Monday, 2011-10-24

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lilstevievgrade: sounds like a good idea00:25
lilstevieI unified tegra tree would be nice00:25
lilstevievgrade: in fact, it should be easier to unify the tegra tree by using a FDT00:25
RaYmAnthe annoying issue is that we can't really have several platforms enabled at once :(00:25
lilstevieRaYmAn: that is why use the device tree00:26
RaYmAnsince e.g. all the older harmony-based tablets all identify as harmony00:26
lilstevieon devices that have uboot00:26
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RaYmAnyeah, so you mean tf and trimslice? =P00:26
lilsteviegetting u-boot to a functional level on the other platforms shouldn't be that difficult00:27
lilstevieand it is tf, trimslice and picasso00:27
lilstevieoh, and the real difference between tf and picasso (both ventana based ofc) is the FDT00:29
lilsteviewell when I say real difference, it is the only difference00:31
RaYmAnthe FDT contains what? devices I guess, but also clocks and stuff or?00:32
lilstevieit is the flat device tree00:33
lilstevieso everything00:34
lilstevie <- the interesting info00:36
lilsteviealso that allows passing over a different identifier for each device00:36
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lilsteviecause like the tf default bootloader passes up ventana00:36
RaYmAnwell, the older devices are harmony based, so I guess we'll see how close it is00:36
lilstevieand now I know why the kernels haven't been working cross bootloader00:36
lilstevieit has been right in front of me00:37
* lilstevie facepalms00:37
lilstevieit is all to do with the HW identifier00:37
RaYmAnoh? =P00:37
lilstevieu-boot passes TF10100:37
lilsteviedefault passes ventana00:37
RaYmAnand kernel checks.00:37
lilstevieima fix it up and try running the default bootloader00:38
lilsteviebut brb00:38
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vgradenight guys, lets take this to TegraLinux next week, but I think the idea of a unified tree appeals00:50
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vgradelilstevie, could you help me with getting uboot up on the tegra?00:52
lilstevievgrade: that is harmony based?00:57
vgradethink so, Shuttle OEM, same hw as povi tablet.01:04
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lilstevievgrade: I would like to note that the port isn't 100% functional, but it works02:35
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dm8tbrcaffeine++ && this.moveTo($orkplace);05:13
Jucatoa place of ork05:14
Jucatoobviously needs more caffeine :)05:14
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dm8tbrdon't you know that intentional misspelling? :)05:15
dm8tbrand yes, 'there be dragons' ;)05:16
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Stskeeps""New smartphones may be lightweight, compact objects, but their OSs are anything but. Ice Cream Sandwich will need workstations with no less than 16 GB RAM to build the source code, twice the amount Gingerbread needed. It will take 5 hours to compile on a dual quad-core 2+GHz workstation, and need 80GB disk space for all AOSP configs."05:49
Stskeepswell, noone will complain about OBS now ;)05:49
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Stskeepsdcthang: could you do me a favour and check if your account still works?06:06
Stskeeps(formerly known as
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dcthangit works fine for me.06:09
Stskeepsdcthang: thanks - we did a hostname changeover and my own account broke a bit so had to check other people06:09
dcthangu r welcome.06:10
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StskeepsSage_: i'm pondering to merge package groups into my;a=tree instead06:46
Stskeepsas that's what people will follow06:46
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Stskeepsmorn veskuh07:04
veskuhmorning Stskeeps07:05
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Stskeepsharbaum: re your error: you might need to create mic bootstrap with mic-bootstrap or something07:09
Stskeepsharbaum: there's a dumb regexp in mic2 that tries to say armv7l needs 'ia32' dir to bootstrap, while it should be i686 :P07:09
Stskeepser, i58607:09
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harbaumStskeeps: ok, will try, thanks07:10
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Stskeepsmorn slaine07:43
slainemorn Stskeeps07:47
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meceMornin' #mer07:50
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meceIs there a different channel for Nemo chat?07:50
Stskeepswell, #meego-arm right now07:51
Stskeepsif it's somehow mer related it's okay in here too07:51
Stskeeps - i guess whoever said n9 wasn't going to be marketed was wrong..07:54
Jucatoor they didn't get the memo07:56
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* lbt suspects the latter :)07:56
