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| sonach | Stskeeps: I have run MDS setup at about UTC 2:00. So I have to grab everything down... | 02:48 |
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| Termana | morning | 03:03 |
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| Stskeeps | a,n | 05:35 |
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| Stskeeps | urgh | 05:50 |
| * Stskeeps is not having a terribly good morning | 05:55 | |
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| timoph | more coffee? | 05:58 |
| iekku | yes please | 05:59 |
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| Stskeeps | probably needed yeah | 05:59 |
| iekku | Stskeeps, i wated 10 minutes to get my coffee and started wonder why i don't smell it. noticed that it's important to add water to the machine also... | 05:59 |
| Stskeeps | iekku: ah, yes | 05:59 |
| iekku | doesn't sound promissing.. | 06:00 |
| Stskeeps | iekku: i usually do the opposite forget to add coffee | 06:00 |
| iekku | :D | 06:00 |
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| sonach | Stskeeps: morning:) | 06:01 |
| Stskeeps | morn :) | 06:02 |
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| sonach | Stskeeps: although I met the "Ignored failure when building extensions, pure python modules will be used instead", I am setting-up MDS now. It is downloading mer-core/cario. | 06:02 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 06:03 |
| Stskeeps | so it's grabbing the source packages | 06:03 |
| Stskeeps | i'm hoping one day we can have MDS as part of platform SDK or something so there's zero setup needed | 06:03 |
| sonach | Yes. Have you had your morning coffee already? :) | 06:04 |
| Stskeeps | yes, but i'm a little sick today so i'm not going to be very useful :/ | 06:04 |
| sonach | ...bless... | 06:04 |
| Stskeeps | but let's see how i feel later in the morning | 06:05 |
| sonach | hmm, maybe you work too hard. Having a rest could do great help, | 06:05 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, maybe | 06:07 |
| sonach | and, is it necessary to break the setup process to modify the Makefile alike, in order to grab i586 and ARMv7l binaries only? Or just grab all the binaries? | 06:07 |
| Stskeeps | ok, you see rsync -aHx --verbose rsync://releases.merproject.org/mer-releases/obs-repos/Core:*:`cat obs-repos/latest.release` obs-repos | 06:08 |
| Stskeeps | in the Makeile? | 06:08 |
| Stskeeps | replace with http://pastie.org/3392478 | 06:09 |
| Stskeeps | then it only grabs those two | 06:09 |
| sonach | OK, I will stop the process and modify the Makefile:) | 06:11 |
| Stskeeps | it is fully resume-able so you can stop the process without problem and re-start it | 06:12 |
| Stskeeps | i have sometimes bad internet connection too, so ) | 06:12 |
| Stskeeps | :) | 06:12 |
| sonach | yes. At the same time, I want to download platform SDK too. Is the platformSDK-downloading resumable? | 06:13 |
| Stskeeps | yes, it should be | 06:13 |
| sonach | cool! | 06:13 |
| Stskeeps | if it's not, please tell lbt to make it ;) | 06:13 |
| sonach | OK, | 06:13 |
| Stskeeps | nokia had a irritating thing for a while where their SDK was like 1.4gb and not resume-able | 06:14 |
| Stskeeps | that was very bad for developers | 06:14 |
| sonach | hmm, that is very bad... | 06:15 |
| sonach | and, how big is Mer's platform sdk? | 06:16 |
| Stskeeps | 67.3mb right now | 06:16 |
| Stskeeps | so, not bad | 06:16 |
| wmarone | downright tiny | 06:17 |
| sonach | very good! | 06:17 |
| timoph | Stskeeps: planning to submit a paper to akademy? Mer might be a welcomed topic there since the spark should have just arrived then | 06:17 |
| Stskeeps | wmarone: well, we don't have any targets within it so, that is pulled down afterwards | 06:20 |
| Stskeeps | wmarone: sysroots will add a bit :) | 06:20 |
| Stskeeps | timoph: compare the dates of http://roskilde-festival.dk/ and http://akademy.kde.org/ | 06:20 |
| timoph | :D | 06:20 |
| timoph | ack | 06:20 |
| Stskeeps | i'll give you one guess what i prioritise ;) | 06:21 |
| Stskeeps | timoph: send a mail to mer-general@ about akademy though, i'm sure we can send some people | 06:21 |
| timoph | yeah | 06:21 |
| Stskeeps | hmm, there might be a 'PRODUCTISE.IN' in bangalore, india in december 2012 | 06:25 |
| Stskeeps | for product developers, with origin in foss.in events | 06:26 |
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| Stskeeps | morn khaled | 06:27 |
| Khaled | Stskeeps: good morning, long time no see | 06:28 |
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| Stskeeps | sonach: we're getting some loongson boards to test/validate the Mer MIPS port by the way | 06:45 |
| Stskeeps | so that should help things a bit | 06:45 |
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| sonach | Stskeeps: Will gst be replaced by openmax later? | 06:50 |
| Stskeeps | sonach: gst can use openmax rather | 06:50 |
| Stskeeps | gst isn't going away in the forseeable future :) | 06:50 |
| sonach | Stskeeps: longson? Produced by china? | 06:52 |
| Stskeeps | sonach: yes | 06:53 |
| Stskeeps | sonach: i have a contact there and introduced mer | 06:53 |
| Stskeeps | we're also trying to talk to ingenic | 06:55 |
| sonach | Stskeeps: ingenic? very good:) | 06:58 |
| sonach | Got some ingenic boards ? | 06:58 |
| Stskeeps | not yet, one of the purposes to talk to them is to learn about their support for opengl es + ingenic chips | 06:59 |
| Stskeeps | and what their chips are capable of | 06:59 |
| Stskeeps | many people were interested because of the 99 USD MIPS android tablet | 06:59 |
| sonach | the 99 USD MIPS android tablet is ingenic? | 07:00 |
| Stskeeps | yes, as far as i can tell | 07:00 |
| Stskeeps | ingenic xburst jz4770 | 07:00 |
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| Stskeeps | morn phaeron | 07:04 |
| phaeron | morning | 07:04 |
| phaeron | things starting to normalize again :D | 07:05 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 07:06 |
| phaeron | lbt: ping | 07:11 |
| sonach | Stskeeps: Does Gstreamer have hardware requirement interface similar to openmax? | 07:12 |
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| sonach | Stskeeps: that is to say, whether gst have standard hardware A/V acceleration framework? | 07:13 |
| Stskeeps | sonach: no, it's basically an abstraction of video/audio, so you add plugins that can decode | 07:13 |
| Stskeeps | for example on my n900 we have a "gst-dsp" plugin which decodes some types of video/audio using the DSP on the OMAP3430 | 07:14 |
| Stskeeps | it could also be software decoding plugins | 07:14 |
| Stskeeps | decode or encode, that is | 07:14 |
| sonach | Stskeeps: so these plug-ins is equal to openmax in function? | 07:14 |
