Saturday, 2012-02-11

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Stskeepstimoph: so it seems like we'll start by bootstrapping the sdk tools within cobs at first06:46
Stskeepswe had some discussion yesterday06:46
Stskeepsand then just extract it into a mer release06:47
timophsounds good06:47
timophso bake a rootfs, build and install tools and go06:48
timophwhat's the sdk tools repo in cobs?06:49
Stskeeps has qemu-usermode, qemu-usermode-static etc now06:49
StskeepsMer:Tools / Mer:Tools:Testing i think06:49
timophI'm thinking can we do all the rootfs setup in a .ks file or does it need additional magic06:51
Stskeepsyeah, i think we can do all the magic in a .ks and provide that06:52
Stskeepsie, the .ks and a tarball06:52
Stskeepsmaybe enter-chroot aloneside06:52
Stskeepsor within06:52
timophyep. that's what I was thinking06:52
Stskeepsi guess within makes sense06:52
timophkeeps the thing simple06:52
Stskeepsi think we can just put enter-chroot in the .ks's %post06:53
Stskeepsalso, it's feb11 today06:57
timophnot sure if I got the purpose of doing mounting in %post06:57
Stskeepsoh, i didn't say mounting06:57
Stskeepsi said put into / of the file system06:57
timophah. just got confused by the script's content :)06:58
Stskeepscat > / << EOF kind of thing06:58
timophyeah. got it now :)06:58
timophthought you wanted to execute it there :)06:59
Stskeeps8 months later and people start checking in with QR tags/nfc tags like i proposed in grande, heh07:00
* Stskeeps really needs to learn how to capitalise his ideas ;)07:00
timophyeah. I've noted that even if you think that the idea isn't worth implementing someone else will like it.07:02
timophhappened to me a couple of times.07:03
Stskeepsi have on occasion considered to utilize the thing that nokia has with patents and ideas, ie, you keep it secret and they try to see if it's patentable, and pay you a one-time thing07:04
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timophmight be something worth trying out07:05
Stskeeps( )07:05
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* timoph needs to make a trip to the store to get some breakfast07:06
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* timoph back07:32
* Stskeeps is studying qtonpi07:41
timophPi will make a nice test bed for Mer07:42
* timoph can't wait to get his hands on it07:42
Stskeepsi think there would be more interest in qtonpi if people understood wtf they have actually made07:42
Stskeepsand what's published already07:43
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Stskeepsit's a fairly minimal qt5 stack07:43
Stskeepsof course i plan on being able to beat that architectually and use-case wise with mer, but .. :)07:43
timophI really should start getting familiar with Qt507:43
Stskeepsmorn araujo, how are things?07:45
* Stskeeps ponders what to work on today07:49
Stskeepstimoph: so what's your plans today?07:50
* timoph asks the better half if she's got anything planned before answering07:51
Stskeepsmine's gone until 5pm :P07:51
timophok. I have time and nothing special planned07:56
timophshe's planning to go skiing07:57
Stskeepsi'm wondering if we should get started on some skeleton platform SDK documentation and then fill in the gaps07:57
Stskeepsie, download this tarball, untar it as root, run enter-chroot..07:57
Stskeepswhat you can do inside it.. etc07:57
timophsounds like a plan07:57
timophdocumentation driven development :p07:58
Stskeepsthat's a new one07:58
Stskeepsyou should patent that ;)07:58
timophbut yeah. I'll be ready to start in about 15 to 30 mins08:00
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Stskeepsi'm not yet at cruising altitude of my caffeine levels either08:02
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Stskeepsmorn vgrade108:18
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timophStskeeps: ok. so do we start adding the docs to the platform sdk wiki page or do a separate page for the manual?08:42
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Stskeepsi think we can start out at the wiki page08:42
Stskeepsor Platform_SDK/Documentation08:42
timophok. usage subsection it is08:42
timophthe whole thing needs a bit of restructuring08:42
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Stskeepsgood morning sonach08:53
sonachStskeeps: morning,too!08:53
