| phaeron | x32 | 00:03 |
|---|---|---|
| smoku | looks good. let's try it :) | 00:08 |
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| merder | Jolla! | 01:07 |
| merder | w00t | 01:07 |
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| smoku | phaeron: thanks for the kick. I'm on latest Mer/GTK/mutter now :-) | 01:16 |
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| Stskeeps | morn | 05:19 |
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| Stskeeps | jjardon: good work :) we are currently working on the CI machinery, but after that's back up and fixed, your submissions will go through build tests | 05:49 |
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| Stskeeps | hello goku12 | 06:29 |
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| Stskeeps | hello Grimmer :) | 06:40 |
| Grimmer | Stskeeps: Hi :) | 06:40 |
| Grimmer | just writing latest nemo release to card in order to test with n900 :) | 06:40 |
| Stskeeps | cool :) | 06:40 |
| Stskeeps | if you have any questions regarding Mer, don't hesitate to ask at any time, else feel free to hang out :) | 06:41 |
| Grimmer | thanks, actually I have :) | 06:41 |
| Grimmer | anybody knows if any mer ports exists for n800? | 06:41 |
| Grimmer | I love my n800 still event tough I use samsung note for mostly | 06:42 |
| Grimmer | but the n800 serves as the best night clock :), but was wondering if any mer ports exists for it | 06:42 |
| Stskeeps | there's a port but up to date kernels aren't getting that much love | 06:46 |
| Stskeeps | so it's a lot of hard work | 06:46 |
| Grimmer | hmm, what would it need? recompiling and some patching? | 06:47 |
| Stskeeps | well, i'm not 100% sure, but it's not just 'install to sd' :) | 06:47 |
| Grimmer | in order to get the latest kernel ported | 06:47 |
| Grimmer | yeah :) | 06:47 |
| Grimmer | i was expecting that | 06:48 |
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| Stskeeps | and battery charging on n800 is a bit of a weird field | 06:49 |
| Stskeeps | hello subzero :) | 06:49 |
| subzero | hello | 06:49 |
| Stskeeps | subzero: welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer ? | 06:50 |
| subzero | Great to be here. I am a former Nokia employee, I worked on Symbian | 06:50 |
| Stskeeps | cool :) well, if you have any questions at any time, or you'd like to know how to contribute, don't hestitate to ask, else feel free to hang out and learn :) | 06:51 |
| subzero | I do not have much of linux professional experience, am looking to gain that thru this project | 06:51 |
| Stskeeps | there's a surprising amount of former symbian people joining in the last 24 hours | 06:51 |
| subzero | Ah.. good to know .. | 06:51 |
| Stskeeps | and yes - it's a good place to learn :) | 06:52 |
| Stskeeps | we're very friendly | 06:52 |
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| Stskeeps | hello ssp :) | 06:52 |
| subzero | Will do my best. Any high level architecture docs avaiable ? | 06:52 |
| ssp | Stskeeps: Hey | 06:53 |
| Stskeeps | subzero: https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Architecture is in progress | 06:53 |
| Stskeeps | ssp: welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer ? | 06:53 |
| iekku | huh, nice to see so much new nicks in here | 06:54 |
| ssp | Stskeeps: Nothing in particular. Curiosity I guess. | 06:54 |
| Stskeeps | ssp, sure :) | 06:55 |
| Stskeeps | ssp: well, if you have any questions at any time, or you'd like to know how to contribute, don't hestitate to ask, else feel free to hang out and learn :) | 06:56 |
| goku12 | Hi Stskeeps! | 06:57 |
| timoph | morning | 06:59 |
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| Stskeeps | welcome goku12 :) so what brings you here to #mer? | 07:04 |
| goku12 | Hi Stskeeps! | 07:05 |
| timoph | oh btw, I'll add a feature or two to tr-ui before making a new release | 07:06 |
| timoph | things like checking that the specified paths for tr-lite, etc. exist | 07:06 |
| goku12 | I am facing an issue with the mer wiki. Does it have a valid SSL certificate? | 07:08 |
| timoph | no | 07:08 |
| timoph | "trust us" | 07:08 |
| goku12 | sure! :D | 07:09 |
| timoph | :) | 07:09 |
| Stskeeps | goku12: we are currently using self signed, as we exchange passwords for our single sign on | 07:09 |
| Stskeeps | we are working on getting proper certs | 07:09 |
| goku12 | sure! Just wanted to check before adding an exception | 07:10 |
| timoph | hmmh. I am really tempted to do a complete rewrite of the ui code in tr-ui | 07:10 |
| timoph | it's currently using forms and that makes it a bit difficult to add new things to it | 07:11 |
| timoph | and I like to be in complete control of the code :p | 07:12 |
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| Stskeeps | timoph: i'd like an option to grab report layout in results preview without css available.. ie offline | 07:17 |
| Stskeeps | if possible | 07:17 |
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| timoph | Stskeeps: should be doable | 07:20 |
| timoph | Stskeeps: can you file a task bug? | 07:20 |
| timoph | so I actually remember that :) | 07:20 |
| timoph | actually fea req | 07:21 |
| Stskeeps | timoph: 419 | 07:24 |
| timoph | thanks | 07:24 |
| Stskeeps | the nigerian scam bug | 07:24 |
| timoph | x) | 07:24 |
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| Stskeeps | hello sivu :) | 07:31 |
| kyyberi | morning | 07:32 |
| Stskeeps | morn kyyberi | 07:32 |
| kyyberi | have been refreshing my ruby skills | 07:32 |
| sivu | hi stskeeps | 07:32 |
| timoph | kyyberi: pervert | 07:33 |
| Stskeeps | sivu, welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer? | 07:33 |
| kyyberi | timoph :) | 07:33 |
| timoph | :p | 07:33 |
| kyyberi | timoph: I really must be pervert, since I again fell in love with the simplicity of ruby | 07:35 |
| kyyberi | in usage at least, not version management ;) | 07:35 |
| sivu | stskeeps, just lurking how jolla gets going :) | 07:35 |
| timoph | kyyberi: yep :) | 07:36 |
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| Stskeeps | sivu, sure :) jolla is a vendor in mer 'ecosystem', we work on a core here, so if you have any questions at any time, don't hesistate to ask, or would like to know how to contribute, else feel free to hang out and learn more :) | 07:37 |
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| Stskeeps | hey ngharo :) | 07:38 |
| ngharo | hello | 07:39 |
| sivu | stskeeps, great. i did work on a meego port for a certain mobile manufacturer, which obviously got scrapped after the announcement. | 07:39 |
| Stskeeps | ngharo: welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer? | 07:39 |
| Stskeeps | sivu: cool, yeah, the news hurt a lot of people | 07:39 |
| Stskeeps | sivu: i was in meego arm myself | 07:40 |
| sivu | stskeeps, yes, i remember. we chatted few times about some specifics | 07:40 |
| ngharo | I'm a big HTML5 fanatic and was using Meego on my laptop quite a while ago | 07:40 |
| ngharo | just generally interested in the new project that's going on here | 07:40 |
| sivu | stskeeps, currently i find the raspberry pi version interesting, as farnell was kind enough to get me one :) | 07:43 |
| Stskeeps | thought it was time to make a solid mobile core that can't as easily be swayed by silly corporate choices.. or simply just showing how it -should_ be done.. | 07:43 |
| Stskeeps | sivu, yeah, mer is for rpi too. i thought i recalled your nick from somewhere :) | 07:44 |
| Jope | arabuusimiehet world domination | 07:44 |
| denism | hi, part of the topic "To see what you can help with, http://bit.ly/ymlJ0c & find "Available tasks'" - but there is no such records, last found 'available tasks' is ~January 2012 | 07:45 |
| Stskeeps | denism, yes, it's broken. my fault -- go to bugzilla, search for severity 'task' | 07:48 |
| Stskeeps | it's included in bug triage mails these days | 07:49 |
| sivu | stskeep, and i got one jolla guy drunk on friday :) | 07:49 |
| Stskeeps | sivu, ah, the finnish form of industry spionage | 07:52 |
| Stskeeps | ngharo: sure :) if you have any questions at any time, don't hesitate to ask, or if you'd like to know how to contribute, else feel free to hang out and learn more :) | 07:53 |
| ngharo | Stskeeps: cool, will do. Thanks. I'm gonna build an image and start there perhaps tomorrow. For now I'm off to bed! | 07:55 |
| ngharo | thanks for the warm welcome! | 07:55 |
| Stskeeps | sleep well :) | 07:57 |
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| lbt | *sigh* .. so power out *again* last night until 1:45am ..... why? It rained. No thunderstorms, No snow, ice... just a bit of rain. | 08:02 |
| Stskeeps | sounds like you have exposed xcables | 08:03 |
| lbt | something - it's a real PITA | 08:05 |
| lbt | anyhow, removed some redundant hardware during the reboots | 08:06 |
| lbt | and played dominos by candlelight .... which was fun | 08:06 |
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| Stskeeps | hello daevis :) | 08:07 |
| daevis | hello | 08:07 |
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| Stskeeps | daevis: welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer? | 08:10 |
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| Stskeeps | taziff, where from in .pl, byt the way? | 08:12 |
| Stskeeps | by, that is | 08:12 |
| lbt | looking at twitter and wondering if anyone went to sleep ? | 08:20 |
| phaeron | well there was the other side of the globe | 08:22 |
| lbt | *g* | 08:23 |
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| taziff | Stskeeps: of what city I come from? | 08:34 |
| dm8tbr | that's what he asked, yes | 08:37 |
| Stskeeps | taziff: yeah, or live - i'm in warsaw myself | 08:37 |
| taziff | i'm from bialystok | 08:38 |
| Stskeeps | ah alright :) | 08:39 |
| taziff | five days ago I was in warsaw on BB10 Jam :) | 08:39 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, i was considering to go, but work kept me busy | 08:39 |
| taziff | :) | 08:40 |
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| taziff | ohh Stskeeps you are Carsten :) I would be on the N9 party in Wroclaw, but I could not be | 08:48 |
| Stskeeps | taziff: yup | 08:49 |
| sivu | lbt, ping | 08:53 |
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| Stskeeps | 'lo Kypeli, good to see you here too :) | 08:59 |
| Stskeeps | and hey vinsci | 08:59 |
| vinsci | hi Stskeeps | 09:00 |
| Kypeli | Stskeeps: Thanks for having me :) I started my summer vacation and need some project to work on. So why not Mer :) | 09:00 |
| Stskeeps | vinsci: welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer? | 09:00 |
| Stskeeps | Kypeli: sure :) if you have any questions on mer or how to get started, feel free to ask any time | 09:00 |
| Kypeli | Thanks! | 09:01 |
| vinsci | Stskeeps, jolla. Being an N900 user since a couple of years and a dev, looking for the next thing to work on. | 09:02 |
| Stskeeps | grab http://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Platform_SDK as a start (yes, certificate is self signed) | 09:02 |
| Stskeeps | vinsci: cool, if you have any questions or wondering how to get started, feel free to ask at any time, else feel free to hang around and learn | 09:02 |
| sivu | stskeeps, can you give obs access | 09:03 |
| lbt | sivu: pong (coffee) | 09:03 |
| sivu | ah there you are | 09:03 |
| lbt | no... that power is all mine bwahahahaa | 09:03 |
| Kypeli | Stskeeps: Cool, thanks! I'll install the SDK, browse on the wiki and create some accounts to get started. | 09:03 |
| sivu | lbt, *petting white fat cat* | 09:04 |