| Stskeeps | openmax is just an interface to use hardware to decode/encode without having to write software specifically for that chip, while gstreamer is a generic framework | 07:15 |
| Stskeeps | kind of like opengl es is an interface to many different graphics chips | 07:15 |
| sonach | So, if hi3716m does support openmax, gst should use it instead of writing our own plug-in. is that right? | 07:16 |
| Macer | hm | 07:16 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 07:16 |
| Macer | anybody know if there are other places than login.defs or profiel where a umask would be set for sshd/ssh? | 07:16 |
| Stskeeps | but i can't figure out if it supports it or not | 07:16 |
| Macer | sftp and sshfs seems to be 0077 whereas locally both are 0022 | 07:17 |
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| sonach | Stskeeps: OK. We will figure out this. thank you for the clarity:) | 07:17 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: it seems openmax can be plugged into a gst pipeline http://freedesktop.org/wiki/GstOpenMAX | 07:17 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: yes | 07:17 |
| sonach | phaeron: what does this mean? | 07:18 |
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| phaeron | sonach: you can use openmax as a part of a gstreamer pipeline | 07:18 |
| Stskeeps | sonach: just what we just talked about :) that to decode in gstreamer, it can use openmax | 07:18 |
| sonach | OK:) | 07:18 |
| phaeron | yes | 07:18 |
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| Stskeeps | BTW, i've temporarily put any new validation checks for gerrit on backlog as i'm planning to reboot the OBS during this weekend | 07:33 |
| sonach | lbt: where to download platform SDK? "curl -O url_to_be_defined"... | 07:40 |
| Stskeeps | https://img.merproject.org/images/mer-sdk.tar.bz2 | 07:40 |
| sonach | so the wiki needs to be updated? | 07:41 |
| sonach | http://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Platform_SDK | 07:41 |
| Stskeeps | yes, think we want to put it on a better url | 07:42 |
| Stskeeps | alongside mer release | 07:42 |
| sonach | ok, | 07:42 |
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| niqt | morning | 07:44 |
| jukkaeklund | hi | 07:47 |
| w00t | _o/ | 07:48 |
| matrixx | o/ | 07:48 |
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| Bostik | lbt: FYI - I'm dragging my co-worker here, he's taking over the day-to-day Qt5 packaging maintenance and I'll lend my hand only when really necessary | 09:18 |
| lbt | Bostik: great | 09:18 |
| sonach | lbt: There is no enter-chroot.sh in mer-sdk... | 09:18 |
| lbt | sonach: what url? | 09:18 |
| sonach | https://img.merproject.org/images/mer-sdk.tar.bz2 | 09:19 |
| Bostik | and as a neat bonus, another one finally figured out a workaround for the devious "touch events cause progressive lag" issue :) | 09:19 |
| lbt | https://img.merproject.org/images/ | 09:19 |
| sonach | lbt: ah, i see:) | 09:19 |
| lbt | sonach: :) | 09:19 |
| lbt | Bostik: that sounds rather useful | 09:20 |
| lbt | Bostik: it would be good if you could do the handover in here | 09:20 |
| Bostik | will do, you'll see all the gritty details | 09:20 |
| lbt | excellent | 09:20 |
| lbt | you know I tried to get involved pre-china but just got swamped | 09:21 |
| lbt | this time around ... who knows | 09:21 |
| Bostik | I've had my hands more than full since early December, so I do feel you | 09:21 |
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| sonach | lbt: when exit from chroot, the bind-mounts are all umounted on my ubuntu11.10 desktop. So it is safe:) | 09:30 |
| lbt | good | 09:31 |
| lbt | I'm going to finish up the new OBS and then wrap up the SDK | 09:32 |
| lbt | it should be just about useable at the moment - the main issue is doing an "osc build" | 09:32 |
| lbt | that gets the architecture confused if you have an x86_64 desktop | 09:33 |
| sonach | my desktop is 32 bit:) | 09:33 |
| Stskeeps | define confused | 09:33 |
| lbt | python's os.uname() says it's x86_64 | 09:34 |
| Stskeeps | okay, and that affects what? | 09:34 |
| sonach | lbt: So I still can try current SDK. But when you update the SDK, I have to download a new one, is that right? | 09:34 |
| lbt | the osc build command line gets "linux32" prepended | 09:34 |
| Stskeeps | ah.. | 09:34 |
| lbt | sonach: eventually, if you need to | 09:34 |
| Stskeeps | ok, got it | 09:34 |
| sonach | lbt: OK:) | 09:35 |
| lbt | Stskeeps: yeah, I hack it but need to think of a proper fix | 09:35 |
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| Aard | is there osc for n900? :) | 09:54 |
| Aard | clothes shopping with wife, looking for something interesting to do | 09:56 |
| phaeron | osc is hardly interesting :) | 09:56 |
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| lbt | when you come back sonach: you can "zypper up" or "zypper in" too | 10:02 |
| lbt | phaeron: good morning | 10:02 |
| phaeron | morning | 10:03 |
| Aard | phaeron: no, but I could do some packaging | 10:06 |
| phaeron | wow that's desperate | 10:14 |
| lbt | Aard: clothes selection is a complex technical problem.... plus you get hack-time points for helping out | 10:16 |
| Aard | lbt: it comes down to 'take', 'move', 'try' and 'buy'. not very challenging for me | 10:18 |
| Aard | questions like 'you like it?' are rethorical, my answer is irrelevant | 10:18 |
| lbt | ah, so basically you haven't solved the pattern match problem? | 10:20 |
| lbt | or gotten a good grasp on the control language syntax... | 10:20 |
| Aard | which control? :p | 10:20 |
| phaeron | why are linux headers in mer old .. 2.6.37 ? | 10:20 |
| lbt | Aard: her of course | 10:21 |
| lbt | phaeron: Mer doesn't have kernel headers | 10:21 |
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| Stskeeps | yes we do | 10:21 |
| lbt | we do? | 10:21 |
| phaeron | lbt: the glibc sanitized ones | 10:21 |
| lbt | oh | 10:21 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: userland has to build against -some- kernel headers | 10:21 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: because chances are that if we upgrade to 3.0, we'll loose ability to run older kernels | 10:22 |
| Aard | having not too much to do with it is good. i just need to remove me beeing present... | 10:22 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: ok :( | 10:22 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: any specific problem you're having? | 10:22 |
| phaeron | trying to compile a recent udisks version | 10:22 |
| Stskeeps | hmm | 10:22 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: https://build.pub.meego.com/package/live_build_log?arch=i586&package=udisks&project=Project%3ACordia%3AGNOME%3AShell&repository=Mer_Core_i586 | 10:23 |
| Stskeeps | it's very new, 30 july 2011 | 10:23 |
| phaeron | yes introduced in 3.1 rc2 | 10:24 |
