's good work, so | 06:45 |
| Paimen | yup | 06:45 |
| Paimen | well at least heap size fix is available here: https://gitorious.org/tdriver/agent_qt/merge_requests/22 | 06:46 |
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| Stskeeps | :nod: | 06:46 |
| Venemo_N9 | morning :) | 06:46 |
| timoph | morning | 06:46 |
| Paimen | and it is great news to hear you try to take tdriver onboard | 06:47 |
| Paimen | made my monday better already :) | 06:47 |
| timoph | :) | 06:47 |
| Stskeeps | meego QA tools delivered a lot of very useful stuff | 06:47 |
| Paimen | indeed | 06:47 |
| Stskeeps | Paimen: how were you involved with it, out of curiousity? | 06:48 |
| timoph | I think E-P is working on it | 06:48 |
| Stskeeps | if you were | 06:48 |
| Paimen | Stskeeps: not involved to tdriver, just modified it inhouse to use in few benchmarking projects | 06:48 |
| Stskeeps | alright | 06:48 |
| Paimen | basically we have created some fancy stuff so we can calculate fps and cpu/gpu usage and mem count | 06:49 |
| Stskeeps | cool | 06:49 |
| Venemo_N9 | are you aware that the battery indicator of Nemo doesn't work on the N950? | 06:49 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo_N9: yes | 06:49 |
| Stskeeps | we're also packaging traditional good tools for debugging/perf work | 06:49 |
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| Venemo_N9 | is it a driver issue or a gui bug? | 06:49 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo_N9: lacking backend for n950/n9's bme | 06:49 |
| Paimen | Stskeeps: like http://steelratstory.com/uploads/images/steelbench_diagram3.png | 06:49 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 06:50 |
| Stskeeps | iekku: wiki's up again | 06:50 |
| iekku | thanks | 06:50 |
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| Venemo_N9 | Stskeeps, hm. is it something a mere simpleton like me can fix? | 06:50 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo_N9: not really and even i have problems.. | 06:51 |
| timoph | Stskeeps: have you noticed http://gitorious.org/meego-graphics/glmemperf | 06:51 |
| Venemo_N9 | :( | 06:51 |
| Stskeeps | timoph: hmm no | 06:51 |
| Paimen | Stskeeps: what version of tdriver you are currently integrating? | 06:51 |
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| Stskeeps | Paimen: Sage_ would know | 06:51 |
| timoph | I was just browsing through garage and bumbed into that | 06:51 |
| Venemo_N9 | Stskeeps, what's the issue with it? | 06:51 |
| Stskeeps | timoph: bug for integration please (severity=task) | 06:51 |
| Sage_ | Paimen: a moment | 06:51 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo_N9: something needs to communicate with bme | 06:51 |
| timoph | Stskeeps: will do | 06:51 |
| Sage_ | alterego: did start doing something around the ruby already btw? | 06:52 |
| Venemo_N9 | Stskeeps, yep, I get that | 06:52 |
| Paimen | timoph: oh that glmemperf seems like something I need to checkout | 06:52 |
| Stskeeps | timoph: thank you | 06:52 |
| Venemo_N9 | but what's the difficulty of implementing that something? | 06:52 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo_N9: i think maybe the open source libbme will work | 06:52 |
| Stskeeps | but i'm unsure | 06:53 |
| Venemo_N9 | is it documented? | 06:53 |
| Sage_ | Paimen: 1.5.3 was the version I tried. | 06:53 |
| Stskeeps | sortof | 06:53 |
| Paimen | Sage_: ok | 06:53 |
| Sage_ | Paimen: my packages are in https://build.pub.meego.com/project/packages?project=home%3Asage%3Abranches%3AMer%3ATools%3ATesting | 06:53 |
| Stskeeps | http://meego.gitorious.org/meego-device-adaptation/n900_libbme | 06:53 |
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| Paimen | Sage_: ok thanks | 06:54 |
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| Paimen | Sage_: out of curiosity what ruby problems did oyu encounter? | 06:55 |
| Paimen | s/oyu/you | 06:56 |
| timoph | Stskeeps: 425 | 06:56 |
| Stskeeps | timoph: thank you | 06:56 |
| Venemo_N9 | Stskeeps, I'll have a look at that. | 06:57 |
| Sage_ | Paimen: none so far. Just ran some very basic stuff | 06:57 |
| Venemo_N9 | Stskeeps, is bme in Mer the same as the one in Harmattan? | 06:57 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo_N9: .. ish | 06:59 |
| Paimen | Sage_: ok, and well if you just run qttas stuff on mer ruby is not needed afaik | 06:59 |
| Stskeeps | Paimen: we use it within sdk, which is also mer-based | 06:59 |
| Paimen | ah ok, that is different story then | 06:59 |
| Venemo_N9 | Stskeeps, hm. ok :) | 07:00 |
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| Stskeeps | Paimen: but yes, it's a blessing it's not going on device.. | 07:00 |
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| Paimen | damn July is bad month to be at work, everyone is on vacation | 07:01 |
| Stskeeps | what, it's july? ;) | 07:01 |
| Sage_ | Paimen: what is vacation? :) | 07:02 |
| Paimen | Sage_: :P | 07:02 |
| Venemo_N9 | Paimen, at least there's silence and peace | 07:02 |
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| Paimen | Venemo_N9: well I work mainly from home so silence and peace is default | 07:02 |
| Paimen | well as much as you can have with 4 dogs | 07:03 |
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| Paimen | Sage_: but well I try to push that we could finally update our tdriver to 1.5.3 and push our qtQuick 2.0 fixes somewhere at least | 07:04 |
| Paimen | currently we use 1.4.x something just because we haven't got time to merge to newer and it "works" for us now | 07:05 |
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| Venemo_N9 | Paimen, ah, ok | 07:05 |
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| Venemo_N9 | anyway, I arrived at work, and I have a planning meeting ahead | 07:11 |
| Venemo_N9 | so ttyl :) | 07:11 |
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| lbt | morning all | 07:31 |
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| Paimen | morning lbt | 07:37 |
| lbt | hey | 07:37 |
| lbt | I see in the backlog that you're looking at tdriver | 07:38 |
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| Paimen | well, it is just tool I like to use and we have some fixes to it | 07:39 |
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| lbt | *nod* | 07:39 |
| lbt | just wondering how to make sure it's available in Mer | 07:39 |
| lbt | we need to ensure ruby is easy to live with | 07:40 |
| Paimen | and maybe I can contribute some information to wiki also how to use it, when you have it in mer also I can try to help you on making it to Mer too, altought Ruby part is not something I know lot of as I have used those on my ubuntu host and our devices has just ran qttas | 07:40 |
| lbt | right - we want to use it in the SDK | 07:41 |
| Paimen | hmm too long sentences and too few caffein | 07:41 |
| Paimen | lbt yup so Sage_ told me | 07:41 |
| lbt | :) | 07:41 |
| lbt | OK - good | 07:41 |
| lbt | so we can talk to E-P about where in the wiki to put things ... I'm trying to keep wiki pages small and focused to one topic | 07:42 |
| Paimen | lbt: but I try to talk to someone in here to merge our qtquick 2.0 fixes to 1.5.3 and commit them somewhere you can snatch them | 07:42 |
| lbt | sure | 07:42 |
| * Sage_ is interested if there was conclusion of ruby packaging yet for us. | 07:42 | |
| lbt | the best solution is to use the contribution | 07:42 |
| Paimen | we have one little fix to heap memory count already committed if you guys want to look into it | 07:42 |
| Paimen | https://gitorious.org/tdriver/agent_qt/merge_requests/22 | 07:43 |
| lbt | https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Contribution_in_detail | 07:43 |
| Sage_ | In my opinion if we could just first agree that we juse rubygem-* or something else for package names the package content could be improved later. It is not so bad atm. but that is just my opinion. :) | 07:43 |
| lbt | we can take things as patches we carry in Mer too | 07:43 |
| lbt | Sage_: yeah, I apologise - really crappy weekend | 07:43 |
| Paimen | as it was documented to return memory in bytes and it was actually returning page count, not a big deal, but annoyance | 07:43 |
| lbt | Paimen: ouch | 07:43 |
| Sage_ | lbt: no need to apologise. That is called life :) | 07:44 |
| lbt | Sage_: power cuts all day saturday, disk failure, PSU failures, grub cockup.... and jolla buzz | 07:44 |
| lbt | <shudder> | 07:44 |
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| lbt | :) | 07:44 |
| Sage_ | heh, I only broke a lamp from tractor while moving some stuff nothing else ;) | 07:45 |
| Paimen | well I banged my head to desk on Sunday and now I have nasty cut and bruise | 07:45 |
| * lbt is not alone \o/ | 07:46 | |
| lbt | Stskeeps: FYI ... wiki died due to oom - see messages ... puppet, myslqd and then apache .... | 07:48 |
| lbt | ok ... coffee | 07:48 |
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| lbt | Sage_: OK .. for ruby I'll say lets take the suse approach - we have to use that rubygem packaging in all the OBS and BOSS stuff anyhow | 08:03 |
| Sage_ | lbt: ok. That is fine with me. | 08:05 |
| lbt | good, gives you and alterego an easy place to port docs and policies from :) | 08:06 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: so I refactored the code , and it copies faster now , and no "broken" packages | 08:08 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 08:09 |
| Stskeeps | patch(es) welcome | 08:09 |
| lbt | phaeron: nice | 08:09 |
| phaeron | lbt disabling publishing and building makes it faster | 08:09 |
| lbt | ie it stops sending events? | 08:09 |
| phaeron | it stops calculating some stuff | 08:09 |
| * lbt should look at code :) | 08:09 | |
| phaeron | I'll push the code now | 08:09 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: is OOM coming from external pressure or internal VM pressure? | 08:10 |
| lbt | actually, much as I want to, I'll leave this to you + Stskeeps and get on with some HW adaptation+SDK work ... on the condition you have enough comments that I can understand it later | 08:10 |
| Stskeeps | ie, is it dynamic RAM allocation on vm | 08:11 |
| lbt | Stskeeps: internal | 08:11 |
| lbt | always for VMs | 08:11 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: ok, but why does it start to happen now.. | 08:11 |
| Bostik | hmh, you've been flashing me... | 08:11 |
| lbt | I'm guessing puppet - I didn't spend time debugging .... | 08:11 |
| Stskeeps | Bostik: just discussing tdriver and qtt | 08:11 |
| Stskeeps | qt5 | 08:11 |
| lbt | Bostik: what flashes you? Qt ? | 08:12 |
| Bostik | Paimen: just to toss an idea in the winds - would it help if I taught myself how to properly package ruby gems for systemwide use? :) | 08:12 |
| Stskeeps | bostik, probably | 08:12 |
| Bostik | bingo, it's my name | 08:12 |
| lbt | Bostik: *g* | 08:12 |
| lbt | Bostik: as for rubygems - what would be good is to nag Sage_ and alterego and beta-test their packaging policies | 08:13 |
| lbt | ideally they'll point to suse docs and just say how to do it for SDK | 08:13 |
| lbt | Bostik: probably better for them to be delivering to someone who's waiting for them (pressure always helps focus) | 08:14 |
| Paimen | Bostik: I think it would help Mer, in our current setup we do not use ruby on client/hw side just on host that is ubuntu | 08:14 |
| Sage_ | lbt: I'm waiting for myself atm. Would like to have this ruby thing done today :) | 08:15 |
| Paimen | but if we want to use Mer SDK in somepoint and it has TDriver it would be blast | 08:15 |
| lbt | Paimen: that's the goal | 08:15 |
| lbt | we have testrunner-ui in there already | 08:16 |
| Paimen | yep, I really need to dig into Mer more proberly, well 4 days to vacation and then 2 weeks more or less own time | 08:16 |
| Paimen | and who knows how long after that | 08:17 |
| lbt | I think the risk around Mer has dropped several notches now | 08:17 |
| lbt | ooh I found a bug in something | 08:17 |
| Sage_ | lbt: http://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Packaging_Ruby <- this is all... ? | 08:18 |
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| lbt | my ExoPC was running an infinite QML shader demo and it's crashed with a frozen screen this am | 08:18 |
| lbt | Sage_: yep | 08:19 |
| lbt | gem2rpm may need to have a modified template | 08:19 |
| lbt | for our spec file | 08:19 |
| Paimen | lbt: yup, risk is reduced, but mer to realize into projects for us might take its time | 08:20 |
| lbt | yes, still at the proposal stage? | 08:20 |
| Stskeeps | hey mikhas :) | 08:20 |
| lbt | mikhas: speak of the devil | 08:20 |
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| iekku | hi andre__ | 08:21 |
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| Paimen | lbt: I do not know, I just work here | 08:21 |
| lbt | *g* | 08:21 |
| Sage_ | lbt: I expected a much more complex thing :) | 08:21 |
| mikhas | hi there | 08:21 |
| mikhas | exciting weekend, even if I was mostly offline. | 08:22 |
| lbt | Sage_: this is why I like gem2rpm .... it does a lot for us ... but it needs time checking it's all OK with Mer | 08:22 |
| Stskeeps | mikhas, indeed | 08:22 |
| Sage_ | lbt: well what I looked quickly about the output it looked quite ok. Just couple of minor things that we might want to change, but even those shouldn't be required. | 08:22 |
| lbt | and we skip spectacle for these | 08:23 |
| lbt | (and note that in policy) | 08:23 |
| lbt | happy to just have task bugs for minor things too - ideally noted on the ruby page | 08:24 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: https://github.com/Merproject/open-build-service/commit/de0c421dd0573461289ba5f9f6c28a83ebc77dae | 08:24 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: thank you | 08:24 |
| lbt | phaeron: checking for comments... | 08:24 |
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| lbt | phaeron: that didn't take long | 08:24 |
| Stskeeps | morn slaine | 08:25 |
| phaeron | lbt: it's very much 2am hacking | 08:25 |
| phaeron | so give me a break :D | 08:25 |
| lbt | phaeron: you? you astonish me *g* | 08:25 |
| lbt | *sigh* /usr/bin/qmlscene qml/main.qml just hangs after a few hours | 08:26 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: dmesg? | 08:26 |
| lbt | nothing | 08:26 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: the mesa drivers are not up to date anyway | 08:26 |
| slaine | morning folks | 08:27 |
| lbt | OK - I did put some shader stuff in - so that fits | 08:27 |
| Stskeeps | slaine: saw news over weekend? | 08:27 |
| slaine | Saw the news alright, not read any details yet though.Sounds promising. Are there details ? | 08:28 |
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| lbt | not many, confirmed they're using Mer as the core | 08:29 |
| slaine | Now that is awesome | 08:29 |
| lbt | building buzz around the meego community by using meego-based | 08:29 |
| Stskeeps | slaine: .. and has been contributing for a while in stealth :P | 08:29 |
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| phaeron | Stskeeps: I saw some stuff that worries me. some packages that I deleted still have binaries around and are used to resolve things in the source project | 08:30 |
| slaine | My understanding was that these are former Nokia Meego/Harmattan team members, is that right ? | 08:30 |
| pohly | Stskeeps: which news? | 08:31 |
| Stskeeps | slaine: sure, and some people you know from here, including me | 08:31 |
| slaine | lol | 08:31 |
| slaine | That's great news | 08:31 |
| Stskeeps | pohly: http://www.engadget.com/2012/07/07/jolla-promises-meego-will-live-on-plans-new-smartphone/ | 08:31 |
| iekku | Stskeeps, iäm there also | 08:32 |
| iekku | klajgäölsa aäsgjäölagjs | 08:32 |
| iekku | slaine, i'm in jolla also | 08:32 |
| Stskeeps | 'meego' mention is a bit wobbly, agreed, as it's really mer, which is made clear in press release.. | 08:32 |
| slaine | Man, you've just made my month :-D | 08:33 |
| lbt | makes *total* sense - if they hadn't used #meego-based then they'd have missed 99% of their audience ... marketing :) | 08:33 |
| iekku | hope we soon make your year :P | 08:33 |
| slaine | iekku: Yeah, you have to earn that bit still ;) | 08:33 |
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| Stskeeps | anyway.. back to work | 08:34 |
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| lbt | indeed | 08:34 |
| Stskeeps | project copy patch to test | 08:34 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: I'd appreciate a test with a clean source project. mine had stale stuff lying around and I removed the qt stuff | 08:34 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 08:35 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: what branch is this on? | 08:35 |
| Stskeeps | ok, on top of transparent | 08:36 |
| Stskeeps | sec | 08:36 |
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| Stskeeps | lbt: restarting fe.. | 08:41 |
| lbt | did you have a shell | 08:42 |
| lbt | and did dmesg tell you anything ? | 08:42 |
| Stskeeps | couldn't get into ssh | 08:42 |
| Stskeeps | just stalled | 08:42 |
| lbt | OK | 08:42 |
| phaeron | needs more ram ? | 08:43 |
| Stskeeps | fe at 1,5gb atm | 08:43 |
| Stskeeps | and swap | 08:43 |
| Stskeeps | it scares me how much it uses | 08:43 |
| phaeron | ruby on rails + apache .. | 08:44 |
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| mikhas | Stskeeps, so any plans to replace X11 soon-ish? | 08:50 |
| Stskeeps | mikhas: aren't we all going that direction.. | 08:50 |
| Stskeeps | mikhas: i'm personally interested in maliit on qml compositor | 08:51 |
| mikhas | yep | 08:51 |
| mikhas | we need to get the wayland protocols in shape first | 08:51 |
| Stskeeps | did you see w00teh's videos? | 08:51 |
| mikhas | nope? | 08:51 |
| Stskeeps | sec | 08:51 |
| mikhas | I mean, sure, for Qt5, we can still just keep using input method modules | 08:51 |
| mikhas | but I'd really like to get rid of that | 08:51 |
| Stskeeps | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V83mChc-hQE&feature=plcp , http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7PMlgIoTuJ4&feature=plcp , http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bx7iEHlGxMU&feature=plcp | 08:51 |
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| Stskeeps | lag problem is known and caused by fbcon | 08:52 |
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| Stskeeps | phaeron: POST http://api-ci.tspre.org/source/Core:test12:i486?comment=foo&withhistory=1&oproject=Core%3Ai486&cmd=copy&withprjconf=1&withbinaries=1&nodelay=1 | 08:54 |
| Stskeeps | in progress | 08:54 |
| phaeron | yeah if you tail the logs you'll see it goes faster .. I hope I didn't mess up the rebase | 08:55 |
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| Stskeeps | ok, massive thunderstorm coming here.. | 08:56 |
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| Stskeeps | so if i vanish, that's why :) | 08:56 |
| jussi | thunderstorms are awesome | 08:56 |
| Stskeeps | hello donza :) | 08:56 |
| donza | Stskeeps: hello | 08:56 |
| * jussi waves to Stskeeps | 08:56 | |
| Stskeeps | good monday jussi :) | 08:56 |
| jussi | Stskeeps: no | 08:56 |
| Stskeeps | donza: welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer ? | 08:56 |
| donza | curiosity :) | 08:56 |
| jussi | Stskeeps: 7 hour drive home + 3am + 8am start is horrible... | 08:56 |
| Stskeeps | jussi: ouch | 08:56 |
| Bostik | lbt: alright, I'll take the packaging policy out for a spin then (not now, but soon) | 08:57 |
| Stskeeps | donza: sure :) if you have any questions on Mer, feel free to ask at any time, or if you're curious on how to contribute, else feel free to hang out and observe, learn :) | 08:57 |
| jussi | Bostik: you couldnt just stay away, could you :P | 08:57 |
| donza | Stskeeps: thanks! | 08:57 |
| Bostik | jussi: being on vacation and being totally in the dark are two different things | 08:58 |
| jussi | lol | 08:58 |
| lbt | jussi: he just knows where it's cool to hang out | 08:59 |
| jussi | hehe | 08:59 |