| vinsci | thanks, Stskeeps | 09:04 |
| lbt | sivu: *g* | 09:05 |
| lbt | also, I need your meego.com account (goes for anyone who needs c.obs access) | 09:06 |
| sivu | lbt, check your privmsg | 09:06 |
| Stskeeps | Kypeli: bugs.* account will work on wiki as well, if you see anything that is missing, broken or WTF-ish, file a bug -- we admit to our problems and best way to fix is a bug report :) | 09:07 |
| lbt | sivu, yeah, account, not email (and in here is fine for public info :) ) | 09:07 |
| Kypeli | Stskeeps: That's a good spirit :) | 09:07 |
| Kypeli | Stskeeps: Btw. what's the best way to get into the project and finding something to do? Look in the Bugzilla or join some meeting first on IRC? | 09:08 |
| sivu | lbt, account is sivu | 09:08 |
| lbt | heh .. thought so ... just logging in | 09:08 |
| Stskeeps | Kypeli: wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list and follow bug triage meetings or their emails | 09:09 |
| Stskeeps | might be 'lists' | 09:09 |
| Kypeli | Ok | 09:09 |
| Stskeeps | bugzilla has a lot of severity=task and not-taken@merproject.org assignees | 09:09 |
| Stskeeps | which is work up for grabs | 09:10 |
| Kypeli | Good to know | 09:10 |
| lbt | sivu: done | 09:10 |
| lbt | have fun | 09:10 |
| lbt | on bugs ... please assign to yourself when you actively start working on them | 09:10 |
| lbt | not when you think "I can do that" :) | 09:10 |
| * lbt looks for jjardon just to check | 09:11 | |
| sivu | lbt, thanks | 09:15 |
| lbt | np | 09:15 |
| Kypeli | mer | 09:16 |
| Kypeli | ugh | 09:16 |
| lbt | if it was a password, no one noticed :) | 09:17 |
| Kypeli | :) | 09:17 |
| Kypeli | Just the delicious tag typed in the wrong focus ;) | 09:18 |
| lbt | Stskeeps: bergie suggested https://github.com/mojombo/jekyll/ | 09:19 |
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| lbt | powers http://pages.github.com/ apparently | 09:20 |
| lbt | produces static pages so low resource | 09:20 |
| lbt | and probably great CSS design | 09:20 |
| lbt | also static means easily mirrored to .cn etc | 09:21 |
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| * kyyberi off to beach with kinds, bbl | 09:42 | |
| kyyberi | *kids | 09:43 |
| CosmoHill | cyas .o/ | 09:43 |
| CosmoHill | kyyberi: in the UK we don't have to go to the beach for a swim :p | 09:43 |
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| kyyberi | CosmoHill :) | 09:48 |
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| phaeron | Stskeeps: python failed 2 tests | 10:00 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: how does it build in core ? | 10:00 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: what tests? | 10:04 |
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| Stskeeps | hello Ivan__ :) | 10:08 |
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| phaeron | Stskeeps: http://pastie.org/4219644 | 10:09 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: chroot or kvm and what fs | 10:11 |
| phaeron | want the whole log ? | 10:11 |
| phaeron | chroot | 10:11 |
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| Stskeeps | yes, but will first be able to look later, i'm on mobile | 10:12 |
| phaeron | ext4 | 10:12 |
| phaeron | ok | 10:12 |
| phaeron | np was just reporting | 10:12 |
| Stskeeps | ext4 should work | 10:12 |
| phaeron | I can see most are network access related , there is no network access allowed in workers , right ? | 10:12 |
| Stskeeps | right | 10:13 |
| lbt | so how does it build in core? | 10:15 |
| Stskeeps | perhaps he has net access in chroot | 10:17 |
| phaeron | so the problem is it _has_ network access ? :) | 10:18 |
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| Stskeeps | maybe | 10:21 |
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| thauta_ | so whats the relation of jolla and mer? :) | 10:31 |
| tanuk | thauta_: Jolla uses Mer in their products and also contributes to Mer development. | 10:35 |
| thauta_ | nice | 10:40 |
| thauta_ | tanuk: so their ux is not based on nemo but something else? | 10:40 |
| tanuk | thauta_: Yes, to my understanding they're writing their own UI. | 10:40 |
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| Stskeeps | moo moo-_- | 10:52 |
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| phaeron | vgrade: o/ | 11:09 |
| vinsci | This is as close to a public chat for Jolla one can get for the time being, right? | 11:12 |
| Stskeeps | well, #jollamobile exists too | 11:12 |
| Stskeeps | we keep .. ish .. to mer talk here | 11:12 |
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| vinsci | Stskeeps, thanks. Glad I asked that. :-) | 11:12 |
| vinsci | inofficial as #jollamobile is, though | 11:13 |
| Stskeeps | it's probably better to have a place community can grow | 11:13 |
| * vinsci nods | 11:14 | |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: hey, I sent some patches to gerrit. Could you take a quick look to check that I'm doing the things correctly? | 11:15 |
| Aard | vinsci: #jollamobile is inofficial in a way that you won't read things not mentioned in the press releases already from jolla employees, but still probably the best way in irc to get your comments to us | 11:15 |
| * vmlemon_ wonders how easy it would be to run Harmattan, or even WebOS applications on their offering... | 11:15 | |
| jjardon | lbt: hi | 11:15 |
| vinsci | Aard, preparing CV... ;-) | 11:15 |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: looks great so far | 11:15 |
| Stskeeps | vmlemon_: well, i can't speak for jolla, but qt and qml are center pieces | 11:16 |
| Stskeeps | enyo can run on phonegap now can't it? | 11:16 |
| vmlemon_ | I think so. I know that they're trying to release the source code for some of its components (or a "reinvented version" of them), too. | 11:17 |
| vmlemon_ | I don't know much about PhoneGap to be honest, though. | 11:17 |
| Stskeeps | think its pretty oss now | 11:17 |
| lbt | jjardon: hey | 11:18 |
| lbt | jjardon: looking fine ... just noticed the bug takes and wanted to check :D | 11:18 |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: Build tests will run later, we are working on the machine room so | 11:18 |
| jjardon | lbt: I wonder if I can access to cobs, so I can test the patches correctly ;) | 11:19 |
| lbt | of course | 11:19 |
| lbt | you need a meego.com account ... then you tell me what it is | 11:19 |
| jjardon | I knew mer for long time, but the jolla announcement makes me want to contribute a little bit ;) | 11:20 |
| jjardon | lbt: jjardon is the account | 11:20 |
| lbt | jjardon: done... have fun | 11:21 |
| jjardon | lbt: thanks! | 11:21 |
| lbt | that makes sense .... Mer needed to get established enough to justify people investing time in it | 11:22 |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: why gst-plugins-bad-free instead upstream why gst-plugins-bad? AFAIK the problematic plugins are in -ugly | 11:22 |
| jjardon | (remove the second why) | 11:22 |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: two possible reasons.. one, fedora does that, or two: problems with patents/royalties | 11:23 |
| Stskeeps | nothing stops a vendor from patching for use but we cant | 11:23 |
| Stskeeps | running out of battery | 11:25 |
| Stskeeps | gtg | 11:25 |
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| phaeron | lbt: we never planned an upgrade to cobs :( | 11:28 |
| lbt | phaeron: no we didn't | 11:31 |
| lbt | why? | 11:31 |
| lbt | it's very much in the short-term queue | 11:31 |
| lbt | right now ... "make my wife's PC boot" is top of the list though :D | 11:32 |
| phaeron | ok :) | 11:34 |
| phaeron | lbt: I get annoyed every time I want to search for a package and get the error page | 11:34 |
| lbt | me too ... but the workaround is easy enough | 11:35 |
| phaeron | still, getting annoyed 10 times a day is very annoying :) | 11:37 |
| lbt | bookmark | 11:38 |
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| phaeron | lbt: not like you to promote workarounds | 11:41 |
| lbt | I know :/ | 11:41 |
| lbt | need to prioritise though | 11:42 |
| lbt | and I need to spend all the rest of today on the protyping docs I shoulda done yesterday but for jolla and powercuts :( | 11:42 |
| lbt | and I've still got to fix Denise's machine | 11:42 |
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| phaeron | yeah I was just poking ;) | 11:43 |
| phaeron | have fun | 11:43 |
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| vmlemon_ | Sounds like Jolla good fun. | 11:52 |
| * vmlemon_ hides | 11:53 | |
| iekku | vmlemon_, hmm? | 11:53 |
| vmlemon_ | (Was just a crappy pun that I thought of). :) | 11:54 |
| phaeron | you mean jolly good fun | 11:54 |
| vmlemon_ | Yeah ;) | 11:54 |
| phaeron | :) | 11:55 |
| alterego | Guess I've not missed much this morning? | 11:55 |
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| alterego | I think a true differentiator for Jolla could be HDMI and USB OTG, the first phine that could double as a desktop... :) | 12:03 |
| alterego | I | 12:05 |
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| alterego | Imagine if we had a European handset creator that could adopt new technologies like the chinese :) | 12:06 |
| alterego | That would be cooool | 12:06 |
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| * vmlemon_ wished that we had NFC/FeliCa support, 1-Seg/ISDB/DVB support, and other fun things like that... | 12:09 | |
| alterego | Not bothered with DVB, just stream video over the network. | 12:10 |
| alterego | Though with OTG you could plug in a DVB dongle | 12:10 |
| vmlemon_ | True | 12:11 |
| vmlemon_ | Bonus points if Bluetooth 3.0, 802.11n, and even UWB/Wireless USB could be implemented. | 12:11 |
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| alterego | Bluetooth 3, would be an acceptable request, wireless USB is probably not :p | 12:12 |
| * vmlemon_ thinks that a "Polaroid Phone" with a built-in printer would be amusing... | 12:12 | |
| vmlemon_ | (If not totally pointless) | 12:13 |
| alterego | lol | 12:13 |
| alterego | With the amount of photo printers availablr in shops now-a-days, it's pointless ;) | 12:14 |
| vmlemon_ | It might be vaguely useful/novel for things like business cards, though. | 12:14 |
| alterego | Have NFC for that | 12:15 |
| * vmlemon_ wished that more Western market phones had support for Japanese text rendering/input. | 12:15 | |
| vmlemon_ | True | 12:15 |
| vmlemon_ | (I've only ever seen an NEC one with rendering functionality; although I've seen lots of Nokias that can render Arabic and Russian, of all things). | 12:15 |
| alterego | I really hope Jolla are as open as they can be. | 12:16 |
| alterego | Hardware wise | 12:16 |
| alterego | and not just software | 12:16 |
| vmlemon_ | I have a feeling that they'll be like the First Else, or one of those other proprietary, vapourware "boutique" phones. | 12:16 |
| vmlemon_ | *"boutique" Linux phones | 12:16 |
| vmlemon_ | I remain hopeful otherwise, though. | 12:17 |
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| M4rtinK | are there already PySide packages for MER ? :) | 12:39 |
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| M4rtinK | also, where to check which packages are available ? in COBS or also somewhere else ? | 12:45 |
| Stskeeps | macmaN: i think we had them for Nemo but not sure of their state on 4.8.1 | 12:47 |
| Stskeeps | ie, qt | 12:47 |
| Stskeeps | hello celeron55, khj, tdrinaetudir and dsa :) so what brings you all here? | 12:48 |
| Stskeeps | M4rtinK: above message to macman was to you | 12:48 |