| phaeron | this project exposes three problems : the old kernel headers , spidermonkey fails for arm , mer old libnl1 hangs configure on arm | 10:24 |
| phaeron | interestingly spidermonkey fails for hardfp only not softfp | 10:25 |
| Stskeeps | spidermonkey failing, not surprising | 10:25 |
| phaeron | yes but why only hardfp ? | 10:25 |
| Stskeeps | because it uses a new ABI | 10:26 |
| Stskeeps | which many projects haven't adjusted to | 10:26 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: https://build.pub.meego.com/package/live_build_log?arch=armv8el&package=js&project=Project%3ACordia%3AGNOME%3AShell&repository=Mer_Core_armv7hl | 10:26 |
| phaeron | very weird error though .. | 10:26 |
| Stskeeps | https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=770230 | 10:27 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: and the third issue https://build.pub.meego.com/package/live_build_log?arch=armv8el&package=NetworkManager&project=Project%3ACordia%3AGNOME%3AShell&repository=Mer_Core_armv7hl | 10:28 |
| Stskeeps | last one, no clue, qemu interaction? | 10:28 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: yeah and I tried to hunt for the patch for js | 10:28 |
| lbt | Stskeeps: when you have a minute can you give me the # numbers of your phosts from https://robot.your-server.de/ | 10:29 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: probably qemu | 10:29 |
| lbt | I want to ask them about consolidation, switches and close locations | 10:29 |
| Stskeeps | okay, but consult me before asking them to do anything that'll incurr a cost | 10:30 |
| lbt | of course | 10:30 |
| lbt | asking for options and how to ensure that new machines are setup physically close to old ones to allow potential LAN | 10:30 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 10:30 |
| phaeron | lots of spec macros from fedora could be helpful for us as well | 10:34 |
| Stskeeps | task bugs.. | 10:43 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: http://releases.merproject.org/~carsten/magic.txt btw, got it to work within obs | 10:46 |
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| Stskeeps | zumbi: http://releases.merproject.org/~carsten/magic.txt might be interesting for you too, building embedded systems without modifying rpm configuration or spec files | 11:01 |
| zumbi | Stskeeps: ok, thanks | 11:01 |
| Stskeeps | without any tools in the taret | 11:01 |
| Stskeeps | target | 11:01 |
| zumbi | Stskeeps: I'll have a look, I saw your mail about sysroots in the OBS ML | 11:02 |
| zumbi | looking great! :) | 11:02 |
| zumbi | I gotta go to meeting :) | 11:02 |
| Stskeeps | cya | 11:02 |
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| zumbi | Stskeeps: well, not yet | 11:04 |
| zumbi | Stskeeps: whats interesting from that acl build? | 11:04 |
| zumbi | Stskeeps: is it a build using qemu static? | 11:04 |
| Stskeeps | zumbi: i'm transparently cross building, there's no 'gcc', 'bash' etc in target, it acts like a fast arm machine | 11:04 |
| Stskeeps | i am not modifying package in any way | 11:04 |
| zumbi | is that SB2 patches? | 11:05 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, it's built using sb2 | 11:05 |
| Stskeeps | the idea is the toolchain-core split, where toolchain is x86 and core is not self-hosted | 11:05 |
| zumbi | and is it faking native gcc with cross-gcc? | 11:05 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 11:06 |
| Stskeeps | it means i can build everything from a wireless router to a full netbook with same tools and ease of use | 11:06 |
| zumbi | there might be some corner cases where it fails | 11:06 |
| Stskeeps | probably, yeah | 11:06 |
| Stskeeps | this is just proof of concept | 11:06 |
| Stskeeps | i don't expect to be able to build full debian archive | 11:06 |
| zumbi | I am also bit worried on qemu magic by not detecting misalignments | 11:06 |
| Stskeeps | but the fact we can do this without modifying packaging or do voodoo rpm configuration, is a good sign | 11:07 |
| zumbi | Stskeeps: full debian archive would be great test :) | 11:07 |
| zumbi | Stskeeps: yes, thats great, if I find the time I'll play with it | 11:07 |
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| zumbi | gotta go now | 11:07 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 11:07 |
| Stskeeps | cya | 11:07 |
| zumbi | thanks for all that fish :) | 11:08 |
| lbt | phaeron... | 11:20 |
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| sonach | lbt: In platform SdK, there is no sb2 or gcc, | 12:18 |
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| Stskeeps | sonach: should be easy to install, zypper in scratchbox2 gcc glibc-devel | 12:20 |
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| Stskeeps | sonach: we just wanted to provide a working 'mic' image creator and such and the infrastructure first | 12:21 |
| sonach | Stskeeps: sdk's first step, only for creating image? | 12:22 |
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| Stskeeps | yes | 12:22 |
| Stskeeps | because we don't have good 'mic' packages for people | 12:22 |
| Stskeeps | so this one includes a working one | 12:22 |
| Stskeeps | next week we start looking closer at scratchbox2 and gcc | 12:23 |
| lbt | sonach: you can use "osc build" too | 12:23 |
| sonach | It is interesting that it can access network, but no ifconfig at all:) | 12:24 |
| lbt | magic | 12:24 |
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| sonach | in my opinion, "osc" is used to build stuff on OBS. So, what is osc used for in platform SDK? | 12:25 |
| sonach | I am puzzled about this | 12:25 |
| Stskeeps | sonach: platform sdk contains tools that's useful for a mer developer (and vendor developer)'s usual day to day activities | 12:26 |
| Stskeeps | sonach: so the osc in platform sdk will always work with mer systems | 12:26 |
| Stskeeps | instead of being a random one from ubuntu | 12:26 |
| sonach | ah. I can understand this,because sdk can share the network connection with host PC and can access remote OBS:) | 12:27 |
| Stskeeps | sonach: we will add things for building software without obs soon as well, but we needed some things to work first before we did that, which is the first version you see there | 12:27 |
| lbt | yes | 12:27 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 12:27 |
| sonach | hmm, that is to say, osc will be removed in the end? | 12:27 |
| lbt | no | 12:27 |
| lbt | it won't be mandatory though | 12:27 |
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| lbt | the sdk is supposed to be easily cleaned too | 12:28 |
| sonach | In My POV, osc is useless for 'official' Platform SDK... | 12:28 |
| lbt | that's OK | 12:28 |
| sonach | I think that platform SDK is used to build source code locally, and create image, | 12:29 |
| lbt | there will be a variety of uses | 12:29 |
| lbt | and that use is there too | 12:29 |