Stskeepsi don't have anything new on busybox side just yet, i've been busy with some work regarding cross compilation08:54
Stskeepswe're working a bit on platform SDK this weekend as well, me, lbt, timoph and phaeron08:54
Stskeepswhat are the big problems you're having at the moment?08:56
sonachStskeeps: No big problems at the moment. We can test the busybox stuff when you have time. We change the FLASH to 256MB for all boards now.08:59
timophok. did a little topic level restructuring on the page08:59
* Stskeeps looks08:59
sonachStskeeps: Anyway, the footprint stuff is very important. If we can run our OS on 128MB FLASH, that will be great!08:59
Stskeepsadd "Building an image"08:59
* timoph adds09:00
Stskeepssonach: yeah, i want to make it smaller too, the smaller the OS, the more space for content09:00
vgrade1morning, bowling, back soon09:00
phaerongood morning09:05
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timophhmmh. do we (want to) have a fixed link for a stable sdk rootfs?09:19
Stskeepsi think we will have one with /latest/09:19
timophhelps to put that into the docs so no need to update the links all the time09:20
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Stskeeps /names09:48
timophI'm a bit worried about documenting stuff that isn't there yet10:00
timophmight cause some confusion..10:00
Stskeepsjust write a big fat DRAFT10:03
timophah. that solves it :)10:03
Stskeepsthe more it says draft the more motivated we are to fix it instead of going off a tangent10:03
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timophgot a time table update. I have time until about 3pm EEST10:07
timophso a good 3h10:08
Stskeepshehe, okay10:09
lbtmorning all10:15
* timoph is trying to picture how to document compilation with the sdk10:17
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timophthere's two parts - with sb2 and without it10:17
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lbttimoph: go for normal vs cross10:18
lbtStskeeps: or are we usin sb2 for x86?10:19
Stskeepserrrrrr.. hmmmmm10:19
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Stskeepsideally we'll have same strategy..10:19
Stskeepsit isn't impossible, at all10:19
timophI'd still add some note about being able to compile without sb210:20
lbtthat's what struck me - more "why not" for consistencies sake10:21
* lbt goes back to the git->OBS layer for sdk10:21
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Stskeepsphaeron: so you have an instance of obs up anywhere with my patches?10:29
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lbtwe're going for cfe.merproject.org10:30
Stskeepsok, that sounds wise10:30
Stskeepstest out with fakeobs?10:30
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* lbt tweets the SDK challenge10:33
lbttimoph: so ... where's the docs?10:33
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timophthe platform sdk wiki page :)10:40
* lbt looks for "how to make an sdk rootfs"10:40
Stskeepsusing another sdk, duh10:41
* lbt stabs Stskeeps with a sharpened belgium waffle10:41
Stskeepsbootstrap sdks :)10:41
Stskeepsyou have a .ks at the page, start with that, the idea is that we'll give out a tarball of a prebuilt one10:42
lbtactually we need info on using Mer:Tools:Testing vs Mer:Tools10:42
Stskeepsfirst manually built, then built with sdk10:42
lbtagreed - but we also want the dev process10:42
lbtalso we only have a link to the static ,ks10:43
lbtdid anyone make a git repo yet?10:43
Stskeepsbecause erm, someone didn't want to let me put kickstarter in core10:43
lbtagreed :)10:43
lbtwe have mer-tools now10:43
lbtis that a good place?10:44
Stskeepsbetter, yes10:44
joroiis this a real error or do I miss something "failed to create image : Failed to build transaction : libXcursor-1.1.12-1.2.i586 requires /usr/bin/gtk-update-icon-cache"?10:44
joroion libXcursor.spec is: Requires(post): %{_bindir}/gtk-update-icon-cache10:44
Stskeepsjoroi: upgrade your spectacle10:44
* Stskeeps ponders where sage put that patc10:45
lbtMer:Tools:Testing ?10:45
Stskeepsjoroi: basically spectacle adds gtk-update-icon-cache and we don't have gtk in core10:46
Stskeepsjoroi: is that your own package or something from mer?10:47
Stskeepsok, mer bug10:47
joroithat's my own package, which has libXcursor as a dep10:47