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veskuhStskeeps: some people believe way too much what Eldar says07:56
* Jucato recalls one "exclusive" dinner for developers with Nokia on Feb 11, with the local Nokia's marketing head talking blah blah blah about Qt, MeeGo, etc. ... and then right in the middle of the dinner, Elop goes "we're switching to WP" ...07:57
Jucatoor was that Feb 12? can't recall anymore. pre-Astrolabe timezone difference07:57
Stskeepswhich reminds me i should probably go buy that n9 sometime..07:57
Jucatoan N950 *and* an N9. one can only be so lucky ;)07:58
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Stskeepsn950 i probably have to hand back at some point, N9, all mine :P07:58
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lbtStskeeps: yeah - you can put it in the same parcel as the N900 from Amsterdam :)07:59
JucatoI do wonder if they will try to take back those n950's07:59
Stskeepslbt: :cough:07:59
Jucatomaybe next year? :D07:59
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Jucatoor you know, when they remember they have units out there08:00
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Jucatoheh that video kinda makes me want to have an N9 :(08:02
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chouchounehaha, mine is on its way home ;)08:11
chouchouneI can't wait ! I'll maybe have it today or tomorrow08:12
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sebasvgrade: yo08:21
lilstevieStskeeps: the N9 is being hammered into us here08:22
Jucatofeel free to send the hammer over here. will be much welcomed :)08:23
lilstevieCan't walk into a shopping centre without seeing an N9 advert08:23
lilstevieI tell you, they are selling us the N9 as if we have no idea that nokia discontinued Meego08:24
Jucatothat's the whole point of marketing isn't it? :)08:24
lilstevieyeah, but the point is, nobody actually knows08:25
Jucatoall the better! it takes more work to convince people of the opposite reality than to not let them know the opposite reality even exists08:25
lilstevieI was looking at the N9 in a phone shop and the attendant said "nice phone hey" I replied "yeah, shame Nokia discontinued meego and are switching to WP7"08:26
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lilsteviefucker didn't believe me08:26
lilstevieand he works in a telecomunications store08:26
Jucatoah, that phenomenon is called "believing your own propaganda (too much)" :D08:26
lilstevieit took showing him the press release for him to know08:27
lilsteviethen he was sad08:27
lilsteviecause he just purchased one himself :p08:27
Sage_Stskeeps: I'm ok with that package groups location.08:27
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lilstevieJucato: however, doesn't change the fact, I still want an N908:28
jonnor_workDoes the fact that Nokia has said no more MeeGo phones make the N9 a bad phone?08:28
Jucatolilstevie: you also failed to convince me that I shouldn't want an N9 ;)08:28
lilsteviejonnor_work: well, from a developers perspective, it is a bad place to develop for08:29
lilstevieJucato: heh08:29
StskeepsSage_: k08:30
Jucatolilstevie: I would qualify that as "from a developer's perspective who wants to monetize his apps"08:30
Jucatofor someone who just wants to develop apps, the almost lack of apps on it will mean it's fair game for everyone :D08:30
jonnor_workCompared to Android and iOS, sure. But that has been the case a long time?08:30
Jucato(getting it into Nokia store though, is a totally different story)08:31
StskeepsSage_: simplified it a bit,;a=commit;h=7e1aa3f24c78042a5e7600a3c7bc69aa01268655 - Makefile helps08:31
StskeepsSage_: i'm pondering if configurations.yaml and repos.yaml would be a good place, as release tools use these to generate releases08:32
lilsteviejonnor_work: it isn't the fact you can't break in, it is the fact that it is the last of its lineage08:33
veskuhlilstevie: well, yep, but Qt will live on.08:33
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lilstevieveskuh: that is true08:35
Jucatoin the case of devices with discontinued platforms, I tend to look at the hardware itself first and then on how much I or the community can "continue" the platform even without the manufacturer's help.  I think the N9 as a device is quite nice in itself08:35
lilstevieyeah, I don't even want to hack up the N908:36
Stskeepsat least even before release, we have a OS that can be installed on N9 if need be08:36
Jucatoas for the platform, well, there's probably still time that Nokia will support it for a while (since it's really marketed, unlike the N900). and even after then, you can still develop apps for it. bug fixing on the core though, might be difficult08:36
Sage_Stskeeps: what about those configurations.yaml and repos.yaml?08:36