| lbt | sonach: actually the SDK *is* an "osc build" | 12:29 |
| Stskeeps | sonach: it's not useless in the big perspective, when you look beyond just one developer and into a team working together | 12:29 |
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| lbt | we'll probably have some command like "sdk setup-to-build project/package" | 12:30 |
| lbt | which will be a lot like "osc build project/package" | 12:30 |
| Stskeeps | example use case: do your software with scratchbox2 and gcc and so on, then upload with osc to team server to build | 12:30 |
| lbt | but will put things into one of your SDKs | 12:30 |
| sonach | Stskeeps: you are right, I forget that I should use osc to commit my code to OBS server, so I need a stable osc different from linux distro(such as ubuntu,fedora...) | 12:32 |
| Stskeeps | sonach: yeah, because those are very often old | 12:32 |
| sonach | Stskeeps: I find that "Retrieving: gcc-4.6.3-1.19.i486.rpm". What should I do if I want to build for ARM? | 12:33 |
| Stskeeps | sonach: that's what we're working on next week :) | 12:34 |
| sonach | OK:) so now I can test is to build for X86? | 12:34 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 12:34 |
| sonach | cool:) | 12:34 |
| sonach | I think sb2 will be the main point to support cross-compilation? | 12:35 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 12:35 |
| Stskeeps | we got delayed because we had to deploy sb2 on OBS side and it takes a little longer than expected | 12:35 |
| sonach | "deploy sb2 on OBS" is for MDS? | 12:35 |
| Stskeeps | it's for actually cross building inside our build servers | 12:36 |
| Stskeeps | the combination of sb2 and OBS is completely new technology | 12:36 |
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| Stskeeps | MDS is a thing that helps people use mer in their build systems without having always to communicate with our main servers | 12:37 |
| sonach | ah, new technology:) Now I don't quite understand the cross-compilation process of OBS, let alone sb2. Is that any wiki page explains those? | 12:37 |
| Stskeeps | i should probably do a diagram, but it is a bit hard to understand for many | 12:38 |
| sonach | Stskeeps: Several days ago, we had a disscussion with meego's toolchain maintainer, she explained that OBS uses qemu to do cross-compilation... but I am puzzled about this... | 12:39 |
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| sonach | Anyway, If you have worked out the diagram, please tell me:) I think I should try to understand this:) | 12:40 |
| Stskeeps | sonach: long story short: Scratchbox2 is a technology that can change the perception of file system for a process (for example, make /bin point to /target/bin), or choose another binary to execute when a command is executed (for example gcc to ARM cross compiler) | 12:40 |
| Stskeeps | sonach: expanding a bit on this you can make a fake world that can run ARM binaries in qemu, but for many things like compiler, use X86 binaries instead | 12:41 |
| Stskeeps | so very little is built with emulation | 12:41 |
| Stskeeps | it's a bit high tech :) | 12:42 |
| sonach | it really is! | 12:50 |
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| lbt | phaeron: do you want to help on the obs redirect mess then | 13:41 |
| phaeron | lbt: I can try , if you haven't tangled it up already :D | 13:41 |
| lbt | yeah | 13:42 |
| lbt | so adrian says they run a similar setup | 13:42 |
| lbt | check production.rb for webui and api | 13:42 |
| lbt | webui seems to be the issue | 13:42 |
| phaeron | let me jump ssh first | 13:43 |
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| InformatiQ | lbt: | 13:45 |
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| lbt | hey InformatiQ | 13:45 |
| InformatiQ | lbt: private | 13:46 |
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| jeremiah | I know this isn't necessarily the right place to ask, but where is the "canonical" git repo for mic? github or gitorious. | 14:29 |
| Stskeeps | github is the one i know of | 14:30 |
| Stskeeps | that the author pointed us to | 14:30 |
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| jeremiah | ah, cool | 14:32 |
| jeremiah | The versions look to be the same judging by the git log | 14:32 |
| jeremiah | And I imagine that they just pushed it to github when their LF repos went down. | 14:32 |
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| lbt | phaeron : process 20120216-bigirojo SR#4377 ERROR | 14:49 |
| lbt | ? | 14:49 |
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| phaeron | lbt: was away | 15:20 |
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| lbt | alterego: ping | 16:07 |
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| alterego | lbt: hi, :) | 16:39 |
| lbt | hey | 16:39 |
| lbt | so ... preparing for the wiki move | 16:39 |
| alterego | Yes, so what dist/ver is the target machine running? | 16:40 |
| lbt | squeeze | 16:40 |
| alterego | Cool | 16:40 |
| * alterego checks his server version | 16:40 | |
| alterego | Hrm, I'm on 5 | 16:40 |
| alterego | Oh well. | 16:40 |
| alterego | So, firstly I guess apt-get installing media wiki and setting it up in apache properly. | 16:41 |
| lbt | yep | 16:42 |
| alterego | Then copying over the configuration and possibly adapting from my setup | 16:44 |
| alterego | Then copying over a current version of the database and switching over the DNS | 16:44 |
| alterego | So, how would you like to proceed :) | 16:44 |
| alterego | I think if we get to the point of configuration today. Then possibly do the DNS switch tomorrow. | 16:45 |
| lbt | #1 get you logged in | 16:45 |
| alterego | I think if we do a test restoration of the database before the DNS switch, then we can do the DNS switch, and I'll offline my instance, then we do another restore and wait until the DNS propogates. | 16:46 |
| Stskeeps | remember backup of database before doing all this.. | 16:46 |
| alterego | Yeah :P | 16:46 |
| alterego | I've got a full backup of the system from lastnight anyway. | 16:47 |
| Stskeeps | http://makeplaylive.com/ | 16:54 |
| Stskeeps | (spark pre-order) | 16:54 |
| vgrade | Mer OS | 16:59 |
| Stskeeps | close enough | 17:00 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:00 |
| Stskeeps | if you fetch him, Mer Core is the usual name | 17:00 |
| Stskeeps | we should really have a 'powered by mer core' | 17:00 |
| Stskeeps | logo | 17:00 |
| * Stskeeps ponders idly | 17:02 | |
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| lbt | you can look at cobs redirect | 17:09 |
| Stskeeps | laggy cnnection atm, not going to be good for me or the cobs | 17:11 |
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| bigbluehat | Art Technica article on boot2gecko…for the curious :) http://arstechnica.com/business/news/2012/02/first-look-mozillas-boot2gecko-mobile-platform-and-gaia-ui.ars | 17:28 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 17:28 |
