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| PaulePanter | Hi everyone. How can I turn off the proximity sensor? | 08:40 |
|---|---|---|
| cehteh | off as in? swiping with your ear? | 08:42 |
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| PaulePanter | cehteh: ;-) | 08:45 |
| PaulePanter | No idea. Currently it turns on the screen when it’s just lying on the desk and then the touchscreen stops working. | 08:46 |
| cehteh | soory my jolla should be in the mail today, i dont have one yet | 08:46 |
| cehteh | but on the n900 iirc one could tinker with it over dbus and maybe mce.conf | 08:46 |
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| Pawky | has the jolla tablet disappeared from the face of the earth? | 11:33 |
| sharpneli | Yes | 11:33 |
| Pawky | how come? | 11:33 |
| Nicd- | disappeared? it has not even appeared yet for the most part | 11:34 |
| Pawky | kind of what I meant | 11:34 |
| Pawky | earlier one atleast got some news updates about it, but thats gone as well since a while.. | 11:35 |
| Nicd- | wasn't there an update just last week? | 11:36 |
| ln- | there wasn't? | 11:36 |
| coderus | blog.jolla.com | 11:36 |
| Nicd- | https://blog.jolla.com/tablet_schedule_aptoide_store/ | 11:36 |
| Pawky | coderus: found it.. | 11:37 |
| Pawky | how do you know which "wave" one is to be in? | 11:38 |
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| DBcanyeAndDou-zi | jolla | 11:41 |
| citylight2 | price is now 169 per the cellular phone | 11:41 |
| DBcanyeAndDou-zi | jolla tablet just is a story. | 11:41 |
| citylight2 | kind of expensive for a second battery | 11:41 |
| coderus | why you didn't bought htc desire 310 battery yet? | 11:42 |
| citylight2 | could not find it locally | 11:42 |
| coderus | try harder or use internet? | 11:42 |
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| DBcanyeAndDou-zi | er,In Finland do you see some people use jolla? | 11:43 |
| DBcanyeAndDou-zi | I don't see anyone | 11:43 |
| DBcanyeAndDou-zi | just myself. | 11:43 |
| coderus | i think all current jolla phones batteries are 2-3 years old also | 11:43 |
| Tegu | I have seen some | 11:43 |
| pp_ | very rare, most have given up | 11:44 |
| Tegu | ye | 11:44 |
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| citylight2 | here is a networking question: I want to connect a small server in the basement. wifi reception is not reliable | 11:45 |
| citylight2 | so I will use powerline ethernet | 11:45 |
| citylight2 | but I must use a power socket which is far from the router. so I will connect a beaglebone with wifi. this is a small server | 11:46 |
| citylight2 | should I bridge the ethernet to the wifi in this case? | 11:46 |
| pp_ | buy mail-order and prepare to return the kit, and do not buy d-link :-) | 11:46 |
| citylight2 | or should I use WDS? | 11:47 |
| pp_ | ... and probably just running a long ethernet cable is the best option | 11:47 |
| citylight2 | pp_ : assume this is not possible | 11:48 |
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| pp_ | 5kB/second with d-link powerline ethernet and 400k/s with 802.11g WDS :-) (and 1Gbps with Ethernet) | 11:50 |
| citylight2 | speed is not relevent in this case | 11:52 |
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| ggabriel | citylight2: assuming ethernet over power works for you (depends on a lot of things), it depends on your AP too... if it has ethernet ports, just connect the cable there and you should be part of the same LAN | 12:18 |
| ggabriel | WDS requires wifi and you say that reception is low in your basement so i don't understand how that would work | 12:19 |
| Pawky | coderus: I did, the HTC 310 desire battery works like a charm | 12:20 |
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| dr_gogeta86 | pp_, i don't give up | 12:41 |
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| citylight2 | ggabriel: I ment router -- WDS --> small server with ethernet -- power --> ethernet on basement server | 12:57 |
| ggabriel | but then your small server has to be a router somehow | 12:59 |
| ggabriel | better if the ethernet goes to the (wifi) router and avoid WDS IMO | 12:59 |
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| citylight2 | but linux can connect to the static WDS, right? | 13:08 |
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| ggabriel | citylight2: I have no clue, I tried WDS once and it was between apple ap's (assuming we're talking about the same wds) | 13:28 |
