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| phaeron | g'night | 00:09 |
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| lbt | o/ | 00:23 |
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| Khaled | I heard that tegra and omap are the easiest to port to | 01:59 |
| wmarone_ | yes you did, about a day ago | 02:00 |
| wmarone_ | or was it two? | 02:00 |
| Khaled | according to reviwers the transformer prime is the best tablet thats no the ipad | 02:00 |
| Khaled | we really need to work on that whih is tegra3 | 02:01 |
| wmarone_ | we? | 02:01 |
| Khaled | I mean whoever is porting to non nokia devices this should be the tablet of focus | 02:02 |
| wmarone_ | anyone can try to port to a device if they wish | 02:03 |
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| wmarone_ | the transformer prime is currently crippled with a signed and locked bootloader | 02:04 |
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| Khaled | really? | 02:11 |
| Khaled | I belive asus said they will get it unlocked | 02:11 |
| wmarone_ | yes, sometime this month | 02:12 |
| wmarone_ | no point in looking at it until then, no urge to buy a device that's crippled like that | 02:13 |
| Khaled | but it is currently the best so no efforts should be wasted on medicore tablets | 02:14 |
| wmarone_ | I don't have one so I don't particularly care | 02:15 |
| Khaled | what is the most usable tablet running mer right now? | 02:15 |
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| wmarone_ | wetab I suspect | 02:24 |
| wmarone_ | everything else is still experimental or being worked on | 02:24 |
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| Khaled | wetab? wasnt that fromwi | 02:37 |
| Khaled | witito? | 02:37 |
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| Stskeeps | Khaled: i just woke up at 4am for no reason, but: there's no preferential devices in Mer and we don't have specific hardware focuses, people can waste their time on random hardware all they want, it doesn't hold back the core | 02:52 |
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| Stskeeps | morn | 05:43 |
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| Stskeeps | lbt: systemd usage in what context? OBS?? | 05:51 |
| Alison_Chaiken | Just was looking at the merproject main web page. Wow, it's beautiful! Hats off to whoever designed it. | 05:54 |
| Stskeeps | we had old artwork so that was reused (logo, background), and the web page design is by someone off the street who came by and contributed it | 05:56 |
| Stskeeps | but yeah, it's beautiful artwork, i just wish sometimes i had http://wiki.maemo.org/Image:Mer_Wazd_Wallpaper_Nokian_Ship.jpg in higher resolution ;) | 05:57 |
| timoph | it is | 06:00 |
| * timoph uses it as his desktop background | 06:00 | |
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| Alison_Chaiken | I think I see Steven Elop there at the helm. | 06:18 |
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| Stskeeps | himamura_: ping | 06:45 |
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| Stskeeps | Khaled: there's no preferential devices in Mer and we don't have specific hardware focuses, people can waste their time on random hardware all they want. we don't push a certain piece of hardware and will not, as it will skew things | 06:56 |
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| Stskeeps | and of course he's not around :P | 06:58 |
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| Stskeeps | splitnode | 07:04 |
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| Stskeeps | timoph_: btw, platform SDK and tools repo is on my schedule for this weekend | 07:25 |
| timoph_ | cool | 07:25 |
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| Sage_ | lbt: I just have to love your kernel config check script :) | 07:39 |
| Sage_ | That is so nice | 07:40 |
| Stskeeps | if username == 'sage': fail() ? | 07:40 |
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| timoph | :D | 07:40 |
| Sage_ | if user_didnt_check_options == fail :) | 07:40 |
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| Sage_ | Stskeeps: I think that was close as well ;) | 07:41 |
| Sage_ | timoph: http://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Contribution_in_detail#Feedback ;) | 07:42 |
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| timoph | Sage_: x) | 07:43 |
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| Sage_ | lbt: seen this happening before http://pastie.org/3353169 with the new kernel packaging? | 07:47 |
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| * Stskeeps submits his SB2-OBS patches for review | 08:34 | |
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| Stskeeps | posted my SB2-OBS patches for review, http://lists.opensuse.org/opensuse-buildservice/2012-02/msg00051.html | 08:37 |
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| * Stskeeps ponders idly if lbt_ is awake | 08:44 | |
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| * rantom boots N900 with Mer on it, opens bugzilla and makes some coffee | 09:01 | |
| rantom | s/Mer/Nemo | 09:01 |
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| * Sage_ starts waiting for bug reports from rantom | 09:03 | |
| rantom | :) | 09:05 |
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| Sage_ | Stskeeps: looks good | 09:13 |
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| Stskeeps | quite satisfied with this release so far, http://pastie.org/3353482 | 09:16 |
| lbt_ | morning Stskeeps ... awake now.... ish | 09:17 |
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| Stskeeps | lbt_: what was the systemd issues you were having? | 09:17 |
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| lbt_ | on suse | 09:17 |
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| Stskeeps | yes, but in what context? | 09:17 |
| Stskeeps | OBS? | 09:17 |
| lbt | no | 09:17 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 09:17 |
| lbt | starting apache as a systemd daemon | 09:17 |
| lbt | and having to look in /var/log/messages for apache errors | 09:18 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 09:18 |
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| lbt | just getting used to that kind of change is all | 09:18 |
| lbt | mainly a real PITA when you just need to get stuff done :) | 09:19 |
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| Stskeeps | :nod: | 09:19 |
| Stskeeps | i've rebased my sb2-obs patches and mailed them upstream | 09:20 |
| Stskeeps | for review/comments | 09:20 |
| Stskeeps | next step is cobs/mer obs deployment of the packaging | 09:20 |
| lbt | phaeron did a lot of that last night | 09:20 |
| lbt | I have a couple of vms on the slx machine | 09:20 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 09:20 |
| lbt | so we can do trial deployments | 09:20 |
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| Stskeeps | i also exported 0.0.3 which i will officially announce once we have all the pieces in place | 09:21 |
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| lbt | riht | 09:21 |
| lbt | g | 09:21 |
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| lbt | I need to make coffee and clear the driveway of snow | 09:22 |
| Stskeeps | i was pondering on coffee too | 09:22 |
| lbt | bbiab then | 09:22 |
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| lbt | phew | 09:52 |
| * Stskeeps offers lbt hot chocolate | 09:53 | |
| lbt | oddly iced-tea feels more like it :) | 09:54 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 09:54 |
| lbt | but yay for automation !! | 09:54 |
| Stskeeps | i'm pondering how to structure tools in mer | 09:55 |
| Stskeeps | seperate obs project, for sure, | 09:55 |
| Stskeeps | .. built against the mer targets? | 09:55 |
| lbt | nah | 09:56 |
| lbt | obs builds against suse | 09:56 |
| Stskeeps | nah? | 09:56 |
| Stskeeps | mm | 09:56 |
| Stskeeps | so we need a split, tools and tools:sdk and tools:useful? | 09:56 |
| lbt | so.... why? | 09:56 |
| Stskeeps | well, okay, so, i'd like to get platform sdk on the road this weekend | 09:56 |
| Stskeeps | and release it alongside next mer release | 09:57 |
| lbt | what criteria do we use to split? | 09:57 |
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| lbt | yep, I agree with that | 09:57 |
| lbt | morning bergie | 09:57 |
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| Stskeeps | that means we need to put https://build.pub.meego.com/project/packages?project=home%3Astskeeps%3Atools somewhere, so CI-obs can use them | 09:58 |
| lbt | we do want tools that run in build vs tools that run on device | 09:58 |