| Stskeeps | i'm not underestimating b2g fwiw, but they do have fatal dependencies on android | 17:28 |
| Stskeeps | no matter how much they try and slice and dice it | 17:29 |
| Stskeeps | but they might actually get some devices out with that | 17:30 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: how small can we get Mer do you think? | 17:31 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: in what timeframe? | 17:31 |
| alterego | Say if I wanted a dist < 2M using busybox etc, for a real minimal, would using mer as a base be a good idea? | 17:31 |
| w00t | rm -rf ALL the things! | 17:31 |
| Stskeeps | i have some wet dreams about the core to rule all cores, but let's see how bad it gets | 17:31 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: well, the split-toolchain-core thing i'm working on certainly has the ability to do funky things | 17:32 |
| alterego | Basically, if it can build uclibc and busybox I'm happy ;) | 17:32 |
| Stskeeps | that's one of the ideas.. | 17:32 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:32 |
| alterego | I also need to contend with a weird fs image format. But meh :) | 17:33 |
| bigbluehat | Stskeeps: keep up the greatness :) I do think a primary (single?) mobile linux core makes sense | 17:33 |
| bigbluehat | the one in webOS is likely quite different…for example | 17:33 |
| bigbluehat | who knows | 17:33 |
| Stskeeps | bigbluehat: the big challenge would be binary compatibility | 17:33 |
| bigbluehat | ah, true | 17:33 |
| Stskeeps | and that's why i don't promise it | 17:33 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:33 |
| alterego | Oh, and this is also an odd processor. Can't remember what it is. | 17:33 |
| alterego | Some random RISC architecture. | 17:33 |
| alterego | Oh wait, no, they're ARM7s | 17:34 |
| Stskeeps | i think the problem is when you go to no-mmu stuff | 17:35 |
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| bigbluehat | good plan on subjugating promises to reality :) | 17:35 |
| bigbluehat | but here's hoping :) | 17:36 |
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| alterego | It probably is mmu-less, but I'll have to check when the new units come in. | 17:36 |
| bigbluehat | also, what are the chances I'll someday be able to run Mer on the HP TouchPad I got yesterday? | 17:36 |
| bigbluehat | it's currently dual booting webOS and that other OS people seem to like | 17:36 |
| Stskeeps | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LyGMkSYAjJI | 17:37 |
| alterego | neat :) | 17:41 |
| vgrade | make,play,live needsa bigger server | 17:43 |
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| Stskeeps | it crashed already | 17:44 |
| Stskeeps | ? | 17:44 |
| vgrade | yea | 17:44 |
| Stskeeps | fun | 17:44 |
| sroedal | I was able to register in time :p | 17:44 |
| sroedal | great page, loved the message | 17:44 |
| Stskeeps | at least it's the good kind of preorder page, the one that doesn't take your credit card details | 17:46 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:46 |
| Stskeeps | vgrade: we should really try qt5 with eglfs on that device.. | 17:47 |
| bigbluehat | Stskeeps: tnx for the link…guessing that is Mer underneath nemo? | 17:47 |
| Stskeeps | bigbluehat: yeah | 17:48 |
| Stskeeps | no graphics acceleration | 17:48 |
| bigbluehat | ah. seemed to fair relatively well without it | 17:48 |
| bigbluehat | Android 2.3 (CM7) is pretty snappy on the HPTP | 17:48 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, but it has graphics accel | 17:48 |
| sroedal | Stskeeps: I'm definitely going to try qt5 with eglfs on it | 17:49 |
| bigbluehat | webOS feels sluggish after you use the catalog for a long time…which I did this morning :) | 17:49 |
| bigbluehat | Stskeeps: right. which makes this an even more promising demo :) | 17:49 |
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| Stskeeps | sroedal: at least there's framebuffer mali drivers readily downloadable, http://openlinux.amlogic.com/wiki/index.php/Arm/OpenGL | 17:50 |
| sroedal | Stskeeps: great, also curious what the limadriver project will lead to... | 17:51 |
| Stskeeps | (http://openlinux.amlogic.com/download/linux/ARM/filesystem/ ) | 17:51 |
| Stskeeps | i do ponder how much mali devices share binaries though | 17:51 |
| sroedal | without an open driver it will be hard to get wayland on there | 17:52 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, sadly | 17:52 |
| sroedal | unless arm suddenly decide to support it | 17:52 |
| * w00t eyes sroedal | 17:52 | |
| Stskeeps | well, at least ST-E used to have a wayland compositor on top of mali, so it ought to be possible | 17:53 |
| sroedal | Stskeeps: ok? | 17:53 |
| Stskeeps | but this was before black friday | 17:53 |
| Stskeeps | (http://conference2010.meego.com/sites/all/files/sessions/a_gallo_u8500_meego_linaro.pdf mentions it) | 17:54 |
| sroedal | of course it's possible for them to support wayland, it's just unlikely that arm will put in the effort voluntarily | 17:54 |
| sroedal | unless there's some customers paying for it | 17:54 |
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| sroedal | Stskeeps: ok, interesting | 17:55 |
| sroedal | but I guess ST-E aren't involved with the Spark hardware | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | but they are involved with linaro.. | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:56 |
| Stskeeps | either way, framebuffer gles is better than nothing | 17:56 |
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| sroedal | yeah | 17:57 |
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| alex____ | hello | 18:00 |
| alex____ | I need the link to the interview of the spark society founder | 18:00 |
| alex____ | anyone? | 18:00 |
| lbt | alterego: ping - try again? | 18:01 |
| vgrade | alex____, http://www.jupiterbroadcasting.com/16882/sparking-a-fire-las-s20e06/ | 18:01 |
| alex____ | thx a lot | 18:01 |
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| alex____ | bye and sorry for the intrusion | 18:02 |
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| vgrade | Stskeeps, eglfs, is that what qtonpi is using | 18:03 |
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| Stskeeps | vgrade: yeah, for instance | 18:03 |
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| lbt | vgrade: not sure that ml thread is giving the right message | 18:04 |
| vgrade | yea, I remember Donalds article, http://labs.qt.nokia.com/2011/10/03/chasing-the-raspberry-pi-dragon-opengl-es2-accelerated-qt-pi/ | 18:04 |
| vgrade | lbt, re-reads | 18:05 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: IVI? | 18:05 |
| lbt | es | 18:06 |
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| lbt | just replying | 18:06 |