timophso about the sb2 setup.. quessing we'll be offering predefined targets named something like armv7hl, armv6, x86, etc.10:47
Stskeepsjoroi: i'll just file a bug10:47
lbtteach a man to fish...10:48
lbtjoroi: would you like to file a merproject bug?10:48
Stskeepsi need to find spectacle fix first ;)10:48
Stskeepsalso, too late10:48
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StskeepsSage_: where is your spectacle gtk-update-icon-cache patch?10:49
lbtso for the sdk  .ks - do we want to mix any other .ks together or simply have an sdk .ks git repo?10:50
lbtmer-tools/sdk sounds reasonable10:50
Stskeepsi'd say a derived from kickstarter configs thing10:51
Stskeepskeep in mind we don't want a static .ks, we want a kickstarter yaml to keep it in sync with rest of mer core10:51
Stskeepsthat generates .ks'es10:51
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timophsounds sane10:53
Stskeepsfits the N and N+1 story better, too10:54
lbtso ... do we keep vc of the SDK discrete10:54
lbtI think we do10:54
lbtbut to build it we need to define the version of the core yamls to incorporate10:54
lbt(and yes, I do keep saying .ks repo when I should say .yaml)10:55
Stskeepsbtw, N and N+1.. what cross compiler to use? N+1 or N?10:55
lbtM ?10:56
lbtis cross in core?10:56
lbtN then10:56
Stskeepsand SDK should match the toolchain in the core it targets10:56
lbtOK making mer-tools/sdk in 310:57
Stskeepsbad name10:57
Stskeepswhat is the purpose?10:57
Stskeepskickstarter configs?10:57
lbtno, just the yaml/ks to make the .ks for the sdk10:57
Stskeepsthat's kickstarter configs10:57
lbtso it's in the same repo as all the core stuff10:57
lbtah, I misunderstood the objection10:58
lbtyou just don't like the name10:58
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Stskeepsokay, so, buildrequires: mer-kickstarter-configs, place in mer:tools*, add own kickstarter configs that inherits from mer-kickstarter-configs to generate .ks'es for sdk10:58
lbtwasn't even sure if this was a package10:59
Stskeepsit is10:59
lbtit builds an rpm ?10:59
lbtdon't see why11:00
Stskeepsokay.. try to visualize it backwards11:00
lbtit's just a yaml/ks that I feed to mic11:00
Stskeepsmic doesn't take kickstarter configs11:01
Stskeepsmic takes kickstart (.ks) files, .ks is generated by .yaml11:01
Stskeeps(by kickstarter)11:01
lbtso I need mic and kickstarter to make an sdk rootfs11:02
lbtI also need access to all the mer core yamls to expand11:02
Stskeepsright, mer-kickstarter-configs11:02
Stskeeps(in core)11:02
lbtdo they need to be 'installed' using rpm or are they pulled from http repos11:03
Stskeepsso, we can build the .ks'es (the files) in OBS just fine, or just install mer-kickstarter-configs and sdk-kickstarter-configs and generate a .ks with platform sdk11:04
Stskeepstwo ways11:04
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Stskeepsfirst one you'd have to rpm2cpio the .ks'es out of it, second one you have to boot up platform sdk11:05
lbtthe yamls seem to be making the .ks creation process more convoluted11:05
lbtI agree they manage grouping well11:05
lbtbut this is sounding awfully over-complex11:05
Stskeeps'seem', yes, but in practice they are configuration management11:05
Stskeeps.ks'es can't follow an upstream11:05
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Stskeepsand .ks is one-target-one-release practically11:06
lbtI do understand - but I'm seeing reproducability becoming very hard11:07
lbtI'm kinda tempted to vc the results of running kickstarted11:07
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lbtok - what to call the git repo?11:08
Stskeepswe're trying to make kickstarter configurations first, right11:09
lbtyes, that needs to be vc'ed11:09
Stskeepsagreed, so, mer-tools/sdk-kickstarter-configs   , contains only .yaml files, requires: mer-kickstarter-configs11:10
Stskeepsi just want to show you what i did once, sec11:10
Stskeepsfirst one is yaml11:11
Stskeepssecond one generates .ks'es11:11
Stskeepssecond one you can do in OBS, or do within platform sdk, i don't have any particular opinions11:13
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lbtlets see how it goes11:15
lbtin MINT the heavy cycle made iteration difficult and hurt QA - I may be overcompensating from that11:16
lbtthe basic "we use yaml and inherit" is totall sane11:16