| lbt | eg gfx-checks | 09:58 |
| lbt | Mer:Tools iirc | 09:58 |
| lbt | https://build.pub.meego.com/project/packages?project=Mer%3ATools:Testing | 09:59 |
| Stskeeps | ok, so Mer:Tools build not only for Mer? | 09:59 |
| Stskeeps | and typically non-target | 09:59 |
| Stskeeps | how do we want to adminster them? put them in fakeobs + git? | 10:01 |
| Stskeeps | or treat 'tools' as a vendor | 10:01 |
| lbt | no. not a vendor | 10:01 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 10:01 |
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| lbt | I think we should have the majority built against Mer | 10:01 |
| lbt | to run in the sdk | 10:01 |
| lbt | there may be one or two that build against other distros but I think that's too costly for us | 10:02 |
| Stskeeps | so, if it has to get released alongside mer, i should have them in git and a seperate obs project | 10:02 |
| Stskeeps | and we submit changes like we do with core | 10:02 |
| lbt | we should think about what we mean by the SDK and released alongside | 10:02 |
| lbt | version N+1 of Mer should use the version N of the SDKK | 10:03 |
| lbt | use==be built by/on | 10:03 |
| lbt | Mer, not Tools | 10:03 |
| lbt | we may need to release Tools during a Mer cycle | 10:03 |
| lbt | so I see them discrete | 10:03 |
| lbt | independent but usually synchronised | 10:04 |
| Stskeeps | any good reason for N+1 and N? and define 'built by' | 10:04 |
| bergie | hi lbt | 10:04 |
| lbt | the SDK on my desktop and in the IMG and OBS workers is version N | 10:05 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, okay | 10:05 |
| Stskeeps | OBS workers? | 10:06 |
| Stskeeps | thinking build and obs? | 10:06 |
| lbt | mmm ISTR something that made me think that | 10:07 |
| lbt | but it may not make sense | 10:07 |
| Stskeeps | it can make sense to some degree | 10:07 |
| Stskeeps | but okay, i understand why N and N+1 makes sense now | 10:07 |
| lbt | and actually that should be fairly easy to do | 10:08 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, that's what you think.. | 10:08 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 10:08 |
| lbt | hehe | 10:08 |
| lbt | well, it should be ... if it's not that's a bug | 10:08 |
| lbt | but... moving on | 10:09 |
| Stskeeps | long story short i don't currently have access to latest binaries from last full release in my CI obs | 10:09 |
| Stskeeps | i can get it, but i don't currently | 10:09 |
| lbt | OK... | 10:09 |
| lbt | nb repo.ci.merproject.org exists | 10:09 |
| lbt | it's on the IMG phost | 10:10 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, i know | 10:10 |
| lbt | OK | 10:10 |
| lbt | http://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Mer_OBS_Build | 10:10 |
| lbt | the last section | 10:10 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 10:10 |
| lbt | we should do that from a true Mer git for every tool | 10:11 |
| Stskeeps | ish, some things we might want to actually be close to upstream? | 10:11 |
| lbt | day 1 I don't care if it's a no-hist repo made from a tarball | 10:11 |
| lbt | we should have a public git clone for mer though | 10:12 |
| Stskeeps | ('mic' as an example) | 10:12 |
| lbt | gerrit managed | 10:12 |
| Stskeeps | mm | 10:12 |
| lbt | and cloned from upstream | 10:12 |
| lbt | with perdiodic pulls from upstream | 10:12 |
| Stskeeps | just remember to keep it easy to track :) | 10:12 |
| lbt | yeah - this should be how core ends up too | 10:13 |
| lbt | but the important thing is to make some git repos | 10:13 |
| lbt | then git -> tarball -> obs | 10:14 |
| Stskeeps | is N and N+1 important for first stage platform sdk? | 10:15 |
| Stskeeps | i can see some items that i need to do before we can do N and N+1 sanely in ci-obs | 10:16 |
| lbt | my biggest problem with our MINT project when I put a mgmt hat on was overview | 10:16 |
| Stskeeps | which i need to do anyway, but i think it's important we do platform sdk release first | 10:16 |
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| lbt | oh, sorry, I'd scrolled up and missed that | 10:16 |
| lbt | N and N+1.... hmm | 10:17 |
| Stskeeps | it has to match the release for sure, yes | 10:17 |
| lbt | I don't mind building Tools in c.obs | 10:17 |
| lbt | manual process | 10:17 |
| Sage_ | lbt: https://build.pub.meego.com/package/view_file?file=kernel-adaptation-pc.spec&package=kernel-adaptation-pc&project=home%3Asage%3Abranches%3ACE%3AAdaptation%3Ax86-generic&srcmd5=c4476026649a41320ba885ade00f2d10 line 115 | 10:17 |
| lbt | even using cobs boss | 10:17 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: does repo.pub support rsync? | 10:18 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 10:18 |
| Sage_ | lbt: had to remove srctree and objtree to get it to install modules | 10:18 |
| lbt | Sage_: OK ... will look at that - thanks | 10:18 |
| lbt | Stskeeps: yes | 10:18 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 10:18 |
| Stskeeps | also externally? | 10:18 |
| lbt | I have root on everything | 10:19 |
| Stskeeps | ok, we can script something that pulls SDK from COBS and puts it alongside a release when it has built for the release then | 10:19 |
| lbt | do you mean to permit anyone to rsync? | 10:19 |
| Stskeeps | or just limited ips (monster..) | 10:20 |
| Stskeeps | i can live with that until we sort out some other stuf | 10:20 |
| Stskeeps | f | 10:20 |
| lbt | yes | 10:20 |
| lbt | yep - so all that is tedious operational stuff | 10:20 |
| lbt | OK .. so I was saying about overview | 10:21 |
| lbt | the tools space is actually quite fast-paced compared to much of core upstream | 10:21 |
| lbt | god help us if we use ruby where they have restless-fingers-syndrome | 10:22 |
| lbt | so tracking versions in Tools vs Testing was a pita - and when we had dependencies that was even worse | 10:22 |
| lbt | eg a deepish python lib change | 10:23 |
| lbt | I also found that many packages were simply ports with no real changes | 10:23 |
| lbt | so splitting into modified and vanilla was helpful | 10:24 |
| lbt | but I'd want phaeron's advice there | 10:24 |
| phaeron | *yawn* | 10:24 |
| Stskeeps | morn phaeron | 10:24 |
| phaeron | morning | 10:24 |
| lbt | when he's had coffee | 10:24 |
| lbt | and only if he's not grumpy :D | 10:24 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: your copy-whole-project thing, it's basically "copy project A with meta, packages, everything to new project B"? | 10:25 |
| phaeron | not meta | 10:26 |
| Stskeeps | but package meta, i would hope | 10:26 |
| phaeron | yes pkg meta afair | 10:26 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 10:26 |
| Stskeeps | and binaries too? | 10:28 |
| phaeron | yes | 10:28 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 10:28 |
| lbt | have you seen adrian's release and maintenance stuff | 10:29 |
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| Stskeeps | yes was in the talk | 10:29 |
| lbt | I missed that talk | 10:30 |
| phaeron | it's nice but It's going to be difficult to apply if we don't understand it well | 10:32 |
| phaeron | and we need to buy in more into their ideas | 10:32 |
| lbt | yeah - http://doc.opensuse.org/products/draft/OBS/obs-reference-guide_draft/cha.obs.maintenance_setup.html | 10:33 |
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| lbt | fyi snow automation: http://www.flickr.com/photos/96141280@N00/6850879245/in/photostream | 10:34 |
| lbt | then http://www.flickr.com/photos/96141280@N00/6850881871/in/photostream | 10:34 |
| lbt | then http://www.flickr.com/photos/96141280@N00/6850884491/in/photostream | 10:34 |
| * Stskeeps puts a 'geek' sticker on lbt | 10:34 | |
| Stskeeps | hacking reality | 10:35 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 10:35 |
| lbt | I like that phrase :) | 10:35 |
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| * Stskeeps looks at the sunny day outside | 10:39 | |
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| lbt | yep - we have blue skies now | 10:40 |
| lbt | and even better, the part to fix my coffee maker arrived! | 10:41 |
| lbt | so ... SDK | 10:41 |
| lbt | I'm thinking about git | 10:42 |
| lbt | I think we should aim to build the initial Tools from 'random' git repos | 10:42 |
| lbt | which will not be retained forever | 10:42 |
| lbt | so the first release of Tools will be archived | 10:43 |
| lbt | but not recreatable from git | 10:43 |
| lbt | this permits us to JFDI | 10:43 |
| lbt | and then blat the git repo when we know what we should have done | 10:43 |