| Stskeeps | i think it's fine, the idea is anyway to be able to utilize qtonpi efforts on mer | 18:06 |
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| Stskeeps | and there's other ivi demos around the place | 18:06 |
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| lbt | yep - I just want a clear "IVI is important to Mer and we welcome IVI interest groups" | 18:15 |
| Stskeeps | makes sense | 18:16 |
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| lbt | rather than "Carsten actually just answered ....about IVI Mer - that there is NOT going to be such vertical in the future" which although accurate is potentially misleading on a glancing read :) | 18:16 |
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| Stskeeps | yeah, i think i followed up in that thread too | 18:18 |
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| lbt | ah, so you did - that didn't get filed into the mer folder | 18:20 |
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| vgrade | lbt, still ok to have that IVI page on the wiki | 18:25 |
| lbt | for sure | 18:26 |
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| Stskeeps | lbt: we're keeping access logs on www.merproject.org right? | 19:00 |
| lbt | safer to say we're not actively deleting them | 19:01 |
| lbt | logrotate though... | 19:01 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 19:01 |
| Stskeeps | we should do some statistics about how many visit merproject.org | 19:01 |
| Stskeeps | if anything, to get a sense of reality | 19:02 |
| alterego | 10 unique visitors :P | 19:02 |
| alterego | I can do some stats on wiki.merproject.org | 19:02 |
| alterego | Which is probably more interesting no? | 19:02 |
| Stskeeps | wiki could be interesting too | 19:02 |
| alterego | 1181204 accesses. | 19:03 |
| alterego | Erm, I should probably install some proper access log reader to get better stats. | 19:04 |
| alterego | unique ips? | 19:05 |
| Stskeeps | i guess that's one way | 19:05 |
| lbt | web log analysis is a career | 19:05 |
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| alterego | 34593 - unique ip hits. | 19:08 |
| alterego | From the 4th of Oct 2011 to now. | 19:08 |
| alterego | I had a really nice ruby script a long time ago that I wrote that did all this stat generation stuff. | 19:09 |
| alterego | Well, I managed to prototype my own arduino compatible circuit on a breadboard :) | 19:13 |
| alterego | And program it :) | 19:13 |
| alterego | The serial port on the N900 under the battery is TTL isn't it? | 19:14 |
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| Stskeeps | don't risk it | 19:15 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 19:15 |
| alterego | Heh | 19:15 |
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| alterego | But I want it to be my home automation server :P | 19:16 |
| Stskeeps | get a pi or a beaglebone :P | 19:16 |
| alterego | Hmm, not a bad idea. | 19:16 |
| alterego | A Pi would be the best bet for sure. When they're available ;) | 19:17 |
| ali1234 | it's almost certainly TTL | 19:17 |
| Stskeeps | oh nice, referring to merproject.org in the spark preorder confirmation email | 19:17 |
| Stskeeps | that should help stats | 19:17 |
| alterego | I can check anyway, got my scope. | 19:17 |
| Stskeeps | alterego: hint: rd mode, serial-console rd flag before trying the scope | 19:18 |
| alterego | Stskeeps: of course ;) | 19:18 |
| alterego | Alternatively I could use my USB->TTL lead with the N900, but I can never be arsed to piss around with hostmode. | 19:18 |
| ali1234 | you generally power your level shifter from the same header anyway | 19:18 |
| ali1234 | you might be able to make the USB port do serial | 19:19 |
| ali1234 | i think i checked this before and it wasn't possible | 19:20 |
| Stskeeps | don't bother, just connect up the pads | 19:20 |
| alterego | Yeah# | 19:21 |
| Stskeeps | the problem is power supply during connectivity | 19:21 |
| alterego | Well, both units will be powered | 19:22 |
| ali1234 | you still need a battery in the N900 | 19:22 |
| ali1234 | or a fake battery | 19:23 |
| alterego | Sure, I'll just use teeny weenie wires :) | 19:23 |
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| alterego | Or take it apart and poke the out of something. | 19:23 |
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| alterego | My other idea, is to use RF links between each home automation "node" and then have the N900 or a server able to access that "network". | 19:27 |
| alterego | I quite like that idea, because it's more of a challange, but the range of the RF tranceivers probably isn't that great. | 19:27 |
| ali1234 | bluetooth will cover most of a house at low bitrates | 19:28 |
| alterego | Not my house -_- | 19:28 |
| alterego | I have 3 stories and BT doesn't reach from the ground to top floor (annoyingly my main room ;) | 19:28 |
| ali1234 | something slower will cover more | 19:29 |
| alterego | Another idea is to employ something like those PLC (power line) ethernet bridges that turn your homes' mains electrical circuit into a network. | 19:29 |
| alterego | If I could build one cheap enough I'd be interested in doing that. | 19:30 |
| ali1234 | use X10? | 19:30 |
| ali1234 | oh, those are wireless | 19:30 |
| alterego | Oh, that looks perfect .. | 19:31 |
| ali1234 | how come no one made a system like X10 that communicates over power lines? | 19:31 |
| alterego | ali1234: they have | 19:31 |
| ali1234 | seems like a perfect match | 19:31 |
| alterego | X10 is over power lines. | 19:31 |
| ali1234 | oh, cool. i thought it was | 19:31 |
| ali1234 | but for some reason i thought i was wrong | 19:31 |
| alterego | :) | 19:31 |
| alterego | Lets se if I can find some X10 compatible ics | 19:32 |
| ali1234 | http://arduino.cc/en/Tutorial/x10 | 19:33 |
| alterego | Heh, found the same article ;) | 19:33 |
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| alterego | Very simplistic protocol. | 19:36 |
| alterego | Anyway, that's all food for thought, thanks :) | 19:39 |
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| AndrewFBlack | Hello | 19:47 |
| Stskeeps | lo AndrewFBlack | 19:49 |
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| Stskeeps | AndrewFBlack: http://makeplaylive.com/ | 19:54 |
| AndrewFBlack | Stskeeps: Can I just by the Zenithink C71 tablet add install Mer on it lol | 20:01 |
| AndrewFBlack | looks to be the Tablet the Spark is based on | 20:01 |
| * _av500_ had an allwinner a10 running ICS in his hands yesterday | 20:01 | |
| Stskeeps | AndrewFBlack: probably ;) | 20:02 |
| Stskeeps | _av500_: well, that sounds good for the kernel version | 20:02 |
| _av500_ | Stskeeps: i have seen android run on kernels from the middle ages :) | 20:03 |
| Stskeeps | point | 20:03 |
| _av500_ | kernels are overrated | 20:03 |
| * lbt runs a 2.2 kernel | 20:04 | |