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| PaulePanter | http://releases.sailfishos.org/ gives me a 403 error. | 13:36 |
| PaulePanter | (Forbidden) | 13:36 |
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| Lieke_ | http://releases.sailfishos.org/sources/ | 13:36 |
| PaulePanter | Lieke_: Thanks. | 13:37 |
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| MoritzJT | Wow, that latest blogpost comment pile... | 14:08 |
| MoritzJT | Anyone made it through there yet? | 14:08 |
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| ggabriel | it's long indeed | 14:12 |
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| MoritzJT | The last two comments made my day... It's hilarious... | 14:16 |
| MoritzJT | And really sad. | 14:18 |
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| cehteh | eh wtf ... jolla is there .. and now i see so much pita .. let camera or android apps store data on sdcard ... enable ssh w/o devel mode | 14:24 |
| ggabriel | the phone should be able to pull an espresso | 14:25 |
| ggabriel | how hard is that, really | 14:25 |
| ggabriel | come on jolla :P | 14:25 |
| PaulePanter | cehteh: What do you mean? | 14:25 |
| PaulePanter | Your notes were too short for me to understand your problems. | 14:26 |
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| PaulePanter | I guess you also compare it to the N900 experience? | 14:26 |
| cehteh | whatever | 14:26 |
| cehteh | i just want it to store data on the sd card | 14:26 |
| PaulePanter | Ah. | 14:26 |
| ggabriel | open terminal | 14:26 |
| cehteh | camera has no setting for it .. yes i am reading hacks | 14:26 |
| ggabriel | use the "mv" command | 14:26 |
| ggabriel | you can do it today | 14:27 |
| cehteh | android needs some more work has no access to sdcard | 14:27 |
| ggabriel | or buy an apple, i'm sure they can... oh, wait | 14:27 |
| ggabriel | cehteh: there is a workaround for android accessing the sd card | 14:28 |
| ggabriel | you can do that today, too | 14:28 |
| ggabriel | or you can buy an android phone, i'm sure they all come with sd card... oh, wait | 14:28 |
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| cehteh | https://together.jolla.com/question/40802/how-to-format-your-usd-card-to-btrfs-and-share-space-with-android/?sort=votes&page=1 .. just trying that, doesnt work for me yet | 14:31 |
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| ggabriel | I'm sure folks here will be happy to help you if you explain your problem | 14:32 |
| cehteh | on reboot it just mounted the main volume | 14:33 |
| cehteh | /dev/mmcblk1 on /media/sdcard/52123c66-e60f-452a-bd3a-6e09d086e5ed type btrfs (rw,nosuid,nodev,noexec,noatime,dirsync,thread_pool=4,ssd,noacl,space_cache) | 14:33 |
| cehteh | newest sailfish | 14:34 |
| lainwir3d | o/ | 14:38 |
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| coderus | cehteh: did you modified alien script? | 15:04 |
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| cehteh | did what? | 15:05 |
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| coderus | chem|st: ping | 15:56 |
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| cehteh | so .. installing openssh from openrepos .. breaks developer mode and thus ssh completely :D | 19:32 |
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| r0kk3rz | oops | 19:34 |
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| cehteh | mhm so without devel mode and root access .. how to fix it :D | 19:49 |
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| TemeV | nice work, sir :) | 19:50 |
| TemeV | sounds like you need some recovery mode | 19:50 |
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| cehteh | guess i reinstall tomorrow | 19:51 |
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| TemeV | Maybe you can install correct openssh package via gui | 19:52 |
| TemeV | And I think there was some terminal in open repos you can use | 19:52 |
| cehteh | the terminal has no root | 19:52 |
| TemeV | su-devel doesn't work? | 19:52 |
| cehteh | only when devel mode is enabled | 19:53 |
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| cehteh | does the sudo from openrepos work? | 19:54 |
| cehteh | nemo has no passwd normall or? | 19:54 |
| r0kk3rz | cehteh: nemo has the developer mode password... | 19:57 |
| cehteh | developer mode is broken | 19:57 |