Stskeepsgood advertisement11:22
timophthe sdk wiki page could use a sanity check11:33
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Stskeepstimoph: ah, clever idea with preconfiguration11:44
vgradecold out there this morning, what to do today11:46
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Stskeepshello cynamoon11:48
timophStskeeps: thanks.11:48
Stskeepstimoph: though we might need a create-target kind of thing11:48
cynamoonHello everyones11:49
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timophI didn't think too much of how instead of what would be handy11:49
timophoh. I need to go. I'll be around later in the evening11:51
Stskeepssee you11:51
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Stskeepsyello termana11:53
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lbtso Stskeeps... one problem I have with  is that when I add a stanza that says "AMD Athlon" it doesn't magically work12:20
lbtit's very very magical12:20
lbtthe spec doesn't depend on anything ... so I have no clues as to where to look12:21
lbtthere's no links or docs12:21
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lbtit makes it very hard to do any incremental work12:22
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Stskeepslbt: well you naturally need to build image(s) utilizing that change12:23
Stskeepsand yes, documentation is missing12:23
Stskeepsit should be there12:23
lbtdoesn't mention SSSE312:24
Stskeepsit does mention SSSE312:24
lbtI was reading descriptions12:25
lbtok, my apologies12:25
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lbtlack of documentation is rude12:42
* phaeron runs away12:42
lbtyeah, that's how I feel12:42
lbtsure I can follow code... but we don't even use bloody git properly so I can't browse a remote repo ... have to download the tarball, unpack and then look at the code12:43
lbtand that code sucks ass12:43
_av500_so better leave it in the tar ball12:44
_av500_and add feathers12:44
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lbtwell, technically I do - I use emacs to browse the tarball :)12:44
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Stskeeps'mic' is pretty well developed13:40
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phaerongithub not responding .. :D13:47
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Stskeepsis it monday yet?13:53
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phaeronit's back already , only few minutes down14:07
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Stskeepshi HUELK14:12
HUELKStskeeps: salute 0>14:14
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Stskeepshello merious :)14:20
meriousHello there!14:20
Stskeepswelcome :) so what brings you here?14:21
meriousI was wondering if I could get some information about running Plasma Active on the Archos G9 Tablet.14:23
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Stskeepsmerious: i think there's a page on basyskom's pages14:28
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HUELKim getting "failed to open /dev/kmsg for logging" i have CONFIG_DEVTMPFS=y and CONFIG_DEVTMPFS_MOUNT=y so why it is appearing is this a bug14:32
meriousThanks for the pointer Stskeeps14:34
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StskeepsHUELK: probably a race condition as systemd starts udevd14:48
HUELKah ok so i nvm14:49
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Stskeepswhat kernel version / image?14:52
matrixxlbt: Stskeeps: Sage_: dm8tbr: :)14:54
Stskeepsi can't wait to getting back to summer jackets14:55
matrixxme neither14:55
matrixxI could skip winter at all14:55
HUELKStskeep: kernel version 3.2.2 image from this ks:
StskeepsHUELK: ok, should be okay14:56
StskeepsHUELK: file a bug on please14:57
HUELKwhat size has the mer source code14:58
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vgradeStskeeps, lbt,
vgradeI was hoping to attend for a day. A good time to discuss future COBS?15:40
Stskeepsmaybe, but my march is a total unknown15:40
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lbtStskeeps: could you jot down the process for doing a couple of iterative hack/build cycles on mer-kickstarter-configs and verifying the effect by building the .ks files16:08
lbtassuming a few syntax errors and stuff16:09