| lbt | it's not ideal but we're not at the stage where it really matters | 10:44 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 10:44 |
| lbt | so step 1 is to go into gerrit and make mer-tools/* for all the things we have | 10:44 |
| lbt | ie https://build.pub.meego.com/project/packages?project=Mer%3ATools:Testing | 10:45 |
| lbt | andre__: ping .. post-office run soon - address required :) | 10:47 |
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| Stskeeps | phaeron: did i say that i rebased my patches and now is on top of mainline, in github.com/stskeeps ? | 11:01 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: oh.. didn't catch that | 11:01 |
| phaeron | will snapshot | 11:02 |
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| Stskeeps | i might have forgotten to say | 11:02 |
| Stskeeps | i'm having a bit of a 'would prefer to be out in the sun' day :P | 11:02 |
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| Stskeeps | lbt: and we agree mer-tools/ would be packaging, in style of mer-core/ ? | 11:03 |
| lbt | that wasn't what I had in mind | 11:04 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: same here , it's surprisingly clear sky | 11:04 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: okay, what did you have in mind then? | 11:04 |
| lbt | what phaeron did for OBS | 11:04 |
| lbt | http://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Mer_OBS_Build | 11:05 |
| lbt | git archive --prefix=build-service-$VERSION/ $BRANCH_OR_TAG | bzip2 - > ../obs-server-$VERSION.tar.bz2 | 11:05 |
| Stskeeps | mmkay | 11:05 |
| lbt | I know | 11:05 |
| lbt | but it's the sane way to go | 11:05 |
| Stskeeps | as long as you make it in such a way that i can eventually use fakeobs against it, ok | 11:05 |
| lbt | I'm sure we'll make fakeobs work against it yes :P | 11:06 |
| * lbt ducks | 11:06 | |
| Stskeeps | lbt: you have admin access, go ahead | 11:07 |
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| lbt | so let me just check IMG is done+dusted | 11:07 |
| lbt | I think I need to add ldap and some httpd level ldapauth | 11:07 |
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| lbt | setup ci-repo rsync | 11:08 |
| Stskeeps | the approach used must not take over a screenful of explanations to commit a single fix, on top of our current gerrit instructions | 11:08 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 11:08 |
| Stskeeps | ie, not too much complexity | 11:08 |
| lbt | agreed | 11:09 |
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| lbt | I will say that the first priority is just to get the code working | 11:10 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 11:10 |
| Stskeeps | i want to see a rpm repo at the end of this weekend ideally | 11:11 |
| Stskeeps | that we can plug into a .ks | 11:11 |
| lbt | yep | 11:11 |
| * lbt gets his head down | 11:11 | |
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| phaeron | I wish we could configure our OBS to do something useful with the Release: tag | 11:14 |
| Stskeeps | define useful | 11:14 |
| phaeron | like add it to the rpm name | 11:14 |
| * lbt pricks up ears... | 11:14 | |
| phaeron | I put the short sha1sum there | 11:15 |
| Stskeeps | why not use a macro in Version: ? | 11:15 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 11:15 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: because it complicates the build process | 11:15 |
| phaeron | I don't want to change the spec that much | 11:15 |
| lbt | bugs 91 110 111 | 11:16 |
| phaeron | I will need to change tarball name , %setup possibly other places in the spec | 11:16 |
| Stskeeps | %{version} | 11:16 |
| phaeron | yes that macro is used in Source: | 11:17 |
| Stskeeps | and in %setup etc | 11:18 |
| phaeron | ,, lazy | 11:19 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 11:19 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: error: File not found: /usr/src/packages/BUILDROOT/obs-server-2.2.120-213.1.i386/usr/lib/obs/server/BSCando.pm | 11:20 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: from your git master | 11:20 |
| Stskeeps | hmm | 11:21 |
| Stskeeps | added a day ago | 11:21 |
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| * Stskeeps ponders how to do this without breaking his sb2-obs stuff in review | 11:23 | |
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| Stskeeps | phaeron: problem must exist in upstream | 11:31 |
| Stskeeps | https://github.com/openSUSE/open-build-service/commits/master vs https://github.com/stskeeps/open-build-service/commits/master | 11:31 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: not in their master branch .. | 11:31 |
| phaeron | looking | 11:32 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: https://github.com/openSUSE/open-build-service/tree/master/src/backend | 11:33 |
| phaeron | the file is there | 11:33 |
| Stskeeps | it is | 11:33 |
| Stskeeps | so is it in mine | 11:33 |
| phaeron | wait | 11:33 |
| phaeron | you have your own fork ? | 11:33 |
| phaeron | what about Merproject's fork | 11:34 |
| Stskeeps | i haven't pushed to that one yet | 11:35 |
| Stskeeps | but yes, i have one as i'm going to upstream into main obs probably | 11:36 |
| Stskeeps | i just need someone to package up the stuff so we can validate this :) | 11:37 |
| Stskeeps | (the stuff being sb2-obs) | 11:37 |
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| Stskeeps | we'd probably be using merproject eventually | 11:38 |
| phaeron | ok sorry about the confusion will package that | 11:40 |
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| Stskeeps | np | 11:48 |
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| Stskeeps | phaeron: i think in our 'merproject' branch we can keep stuff like transparent prjconfs, copy-whole-project, sb2-obs until upstreamed | 11:59 |
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| phaeron | that's what I expected , we collect work there and use it | 12:00 |
| Stskeeps | and then have that there eventually | 12:00 |
| * Stskeeps ponders how to pull from upstream to merproject | 12:01 | |
| * lbt votes for a rebase | 12:01 | |
| Stskeeps | git pull --rebase ? | 12:02 |
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| lbt | think so | 12:02 |
| lbt | so if we have upstream 11.3 + mer patches thats 11.3mer branch | 12:02 |
| lbt | 2.3 | 12:02 |
| phaeron | git remote add upstream giturl ; git fetch upstream ; git rebase master upstream/master | 12:03 |
| lbt | then if they release 2.4 we make 2.4mer branch as a rebase of patches over 2.4 | 12:03 |
| phaeron | Illegal char '-' in: Version: | 12:04 |
| lbt | hehe | 12:04 |
| phaeron | what else can I use there ? | 12:04 |
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| Stskeeps | ~git | 12:04 |
| phaeron | '.' ? | 12:04 |
| lbt | _ | 12:04 |
| phaeron | ok .. | 12:04 |
| lbt | our machines don't do well with massive traffic spikes | 12:05 |
| Stskeeps | the meego.com ones? | 12:05 |
| Stskeeps | or mer | 12:05 |
| lbt | mer | 12:05 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 12:05 |
| Stskeeps | sure it isn't I/O instead? | 12:06 |
| lbt | like rsync of ci -> repo | 12:06 |
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| Stskeeps | phaeron: and then git push ..? | 12:09 |
| phaeron | if the rebase went ok yes : git push origin master | 12:10 |
| Stskeeps | http://pastie.org/3354202 | 12:12 |
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| lbt | http://repo.ci.merproject.org/repos/ is coming along | 12:13 |
| Stskeeps | just recall that we do a fair bit of repo preprocessing in release making | 12:14 |
| Stskeeps | err | 12:14 |
| lbt | http://repo.ci.merproject.org/ | 12:14 |
| Stskeeps | postprocessing | 12:14 |
| Stskeeps | ie, you're testing against the non-postprocessed stuff | 12:14 |
| lbt | mmm | 12:15 |
| lbt | so we need to do a 'release' in order to do a QA image build? | 12:15 |
| Stskeeps | right | 12:15 |
| lbt | eww | 12:15 |
| Stskeeps | well it is the release you're supposed to QA ;) | 12:15 |
| lbt | How is that going to work then? | 12:17 |
| Stskeeps | well, your favourite solution | 12:17 |
| Stskeeps | BOSS, of course | 12:17 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 12:17 |
| lbt | OK - so merging the DBC into a transient release | 12:18 |
| Stskeeps | i need to do some drawing but i plan on using phaeron's copy-project stuff | 12:18 |
| lbt | mmm | 12:19 |
| lbt | I'm thinking of the non-cacheability of that from IMG PoV | 12:19 |
| lbt | OK - this is too much for today | 12:20 |
| lbt | the task was to get IMG up | 12:20 |
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| Stskeeps | if IMG can build images, i'm happy | 12:20 |