| M4rtinK | Stskeeps: ok, thanks :) | 12:48 |
| M4rtinK | well, as long you have Python & standard Qt setup it shouldn't be difficult to rebuild/repackage if it got lost somewhere :) | 12:50 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, just effort needed | 12:50 |
| Stskeeps | i'm a pyside fan myself | 12:50 |
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| M4rtinK | me to, obviously :) | 12:52 |
| M4rtinK | I still also maintain the old GTK GUI for modRana though :) | 12:53 |
| alterego | M4rtinK: do you use pythin with qml? | 12:54 |
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| Forty-Two | how close is this to having a stable version? | 12:55 |
| M4rtinK | alterego: yep :) | 12:55 |
| alterego | Forty-Two: mer release are pretty damn stable, I think you're confused in what you're asking | 12:57 |
| Forty-Two | ok | 12:57 |
| celeron55 | hi; just joined here to see if there is anything interesting going on 8) | 12:58 |
| Forty-Two | if I were to launch a phone today with this, would it crash and burn? | 12:58 |
| celeron55 | because of news | 12:58 |
| Stskeeps | Forty-Two: we are a core and we try to release stable each tieme | 12:58 |
| Forty-Two | ah | 12:58 |
| dm8tbr | Forty-Two: the core would work fine, hardware adaptation and UI are for you to bring or source otherwise | 12:59 |
| Forty-Two | ok | 12:59 |
| alterego | mer isn't a full handset, tablet, whatever operation system. It's an adaptable core for people to use in all these kinds of devices. | 13:00 |
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| Termana | Stskeeps, is it just me or are you occasionally (probably accidentally) putting symbols in the middle of words? | 13:00 |
| alterego | Can't say I've noticed it Termana :p | 13:00 |
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| Stskeeps | Termana: ssh on gprs | 13:04 |
| alterego | Using a mobile? | 13:04 |
| Stskeeps | celeron55: cool, feel free to ask any questions you may have at any time, else feel free to hang out | 13:04 |
| Stskeeps | Forty-Two: we try our best to validate our core though, though as with any software, we can do better | 13:05 |
| Forty-Two | ok | 13:06 |
| Stskeeps | next up, how'd you like to help? :) | 13:06 |
| M4rtinK | so I gather this is the main Nemo OBS project, that is used to build the Nemo images ? https://build.pub.meego.com/project/show?project=CE | 13:07 |
| rzr | Stskeeps, in case of . setup something for https://twitter.com/rzrfreefr/status/221952868821897216 | 13:07 |
| Stskeeps | M4rtinK: yes, and subproject | 13:07 |
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| Venemo_N9 | hey | 13:11 |
| Stskeeps | hey Venemo_N9 | 13:12 |
| Venemo_N9 | moo Stskeeps :) | 13:12 |
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| Venemo_N9 | what's up? | 13:14 |
| M4rtinK | interesting, looks like libshiboken is already included for some reason in CE:shiboken | 13:14 |
| Stskeeps | hello asabil :) | 13:14 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo_N9: the usual, good mer day | 13:15 |
| Venemo_N9 | that's nice :) | 13:15 |
| Venemo_N9 | I know I've asked this before, but. do you guys plan on adding some sort of qt creator support? | 13:16 |
| M4rtinK | ant there are quite a few (buildable) PySide packages in custom branches, including Stskeeps :) | 13:16 |
| rcg1 | Venemo_N9: ordered the archos 101 g9 turbo. will let you know how it works out. | 13:16 |
| asabil | Hi Stskeeps | 13:16 |
| rcg1 | however, i am on a conference in south africa this week so i won't have time to play around with it till next sunday | 13:16 |
| Stskeeps | asabil: welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer? | 13:17 |
| Venemo_N9 | I know I can run qt creator inside the platform sdk, but I'd like to run it on my regular os and make the apps run on a device. is this possible? | 13:18 |
| Venemo_N9 | rcg1, thank you, next sunday will be excellent for me :) | 13:18 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo_N9: we are slowly getting there | 13:18 |
| Venemo_N9 | Stskeeps, how can I help in this area? | 13:19 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo_N9: find out how reliably to use diff sysroots in qt creator | 13:20 |
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| Venemo_N9 | well, i'm not even sure qt creator supports scratchbox at all. | 13:21 |
| Venemo_N9 | I assume it doesn't | 13:21 |
| Stskeeps | not scratchbox | 13:21 |
| Stskeeps | sysroots | 13:22 |
| Venemo_N9 | but we could make a madde sysroot for mer | 13:22 |
| Venemo_N9 | is that what you're referring to? | 13:22 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo_N9: generally that qt creator can use different sysroots and toolchains | 13:24 |
| Stskeeps | madde is a step up from that | 13:25 |
| Venemo_N9 | right. | 13:25 |
| Venemo_N9 | all right, I'll find out what I can :) | 13:25 |
| Venemo_N9 | oh, and a question: can I edit the mer wiki? | 13:27 |
| Venemo_N9 | I'd like to add some info to the page that tells how to flash mer to the N9(50) | 13:28 |
| phaeron | you can edit it , that's why it's a wiki :) | 13:30 |
| Venemo_N9 | ok! | 13:30 |
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| Venemo_N9 | thx :) | 13:30 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: do mer patterns need yum as pkgmgr during image creation ? | 13:31 |
| tdrinaetudir | How stable is Mer (Nemo) on N900? And does Mer use or replace those proprietary drivers? | 13:36 |
| alterego | It has more up-to-date versions of the proprietary drivers. | 13:38 |
| Stskeeps | tdrinaetudir: nemo uses some but not many closed blobs, and they're all redistributable | 13:41 |
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| *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Stskeeps | 13:45 | |
| *** Stskeeps changes topic to "The Mer Project - http://www.merproject.org | http://wiki.merproject.org/ | Contribution to packages: http://bit.ly/tJUL43 | Building against Mer in COBS: http://bit.ly/v4riNg | This channel is logged, http://mer.bfst.de/logs | To see what you can help with, http://bit.ly/L9v3nR | Meetings: http://bit.ly/yP9Jg6 | IRC guidelines: http://bit.ly/xK6IRv" | 13:46 | |
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| Eelis | today's jolla press release: good news or bad news? :) ( http://www.esphoneblog.com/2012/07/08/jolla-details-their-mission-with-first-official-press-release/ ) | 13:54 |
| Stskeeps | i'd.. say good? | 13:54 |
| Stskeeps | Jolla has been and is contributing to mer | 13:55 |
| Eelis | when you buy a hypothetical future jolla phone, though, will it basically be Mer with some proprietary UI slapped onto it? | 13:55 |
| Stskeeps | Eelis: the twitter says that it's Mer with a Jolla-made UI on top | 13:56 |
| Stskeeps | Eelis: which is fine - contributions come to mer core and is shared amongst all vendors using Mer | 13:56 |
| Eelis | right, but will that UI be open? | 13:56 |
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| Venemo_N9 | who knows? | 13:57 |
| Stskeeps | that you will have to ask the jolla guys about, but for now, be patient and see where things lead | 13:57 |
| Eelis | ok, thanks :) | 13:57 |
| Stskeeps | Mer is just a core :) | 13:57 |
| Eelis | fair enough | 13:57 |
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| Venemo_N9 | "just"? | 13:57 |
| Venemo_N9 | don't be so modest. | 13:57 |
| Eelis | also, another question: with both Tizen and Jolla going with Mer, is anybody still working on non-Mer MeeGo? | 13:59 |
| alterego | Tizen isn't going mer | 13:59 |
| Stskeeps | Eelis: i think you misunderstood Tizen - Tizen has it's own game, their handset originate from Samsung Linux Platform, and IVI from meego 1.2 | 13:59 |
| Eelis | oh, i read this blurb on merproject.org: "The Core is based upon the work from the MeeGo project and plans to share effort with the Tizen project." | 14:00 |
| Stskeeps | tizen ivi we have a bit in common with | 14:00 |
| Aard | non-mer meego has been in maintenance since about one year | 14:00 |
| Stskeeps | Eelis: yeah, that's from our original mission statement | 14:00 |
| Stskeeps | Eelis: back when tizen was supposed to release source within a week or two | 14:00 |
| Stskeeps | and instead took 4-5 months.. | 14:00 |
| Eelis | ah | 14:00 |
| Eelis | interesting | 14:00 |
| Eelis | that's disappointing :( | 14:00 |
| vmlemon_ | Are the Linux DeadPool(TM), erm Linux Foundation planning on shutting down the MeeGo sites, eventually? | 14:00 |
| Stskeeps | we do like and collaborate with individuals within those communities | 14:00 |
| Venemo_N9 | non-mer meego is dead for the most part | 14:00 |
| Stskeeps | but yes, meego as a project is dead | 14:00 |
| Stskeeps | mer carries on spirit and dream, though | 14:01 |
| Eelis | ok, i understand. thanks | 14:01 |
| alterego | We'd collaborate with Tizen, if there was anything to collaborate on at the moment :) | 14:01 |
| Stskeeps | Eelis: so are you interested in contributing? :) | 14:01 |
| Eelis | Stskeeps: heh, not right now. just trying to make sense of all this ^_^ | 14:01 |
| Stskeeps | Eelis: sure :) when you do, don't hestitate to ask any questions | 14:01 |
| Eelis | i will, thanks :) | 14:02 |
| Stskeeps | vmlemon_: from what i know, it has been on plan to shut down meego for a while | 14:02 |
| vmlemon_ | Aah | 14:02 |
| Venemo_N9 | it surprising that they haven't done that yet. | 14:03 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo_N9: meego 1.2 is still used in IVI | 14:03 |
| Stskeeps | and TV to some extent | 14:03 |
| * vmlemon_ wonders why we're suddenly seeing a resurgence of HTML-based dumbphone Linuxes, too... | 14:03 | |
| vmlemon_ | (FireFox OS vs WebOS vs Tizen et al) | 14:03 |
| Stskeeps | well | 14:03 |
| vmlemon_ | Such a stupid idea... | 14:04 |
| Stskeeps | i beg to differ, though | 14:04 |
| Stskeeps | firefox OS should not be underestimated, since any given application framework-centered OS will be difficult to push through in a market | 14:04 |
| Stskeeps | and when you've seen what the html5 community can do, it is sometimes more sharing, open, standards-making than typical framework communities | 14:04 |
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| vmlemon_ | There's a ridiculous amount wheel-reinvention going on with these things for some reason, too. | 14:05 |
| Stskeeps | sure | 14:05 |
| vmlemon_ | *amount of | 14:05 |
| Stskeeps | and i must say, they probably did the best marketing launch ever, by showing working devices with their OS, on top of android hw adaptation, stealing all thunder from Tizen | 14:05 |
| vmlemon_ | Shades of what LiMo were pedalling, ages ago, prior to their demise. | 14:06 |
| Stskeeps | .. and that they might have a usable web runtime usable in other circumstances | 14:06 |
| alterego | I think Firefox OS has the potential to be successful. But it depends who adopts it. | 14:06 |
| vmlemon_ | (I've never seen a product that wasn't vapourware from them). | 14:06 |
| Stskeeps | hello luketheduke :) | 14:06 |
| luketheduke | hi there | 14:06 |
| Stskeeps | luketheduke: welcome here to #mer :) so what brings you here? | 14:07 |
| alterego | And like Stskeeps says, the web communities are generally more open, mainly because all their sources are plain text ;) | 14:07 |
| alterego | And the web has been the single fastest evolving platform on the planet. | 14:07 |
| luketheduke | Stskeeps: I'm a n900 fanboi. Eelis told me about the conversation in here, I'm just listening in | 14:07 |
| vmlemon_ | I predict that the resulting UIs will be clunky, too. | 14:07 |