ali1234if i install that plasma active build on n900, can i make phone calls with it?08:36
lilstevieI jailbreak iPhones, root android phones, I would be quite content with the N9 as is08:36
ali1234ie does it have a dialer UI?08:37
StskeepsSage_: well, to drop the basic configurations into mer project-core just like package-groups - i mean, they usually follow together08:37
lilstevieStskeeps: what do you mean by "before release"08:37
Jucatoali1234: you can't08:37
Stskeepslilstevie: as in usually community projects of open systems come way past release of a device, this time around, we're actually ahead with Nemo/CE08:38
Stskeepsali1234: new name for CE08:38
ali1234that's what you decided to call it?08:38
ali1234i don't remember that one being on the survey :)08:38
Jucatoali1234: I couldn't even get it past that phase in the photo (it somewhat hangs). and even if you get past that, Plasma Active One wasn't designed for phones, so there's no telephony functions yet08:38
lilstevieI was going to say the N9 has already released08:38
Stskeepsali1234: it was08:38
Jucatoali1234: you were able to remember what was and wasn't on that painfully long list? O.o08:39
ali1234well no08:39
Sage_Stskeeps: true08:39
ali1234but i would have voted for nemo if i saw it, probably08:39
ali1234maybe i saw it but just didn't get the jules verne reference08:40
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lilstevieok, so is Nemo the handset ui?08:44
Stskeepsnemo's a handset ui, yes08:44
StskeepsSage_: i wonder if we're missing the qt drag patch08:45
lilstevieStskeeps: ah ok08:46
lilstevieI need to figure out how to boot the XMM6180 outside of android08:46
lilsteviefor the SGS08:47
Stskeepswell, if you're a hacker/can code, i have a project for you that would probably help you a bit08:51
Stskeepshint: try to make a ofono wrapper for rild plugins08:52
lilsteviesamsungs RILD is a pita08:57
Stskeepsthat or look into what intel has going for medfield+ofono, i think those are infenion modems08:57
lilstevieso far I have the pin that gets toggled08:57
lilsteviedo any of those devices use EFS though08:58
lilstevierild wrapper would probably be the easiest08:59
Stskeepsthe idea is to provide an api over a socket or something, while being statically linked with bionic09:00
Stskeepsso it can dlopen stuff from bionic09:00
lilsteviewell I can code.... kinda :p09:03
lilsteviewell I can, I just am never confident about my code09:04
dcthangStskeeps: just wonder. Do we still use Mer for naming any more?09:04
Stskeepsdcthang: Mer project effort is efforts to improve the core, efforts to support the core (such as QA) and efforts to make it easier to use the core (tools) - basically09:05
Stskeepsdcthang: Mer naming is for the core/effort surrounding it/to some degree the mer community but it isn't a brand09:06
Stskeepsdcthang: most of the interesting things will happen in the projects that use Mer :)09:06
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dcthangokay, so to name Meego CE now has it defined yet? Meego CE = Nemo? :P09:07
Stskeepsdcthang: yes09:07
Stskeepsit's a seperate project from Mer, it uses Mer however09:07
dcthangok, good to know09:07
dcthangone more question, which channels are good to follow Nemo development progress?09:08
Stskeepshere and #meego-arm i guess - we'll probably set up our own irc channel at some point for nemo09:09
dcthangok, I will join it definitely09:11
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StskeepsSage_: - ideas welcome on how we go ahead and structure core .ks deliveries so others can inherit from them09:28
Stskeepsie, something for example Nemo would follow09:28
Stskeeps(not high priority, i'll first be able to put it into system on saturday-sunday anyway)09:29
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Stskeepsmorn vgrade09:41
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lilsteviemorning vgrade09:44
vgradelilstevie, morning09:46
vgradeStskeeps, I have this error on N900 plasma ,  sebas from plasma says its because qt-mobility does not have gstreamer-devel. Could this be added to out qt-mobility?09:48
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vgradelilstevie, just talking to the plasma guys about the welcome screen issue09:49
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Stskeepsvgrade: might be, qtmultimediakit not there might be an option too09:50
lilstevievgrade: cool09:51
Stskeepsvgrade: check our qtmobility sources;a=tree;h=refs/heads/master;hb=master09:51
sebasStskeeps: afaiu, qtmultimediakit is built and installed from qt-mobility, but requires those gstreamer headers09:55
lilstevievgrade: I am working at removing the requirement on the incomplete u-boot09:56
sebasI have these: BuildRequires:  gstreamer-0_10-devel gstreamer-0_10-plugins-base-devel09:56
sebas(for openSUSE, that works)09:56