| * lbt is bored watching dd and decides we need pv or ddrescue for SDK | 09:00 | |
| Stskeeps | lbt: +1 | 09:00 |
| Stskeeps | pv is essential | 09:01 |
| Stskeeps | bug please | 09:01 |
| Paimen | Bostik is always in the light | 09:01 |
| jussi | Paimen: he isnt far enough north for that | 09:02 |
| Paimen | but if he has been bitten by radioactive firefly? | 09:03 |
| jussi | ahhhhhhhhhhhhh! thats why he always glows :P | 09:03 |
| jussi | or maybe its that stuff he rubs into his face :P | 09:03 |
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| Stskeeps | hello j_h :) | 09:08 |
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| ZiQiangHuan | Stskeeps: do you have any idea with MeeGo Policy Framework http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/docs/library/html/libresourceqt/main.html? is it already in mer or not? | 09:12 |
| lbt | wiki is being really slow :( | 09:12 |
| Stskeeps | ZiQiangHuan: we have it in nemo | 09:12 |
| Stskeeps | ZiQiangHuan: what do you need it for? | 09:12 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: same machine as fe, isnt it | 09:13 |
| lbt | yeah, but phost is idle | 09:13 |
| ZiQiangHuan | Stskeeps: for mutimedia resource manager now, maybe other resource manager in the future | 09:13 |
| lbt | web (reverse ssl proxy) is also idle | 09:13 |
| lbt | no RAM issues | 09:13 |
| Stskeeps | ZiQiangHuan: perhaps - do you know prolog? :) | 09:13 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: I/O ? | 09:13 |
| phaeron | lbt: ram or power issues on phost ? | 09:14 |
| ZiQiangHuan | Stskeeps: no, I donot know prolog | 09:14 |
| Stskeeps | ZiQiangHuan: resource policy framework uses prolog programming languages for rules | 09:14 |
| Sage_ | lbt: I'm failing to update mer sdk btw. | 09:14 |
| lbt | Sage_: openssl ? | 09:14 |
| Sage_ | yes | 09:14 |
| lbt | damn it | 09:15 |
| Sage_ | or actually ca-certificates but probalby related to openssl | 09:15 |
| lbt | 2 bugs | 09:15 |
| lbt | one in my script which copies host certs to sdk | 09:15 |
| lbt | https://bugs.merproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=412 | 09:15 |
| lbt | is the other | 09:16 |
| ZiQiangHuan | Stskeeps: yeah, ok. you use it in nemo? for what function? | 09:16 |
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| Stskeeps | ZiQiangHuan: phonecall adjustment, headphone plug plugging, speaker vs not speaker, etc | 09:16 |
| Stskeeps | priorities in cpu.. | 09:16 |
| alterego | Sage_: no, was waiting about that, looking in to ofono & dialer nemo issues at the moment. | 09:17 |
| ZiQiangHuan | Stskeeps: I have a quick with the doc of it, but it says the function is not complete, right? | 09:17 |
| Stskeeps | ZiQiangHuan: it might not be | 09:18 |
| Stskeeps | ZiQiangHuan: it works pretty well on n9xx though | 09:18 |
| Sage_ | alterego: ok, well I start doing the gems with gem2rpm and doing new push for that. | 09:19 |
| Sage_ | lbt: then it would be accepted right? | 09:20 |
| alterego | Okay, cool | 09:20 |
| lbt | simple docs too would be good | 09:20 |
| ZiQiangHuan | Stskeeps: ok. is it a alone project, or it is already in qt sdk? | 09:21 |
| jussi | I hope someone fixes the damn browser, the one on my n950 doesnt do mobile g+, only basic mobile and desktop | 09:21 |
| jussi | :D | 09:21 |
| Stskeeps | ZiQiangHuan: standalone | 09:21 |
| ZiQiangHuan | Stskeeps: I found many modules in qtmobility have been merged into qt5 | 09:22 |
| alterego | Also, why do non of the apps support multi-touch gestures? | 09:22 |
| alterego | s/non/none/ | 09:22 |
| lbt | is there any way to chvt on the N900 from the keyb? | 09:22 |
| Stskeeps | ZiQiangHuan: yes it has | 09:22 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: don't assume chvt will work | 09:23 |
| alterego | The image viewer, the browser .. They should all have punch to zoom | 09:23 |
| Stskeeps | there's not always a fbcon | 09:23 |
| Stskeeps | and sgx.. erm | 09:23 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 09:23 |
| lbt | OK - I didn't think so .. worth checking | 09:23 |
| leinir | punch to zoom... ;) | 09:23 |
| ZiQiangHuan | Stskeeps: Ok, thank you | 09:24 |
| Sage_ | lbt: :nod: doing that as well | 09:25 |
| lbt | ty | 09:25 |
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| Stskeeps | phaeron: faster, for sure: but: http://pastie.org/4224798 | 09:30 |
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| lbt | something is screwy on the wiki - things happening in 20s bursts | 09:33 |
| lbt | is anyone else seeing a wiki problem ? | 09:33 |
| lbt | (I have odd vpn/nw settings as part of admin so it's a way to check it's not that) | 09:34 |
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| lbt | nope? OK I'll leave it until later then | 09:35 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: i dont se anything odd.. | 09:36 |
| lbt | OK | 09:36 |
| alterego | seems fine to me too | 09:36 |
| lbt | takes me 80s to login :) | 09:36 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: can you help interpret that pastie? | 09:37 |
| lbt | looking | 09:38 |
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| Stskeeps | morn shrikrishna | 09:38 |
| lbt | it's a bit context-less | 09:38 |
| shrikrishna | morning Stskeeps :) | 09:38 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: it's just after re-enabling builds for a project | 09:39 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: that has been prjcopyed to | 09:39 |
| Stskeeps | from scheduler_i586 log | 09:39 |
| lbt | ah, in log? | 09:39 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 09:39 |
| lbt | ok | 09:39 |
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| *** asd is now known as Guest25747 | 09:41 | |
| Stskeeps | hello asd / Guest25747 | 09:42 |
| Guest25747 | hello | 09:42 |
| Guest25747 | meego is good os! | 09:42 |
| Stskeeps | welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer ? | 09:42 |
| lbt | I think ! is md5 changed | 09:42 |
| Stskeeps | ok, so maybe we should debug on what changed | 09:43 |
| phaeron | looking | 09:44 |
| Guest25747 | i want to make a meego sdk | 09:44 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: ncurses is the only package , or just one you picked | 09:44 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: first one | 09:45 |
| Stskeeps | Guest25747: install or help make one? | 09:45 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: ie, first one mentioned in log | 09:45 |
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| Stskeeps | hello saya_ :) | 09:45 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: at this point I had similar output and wasn't sure if it was me copying the messed up project or something else | 09:45 |
| Guest25747 | i make a sdk tizen too | 09:46 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: adding some debugging to the ! stuff | 09:46 |
| phaeron | yeah I am not sure which meta it is talking about. pkg meta change or the meta in the backend ? | 09:47 |
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| Stskeeps | Guest25747: you can grab qt sdk, that's a good start | 09:49 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: in the new patch I copy :full/*.meta as well but they get deleted , or rejected afaics | 09:49 |
| Guest25747 | @Stskeeps thank you | 09:50 |
| Guest25747 | qt sdk can run in windows? | 09:52 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 09:52 |
| Guest25747 | or arm? | 09:52 |
| Stskeeps | let's just say windows | 09:53 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 09:53 |
| Guest25747 | lol | 09:53 |
| ZogG_laptop | i think someone had qt sdk on n900 =) | 09:53 |
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| Guest25747 | can the qt sdk run in webos--------palm pre3:) | 09:53 |
| Stskeeps | Guest25747: SDK runs on a pc usually :) | 09:54 |
| Stskeeps | morn stefan_schmidt_w | 09:54 |
| stefan_schmidt_w | hi Stskeeps | 09:54 |
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| Guest25747 | see you i go to lunch | 09:55 |
| Stskeeps | seeyou | 09:56 |
| ZogG_laptop | btw Stskeeps, if i develp for mer, only target i can develop for is Nemo - right? | 09:56 |
| ZogG_laptop | M4rtinK, sup | 09:56 |
| Stskeeps | ZogG_laptop: nop, there's other targets too | 09:56 |
| Stskeeps | plasma active, nemo, .. mer in obscure other configurations | 09:56 |
| * alterego jumps in shower | 09:56 | |
| M4rtinK | ZogG_laptop: hi :) | 09:57 |
| ZogG_laptop | Stskeeps, oh, vivaldi is using mer as base? But i mean, as far as mer is core only, i need to rebuild and optimize my app for each target separetly? | 09:57 |
| shrikrishna | ZogG_laptop: vivaldi has plasma, which is based on mer, so yeah,... :) | 09:58 |
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| Stskeeps | ZogG_laptop: we don't really push a common story, but if it's qt.. | 09:59 |
| shrikrishna | oh.. dint see the second part of the question =) | 10:00 |
| ZogG_laptop | Stskeeps, the main question is "I do not develop for Mer but for specific Mer based distro as Nemo for example" | 10:00 |
| lbt | ZogG_laptop: that's the answer, yes | 10:02 |
| ZogG_laptop | ok | 10:02 |
| lbt | and if those distros share a technology, it makes it easier for you | 10:02 |
| ZogG_laptop | yeah | 10:02 |
| lbt | Cordia, Plasma and Nemo use different UIs and won't have a common app story | 10:02 |
| lbt | whilst Nemo and Harmattan share a lot | 10:03 |
| ZogG_laptop | i just looking into harmattan / maemo and as harmattan maemo6 it's still needs things to be re-written or optimized from one platform to run on another | 10:03 |
| M4rtinK | well, from my experience as a Python developer | 10:04 |
| ZogG_laptop | are people really still working on cordia? haven't heard of them a lot | 10:04 |
| M4rtinK | as long as all the needed packages are available, my stuff should run just fine :) | 10:04 |
| ZogG_laptop | M4rtinK, you mean script-poet? =P | 10:04 |
| M4rtinK | ZogG_laptop: sound nice :) | 10:04 |
| M4rtinK | *sounds | 10:04 |
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| M4rtinK | ZogG_laptop: I think I've seen smoku on this channel the other day, working on something | 10:05 |
| Stskeeps | hey kjokinie :) | 10:06 |
| ZogG_laptop | M4rtinK, i wanted to pre-order tablet and than it was unavlb anymore | 10:06 |
| M4rtinK | the Vivaldi ? | 10:06 |
| phaeron | M4rtinK: cordia | 10:06 |
| ZogG_laptop | M4rtinK, CordiaHD | 10:06 |
| M4rtinK | oh | 10:06 |
| M4rtinK | yeah, that chinese vendor fiasco | 10:06 |
| ZogG_laptop | yeah there were few devices i think | 10:07 |
| kjokinie | Stskeeps: hey :) | 10:07 |
| alterego | The Vivaldi tablet looks pretty sleek | 10:08 |
| ZogG_laptop | alterego, i like Qt, especially for mobile, but i don't like KDE =) | 10:09 |
| alterego | Me either, I wasn't talking about the UX, I was talking about the device :D | 10:09 |
| * alterego looks in to why modem isn't being powered on | 10:10 | |
| Stskeeps | alterego: what ofono version? | 10:11 |
| alterego | 0.52 | 10:11 |
| alterego | Like I said, it works fine doing it manually, but it doesn't happen on start up | 10:11 |
| ZogG_laptop | btw harmattan uses ofono as well right? | 10:11 |
| alterego | So, who did the systemd scripts? And how are they organised for powering on and connecting the modem on startup? | 10:12 |
| ZogG_laptop | systemd? you use that? | 10:12 |
| alterego | ZogG_laptop: indeed | 10:12 |
| alterego | mer is 100% systemd now ;) | 10:12 |
| ZogG_laptop | oh nooooo | 10:13 |
| ZogG_laptop | i heard funtoo devs heading to tablet as well, and they decided to go with mdev i think | 10:13 |
| ZogG_laptop | just to avoid systemd | 10:13 |
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| alterego | Stskeeps: I've looked all over the place, there doesn't seem to be a place where the modem is powered on and set online. | 10:17 |
| alterego | This obviously needs to happen before pin query as well. | 10:17 |
| * alterego checks the package. | 10:17 | |
| alterego | full ver is 0.52-1.12 | 10:19 |
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| Stskeeps | hey sledges | 10:23 |
| sledges | heyllo Stskeeps ! | 10:23 |
| sledges | many things happened while I was away in N9 world :) | 10:24 |
| lbt | Sage_: does the N900 Nemo HW adaptation provide usb networking? | 10:25 |
| Sage_ | lbt: yes | 10:25 |
| lbt | ta | 10:25 |
| sledges | s/away in/away, in/ | 10:26 |
| Stskeeps | sledges: http://www.engadget.com/2012/07/07/jolla-promises-meego-will-live-on-plans-new-smartphone/ , click view press release, read | 10:26 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: does things work better when it's powered on? | 10:27 |
| Stskeeps | or you can't power it on | 10:27 |
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| Stskeeps | alterego: could you run /sbin/ifconfig -a | 10:28 |
| Stskeeps | and show output | 10:28 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: everything works fine, when the modem is powered on, and set online. The problem is, that mer/nemo isn't setup to do this on system startup | 10:29 |
| alterego | So the modem is not powered on, or set online automatically. | 10:29 |
| alterego | So somewhere in the system startup, two dbus calls need to be send to ofonod to power on the modem, and set it online. | 10:29 |
| Stskeeps | interesting | 10:29 |
| Stskeeps | so calls work when it's poweerd on ? | 10:29 |
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| alterego | Stskeeps: sort of ;) | 10:30 |
| Stskeeps | can you hear sound? | 10:30 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 10:30 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: when there's an incoming call, the ringtone goes, but the dialer app is broken and I can't use it to accept calls. | 10:30 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 10:30 |
| Stskeeps | can you make outgoing? | 10:30 |
| alterego | Ang on, I'll just do a couple more tests. | 10:31 |
| alterego | Okay, speaker works, microphone does not. | 10:32 |
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| Stskeeps | progres | 10:32 |
| Stskeeps | s | 10:32 |
| alterego | :) | 10:32 |
| alterego | If I remember correctly, the modem was initialized during the misc boot script. | 10:32 |
| Stskeeps | hmm? | 10:33 |
| alterego | So the move to systemd may have broken this? | 10:33 |
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| Stskeeps | i thought it's supposed to come up on it's own | 10:33 |
| alterego | Do calls work on the N900 with the latest nemo release? | 10:33 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 10:33 |
| Stskeeps | afaik | 10:33 |
| alterego | If not, how long have calls been broken for? | 10:33 |
| alterego | Hrm, okay. | 10:33 |
| alterego | Maybe an adaptation thing. | 10:33 |
| * alterego builds an N900 nemo image. | 10:33 | |
| Stskeeps | REMINDER: Mer bug triage in 30 minutes in #mer-meeting, feel free to join if you're looking for something to contribute in | 10:34 |
| vinsci | so, does Nemo support N900 functionality completely? Haven't kept up to date on that. | 10:35 |
| Sage_ | lbt: so should we name our ruby gem packages as: rubygem-X or ruby-gems-X or something else? | 10:35 |
| Stskeeps | vinsci: nemo provides n900 hardware adaptation, it's quite complete but some pieces missing | 10:35 |
| alterego | Do we need to name them rubygem? | 10:35 |
| Stskeeps | not as complete as maemo5 | 10:35 |
| alterego | Would have thought, ruby-package would suffice. | 10:35 |
| Sage_ | alterego: I would prefer gem name there as they are gems packaged to rpm form. | 10:35 |
| alterego | lbt: think I'm getting spouts of network latency with the wiki now you mention it .. | 10:36 |
| M4rtinK | Stskeeps: so is there already GPS support in Nemo@N900 ? | 10:36 |
| Stskeeps | M4rtinK: we used to, but i haven't wired it up to mer's qtmobility | 10:36 |
| Stskeeps | the binaries are there | 10:36 |
| M4rtinK | I think there were some issues previously | 10:36 |
| M4rtinK | oh | 10:36 |
| alterego | Sage_: yeah, I see your point there. Does it package the gemspec and everything? So we actually need rubygems installed as well to use the packages? | 10:36 |
| M4rtinK | good to know its on the way :) | 10:36 |
| Sage_ | alterego: but anything goes. Fedora uses rubygem-X and opensuse ruby-gems-X | 10:36 |
| Sage_ | in general we have followed fedora with these so should we follow fedora now as well? | 10:37 |
| lbt | alterego: OK | 10:37 |
| lbt | Sage_: I think suse use rubygem-XXX | 10:38 |
| Sage_ | alterego: I think the ruby-gems is needed only while packaging. | 10:38 |
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| lbt | alterego: if you prefer another name then that's fine by me - but you need to write it up and make sure the tools support it :) | 10:38 |
| Sage_ | lbt: ah, you are right. sry. | 10:39 |
| ZogG_laptop | alterego, on what device you run it? | 10:39 |
| lbt | alterego: just be careful not to bikeshed it | 10:39 |
| alterego | rubygem-XXX is good with me | 10:40 |
| lbt | thought it would be :D | 10:40 |
| alterego | lbt: to use these packages, does the actual rubygems need to be installed? | 10:40 |
| lbt | the tool creates spec files with appropriate dependencies | 10:41 |
| Sage_ | alterego: does it make any difference? | 10:41 |
| alterego | Sure, but in ruby, do you need to "require 'rubygems'" "require 'mygem'"? | 10:41 |
| alterego | Sage_: somewhat yes ;) | 10:41 |
| lbt | 1.9.3 should include rubygems now | 10:41 |
| lbt | I thought | 10:41 |
| Sage_ | lbt: it does | 10:42 |
| Sage_ | alterego: I know, but does it make any difference to the question I have aobut the package name? :) | 10:42 |
| alterego | Sage_: no | 10:42 |
| Sage_ | alterego: atm. some of the packages depend on rubygems package it seems yes. | 10:42 |
| lbt | also - tool dependency generation will need the name to be defined | 10:43 |
| lbt | IIRC the 'require' string is the package name | 10:43 |
| alterego | I'm gessing this gem2rpm handles that by just sticking rubygem-XXX infront of the package dependencies. Which is fine, but it also makes me think that all of these packages require 'rubygems' which is also fine. I'm just curious :) | 10:43 |
| lbt | seems a damn sensible policy | 10:43 |
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| Stskeeps | morn dcthang :) | 10:43 |
| lbt | alterego: that feels like a ruby port issue | 10:43 |
| dcthang | morn Sstkeeps :P | 10:44 |
| ZogG_laptop | Stskeeps, you are welcoming everyone, ah? =P | 10:44 |
| Stskeeps | ZogG_laptop: sure, didn't i welcome you? | 10:44 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 10:44 |
| alterego | lbt: Well, we are packaging gems after all, I'd imagine it's just sticking all the files that would be in the gem directory in to a rpm archive. So you just do rpm -i or zypper in, instead of gem install | 10:44 |
| lbt | ZogG_laptop: only when he's had too much coffee | 10:44 |
| lbt | alterego: correct | 10:44 |
| alterego | Anyway, all good from here :) | 10:45 |
| dcthang | it looks like we have a good news :-) | 10:45 |
| lbt | good | 10:45 |
| alterego | Also, OT, but has anyone heard about Dells' Project Sputnik? :) | 10:45 |
| alterego | "Project Sputnik", I applied last night. Maybe I'll get lucky. | 10:46 |
| dcthang | I heard that long times ago | 10:46 |
| ZogG_laptop | Stskeeps, you actually didn't :_( | 10:48 |
| Stskeeps | ZogG_laptop: i'm sorry, must have been asleep ;) | 10:49 |
| ZogG_laptop | alterego, there is nothing about specs and prices there, except "discount for beta testers" | 10:49 |
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| alterego | ZogG_laptop: indeed. | 10:49 |
| Stskeeps | ZogG_laptop: welcome to #mer :) what brings you here? | 10:49 |
| anidel | morning | 10:49 |
| ZogG_laptop | Stskeeps, actually you | 10:49 |
| alterego | ZogG_laptop: but it'll be normal ultrabook specs. Dell are pretty good imo. I love using their laptops .. | 10:49 |
| Stskeeps | hey anidel | 10:50 |
| alterego | At least the ones I've had .. :D | 10:50 |
| * anidel guesses that #mer will have few more people joining soonish | 10:50 | |