| Stskeeps | luketheduke: sure :) if you have any questions, feel free to ask at any time, else feel free to hang out | 14:07 |
| luketheduke | thanks! | 14:07 |
| alterego | vmlemon_: I don't think that's necessarily true, but we'll see. I think when you have a specific runtime, like Gecko which Firefox OS is based on, then developers can use the assets that that runtime specifically offers to create the most rich and powerful, compelling UXs they can. | 14:08 |
| Stskeeps | vmlemon_: my belief is that app framework could be html5.. but doesn't mean we can't do our ui's in qt | 14:08 |
| vmlemon_ | (As are most attempts to shoehorn a document-centric "platform" into something that vaguely behaves like a native application, in my opinion). | 14:08 |
| alterego | It's not like they need to target other rendering engines. | 14:08 |
| alterego | vmlemon_: then maybe it's time for a paradigm shift ;) | 14:08 |
| vmlemon_ | I'll wait and see though, like you say. | 14:08 |
| alterego | Which is on the cards, but people are slow to evolve out of the app-centric ecosystems we have now, which is half the problem. | 14:09 |
| alterego | And Apple, Google, MS, they don't want to lose the potential of app stores, because it's a big revenue earning service for them. | 14:09 |
| vmlemon_ | Most attempts don't seem to take into account the fact that smartphones contain interesting hardware, and user-related data that should be accessible to programmers. | 14:10 |
| Eelis | other random question: is Wayland at all relevant to Mer? or is Mer so UI-agnostic that it doesn't even know about things like X ? | 14:10 |
| Stskeeps | Eelis: sec, let me show you a video | 14:10 |
| alterego | Eelis: it's completely relevent, mer needs to create the enablers for UX designers. | 14:10 |
| Eelis | ok :) | 14:10 |
| Eelis | cool. i've been reading about Wayland. i think it's an exciting project | 14:10 |
| Stskeeps | Eelis: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V83mChc-hQE&feature=plcp is Mer + busybox + llvmpipe + wayland + QML compositor + Qt5 on top of virtualbox. (Note: lag issue is known and just a bad conflict with cursor blink/fbcon) | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | Eelis: no libx11 dependencies installed through qt5 modularity | 14:11 |
| vmlemon_ | (After all, there aren't "Web APIs" for controlling haptics motors, interfacing with the phonebook, initiating NFC or Bluetooth connections, controlling cameras, or recording audio as far as I know). | 14:11 |
| Eelis | Stskeeps: sweet! | 14:12 |
| Eelis | i should subscribe to some Mer blogs and keep informed about things | 14:12 |
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| Stskeeps | we don't really have blogs, just get the mailing list | 14:12 |
| Eelis | allright | 14:13 |
| Stskeeps | the problem with existing blog systems is that they're blocked in china | 14:13 |
| Eelis | :/ | 14:13 |
| Stskeeps | and one of the vendors using mer is in china | 14:13 |
| Stskeeps | hello pii :) | 14:13 |
| vmlemon_ | On the other hand, you get things like Android that try too hard to shoehorn said "Web-centric"/"document-centric" paradigm into places where it doesn't fit. (The phonebook access APIs for instance are horrific). | 14:13 |
| pii | Hi! | 14:13 |
| M4rtinK | vmlemon_: heard from a WebOS dev that was developing a painting program, that he had to convert the resulting bitmap to a plaintext string to pass it to some backend service to save it to file :) | 14:13 |
| vmlemon_ | Eew | 14:13 |
| Stskeeps | pii: welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer ? | 14:13 |
| vmlemon_ | I'm reminded of nasty hacks involving ancient LISP applications that recursively generated PostScript, and more LISP code; amongst other monstrosities... | 14:14 |
| pii | Well, you guys are on the news today, you know. :D I I looked at the web site and wanted to see if there is life on the channel .. guess there is. | 14:15 |
| Stskeeps | pii: sure :) if you have any questions about Mer , or on how to contribute, feel free to ask at any time, else feel free to hang out :) | 14:15 |
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| Eelis | the "EFL" sometimes mentioned in Mer contexts, does it refer to the Enlightenment Foundation Libraries or something else? | 14:17 |
| Stskeeps | Eelis: yes, again from original mission statement | 14:18 |
| Stskeeps | we're basically, from core POV, not picky about what people do | 14:18 |
| Eelis | right | 14:18 |
| Stskeeps | but we do optimize towards qml/html5 like scenarios in our development | 14:18 |
| Eelis | ok | 14:18 |
| Stskeeps | it doesn't mean people aren't running GNOME stack on top though | 14:18 |
| Stskeeps | as we do other things right | 14:18 |
| * vmlemon_ wants to find whoever designed said contacts APIs, and force them to listen to Korean rap music, whilst eating extremely hot chilli, and having their eyes gouged out with hot, rusty scissors... | 14:18 | |
| Stskeeps | vmlemon_: i don't believe in contacts api | 14:18 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 14:18 |
| Venemo_N9 | vmlemon_, :D | 14:20 |
| Stskeeps | hey nibbler :) | 14:20 |
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| celeron55 | well; keep up the good work - i'm off to... eh, somewhere else i guess -> | 14:23 |
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| Stskeeps | hello ErkanYilmaz :) | 14:25 |
| ErkanYilmaz | Hello Stskeeps :-) /me just lurking | 14:26 |
| Stskeeps | ErkanYilmaz: sure :) if you have any questions, don't hestitate to ask, else feel free to just lurk :) | 14:26 |
| ErkanYilmaz | sure, will do | 14:26 |
| ErkanYilmaz | thx | 14:26 |
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| * vmlemon_ wonders if we'll eventually see an "OperaOS", to match ChromeOS and FFOS... | 14:28 | |
| Stskeeps | vmlemon_: supposedly opera runs fine on top of mer | 14:28 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 14:28 |
| Stskeeps | actually, in nemo we already had a special opera build, i think | 14:28 |
| Termana | vmlemon_, oh and Safa... oh wait no you probably won't see that... :p | 14:29 |
| vmlemon_ | What's next? Internet Explorer OS? LynxOS? ELinksPhone? | 14:29 |
| Stskeeps | vmlemon_: i'd use elinksphone | 14:29 |
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| vmlemon_ | Ooh, strange green icons in https://github.com/andreasgal/B2G... | 14:31 |
| vmlemon_ | I've never seen those on GitHub befoe. | 14:31 |
| vmlemon_ | *before | 14:31 |
| Stskeeps | submodules? | 14:32 |
| vmlemon_ | Maybe - although the hyperlinks next to them seem to refer to other projects/repositories, and revisions. | 14:33 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, git submodules | 14:33 |
| vmlemon_ | Aah. That makes sense now. | 14:33 |
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| Stskeeps | hello merder :) | 14:40 |
| merder | hello | 14:44 |
| merder | Jolla! | 14:44 |
| merder | w00t | 14:44 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 14:44 |
| Stskeeps | i don't have to ask what brings you here, i guess :) | 14:45 |
| Stskeeps | merder: if you have any questions about Mer, don't hestitate to ask, else feel free to hang out :) | 14:45 |
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| Venemo_N9 | anyway folks, I need my battery for later | 14:55 |
| Stskeeps | seeya | 14:55 |
| Venemo_N9 | so, have a nice day, and goodbye :) | 14:55 |
| alterego | caio | 14:55 |
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| merder | actually theres one thing i'm wondering about | 14:58 |
| Stskeeps | sure | 14:58 |
| merder | how easily portable are android apps to mer? | 14:58 |
| Stskeeps | it really depends on a lot of facotrs | 14:58 |
| Stskeeps | is it an app that just loads a web page? fairly easy | 14:58 |
| Stskeeps | is it a fart app? fairly easy, make it in qml | 14:58 |
| Stskeeps | is it a native android app that uses a lot of android specific things? not so easy | 14:58 |
| merder | ok | 15:00 |
| M4rtinK | and thanks to Necessitas, its quite easier the other way around :) | 15:01 |
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| Stskeeps | hello jonbristol :) | 15:02 |
| Stskeeps | merder: some people also ran android apps as-is with emulation, on old MeeGo, on intel | 15:02 |
| Stskeeps | but that's a commercial product | 15:02 |
| jonbristol | hey sts | 15:02 |
| Stskeeps | jonbristol: welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer ? | 15:02 |
| merder | emulation? | 15:03 |
| jonbristol | well I was reading up on what Jolla is, and how it'll be based on Mer, I'm also an owner of the ancient N800 lol | 15:03 |
| alterego | merder: I think we should be thinking, do we want "apps" or do we want a platform that is already full featured and can work well with web services. | 15:03 |
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| Stskeeps | jonbristol: sure :) if you have any questions or would like to know how to contribute, feel free to ask at any time :) else feel free to hang out | 15:04 |
| merder | I'm just thinking about the many small time devs that have already made some application for android | 15:04 |
| jonbristol | Cool, hopefully my input will be of use lol | 15:04 |
| alterego | Apps are like a money making scheme for ISVs who can't be bothered ti make a complete UX and want to steal money from independent developers. | 15:05 |
| Stskeeps | any contribution is valuable | 15:05 |
| jonbristol | merder, a lot of OSes already run Android apps, such as the playbook's QNX OS and I've also seen a video of a tizen device running the apps | 15:06 |
| jonbristol | So I guess all those apps can be utilized in one way or another | 15:06 |
| Stskeeps | (that was a meego device, from what i recall..) | 15:06 |
| Stskeeps | but sure | 15:06 |
| jonbristol | um, this is the link I believe | 15:08 |
| jonbristol | http://www.intomobile.com/2012/05/17/video-tizenpowered-tablet-caught-running-android-apps/ | 15:08 |
| merder | just thinking about those useful android apps i know and how likely it would be possible to use them on mer | 15:08 |
| Stskeeps | jonbristol: yeah, that was actually meego :) | 15:09 |
| Stskeeps | oh | 15:09 |
| Stskeeps | wait | 15:09 |
| Stskeeps | no | 15:09 |
| Stskeeps | tizen IVI | 15:09 |
| Stskeeps | same stuff ;) | 15:09 |
| merder | so whats up with meego running android apps? | 15:09 |
| Stskeeps | merder: you'd have to ask the companies making that commercial offering | 15:09 |
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| merder | oh, so its a deal between the businesses giants.. | 15:10 |
| Stskeeps | i wouldn't say giants | 15:11 |
| jonbristol | what about Bluestacks? They offer android apps emulation even for windows... | 15:11 |
| Stskeeps | bluestacks is from what i know, full-system emulation, isn't it? | 15:12 |
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| M4rtinK | I'm uninterested until there is a fully OSS implementation | 15:13 |
| Stskeeps | M4rtinK: well, the story was that some guy at canonical got it working perfectly fine under glibc .. and then stopped due to moral quibbles | 15:14 |
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| Stskeeps | and never releasesd source | 15:14 |
| Stskeeps | this was several years ago | 15:14 |
| Stskeeps | imagine how linux landscape would have looked now | 15:14 |
| M4rtinK | and that's why you use Github (or equivalent) & do regular pushes :) | 15:15 |
| M4rtinK | but yes - I really hate all the wasted potential and reinventing the wheal | 15:16 |