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Stskeepslbt: bogna's about to come home so no guarantees16:14
Stskeeps(read: cooking)16:14
lbtnp - I only have another 30m myself16:15
Stskeepshow's the git side of things looking?16:15
lbtrather tidy16:15
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lbtwe can add an orphan packaging branch to either an upstream git tree or a pristine-tar tree16:16
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lbtthat takes a sha1 pair and makes a tarball and patchset16:16
lbtcan be a null patchset16:16
Stskeepsi'd like to see how gerrit reacts to pristine-branch stuff16:17
lbtthat will look like a checkout from our existing git trees16:17
Stskeepser, tar16:17
lbtyeah - gerrit's reaction is uncertain16:17
lbtI worry about what happens when I push a change with say 10 commits16:18
lbtbut lets worry about that in a bit16:18
* Stskeeps discovers dark dusty corners of rpm he can use16:21
* lbt shudders16:22
timophdamn there's a weird looking guy in the mirror16:23
* timoph shaved16:23
Stskeepsyou must look almost human now ;)16:23
timophalmost :p16:23
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lbtStskeeps:  uses "PostScripts:" for both cases16:57
Stskeepsyeah, that's a fluke16:59
lbttypo I assumed17:00
* Stskeeps fixes17:00
lbtcan we comment ythis yaml?17:01
Stskeepsthe mer one?17:02
Stskeepsyes, we can17:02
Stskeepsbut i'm not going to do that now :P17:02
lbtno :)17:02
lbtI meant are comments permitted in the yaml17:02
Stskeepsyes, they are17:03
lbtstart of line only I guess17:03
Stskeepsnot so sure about that17:03
Stskeepsi'd have to see the parser17:03
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Stskeepsi need some obscure codename for a project, any good ideas?17:42
Stskeepsit's for the toolchain-core split17:42
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Stskeepsmm nah17:43
timophlbt: any idea why that fails to build? Thinking it would be a easy way to provide the latest ks files in the sdk.17:56
lbtyat - yet another toolchain17:56
timophone would just install to configs and build away17:56
lbtmissing : on Mer internet connectivity line - d'oh17:57
lbtpushing fix17:58
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lbtthen off out (again)17:58
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araujoStskeeps, things go good here, how about you? :)18:16
Stskeepsaraujo: i'm good, just happy to be in one city more than a week..18:18
Stskeeps<- sick of traveling for at least a few weeks18:19
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* Stskeeps fights with rpm cross compile18:30
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Sage_matrixx: :)19:16
Sage_Stskeeps: that patch is in upstream19:17
Sage_0.23 version contains that patch19:17
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Stskeepsso we should merge that into mer:tools19:17
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Stskeepsevening Meizirkki19:23
MeizirkkiHello Stskeeps19:23
Stskeepshow's your weekend so far?19:23
Stskeepsgood, getting some hacking done i've been wanting to do for a while19:24
MeizirkkiI finally got another n81019:25
Stskeepswell the other one was quite destroyed19:26
MeizirkkiWhich kicks ass comparing to Touchbook, android and ipod19:26
Stskeepstouchbook i can believe ;)19:26
MeizirkkiI was lucky to receive one :D19:26
harbaumI also still have a toucbook ....19:26
Stskeepsshould be able to run mer, i guess19:27
harbaumyeah, very likely. after all it's really close to the beagle19:27
MeizirkkiThere are many 7" ARM Cortex-A9 tablets for sale in dealextreme.. anybody here familiar with any of them?19:28
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Stskeepsmany of them 'forget' to include kernel source19:29
Stskeepsdid you see Spark?19:29
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Meizirkki_ffs i'm stupid19:31
Meizirkki_I pulled off the modem to replug memorycard19:32
Meizirkki_did I miss anything after <Stskeeps>
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Meizirkki_hmm. spark looks cool19:34
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Stskeepsmer-based, too19:38
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meriousHello all. I have a question and would appreciate your inputs. I have a QtQuick application which I would like to test on a tablet. What tablet would you suggest which is relatively inexpensive and fulfills the minimum conditions for running a QML application?19:57