| lbt | Bug triage in #mer-meeting in 10mins | 10:50 |
| Stskeeps | anidel: already started yesterday | 10:50 |
| lbt | iekku: ^^ ? | 10:50 |
| ZogG_laptop | Stskeeps, it was like that jolla->jollamobile->mer . I was here few times, but i feel useless most of the time =\ | 10:50 |
| Stskeeps | ZogG_laptop: core work is not always sexy :) | 10:51 |
| alterego | It is if you're wearing your "I'm sexy and I know it" Hat. | 10:51 |
| ZogG_laptop | Stskeeps, it's not about that, i would like to help, it's about my knowledge =) but i think i'll play more with Nemo and mer when i get n950 and rasbperry (first is stuck in customs, second is awaiting orders) | 10:52 |
| anidel | lbt: :) | 10:52 |
| lbt | ZogG_laptop: I'm nearly ready to get people testing and improving minimal Mer installs | 10:52 |
| alterego | ZogG_laptop: you don't have to be a hacker to work with us. Just test, test, test :) | 10:52 |
| lbt | anidel: :) | 10:52 |
| alterego | And submit bugs, etc. | 10:52 |
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| lbt | right now I need to make a bare N900 image boot to usb-nw | 10:53 |
| ZogG_laptop | alterego, i do not like Dell and i wouldn't mind to buy one, as my gf wants laptop, but no real specs or prices, and as it's beta it may be not the best specs avlb and price can be high | 10:53 |
| lbt | I think the auto usb0 line is in one of the Nemo bits I removed | 10:53 |
| ZogG_laptop | lbt, alterego ok, but on what can i test it? all i have for now is n9 as main phone, so no tests there for sure =) | 10:54 |
| lbt | ExoPC, N900, N950, RasPi, and soon, VM | 10:54 |
| lbt | also beagleboard iirc | 10:54 |
| ZogG_laptop | alterego, i had bad expr with Dells once - so no Dell anymore. I have over priced but really good HW that is poorly supported by company in linux and most of options even in bios are closed - now you have one chance to quess what laptop i have =) | 10:55 |
| ZogG_laptop | lbt, as i get n950 and RasPi i would love too | 10:56 |
| alterego | ZogG_laptop: Apple? :P | 10:57 |
| iekku | lbt, thanks! | 10:57 |
| lbt | ZogG_laptop: OK, I'm working on N900 first, then N950 | 10:58 |
| lbt | RasPi when they get their fingers out of their arses | 10:58 |
| ZogG_laptop | lbt, i want to get N900 as mine dead | 10:59 |
| alterego | lbt: getting quite a bit of latency on wiki, is it unusually busy per chance? | 10:59 |
| ZogG_laptop | alterego, nope | 10:59 |
| ZogG_laptop | alterego, Sony | 10:59 |
| lbt | alterego: no ... it's being a pita ... don't know why | 10:59 |
| lbt | I thought it was just me so left it for a bit | 10:59 |
| lbt | will look post-triage as it's affecting other people now | 11:00 |
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| iekku | mer bug triage starting | 11:00 |
| lbt | ZogG_laptop: (and this is why a simple tutorial takes forever to finish) | 11:00 |
| ZogG_laptop | lbt, i would love to help as i get devices to test | 11:01 |
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| Sage_ | lbt: where does suse store the gems as in directory in file system %{_libdir}/gems/ ? | 11:05 |
| lbt | Sage_: in triage - not 100% sure | 11:06 |
| Sage_ | or where do we want to store them? | 11:06 |
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| alterego | That depends on where rubygems wants them. | 11:10 |
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| KaIRC | "The server at www.jollamobile.com is taking too long to respond." Either they haven't done a proper website yet (as I just tried a website with their email domain name) or they are overloaded with web requests ;-) | 11:17 |
| Stskeeps | working on website | 11:17 |
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| KaIRC | Stskeeps: ah, ok. a placeholder with "coming soon" would be better than a timeout for now, though :) | 11:34 |
| chouchoune | Stskeeps: tss tss tss, focus on the device, not the website ;) | 11:34 |
| * chouchoune kidding, of course | 11:34 | |
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| Stskeeps | phaeron: http://releases.merproject.org/~carsten/oddity.txt , http://pastie.org/4225289 | 11:36 |
| Stskeeps | hello rferrazz :) | 11:37 |
| rferrazz | hello! i'm stepped in just to see what's happening after the jolla annonuncement | 11:38 |
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| alterego | Sage_: can you tell me the purpose of setup_gpio() in /usr/sbin/nokia-n900-configs.sh in the n900 nemo adaptation? | 11:38 |
| alterego | Sage_: do those GPIO calls setup the modem manually without ofonod? | 11:38 |
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| Stskeeps | rferrazz: sure :) if you have any questions on Mer, free free to ask at any time, else feel free to hang out and learn more :) | 11:39 |
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| Sage_ | alterego: Not sure. sry :/ | 11:43 |
| alterego | Sage_: basically, we have a problem in N950 startup that isn't causing N950 modem to power on or go online. | 11:44 |
| alterego | Sage_: do you know if calls have ever worked for N950 nemo? | 11:44 |
| rferrazz | what are the main diffrernces between another embedded linux distro like openwrt and mer? | 11:45 |
| Stskeeps | rferrazz: openwrt has it's place :) we are more about experience devices | 11:45 |
| Stskeeps | rferrazz: we come with systems, too, not only code | 11:45 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: I believe it starts the calculation with the empty or missing packages before the actual stuff has been copied. so I rewriting it not to | 11:45 |
| Sage_ | alterego: they have worked yes. | 11:45 |
| phaeron | *am | 11:46 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: ok | 11:46 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: just collecting data | 11:46 |
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| Sage_ | alterego: however, it has never been too reliable. | 11:48 |
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| Stskeeps | alterego: AFAIK ofono should handle gpio itself | 11:50 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: nowadays | 11:50 |
| Sage_ | Stskeeps: also the version we have in Mer atm. ? | 11:51 |
| Stskeeps | Sage_: i think so | 11:51 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: can you get me dmesg? | 11:51 |
| alterego | Hrm, well, it still needs manually powering on and setting to online. So what's supposed to handle that at startup? | 11:51 |
| alterego | Or is it suppsed to be automagic? | 11:51 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: can you get me that ifconfig -a after startup? | 11:51 |
| Stskeeps | i have a bad feeling | 11:51 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: looks fine, phonet0 is UP | 11:52 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: ok | 11:52 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: and dmesg? | 11:52 |
| Stskeeps | i don't .. yet.. have a microsim | 11:52 |
| * Stskeeps looks embarassed | 11:52 | |
| alterego | lol | 11:52 |
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| alterego | N950 doesn't need microsim :P | 11:52 |
| Stskeeps | i use n950 for my regular phone | 11:53 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: how do you bring modem online? | 11:53 |
| alterego | Using ofono-tests | 11:54 |
| alterego | It's basically two dbus calls | 11:54 |
| Stskeeps | ok, tell me which? | 11:54 |
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| alterego | Stskeeps: /usr/lib/ofono/test/enable-modem && /usr/lib/ofono/test/online-modem | 11:55 |
| Stskeeps | thanks | 11:55 |
| alterego | There are issues with the dialer, basically can't get it to do anything. But that'll be something else. | 11:56 |
| alterego | I can use the test scripts to make and receive calls, mic doesn't appear to work with active call. | 11:56 |
| alterego | So something possibly wrong with PA setup there. | 11:57 |
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| alterego | Unfortunately, I don't know how/when the modem is supposed to be online'd. | 11:58 |
| alterego | I don't think ofonod does it automatically. | 11:58 |
| Stskeeps | can you get a log from ofonod when it starts up? | 11:58 |
| alterego | Yeah, got one. | 11:58 |
| Stskeeps | ie, add -d parameter and submit it somewhere | 11:58 |
| Stskeeps | -before- onlining the modem | 11:58 |
| alterego | Sure | 11:58 |
| alterego | Straight after startup | 11:58 |
| Stskeeps | yep | 11:59 |
| alterego | Okay to grep "ofonod" so you don't get the rest of the junk? :) | 11:59 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 11:59 |
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| phaeron | I guess it needs to understand flight mode from connman | 12:00 |
| Stskeeps | that's what i thought too, but we have a saner connman now | 12:00 |
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| alterego | Stskeeps: http://stage.rubyx.co.uk/ofonod.log | 12:02 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: ah feck | 12:03 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: can't you adjust term length? | 12:03 |
| alterego | Can I? :) | 12:03 |
| Stskeeps | pipe to a file? | 12:04 |
| lbt | is that journalctl ? | 12:04 |
| alterego | Yeah, -a fixes it, hang on | 12:04 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: refresh | 12:04 |
| phako | meh | 12:05 |
| phako | can someone manually subscribe me to the mer mailinglist, please? | 12:05 |
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| lbt | smoku: ^^ ? | 12:06 |
| lbt | pffft | 12:06 |
| Stskeeps | phako: can't you do that on your own? | 12:06 |
| phako | my mailserver is still in ahbl | 12:06 |
| phako | Stskeeps: ^ | 12:06 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 12:06 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 12:06 |
| phako | or rather the whole /24 | 12:06 |
| alterego | lol | 12:06 |
| * Stskeeps has to go lay down a bit | 12:07 | |
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| Stskeeps | alterego: i have a later kernel .. might be useful | 12:09 |
| alterego | Okay | 12:11 |
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| smoku | lbt: ? | 12:13 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: http://repo.pub.meego.com/home:/stskeeps:/branches:/tearing/Mer_Core-next_CE_Adaptation_N9xx-common_armv7hl/ | 12:14 |
| Stskeeps | add, zypper up | 12:14 |
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| alterego | Cool | 12:16 |
| Stskeeps | welcome back ravirdv | 12:19 |
| ravirdv | hi! | 12:19 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: no guarantees this won't botch everything | 12:19 |
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| w00t | Stskeeps: i see you're learning since your "new qt5 is totally available in the repository right now" incident | 12:21 |
| w00t | :-P | 12:21 |
| Stskeeps | w00t: at least i didn't write unrealircd! | 12:21 |
| Stskeeps | oh, wait | 12:21 |
| w00t | you were drunk, you're excused | 12:21 |
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| Stskeeps | welcome back, blaroche :) | 12:24 |
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| ravirdv | @Stskeeps I love this palce :) | 12:24 |
| Stskeeps | ravirdv: good, then i'm doing a good job :) | 12:24 |
| blaroche | Stskeeps: morning :) .. at least for me | 12:24 |
| ravirdv | I've been 2nd time here, but already feel part of this community :) | 12:24 |
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| Stskeeps | yep, we work by UGT here - http://www.total-knowledge.com/~ilya/mips/ugt.html | 12:25 |
| alterego | lol | 12:25 |
| alterego | I was loling at unrealircd .. | 12:26 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 12:26 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 12:26 |
| w00t | it's always morning in #mer! (monday morning with mer! let's just hope that isn't yet another rerun of san francisco) | 12:26 |
| blaroche | i wasn't aware, thanks much for the link :) | 12:26 |
| alterego | lol | 12:26 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: what will this updated kernel supposedly achieve? :) | 12:27 |
| lbt | smoku: phako was trying to get subscribed to ml | 12:27 |
| lbt | has ahbl issues | 12:27 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: modem update stuff | 12:27 |
| alterego | Ah, cool | 12:27 |
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| phako | lbt: remembered that I could finally use my gmail address for sth useful | 12:27 |
| phako | so, nevermind :) | 12:27 |
| chouchoune | Stskeeps: I've read on Twitter several days ago that you were working on Wayland/Qt5 ? | 12:28 |
| chouchoune | Was it with Mer ? | 12:28 |
| w00t | chouchoune: yes, we're experimenting with wayland+mer | 12:28 |
| chouchoune | oh great | 12:29 |
| chouchoune | what's the status ? | 12:29 |
| w00t | chouchoune: some videos at http://www.youtube.com/w00teh1 | 12:29 |
| chouchoune | thanks | 12:29 |
| * alterego installs new kernel | 12:31 | |
| w00t | chouchoune: that's all done with software rendering inside a VM btw.. if that helps give perspective on performance.. and the lag you see isn't down to that, but some issues with console output | 12:32 |
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| mja | is it likely wayland ends up in Jolla's products? | 12:32 |
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| chouchoune | w00t: not worried about performance in the short term | 12:32 |
| Stskeeps | mja: i can't talk about the future, but if it works fine in mer, and hardware support exists, why not | 12:33 |
| Stskeeps | ravirdv: sure :) think of this as a giant virtual office and that helps :) | 12:33 |
| mja | stskeeps, but it's likely it'll be xorg to begin with? | 12:33 |
| w00t | chouchoune: sure, general base is that it performs well anyway | 12:33 |
| chouchoune | yes | 12:34 |
| Stskeeps | mja: i'll only say that wayland support isn't terribly well out there in current hardware offerings. | 12:34 |
| Stskeeps | which is a damn shame | 12:34 |
| Stskeeps | from Mer POV, i want to make it easy to do wayland based systems | 12:34 |
| Stskeeps | and develop them | 12:34 |
| mja | Stskeeps: understood | 12:35 |
| Stskeeps | like in w00teh1s videos about | 12:35 |
| Stskeeps | above | 12:35 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: no change. | 12:35 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: uname -a | 12:35 |
| alterego | Linux localhost.localdomain 2.6.32.20115101-21.1.Nemo.Adaptation.N950.N9-adaptation-n950 #1 PREEMPT Sat Jul 7 09:49:44 UTC 2012 armv7l armv7l armv7l GNU/Linux | 12:36 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 12:36 |
| Stskeeps | well, one more dow | 12:36 |
| Stskeeps | n | 12:36 |
| Stskeeps | mja: personally, in my free time, i'm working to sgx enable n900/n950/n9 again | 12:36 |
| Stskeeps | and me and w00t are brewing on a wayland-only stack with busybox, etc | 12:37 |
| Stskeeps | which will run on usual suspects, exopc, n900/n950/n9, perhaps archos 69, s10-3t, raspberry pi | 12:37 |
| Stskeeps | err.. | 12:38 |
| Stskeeps | archos G9 | 12:38 |
| * w00t reads up | 12:39 | |
| w00t | *nod* | 12:39 |
| Stskeeps | _av500_: archos 69 sounds like a brilliant product direction | 12:40 |
| chouchoune | that would already be a grat start ! | 12:40 |
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| alterego | Stskeeps, Sage_ okay, what next? wrt ofono not intializing N950 modem :) | 12:43 |
| Sage_ | alterego: well, you could probably use phonesim to emulate modem and do some tests with that. | 12:43 |
| Sage_ | not sure though if we have it packaged atm. | 12:43 |
| alterego | I'll continue poking around for a bit more then. | 12:44 |
| Sage_ | alterego: also one note is that our ofono has old dbus api's and the updated ofono will have changed api's | 12:44 |
| alterego | Do we have anyone that specialises more in this area? | 12:44 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: compare with n900 logs | 12:44 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: was thinking of doing that .. | 12:45 |
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| Stskeeps | hi aiads :) | 12:52 |
| aiads | hi | 12:53 |
| aiads | who | 12:53 |
| Stskeeps | welcome here to #mer :) what brings you around? | 12:53 |
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| Stskeeps | hello eric / Guest41054 :) | 13:01 |
| Stskeeps | .. or formerly known as aiads ;) | 13:01 |
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| Guest41054 | i am new guy | 13:02 |
| Stskeeps | sure :) | 13:03 |
| Stskeeps | if you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask | 13:03 |
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| ericc | ok | 13:03 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: how are we doing? | 13:04 |
| ericc | the tizen is mer 2.0? | 13:04 |
| Stskeeps | nah, tizen is it's own thing :) | 13:04 |
| Stskeeps | mer is mer | 13:04 |
| Stskeeps | original idea for mer was meego 2.0, but then intel launched meego | 13:04 |
| Stskeeps | err | 13:04 |
| Stskeeps | launched tizen | 13:04 |
| w00t | Stskeeps: we should probably update the homepage.. | 13:05 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 13:05 |
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| phaeron | Stskeeps: stuck on a perl syntax issues; | 13:06 |
| ericc | meego can run in the palm pre3？ | 13:06 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: ah, the usual :) | 13:06 |
| Stskeeps | ericc: we don't do meego here, sorry, we do Mer :) | 13:06 |
| Stskeeps | ericc: Mer could potentially run but you need to do a lot of hard work | 13:06 |
| ericc | i want to ner run in my palm | 13:07 |
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| ericc | to hack it？ | 13:07 |
| Stskeeps | ericc: OK, and it takes a lot of work :) you need to know about linux kernel compilation, etc | 13:07 |
| alterego | What's the appropriate mic command for creating raw images for N900? | 13:07 |
| alterego | -f raw doesn't work for me anymore .. | 13:08 |
| alterego | Oh wait, do I just not do -f now .. | 13:08 |
| lbt | mic create raw | 13:08 |
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| alterego | Yeah, just figured that out ;) | 13:08 |
| lbt | https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Getting_Started | 13:08 |
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| lbt | I was editing it w/o saving ... but you may find it helpful | 13:09 |
| lbt | I'm about to add something to get usb networking to work | 13:09 |
| alterego | cool | 13:09 |
| * alterego wonders where his _other_ _other_ _other_ sim card is .. | 13:10 | |
| ericc | the mer sdk only run linux？or windows | 13:11 |
| lbt | ericc: most linux | 13:11 |
| alterego | only Linux is supported | 13:11 |
| alterego | You can run it in a VM under windows though ;) | 13:11 |
| shrikrishna | i just switched over to precise | 13:11 |
| alterego | lbt: what do you think about creating a remote compiler like Nokia have for Qt Creator? :) | 13:12 |
| shrikrishna | and /etc/apt/sources.list is very different here | 13:12 |
| ericc | i had as5 in | 13:12 |
| shrikrishna | oops sorry i'll wait... | 13:12 |
| ericc | my vbox！ | 13:12 |
| alterego | Would need an OSC client for windows I guess. | 13:12 |
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| lbt | I have zero windows knowledge | 13:12 |
| lbt | and no windows PCs | 13:12 |
| lbt | or phones | 13:12 |
| shrikrishna | cheers lbt !! :D | 13:13 |
| ericc | which you phone？n9？n900 | 13:13 |
| anidel | lbt: your Dell came with Linux? cool | 13:13 |
| lbt | anidel: it's a long story .... a grateful customer .... | 13:13 |
| alterego | anidel: mine came with Windows 7, doesn't mean I booted it .. | 13:13 |
| ericc | how can you see the mer sdk pic？ | 13:14 |
| Stskeeps | ericc: for application developer, you want qt sdk | 13:14 |
| lbt | ericc: the Mer SDK is only command line | 13:14 |
| ericc | impressive ？ | 13:14 |
| anidel | alterego: it's still a Windows PC :P na kidding :) I wish one could really choose hw and pick the sw he wants, be it pc, tablet, pad, phone... | 13:14 |