| vmlemon_ | Didn't they implement 2 different versions of it? | 15:17 |
| vmlemon_ | Or at least a vapourware proposal was published on a wiki; and a proprietary demo implementation was shown on video. | 15:18 |
| Stskeeps | can't recall | 15:18 |
| merder | but qt's coming to android? or its working already? | 15:22 |
| jonbristol | there is an implementation of it already | 15:22 |
| jonbristol | hmmm, let me get you a link lol | 15:22 |
| merder | nice | 15:22 |
| merder | true cross-platformness | 15:22 |
| M4rtinK | merder: try "Qw" from Play | 15:23 |
| M4rtinK | its a QtGraphicsView using application from THP | 15:23 |
| jonbristol | Can't find the exact link, but I know some developers have interest in it | 15:23 |
| jonbristol | http://code.google.com/p/android-lighthouse/ | 15:23 |
| M4rtinK | it quite nicely illustrates how the automatic library download works | 15:24 |
| M4rtinK | and it is also possible to use PySide (little hacky at the moment though) | 15:24 |
| jonbristol | Yep, QT is quite powerful, it's only hinderanec I believe is some developers not adopting it | 15:24 |
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| merder | i hope it wont be too much of a pita to port android apps to mer so i can see many of those useful android apps on mer as well! :) | 15:38 |
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| alterego | merder: the few apps worth having can either be written, but a lot of apps people like are generally coorporate | 16:02 |
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| alterego | like angry birds, or spotify, etc. | 16:03 |
| merder | yeah, but i was mainly thinking about very niche apps developed by some small time dev | 16:03 |
| alterego | Which will probably be easy to develop ;) | 16:05 |
| alterego | Maybe you could start a wish list / must have apps blog post ;) | 16:05 |
| alterego | I'm sure other people have. | 16:06 |
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| Stskeeps | hello mario :) | 16:14 |
| mario | indeed! hello. | 16:15 |
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| Stskeeps | mario: welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer ? | 16:17 |
| * CosmoHill offers mario a cup of tea | 16:17 | |
| jonbristol | along with some complimentary crumpits (english accent) | 16:18 |
| mario | heh, what a friendly channel | 16:18 |
| CosmoHill | jonbristol: gah | 16:18 |
| CosmoHill | you're call jon and you're english :o | 16:18 |
| CosmoHill | this makes two of us :) | 16:18 |
| Stskeeps | mario: when building community it's important to people to feel welcome :) | 16:18 |
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| mario | i was just looking arround for a future n900 replacement | 16:18 |
| Stskeeps | mario: sure :) maybe a mer vendor will do that one day | 16:19 |
| jonbristol | haha, I'm not english but a big fan of the accent though | 16:19 |
| Stskeeps | mario: if you have any questions about Mer, feel free to ask at any time, or about how to contribute, etc. else feel free to hang out :) | 16:19 |
| mario | well i hope someone does it already because my phone will not last forever :( | 16:19 |
| jonbristol | Wow, N900 replacement would sure be awesome, honestly I secretly hope for something around the E7 form factor | 16:19 |
| jonbristol | True, just be glad it's still working :) lol | 16:20 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 16:20 |
| mario | i read about all these forks and new os'es, but nothing seems like a final product | 16:20 |
| * Stskeeps looks at his n900 with broken usb :( | 16:20 | |
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| Stskeeps | mario: so, mer is a core, vendors take it, add a hardware adaptation for a device, and UI on top | 16:21 |
| Stskeeps | which means we can focus on doing a good job in core level | 16:21 |
| CosmoHill | jonbristol: you've not heard me speak then :p | 16:22 |
| jonbristol | true, core is where the actual magic happens, however I feel a lot of people will be expecting that umzies, patented (swipe UI) :\ | 16:22 |
| Stskeeps | vendors are free to do that, mer can hit 60fps with ease, too :) | 16:23 |
| Stskeeps | we just make it easier to focus on what matters instead of system work | 16:23 |
| jonbristol | CosmoHill what if I'm psychic and already know how you speak? | 16:23 |
| mario | Stskeeps: i do get that, its just frustrating fearing the day when my phone will stop working and i will have to settle down for some half-product n900 is | 16:23 |
| mario | i mean, something half-product compared to n900, even tho its not complete its still far better then anything i can find :p | 16:24 |
| jonbristol | And stskeeper, do you know if the devices will he hacker friendly? like flash your own custom roms etc | 16:24 |
| alterego | jonbristol: knowing tue involved parties, I imagine it'll be more open that even the N900 | 16:28 |
| jonbristol | Which is godd, most people think that people who wants to flash etc are a small niche market, but I guess every incentive to buy counts :) | 16:29 |
| Stskeeps | jonbristol: n900/n9, archos g9, raspberry pi.. | 16:31 |
| Stskeeps | exopc.. | 16:31 |
| Stskeeps | brb fodo | 16:31 |
| jonbristol | well archos has been quite friendly to the hacking community at times, een helped out Bodhi linux with giving them some tablets for development i think | 16:34 |
| dm8tbr | archos tries their best to support hacking on their devices | 16:38 |
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| dm8tbr | and they are very good when it comes to complying with all license requirements | 16:38 |
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| jonbristol | yeah, and france, if they're based there has very relaxed tech laws lol | 16:39 |
| jonbristol | hence VLC can have all those codecs and still be free | 16:39 |
| jonbristol | legally that is | 16:39 |
| dm8tbr | did you know that they actively contribute to libAV? | 16:39 |
| dm8tbr | or avlib | 16:39 |
| dm8tbr | well that ffmpeg successor | 16:40 |
| jonbristol | Nope, but that makes them even more epic! there are some really good people out there :) | 16:40 |
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| timoph | p.setColor( QPalette::Normal, QPalette::Base, trExists ? QColor(255, 255, 255) : QColor(255, 0, 0, 128) ); | 17:10 |
| timoph | to me that looks somehow beautiful :p | 17:10 |
| * timoph is a perv | 17:11 | |
| Stskeeps | is it black on black? | 17:11 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:11 |
| timoph | no. set the background color of a lineEdit to either white or transparent red | 17:11 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 17:12 |
| timoph | just added that to tr-ui | 17:12 |
| timoph | visual indication if the paths for testrunner-lite & co are misconfigured/missing | 17:13 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 17:13 |
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| * lbt now has a shader enhanced alternative to minimer | 17:22 | |
| alterego | I've got a new idea for visual feedback with buttons, must, proto, type, it ... :) | 17:24 |
| alterego | It will stretch my glsl abilities for sure ... | 17:24 |
| sivu | stskeeps, Mer:fake:Core configuration should include python | 17:26 |
| sivu | atleast for me, rpmlint gives error if python is not found | 17:27 |
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| alterego | lbt: packaging Ruby then, where should I start? | 17:30 |
| alterego | I wanted to clone OpenSuSe's packages and adapt for Mer, but you seemed hestitant about that idea yesterday? | 17:30 |
| Stskeeps | sivu: error can be ignored | 17:35 |
| Stskeeps | not entirely sure why it happens, but it's in no way fatal | 17:35 |
| sivu | stskeeps, i know but it's still ugly. and can be resolved by adding python :) | 17:35 |
| Stskeeps | sivu: we don't have Mer:fake:Core basics including python because of low level interdependencies causing a cycle | 17:35 |
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| Stskeeps | sivu: python is actually there, in /opt/testing, a minimal testup | 17:36 |
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| Stskeeps | anyway, i'm making excuses, i'll file a bug about that message | 17:36 |
| Stskeeps | bug 420 added | 17:37 |
| alterego | :) | 17:37 |
| alterego | This new keyboard mapping is a bit lame, but I like having a proper keyboard and mouse with my new work station setup :) | 17:37 |
| Stskeeps | sivu: thanks for reporting the issue | 17:38 |
| sivu | no problem | 17:38 |
| sivu | i'm looking for mer on rpi | 17:39 |
| Stskeeps | the general rule is that if you see something odd, or something that 'should be done', we add a task bug or a bug and catch it in the triage | 17:39 |
| Stskeeps | sivu: http://images.formeego.org/raspberry-pi/ | 17:39 |
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| Stskeeps | welcome to zx2c4 and Lava_Croft :) | 17:39 |
| alterego | Hey guys :) | 17:40 |
| alterego | zx2c4: more on topic in here :P | 17:40 |
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| sivu | stskeeps, i know about that. already branched vgrades packages and updated kernel into newer :) | 17:42 |
| Stskeeps | sivu: alright | 17:42 |
| sivu | and fixed gfx-libs-raspPi build problem | 17:42 |
| Stskeeps | if you're bored, you can package up gles libs too, remember libGLESv2.so.2 -> libGLESv2.so and libEGL.so.1 -> libEGL.so | 17:42 |
| Stskeeps | man, you're quick :) | 17:42 |
| zx2c4 | yo | 17:43 |
| sivu | well it's a dirty fix atm, i added rpmlint filter to ignore offending files :) | 17:43 |
| Stskeeps | sivu: yes, dirty, erm | 17:43 |
| * Stskeeps hides some of his prototypes | 17:43 | |
| sivu | :) | 17:44 |
| zx2c4 | so nemo actually works for things, eh? | 17:44 |
| zx2c4 | any screenshots available, or should i just dig right in and install it | 17:45 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: yeah, i've had a telco on it | 17:45 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: http://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Nemo and #nemomobile | 17:45 |
| alterego | zx2c4: loads of vids and screenies available, just google and look at youtube. | 17:45 |
| zx2c4 | why's nemo considered separate from mer? | 17:45 |
| zx2c4 | different channel and all | 17:45 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: long story short: mer is a core and does not contain hardware adaptations or UIs. we treat everyone the same, they're vendors | 17:46 |
| alterego | zx2c4: they are different :P | 17:46 |
| Lava_Croft | mer is the core or base of the system | 17:46 |
| Lava_Croft | anyone can put anything on top of it | 17:46 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: that way we can make sure people/vendors can work together on a common core without typical places of disagreement | 17:46 |
| alterego | We don't want to say, prioritise Nemo over Cordia, or any other project, we're vendor neutral :) | 17:46 |
| Stskeeps | like vivaldi, with plasma active or mer | 17:46 |
| Stskeeps | er, and | 17:46 |
| Stskeeps | or nemo, with n900/n950/n9 and mer | 17:46 |
| Stskeeps | etc | 17:47 |
| zx2c4 | aaa interesting | 17:47 |
| zx2c4 | so | 17:47 |
| zx2c4 | mer -- base | 17:47 |
| Lava_Croft | still havent heard from spark/vivaldi | 17:47 |
| Lava_Croft | i want one | 17:47 |
| zx2c4 | then there are various layers over it -- plasma active from aseigo, nemo from the old meego proj, and cordia from _____ | 17:47 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: yeah, -- to be honest we run with a principle of hackability, ie, no size fits all | 17:48 |