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anab1sso, is this the future of meego?10:30
Stskeepsanab1s: well, more along lines of a different approach10:31
anab1s@Stskeeps: What I really want to know is: will this project save the Nokia N9?10:32
Stskeepsanab1s: it's better to ask nokia about that - what the nokia n9 runs is not techically meego from anyway :P10:33
Stskeepsanab1s: but in practice, we don't do hardware adaptations in this, we're a project to do a core, not a whole UI and OS :)10:34
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anab1s@Stskeeps: thanks for your responses.10:40
lbtanab1s: Mer is probably one of the more important components to provide a community solution for the N9 in the future10:43
lbtas said : it will need other components too10:43
anab1s@lbt: I just need some kind of assurance that the Nokia N9 has some kind of future with application development10:44
Stskeepsanab1s: Qt isn't going away10:44
Stskeepsand well, it's a great device10:45
Sage_Stskeeps: drag patch should be there. Is touch behaving bad?10:45
StskeepsSage_: that, or i had difficulties with precision on n900 screen10:45
Sage_Stskeeps: couple of comments in configurations yaml10:45
StskeepsSage_: Repositories:10:46
Stskeeps    -   Name: mer-core10:46
Stskeeps        Url:
StskeepsSage_: i also have a patch that makes Architecture turn into mic2-options --arch10:46
Sage_ok, well that work10:46
slaineStskeeps: are there details online on how to do a HW adaptation using Mer ?10:47
Stskeepsslaine: pretty much equal to how you do with meego10:47
Stskeepskernel, gles, perhaps pulseaudio/xorg config.. udev rules10:47
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slaineWhere there ever any walk throughs on meego wiki ?10:54
Stskeepsonly starts of a porting guide10:55
Stskeepstell me something about your target10:55
slaineWas gonna start with a basic Atom nettop, figured that'd be an easy start for the i586 repo10:56
slaineand work from there for a Trimslice project10:56
Stskeepsright - we have a atom/pc adaptation for CE made already,  so you can take that and customize it i think10:56
Stskeepsstill getting built10:56
slaineneed to be able to do all that from our own servers10:57
Stskeepsthat's fine, just copypac it10:57
slaineSo, userspace tools for pulling all this together10:57
lbtNemo's 586 is looking good10:57
slaineI assume you're still looking at using mic210:57
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smokulbt: cool. I could drop mine x86 HA then :)11:57
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lbtsmoku: it would make sense to share, yes11:58
smokuwho is maintaining ?  todays dist upgrade removed osc from my machine due to missing dependencies11:59
lbtsmoku: you need to speak to "the hazy ones"12:03
lbtphantom engineers who are only partly of this realm12:03
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smokulbt: should we adopt the tools too, then?12:09
Stskeepscould we start Mer:Tools on COBS?12:09
Stskeepsso we keep track of the tools we need12:09
lbtI think we did - it has qemu12:09
StskeepsSage_: could you drop a X86 nemo+MTF image somewhere?12:10
lbtSage_: and walk me through making it ?12:10
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smokuanyway, the real issue is keeping the distro repositories we build for up to date12:12
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smokudo we control these on COBS?12:13
Sage_Stskeeps, lbt: Rush? Or can you give me end of today? :)12:13
StskeepsSage_: end of today is fine, just thought you had an old one :)12:14
lbtsmoku: X-Fade and I control cobs, so yeah12:14
smokulbt: so having osc and mic2 in Mer:Tools would be nice12:15
lbtsmoku: is there an issue and a failure to respond in MeeGo:Tools12:17
lbt(apart from, say, building Debian6)12:17
Sage_lbt: back to MTF :)12:21
smokulbt: I don't understand the question12:21
lbtsmoku: the missing dep - did you report it?12:22
lbtI don't want to jump to take on more work if there isn't a huge issue12:22
smokulbt: nope.  How should I report it?12:23
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Stskeepsis the problem that osc breaks on debian unstable, or?12:23
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lbtand... osc should be available from suse anyway, not mer/meego12:24
lbtbut ... yeah12:24
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smokuthere is a tools repo for ubuntu 11.10 and it has tools in12:24
smokuit was working up until today, where upstream (ubuntu 11.10) updates changed deps, causing removal of osc12:25
smokuI guess the repo OBS builds tools for wasn't updated to the latest 11.10 paskages yet12:25
Stskeepsyeah, probably, OBS has a weak point there12:28
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dm8tbr12:38:50< hitlin37_> there's live video streaming available for linuxcon.