| lbt | shrikrishna: the Platform SDK works on any modern linux distro | 13:15 |
| lbt | it's chroot based | 13:15 |
| alterego | anidel: indeed, Dell are probably one of the more Linux friendly manufacturers tbh. | 13:15 |
| shrikrishna | no.... my problem is | 13:15 |
| lbt | anidel: as long as there's no MS-tax | 13:15 |
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| shrikrishna | in sources.list | 13:15 |
| lbt | shrikrishna: mmm so what are you installing? | 13:15 |
| shrikrishna | it's something like deb http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/tools/repos/ubuntu/ maverick main multiverse universe | 13:16 |
| anidel | lbt: :) | 13:16 |
| shrikrishna | which is different from previous versions | 13:16 |
| lbt | shrikrishna: ah, that's MeeGo ... it's dead | 13:16 |
| lbt | don't tell Jolla :) | 13:16 |
| Stskeeps | shrikrishna: just grab mer platform sdk, http://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Platform_SDK | 13:16 |
| lbt | we're Mer ... and we do things differently in some areas | 13:16 |
| lbt | .... | 13:16 |
| lbt | like that | 13:16 |
| shrikrishna | oh | 13:17 |
| shrikrishna | thanks | 13:17 |
| lbt | shrikrishna: you'll probably want to remove any MeeGo things from your system if you're just working with Mer | 13:17 |
| lbt | to avoid conflicts | 13:18 |
| shrikrishna | just did | 13:18 |
| shrikrishna | followed it from the guide in this page - https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Image_Creation_For_Beginners | 13:18 |
| ericc | html5 can run on th mer？ | 13:19 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 13:19 |
| ericc | ok i go to install sdk | 13:23 |
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| ericc | where is mer ui？ | 13:38 |
| Stskeeps | ericc: mer doesn't have a ui :) | 13:38 |
| ericc | how can mer do somthing | 13:39 |
| anidel | it has a UI...it's called CLI | 13:39 |
| ericc | lol | 13:40 |
| Stskeeps | anidel: good luck getting a login prompt without a kernel ;) | 13:40 |
| lbt | anidel: https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Getting_Started soon | 13:41 |
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| anidel | if there's no kernel, then there's no mer | 13:43 |
| anidel | if there's mer, there could be a shell, thus a cli | 13:43 |
| anidel | :D | 13:43 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 13:43 |
| anidel | but yeah...you're right, of course ;) | 13:44 |
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| Stskeeps | hello shanxS :) | 13:51 |
| _av500_ | Stskeeps: just put the matching content on it | 13:51 |
| Stskeeps | _av500_: deal! | 13:51 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 13:51 |
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| alterego | hurp, n900 nemo doesn't have journalctl thingy | 13:52 |
| Stskeeps | anidel: uhh | 13:52 |
| Stskeeps | it should | 13:52 |
| Stskeeps | err | 13:52 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: i mean | 13:52 |
| Stskeeps | same core version | 13:52 |
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| lbt | alterego: good, I thought that too | 13:53 |
| alterego | what package is it supposed to be in? | 13:53 |
| Stskeeps | systemd | 13:54 |
| alterego | Definitely not there. | 13:54 |
| Stskeeps | hmm | 13:54 |
| alterego | Not in latest n950 image either O_O | 13:54 |
| shanxS | hey Stskeeps | 13:54 |
| Stskeeps | systemd-journalctl ? | 13:54 |
| Stskeeps | journalctl ? | 13:54 |
| alterego | Oh I'm anidiot | 13:54 |
| Stskeeps | shanxS: welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer ? | 13:54 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: no, you're altereg | 13:55 |
| Stskeeps | o | 13:55 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 13:55 |
| alterego | :P | 13:55 |
| shanxS | I just saw news about Jolla Mobile | 13:55 |
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| alterego | shanxS: cool :) | 13:55 |
| shanxS | a link took me to http://bergie.iki.fi/blog/meego-diaspora/ | 13:55 |
| Stskeeps | shanxS: cool :) if you have any questions about Mer, feel free to ask at any time, or on how to contribute - else feel free to hang out and learn | 13:55 |
| shanxS | yes.. yes !!! | 13:56 |
| shanxS | what are the future plans | 13:56 |
| Stskeeps | for Mer? continue as we're going, solving the problems we have, innovate, :) | 13:56 |
| shanxS | I have not yet explored the wesite completely | 13:56 |
| shanxS | cool | 13:56 |
| Stskeeps | we're just a core, so it's limited how much we need to do, we 'just' need to do it well | 13:56 |
| Stskeeps | UI and hardware adaptation left up to others | 13:57 |
| shanxS | how can I start to contribute | 13:57 |
| shanxS | ? | 13:57 |
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| Stskeeps | shanxS: well, as a start, grab Mer platform SDK, http://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Platform_SDK | 13:57 |
| Stskeeps | and register at https://bugs.merproject.org | 13:57 |
| Stskeeps | and yes, our SSL certificates are self-signed | 13:57 |
| Stskeeps | hello foob :) | 13:57 |
| shanxS | cool | 13:58 |
| ericc | the jolla is mer？ | 13:58 |
| Stskeeps | ericc: yes, jolla is mer based | 13:59 |
| shanxS | I'll be needing some guidance in initial stages... so I'll keep bothering you | 13:59 |
| shanxS | :P | 13:59 |
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| Stskeeps | shanxS: please do | 13:59 |
| shanxS | jolla is mer based ? aren't they trying to bring MeeGo into market instead ? | 13:59 |
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| alterego | shanxS: Mer is sort of MeeGo 2.0 | 14:00 |
| Stskeeps | shanxS: mer is meego based too :) | 14:00 |
| alterego | We're continuing where that project left off. | 14:00 |
| Stskeeps | shanxS: we split off from meego 1.3, where meego had died | 14:00 |
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| Stskeeps | and decided to do things the right way | 14:00 |
| shanxS | alrighty... so its like Mer is a fork of MeeGo, right ? | 14:01 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 14:01 |
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| Stskeeps | tizen IVI is also a fork of meego | 14:01 |
| shanxS | cool | 14:01 |
| Stskeeps | many of us worked in meego.com before | 14:01 |
| rcg | greetings from port elizabeth | 14:01 |
| rcg | :) | 14:01 |
| Stskeeps | rcg: hope you enjoyed your trip :) | 14:01 |
| shanxS | yeah I just read about that.. but why do we have two forks ? shouldn't both teams work together to speed up things IMHO | 14:03 |
| Stskeeps | shanxS: we wanted to go a different direction -- in fact, Mer existed before MeeGo | 14:03 |
| Stskeeps | we joined as they claimed same methods and philosophies as us | 14:04 |
| Stskeeps | it got turned into a damn mess | 14:04 |
| shanxS | ohh.. I see... | 14:04 |
| Stskeeps | so, when Tizen got announced.. well, we decided it was time to show how it should be done | 14:04 |
| Stskeeps | we do work together and admire people in tizen IVI though | 14:04 |
| Stskeeps | they do good work on their stack, for their purpose, but we're not playing the same game | 14:04 |
| rcg | Stskeeps: well, was quite exhausting.. took a nap when i first arrived at the hotel here | 14:05 |
| rcg | ;) | 14:05 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: lots of differences between N900 and N950 startup. | 14:05 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: interesting | 14:05 |
| alterego | Basically N900 continues and N950 stops | 14:05 |
| * shanxS off to explore Mer | 14:06 | |
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| alterego | Stskeeps: apparently connman is supposed to do this stuff. But not sure about that. | 14:07 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: hmm | 14:07 |
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| phaeron | Stskeeps: it's looking better, and I found the reason some packages were not copied | 14:07 |
| anidel | what stuff? | 14:07 |
| alterego | init cell mo | 14:07 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: interesting | 14:07 |
| anidel | ok | 14:07 |
| Stskeeps | hello subhamoy :) | 14:08 |
| alterego | well cause cellmio init | 14:08 |
| Stskeeps | anidel: we're debugging why modem doesn't always come up on n950/n9 adaptation | 14:08 |
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| Stskeeps | hey supreet :) | 14:08 |
| subhamoy | hello | 14:08 |
| supreet | Stskeeps: hey | 14:09 |
| Stskeeps | subhamoy & supreet: welcome :) so what brings you here to #Mer ? | 14:09 |
| anidel | stskeeps you mean for makin calls or for when a USB cable is attached to a PC | 14:09 |
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| supreet | Well, I was supposed to aKademy - 2012 ( KDE summit) | 14:09 |
| supreet | but couldn't due to visa issues | 14:09 |
| Stskeeps | anidel: for making calls | 14:09 |
| supreet | but my friends who attended it | 14:09 |
| supreet | made some posts | 14:09 |
| Stskeeps | supreet: ah, yeah, visas are always such a mess :) | 14:09 |
| supreet | regarding mer | 14:10 |
| Stskeeps | cool - got a URL? | 14:10 |
| supreet | so I thought I should check up :) | 14:10 |
| KaIRC | don't get me started on visas | 14:10 |
| subhamoy | Stskeeps: i have been involved indirectly in Meego dev and R&D while doing my Master's in aalto univ in helsinki | 14:10 |
| supreet | since I have been working with QMl | 14:10 |
| Stskeeps | subhamoy: alright :) me too, on meego.com / ARM side | 14:10 |
| Stskeeps | subhamoy: if you have any questions regarding Mer, or on how to contribute, feel free to ask any time - else feel free to hang out and learn/watch :) | 14:10 |
| supreet | url> -http://www.merproject.org/ :P | 14:11 |
| supreet | there was a post on G+ | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | supreet: ah, i meant the post on G+ | 14:11 |
| subhamoy | Stskeeps: yes, of course; that's one of the reasons to join here ! :) | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | subhamoy: excellent :) | 14:11 |
| supreet | https://plus.google.com/u/0/110953740010395822648/posts/1Fcou3VSFC4 | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | supreet: thanks :) | 14:12 |
| Stskeeps | supreet: i was positively surprised by http://www.phonenews.com/core-nokia-meego-team-announces-new-company-in-jolla-20662/ | 14:12 |
| Stskeeps | it's a very well written article | 14:12 |
| supreet | :) | 14:12 |
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| supreet | Stskeeps: i would like to contribute, I currently won't have a lot of time but possibly over the weekends | 14:14 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: let me know when i should test something.. i have to go in an hour latest to my mother in law though | 14:14 |
| Stskeeps | supreet: sure :) any contribution, no matter the size, matters | 14:14 |
| supreet | I am looking more towards QML | 14:14 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 14:15 |
| Stskeeps | we'd like people to use Mer, do exciting new things with it | 14:15 |
| Stskeeps | not just rehashing handsets or tablets :) | 14:15 |
| supreet | :) | 14:16 |
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| alterego | Wow, that article is good Stskeeps | 14:17 |
| alterego | That one had missed me. | 14:17 |
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| Stskeeps | hello ukas :) | 14:18 |
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| anidel | need to ask Jukka, but do you guys know how much open JollaMobile plans to be? | 14:19 |
| ukas | hello :) | 14:19 |
| anidel | hello ukas | 14:19 |
| Stskeeps | ukas: welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer ? | 14:19 |
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| alterego | anidel: I'm sure we'll find out more over the next few weeks as the ramp up their online presence. | 14:19 |
| alterego | They've just put a facebook page together and they're working on proper website at the moment. | 14:20 |
| Stskeeps | anidel: i can't say more than what twitter and press releases say, but the message is that they're working with Mer (and has been for several months) and contributing to it, and continuing to | 14:20 |
| Stskeeps | anidel: so that's already a good start | 14:20 |
| Stskeeps | and Mer and Qt are corner stones | 14:20 |
| ukas | Stskeeps: plain curiosity | 14:20 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: I might drop this ofono startup issue for a bit until new version comes. And just manually enable it for now whilst working on dialer. | 14:21 |
| Stskeeps | ukas: sure :) if you have any questions about Mer, or on how to contribute, feel free to ask at any time :) else feel free to just hang out, watch, and learn :) | 14:21 |
| ukas | Stskeeps: thanks :) | 14:21 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: get me n900 logs and i'll follow up | 14:21 |
| anidel | they are ineed. As Alterego said, we need to wait and see. Will let Jukka work on the website instead of bothering him with questions he'll answer ultimately anyway | 14:21 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: ttp://stage.rubyx.co.uk/ofono-n900.log | 14:21 |
| alterego | With a h | 14:21 |
| Stskeeps | anidel: but in general, it's not a cashless hippie commune trying to launch a project, there's partners and investors | 14:21 |
| Stskeeps | ok, that sounded bad in open context :) | 14:22 |
| alterego | lol | 14:22 |
| ukas | cashless hippie commune :D | 14:22 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: thanks | 14:22 |
| alterego | I think you just insulted about 90% of the people in this channel ;) | 14:22 |
| mikhas | and it's factually wrong, too | 14:23 |
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| Paimen | I still have hippie on hilite, but I'm not insulted :P | 14:23 |
| alterego | hippies can have partners too! | 14:23 |
| anidel | stskeeps: ;) | 14:23 |
| Stskeeps | ;) | 14:23 |
| Stskeeps | anidel: what kind of open were you interested in, just out of curiousity? | 14:24 |
| anidel | Stskeeps: governance | 14:25 |
| Stskeeps | anidel: ah | 14:25 |
| anidel | Stskeeps: but I know the answer already /me thinks | 14:25 |
| Stskeeps | anidel: mer stays the way it is (open governance), with jolla as a vendor amongst many.. regarding upper stack, stay tuned | 14:26 |
| anidel | Stskeeps: of course will be very intersting to see what they choose to keep closed | 14:26 |
| Stskeeps | it always is, yes | 14:26 |
| anidel | definitely fascinating times on the mobile industry... | 14:27 |
| Stskeeps | i personally consider it a win if we can have multiple companies using mer, to build different kind of devices | 14:27 |
| Stskeeps | a new kind of ecosystem, as such | 14:27 |
| Stskeeps | not just app centered | 14:27 |
| Paimen | I'm very exited to see what kind of UX they manage to ship | 14:27 |
| anidel | Stskeeps: for you guys it's definitely a win. | 14:27 |
| anidel | Stskeeps: yeah, what meego should have done, as said, you're doing it right. | 14:28 |
| vilpan | for everybody. The more companies, the more things they'll find in common, then it's only common sense to collaborate | 14:28 |
| Stskeeps | as i've said in several talks.. what people didn't do in meego, was actually to make handsets or for that matter tablets | 14:28 |
| alterego | I think what I'd like is open user engagement. I hope they keep a close relationship with the customers, and really listen to what people want. | 14:28 |
| Stskeeps | they made devices that was beyond that, scrapped the upper ui layer | 14:28 |
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| anidel | alterego: I strongly believe they will | 14:29 |
| Stskeeps | as that was what meego really was, damn good for customizing | 14:29 |
| anidel | Stskeeps: it was indeed | 14:29 |
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| alterego | anidel: I do too. | 14:29 |
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| Stskeeps | i'm personally almost scared at the attention this stuff is getting though, makes you wonder if it really touched a significant nerve in mobile industry | 14:30 |
| anidel | several open seeds have been planted, few storms passed by, it's time to see something grow up of this mess. JollaMobile is one of these. And I believe they have the right assets to succeed and I'll do my best to support them. | 14:30 |
| Stskeeps | .. and next up, what kind of businesses can be built on top of this | 14:30 |
| anidel | Stskeeps: what I just intended to say , but in a more clear way :) I think it has | 14:31 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 14:31 |
| Paimen | Stskeeps: well Samsung is shooting itself in to foot with Tizen and android, wp and iphone are closed. So of course Mer and Jolla will get lot of attention | 14:31 |
| anidel | and I hope Samsung sees it through and joins, as they are powerful enough to make a big difference here | 14:32 |
| Stskeeps | anidel: Intel, Samsung and others are welcome to join Mer, on same conditions as everybody else | 14:32 |
| anidel | Samsung is a hard to understand player here with Tizen. | 14:32 |
| ukas | has anything new happened with Tizen since they announced it? | 14:32 |
| alterego | I don't think it's that hard to understand./ | 14:32 |
| Stskeeps | ukas: well, they do have a reference device | 14:33 |
| alterego | Tizen gives them more power over the platform they use in their devices. | 14:33 |
| anidel | and they have what Nokia had with Maemo, I hope they do not make the same mistakes. | 14:33 |
| ukas | but not much | 14:33 |
| Paimen | Tizen is just new iteration of Bada, so called open platform, but all decissions and development is done inhouse | 14:33 |
| Stskeeps | i don't want to downplay tizen as 1) there's people who want to do really good in those projects 2) their web runtime isn't half bad | 14:33 |
| ukas | and android/ios/wp is old news, so no wonder if Jolla is causing waves :P | 14:33 |
| Stskeeps | and 3) they seem to care about wanting to go for standards | 14:33 |
| alterego | Paimen: unfortunately with these large companies I can only seeing it work that way. | 14:33 |
| alterego | They want to stay in control. | 14:33 |
| Paimen | it is not bad platform, but people want more open platform | 14:34 |
| Stskeeps | .. now if they could just do it right and publish things sanely.. | 14:34 |
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| anidel | exactly that. | 14:34 |
| anidel | let's hope... | 14:34 |
| Paimen | also it will be really interesting thing to see how it goes with html5 | 14:34 |
| Stskeeps | there's good work being done with tizen '2.0' or whatever it's called, which is practically meego based | 14:34 |
| Paimen | altought Mer is in good standign point with that too | 14:34 |
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| anidel | I met the team and they are hard workers and they want Tizen to succeed. As said, hope they learnt from mistakes already been made by Nokia | 14:35 |
| Stskeeps | anidel: yeah.. and then go on to let the samsung+intel mix do exactly the same things all over again | 14:35 |
| Stskeeps | and yes, they're good people | 14:36 |
| Stskeeps | just i think they should really have been let go of corporate restraints, get pushed in front and set up shop properly themselves | 14:36 |
| * anidel nods | 14:36 | |
| ukas | how well does mer work in n900? meaning can you make calls and surf the web? coworker of mine got interested since there seemed to be a image of mer for n900 | 14:37 |
| Stskeeps | ukas: calls, surf web | 14:37 |
| Stskeeps | it's Nemo, however | 14:37 |
| Stskeeps | mer doesn't contain hw adaptations, or UI | 14:37 |
| ukas | aah | 14:37 |
| Stskeeps | ukas: it's a nice hacking platform, but not a end user product | 14:37 |
| ukas | okay :) | 14:37 |
| ukas | so what does mer actually contain? | 14:38 |
| supreet | Stskeeps: do we have a developer device in the making? | 14:38 |
| anidel | correct if wrong: hw adaptation (kernel, drivers, etc) + mer core + whatever you need+ UI -> full blow OS | 14:38 |