| Stskeeps | so there'll be some that only use parts of mer, others who use it all, some who modify it | 17:48 |
| Stskeeps | some might even run their own full mer builds | 17:48 |
| Stskeeps | did you know the Mer infra budget is -only- 300 euro a month? | 17:48 |
| Stskeeps | considering we build for armv6, armv7 soft/hardfp, x86 generic, atom, mips | 17:49 |
| Stskeeps | and build tests for changes on top | 17:49 |
| zx2c4 | oh man there's so much fragmentation here though. looks to me like linux desktop situation all over again | 17:49 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 17:50 |
| zx2c4 | :-( | 17:50 |
| Lava_Croft | fragmentation is good | 17:50 |
| Lava_Croft | consolidation is a path of darkness | 17:50 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: the general idea is to work together and save effort, so we don't all have to do the exact same things | 17:50 |
| Stskeeps | and sometimes this is done with permitting some customizability | 17:50 |
| alterego | zx2c4: it's not that fragmented, when you think of them as seperate projects, with different goals. | 17:50 |
| zx2c4 | but, for example, apps.... | 17:51 |
| Lava_Croft | its to have no fragmentation in an open world | 17:51 |
| Lava_Croft | its hard* | 17:51 |
| zx2c4 | its the gtk/qt/kde/gnome wars all over again | 17:51 |
| alterego | The goal of Mer is to provide a common base for vendors like Nemo, Cordia, Plasma, etc. to use and maintain a certain amount of interoperability. | 17:51 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: sure - and we're not pushing a app story, as such. personally i push HTML5 as something that could be common | 17:51 |
| zx2c4 | soon we'll have www.nemo-look.org, www.cordia-look.org, www.html5-look.org | 17:51 |
| alterego | Each of those projects have completely different goals, yet mer manages to cater for and work with them all successfully. | 17:51 |
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| Stskeeps | mer's there to build products, simple as that | 17:51 |
| Stskeeps | and vendors are welcome to work together on app stories | 17:52 |
| zx2c4 | yea, i apprecaite the mer base. that seems good | 17:52 |
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| zx2c4 | so mer is just a basic linux distro? based on suse? what's it have that makes it special | 17:52 |
| * zx2c4 goes and reads documentation | 17:52 | |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: compared to bigger distros, we're about mobile, small, QA-ability | 17:52 |
| zx2c4 | does it include a gsm stack? | 17:53 |
| Stskeeps | oFono | 17:53 |
| zx2c4 | or is that in the nemo,cordia,plasmactive layer | 17:53 |
| Stskeeps | ie, we aren't likely to support server usage, or for that matter desktop that well | 17:53 |
| Stskeeps | we're meant to go into low foot print mobile devices, and not only phones | 17:53 |
| Stskeeps | 'experience' devices, as such | 17:53 |
| lbt | alterego: you just missed me - having dinner now ... bbiab | 17:54 |
| alterego | lbt: okay, talk to you later | 17:54 |
| zx2c4 | is there any hope for tizen rebasing based on mer, or will we always be following them around? | 17:54 |
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| alterego | I think eventually they'll be following us .. | 17:55 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: in our original mission statement we wanted to collaborate but tizen's behind closed doors discussions have made things difficult | 17:55 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: mer wanted to play a different game, tizen plays entire-stack game | 17:55 |
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| zx2c4 | Stskeeps, so basically, mer is just a kind of final attempt to keep all the meego stuff from being comendeered by corporations | 17:56 |
| alterego | We openly, and actively tried to get them on board, but they clearly don't like the idea of not being incharge, and the idea of transparent meritocratic project management. | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: bit of an overexaggration :) we just wanted to show how it -should- be done | 17:56 |
| alterego | zx2c4: MeeGo for us is an idea. | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | we had Mer before meego existed. | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | we joined meego in the hope they were true to the ideals they wrote | 17:56 |
| alterego | And idea that wasn't executed properly by LXF, Intel and Nokia. | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | .. they weren't | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | we go back | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:56 |
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| Stskeeps | zx2c4: we do discuss regularly with tizen ivi and i even have a photo of myself with EFL guy, from when tizen invited many of us from Mer to their conference in SF | 17:57 |
| Stskeeps | in practice there's always collaboration in upstream projects | 17:57 |
| zx2c4 | but nonetheless, all the hard work is now being taken by big corporations, and they arent interested in giving you any piece of the cake, and since they have way more developer power and money, mer will always be playing tizen-catchup | 17:57 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: i used to think so too, but go look at those projects in practice | 17:58 |
| alterego | I think I've fried my USB3 controller .. | 17:58 |
| zx2c4 | you think its gonna flop? | 17:58 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: did you know, that in entire lifetime of meego, every package was only touched for integration purposes 4 times in average? | 17:58 |
| zx2c4 | tizen, i mean | 17:58 |
| vmlemon_ | I assume that it'd be technically possible to implement a Tizen, WebOS, or even Android "profile" on top of Mer? | 17:58 |
| leinir | you seem to believe that clunky, closed-door development practices are more capable of producing functioning systems than agile, open-door methods ;) | 17:58 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: i don't want to be making any kind of doomsday prophecies, it's not valuable for anybody | 17:58 |
| Stskeeps | vmlemon_: sure, sec | 17:59 |
| Stskeeps | vmlemon_: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qwPu6lbG_Xk | 17:59 |
| vmlemon_ | (Given that it's all just Linux, at the end of the day, to put it bluntly). | 17:59 |
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| Stskeeps | hello Anonymous9999999 :) | 18:00 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: let me just dig out a presentation | 18:00 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: was it just on the N950 you wanted me to test calls? | 18:00 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: yes or n9 | 18:00 |
| alterego | I've not set up an N9 for mer development yet. | 18:00 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: https://archive.fosdem.org/2012/schedule/event/391/79_beyond.pdf | 18:00 |
| alterego | Shuld get around to that at somepoint. | 18:00 |
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| zx2c4 | Stskeeps, i think i was at this talk actually | 18:01 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: my condolences | 18:01 |
| zx2c4 | or maybe not | 18:01 |
| alterego | nemo n950 image almost done | 18:01 |
| zx2c4 | fosdem was a blur | 18:01 |
| * alterego loves his 120Mb internets :) | 18:01 | |
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| Stskeeps | hello achilles99 :) | 18:02 |
| achilles99 | hi | 18:02 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: not one of my best, but i was in 3 different countries in the leadup to the conference, so that really hindered matters | 18:02 |
| Stskeeps | achilles99: welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer ? | 18:02 |
| zx2c4 | about all i can remember from fosdem is | 18:02 |
| rcg | any hints what to do or see in port elizabeth, south africa? | 18:02 |
| zx2c4 | screaming at the Nokia Qt guys for ditching QWidget | 18:02 |
| alterego | lol | 18:03 |
| alterego | They've not ditched it :P | 18:03 |
| timoph | zx2c4: afaik it's just moved to it's own module | 18:03 |
| Stskeeps | that's another good discussion, but i've grown tired of it after reading about it day in and day out on qt mailing lists.. | 18:03 |
| timoph | 100% supported stuff | 18:03 |
| Stskeeps | it has just blocked people doing good work with qml desktop components | 18:03 |
| zx2c4 | there was some exchange like "I dont want to use QML" "Are you a developer or designer?" "Uh, both." "Well, you see, designers love QML. YOu must be a developer." "Fuck your bullshit distinctions. I like my qwidget." "I declare declaratively you shall not pass." "Sorry what?" "See, you dont understand QML." "No, I don't." | 18:03 |
| timoph | true | 18:04 |
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| timoph | nah. matters of habbit/taste | 18:04 |
| timoph | both ways supported so really a non-issue | 18:04 |
| zx2c4 | timoph, well, back then, they were talking about just putting it in maintance mode. i think since, there's been some community backlash, and qwidget will be a little bit more maintained than previoulsy stated, which is nice to hear. | 18:05 |
| Stskeeps | zx2c4: there's even a maintainer now, i think | 18:05 |
| Stskeeps | just remember that in any open source project, to keep stuff alive, there has to be people stepping up.. | 18:05 |
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| Stskeeps | companies or even people's priorities change | 18:06 |
| timoph | I think that they are not actively bringing new stuff to widgets but it's an open project so anyone can contribute | 18:06 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 18:06 |
| vmlemon_ | Bilge water? Dead people? Sand? Lions? Coins with holes in them? Fraudsters? | 18:06 |
| * vmlemon_ hides | 18:06 | |
| Stskeeps | what? | 18:06 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 18:06 |
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| Stskeeps | .dk has coins with holes in them | 18:07 |
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| vmlemon_ | (Was in response to rcg's question of "What can I see in (South) Africa?") ;) | 18:09 |
| alterego | Installing nemo on N950 | 18:09 |
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| timoph | btw, can't make a tr-ui release before the updated tr-lite is out | 18:09 |
| vmlemon_ | I'm sure it's a nice place, really. | 18:10 |
| Stskeeps | ah :) | 18:10 |
| rcg | vmlemon_: right, well, i will see tomorrow :) | 18:10 |
| vmlemon_ | Oh, only Kenya has lions and tigers, apparently. (If the song is to be believed). ;) | 18:13 |
| rcg | at least the people here at the gate seem all to be friendly and most of them talk english :) | 18:13 |
| alterego | Wow, has it been that long since I've used nemo O_O | 18:14 |
| alterego | This is gorgeous .. | 18:14 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, xruxa's work really helps matters | 18:14 |
| iekku | alterego, :) | 18:14 |
| alterego | Okay, notes, battery indicator is broken. | 18:16 |
| alterego | As well as cell signal indicator .. | 18:16 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 18:17 |
| rcg | alterego: did you say battery indicator? all help's appreciated on that one :) | 18:17 |
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| alterego | rcg: if I have time I'll have a look. | 18:18 |
| Stskeeps | hey zchydem :) | 18:18 |