| lbt | yeah - DBC images come later | 12:20 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 12:20 |
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| Stskeeps | lbt: so you'll take lead on the mer:tools stuff and i'll help with ways to get it onto releases.merproject.org when time comes during the weekend? | 12:29 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: Illegal char '~' in: Version: Â Â 2.2.120~git7fced08 | 12:35 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: ignore obs's source services | 12:35 |
| Stskeeps | / validation | 12:35 |
| phaeron | that is on the server | 12:35 |
| Stskeeps | ~ is perfectly legal in meego/mer | 12:35 |
| Stskeeps | ah.. | 12:35 |
| Stskeeps | but not in opensuse.. | 12:35 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 12:35 |
| phaeron | grr | 12:35 |
| lbt | Stskeeps: sounds good | 12:41 |
| * lbt is however wondering if having repo on the IMG machine was all that bright ... | 12:42 | |
| lbt | meh ... | 12:42 |
| Stskeeps | how much space? | 12:42 |
| lbt | I gave it 50G | 12:43 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron, lbt: http://pastie.org/3354202 -- what goes wrong here? | 12:43 |
| lbt | where? | 12:44 |
| lbt | ah you're applying upstream onto your branch | 12:44 |
| Stskeeps | well, i'm trying to fetch obs upstream, and push to my own repo | 12:44 |
| lbt | the rebase is wrong | 12:45 |
| Stskeeps | okay | 12:47 |
| Stskeeps | so what should i do instead? | 12:47 |
| lbt | assuming local master is tracking upstream master then git pull master; git push origin master | 12:47 |
| lbt | git pull upstream master sorry | 12:47 |
| lbt | I assume master should contain no local commits | 12:48 |
| phaeron | he's using master for his work | 12:48 |
| phaeron | ok https://build.pub.meego.com/package/binaries?package=obs-server&project=Mer%3AOBS%3ATesting%3ADevel&repository=openSUSE_11.4 | 12:49 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: it might just be telling you that origin master is same as your local master | 12:49 |
| phaeron | so nothing to push | 12:49 |
| phaeron | http://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Mer_OBS_Build#Mer_OBS_Build | 12:49 |
| phaeron | updated the script | 12:49 |
| phaeron | *cricket* | 12:54 |
| Stskeeps | cool | 12:55 |
| Stskeeps | so we have a obs build? | 12:56 |
| Stskeeps | and of osc and 'build' too? | 12:56 |
| phaeron | not osc and build | 12:57 |
| phaeron | didn't know we need those too | 12:57 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 12:57 |
| Stskeeps | build we need | 12:57 |
| phaeron | but osc should go to :Tools | 12:57 |
| Stskeeps | osc we kinda need of the reason that i had to patch it for local obs builds of sb2 | 12:57 |
| phaeron | I'll do build | 12:57 |
| Stskeeps | which annoyed me a bit :) | 12:57 |
| Sage_ | \o/ | 13:04 |
| Sage_ | systemd 41 and udev 181 and the bootspeed regression seems gone | 13:04 |
| Stskeeps | yay | 13:04 |
| Sage_ | actually boot speed might be second faster or so :) | 13:05 |
| phaeron | cool | 13:05 |
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| phaeron | we get the journal ? | 13:05 |
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| Sage_ | phaeron: yes we get that | 13:05 |
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| Sage_ | I would appreciate if someone else could test this packaging as well though as it is quite large update :) | 13:06 |
| Sage_ | https://build.pub.meego.com/project/show?project=home%3Asage%3Abranches%3AMer%3Afake%3ACore%3Aarmv7l <- install systemd and udev from there (and the deps that come with but nothing else as there is broken stuff in same repo as well) | 13:06 |
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| * Sage_ submitted packages to review | 13:15 | |
| Stskeeps | won't be in next, but the one after that probably | 13:15 |
| Stskeeps | if we regress in libxi, probably that goes in | 13:15 |
| Sage_ | Stskeeps: definitely not in next http://pastie.org/3354476 :D | 13:16 |
| slaine | lbt: Where you at the Fosem Wayland QA session ? | 13:17 |
| lbt | yes | 13:17 |
| phaeron | slaine: yes | 13:17 |
| lbt | wasn't terribly interesting tbh | 13:18 |
| slaine | Thought I just heard you | 13:18 |
| Sage_ | so what does this mean http://pastie.org/3354476 ? | 13:18 |
| slaine | http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=WNXWT3ine7E#! | 13:18 |
| lbt | I wasn't sure what the impact of moving decoration client-side would have on regression | 13:18 |
| lbt | since a change in decoration could mean quite a lot of code needs to be touched | 13:19 |
| Stskeeps | Sage_: was systemd-sysv installed? | 13:19 |
| lbt | agreed that *should* be abstracted through the toolkit ... | 13:19 |
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| lbt | slaine: I actually expected a Q&A .... so I kinda asked "what is wayland" as a joke :) | 13:20 |
| lbt | and to get some interaction going | 13:21 |
| slaine | was that at the start ? | 13:21 |
| lbt | pre-video start | 13:21 |
| slaine | yeah, hehehe | 13:21 |
| lbt | but yes | 13:21 |
| phaeron | that the dev node is stale and systemd is not listening to that pipe ? | 13:21 |
| phaeron | does it still support it ? | 13:21 |
| Sage_ | Stskeeps: yes | 13:22 |
| slaine | The windows hints part is slightly worrying | 13:28 |
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| slaine | i.e. the lack of control on how to place windows | 13:28 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: https://build.pub.meego.com/project/monitor?project=Mer%3AOBS%3ATesting%3ADevel | 13:29 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: ta | 13:29 |
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| Sage_ | Stskeeps: is connman only reason why we have ntpd in mer core+ | 13:39 |
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| Stskeeps | yes | 13:40 |
| Stskeeps | and its fairly useful too | 13:40 |
| Sage_ | well newer connman has ntpd buildin in connman core | 13:40 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 13:41 |
| Stskeeps | that's crazy, or good | 13:41 |
| Sage_ | http://git.kernel.org/?p=network/connman/connman.git;a=commit;h=52aab9919519dc94ae891efb22e8d92d32e242de | 13:42 |
| Stskeeps | mmkay | 13:45 |
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| Sage_ | ok, systemd that actually works is now in review :) | 13:50 |
| lbt | I guess connman and systemd will be all we need eventually | 13:50 |
| Sage_ | hehe :) | 13:50 |
| w00t_OSL | soon, the kernel will be embedded too | 13:51 |
| * lbt opens a book on which one will absorb the kernel ... | 13:51 | |
| * phako votes for systemd replacing grub and then booting directly into systemd | 13:52 | |
| phako | and then loading whatever is needed | 13:52 |
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| slaine | pffff, we could just dump mer-core and use emacs right now | 14:01 |
| Stskeeps | Boot2Emacs! | 14:01 |
| lbt | \o/ | 14:02 |
| * lbt has a project | 14:02 | |
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| HUELK | hi | 14:07 |
| Stskeeps | lo | 14:07 |
| HUELK | ^^ | 14:07 |
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| lbt | Does anyonw know Arnaud Delcasse's nick? | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | choucone? | 14:12 |
| Stskeeps | chouchoune: | 14:12 |
| lbt | :) | 14:12 |
| chouchoune | Stskeeps: | 14:12 |
| lbt | lbt | 14:12 |
| chouchoune | oh | 14:12 |
| chouchoune | yes, it's me ;) | 14:12 |
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| Stskeeps | hello franc | 14:34 |
| franc | hi | 14:34 |
| Stskeeps | welcome :) what brings you here? | 14:34 |
| franc | installing nemo on n900 | 14:35 |
| Stskeeps | ah, cool - you might want to join #nemomobile too then :) | 14:35 |
| franc | yes will do | 14:36 |
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| HUELK | i get a grey screen in installer is there a fix to that | 14:38 |
| Stskeeps | if you're using the mer images, boot into the OS and then open a terminal and run installer-shell there | 14:39 |
| HUELK | ok | 14:40 |
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| Stskeeps | morn Khaled | 15:30 |
| Khaled | Stskeeps: morning how r u? | 15:33 |
| Stskeeps | i'm fine | 15:33 |
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| Stskeeps | Khaled: just one minor thing.. you're talking about focusing on one device etc -- we have a principle that we don't give any kind of preferential treatment to certain hardware, vendors, or devices as this ruins the whole benefit of an independent core -- people are free to work on what they want | 15:34 |