| supreet | for UX development? | 14:38 |
| Stskeeps | anidel: we usually say = product, but sure | 14:38 |
| Stskeeps | ukas: http://gitweb.merproject.org/gitweb + systems surrounding it | 14:38 |
| anidel | supreet: you can run Mer on everything, why you need a developer device from Mer? | 14:38 |
| Stskeeps | supreet: let me show you a video.. | 14:39 |
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| supreet | from what I read you guys are concentrating on phones | 14:39 |
| Stskeeps | supreet: nop, mobile core | 14:39 |
| Stskeeps | means a core that can run in a mobile scenario, ie, not plugged into the mains at all times | 14:39 |
| supreet | aah | 14:39 |
| Stskeeps | and low footprint, etc | 14:39 |
| alterego | supreet: Jolla are concentrating on Phones, Mer is a core to run on all kinds of devices. We actually don't even think too much about devices, just make it as lean and robust as possible :) | 14:40 |
| Stskeeps | (and easy to hw adapt for) | 14:40 |
| Stskeeps | supreet: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V83mChc-hQE&feature=plcp is in a virtual machine, with Mer, LLVMpipe software rendering, Qt5, wayland, qml compositor | 14:40 |
| Stskeeps | oh, on a x86 laptop | 14:40 |
| supreet | cool I ll check it out | 14:40 |
| Stskeeps | and yes, we know that lags, it's a bug we found after video recording | 14:40 |
| ukas | but mer comes with Qt? | 14:40 |
| Stskeeps | ukas: yes, but some even strip qt and use GNOME instead | 14:40 |
| Paimen | ukas: qt5 alpha1 I think | 14:41 |
| Stskeeps | we optimize for html5/qml/js scenario | 14:41 |
| ukas | okay :) | 14:41 |
| Stskeeps | we're very much about mold-your-own core if you need to | 14:41 |
| Stskeeps | plasma active doesn't use connman, like mer's standard configuration, they use network manager | 14:41 |
| saya_ | Hi. Been reading this discussion. So mer is more like a standard set of packages and configuration? I don't get exactly what it is, not ux, not drivers. | 14:44 |
| Stskeeps | saya_: Mer is a bit loosely defined as a core.. combine with a UI and a hardware adaptation and you have a 'product' | 14:44 |
| Stskeeps | saya_: we work towards creating a core, and systems (build farm software, SDKs, QA tools), etc, that any vendor can pick up and use | 14:45 |
| supreet | so how closely is the Jolla team working with you guys? | 14:45 |
| Stskeeps | the thing is that for most mobile linux solutions, people end up with very similar stacks | 14:45 |
| Stskeeps | supreet: i'm project architect, and part of jolla (though i handle my role as i should, vendor-agnostic) | 14:46 |
| Stskeeps | supreet: and few others contributing too | 14:46 |
| saya_ | Hmmm ok so a good base to build from. | 14:46 |
| Stskeeps | saya_: yes | 14:46 |
| shanxS | i may be interrupting.. buts isn't Linux + UI + h/w adaptation == product, too ? | 14:46 |
| Stskeeps | shanxS: Linux is just a kernel :) | 14:46 |
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| Stskeeps | shanxS: on top of that there's a userland that UI stands upon | 14:46 |
| shanxS | so what is difference b/n Linux and Mer | 14:46 |
| shanxS | I mean Mer == Linux + what ? | 14:46 |
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| alterego | Linux is a kernel, Mer uses the Linux kernel. | 14:46 |
| Paimen | shanxS: Linux + Middleware | 14:47 |
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| alterego | Mer == Linux + GNU + More standard middleware | 14:47 |
| Stskeeps | saya_: yes, indeed - and keep updates for, security updates, new technologies.. | 14:47 |
| saya_ | + Integration and QA tools then? | 14:47 |
| alterego | For instance, X11, Qt | 14:47 |
| Stskeeps | saya_: yup, sec | 14:47 |
| alterego | saya_: yes, and those | 14:47 |
| shanxS | what exactly is middleware.. pls enlighten me | 14:47 |
| alterego | shanxS: it's all the boring stuff people don't see behind their UIs | 14:47 |
| Stskeeps | shanxS: if it's OK, can i ask you to look up terms on wikipedia too? (not trying to be mean, but it will let you know more than our 512-character max replies) | 14:48 |
| anidel | lbt; read and write a nice What's exactly Mer is wiki page :P | 14:48 |
| alterego | shanxS: the daemons and system startup scripts and tools, the filesystem management stuff, the graphics APIs, etc, etc. | 14:48 |
| Stskeeps | saya_: http://releases.merproject.org/~carsten/hostbased.png , http://qa-reports.meego.com/1.2/Handset etc | 14:48 |
| alterego | shanxS: it's basically the _largest_ part of any products operating system. | 14:48 |
| shanxS | Stskeeps, ohh that sounds like good ides | 14:48 |
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| Stskeeps | saya_: we want to make it easy to scale from prototype to full product team fast | 14:49 |
| shanxS | alterego: cool... thanks for explaination | 14:49 |
| Stskeeps | and hence we target mostly small to medium enterprises | 14:49 |
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| alterego | shanxS: so we give people this core operating system, and say, make it work on your hardware by including your specific device drivers, and make it do what you want for your customers by creating a compelling UX on top of what we supply. | 14:49 |
| alterego | And they they have their product. | 14:49 |
| saya_ | Stskeeps: Ok thanks :p and i your testing all of that first hand with jolla | 14:49 |
| Stskeeps | saya_: yes, and we have already been doing it with other vendors too | 14:50 |
| Stskeeps | there's no good reason why different mer vendors has to NIH their own systems :) | 14:50 |
| alterego | lbt: got an SDK issue | 14:50 |
| shanxS | alterego, ohh.. I see... | 14:51 |
| lbt | anidel: :) | 14:51 |
| alterego | shanxS: :) | 14:51 |
| lbt | alterego: ? | 14:51 |
| alterego | lbt: http://pastie.org/4226126 | 14:51 |
| alterego | lbt: can't use git | 14:51 |
| lbt | command line ? | 14:51 |
| Stskeeps | mikhas: do maliit have CJK input methods btw? | 14:52 |
| mikhas | I wish … | 14:52 |
| alterego | git clone https://github.com/nemomobile/qmldialer.git | 14:53 |
| mikhas | Stskeeps, not easy to get that stuff for free these days. But there's talk. | 14:53 |
| alterego | lbt: ^ | 14:53 |
| Stskeeps | mikhas: alright | 14:53 |
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| mikhas | And we have the J at least. | 14:53 |
| lbt | alterego: confirmed | 14:53 |
| lbt | fck | 14:53 |
| mikhas | and with some effort, even simple Chinese input method ought to be feasible. | 14:53 |
| lbt | alterego: log bug against SDK please | 14:54 |
| mikhas | (by using http://www.ohloh.net/p/fcitx for instance) | 14:54 |
| lbt | release blocker too | 14:54 |
| alterego | mikhas: I guess the N9s chinese input method is nothing to do with maliit? | 14:54 |
| alterego | The one for drawing glyphs? | 14:54 |
| mikhas | it does use Maliit | 14:54 |
| alterego | Ah, okay. | 14:54 |
| mikhas | even that one does | 14:54 |
| lbt | it needs tying to the SDK ca-cert one if you can | 14:54 |
| alterego | But a closed Nokia plugin of some kind? | 14:54 |
| mikhas | but it's all secret sauce | 14:55 |
| lbt | I just need to make sure to test it | 14:55 |
| mikhas | yep | 14:55 |
| alterego | Yeah | 14:55 |
| * lbt will do SDK when his N900 has ssh + qt5 mer on it | 14:55 | |
| alterego | lbt: do you need me to do anything? | 14:55 |
| mikhas | alterego, but even if you got the UI bits released: they're worthless without engines | 14:55 |
| alterego | mikhas: yeah | 14:55 |
| lbt | so if anyone wants to help me get an IP on my N900... | 14:55 |
| alterego | lbt: default is 192.168.2.15 ;) | 14:55 |
| alterego | Think it's setup in the udev scripts .. | 14:56 |
| lbt | yeah but it needs usb0 on auto | 14:56 |
| lbt | really | 14:56 |
| alterego | Yes | 14:56 |
| lbt | in Mer | 14:56 |
| alterego | I'll check | 14:56 |
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| Paimen | ok, getting some pizza and watching some movie with wife, so see you tomorrow | 14:58 |
| anidel | enjoy | 14:58 |
| alterego | caio | 14:58 |
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| alterego | hmm, missing | 14:58 |
| lbt | o/ Paimen | 14:58 |
| lbt | alterego: I'd have thought connman? | 14:58 |
| alterego | Yeah, maybe now. | 14:58 |
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| alterego | Is nemo using Qt5? | 15:03 |
| alterego | I'm guessing not .. | 15:04 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: i've had qmlscene -platform xcb working on my nemo setup | 15:04 |
| alterego | Ah, m'kay. | 15:04 |
| Stskeeps | with co-installed qt4/5 | 15:04 |
| lbt | Stskeeps: so should I be looking to make connman bring up usb0 on Mer on N900 ? | 15:04 |
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| Stskeeps | lbt: no, that's done by usbmoded on there AFAIK | 15:05 |
| lbt | OK - saves reinventing the wheel | 15:06 |
| Stskeeps | if you need to do auto QA, use ip= trick in kernel command line, or connman config files | 15:06 |
| lbt | connman config sounded sensible | 15:07 |
| lbt | I'll try wifi like that then | 15:07 |
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| alterego | lbt: do you know where the obs package for qml dialer is? | 15:14 |
| alterego | I want to clone it | 15:14 |
| lbt | check with Sage_ | 15:14 |
| alterego | Sage_: ping ^ | 15:15 |
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| * sledges [un]fortunately today discovered how great an Android platform is: http://www.archos.com/products/ah/archos_35_hc/index.html?country=gb&lang=en | 15:18 | |
| leinir | for some value of "great", sure ;) | 15:20 |
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| sledges | having a "loadsaapps" ecosystem is beneficial (contrary to dying OVI...): if development/integeration time is a key to project's success (in most cases it is), Android wins when you want to come up with such an alarm clock, with web radio app, google maps app (tailored to wake you up to your favourite station and see traffic info before you go to work) - as such apps already exist and need only polishing touches! | 15:21 |
| sledges | and I thought it's silly to put Android on STBs/TVs/[insert_a_vertical_market_where_you_would_rather_put_Mer+UX] -- but it's not, as you'll want to play Angry Birds on them (to be more serious - refer to the above scenario I just wrote down..) | 15:23 |
| alterego | Sage_: nevermind found it, "Project:MTF:Tracker" | 15:23 |
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| lbt | sledges: sure ... also s/android/ms windows/ | 15:25 |
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| Stskeeps | sledges: and you didn't get an archos g9, that can run mer? :P | 15:25 |
| lbt | both offer compelling stories based on scale, market share etc | 15:25 |
| sledges | Stskeeps, that's the first reason I went to they homepage :) | 15:25 |
| sledges | lbt, I personally go for Android (ignoring my attitude to MS), just because it is going ahead above everyone else (Google Now >> Apple Siri, Google Maps/Nav+traffic_info >> any-other nav software I know; mail, PIM, integration) | 15:27 |
| lbt | yep, understandable | 15:28 |
| ShadowJK | And also android can now do vpn without rooting | 15:28 |
| sledges | so this is the area Mer & Co. needs to revive: OVI store full with up-to-speed apps again, and it's a big challenge | 15:28 |
| sledges | *reconstruct :) | 15:28 |
| lbt | OTOH there are companies who don't want google to own their product strategy | 15:28 |
| leinir | (like Nokia... ;) ) | 15:29 |
| lbt | Mer has no app store though - makes no sense | 15:29 |
| sledges | yes, and being afraid of law suites | 15:29 |
| vilpan | or people that don't want google to own their data | 15:29 |
| alterego | Who doesn't want Google to own their data?! | 15:29 |
| ShadowJK | Nexus 7 is kinda weird. 199 in US, same plus "ripoff britain" addition in UK, but 600 in rest of europe? heh | 15:29 |
| ukas | o/ | 15:29 |
| lbt | hey ukas | 15:30 |
| sledges | but Jolla gives a great impulse for me to start all-out porting :) or looking at ~ACL (OpenMobile) | 15:30 |
| sledges | hope you fellows feel similarly :) | 15:30 |
| lbt | *nod* ... we spoke to them at SF at tizen conf | 15:30 |
| lbt | they were rather interested | 15:30 |
| ukas | hey lbt | 15:31 |
| sledges | (though ACL [on Mer] might trigger Google's law dept. ..) | 15:31 |
| lbt | SEP :) | 15:31 |
| sledges | :)) | 15:32 |
| alterego | Actually getting a decent speed out of the meego obs, cool. | 15:32 |
| alterego | 1min to download 120Mb | 15:33 |
| Sage_ | alterego: yes Project:MTF:Tracker atm. I'm moving that away from there at some point when I get stuff done. what dialer needs is some deps cut out of it, any change you could reduce some of its deps that are not needed? | 15:33 |
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| alterego | Sage_: I | 15:36 |
| alterego | I'll look in to it | 15:36 |
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| lbt | Sage_: why is usb-moded in CE:UX:MTF ? | 15:36 |
| alterego | I'm sure I can strip it down to nothing if you like ;) | 15:37 |
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| ukas | i just realized after reading about Jolla from a blog, the connection between burning platform and Jolla :D | 15:38 |
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| mikhas | ;-) | 15:38 |
| alterego | Should I be building against repo: CE_MW_MTF_armv7hl | 15:39 |
| alterego | ? | 15:39 |
| alterego | Hurp, only works against CE_UX_MTF_armv7hl | 15:40 |
| alterego | Oh well, /me trundles on | 15:41 |
| Sage_ | lbt: well, it was requirement for the UX and nothing else used it thus never moved anywhere else. | 15:42 |
| lbt | vaguely wondering about moving it to N9xx-common? | 15:42 |
| Sage_ | lbt: Also not sure if anything wants to use it. In nemo the discussion has been to move towards MTP so not sure if usb-moded anymore fits to the picture. | 15:42 |
| Sage_ | There was a bug about this already | 15:43 |
| lbt | currently just thinking to use it for usb0 IP allocation :/ | 15:43 |
| lbt | connman would be better but I'm not sure how | 15:43 |
| lbt | and on n900 with no console ... it's hard to mess about | 15:44 |
| Sage_ | the thing with connman is that it doesn't (or shouldn't based on the maintianers) do anything for kernel usb ethernet gadgets | 15:44 |
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| lbt | ? | 15:45 |
| lbt | *sigh* | 15:45 |
| lbt | why do I as a user care if I plug in a usb network connection or an ethernet one | 15:45 |
| Stskeeps | lbt, gadget, not usb network | 15:46 |
| Stskeeps | there's a differenc | 15:46 |
| Stskeeps | e | 15:46 |
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| lbt | ah - I asked about NW and got reply about gadget ... ? | 15:46 |
| Stskeeps | n900 is gadget | 15:46 |
| Sage_ | the usb networking on N900 is done iwth gadget | 15:46 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: "And McDonalds, And metro" - lol | 15:47 |
| alterego | Oh that's right, it's in modprobe config.; | 15:47 |
| lbt | so connman works on one end of USB wire but not the other ? | 15:47 |
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| alterego | wb Venemo_N9 | 15:48 |
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| Venemo_N9 | hey alterego :) | 15:48 |
| Venemo_N9 | what's up? | 15:48 |
| Stskeeps | Sage_: honestly though, i think usb gadget support improved | 15:48 |
| alterego | Venemo_N9: not a lot, chasing dialer issues at the moment. What are you up to? | 15:49 |
| lbt | so Stskeeps, what's the architecturally correct solution to pursue to get usb0 on the N900 on Mer when plugged into a usb_ether PC host? | 15:49 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: usb gadgets are a bit special.. | 15:49 |
| lbt | yeah, I get that :) | 15:49 |
| Sage_ | Stskeeps: it might have haven't checked, but last time I asked it was like that and I think it was with connman 1.1 actually | 15:49 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: i think connman should handle it better these days. | 15:49 |
| lbt | OK, I'll dig a little | 15:49 |
| alterego | Seems to work with my N900 & N950 | 15:49 |
| Venemo_N9 | alterego, at the moment, on my way home. :P | 15:50 |
| Venemo_N9 | alterego, generally, I'm looking for ways to help out :) Stskeeps already gave me the hints I needed. | 15:51 |
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| Sage_ | lbt, Stskeeps: does mer has %{mer_version} in rpm? | 15:52 |
| Stskeeps | Sage_: check mer prjconf | 15:53 |
| Stskeeps | not an exact one | 15:53 |
| Stskeeps | hello KeyserSoze :) | 15:53 |
| Sage_ | Stskeeps: ? | 15:53 |
| lbt | Sage_: you mean an rpm macro | 15:53 |
| KeyserSoze | Hi Stskeeps, do we know each other? | 15:53 |
| ukas | does mer use rpms or deb or something else? or is packaging tool even part of the mer-core? | 15:54 |
| Sage_ | lbt: yes. like %if 0%{?suse_version} > 1120 | 15:54 |
| Venemo_N9 | ukas, yes, rpm it is. | 15:54 |
| lbt | KeyserSoze: he's pathalogically friendly to newcomers | 15:54 |
| KeyserSoze | :) | 15:54 |
| Stskeeps | KeyserSoze: welcoming everybody, it's important to build community to make people feel welcome | 15:54 |
| Stskeeps | KeyserSoze: so what brings you here to #mer? :) | 15:55 |
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| KeyserSoze | looking to find out if there's any possibility of qobject c++ or python code working in mer, or if it will be html5 and qdeclarative code only. | 15:55 |
| Venemo_N9 | KeyserSoze, both of them work afaik | 15:56 |
| Stskeeps | KeyserSoze: mer does c++ and qt fine, and i use pyside myself | 15:56 |
| KeyserSoze | i really like Qt on the desktop, and was dissappointed to find I couldn't make an all QObject C++ application on my nokia N9. | 15:56 |
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| Stskeeps | well, it's rather QWidget that is a problem on mobile platforms | 15:56 |
| Venemo_N9 | KeyserSoze, you can, but it just doesn't look/feel right | 15:56 |
| KeyserSoze | (well, i made a QtC++ app on my N9, but it looked like a desktop app with no skin to make the qui elements size right, and wouldn't autorotate) | 15:56 |
| Venemo_N9 | indeed. | 15:56 |
| ukas | KeyserSoze: same problem with pyqt | 15:57 |
| KeyserSoze | :( | 15:57 |
| Stskeeps | KeyserSoze: for mobile you need mobile ui's.. and typical widget paradigm doesn't always work right | 15:57 |
| ukas | but you can use qstylesheet to make your own theme | 15:57 |
| Stskeeps | QML, in my own personal opinion isn't bad | 15:57 |
| ukas | thats what we are doing right now | 15:57 |
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| Stskeeps | but anyway, if you want to do mer with desktop ui on top, it's possible | 15:58 |
| KeyserSoze | ukas: you're working on a stylesheet to make QWidget code look/work right on phones? | 15:58 |
| ukas | i wonder if qtc++ is as broken as pyqt, touch gestures have to be implemented, virtual keyboard works sometimes, and rotating aplication is pain in the ass | 15:58 |
| Stskeeps | probably | 15:59 |
| ukas | KeyserSoze: actually my coworker discovered that one and made the basic css file but yeah trying to make pyqt app look better in N9 right now using style sheet | 15:59 |
| ukas | it actually makes a world of difference just specifying some stuff for QWidget and QPushButton alone | 15:59 |
| KeyserSoze | which project would the work required to get QWidget working in a phone-like manner go into, ideally? Would it be in Qt itself, or mer, or this new jolla company, or a totally seperate thing? | 15:59 |
| ukas | totally separate thing | 16:00 |
| KeyserSoze | ukas: cool! do you have a link to more info? | 16:00 |
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| Venemo_N9 | it takes less time to write qml than to make qwidgets look not ugly. | 16:00 |
| Stskeeps | KeyserSoze: i personally think qml and qt components are most phone's preference | 16:00 |
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| Stskeeps | but i don't want to weigh qml, qwidget or gtk or efl against eachother in here | 16:00 |