| alterego | rcg: looks like contextkit is broken across the board there. | 18:18 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: backend isn't there | 18:18 |
| alterego | Ah | 18:18 |
| alterego | IP issues? | 18:18 |
| rcg | alterego: as Stskeeps says.. actually, some of us are trying to reverse engineer that fella.. hence, the "subtile" call for all help ;) | 18:19 |
| alterego | Not sure I'll be great help there :/ | 18:20 |
| rcg | well.. seeing the queue move.. i might go offline any moment | 18:20 |
| alterego | I can have a look, but that sounds like a lot of work and time is somewhat limited ;) | 18:20 |
| timoph | alterego: but do the important bits work? namely my yatzy game :p | 18:20 |
| alterego | lol | 18:20 |
| alterego | yatzy! | 18:20 |
| rcg | alterego: right, same problems here.. so much to do, so few time ;) | 18:21 |
| alterego | I like the swipe usage :) | 18:21 |
| alterego | Works really well | 18:22 |
| rcg | alterego: http://ruedigergad.com/2012/06/03/nemomer-vs-battery-status-vs-n9n950/ | 18:22 |
| rcg | just in case.. that's at least what i found out about the battery gauge chip for now | 18:22 |
| rcg | with lots of help from DocScrutinizer | 18:22 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: ssh, not swipe, pan to switch ;) | 18:23 |
| timoph | :) | 18:23 |
| alterego | Right, calls not working. | 18:23 |
| alterego | Looks like cellmo isn't being initialized. | 18:23 |
| * alterego investigates. | 18:23 | |
| alterego | Also, really need to update the UX to Qml Components. | 18:23 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: start pin query | 18:23 |
| alterego | Qt Components .. | 18:24 |
| rcg | alright guys.. gotta go.. next time i will hopefully be online from south africa :) | 18:24 |
| alterego | See ya rcg | 18:24 |
| timoph | have fun o/ | 18:25 |
| Stskeeps | have a good trip, rcg | 18:25 |
| alterego | Stskeeps, how? | 18:25 |
| rcg | thx :) | 18:25 |
| alterego | And I don't have a PIN | 18:25 |
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| Stskeeps | alterego: ok | 18:26 |
| alterego | Hmm, ofonod i running. | 18:26 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: add -d to ofono's service file, reboot, dmesg | 18:26 |
| Stskeeps | /lib/systemd/system or something | 18:27 |
| Stskeeps | er, no | 18:27 |
| Stskeeps | not dmesg | 18:27 |
| Stskeeps | systemd-journalctl | 18:27 |
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| * alterego reboots | 18:30 | |
| alterego | Weird place to but service files I have to say. | 18:30 |
| alterego | I guess it makes sense in someone's head :) | 18:30 |
| Stskeeps | hello rettichschnidi :) | 18:31 |
| rettichschnidi | hi Stskeeps | 18:31 |
| Stskeeps | rettichschnidi: welcome here to #mer :) what brings you around? | 18:31 |
| rettichschnidi | my hope for a successor of maemo/my n900 | 18:34 |
| alterego | Well, one thing, /etc/bluetooth/input.conf isn't there. Should it be? | 18:34 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: does ofono complain about it? | 18:34 |
| alterego | Unrelated issue, but an easy fix for an error in the syslog | 18:34 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: bug please | 18:34 |
| alterego | No, this is bluetoothd | 18:35 |
| Stskeeps | rettichschnidi: :nod: i guess jolla news :) we do Core work here - in case you have any questions about Mer, feel free to ask at any time, or feel free to hang out :) | 18:35 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: starting with your .meta comment | 18:35 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: mm? | 18:35 |
| phaeron | you said .meta files in the :full were not copied | 18:36 |
| Stskeeps | right | 18:36 |
| rettichschnidi | Stskeeps: yep, jolla news | 18:36 |
| rettichschnidi | when i have some time ill flash my n900 and see what is already done | 18:37 |
| rettichschnidi | till then ill just idle here | 18:37 |
| Stskeeps | sure :) | 18:37 |
| rettichschnidi | well, one question: has n900/mer an usb host mode? | 18:38 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: well copying those prevented rebuild but now everything is unresolvable | 18:38 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: hmm | 18:38 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: that doesn't do it for me | 18:38 |
| phaeron | yeah digging deeper | 18:38 |
| alterego | rettichschnidi: nope, unfortunately not, though you could probably use the host mode stuff from N900 maemo5 | 18:38 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: what do you mean | 18:39 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: as in, copying .meta does not cause unresolvable for me | 18:39 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: is this expected: Jul 08 19:38:46 localhost.localdomain mce[494]: GLIB WARNING ** GConf - Client failed to connect to the D-BUS daemon: | 18:39 |
| alterego | Appears quite a lot in the startup log. | 18:39 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: sounds like a bad dependency | 18:39 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: bug in nemo please | 18:39 |
| alterego | That's obviously a nemo thing ;) | 18:39 |
| alterego | Hrm, where's the nemo bugzilla? | 18:40 |
| alterego | found it .. | 18:40 |
| rettichschnidi | alterego: probably. But I'd like to have something out of the box - or the driver i'd like to get working on n900 will be used pretty much exclusively by geeks | 18:40 |
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| Stskeeps | phaeron: http://pastie.org/4221557 , and qtwebkit on top | 18:41 |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: what gconf is used for in mer? | 18:41 |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: in maemo/meego stacks, gconf was used | 18:41 |
| * phaeron scratches head | 18:42 | |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: ah, so Its used in nemo, not mer, rigth? | 18:43 |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: we do use it in mer in some places | 18:43 |
| Stskeeps | though i need to remember where :) | 18:43 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: looks like mce is going through a rebase at the moment. | 18:43 |
| alterego | Possibly related | 18:43 |
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| Stskeeps | hello testttr | 18:43 |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: ah right, pulseaudio, sensorfw | 18:44 |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: gconf has been deprecated long time ago, It would be good if we can clean that dep | 18:44 |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: agreed | 18:44 |
| Stskeeps | dconf instead or how was it? | 18:44 |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: dconf is the unix backend, yes | 18:45 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: maybe we need to look at sources of why things rebuild | 18:46 |
| jjardon | pulseadio has a optional dependency on gconf for paprefs, so maybe Its not needed there | 18:46 |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: sensorfw doesnt seems that depend on gconf? http://gitorious.org/sensorfw/sensorfw/blobs/master/sensorfw.pro | 18:48 |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: hmm, might have been a test then | 18:48 |
| Stskeeps | https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Architecture - we also have tools to navigate dependencies | 18:49 |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: such as http://releases.merproject.org/~carsten/mer-core9.png (old picture, kinda bad compared to what i can generate) | 18:49 |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: nice, could you show what modules depend on gconf? | 18:51 |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: yeah, but in this particular case i think gconf dep in pulseaudio comes from our kinda special pulseaudio | 18:51 |
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| jjardon | I see it in the table but its impossible to follow ;) | 18:52 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 18:52 |
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| Stskeeps | anyhow, i have a driver's lesson in the morning so i think i'll sign off for tonight | 18:52 |
| tanuk | Stskeeps: Do you have any details? | 18:52 |
| tanuk | (regarding the specialness) | 18:52 |
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| Stskeeps | tanuk: meego pulseaudio is the one in mer right now, but we were wondering why there's a gconf dep | 18:52 |
| tanuk | I mean, I don't think Harmattan pulseaudio uses gconf for anything. | 18:53 |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: special pulseaudio? will check the patches then | 18:53 |
| Stskeeps | tanuk: yeah, i wondered too | 18:53 |
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| Stskeeps | jjardon: we're likely to go to a clean upstream PA | 18:54 |
| jjardon | oh, wow | 18:54 |
| * alterego installs ofono test scripts .. | 18:54 | |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: this is what drives audio in n9/n900 | 18:54 |
| jjardon | lots of patches here | 18:54 |
| Stskeeps | and was for a while in meego as well, on intel and n9xx side | 18:54 |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: do you know if the patches were pushed upstream? | 18:55 |
| alterego | urgh, dependency issue with ofono-test package, requires python-dbus | 18:55 |
| tanuk | jjardon: Most were, not all. | 18:56 |
| jjardon | alterego: bad ofono, python-dbus is deprecatred too | 18:56 |
| jjardon | tanuk: http://gitweb.merproject.org/gitweb?p=mer-core/pulseaudio.git;a=tree;h=020c304aa35abf2bbde73cf25571f28e6d29648f;hb=020c304aa35abf2bbde73cf25571f28e6d29648f | 18:57 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: buug! | 18:57 |
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| Stskeeps | :P | 18:57 |
| Stskeeps | i'd rather be aware of our problems than not :) | 18:57 |
| alterego | ;) | 18:58 |
| alterego | Done | 18:58 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | alterego: (<alterego> rettichschnidi: nope, unfortunately not, though you could probably use the host mode stuff from N900 maemo5) you're aware that hostmode is 99% kernel hacking at its dirtiest? | 18:58 |
| alterego | DocScrutinizer05: I'm sort of aware of that yes, that I think you've tried it with later kernels and had unpredictable results no? | 18:59 |
| alterego | But yes, generally I understand the method to which you get USB host is a massive bodge :) | 18:59 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | nope, we never even tried to hack any 'later kernel' | 18:59 |
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| DocScrutinizer05 | and why would we, since that particular hack is exactly for N900 only, and afaik there's no 'later kernel' on N900 | 19:01 |
| tanuk | jjardon: Hmm, that list differs from the list of Harmattan patches more than I thought (I'm familiar with Harmattan, not really Mer). | 19:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | the whole hack was only to work around massive fsckup Nokia built into N900 USB hw | 19:02 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | so porting it to any 'alter kernel' is a massive wase of time at nest | 19:03 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | best* | 19:03 |
| jjardon | tanuk: seems a janitor work is needed Stskeeps are you planning to update to pulse 2? | 19:05 |
| DocScrutinizer05 | alterego: btw is it just me or is there some sarcasm in between the lines in your answers? | 19:05 |