| Stskeeps | meego took preferential devices to such an extent it ruined it for the rest of people wanting to use it on other kind of devices | 15:34 |
| Khaled | yeah that will be great if we lots of resources and great devices | 15:35 |
| Stskeeps | there will always be devices that has more or less complete hardware adaptations, or virtual machines for development | 15:35 |
| Khaled | but the truth is there really crappy products out there and resources are nt that many so it should be used wisely | 15:35 |
| Stskeeps | the resources that mer project itself has is the ones working on core, hardware adaptations is projects outside it | 15:36 |
| Stskeeps | so if people want to work on that, we can't stop them | 15:36 |
| Khaled | yeah I was not talking about mer core, I was talking about n emo | 15:36 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 15:36 |
| Khaled | as a final ux we need to get one device 100% right | 15:37 |
| Stskeeps | nemo is a bit of a different matter as there's paid people to do n900/n950/n9 adaptations :) | 15:37 |
| Stskeeps | and they can select as they please | 15:37 |
| Khaled | I sent them an email about alot of my ideas and I have yet to have a response | 15:38 |
| Khaled | but I am not sure what nemo's aim to be | 15:38 |
| Stskeeps | i haven't seen any emails? | 15:38 |
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| Stskeeps | i haven't seen any emails? where did you send to? | 15:40 |
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| Khaled | markos email of nemo | 15:46 |
| Stskeeps | as in, mer-general@ mailing list? | 15:47 |
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| Stskeeps | send to me too, carsten.munk@gmail.com | 15:48 |
| Khaled | its only ux stuff it has nothing to do with core | 15:49 |
| Stskeeps | that's fine | 15:50 |
| Stskeeps | my day job is nemo :) | 15:50 |
| Stskeeps | well, for a little wihle yet | 15:50 |
| Khaled | oh then okay sending now, u are a designer? | 15:51 |
| Stskeeps | i wish | 15:51 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 15:51 |
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| Khaled | ok sent | 15:53 |
| Stskeeps | isn't there some way for people to remove the 'sent from my ipad'? | 15:54 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 15:54 |
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| Stskeeps | Khaled: so, are you a designer or? | 15:54 |
| Khaled | sorry i removed it from the original but it came again | 15:54 |
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| Khaled | a begginer but yeah | 15:54 |
| Stskeeps | well, make some mockups of your ideas | 15:55 |
| Stskeeps | that's a better way to approach the problem | 15:55 |
| Khaled | also I will be attending computer engineering after 2weeks | 15:55 |
| Stskeeps | (http://www.interaction-design.org/encyclopedia/mock-ups.html | 15:55 |
| Khaled | yeah I am actually starting | 15:55 |
| Khaled | photoshop is just crashing and slow | 15:55 |
| Stskeeps | http://developer.meego.com/guides/meego-handset-ui-design-guidelines is the closest we have to guidelines | 15:56 |
| Stskeeps | http://developer.meego.com/guides/meego-handset-ui-basics and next pages | 15:56 |
| Khaled | u should just use the n9 design guidlines they are awesome | 15:57 |
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| Khaled | this really feels old | 15:58 |
| Khaled | maybeuse webos guidlines as they are open source | 15:58 |
| Khaled | it just frustrates me every time i see the unlock button, havent anyone saw the n9 | 15:59 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 15:59 |
| Khaled | double tap to wake and swipe to unlock are just no brainers | 15:59 |
| Stskeeps | you have to remember this is from the time that n9 was a deep deep secret :) | 15:59 |
| Stskeeps | so it could in no way look like that | 15:59 |
| Stskeeps | we can't do a full copy of swipe ui due to potential conflicts of interests/patents | 16:00 |
| Khaled | yeah and it came pretty late but its just so polished | 16:00 |
| Khaled | no no sont copy the n9 ui | 16:00 |
| Stskeeps | because well, some of us are paid by nokia (not really a secret) | 16:00 |
| Khaled | it is only limited to phones | 16:00 |
| Khaled | u cant put it on a tanlet it wont be intuitive | 16:01 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, true | 16:01 |
| Khaled | and I actually prefer the task manager ui of webos as it throws away all this crap of widgets and icons | 16:01 |
| Khaled | and focuses me on the main thing I do on ever computing device, | 16:03 |
| Khaled | which is switching between apps | 16:03 |
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| Stskeeps | :nod: | 16:04 |
| HUELK | if i want to boot to init 3 on mer how do i do it passing 3 to kernel cmdline does not work | 16:04 |
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| vgrade | HUELK, don't know the kernel command line required but this has details http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Systemd#How_do_I_change_the_default_runlevel.3F | 16:05 |
| Khaled | btw does anyone know whats the best tools to do mockups? | 16:05 |
| bigbluehat | Khaled: you need your own channel ;) | 16:06 |
| bigbluehat | and I'd recommend Inkscape | 16:07 |
| bigbluehat | inkscape.org | 16:07 |
| Khaled | lol | 16:07 |
| bigbluehat | :) | 16:07 |
| bigbluehat | there's always Mockingbird, Balsmiq and friends | 16:07 |
| bigbluehat | but you can more easily expand on a "rough" Inkscape (SVG) layout | 16:07 |
| Khaled | r u a designer? | 16:07 |
| bigbluehat | who me? | 16:10 |
| bigbluehat | :) | 16:10 |
| Khaled | yeah | 16:10 |
| bigbluehat | yeah, been doing UX for a decade or so | 16:10 |
| Khaled | and whats your main app for mocking uis? | 16:10 |
| bigbluehat | mostly trolling in [Open]Mobile groups of various kinds right now to pick out some platform(s) to help support/push/design-for | 16:11 |
| bigbluehat | Inkscape :) | 16:11 |
| bigbluehat | oh, and paper :) | 16:11 |
| Khaled | yeah paper is the first thing i go to | 16:12 |
| Khaled | so easy and fast | 16:12 |
| bigbluehat | yeah, and it doesn't crash ;) | 16:12 |
| Khaled | yeah photoshop is a nightmare | 16:13 |
| Stskeeps | bigbluehat: but you do loose data at times | 16:14 |
| * Stskeeps has some papers he can't find | 16:14 | |
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| bigbluehat | :) | 16:17 |
| bigbluehat | there are some advantages to things being mutable and even singular | 16:17 |
| bigbluehat | I actually listened to a librarian make the case *for* house fires | 16:18 |
| bigbluehat | and suggested the audience implement the concept in their digital world occasionally | 16:18 |
| bigbluehat | …basically throwing things away willy-nilly to make yourself start over | 16:18 |
| bigbluehat | so that your ideas/thoughts/etc can be build on cleaner foundations | 16:19 |
| bigbluehat | it was...interesting | 16:19 |
| bigbluehat | :) | 16:19 |
| bigbluehat | Khaled: you need to be trolling in the irc.mozilla.org b2g channel | 16:19 |
| Khaled | lol why? | 16:19 |
| bigbluehat | to help me convince them to use Mer ;) | 16:20 |
| bigbluehat | oh, and they do lots of mockups | 16:20 |
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| bigbluehat | so you might want to check those out | 16:20 |
| bigbluehat | there's also #ux and #chromeless which have interesting UI/UX related conversations occasionally | 16:20 |
| Khaled | u have a link for those mockups? | 16:20 |
| bigbluehat | hmmm…one second | 16:21 |
| Khaled | nvm found it | 16:21 |
| bigbluehat | https://wiki.mozilla.org/Gaia | 16:22 |
| bigbluehat | these? https://wiki.mozilla.org/B2G/UI | 16:22 |
| bigbluehat | these are my favorite actually: https://wiki.mozilla.org/B2G/UI#Patryk.27s_Initial_Homescreen_Concept_.28November_11.2C_2011.29 | 16:23 |
| bigbluehat | sort of Win Phone-ish, but that has promise too, imo | 16:23 |
| bigbluehat | anyway, this is the Mer channel ;) | 16:23 |
| Stskeeps | it's okay to incubate here as long as your work will be based on mer | 16:24 |
| Stskeeps | eventually we'll ask people to move out of mom's basement ;) | 16:24 |
| Khaled | i dont know it feels too bloated to me like there isnt any focus or clarity | 16:24 |
| Stskeeps | (speaking about B2G, i assume?) | 16:25 |
| Khaled | their whole idea of booting to the web is just insane | 16:25 |
| Khaled | yeah | 16:25 |
| Khaled | sorry will stop now | 16:25 |
| Stskeeps | nah, i didn't ask you to stop, just had to check you didn't say that about mer ;) | 16:25 |
| Khaled | no come on how could | 16:26 |