| Venemo_N9 | generally, you can even share the same C++ backend between your uis | 16:01 |
| ukas | KeyserSoze: unfortunately not on our project, nda and other research hampering legalities :P, but you can find stuff on stylesheets from qt docs | 16:01 |
| KeyserSoze | Stskeeps: do you use qml on the desktop too? | 16:01 |
| KeyserSoze | I've just always liked Qt in C++, and don't understand why a different language is necessary for writing phone apps. i'd be happiest if all languages worked on all platforms. | 16:02 |
| KeyserSoze | (but i don't want to be argumentative, just looking for info) | 16:02 |
| ukas | i'd be happy if all mobile platforms supported c++ and python | 16:02 |
| ukas | but no, everyone wants their own proprietory tools | 16:02 |
| * KeyserSoze dislikes proprietary tools, and platform lock-in, too. | 16:03 | |
| Stskeeps | you can do qml with qt desktop components afaik | 16:03 |
| Stskeeps | though not fas featureful as qwidget | 16:03 |
| ukas | KeyserSoze: what kind of application did you try to make with qtc++ for N9? | 16:03 |
| KeyserSoze | I tried to make a foreign language dictionary and vocabulary quiz application. | 16:03 |
| ukas | ok | 16:04 |
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| ukas | mixing qml and c++/python might make for pretty powerfull tool, depending if you are prototyping or making final product | 16:04 |
| M4rtinK | I'm using QML + Python and like it quite a lot :) | 16:05 |
| M4rtinK | I'Ts also surprisingly multi-platform | 16:06 |
| Venemo_N9 | I use C++ for my app logics and qml for ui. it works fine! | 16:06 |
| lbt | Stskeeps: so discussing this in #connman with holtzmann | 16:06 |
| ukas | :) | 16:06 |
| alterego | Sage_: what deps do you think need to be removed? | 16:08 |
| alterego | I'm guessing meegotouch is one | 16:10 |
| Sage_ | alterego: yes, also not sure how meegobluetooth is used? | 16:11 |
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| alterego | Sage_: hfp stuff, I'll have a look. | 16:11 |
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| alterego | I'm not sure it is at the moment. | 16:11 |
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| Venemo_N9 | does connman support wpa-eap? | 16:12 |
| Sage_ | alterego: I think there is still that MTF legacy UI code there. | 16:12 |
| alterego | neah, got removed aaaages ago | 16:13 |
| alterego | I think the .spec is out of date tbh | 16:13 |
| alterego | Let me just check in this new .spec and see. Seems to build with a load of lame deps removed. | 16:14 |
| Sage_ | alterego: ah, also readme file probably outdated then :) | 16:14 |
| alterego | More than likely ;) | 16:14 |
| alterego | I stopped working on it when Intel screwed me over by employing a load of contractors to work on the QML side of things. | 16:15 |
| alterego | He ended up breaking pretty much everything (the contractor) and then the code got dropper. | 16:15 |
| alterego | ~dropped | 16:15 |
| Stskeeps | its still in tizen ivi | 16:15 |
| alterego | Some of it is. | 16:16 |
| Stskeeps | maybe steal from there | 16:16 |
| Sage_ | /home/abuild/rpmbuild/BUILD/ruby-1.9.3-p194/lib/fileutils.rb:1371:in `initialize': Permission denied - /usr/bin/ruby1.9 (Errno::EACCES) | 16:16 |
| Sage_ | https://build.pub.meego.com/package/rawlog?arch=i586&package=ruby19&project=home%3Asage%3Amer%3Aruby&repository=Mer_next_Core_i486 | 16:16 |
| Sage_ | hmmp | 16:16 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: do you know where the source is? | 16:16 |
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| Stskeeps | alterego: download.tizen.org/live | 16:16 |
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| KeyserSoze | M4rtinK: you said QML+Python is multi-platform... what platforms do you use it on? | 16:19 |
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| Sage_ | hmmp... ruby tries to install binaries to filesystem not to buildroot | 16:21 |
| M4rtinK | KeyserSoze: I normally run my programs on the PC to test it | 16:21 |
| M4rtinK | and currently release for Fremantle and Harmattan | 16:21 |
| M4rtinK | then I'm currently working on a port for Android | 16:22 |
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| alterego | *building* | 16:23 |
| M4rtinK | (I've finally run a PySide + QML program on an androdized HP Touchpad a few days ago) | 16:23 |
| M4rtinK | there is a pretty active PySide port for BB10 | 16:23 |
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| M4rtinK | and it shouldn't be hard to re-add the missing PySide package to Nemo - so it should be easy to use on Jolla in too (in the future) | 16:24 |
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| alterego | Sage_: sent request with updated .yaml & .spec | 16:26 |
| M4rtinK | only things left out: Tizen (has Python though), IOS (too closed), Windows Phone (...) and WebOS (working on it, currently stuck on Qt compilation) | 16:26 |
| alterego | That's removed a few dependencies. | 16:26 |
| M4rtinK | KeyserSoze: that's basically it | 16:26 |
| alterego | meegotouch qttracker meegobluetooth | 16:26 |
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| KeyserSoze | M4rtinK: oh, running the same app on android, that's cool! | 16:28 |
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| KeyserSoze | (I'm not necessarily an android fan, but if android developers start writing Qt apps, then they'd work on non-android phones too) | 16:29 |
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| lbt | Stskeeps: so no usb gadget support other than tethering | 16:31 |
| alterego | Sage_: scrap that, there is still _some_ MTF stuff in there .. | 16:31 |
| Stskeeps | lbt, ie, no 'set up static ip on gadget'? | 16:33 |
| alterego | nyurgh | 16:33 |
| alterego | Time for a rewrite? lol | 16:33 |
| M4rtinK | KeyserSoze: the port is actually by THP, I'm just getting it to work & documenting it - for more info see: http://thp.io/2011/pyside-android/ and my (work-in-progress) howto: http://modrana.org/trac/wiki/android | 16:33 |
| lbt | Stskeeps: correct | 16:33 |
| Stskeeps | lbt | 16:34 |
| lbt | that's "a broken model" | 16:34 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: ok | 16:34 |
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| Sage_ | alterego: well, at least now it compiles against CE:MW:MTF fine so I'm happy :) | 16:34 |
| alterego | Strangely, I'm not sure it should O_o | 16:35 |
| M4rtinK | KeyserSoze: and yes, the basic PySide + QML demo works without modification - haven't run my apps just yet, but I'd guess they should also work fine once I get Qt Components running :) | 16:36 |
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| shmerl | Hi! | 16:40 |
| alterego | -rw-r--r-- 1 tswindell mer 0 Apr 23 16:56 tizen/hfdialer-0.3.4/README | 16:40 |
| alterego | Well, that's informative. | 16:40 |
| Stskeeps | hey shmerl | 16:40 |
| shmerl | I got some error when compiling Firefox for Vivaldi target: 'undefined reference to QTMLocationProvider' | 16:41 |
| shmerl | Is something missing from qt mobility devel? | 16:41 |
| alterego | well, this is interesting .. | 16:41 |
| Sage_ | alterego: :) | 16:41 |
| Stskeeps | shit might not be wired up | 16:42 |
| Stskeeps | shshmerl, that is | 16:42 |
| alterego | Are they allowed to change the licensing on my code?! | 16:42 |
| shmerl | Does it require some additional packages? Or changes in the qt mobility one? | 16:42 |
| alterego | w.t.f | 16:42 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: isn't iot apl2? | 16:43 |
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| alterego | Stskeeps: yes, but it should say Copyright Tom Swindell and not Intel Coorporation | 16:43 |
| alterego | * Copyright 2012 Intel Corporation. | 16:44 |
| alterego | .... Yeah right .. | 16:44 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: ah.. it's always a mess with headers | 16:44 |
| alterego | They've intentionally set those header. | 16:45 |
| Stskeeps | so typical legal review crap | 16:45 |
| alterego | There's still a couple with my name on, but they all should have my name on. | 16:45 |
| Stskeeps | file a bug | 16:45 |
| Stskeeps | against tizen | 16:45 |
| alterego | I dunno, they're probably allowed to because they've done a load of refactoring? | 16:47 |
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| shmerl | So it's something missing in qt mobility? | 16:47 |
| shmerl | And how that can be fixed? | 16:47 |
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| alterego | Still clearly my original design. | 16:48 |
| * alterego sighs | 16:48 | |
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| alterego | I guess it's mine, until they change a few lines. | 16:48 |
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| timoph | I'd file a bug for it | 16:49 |
| shmerl | About qt mobility? | 16:50 |
| alterego | They'll probably resolve with "Ah, thanks we forgot to remove your name from _every_ file..." | 16:50 |
| timoph | shmerl: no. the alterego's thing | 16:50 |
| lbt | https://build.tizen.org/ :) | 16:50 |
| timoph | :) | 16:50 |
| shmerl | Ah, np. | 16:51 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: 'we thought you were a contractor'? | 16:51 |
| alterego | Heh | 16:51 |
| alterego | I don't even know why it's rustled my Jimmys' so badly. | 16:52 |
| lbt | it's rude | 16:52 |
| Stskeeps | dunno, prolly more useful to spend energy at doing a better job | 16:52 |
| alterego | Yeah | 16:52 |
| lbt | file a bug to register the point and leave it at that ... ? | 16:53 |
| alterego | I don't even have an account on the tizen BZ, so not sure I can be arsed. | 16:53 |
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| alterego | It kind of doesn't make much sense to me, why would the actively replace my headers in some files but not others. | 16:54 |
| alterego | It's clearly the same files, but they | 16:54 |
| alterego | have just been heavily edited. | 16:54 |
| alterego | Maybe it's a % change allows them to do that. | 16:54 |
| alterego | I'm sure they'd prefer to have their name on it .. | 16:54 |
| alterego | *rant over* | 16:54 |
| alterego | I'm going to turn this anger into energy to code a better dialer .. | 16:55 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: https://github.com/Merproject/open-build-service/commit/a74b26dea2af14867a7bf298fde1090596b75960 | 16:56 |
| timoph | alterego: that's the way to do it | 16:57 |
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| Stskeeps | phaeron: thanks will test when home from mother in law | 16:57 |
| Stskeeps | hello AstroAk :) | 16:57 |
| AstroAk | Hi Stskeeps! how's everything? | 16:58 |
| Stskeeps | AstroAk: quite good, thanks :) welcome! so what brings you here to #mer? | 16:59 |
| AstroAk | Just caught the story on PC Mag for MeeGO. I've been reading on the OS for sometime hoping it was going to be an alternative to iOS and Android. Glad to see it back in Development. | 17:00 |
| Stskeeps | AstroAk: sure :) if you have any questions on Mer, or would like to know how to contribute, feel free to ask at any time :) else feel free to hang out and learn/watch/etc | 17:01 |
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| * alterego starts working on new nemobile-dialer | 17:03 | |
| Sage_ | alterego: typo by purpose or accident? ;) | 17:03 |
| alterego | purpose :P | 17:04 |
| alterego | I was thining nemobiler :) | 17:04 |
| * Sage_ curses .spec files and not working # marks in lines | 17:04 | |
| AstroAk | what is your opinion on the current phones available. Is there one in particular that I should be looking at? | 17:04 |
| alterego | Sage_: yeah, screwed things up for me | 17:04 |
| alterego | AstroAk: N9 :) It's a collectors item :) | 17:04 |
| ukas | alterego: dialer as in the phone app? :) | 17:05 |
| alterego | ukas: yes, | 17:05 |
| w00t | alterego: new dialer, eh? | 17:05 |
| w00t | you gave up on the old one? :P | 17:05 |
| alterego | w00t: it's what I'm thinking. | 17:05 |
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| alterego | w00t: not entirely, but without Intel calling the shots it just makes sense to gut it properly. | 17:06 |
| w00t | well, yes | 17:06 |
| alterego | So new project, with the good bits ripped out. | 17:06 |
| alterego | Get rid of that stupid projects.pro convention | 17:06 |
| alterego | nemo-phone ? | 17:07 |
| alterego | and nemo-phone-ui? | 17:07 |
| w00t | (shouldn't this be on #nemomobile?) | 17:07 |
| alterego | yeah, probably. | 17:07 |
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| iekku | yes :) | 17:08 |
| alterego | I don't want it nemo specific though, I'll just call it ophono :) | 17:08 |
| AstroAk | @alterego Thanks! I'll look into that | 17:08 |
| Stskeeps | hello astro72 :) | 17:08 |
| astro72 | hi! | 17:08 |
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| Stskeeps | astro72: welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer? | 17:09 |
| shmerl | Is there anything really besides N9 now? Until Jolla will release something, there isn't much to choose from really. | 17:09 |
| Aard | alterego: hrm, when you're doing it from scratch, would you be interested on some jolla input..? ;) | 17:09 |
| alterego | Aard: indeed. | 17:09 |
| astro72 | just trying out nemo for the first time on N900 and can't get it past the boot screen | 17:09 |
| alterego | Aard: I'm going to look through my current dailer implementation/status, and think properly how it should be implemented. | 17:10 |
| alterego | Aard: if you'd like to put me in touch with those that may already be working on this in Jolla? | 17:11 |
| Aard | alterego: I am, that's why I'm asking ;) | 17:11 |
| alterego | Oh, awesome :) | 17:11 |
| AstroAk | N9 is a good looking phone and a Pentaband which is even better. | 17:11 |
| alterego | erm, how would you like to proceed? | 17:11 |
| lbt | holy crap... it actually worked :) | 17:12 |
| alterego | lbt: usb net? | 17:12 |
| lbt | wifi on n900 using connman config file | 17:13 |
| alterego | cool | 17:13 |
| lbt | which means I have a console to hack on usb0/tethering | 17:13 |
| lbt | also means I can lose loads of connman-test scripting to bring up wifi for tests on exopc too | 17:14 |
| * lbt checks he's not logged into exopc by mistake | 17:14 | |
| astro72 | Stskeeps: any ideas what I should do? I have a couple of errors displayed on the screen such as hci_h4p: "FW error" and "Sending firmware failed" | 17:15 |
| Stskeeps | astro72: thats usually ok | 17:15 |
| lbt | mer needs a "make my device do something visible so I know what black box on my desktop I'm connected to" tool | 17:15 |
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| astro72 | Stskeeps: it seems it's also on a boot loop of some kind | 17:16 |
| Stskeeps | astro72: try to rewrite iamage | 17:16 |
| Stskeeps | you use uboot? | 17:16 |
| astro72 | yep | 17:16 |
| astro72 | i will try that rewriting | 17:17 |
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| astro72 | is class 4 card ok for this? | 17:17 |
| Stskeeps | and make sure your computer doesnt automount before writing | 17:17 |
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| astro72 | i'm on winXp | 17:17 |
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| astro72 | Stskeeps: now it gives "bad data CRC" so I guess I'll have to download the whole image again :P | 17:33 |
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| Stskeeps | bad sd? | 17:33 |
| astro72 | don't know, I will try to download the image once again | 17:34 |
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| Sage_ | lbt: https://build.pub.meego.com/project/show?project=home%3Asage%3Amer%3Aruby you shall be happy soon ;) | 17:53 |
| Sage_ | !"%!&! | 17:54 |
| MerBot | Sage_: Error: No closing quotation | 17:54 |
| Sage_ | MerBot: you think? ;) | 17:54 |
| MerBot | Sage_: Error: "you" is not a valid command. | 17:54 |
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| Sage_ | lbt: so what works in opensuse for ruby packaging doesn't work for us because of that patch check in sb or something? | 17:55 |
| Sage_ | https://build.pub.meego.com/package/live_build_log?arch=i586&package=rubygem-nokogiri&project=home%3Asage%3Amer%3Aruby&repository=Mer_next_Core_i486 | 17:55 |
| alterego | lol | 17:56 |
| lbt | alterego: you can help him out :) | 17:59 |
| alterego | Urgh, it needs tcltk? | 18:00 |
| Stskeeps | yes, what the heck is it that uses tcl? | 18:00 |
| alterego | ruby has bindings for tk | 18:01 |
| alterego | Probably need to remove the --with-tk ./configure flag or something | 18:01 |
| timoph | one would think you can leave it out | 18:01 |
| * timoph is slow | 18:01 | |
| alterego | Sage_: remove the build requirement for tk-devel | 18:01 |
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| alterego | and the ruby tk package | 18:02 |
| alterego | bit | 18:02 |
| Sage_ | ok. Well I can do that sure | 18:02 |
| alterego | In fact, if you just comment out the ruby tk package bit it should work fine. | 18:02 |
| lbt | gitk uses it I think - so I'm happy to have it in Tools | 18:03 |
| alterego | Do we need all that valgrind stuff too? | 18:03 |
| lbt | tk is incredibly old+stable so there should be a very low maintenance burden | 18:03 |
| alterego | looks optional anyway. | 18:03 |
| alterego | lbt: sure, but I don't think we need it? It's either comment out or add tk into mer repos ;) | 18:04 |
| lbt | I don't mind - I was looking forward to getting gitk in but I'm not worried | 18:04 |
| vinsci | smaller mem footprint, faster device. W/ tk, the opposite | 18:04 |
| lbt | vinsci: sure | 18:04 |
| alterego | I have nothing against tk | 18:05 |
| alterego | It's an optional requirement and a seperate package as far as Ruby is concerned, it's just that .spec expected it. | 18:05 |
| alterego | We can always build it with that part reenabled at a later date when you've packaged Tk :P | 18:05 |
| * Sage_ drops it for now less stuff to package | 18:06 | |
| Stskeeps | vinsci: we keep some stuff in tools/sdk..stuff not to go into production images, but useful for debugging/performance work/sdk | 18:06 |
| vinsci | Stskeeps, I see. | 18:06 |
| Stskeeps | as our sdk is actually a small mer | 18:07 |
| lbt | it's a UX! | 18:07 |
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| alterego | lol | 18:10 |
| alterego | It's a product :P | 18:11 |
| alterego | It's a self-replicating product! | 18:11 |
| mikhas | did I hear product? ship it! | 18:11 |
| mikhas | alterego, careful, or it might go … | 18:11 |
| alterego | Mer works for Mer! | 18:11 |
| mikhas | viral | 18:11 |
| alterego | mikhas: the paradox is already open, it will last forever :) | 18:11 |
| mikhas | mer, the new paradOS | 18:12 |
| mikhas | man, I did too much marketing lately | 18:12 |
| Stskeeps | i'd say you got quite good at it, too | 18:12 |
| mikhas | thanks (I guess?) | 18:13 |
| Stskeeps | yes, it was a compliment :) | 18:13 |
| mikhas | "$ whois jollatalk.com" reggie being … reggie ;-) | 18:14 |
| Stskeeps | i conjure up an image about a small boat and two finns talking, while downing korsenkorva shots.. | 18:17 |
| timoph | :) | 18:18 |
| lbt | Stskeeps: Jaeger please! | 18:19 |
| astro72 | ahh, can't get past boot screen. I changed the card, re-downloaded the image and now cursor just blinks on the nemo boot screen and sequentially briefly displays terminal with some text "recovery mode" etc. can't really see what else it says... | 18:19 |
| Stskeeps | astro72: sounds like a sour microsd | 18:20 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: with a burning oil rig in the background? | 18:23 |
| alterego | And the Finns are meegons? | 18:23 |
| alterego | That's what I was thinking!! | 18:23 |
| alterego | lol | 18:23 |
| iekku | Stskeeps, it's koskenkorva | 18:24 |
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| astro72 | or Kossu :) | 18:27 |
| iekku | :nod: | 18:27 |
| mikhas | they should be fishing, too | 18:28 |
| saunabad | and not talking | 18:28 |
| * iekku was fishing fri-sat night | 18:28 | |
| mikhas | definitely not talking | 18:28 |