| alterego | DocScrutinizer05: not intentional | 19:08 |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: plan's for pulse 2 | 19:10 |
| rettichschnidi | DocScrutinizer05, alterego: thx | 19:12 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: doesn't look like the modem is getting powered up | 19:12 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: dmesg | 19:12 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: I can do it manually. It doesn't happen at startup | 19:13 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: hmm, interesting | 19:13 |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: Is there any more up-to-date repo then this? http://repo.meego.com/tools/repos/ (for spectacle) | 19:13 |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: get mer platform sdk, it contains the up to date stuff | 19:13 |
| Stskeeps | in Mer:Tools and Mer:Tools:Testing | 19:13 |
| Stskeeps | zypper in spectacle | 19:13 |
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| alterego | And there are also issues with the dialer, looks like I've got some interesting bugs to look in to tomorrow :) | 19:16 |
| alterego | I think I'll dedicate 2 days a week for the next few weeks to dialer work. | 19:18 |
| alterego | I want to get it using Qt Components, and also get it actualy working. | 19:18 |
| Stskeeps | sounds good | 19:19 |
| alterego | Then add all the missing features that I intended to do previously when I was actively on the project. | 19:19 |
| alterego | And after that, if I manage to get all that done, I'll look at making it truely headless. | 19:19 |
| alterego | Then we can start talking IVI and all sorts, :) | 19:19 |
| alterego | I have to say though, overall, I'm _really_ impressed with how far Nemo has come. | 19:20 |
| alterego | It's really quite beautiful | 19:20 |
| Stskeeps | sometimes all it takes is a bit of lipstick | 19:20 |
| alterego | ;) | 19:21 |
| alterego | And eyeliner? | 19:21 |
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| alterego | If you remember, eyeliner is what I was planning on calling the QML MCompositor fork :) | 19:22 |
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| alterego | Right, I've got a date with the xbox, see you all tomorrow. | 19:24 |
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| Stskeeps | hello Jagoo :) | 19:35 |
| Jagoo | hi | 19:36 |
| Stskeeps | Jagoo: welcome :) so what brings you here to #mer ? | 19:36 |
| Jagoo | general curiosity in mobile OS dev | 19:36 |
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| Stskeeps | Jagoo: sure :) if you have any questions about Mer, don't hestitate to ask at any time, or if you'd like to know how to contribute, else feel free to hang out and learn/watch :) | 19:37 |
| Jagoo | thats what I intended to do :) | 19:37 |
| Stskeeps | cool :) | 19:38 |
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| jjardon | Stskeeps: sdk installed | 19:42 |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: cool | 19:42 |
| jjardon | but git doesnt work | 19:42 |
| Stskeeps | thought you had that already actually | 19:42 |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: 'not work' .. elaborate :) | 19:42 |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: bash: git: command not found | 19:42 |
| Stskeeps | jjardon: zypper in git | 19:42 |
| Stskeeps | er, sudo zypper in git | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | we don't necessarily come with batteries included, to make it easy to grab | 19:43 |
| jjardon | well, git is pretty necessary in a sdk rigth? maybe should be included by default | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | i do agree | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | bug? :) | 19:43 |
| jjardon | btw, having your home files but work with the sdk is cool | 19:44 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 19:45 |
| Stskeeps | it's meant to be easy to throw away, as well | 19:45 |
| jjardon | we use something similar in gnome, jhbuild. but no so powerful | 19:45 |
| jjardon | as you can test thing like pulseaudio for example | 19:46 |
| jjardon | s/can/cant | 19:46 |
| Stskeeps | we try to delimit somewhat as to launching vms or dealing with devices | 19:46 |
| Stskeeps | if you need a full environment, it should really be 'booted up' | 19:46 |
| Stskeeps | so we have a sdk and a target, ideally making it easy to launch vms, or flash devices | 19:47 |
| jjardon | btw, there is a new version of spectacle: 0.25 | 19:47 |
| Stskeeps | yes, we've taken over development | 19:47 |
| Stskeeps | and it's getting merged as we qa it | 19:47 |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: so if my patch was rejected, I have to do the fixes, rebase the new commit with the new one with the fixes and resubmit? | 19:50 |
| Stskeeps | nah | 19:50 |
| Stskeeps | we're friendlier than that :) | 19:50 |
| Stskeeps | sc | 19:50 |
| Stskeeps | sec | 19:50 |
| Stskeeps | https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Contribution_in_detail#Re-submit_if_original_change_was_rejected | 19:50 |
| jjardon | ok, what "amending the commit" means then? | 19:51 |
| Stskeeps | look further down | 19:51 |
| Stskeeps | git commit --amend | 19:51 |
| Stskeeps | it means that you go in and edit the commit in practice | 19:51 |
| Stskeeps | and re-send with the change ID | 19:51 |
| Stskeeps | let me show you in gerrit how it looks.. | 19:51 |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: ups, sorry, I get it | 19:52 |
| Stskeeps | http://review.merproject.org/636 - notice the patch set 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ? | 19:52 |
| Stskeeps | just remember that we reject to make you a better packager :) | 19:52 |
| jjardon | sure | 19:52 |
| Stskeeps | and not because we don't like the change | 19:52 |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: no worries, Its good to learn | 19:53 |
| lbt | nb ... no need for a bug, git is included in the next release of the SDK | 19:56 |
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| jjardon | lbt: k | 20:02 |
| jjardon | Stskeeps: seems I have character encoding problems | 20:03 |
| lbt | also - see http://www.mail-archive.com/mer-general@lists.merproject.org/msg00548.html | 20:03 |
| jjardon | git show I see this: http://fpaste.org/wIrj/ | 20:03 |
| jjardon | I cant push because "not Signed-off-by author/committer/uploader" | 20:06 |
| jjardon | My complete commit message: http://fpaste.org/UZxb/ | 20:07 |
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| jjardon | lbt: thanks, updating. So the link in http://wiki.merproject.com/wiki/Platform_SDK doesnt point to the latest version (I have to download like 200MB again) | 20:13 |
| lbt | nah, updates work | 20:13 |
| lbt | I need to do an SDK release early next week | 20:14 |
| lbt | I may need to check your repos though | 20:14 |
| lbt | Stskeeps: that looks like gerrit may be having utf8 issues? | 20:16 |
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| jjardon | lbt: known bug? http://fpaste.org/1AXo/ | 20:17 |
| lbt | not seen that before | 20:17 |
| lbt | SDK | 20:18 |
| jjardon | yeah, this is upgrading the sdk | 20:18 |
| lbt | hmm - I used to copy the host system certs into the SDK | 20:18 |
| lbt | well, we still do actually | 20:18 |
| lbt | so I wonder if that conflicts | 20:18 |
| jjardon | I'm using Fedora 17 if that matters | 20:19 |
| lbt | shouldn't | 20:19 |
| lbt | can you log a bug for it | 20:19 |
| lbt | this is a zypper up ? | 20:19 |
| jjardon | yes | 20:19 |
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| lbt | I'm guessing something has an install dependency and I need to take that into account now | 20:20 |
| lbt | thanks for highlighting -- I can look at it as part of the SDK update | 20:21 |
| lbt | see if you have any issues | 20:21 |
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| jjardon | lbt: https://bugs.merproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=424 | 20:23 |
| lbt | ta | 20:23 |
| jjardon | mmm, why openssl is going to be removed? | 20:24 |
| lbt | ? | 20:24 |
| jjardon | lbt: see the log | 20:24 |
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| lbt | maybe https://bugs.merproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=412 | 20:25 |
| lbt | nb ... I think the SDK you have is the older variety, uses the unstable repos | 20:26 |
| lbt | cat you pastie /etc/zypp/repos.d/mer-core.repo and /etc/zypp/repos.d/mer-tools-i486.repo | 20:27 |
| jjardon | lbt: http://fpaste.org/0DuB/ | 20:29 |
| lbt | :/ | 20:29 |
| jjardon | http://fpaste.org/aQdZ/ | 20:29 |
| lbt | have you run sdk-upgrade | 20:31 |
| jjardon | yes, just finished now | 20:32 |
| lbt | my SDK was still on 0.20120517.1 | 20:32 |
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| lbt | trying it here | 20:34 |
| lbt | jjardon: did you delete the downloaded SDK tarball ? :) | 20:36 |
| jjardon | lbt: no, should I? | 20:37 |
| lbt | no | 20:38 |
| lbt | I'm thinking you may want to remove the SDK and reinstall it | 20:38 |
| lbt | carefully | 20:38 |
| lbt | you must do the umount first | 20:38 |
| lbt | https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Platform_SDK#WARNING | 20:39 |
| jjardon | lbt: umounted, but I have to go to bed now, Its 5:40 here ;) More tomorrow! | 20:39 |
| lbt | https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Platform_SDK#Removing_and_disconnecting_the_SDK | 20:39 |
| lbt | sure ... good to have you around | 20:39 |
| lbt | 'night | 20:39 |
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| shmerl | Hi! | 21:20 |
| shmerl | Got some issues when building Firefox for Vivaldi target with Mer SDK. | 21:21 |
| shmerl | For some reason confugure can't find QtOpenGL from pkgconfig | 21:21 |
| shmerl | checking for QtGui QtNetwork QtCore QtOpenGL... Package QtOpenGL was not found in the pkg-config search path. Perhaps you should add the directory containing `QtOpenGL.pc' to the PKG_CONFIG_PATH environment variable No package 'QtOpenGL' found | 21:22 |
| shmerl | configure: error: Library requirements (QtGui QtNetwork QtCore QtOpenGL) not met; consider adjusting the PKG_CONFIG_PATH environment variable if your libraries are in a nonstandard prefix so pkg-config can find them. | 21:22 |
| shmerl | Oops, just noticed that libqtopengl-devel wasn't installed. For some reason I thought it was. | 21:23 |
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| shmerl | Cool, looks like it's compiling at last. | 21:35 |
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| shmerl | Is there any tutorial how to create RPMs for Mer? | 21:37 |
| shmerl | Never worked with RPMs much before. | 21:37 |
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| jonni | shmerl: if you have played with debs before, then old meego wiki with deb to rpm examples might be helpfull http://wiki.meego.com/Packaging/Deb_conversion_example | 21:39 |
| shmerl | Thanks, looks useful. | 21:41 |
| CosmoHill | cyas | 21:41 |
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| shmerl | I'll probably remove the SDK and go over all the steps again to put them on the wiki somewhere. | 21:47 |
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| shmerl | Any news about Jolla? I.e. if they'll have open / closed UX and etc. | 21:48 |
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| KaIRC | btw, good to hear that jolla is working with mer, will be interesting to see what's coming out of this effort! | 23:57 |
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