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| r0kk3rz | cehteh: get into the recovery mode shell, and see if you can fix the package | 19:58 |
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| TemeV | maybe you can set root password from recovery mode and use su | 19:59 |
| tiwake | come on, I'm kind of waiting for a relatively up to date jolla cellphone... heh | 20:00 |
| tiwake | my N900 is starting to have issues | 20:00 |
| cehteh | hey i brought the jolla because i hoped its more free than android, yet alone getting root and installing openssh is pita | 20:00 |
| tiwake | any information on that indian cellphone company? | 20:01 |
| TemeV | cehteh: yeah, needs one tap in settings. Real pita | 20:01 |
| r0kk3rz | indeed, it pained me so much to enable dev mode | 20:01 |
| cehteh | the jolla hardware is ok'ish, lacks some n900 stuff .. but software wise there are really a lot regressions | 20:01 |
| Ezko | took me weeks to figure that out | 20:01 |
| cehteh | i dont want passwords .. i want a normal sshd where i can login with key auth | 20:02 |
| cehteh | and normall disabled devel mode | 20:02 |
| TemeV | what is the problem having developer mode on? | 20:03 |
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| r0kk3rz | tiwake: allegedly we will see intex phone in a few months, and will be sold in europe | 20:03 |
| Mikaela | Is there a NY kind of sweeping for Jolla | 20:03 |
| Mikaela | ? | 20:03 |
| TemeV | NY? New York? | 20:04 |
| Mikaela | Swiping, I need more raining with this thing | 20:04 |
| tiwake | r0kk3rz: well yeah, I'm screwed here in USA anyway, so I'd have to use a third party to get a sailfishOS based phone anyway | 20:05 |
| r0kk3rz | tiwake: ah, you're american, yeah... you might be out of luck on that one | 20:05 |
| TemeV | USA makes it really pita to get a phone into market | 20:05 |
| r0kk3rz | indeed, that and the lack of common mobile bands | 20:06 |
| tiwake | well, I use GSM already | 20:06 |
| TemeV | yeah, both technical and legal issues make it difficult | 20:06 |
| tiwake | cause I kind of hate CDMA companies around here | 20:06 |
| tiwake | lol | 20:06 |
| tiwake | but regardless, I don't mind waiting a long time to get a cellphone | 20:07 |
| r0kk3rz | tiwake: most people like to have good mobile data to go along with their smartphones | 20:07 |
| r0kk3rz | but gsm should be fine | 20:07 |
| tiwake | r0kk3rz: I don't have "mobile data" :P | 20:07 |
| r0kk3rz | tiwake: the nexus 5 running sailfish seems to be a popular option in north america | 20:08 |
| tiwake | who makes the nexus? | 20:09 |
| r0kk3rz | that ones made by LG i think, but its a google nexus thing | 20:09 |
| tiwake | I'm kind of a snob with who makes the stuff I own | 20:09 |
| tiwake | lol | 20:09 |
| r0kk3rz | as is your entitlement | 20:09 |
| cehteh | eww .. i tinhk i have no usb networking for the recovery shell here | 20:11 |
| cehteh | oh works :) | 20:12 |
| cehteh | # passwd | 20:14 |
| cehteh | passwd: unknown uid 0 | 20:14 |
| cehteh | \o/ -- -fuu | 20:14 |
| cehteh | where are passwords stored? | 20:15 |
| r0kk3rz | cehteh: i think in recovery shell you need to mount the main root fs | 20:16 |
| r0kk3rz | then chroot into it | 20:16 |
| cehteh | ah | 20:16 |
| r0kk3rz | never actually done it myself | 20:16 |
| cehteh | make sense | 20:16 |
| cehteh | but there is a shitload of partition .. sounds like fun | 20:17 |
| TemeV | /dev/mmcblk0p28 is the one you want | 20:17 |
| r0kk3rz | cehteh: remember is btrfs | 20:17 |
| cehteh | with subvolumes :) | 20:17 |
| r0kk3rz | correct | 20:17 |
| cehteh | TemeV: thanks | 20:18 |
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| Nicd- | soft bricked your jolla in one day? is that a record? ;) | 20:20 |
| cehteh | i am fast :) | 20:21 |
| cehteh | half a day | 20:21 |
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| cehteh | well .. try to reproduce it: install the openssh from openrepos | 20:21 |
| Nicd- | I won't | 20:21 |
| Nicd- | already had enough of a bad time when I installed openssh from homebrew on OS X: D | 20:22 |
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| cehteh | ok .. somewhy worked... accepted the new password .. but next time remind me to add myself to sudoers :D | 20:23 |
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| cehteh | .. ok sucess | 20:47 |
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| cehteh | .https://together.jolla.com/question/89476/cannot-re-enable-developer-mode/ .. iamnotthefirst | 20:50 |