| Stskeeps | well, people boot to QML these days | 16:26 |
| Stskeeps | so boot to a html interface isn't far off | 16:26 |
| Khaled | touché | 16:26 |
| Khaled | yeah but the web is still far from taking over | 16:26 |
| Stskeeps | i'm doing black magic right now, http://releases.merproject.org/~carsten/fun.txt | 16:26 |
| Stskeeps | i'm doing RPM builds without anything useful in my target | 16:27 |
| Stskeeps | (see top, bottom) | 16:27 |
| Khaled | why is everyone so afraid of the future by adopting web stuff? | 16:27 |
| Stskeeps | i think they want to show their worth as foundation of web uis / html5 apps | 16:28 |
| Stskeeps | as they're really sucky (apologies to mozilla developers) compared to webkit on mobile | 16:28 |
| Stskeeps | and since we're going for a war on runtimes and experiences.. | 16:29 |
| ali1234 | Khaled: because of past experience mainly | 16:29 |
| ali1234 | web apps force you to rent software instead of buying it and force you to rely on some remote server outside your control being available (see OBS for an example of why this is bad) | 16:30 |
| Khaled | well look at apple for instance | 16:31 |
| Khaled | do u think they would have any problem booting their whole os whne web takes over | 16:31 |
| ali1234 | in the end they are just a reworking of the thin client/mainframe systems | 16:31 |
| Khaled | instead they used the best and most efficent thing available now | 16:31 |
| ali1234 | except they use http which is even less suited for the task than X11 | 16:32 |
| Khaled | and will probably adopt the web when its ready, its all about perfection | 16:32 |
| Khaled | they dont tolerate buggines or half assed or incomplete stuff | 16:32 |
| ali1234 | lol | 16:32 |
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| Stskeeps | web isn't perfect nor will ever be | 16:32 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 16:32 |
| Stskeeps | geocities... | 16:32 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 16:32 |
| slaine | Stskeeps: nice | 16:32 |
| Khaled | exactly thats why they cant adopt it | 16:32 |
| Khaled | and right now theyhave the most capable mobile os out there | 16:33 |
| Khaled | becuase of native stuff | 16:33 |
| Stskeeps | slaine: understand what that means? :) | 16:33 |
| Khaled | I think that was meego's aim which is to be native linux | 16:33 |
| ali1234 | you can't have a web app without a web browser | 16:33 |
| ali1234 | all you've done is moved the problem to a different domain | 16:34 |
| ali1234 | one which is significantly harder to deal with for the user | 16:34 |
| slaine | Stskeeps: I can detail, but perhaps I'm missing the overall picture. It appears that your SB2 is up and running pulling in requirements for building generic spec files. icbw | 16:35 |
| slaine | s/I can detail/I can see the detail/ | 16:35 |
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| Stskeeps | slaine: well, i'm basically doing rpm build without tools in the target | 16:36 |
| Stskeeps | no autoconf, no native gcc, etc.. | 16:36 |
| Stskeeps | so core doesn't need to be self-hosting | 16:36 |
| ali1234 | :( | 16:36 |
| slaine | Which is what I thought | 16:36 |
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| ali1234 | so what will i use to build it then? | 16:41 |
| Stskeeps | sec, eating | 16:43 |
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| Stskeeps | ali1234: the idea is a split between 'toolchain' and core, toolchain is self-hosting, core isn't | 16:55 |
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| ali1234 | i see, that makes sense | 16:57 |
| Stskeeps | and i'm not terribly convinced of the idea yet | 16:58 |
| ali1234 | presumably this would also make it easier for me to use i486 toolchain to build a i586 core? | 16:58 |
| Stskeeps | yes, for example | 16:58 |
| Stskeeps | though you might have to run i586 binaries | 16:59 |
| ali1234 | well it sounds good in theory :) | 16:59 |
| Stskeeps | this is like a hybrid cross compilation approach | 16:59 |
| ali1234 | seems like it could be a little bit pointless is core is only a subset of toolchain anyway | 17:00 |
| ali1234 | but i guess toolchain wouldn't have X11 etc | 17:01 |
| ali1234 | (if core even still has that) | 17:01 |
| Stskeeps | it has some points.. such as being able to cut and slice things you wouldn't be able to, if you had to self-host | 17:01 |
| Stskeeps | or, erm, build against a bionic libc target for fun | 17:01 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:01 |
| Stskeeps | or point against any kind of target you want mer on | 17:03 |
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| Stskeeps | while not having to edit .spec files | 17:05 |
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| lbt | gitorious sucks | 17:10 |
| Stskeeps | oh? | 17:11 |
| lbt | slow, repeatedly fails to pull, disconnects | 17:12 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 17:13 |
| lbt | just venting :) | 17:13 |
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| * Stskeeps is quite satisfied with his proof of concept | 17:14 | |
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| lbt | you're not allowed to explain it to anyone - they can only read wiki and comments in the code | 17:18 |
| Stskeeps | hehe | 17:18 |
| Stskeeps | it's quite simple really, i just built 'acl' without any tools in the core | 17:18 |
| lbt | using sb2 | 17:19 |
| Stskeeps | right | 17:19 |
| lbt | so all 'dev' package code is outside core | 17:19 |
| Stskeeps | autoconf, automake, cross compiler, bash, coreutils, etc | 17:19 |
| Stskeeps | i had to have libtool in target for technical reasons | 17:19 |
| Stskeeps | and i can still run arm binaries :) | 17:20 |
| lbt | good - that's tidy | 17:20 |
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| Stskeeps | rpm, rpm-build outside to | 17:22 |
| Stskeeps | o | 17:22 |
| lbt | rpm? | 17:22 |
| Stskeeps | right | 17:22 |
| lbt | why? | 17:22 |
| Stskeeps | well, in this particular case 'because it can be', it could easily be in core too | 17:22 |
| lbt | OK | 17:23 |
| Stskeeps | it's just that rpm is x86 based and all binary tools within in this particular example | 17:23 |
| lbt | I'd expect rpm in core rpm-build out | 17:23 |
| lbt | but cool that you can do it | 17:23 |
| Stskeeps | :nod: | 17:23 |
| Stskeeps | imagine true embedded systems made in obs.. | 17:24 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 17:24 |
| lbt | I was wondering what is mandatory in core | 17:25 |
| HUELK | so i got rid of my zypper refresh db error by replacing the satsolver libs and bins form i486 | 17:25 |
| Stskeeps | HUELK: isn't your hardware atom? | 17:25 |
| HUELK | yes but my host system is not and i have to configure the kernel on the host because i connot boot otherwise | 17:26 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 17:26 |
| HUELK | on meego i can do all that on the device | 17:26 |
| HUELK | anyway lets see where this going to end | 17:27 |
| Stskeeps | lbt: 'not much' | 17:27 |
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| HUELK | hmm why there is no ncurses-devel package | 17:30 |
| Stskeeps | should be | 17:32 |
| HUELK | i think my zypper uri is wrong i use this http://releases.merproject.org/releases/0.20111104.1/builds/i586/ | 17:33 |
| Stskeeps | looks a bit old | 17:34 |
| Stskeeps | i might have had to put that one to backup due to it being very old | 17:35 |
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| lbt | off out ... see you all in the morning o/ | 19:10 |
| Stskeeps | have a good dance, if your foot allows it :) | 19:10 |
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| phaeron | lbt: o/ | 19:35 |
| Stskeeps | evening phaeron | 19:35 |
| Stskeeps | lbt went out for dancin' | 19:35 |
| phaeron | evening | 19:35 |
| phaeron | ah | 19:35 |
| phaeron | ok.. I'll start testing th obs packages | 19:35 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: http://releases.merproject.org/~carsten/fun.txt <- look at top and at bottom | 19:35 |
| Stskeeps | black magic(TM) | 19:36 |
| phaeron | sb2 :) | 19:37 |
| phaeron | I have no name means the hostname is not set afair | 19:37 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 19:37 |
| Stskeeps | i'm basically doing a full rpm build with no tools in target | 19:37 |
| Stskeeps | so core doesn't need to be self-hosted | 19:38 |
| phaeron | no tools in host you mean ? probably stuff in /target ? | 19:39 |
| Stskeeps | nop | 19:40 |
| Stskeeps | there's no bash in /target | 19:40 |
| Stskeeps | no tools in target | 19:40 |
| Stskeeps | just in x86 side | 19:40 |