| iekku | no kossu involved | 18:28 |
| iekku | and almost speaked also | 18:28 |
| mikhas | perhaps texting each other … using their brand-new jolla handsets | 18:29 |
| iekku | :D | 18:29 |
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| iekku | place for the jolla texting and drinkin kossu at small boat: http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/389012_10150958825803051_1250426625_n.jpg | 18:31 |
| lbt | :) | 18:32 |
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| iekku | do we have a user story hear? | 18:34 |
| iekku | here | 18:34 |
| iekku | ... | 18:34 |
| lbt | "once upon a time, there was a small, furry meegon...." | 18:35 |
| iekku | :) | 18:37 |
| mikhas | not enough titanic yet | 18:37 |
| lbt | "once upon a time, there was a titanic, furry meegon...." | 18:38 |
| mikhas | leo and kate, just having escaped from the drowning platform | 18:38 |
| iekku | :D | 18:39 |
| mikhas | and then leo proceeds to give kate his jolla smartphone (with all the pictures of their brief but intense relationship), before succumbing to the cold waters | 18:39 |
| mikhas | cant get much better marketing than that, really | 18:39 |
| mikhas | meh, it's too easy | 18:39 |
| lbt | so how's the zaurus doing these days mikhas? | 18:39 |
| saunabad | a feature that would require to solve a puzzle before being able to make a call during weekends would be cool | 18:40 |
| saunabad | that would reduce the drunk calls | 18:40 |
| mikhas | (never ever used a zaurus) | 18:40 |
| mikhas | "Made for Finns (but others, too)" | 18:41 |
| iekku | saunabad, or make the ones coming even angrier | 18:41 |
| mikhas | if the phone detects a drunk user, it should just call the taxi, submitting position via gps | 18:41 |
| mikhas | and of course it also knows where you live | 18:42 |
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| iekku | "oh, joy, i'm at home. yesterday i was 500km from home" | 18:43 |
| saunabad | my htc thinks i'm in taiwan all the time. that kind of bug would become expensive | 18:44 |
| iekku | :D | 18:44 |
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| arcol | pretty nice. Many members in this channel. Just browsed through the irc log, since a few months back (or thats about the time I neglected this channel and nemomobile) | 18:55 |
| Stskeeps | arcol: welcome then :) | 18:55 |
| arcol | I hope the best for you guys. I always had the feeling #nemomobile is just demo qt apps throwed together. And I know why was that, #jollamobile :) | 18:55 |
| iekku | arcol, nemo has longer history | 18:56 |
| arcol | longer then mer? | 18:56 |
| iekku | it used to be nokia's community edition for meego | 18:56 |
| iekku | when it left nokia, name changed to nemo | 18:56 |
| Stskeeps | well, mer is older than meego, but that's another story :) | 18:57 |
| iekku | true :) | 18:57 |
| Stskeeps | arcol: the ux itself is fairly good though | 18:57 |
| mikhas | as long as can iterate and improve, it'll work out | 18:57 |
| mikhas | with Nokia, we got really good at writing platforms from scratch … | 18:58 |
| Stskeeps | which reminds me we should update maliit.. | 18:58 |
| mikhas | *as we can | 18:58 |
| mikhas | no | 18:58 |
| arcol | Stskeeps: you know it lacks the "supervised" part. As with any linux gui. Some programwirters thinks that some others. And you dont have something consequent. Something you can expect along all programs. So I can call it not polished, but thats just me | 18:58 |
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| Stskeeps | arcol: nemo's not polished, agreed | 18:58 |
| mikhas | I wouldn't recommend recent 0.9x series of Maliit | 18:59 |
| mikhas | we keep breaking plugins API etc | 18:59 |
| arcol | you know the silly ithicing bugs, like in n900 when you type a name it does not do a full text search, but a match at the beginning of the names of your contact list. Its a minor caveat, but annoying like hell (when you need to browse through 300+ contacts as everything is thrown together (skype, phone contacts, email contacts) | 18:59 |
| Stskeeps | arcol: i do :) | 19:00 |
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| mikhas | arcol, same on the N9, sadly | 19:00 |
| Stskeeps | arcol: for nemo we haven't had a team working to truly productize it, but the actual technology works fairly well | 19:00 |
| mikhas | I'd be really interested to see the raw performance of QML2, Qt5 on top of Wayland. | 19:01 |
| Stskeeps | i'd love to see maliit in that combo, too | 19:01 |
| mikhas | rendering should be efficient enough to have an effect on battery life | 19:01 |
| arcol | I always save contacts like this FirstnameLastnameSOME_COMMENTS_SO_I_REMEMBER_THE_GUY: AngelinaJolyNEWGF, JoeBakerPIPEGUY | 19:01 |
| mikhas | well, you've been following #wayland, so you probably know our plans ;-) | 19:02 |
| Stskeeps | mikhas: i'm working on qml compositor integration for sgx/n950/n9, so maybe we can test that way.. | 19:02 |
| Stskeeps | on actual hw | 19:02 |
| mikhas | nice, can you benchmark power consumption then? | 19:02 |
| Stskeeps | hmm, good question, not sure how much i can do without tools we used to have in the team | 19:02 |
| Stskeeps | maybe bme has some nice outputs.. | 19:03 |
| mikhas | yeah :-( | 19:03 |
| mikhas | but we could always just ask eero | 19:03 |
| arcol | so full text search is a daysaver. But its only a minor bug (which is actually a dealbreaker for new phone purchase.). So polishing is important, look at iphone, everything behaves about the same. And its polished. Looks like someone tried and used for months | 19:03 |
| Stskeeps | arcol: speaking to the choir | 19:03 |
| Stskeeps | a proper product obviously needs to done right :) | 19:04 |
| mikhas | Stskeeps, with wayland compositor integration, we should be able to reduce roundtrips for virtual keyboard usage, too. on n9, when VKB is up, raw rendering performance drops by as much as 40% | 19:05 |
| mikhas | and that's after we improved it … | 19:06 |
| arcol | also what I think was fundamentally wrong with maemo and meego, is the lack of phones. They should have pushed out bunch of phones, after all nokia was a phone maker. | 19:06 |
| arcol | :) | 19:06 |
| Stskeeps | arcol: yeah. harmattan really held back mattes. | 19:06 |
| Stskeeps | matters | 19:06 |
| mikhas | Apple conquered the mobile world with one model at a time | 19:06 |
| mikhas | focus is also important | 19:06 |
| arcol | I hope jollamobile will do at least release a high end and a middle or low-end phone. So it can spread, and break out of the nich market | 19:07 |
| mikhas | Stskeeps, and regarding CJK: check the wayland ML, our first patches there already got the interest of a Pinyin input method developer ;-) | 19:08 |
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| mikhas | arcol, I see the main advantage in being able to use a modern yet kind-of minimal stack for the OS | 19:08 |
| arcol | mikhas: I know bunch of guys who are simply not that rich to buy that expensive phone. And nokia was really a phone maker, they did hundreds of different model each year from 10USD to 1000USD | 19:09 |
| mikhas | I know what you mean, but most folks that *I* know with an iphone these days haven't paid the full price either | 19:09 |
| arcol | and yet they released the future OS in high-end model only. How it could takeover the symbian models then? I know its now obsolate, as elop killed symbian in a really dumb way, but anyway | 19:10 |
| mikhas | too many models also make it harder to choose the right model for you, the subways dilemma where you starve before having made your choice | 19:10 |
| chouchoune | and, "less rich" people tend to be the ones having an iPhone (for the people I know, at least) | 19:10 |
| mikhas | yeah, it's becoming more and more of a blue collar phone | 19:11 |
| arcol | mikhas: Im marketing only for two or three model most. A full featured geek phone like the n900 was. (hardware keyboard and everything is packed into what was available at that time). An elegant phone what the N9 was. And also an el-cheapo model so people can try out the jollamobile feeling before they go for the highend product | 19:11 |
| chouchoune | arcol: if you have a low end model from the beginning, you break all you high end thing | 19:12 |
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| arcol | chouchoune: why? | 19:12 |
| chouchoune | people will buy the low end device and say it's not usable and so on ... | 19:12 |
| mikhas | nokia in the US was always perceived as el-cheapo | 19:12 |
| mikhas | precisely because you could only got low-end symbian phones | 19:13 |
| arcol | chouchoune: make it usable. Its a lowend phone you cant expent FM transmitter, FM receiver, etc, etc. with it. | 19:13 |
| chouchoune | IMO, if you want to enter the high end market, you should avoid low end at least at the beginning | 19:13 |
| chouchoune | arcol: if it's as usable as you high end device, why would people buy the high end | 19:14 |
| arcol | well, highend three years ago (hardware wise) its a lowend these days. But still can perform awesome. | 19:14 |
| chouchoune | and few people now care about FM things | 19:14 |
| arcol | chouchoune: because its a carbone case? because its elegant? | 19:15 |
| chouchoune | mmmhhh, design ... yes could be | 19:15 |
| chouchoune | but it has to be a big difference between the 2 devices if it's just a differenciation in the design | 19:16 |
| arcol | chouchoune: n900 was really a geek phone. These days I would expect a new n900 phone also packing more stuff (hardware wise) inside. Like NFC, compass, barometer, etc, etc. But you cant sell that modell just to the really geeky people. (I would buy one instantly!) | 19:16 |
| mikhas | I am siding with chouchoune here: when the iphone2 was announced, iphone1 sales spiked (because of the osborne-enforced price drop) | 19:17 |
| chouchoune | yes, I think a geek phone like N950/n900 with keyword and so on and a "sexy" phone like the N9 could be launched togetehr | 19:17 |
| mikhas | => you get your el-cheapo by constantly releasing new high-end models every year | 19:17 |
| arcol | i never liked N9 for that reason (hardware keyboard, microsd). I went into shops and touched it for hours. Besides, I could not get a terminal on it, so it was the other point | 19:17 |
| chouchoune | but in the same price range | 19:17 |
| shmerl | N950 could be a geek phone too, if it'd be publically sold. | 19:17 |
| mikhas | terminal? just a matter of activating developer mode | 19:18 |
| arcol | mikhas: dunno, I also missed a really good browser too. pinch to zoom, etc. | 19:18 |
| arcol | I expected it in .txt viewer and pdf viewer also | 19:18 |
| mikhas | yeah, I liked microb more than grob, too | 19:18 |
| mikhas | well, the document viewers have zoom | 19:19 |
| arcol | I could not zoom into the gpl license agreement or what text was available on the phone in the shop. So I figured it is not polished either as my n900, so no point switching to it | 19:19 |
| arcol | also I like the hardware slide for camera | 19:19 |
| chouchoune | what GPL agreement ? | 19:19 |
| chouchoune | in the preferences ? | 19:20 |
| mikhas | yep, that was a brilliant design decision for the n900 | 19:20 |
| mikhas | jumps directly to the camera app | 19:20 |
| arcol | chouchoune: I hardly remember. I was looking for something to read and try out the pinch to zoom feature. | 19:20 |
| mikhas | and you could install an app that would warn you if you left camera slide open by accident | 19:20 |
| mikhas | actually, circle-to-zoom on the n900 beats pinch-to-zoom every day | 19:21 |
| mikhas | but of course, apple is always right … | 19:21 |
| chouchoune | and the N9 is too beautiful, you're scared to break it ;) | 19:21 |
| arcol | mikhas: really usefull, and works awesomely. When the phone is overwhelmed it still launch the camera app | 19:21 |
| mikhas | see, I would have liked to have the lumia hardware, if only for the extra button on the side that the n9 could have used for the camera … | 19:22 |
| arcol | mikhas: circle to zoom is aweful. it drags the text over until it activates the zoom. Its really a workaround for resistive display. | 19:22 |
| mikhas | it's one-finger friendly | 19:22 |
| mikhas | => one-hand usage | 19:22 |
| mikhas | I wouldnt call it a workaround | 19:22 |
| arcol | mikhas: until it activates (ie. recognise the gesture) it simply drags the display | 19:22 |
| mikhas | but what both browsers were missing was text reflow | 19:22 |
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| arcol | aweful experience, even when you one handed. | 19:23 |
| ngharo | I can't get Mer running in VirtualBox. I've tried building my own image and also the prebuild with llvmpipe. Everytime it boots I just get a black screen, which I assume is X failing to load. | 19:23 |
| mikhas | arcol, you can easily optimize that | 19:23 |
| ngharo | any pointers? | 19:23 |
| arcol | text reflow, yepp I expected that for pinch to zoom. That was the exact reason to search for text. To try out. | 19:23 |
| arcol | pinch to zoom is really intuitive. this circle thing is aweful. | 19:24 |
| chouchoune | I prefer double tap | 19:24 |
| arcol | I used on n900, but awful. I more use the hardware volume buttons instead of this circle thing | 19:24 |
| chouchoune | comparing to both pinch to zoom and circle | 19:24 |
| arcol | but its really two handed (hardware volume button) | 19:25 |
| arcol | chouchoune: yes, but its not continous. Ie. you double-tap for zoom-in mode. not magnification as you like. (ie. a bit bigger, a bit smaller). Its really discreet. | 19:26 |
| arcol | jollamobile times-out the whole day. Why not a simple .html page while slashdotting? | 19:26 |
| mikhas | chouchoune, that's what I use all hte time ;-) | 19:28 |
| shmerl | I was rather trying http://jolla.fi | 19:28 |
| shmerl | Doesn't time out, but nothing there. | 19:28 |
| arcol | shmerl: dont have permissionto access / on server | 19:28 |
| arcol | :) | 19:28 |
| shmerl | Yep. They didn't make any sites so far. | 19:29 |
| arcol | I think they underexpected the peek. Apache is always a bad choice. They should have just put online a static html page preferably with nginx:) | 19:29 |
| Aard | arcol: no, we don't have a page up yet, but expect one soon. | 19:30 |
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| arcol | announcement ahead of time? Or everything else in late:) | 19:31 |
| arcol | timeout does not explained thuogh. | 19:31 |
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| Aard | jolla.fi is not where our site will be ;) | 19:31 |
| Stskeeps | arcol, nah, just different kind of launch :) | 19:32 |
| ukas | jollamobile.com seems to be the domain | 19:32 |
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| arcol | Stskeeps: are you in charge of the webserver?:) | 19:33 |
| arcol | seems like this jollamobile thing is the plan-B of nokia. Just going behind the microsoft agreement | 19:34 |
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| arcol | :) | 19:34 |
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| lbt | ngharo: I don't have a step-by-step for virtualbox yet | 19:34 |
| Aard | arcol: we're not related to nokia, apart from the fact that we used to work for nokia. | 19:35 |
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| arcol | Aard: yeah, just there was not even a week ago, when some news spread across the internet: Nokia has a plan-B in case of windows mobile fails. (which is clever, as windows mobile will fail the 8. version in row... If it does not fail, would be bigger surprise, as it breaks the series of failure) | 19:36 |
| arcol | :) | 19:36 |
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| arcol | and now this jollamobile announcement.:) | 19:37 |
| Aard | yes, we did the same joke before, but as far as I know we're not nokias plan b ;) | 19:37 |
| ngharo | lbt: ok, np. Thanks for the reply | 19:37 |
| timoph | all this jolla speculation needs it's own channel | 19:37 |
| shmerl | Well this one is still up: http://nokiaplanc.com/ | 19:37 |
| arcol | and a tweet like this from jollamobile: "We have been hiring and continue to do that, in co-operation with Nokia. " | 19:37 |
| shmerl | There used to be lot's of those :D | 19:38 |
| Aard | timoph: -> #jollamobile ;) | 19:38 |
| Stskeeps | yep, let's move jolla stuff to #jollamobile | 19:38 |
| Stskeeps | we do core work here :) | 19:38 |
| lbt | ngharo: can you get ssh in ? | 19:38 |
| timoph | yep | 19:38 |
| Stskeeps | ngharo: show me .ks please | 19:38 |
| arcol | Stskeeps: it is just some days, while the hysterial is up. No need a separate channel. | 19:38 |
| Stskeeps | arcol: there's already one :) | 19:38 |
| arcol | you get at least some activity here from outsiders:) | 19:38 |
| ukas | lol | 19:38 |
| shmerl | Aard: Will you collaborate with Plasma Active in any way? | 19:39 |
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| Jake9xx | Sage_: ping | 19:39 |
| Aard | shmerl: we're openly working on mer, and nemo (which contains shared middleware). does that count as collaboration? ;) | 19:39 |
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| ngharo | lbt, Stskeeps: got a conference call. I'll check it out in a bit | 19:40 |
| Stskeeps | ngharo: alright | 19:41 |
| shmerl | Yes, for the handset targets at least for sure. | 19:41 |
| Stskeeps | arcol: is just the way we operate.. common work on core, communities are in their community irc channels :) such as #active, etc, that way we avoid GTK vs Qt discussions, etc :P | 19:41 |
| shmerl | PA mostly works on the tablet form factor now. | 19:41 |
| chouchoune | Stskeeps: don't feed the troll yourself ;) | 19:41 |
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| Stskeeps | chouchoune: let's not resort to calling people trolls :) | 19:42 |
| arcol | Stskeeps: there are not much community yet I think. I was just dropping by, to feed my news hungry | 19:42 |
| Stskeeps | arcol: sure :) | 19:42 |
| shmerl | Aard: If you'd add an open source e-mail client to Nemo, that would be already a good step :) | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | hey donex :) | 19:43 |
| arcol | I will jump onto the wagon, once its usable, every-day I mean. I used openmoko for almost two years as my primary phone, and was a painful experience mostly. So Im a bit calmed down this days. | 19:43 |
| arcol | Have a nice evening guys. Bye | 19:44 |
| Stskeeps | arcol: sounds like a good plan. see you around | 19:44 |
| timoph | there isn't an email client in nemo? I thought it had one. | 19:44 |
| Aard | timoph: nothing usable, though qmf is in place which makes doing an email client not a too difficult task | 19:45 |
| timoph | yep. should be a fun summer project for someone willing to contribute | 19:46 |
| shmerl | A pity Nokia can't open source their Harmattan client. It's not perfect, but quite usable | 19:46 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: not sure if you've tipped over and fallen asleep on the keyboard, will look into it.. | 19:46 |
| Aard | timoph: yep, and obviously we're more then willing to guide anyone who wants to contribute, in any way... | 19:46 |
| timoph | :D | 19:46 |
| Aard | shmerl: if you'd seen the source code for the client you'd say 'thank god they're not opensourcing it' ;) | 19:46 |
| timoph | you're tempting me :) | 19:47 |
| shmerl | Aard: Ah, a WW I tank made of compressed bugs?-) | 19:47 |
| arcol | Aard: you mean the lack of any threading and the painful waiting everywhere? :) | 19:47 |
| Aard | not only that | 19:48 |
| shmerl | (That's xiphmont's term for cinelerra ;) | 19:48 |
| arcol | also forwarding creates its own attachment?:) When you reply you cant automatically attach the original attachments? | 19:48 |
| Stskeeps | threading, pfft, we use coroutines and interrupt-driven e-mail fetching | 19:48 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 19:48 |
| lbt | grumble.... lua scripts in rpm don't like # comment lines ... which does not play well with spectacle | 19:48 |
| M4rtinK | what about trojita ? http://gitorious.org/trojita | 19:48 |