Stskeepsfor keynotes12:48
Stskeepsbesides that, the networking part is the useful part12:48
dm8tbrso no juicy bits?12:49
dm8tbrI know :/12:49
Stskeepswell, no tizen architecture talk12:49
Stskeepsi'm going mostly to talk to people and learn more about yocto12:50
dm8tbrI guess talking to people might be a challenge in case of intel employees, they might come pre-gagged or not attend at all...12:51
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Stskeepswell, yocto website down, mer site up, that's a start..12:55
Stskeepsah, there it cam12:55
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StskeepsSage_: might be a good prelink upstream13:01
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Sage_Stskeeps: omap-update-display <- where should this go? N950 ?13:13
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StskeepsSage_: n95013:27
Sage_k, copied it there already13:27
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Sage_Stskeeps: any new ideas for the duplicated entries in n900/n950 adaptation?13:28
Sage_ti-omap3-sgx and gst-nokia-camera are there at least13:28
StskeepsSage_: ti-omap3-sgx i will unify next week13:29
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Sage_Stskeeps: yes, but where will we put those combined binaries?13:33
Sage_Stskeeps: CE:Adaptation:N9xx ?13:33
Stskeepsyeah i guess13:35
Sage_I guess lynx and iotop should be moved to CE:Utils13:37
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lbtvgrade: Nice  :)14:26
Jucato(201 to 206)14:26
lbtvgrade: "Oktober" :)14:27
slainevgrade: nice14:27
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Sage_Stskeeps: where is your kickstarter patches?14:42
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Sage_lbt: I spotted that same thing :)14:43
Sage_vgrade: nice that pa on n90014:43
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lilstevievgrade: plasma working better now on mer?15:04
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StskeepsSage_: locally, will up somewhere once im done with travel prep15:25
vgradelilstevie, I'm just testing a couple of patches. Have removed the welcome screen and hopefully fixed the mime issue which was stopping the apps working15:26
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vgradeN900 plasma,
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Sage_Stskeeps: sure no rush.15:30
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lilstevievgrade: awesome, the mime issue was the biggest one15:42
lilsteviethat was just missing shared-mime-types though15:42
vgradeapps now work15:44
lilsteviethats good,15:45
lilstevieI fixed up the kernel a bit, but mirgrating away from u-boot and back to standard bootloader has shown how wrong this kernel is15:45
lilstevieclocks are all screwed15:45
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StskeepsSage_: ignore the .yaml changes, but
Sage_Stskeeps: mic arch and repo arch are not the same thing at times :)16:29
Sage_e.g., armv7nhl16:29
Sage_that is in armv7hl repo right, but needs armv7nhl to mic16:30
Sage_but no need to look that as there is alot more of those in mic16:30
StskeepsSage_: right16:30
Stskeepswe should probably make a universal standard or something for mer16:31
Sage_yes, and get rid of the ia32 as well16:31
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vgradedm8tbr ping16:52
dm8tbrvgrade: poing16:52
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vgradehi there, I would like to put a plasma active image at 10738 for N90016:53
vgradethere seems to be a lot of older images in the N900 dir16:55
vgradecould you make a plasma-active sub-directory for me?16:56
dm8tbrI think those are old images before n900 had space on the maemo CDN16:57
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vgradeyes, some are very old, but may be usefull to someone?16:58
dm8tbr/home/vgrade/plasma-active - should be mapped now16:59
dm8tbrI'll poke Sage_ Stskeeps and maybe other MerCEnaries if we should keep those around16:59
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vgradeok cool thanks16:59
Sage_dm8tbr: I think those n900 images can go. A bit too old I guess17:00
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dm8tbrok, I'll drop them17:05
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Stskeepsvgrade: cool @ video17:06