| phaeron | mmm so how does it compile ? cross compile ? | 19:41 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 19:41 |
| phaeron | ooh | 19:41 |
| phaeron | march | 19:41 |
| phaeron | so there is no need for any changes in the spec file :) | 19:41 |
| Stskeeps | it basically does transparent 'empty target' cross compilation, without modifying specs | 19:41 |
| Stskeeps | bingo | 19:41 |
| phaeron | I know someone who will be pissed off :D | 19:42 |
| Stskeeps | good | 19:42 |
| Stskeeps | i still need to actually make this beyond my sandbox, but i'm happy i was able to build at least one package | 19:42 |
| Stskeeps | (actually three) | 19:42 |
| phaeron | so sb2 is smart enough to set the -march and stuff ? | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | that comes from rpm's rpmrc | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | and macros | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | i do have to install some information in, but there's no ARM rpm binary | 19:43 |
| phaeron | hmm black magic indeed | 19:44 |
| phaeron | but I thought the arch was hardcoded in rpm ? or was it in dpkg ? | 19:44 |
| Stskeeps | it's not really | 19:45 |
| phaeron | some people have really misleading info :D | 19:45 |
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| Stskeeps | http://pastie.org/3356633 is the /target i'm building against | 19:48 |
| Stskeeps | ignore usr/bin/perl, it's just a hack to enforce some behaviour | 19:48 |
| Stskeeps | (that part does not contain locales and charmaps, as glibc puts in) | 19:48 |
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| phaeron | it's empty .. | 19:50 |
| Stskeeps | uh-huh | 19:51 |
| phaeron | I mean mostly empty | 19:51 |
| Stskeeps | glibc, glibc-devel, glibc-common, and libattr dependancy | 19:51 |
| Stskeeps | the usr/lib/rpm stuff may need some more hacks | 19:51 |
| Stskeeps | libtool -has- to be on target for technical reasons | 19:51 |
| Stskeeps | but that's a shellscript | 19:52 |
| Stskeeps | glibc can be cross compiled with ease | 19:52 |
| Stskeeps | so, maybe a few more days and i have this ready for production ;p | 19:53 |
| phaeron | so the rationale is to do this for bootstrapping easily ? | 19:54 |
| Stskeeps | the rationale is to be able to strip all the fat needed for self-hosting in the core | 19:54 |
| Stskeeps | as well as to do really minimal systems | 19:54 |
| Stskeeps | .. or build against android bionic libc ;) | 19:55 |
| Stskeeps | or target mer to any kind of hw we want | 19:55 |
| phaeron | mm | 19:55 |
| Stskeeps | with this it becomes trivial to begin a port to any kind of hw, so | 19:56 |
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| phaeron | as long as it can be cross compiled to | 19:56 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 19:56 |
| Stskeeps | also.. no more cycles for base system | 19:57 |
| Stskeeps | just for toolchain | 19:57 |
| * phaeron tries to get that part | 19:57 | |
| Stskeeps | Cycles for armv7el (#1) | 19:58 |
| Stskeeps | autoconf , automake , binutils , bison , bzip2 , cloog , cvs , db4 , e2fsprogs , ed , elfutils , expat , file , flex , gawk , gcc , gdbm , gettext , glibc , gmp , groff , libcap , libtool , lua , meego-rpm-config , mpc , mpfr , nano , ncurses , nspr , nss , pcre , perl , pkgconfig , popt , ppl , readline , rpm , sqlite , texinfo , util-linux , xz , zlib | 19:58 |
| Stskeeps | touch one of those and your port is gone for a few hours/days | 19:58 |
| Stskeeps | with this, we only have that cycle in toolchain (x86) | 19:58 |
| phaeron | and baselib export to the other archs | 19:59 |
| phaeron | err | 19:59 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, for glibc and such base things | 19:59 |
| Stskeeps | like, the target's glibc | 20:00 |
| Stskeeps | so everything is bootstrapped from x86 side | 20:00 |
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| phaeron | sounds good. the obs proposed method for cross compile doesn't have that benifit | 20:01 |
| Stskeeps | it does sortof, but it requires a lot of modifications to packages | 20:02 |
| Stskeeps | i want to avoid that | 20:02 |
| phaeron | the cycles are still there in that method , right ? | 20:02 |
| Stskeeps | it depends on how they do it | 20:02 |
| Stskeeps | i didn't look too much into it | 20:02 |
| * Stskeeps tries to push to Merproject/open-build-service and isn't having much luck | 20:03 | |
| Stskeeps | i have http://pastie.org/3356721 and git push origin master just says everything up to date :P | 20:04 |
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| phaeron | can you visualize in gitg or gitk | 20:05 |
| Stskeeps | mmm, it's on my remote server | 20:05 |
| Stskeeps | i'll take a look at it tomorrow | 20:06 |
| phaeron | git remote show ; git branch -a | 20:07 |
| phaeron | would show what different stuff are there | 20:07 |
| Stskeeps | http://pastie.org/3356745 | 20:07 |
| phaeron | you are on no branch | 20:07 |
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| phaeron | so you're not pushing anything to origin master | 20:08 |
| Stskeeps | ok | 20:08 |
| Stskeeps | that's happened after i did git pull --rebase upstream master | 20:08 |
| phaeron | mm not sure that's correct | 20:09 |
| Stskeeps | mmkay | 20:09 |
| phaeron | git fetch upstream | 20:09 |
| * Stskeeps tries again | 20:09 | |
| phaeron | make sure your patches are backed up , since switching away from your current state could loose them ? | 20:09 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, this is another branch than my own | 20:10 |
| Stskeeps | trying to update merproject | 20:10 |
| phaeron | then git checkout master ; git rebase origin/master | 20:10 |
| phaeron | sorry | 20:10 |
| phaeron | git rebase upstream/master | 20:10 |
| Stskeeps | http://pastie.org/3356764 | 20:11 |
| timoph | evening | 20:11 |
| Stskeeps | phaeron: and now git push what? | 20:12 |
| Stskeeps | evening timoph | 20:12 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: after git checkout master ; git rebase upstream/master | 20:12 |
| Stskeeps | ok, done | 20:12 |
| phaeron | git push origin master | 20:12 |
| Stskeeps | carsten@monster:~/merproject/open-build-service$ git push origin master | 20:13 |
| Stskeeps | Everything up-to-date | 20:13 |
| phaeron | weird | 20:13 |
| phaeron | git branch -a | 20:13 |
| phaeron | are you on branch ? | 20:13 |
| Stskeeps | aftre http://pastie.org/3356776 | 20:13 |
| phaeron | I wonder why you end up on no branch | 20:14 |
| phaeron | does the rebase fail ? | 20:14 |
| Stskeeps | it says a lot of Applying: | 20:14 |
| phaeron | trying here | 20:14 |
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| phaeron | Stskeeps: it says only one here | 20:16 |
| Stskeeps | awkward | 20:16 |
| Stskeeps | 2acarsten@monster:~/merproject/open-build-service$ git --version | 20:17 |
| Stskeeps | git version 1.7.3.4 | 20:17 |
| phaeron | Stskeeps: http://pastie.org/private/fxpo7suo54tygoywghcfqw | 20:18 |
| Stskeeps | wtf | 20:18 |
| phaeron | git version 1.7.9 | 20:18 |
| Stskeeps | ok, so maybe i should upgrade it | 20:18 |
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| crevetor | Hello | 20:31 |
| crevetor | Stskeeps: there ? | 20:31 |
| Stskeeps | lo crevetor | 20:33 |
| Stskeeps | what's up? | 20:34 |
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| crevetor | Stskeeps: not much, I was wondering if you had made some progress with llvmpipe (and more specifically on ARM). I just plugged my touchpad and want to see if I can get new things working :) | 20:39 |
| Stskeeps | crevetor: not on arm sadly | 20:40 |
| Stskeeps | crevetor: but supposedly plasma active works nicely without gles | 20:40 |
| crevetor | hum i'll try that then :) | 20:40 |
| crevetor | Is there a full armv7nhl image for Mer/PA ? | 20:41 |
| Stskeeps | not sure, you'd have to prod vgrade | 20:41 |
| crevetor | vgrade: there ? | 20:41 |
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| Stskeeps | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0wbyyA9X4Qk | 20:42 |
| crevetor | Stskeeps: BTW congrats on the spark ! | 20:42 |
| Stskeeps | ah, i wasn't involved with it :) | 20:42 |
| Stskeeps | it's just good to see people using mer | 20:42 |
| crevetor | Stskeeps: I saw that video but that's accelerated right ? | 20:42 |
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| crevetor | Stskeeps: Well you are involved in mer so in some way you are involved in the spark ;) | 20:42 |
| Stskeeps | thats not accelerated, AFAIK | 20:43 |
| ali1234 | seems unlikely | 20:43 |
| Stskeeps | qtmediahub can also run with non-gles | 20:43 |
| crevetor | Stskeeps: hum, cool | 20:43 |