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Stskeepswhat country are you in?20:09
meriousWho me?20:12
Stskeepsfor example if you were in US, nook color runs mer20:15
RaYmAnaren't there any cheap chinese tablets running Mer yet? =P20:16
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meriousI am Germany20:20
meriousWe have the WeTab here that runs MeeGo but the pricing starts from 350 Euros20:21
meriousI was wondering if I could find a tablet that can run some minimal linux distro and just run my application on that.20:22
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meriousI thought that would be easy to find but doesn't seem like it.. :-(20:22
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Stskeepsmerious: wetab runs mer too20:24
meriousYes.. but it is expensive..20:24
Stskeepscheck out community workspace20:24
Stskeepssee what is useful there20:25
meriousor let's put it this way, I can do with a tablet that is less powerful20:25
meriouscool thanks.. I'll check it out20:25
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vgrademerious, RaspberryPi20:49
vgradeoh sorry , tablet20:49
crevetorhey vgrade there ?20:52
crevetorvgrade: what were you saying about evdev/mtdev yesterday ?20:54
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vgradecrevetor, just asked what you hade configured for input devices in xorg conf evdev or mtev20:58
crevetorvgrade: I have evdev but when I boot PA it says it's skipping my touchscreen because it's not a touch device...20:59
vgrademtev seems to work for me with a few android tablets21:00
crevetorvgrade: is there a package somewhere ?21:00
vgradeyea just replace mtev with evdev in your kickstart and xorg21:01
vgradesorry other way around21:01
vgradecould you pastie your ks?21:01
crevetorvgrade: I don't have a ks yet, I'm putting together bits and pieces :)21:05
vgradeok ,  let me do a search for it21:07
crevetorvgrade: I found it21:11
crevetorvgrade: Now it seems it added it to the devices it listens to but I can't interact with the interface21:11
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crevetorvgrade: Ok I was able to get it to work. But PA ends up crashing21:16
crevetorI'll build a full clean dist and see if that works better. Thanks for your help21:16
vgradeno probs21:19
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HUELKcan someone provide me a link how to setup connman from console21:45
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HUELKStskeep: i have mer up on slate 50021:56
phaeronyou mean how to make it connect ?21:59
vgradeHUELK, have you tried /usr/lib/connman/test/connect-service <SSID> <Password>22:08
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crevetorvgrade: still there ?22:18
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vgradecrevetor, yea22:31
crevetorI'm trying to create an image using mic-image-creator22:33
crevetorbut in the bootstrap process it tries to grab ia32 packages instead of i58622:33
crevetorI get : Error: Failed to create bootstrap : URLGrabber error: [Errno 14] HTTP Error 404 : :
vgradewhat guide are you using?22:35
vgradethere has been some new documentation so we should be using that22:36
crevetorthis :
vgradeI think there is Mer stuff now on the mer wiki, sec22:36
vgrade, not sure how different it is but if we find problems with that we can raise bugs22:38
vgradeso looks like sudo mic-create-bootstrap -n trunk -k /your/repo/cache/path -r -o /your/final/bootstrap to buld the bootstrap22:39
vgradethen udo mic-image-creator --bootstrap=/your/final/bootstrap --format=livecd --config=default.ks --cache=/your/repo/cache/path to build the image22:39
crevetorI'll try that out22:39
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Venemo_N950my Mer T-shirt is awesome!23:10
crevetorHow do I do if I want to buy one ?23:14
Venemo_N950crevetor, a guy was selling them a few weeks ago, not sure if he still has some or not23:15
crevetorVenemo_N950: did you get yours at fosdem ?23:16
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Venemo_N950crevetor, no, he was kind enough to send it to me23:18
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