| lbt | Stskeeps: I thought we handled email in the GPU now ? | 19:48 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: nope still alive | 19:48 |
| arcol | they should have learn something from gmail user interface. They manage to avoid lags voer the network, while the mail client on n900 has full of lags everywhere even when its local | 19:48 |
| M4rtinK | IIRC it has a recently added QML GUI | 19:49 |
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| Stskeeps | phaeron: no syntax errors, a good start :) | 19:49 |
| shmerl | trojita looks good, but maintainers weren't interested in Mer so far. | 19:49 |
| shmerl | Also Trojita doesn't support SSL I think. | 19:49 |
| Aard | is trojita using qmf? | 19:49 |
| shmerl | So it's not serious yet. | 19:49 |
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| mikhas | shmerl, timoph: perhaps you guys should talk to vdvsx about email clients | 19:50 |
| Aard | no, not qmf, which imo is a bit silly, since that hands you quite a lot of the tricky bits when doing an email client for free, _and_ you can easily expand your client to support different protocols | 19:51 |
| shmerl | E-mail client is rather involved thing. If you want to support all the features like IMAP IDLE, SSL and so on. | 19:51 |
| lbt | shmerl: most of that should be in middleware | 19:52 |
| mikhas | that's why you should talk to the guy who was team lead for email on the n9 ;-) | 19:52 |
| shmerl | Hopefully. | 19:52 |
| Aard | lbt: most of that is in qmf, which we have ;) | 19:52 |
| mikhas | he also contributed to qmf, I think | 19:52 |
| lbt | Aard: yeah, the non-MVC QML issue | 19:52 |
| mikhas | has anyone of you actually tried geary? | 19:52 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: come on I tested it here :) | 19:52 |
| Aard | mikhas: of course, the harmattan email builds on qmv | 19:52 |
| mikhas | http://blog.yorba.org/laura/2012/05/geary-0-1-released.html | 19:53 |
| arcol | I would like to see an additional jollamobile/mer button on that site: http://www.viber.com/ Actually this will the only dealbreaker thing for my next phone... | 19:53 |
| shmerl | it doesn't look like handset oriented (geary) | 19:53 |
| Stskeeps | mikhas: it can't impossibly be worse than thunderbird.. :P | 19:53 |
| Stskeeps | mikhas: looks interesting | 19:53 |
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| Stskeeps | though i do most of my stuff on gmail or n9 these days | 19:54 |
| mikhas | no, not really, but it feels great on the desktop, even though it's 0.1 and you cant do email attachments even | 19:54 |
| Stskeeps | i vote we go back to Modest | 19:54 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 19:54 |
| mikhas | I was there visiting the yorba guys when they did the release ;-) | 19:54 |
| shmerl | Well, desktop has no lack of good clients ;) | 19:54 |
| chouchoune | mutt | 19:54 |
| shmerl | A pity Mozilla froze TB development though... | 19:54 |
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| vinsci | what's wrong with emacs -f rmail? | 19:55 |
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| arcol | shmerl: yeah, when they managed to actually release maildir support in their earlybird (alpha channel) | 19:55 |
| arcol | I was waiting for it for *8* years. Finally its working | 19:55 |
| ali1234 | if we're being silly, i vote for dalvik layer and gmail app | 19:55 |
| chouchoune | arcol: as they say, it's a final product now : no need for improvements ;) | 19:55 |
| Aard | ali1234: why not windows vm with outlook? | 19:56 |
| ali1234 | (and maps, youtube, g+...) | 19:56 |
| chouchoune | ali1234: what for, GMail web app is enough : you just need 3G all the time | 19:56 |
| arcol | chouchoune: I migrated mailbox for 4 days for maildir. There is no gui, you need to drag-and-drop for importing and exporting. Pain in the ass, especially over network drive... | 19:56 |
| ali1234 | no, the apps are much better, at least the android versions are. the versions they make for other platforms are terrible | 19:57 |
| chouchoune | arcol: yes I know, just making fun of their argument | 19:57 |
| shmerl | If you manage several servers, web application is useless. | 19:57 |
| arcol | chouchoune: and seriously writing message is always in new window, and no new tab? And the bug for it is like 4 years old already? | 19:57 |
| shmerl | You need a normal client essentially. | 19:57 |
| Stskeeps | arcol: out of curiousity, are you a designer? | 19:57 |
| arcol | chouchoune: its not a final product by any standard | 19:57 |
| * alterego contemplates new name for dialer app | 19:58 | |
| lbt | "caller" | 19:58 |
| alterego | Well, voice call suite I guess :) | 19:58 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: bananaphone? | 19:58 |
| Stskeeps | ringring? | 19:58 |
| alterego | lol | 19:58 |
| lbt | "oi" | 19:58 |
| ali1234 | Stskeeps you beat me to it | 19:58 |
| phaeron | "ahoy" | 19:58 |
| alterego | ringo? | 19:58 |
| arcol | Stskeeps: Im not a designer, so I rather stop complaining/bitching/noising. | 19:59 |
| Stskeeps | arcol: nah, i was just curious :) | 19:59 |
| chouchoune | arcol: actually, I like the user interface of Thunderbird (better than other clients at least), but it definitely lacks functionalities | 19:59 |
| alterego | ofono-call-agent ofono-call-ui ? :) | 19:59 |
| shmerl | They never got up to the point of making a mobile UI for it. | 19:59 |
| lbt | I like thunderbird ... I just wish they'd heard of threading | 19:59 |
| shmerl | And now it's just frozen | 19:59 |
| chouchoune | shmerl: they believe the web is the platform | 20:00 |
| Stskeeps | arcol: personally i'm brought up profesionally with participatory design, so little gripes does matter | 20:00 |
| shmerl | No, it's a side reason. | 20:00 |
| chouchoune | si email app would be "web based" | 20:00 |
| shmerl | I think the real one - tight resources. | 20:00 |
| lbt | chouchoune: web-based browser anyone? | 20:00 |
| chouchoune | "Makes sense" in their mind | 20:00 |
| shmerl | They just want to put more forice into the B2G | 20:00 |
| chouchoune | lbt: how is it done in Firefox OS ? | 20:00 |
| mikhas | it's called firefoxOS now | 20:01 |
| shmerl | Yep, aka Firefox OS. | 20:01 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: Magic number checking on storable file failed at ../../lib/Storable.pm (autosplit into ../../lib/auto/Storable/_retrieve.al) line 380, at BSUtil.pm line 531 | 20:01 |
| chouchoune | I belive the "browser" is made with web technologies | 20:01 |
| arcol | Stskeeps: I would love to be a dictator in a phone development, and make it as seemless as iphone was in its time:) But I would need to be a head of a company to have a word, and everyone would follow me in the sinking boat. (which is actually a submarine:) | 20:01 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: and scheduler crashed | 20:01 |
| ali1234 | is it really called firefoxOS now? | 20:01 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: don't think it's your fault though, i've seen that before this patch | 20:01 |
| chouchoune | ali1234: yes | 20:02 |
| ali1234 | wow, ok. it looks pretty good though... | 20:02 |
| ali1234 | "gonk" lol | 20:03 |
| chouchoune | anyone looked at if it would be possible to extract their OS from Android stack ? | 20:03 |
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| chouchoune | As far as I understood, only their "Gonk" layer is tight to Android | 20:03 |
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| ali1234 | it looks like the only android stuff is some kernel patches | 20:04 |
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| phaeron | Stskeeps: hmm didn't see that here | 20:06 |
| ali1234 | perhaps the rild stuff too, though they use a proxy, i'm sure that could be adapted for ofono | 20:07 |
| alterego | arcol: good luck getting signal under the water :P | 20:09 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: did you try again ? | 20:12 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: cold restart.. | 20:14 |
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| lpotter | the QtSensors guys have always been afraid of sensorfw. too much overhead and too complicated | 20:22 |
| Stskeeps | what alternatives do you propose, fwiw? | 20:22 |
| lpotter | something more streamlined for sure. | 20:23 |
| Stskeeps | contributions welcome :) | 20:24 |
| lpotter | thats my one big issue with meego code: its more complicated than it needs to be | 20:24 |
| lpotter | I will freely contribute once I dont have to go trough lawyers to do so :( | 20:25 |
| Stskeeps | that's the vibe i have going from MTF to QML for instance.. that things has really gotten much less complicated than it has been in the past | 20:25 |
| * lbt looks at trying to bring up usb0 with connman and does *NOT* disagree | 20:25 | |
| lpotter | yes, QML is like that. but much of the middleware is | 20:25 |
| lpotter | bloated | 20:26 |
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| Stskeeps | lpotter: :nod: | 20:27 |
| lpotter | it should scale better downwards, IMHO. down as in less specs | 20:27 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: trying to enable buildsl | 20:27 |
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| lpotter | need to get a new battery for my netbook | 20:28 |
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| lbt | package mer-not-a-ux-0.1-1.armv7hl is intended for a different architecture | 20:31 |
| lbt | package mer-not-a-ux-0.1-2.1.armv7hl (which is newer than mer-not-a-ux-0.1-1.armv7hl) is already installed | 20:31 |
| Stskeeps | etc/rpm/platform? | 20:31 |
| lbt | missing | 20:32 |
| lbt | this is a minimal Mer on N900 | 20:32 |
| Stskeeps | ok, well | 20:32 |
| Stskeeps | that's whythen | 20:32 |
| lbt | *nod* ... bug | 20:32 |
| lbt | doing a minimal install is showing a few gaps | 20:33 |
| * lbt rubs eyes | 20:33 | |
| lbt | bbiab | 20:33 |
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| phaeron | Stskeeps: what ? | 20:34 |
| phaeron | what do you mean | 20:34 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: a scheduler crash == cold restart needed | 20:34 |
| Stskeeps | so it had to recheck all projects | 20:35 |
| Stskeeps | it's up again now, so renabling | 20:35 |
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| phaeron | ok. I am not sure what does that have to do with disabled builds :) | 20:36 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: ah.. well, enabling builds after copyprj | 20:36 |
| phaeron | you don't need to disable build or publish in source project if you used the full patch , it does that automatically | 20:37 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: yeah, but it's disabled in the final project | 20:37 |
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| chouchoune | does the bugzilla give qn OpenID for Gerrit ? | 20:37 |
| Stskeeps | ie, the target project, right | 20:37 |
| Stskeeps | chouchoune: no, it's not currently integrated | 20:37 |
| chouchoune | Stskeeps: ok, thanks | 20:37 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: there's a bug where the frontend still says that build and publish are disabled but they are not. just tell it to take default so it fixed the frontend state | 20:38 |
| phaeron | *fixes | 20:38 |
| phaeron | look at the meta and you will see they are not disabled | 20:38 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 20:38 |
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| Stskeeps | phaeron: succeeded: 349 | 20:39 |
| * Stskeeps hugs phaeron | 20:39 | |
| phaeron | \o/ | 20:39 |
| phaeron | \o | 20:39 |
| phaeron | o/ | 20:39 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: try again for good measure :) | 20:39 |
| Stskeeps | i wouldn't be me if i wasn't already doing that | 20:39 |
| phaeron | and then try changing the link | 20:40 |
| phaeron | link target | 20:40 |
| Stskeeps | right now i'm not doing link change, just copying project first | 20:40 |
| Stskeeps | ie, the mer non-link form | 20:40 |
| Stskeeps | with all packages being linkpacs | 20:40 |
| phaeron | okie | 20:40 |
| phaeron | oh linkpacs , didn't know :) | 20:40 |
| phaeron | I just built the whole mer and then copyprjed it 25 times :) | 20:41 |
| Stskeeps | why do you think i want a new solution | 20:41 |
| Stskeeps | a lot of management | 20:41 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 20:41 |
| phaeron | it's a lot faster now too , I wouldn't stand testing it if it wasn't | 20:42 |
| * phaeron hopes it works the second and third time :) | 20:42 | |
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| Stskeeps | phaeron: yeah, this could be awesome for fast CI | 20:43 |
| phaeron | instead of making n=#packages requests from srcserver -> repserver , the repserver asks for list of packages from srcserver and copies them in one go | 20:44 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 20:44 |
| * phaeron eagerly waits for test results | 20:44 | |
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| shmerl | Stskeeps: So getting back to that undefined reference to QTMLocationProvider, do you have any ideas how to fix that? | 20:47 |
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| Stskeeps | shmerl: qt-mobility-devel installed? | 20:48 |
| shmerl | Yep | 20:48 |
| shmerl | Otherwise the configure step fails. | 20:48 |
| Stskeeps | shmerl: it might simply be that it's not enabled in mer.. | 20:48 |
| Stskeeps | file a bug please | 20:48 |
| shmerl | Sure. | 20:48 |
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| chouchoune | is there a "noob program" ? ;) Or bugs for new people willing to contribute ? | 20:52 |
| Stskeeps | chouchoune: sure, topic :) | 20:53 |
| chouchoune | oups, didn't read ;) | 20:53 |
| Stskeeps | 'low' tasks are usually good | 20:53 |
| Stskeeps | as they're mostly cosmetic | 20:53 |
| Stskeeps | but still needed to be done, they get you into package contribution, review, etc easily | 20:54 |
| chouchoune | Stskeeps: yep, don't know how much time will take my first contribution so better do a low task ;) | 20:54 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 20:54 |
| Stskeeps | hopefully not that long, mer contribution is centered around a 'off the street' contribution principle | 20:54 |
| chouchoune | let's see ;) | 20:55 |
| lbt | hmm :) | 20:55 |
| lbt | Stskeeps: using lua based %post | 20:55 |
| Stskeeps | mm | 20:57 |
| Stskeeps | ? | 20:57 |
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| lbt | http://pastie.org/4227905 | 20:57 |
| lbt | avoids spawning bash during rpm -i | 20:57 |
| * CosmoHill will start working on Lightspark one day | 20:57 | |
| Stskeeps | good | 20:57 |
| lbt | if we do this a lot then quickbuild should get a fair bit quicker, as should img build and any upgrades etc | 20:58 |
| CosmoHill | Stskeeps: was that at me? | 20:58 |
| Stskeeps | no | 20:59 |
| lbt | we may want to assemble a lua lib to make common tasks easy | 20:59 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: perhaps make spectacle use lua for some things? | 20:59 |
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| lbt | yeah ... it annoyingly conflicts with spectacle # chars | 20:59 |
| lbt | so a %post -p <lua> has to end on the next % section ... no comments, no #<<< stuff | 21:00 |
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| Stskeeps | phaeron: success on second try too | 21:07 |
| phaeron | very cool | 21:07 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: it does re-check the project 2-3 times though | 21:07 |
| Stskeeps | see log on be | 21:07 |
| Stskeeps | but now i gotta get some sleep | 21:07 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: awesome work | 21:07 |
| Stskeeps | and thank you | 21:07 |
| phaeron | yeah I haven't found the minimal amount of events needed | 21:07 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: glad it's starting to work finally | 21:08 |
| phaeron | now to just clean it up | 21:08 |
| phaeron | I'll need some help from lbt on that | 21:08 |
| Stskeeps | i'm also happy as i can begin prototyping the BOSS side of things as well | 21:09 |
| phaeron | cool | 21:09 |
| lbt | we could do with rolling out a new boss before too long | 21:09 |
| Stskeeps | agreed | 21:10 |
| Stskeeps | that should be done firs | 21:10 |
| Stskeeps | t | 21:10 |
| phaeron | lbt: you mean deploying ? | 21:10 |
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| lbt | well, a review of where we are with it | 21:14 |
| lbt | upstream syn | 21:14 |
| lbt | c | 21:14 |
| lbt | and a deploy to CI | 21:14 |
| lbt | maybe not COBS until X-Fade has time to review things | 21:14 |
| lbt | basically make it a touch more releasable and maintained | 21:15 |
| phaeron | nooooooooo | 21:15 |
| phaeron | :) | 21:15 |
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| lbt | don't worry | 21:15 |
| lbt | tomorrow is fine | 21:15 |
| lbt | you can sleep tonight | 21:15 |
| phaeron | grr | 21:15 |
| * lbt backs away ... "good doggy^H^H^H^Hdeveloper" | 21:16 | |
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| phaeron | can you help with cleaning the patch ? | 21:17 |
| lbt | sure | 21:17 |
| lbt | I just got my mer-not-a-ux kinda working on the N900 | 21:17 |
| lbt | no shader though | 21:17 |
| lbt | w00t: ping | 21:18 |
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| w00t | lbt: pong | 21:18 |
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| lbt | so... screen size | 21:21 |
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| lbt | width: 1400 in main.qml | 21:22 |
| lbt | how do I get the real screen size? | 21:22 |
| lbt | running qmlscene --fullscreen doesn't seem to allocate a width | 21:22 |
| tripzero | ooo, what's a "mer-not-a-ux" ? | 21:24 |
| tripzero | sounds exciting | 21:24 |
| lbt | it's a wallpaper with a shader modified wibbly text | 21:24 |
| tripzero | lol, nice | 21:25 |
| Sage_ | http://pastie.org/4228049 <- so this failure is sb2 thing as opensuse isn't getting the same? | 21:25 |
| * lbt waits for "oh :(" | 21:25 | |
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| * someone_else waits for Sage_ to fall asleep | 21:25 | |
| * Sage_ throws the ruby packaging soon to garbage bin and leaves it there to rot | 21:26 | |
| *** someone_else is now known as lbt | 21:26 | |
| lbt | hey, a true ruby packager! | 21:26 |
| lbt | so this is the "finds buildroot string in binaries" check | 21:27 |
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| * lbt goes to #obs to ask a ruby pkg guru there | 21:30 | |
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| ngharo | lbt: I can SSH into my Mer guest VM. X is running, Xorg.log shows it using VESA driver. I only get a black display. | 21:40 |
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| lbt | ngharo: cool | 21:40 |
| ngharo | Stskeeps: I used nemo-handset-i586-testing-0.20111128.3.CE.2011-12-01.2.ks | 21:40 |
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| vinsci | meh - sdk chroot tar wants to make device inodes on my nodev-mounted /home. #thingsthatslowdowndevelopers | 21:47 |
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| lbt | vinsci: #developersthatliketobedifferent go slower | 21:51 |
| lbt | why is it making dev nodes in /home | 21:51 |
| lbt | it should be in /opt | 21:52 |
| lbt | vinsci: also, suggestions and patches for improvements are welcome | 21:53 |
| vinsci | lbt, obv. since I'm not reading the instructions (will dig them up again, of course) | 21:54 |
| lbt | oh, /srv, not /opt | 21:55 |
| lbt | https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Platform_SDK | 21:55 |
| vinsci | thank you, lb | 21:56 |
| vinsci | thank you, lbt | 21:56 |
| lbt | np ... feedback is good | 21:56 |
| lbt | hmmm PowerVR device not found | 21:58 |
| lbt | Sage_: got a sec | 21:58 |
| lbt | should I get shaders working on N900/Qt5 ? | 21:58 |
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| CosmoHill | cyas | 22:23 |
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