| lbt | 2.2.17 | 20:05 |
| AndrewFBlack | Is the Spark just the Zenithink C71 tablet with Mer on it or does it just look like the Zenithink C71 | 20:06 |
| _av500_ | it is | 20:06 |
| kimju | lbt, some linux based appliance? | 20:06 |
| AndrewFBlack | Don't want to be rude of Spark people are on here by why the big price increase? | 20:06 |
| lbt | kimju: yes. Empeg car stereo | 20:06 |
| lbt | AndrewFBlack: lack of scale | 20:06 |
| _av500_ | lbt: nice :) | 20:07 |
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| * _av500_ should revive his NEO35 car mp3 player | 20:07 | |
| AndrewFBlack | lbt: what do you mean? | 20:07 |
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| _av500_ | AndrewFBlack: smaller order amount | 20:07 |
| _av500_ | only a few geeks | 20:08 |
| lbt | AndrewFBlack: we have little idea of how much it costs to manage a small product in retail. Spark will probably lose money at that price | 20:08 |
| Stskeeps | AndrewFBlack: i think part might be import, in some countries VAT, warranty, etc.. | 20:08 |
| vgrade | _av500_ , was it this one? I can't find a kernel yet | 20:09 |
| AndrewFBlack | lbt: If you ordered then retail for $130 which i've seen them that low. its like a $200 markup to install Free Software. | 20:09 |
| Stskeeps | AndrewFBlack: but yeah, it's a bit of a increase, but you have to calculate in the effort spent on it being pushed back the communities building it | 20:09 |
| Stskeeps | (i'm not involved with it) | 20:10 |
| _av500_ | vgrade: ? | 20:10 |
| lbt | AndrewFBlack: yes it is. And? | 20:10 |
| AndrewFBlack | Stskeeps: yeah I know | 20:10 |
| vgrade | AndrewFBlack, ask aseigo | 20:10 |
| lbt | feel free to buy an Apple :) | 20:10 |
| vgrade | AndrewFBlack, about price | 20:10 |
| vgrade | _av500_, A10 | 20:10 |
| AndrewFBlack | lbt: I have 4 already thanks. I also have every Maemo Tablet ever made :) | 20:10 |
| lbt | AndrewFBlack: there is no way a production run that small can be price competitive | 20:11 |
| lbt | it's just economics | 20:11 |
| lbt | measure it a different way | 20:11 |
| lbt | what's your pay per day? | 20:11 |
| _av500_ | vgrade: some prototype we have | 20:11 |
| lbt | is it worth a few hours of your time to contribute to an open source project? | 20:12 |
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| vgrade | ah, ok. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYHpHKIGqYk | 20:12 |
| lbt | AndrewFBlack: is that a better way to evaluate the cost? | 20:12 |
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| lbt | what will they give you back for your $200? | 20:12 |
| lbt | will they work on opening hw drivers? | 20:12 |
| lbt | so it's not the same equation as buying a mass market device | 20:13 |
| Stskeeps | lbt, you're ranting a bit.. | 20:13 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 20:13 |
| lbt | sorry | 20:13 |
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| Stskeeps | it should be better explained on the spark website reasons for the markup, considering similar model down to the design and colours can be found for a lot less | 20:14 |
| Stskeeps | and they explained this somewhere but i can't find it right now | 20:15 |
| AndrewFBlack | lbt: I guess I just think its a little high markup, but I'm sure users that wouldn't know how to install Mer on it if a version was available for it wouldn't mind paying the extra money. | 20:15 |
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| lbt | AndrewFBlack: yeah - I'm just rather happy to see their approach to the market | 20:16 |
| Stskeeps | actually, they started at 270 USD and now they're saying around 200 | 20:16 |
| Stskeeps | so i think they realised the markup was too high | 20:16 |
| lbt | equally if they got more response and re-evaluated volume they may get better deals | 20:17 |
| AndrewFBlack | Sites doesn't list USD its Euros or GBP cna't remember the symbols lol | 20:17 |
| lbt | Target retail price of €200 | 20:18 |
| Stskeeps | but anyway, the point is: compared to android where you pay with your user data for a 'free system', you instead pay into the communities developing the software | 20:18 |
| Stskeeps | so that's a good reason for the markup, maybe not the best global marketing strategy :) | 20:18 |
| AndrewFBlack | what do you mean pay into the communities developing the software, isn't the money for the tablet just going to the people who are installing the OS on the tablets? | 20:19 |
| vgrade | http://aseigo.blogspot.com/2012/02/spark-answers.html?showComment=1328285201712#c7755173221624518884 | 20:20 |
| Stskeeps | AndrewFBlack: nop, they're pushing them back into plasma active community as an example | 20:20 |
| lbt | fwiw they're looking to fund it all back to OSS | 20:20 |
| Stskeeps | vgrade: ah, there it was | 20:20 |
| Stskeeps | read vgrade's url :) | 20:20 |
| Stskeeps | AndrewFBlack: one example of what they would do could for example be sponsoring servers for mer, as they base on our work | 20:21 |
| AndrewFBlack | Stskeeps: I didn't see that listed anywhere that changes things | 20:21 |
| vgrade | and my Ferrari | 20:21 |
| Stskeeps | AndrewFBlack: :nod: they should be more public about that, and sponsoring vgrade's ferrari | 20:21 |
| lbt | hmm that's a good point - asiego already talked about funding Mer .... I hadn't forgotten but I wasn't thinking of it in this discussion | 20:22 |
| lbt | vgrade: ferrari...? Wuss. Get a Tiv ! | 20:22 |
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| AndrewFBlack | I was thinking someone was buying $130 tablets, taking a few hours to install Mer and Plasma Display and adding $200. | 20:22 |
| Stskeeps | nop, it's bigger than that | 20:23 |
| Stskeeps | or at least if we trust them on their words | 20:23 |
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| AndrewFBlack | I would like to see them offer then to developers at cost, I think that might do more for some people. | 20:24 |
| Stskeeps | they should really note that aspect better | 20:25 |
| lbt | AndrewFBlack: I guess the think is ... how many devs pay full price for apple equipment? | 20:25 |
| lbt | sure there are cases where they should (and will) support developers | 20:26 |
| Stskeeps | AndrewFBlack: i think sadly that for startups giving rebates to developers is not that easy in this economic environment :/ | 20:26 |
| Stskeeps | AndrewFBlack: best thing that they can do is reserve spots in orders so they have them early | 20:26 |
| lbt | but there are plenty of devs who throw a *lot* of money at gadgets and wish they were more open | 20:26 |
| lbt | this is a gadget that *is* more open .... and we want it to be cheaper? | 20:27 |
| vgrade | but the device is aimed at devs | 20:27 |
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| Sage_ | X-Fade: sync ping | 20:29 |