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| Stskeeps | even xf86-video-msm can help out , i think | 20:43 |
| crevetor | I'll check if I can get it to run on my touchpad | 20:43 |
| wmarone_ | considering they only just posted the lima driver sources the other day, which aseigo is banking on for accel... | 20:44 |
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| Stskeeps | wmarone_: well, there is framebuffer GLESv2 drivers at least | 20:44 |
| Stskeeps | for glibc | 20:44 |
| crevetor | the spark is QSD based ? | 20:44 |
| Stskeeps | for amlogic | 20:44 |
| Stskeeps | so that's a start | 20:44 |
| wmarone_ | crevetor: AMLogic made single core Cortex A9 | 20:44 |
| Stskeeps | http://lwn.net/Articles/479742/ | 20:47 |
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| crevetor | Stskeeps: any idea where I could find libqca for Mer on armv7nhl ? | 21:20 |
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| crevetor | Stskeeps: nevermind I found what I was looking for | 21:36 |
| * phaeron builds old dawati .. | 21:36 | |
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| vgrade | guys, the Spark video is framebuffer only no fancy mali stuff | 22:03 |
| vgrade | crevetor, arm PA builds on Mer here, http://share.basyskom.com/contour/Deployment/mer_arm_install_archive/ | 22:05 |
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| vgrade | I've had a few issues with some of these issues so the demo on youtube is from one of my old images at http://images.formeego.org/tegra2/ with kernel, xorg.conf and fstab changes | 22:06 |
| vgrade | some of these images | 22:06 |
| crevetor | vgrade: I'm using your obs repo + the kde trunk repo ATM | 22:09 |
| crevetor | dunno if that's the right path but it has installed on top of my mer install :) | 22:09 |
| vgrade | crevetor, you should not now need my repo as Sage did a much better job of providing the bridge between mer core and PA deps | 22:10 |
| vgrade | see the kickstarts from the basyskom site | 22:10 |
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| vgrade | I had 100 packages he got that down to about 30 | 22:11 |
| crevetor | vgrade: yeah but I'm using an old mer image | 22:11 |
| crevetor | so as of now I'm going to do it this way | 22:11 |
| crevetor | if it works I'll probably create my own image with everything cleaned up | 22:12 |
| crevetor | vgrade: startactive seems to work but nothing shows up. I'll pasty the output | 22:12 |
| crevetor | vgrade: if you could have a look : http://pastie.org/3357399 | 22:13 |
| vgrade | yea, that is what I was seeing a couple of days ago, there was a chenge done earlier in the week to maybe fix but may only be in devel and not testing | 22:14 |
| crevetor | vgrade: so no quick fix I guess ?! | 22:15 |
| crevetor | or is there devel repos somewhere ? | 22:15 |
| vgrade | startactive was created to controll the bring up of the various processes required by PA, it looks like you are missing the list of tasks to start | 22:17 |
| vgrade | check the basyskom links above for testing and devel kickstart files which will give you the repos | 22:18 |
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| vgrade | we can move to #active once we are on those repos | 22:18 |
| matrixx | was playing a bit with webgl: http://koti.kapsi.fi/matrixx/webgl/merux.html | 22:21 |
| matrixx | within this experiment I can also so doing things with qt/qml is so much nicer than web development | 22:22 |
| matrixx | s/so/say | 22:23 |
| phaeron | at least in firefox it pegs cpu at 100% | 22:23 |
| matrixx | it has quite a lot of vertex data | 22:23 |
| matrixx | not that bad with chrome, though I have quite new hardware too | 22:24 |
| phaeron | chromium has been broken on debian unstable since forever :( | 22:25 |
| matrixx | I'm running on windows atm :/ | 22:26 |
| matrixx | cpu 5-6% | 22:27 |
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| phaeron | maybe someone with working chromium can test | 22:29 |
| phaeron | it looks wicked though :) | 22:29 |
| matrixx | the shader is same I was using in the merux done with qtopengl, just ported to javascript and webgl | 22:30 |
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| ali1234 | i have chromium, dunno if it can be described as "working" though | 22:30 |
| matrixx | at least it's not like in exopc - 3 frames per second :D | 22:31 |
| ali1234 | matrixx: what's it supposed to do? | 22:31 |
| ali1234 | i just see the mer background | 22:31 |
| matrixx | ali1234: by itself - nothing, if you click, there should be ripples | 22:32 |
| ali1234 | also CPU is pegged with chromium | 22:32 |
| ali1234 | synchronous javascript? | 22:32 |
| ali1234 | yeah, i see ripples | 22:32 |
| matrixx | you can check the source :) | 22:32 |
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| matrixx | I'm pretty new with javascript so there's definately something I can do more efficiently | 22:33 |
| ali1234 | well, do you have a function which runs continuously? | 22:33 |
| matrixx | well, the webgl drawScene sure is :) | 22:34 |
| matrixx | though the stuff should happen mostly on gpu | 22:34 |
| ali1234 | hmm... but i don't see any loops | 22:34 |
| ali1234 | what's this function tick? | 22:35 |
| ali1234 | how does it render frames after the first? | 22:35 |
| ali1234 | i'm not familiar with webgl but in normal javascript you would use a timer to make it sleep in between updates | 22:35 |
| ali1234 | maybe webgl does that internally | 22:35 |
| matrixx | requestAnimFrame is the browser independent method for webgl | 22:36 |
| matrixx | called in tick | 22:36 |
| matrixx | with a callback | 22:36 |
| phaeron | I am guessing if webgl isn't really accelerated it will do software rendering | 22:36 |
| matrixx | yeah, that's what I'm also suspecting, since linux :/ | 22:37 |
| ali1234 | so you call tick, that calls requestAnimFrame, that calls tick again? | 22:37 |
| matrixx | yep | 22:37 |
| ali1234 | and so on forever | 22:37 |
| matrixx | that's how I suppose it happens :) | 22:37 |
| matrixx | I picked the method from khronos wiki: http://www.khronos.org/webgl/wiki/FAQ so I guess it's the proper way to render | 22:38 |
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| ali1234 | ah ok, requestAnimFrame does all that timer magic for you | 22:38 |
| matrixx | return window.setTimeout(callback, 1000/60); | 22:39 |
| matrixx | seems to be inside | 22:39 |
| ali1234 | yeah that's just turning off the ripple though right? | 22:39 |
| matrixx | there's another timer for that | 22:40 |
| matrixx | but yeah, I could do so that it draws only when ripple is "on" | 22:40 |
| ali1234 | hang on though | 22:40 |
| ali1234 | ah, i guess it doesn't matter which order you call them | 22:40 |
| ali1234 | calling the setTimeout first keeps the framerate constant :) | 22:41 |
| matrixx | :) | 22:41 |
| ali1234 | so yeah must just be software rendering | 22:41 |
| matrixx | I'm getting 55% on firefox 11 | 22:43 |
| ali1234 | 76% here | 22:44 |
| ali1234 | sometimes it spikes though | 22:44 |
| matrixx | but firefox is not at its best on win anyway | 22:44 |
| ali1234 | it's making my compiz run really slow | 22:44 |
| ali1234 | that usually indicates it is using hardware acceleration | 22:44 |
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| ali1234 | speaking of, i need to test a compiz update | 22:45 |
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| matrixx | tomorrow I'm gonna prettify the code and getting rid of the globals | 22:59 |
| crevetor | vgrade: :) got PA to start correctly | 23:00 |
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| vgrade | crevetor, cool | 23:31 |
| vgrade | devel or testing repos? | 23:31 |
| vgrade | we have a task running for increasing the number of devices running PA, would you mind adding some details to, http://community.kde.org/Plasma/Active/Tasks#Support_more_.28touch.29_devices | 23:34 |
| crevetor | vgrade: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aa_zUZXm1GA | 23:35 |
| crevetor | vgrade: I still have some work to do because the touchscreen doesn'T work yet | 23:35 |
| crevetor | so it's not really usable | 23:36 |
| vgrade | good to see, what input driver are you using evedv or mtev? | 23:38 |
| crevetor | vgrade: nothing yet because the underlying hardware doesn't have proper support | 23:39 |
| crevetor | I have to look it up in more detail | 23:40 |
| vgrade | ok | 23:40 |
| vgrade | lbt, see video above, uses same SoC as your dragonboard | 23:41 |
| vgrade | crevetor, which repos are you using? | 23:45 |
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