| cehteh | i should make a acocunt at tjc and reply how to fix that tomorrow | 20:51 |
| cehteh | anyone here with more insight: is it right that openssh *is* installed all the time and devel-mode only enables it via systemd? or does enabling devel mode instal openssh and deinstall it when disabled? | 20:53 |
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| TemeV | after your adventure... I'm not surprised :) | 21:00 |
| tbr | cehteh: the obvious answer is not to fuck around with platform packages by installing binaries from unknown third parties | 21:00 |
| cehteh | tbr: if i didnt want to tinker with the device i would have buyed an iphone | 21:01 |
| tbr | cehteh: that can be done without running such risks, or if you are into that, don't complain and just nuke and restore from recovery | 21:02 |
| cehteh | but it *should* have an option to enable ssh aside from devel mode, maybe with a dedicated user and strict permissions by default only | 21:02 |
| tbr | the average end user has no clue what a SSH is and which wine you drink with it | 21:02 |
| cehteh | jolla is not for average end users | 21:03 |
| cehteh | anyway i dont say everyone *must* enable ssh | 21:03 |
| tbr | the device and its UI are designed for end users | 21:03 |
| cehteh | i just expect that on any device i have | 21:03 |
| tbr | the N900 was a developer device | 21:03 |
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| cehteh | considering how much stuff are still lacking i would say its not end user ready | 21:04 |
| cehteh | even my grandma would want to store her photos on sdcard | 21:05 |
| tbr | that is a whole different story | 21:05 |
| tbr | you can't try to justify one with the other | 21:05 |
| cehteh | well still .. i brought it for my personal use and want to customize it to my needs, nothing more | 21:05 |
| cehteh | and ssh is really mandatory | 21:06 |
| cehteh | for me | 21:06 |
| tbr | then use developer mode, it's the platform mandated way for it | 21:06 |
| cehteh | thats a joke | 21:07 |
| cehteh | or lame excuse | 21:07 |
| r0kk3rz | why? | 21:07 |
| tbr | if you don't like the platform, feel free to break it, but you get to keep both pieces | 21:07 |
| r0kk3rz | developer mode is the 'i know what im doing give me the keys' option | 21:07 |
| cehteh | because i want key auth and not all the other things devel mode enables | 21:07 |
| tbr | you can dump your keys in after enabling developer mode | 21:08 |
| tbr | worked a-ok for me | 21:08 |
| cehteh | but i have to have the device permanently in devel mode, with all things it enables | 21:08 |
| cehteh | sure works but feels a bit improper | 21:08 |
| tbr | it's like wanting to use adb but complaining that you have to put android in developer mode | 21:09 |
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| tbr | there is no other active overhead than sshd running AFAIU | 21:09 |
| tbr | at least not by default | 21:09 |
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| cehteh | on my wifes cyanogen mode i connected adb once in devel mode, enabled ssh and disabled devel mode afterwards | 21:10 |
| r0kk3rz | 'all the things' what things? it sets a password, and gives you terminal | 21:10 |
| r0kk3rz | thats about the extent of it | 21:10 |
| cehteh | now her phone is part of the backup-servers business, her photos get synced to the server automatically and she has a gui to push mp3's onto the phone via rsync .. thats all whats needd | 21:11 |
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| r0kk3rz | unless you want to have ssh access without root access, which is legitimate i guess | 21:11 |
| cehteh | yeah thats ok | 21:12 |
| r0kk3rz | but not really a covered use case | 21:12 |
| cehteh | well not for the backup server part | 21:12 |
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| cehteh | but jolla states that devel mode may void your warranty .. hey i only want to push some mp3's and pics around, that shouldnt require something which may void the warranty | 21:13 |
| r0kk3rz | cehteh: jolla are generally fine with using devel-mode and warranties | 21:13 |
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| r0kk3rz | so long as you havent obviously cooked the thing using your new powers | 21:13 |
| tbr | though enabling developer mode once marks the device as tainted, forever | 21:14 |
| cehteh | yeah | 21:14 |