| Stskeeps | either way, it's good to see someone dare to launch anything with mer ;) | 20:30 |
| AndrewFBlack | I have paid for some of my Dev Devices but most I have goten for cheap or free. | 20:30 |
| AndrewFBlack | Stskeeps: I'm happy to see it launch to | 20:30 |
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| Stskeeps | AndrewFBlack: btw, were you into theme design only or into web design to? | 20:32 |
| Stskeeps | o | 20:32 |
| AndrewFBlack | Active Plasma look but I would really perfer goold old hildon I think lol | 20:32 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 20:32 |
| AndrewFBlack | Stskeeps: theme and web design | 20:32 |
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| Stskeeps | you could run cordia on there probably, at least apps side | 20:32 |
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| Stskeeps | AndrewFBlack: if you have any sort of time and if you want to, i'd really appreciate some help on the mer website | 20:33 |
| Stskeeps | it's straight to the point at the moment but not terribly informative | 20:33 |
| Stskeeps | or deep | 20:34 |
| AndrewFBlack | Stskeeps: I have both, you wanting to add some new features to site or just change the look/layout | 20:35 |
| Stskeeps | AndrewFBlack: i think a bit of both, stay with the mer general style but perhaps extend into more sections | 20:36 |
| AndrewFBlack | http://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Website_Ideas some of the ideas you still wanting? | 20:37 |
| Stskeeps | -ish .. this was a guy who came by with some ideas of the website.. it's terribly important to have basic information on the project, even links to wiki at times | 20:38 |
| Stskeeps | so, just for good measure: we're presenting a linux core and we try to refer within the site to the people and contributors within mer, as well as vendors within the mer ecosystem | 20:39 |
| Stskeeps | and giving people enough info to dive into wiki, start using mer, etc | 20:39 |
| Stskeeps | .. as the purpose of the website | 20:39 |
| Stskeeps | we're not trying to present ourselves to endusers, but instead to vendors (companies, ui projects, hardware adaptation efforts, or lone hackers using mer to make a interactive sign) | 20:40 |
| Stskeeps | (just brainstorming) | 20:40 |
| AndrewFBlack | right now there is bugzilla and wiki. Do you want to add any forums? | 20:43 |
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| Stskeeps | no, we have mailing lists | 20:44 |
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| Stskeeps | we have bugzilla, wiki, review.merproject.org | 20:44 |
| AndrewFBlack | Do you want a section that highlights End User Products, Like Nemo and Codia? | 20:44 |
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| Stskeeps | i think some kind of vendor list would be good | 20:45 |
| vgrade | "Powered by Mer Core" | 20:46 |
| Stskeeps | mm? | 20:46 |
| Stskeeps | for example, but vendors can be consultancies within OBS, Mer systems, etc.. | 20:46 |
| AndrewFBlack | Got a preferance on what software runs the website? | 20:46 |
| lbt | should run on debian | 20:47 |
| lbt | easy to install security updates | 20:47 |
| Stskeeps | AndrewFBlack: well, what's your preferred tool? | 20:47 |
| AndrewFBlack | Stskeeps: I normally use Joomla, sometimes Drupal makes for easy theming, can bridge your user database to alot of other things like bugzilla | 20:49 |
| AndrewFBlack | maemo.org uses Migard | 20:50 |
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| lbt | from a functional pov I think we mainly want blog and some content structure | 20:52 |
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| lbt | either drupal or joomla would be perfectly capable - whichever is easier to setup and maintain. | 20:53 |
| AndrewFBlack | Joomla is easier to me. | 20:54 |
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| lbt | one reason for using it for blogs is that chinese can't see mainstream blog services | 20:54 |
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| AndrewFBlack | So we want a blog, information about Mer page, Vendor List, links to wiki and bugzilla. anything else | 20:59 |
| Stskeeps | People, perhaps | 20:59 |
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| lbt | hmm yeah | 21:00 |
| lbt | AndrewFBlack: what's your feeling about django? | 21:00 |
| AndrewFBlack | Never used it | 21:01 |
| lbt | ah well :) | 21:01 |
| Stskeeps | looks heavy | 21:01 |
| Stskeeps | for non-python coders | 21:01 |
| lbt | mmm | 21:01 |
| lbt | there are CMS built with it | 21:02 |
| lbt | and we know it very well (phaeron and I) | 21:02 |
| Stskeeps | that's true, but ideally you two shouldn't be doing web :) | 21:02 |
| lbt | exactly | 21:03 |
| bigbluehat | Stskeeps: I recommend HTML :) | 21:03 |
| lbt | HTML5 surely | 21:03 |
| Stskeeps | i'm inclined towards joomla or drupal, midgard not so much, as it's easier to find people who know how to work with it amongst contributors | 21:03 |
| bigbluehat | ;) | 21:03 |
| bigbluehat | how much do you really need/want? | 21:03 |
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| bigbluehat | basic intro, blog maybe, wiki, etc you already have | 21:03 |
| lbt | bigbluehat: not much at all ... see backlog | 21:04 |
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| bigbluehat | right…saw most of it | 21:04 |
| Stskeeps | still a lot of templating work | 21:04 |
| bigbluehat | I'd recommend plain HTML | 21:04 |
| bigbluehat | and apply the template to everything else | 21:04 |
| Stskeeps | plain html has issues when changing template around ;) | 21:04 |
| bigbluehat | make it a github project :) | 21:04 |
| bigbluehat | and let people fork i | 21:04 |
| bigbluehat | *it | 21:04 |
| lbt | that's an idea | 21:05 |
| bigbluehat | well… http://twitter.github.com/bootstrap | 21:05 |
| lbt | not a good one... but it's an idead :P | 21:05 |
| bigbluehat | heh | 21:05 |
| * Stskeeps should get some sleep | 21:05 | |
| bigbluehat | get some Stskeeps | 21:05 |
| lbt | the first thing is probably a simple css'able view that can work on desktop and device | 21:06 |
| Stskeeps | AndrewFBlack: if you'd like to call a irc meeting to discuss website content you're more than welcome, just lay out some directions and basic templates i guess | 21:06 |
| AndrewFBlack | djangoCMS is based off django it seems | 21:06 |
| lbt | AndrewFBlack: yes | 21:06 |
| Stskeeps | ah, yeah, good point: useful on desktop and device | 21:06 |
| Stskeeps | or at least somehow templateable to fit both | 21:07 |
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| AndrewFBlack | Stskeeps: making it fit both desktop and device is easy with any of the ways we have talked about | 21:09 |
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| AndrewFBlack | bbl | 21:31 |
| lbt | o/ | 21:33 |
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