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vgradeStskeeps, just building a new image for N900 which fixes the apps. Will do a side by side Vega/N90017:15
vgradeStskeeps, then need to do some packing17:16
Stskeepsyeah, me too17:16
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KaziKluBey_N900vgrade: is it possible to run this image with u-boot from a sd-card on the n900?17:30
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vgradeKaziKluBey, yes if you have the right setup on the M900. Have you booted the CE build17:36
KaziKluBey_N900vgrade: yes,i have tried a whole bunch of em. u-boot on n900 and diskwriter on win7. anything else needed?17:39
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vgradedm8tbr, something wrong with that plasma-active link I think17:59
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KaziKluBey_N900 vgrade: care to share link to image here when it's cooked? :)18:04
vgradewill do18:06
KaziKluBey_N900vgrade: sweet18:06
dm8tbrvgrade: fixed18:07
dm8tbrmy mistake, the symlink was pointing to nowhere18:07
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* Stskeeps applies Mer stickers to everything18:28
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Stskeepsgood thing we had the old ones ;)18:28
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Stskeepsvgrade: are you taking demos?18:29
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vgradeStskeeps, well I have plasma on Vega and N900, may stick the Pi in if I have room18:34
Stskeepspi requires a hdmi monitor so that's maybe more difficult to drive out, but could make for a good discussion, i guess18:35
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Stskeepsi'm taking ideapad and n90018:36
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Stskeepswell, and n950 but i need a working phone..18:37
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Stskeepswhich reminds me.. maps download18:38
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Stskeepsand good work18:42
vgradestruggles a bit on N900 but vega is smooth18:46
Stskeepshow's memory on n900?18:46
Stskeepsit might have to resize more on n900 so18:46
Stskeeps(free -m)18:47
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vgradeharbaum, evening18:48
harbaumhave just got mic to work on the second machine. will try the plasma desktop next18:49
Stskeepswas it the bootstrap thing?18:49
harbaumi just entered the bootstrap demo command line from the wiki and afterwards everythink was ok18:50
Stskeepsvgrade: the menu bars in PA seem so wrong to me..18:52
Stskeepsbut i guess that's heritage18:52
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vgradeStskeeps, I think thats the legacy apps not transitioned fully to qml18:54
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Stskeepsvgrade: :nod:19:03
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vgradelooks at the work going on on meego-arm and looks at his 161 plasma active deps20:45
vgradeand 60 plasma active package20:45
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lbtvgrade: :)20:51
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lbtThe automated checks and 'CI' is getting to be a bit more solid now20:51
lbtif you think it would be of value then we can talk about it next week20:52
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vgradelbt, I think the idea was to reuce the deps to a more manageble level21:31
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Sage_Image building from proper repos :D22:01
Sage_Stskeeps, lbt: sry, missed yesterdays target a bit :P22:02
lbtyay - good going!22:03
lbtwhat are you building ?22:03
Sage_x86 and n90022:03
Sage_x86 on its way atm.22:03
lbtcan you pastie the mic2 command?22:04
Sage_sudo mic-image-creator -c kickstarts/Nemo/nemo-handset-ia32-ce-testing.ks --outdir=images22:04
Sage_a sec. I push the changes to git.22:04
lbtOK - and which git repo is this22:04
Sage_X-Fade, dm8tbr: ping? :)22:09
Sage_can someone remember the url to dm8tbr's scp?22:14
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Sage_grr... n900 image needs lots of more stuff :/22:17
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vgradeSage user@bug10738.openaos.org22:40
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