| tbr | their warranty handling and procedures are a separate story to that | 21:14 |
| cehteh | still one might feel uneasy about that | 21:14 |
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| tbr | enabling 3rd party RPMs is actually known to void warranty | 21:15 |
| cehteh | ssh / rsync or whatever else you can do with ssh, even without root is often (when wrapped in a gui) the most easy and secure way to acomplish some tasks | 21:15 |
| tbr | as in if you fuck your device up beyond recovery by openrepos, then you will _pay_ for care to fix it | 21:15 |
| cehteh | even windows users could use winscp like a filemanager to securely copy stuff from and to the device | 21:15 |
| tbr | nobody disputes the godsend from the FSM that SSH is | 21:16 |
| cehteh | i fixed my issues meanwhile | 21:16 |
| cehteh | but still i would like some plan how to enable openssh w/o devel mode | 21:16 |
| tbr | good luck, you're on your own there | 21:17 |
| cehteh | remembering on the n900 there where battery lifetime issues with devel mode, i dunno whats the case with the jolla but it certainly does more than adding a terminal to the launchers and enabling openssh | 21:18 |
| cehteh | if thats the only thing .. mmkay, i should live with devel mode | 21:18 |
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| kimmoli | happily ever after... | 21:19 |
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| caitlin | anyone know of a way to turn off vibrate on things like texts and emails? | 21:19 |
| phlixi | [2015-11-16 22:15:54] <cehteh> even windows users could use winscp like a filemanager to securely copy stuff from and to the device <<<- actually i use filezilla :D | 21:19 |
| cehteh | and running a ftp server on the jolla? | 21:20 |
| caitlin | the only thing my dead iphone did better was have a “srsly leave me alone” between certan hours, the LED is thwarted by laying the phone face down, but the wife complains that the ZZZZZT wakes her up, and she’s really not lying on top of it or anything :P | 21:20 |
| phlixi | cehteh: SFTP | 21:21 |
| cehteh | so you need ssh on the jolla too | 21:21 |
| phlixi | ep | 21:21 |
| phlixi | yep | 21:21 |
| TemeV | caitlin: you have to disable all vibrations from the settings | 21:21 |
| cehteh | i dont have windows dont know that software | 21:21 |
| caitlin | could i attach that to a cron TemeV? | 21:21 |
| caitlin | i turned off “touch screen vibration” in “sounds and feedback” | 21:22 |
| phlixi | like 10 years ago i switched from winscp to filezilla, i dont know anymore, but there was something winscp coulndt do filezilla can | 21:22 |
| caitlin | ideally i only want it between certain hours though :/ | 21:22 |
| kimmoli | wasnt there situations app (or some other ambience switcher?) for that? | 21:23 |
| phlixi | iirc there is an app for automatically switch stuff | 21:23 |
| phlixi | it looked horribly but kinda useful (however i could not use it) | 21:23 |
| cehteh | is there cron? .. i thought systemd rules them all | 21:24 |
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| phlixi | i would need to (de-)activate wlan-ap once i enter/leave home (but of course while AP is active, you can not see wlan around...) | 21:24 |
| cehteh | phlixi: i was thinking about such an app for the n900, android (CM) has this profile switch thing, something similar | 21:26 |
| r0kk3rz | there is situations | 21:26 |
| caitlin | there is in fact no crontab | 21:26 |
| cehteh | trigger ambiences by events like wlan, bluetooth connectivity, if the device is plugged in, if it lays still or is moveing and possibly position data | 21:26 |
| phlixi | https://together.jolla.com/question/16434/cronjob-on-sailfish/ | 21:27 |
| caitlin | neat, thanks for the pointer | 21:28 |
| phlixi | cehteh: sounds like the app kimmoli, r0kk3rz and i reffered to | 21:28 |
| caitlin | I’ll see if i can get a “bedtime” ambience which turns it off sorted, otherwise, to the scripts! | 21:28 |
| cehteh | is there one? | 21:28 |
| r0kk3rz | yep, is called situations on jolla store | 21:28 |
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| phlixi | i do not remember the name, but "situations" sounds right | 21:28 |
| cehteh | ah nice | 21:29 |
| cehteh | trying that | 21:29 |
| pbrunier | how can I give my own apps a try without losing waranty? My Jolla will arrive next week...I hope. | 21:30 |
| r0kk3rz | pbrunier: you dont need to worry too much about that | 21:36 |
| phlixi | pbrunier: besides thedeveloper mode there is also a "use third party apps" checkbox | 21:36 |
| phlixi | while the devmode officially breaks waranty, i dont think the third party checkbox does | 21:36 |
| kimmoli | ...or if one wants to change settings oldskool; http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=1438556#post1438556 | 21:37 |
| phlixi | :D | 21:37 |
| phlixi | dont they go off and on in the pocket by themself? | 21:38 |
| pbrunier | thanks for the info guys | 21:39 |
| phlixi | wow, deinstalling android support whipes all data | 21:40 |
| phlixi | that really sucks :( | 21:40 |
| phlixi | that sucks especially because reinstalling didnt help, android apps still dont work | 21:42 |
| phlixi | so i lost data without the benefit of fixing something | 21:42 |
| pbrunier | hmmm that sucks. why did they design it that way? | 21:43 |
| phlixi | the apks are still there (i could just redownload them) but the app data is whiped | 21:43 |
| phlixi | wtf? | 21:43 |
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| r0kk3rz | not all that surprising really | 21:47 |
| phlixi | well, in fact i think it is quie surprising if the android support suddenly stops working | 21:48 |
| phlixi | i had android apps running, closed them, got to flight mode, and the next morning they just do not start anymore | 21:48 |
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| r0kk3rz | yeah thats not normal | 21:50 |
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| chiromante | hello | 21:53 |
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| chiromante | I was wondering what degree of compatibility there is between Android and Sailfish as installed on a Jolla I would buy these days | 22:00 |
| chiromante | I mean, can I run applications from Android 4? | 22:01 |
| phlixi | chiromante: compatibility is like 4.something | 22:01 |
| phlixi | last time i asked wether i should use firefox for android-9 or android-11 the answer was 11 | 22:02 |
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| chiromante | first of all thank you phlixi | 22:02 |
| r0kk3rz | threres tjc questions about android compatibillity with some more info | 22:02 |
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| chiromante | I was thinking about buying one but I have some things I would like to understand first | 22:03 |
| eugenio | Dalvik VM on the phone is 4.1.2 | 22:03 |
| chiromante | for example: is there some kind of firewall / way to limit privileges to the apps? | 22:04 |
| eugenio | (there are plans to upgrade that to 4.4 AFAIK) | 22:04 |
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| eugenio | native apps no, dunno about Android ones | 22:04 |
| r0kk3rz | eugenio: reasonably certain thats just the tablet, not the phone | 22:04 |
| eugenio | the tablet already has 4.4 | 22:05 |
| phlixi | chiromante you can select for each installed android app whether it is allowed to have background task or not and additionally you can set for all aps one setting whether android apps should be alloewd to access phonebook | 22:05 |
| rmull | Anybody use Jolla (phone) in the USA? | 22:05 |
| r0kk3rz | rmull: theres a few, but its not the best situation | 22:06 |
| phlixi | let me correct that, you can select whether an app is allowed to have a background process started at bootup | 22:06 |
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| chiromante | phlixi, I would like to stop some applications from using the Internet (or any connection at all) | 22:06 |
| rmull | r0kk3rz: Okay, thanks | 22:07 |
| phlixi | chiromante besides those two settings, there are none i know of in gui | 22:07 |
| chiromante | thank you again :) | 22:07 |
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| r0kk3rz | rmull: i think nexus 5 running sailfish is the preferred solution in north america | 22:08 |
| r0kk3rz | since the jphone doesnt support us carrier frequencies | 22:08 |
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| tiwake | r0kk3rz: any idea how much the nexus 5 runs? | 22:10 |
| r0kk3rz | reasonably well afaik | 22:11 |
| r0kk3rz | no android support of course, but otherwise ok | 22:11 |
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| tiwake | erm | 22:12 |
| tiwake | I mean money | 22:12 |
| tiwake | lol | 22:12 |
| tiwake | r0kk3rz: seems its no longer produced | 22:12 |
| r0kk3rz | missed the much | 22:12 |
| r0kk3rz | no idea actually | 22:12 |
| phlixi | nexus 5 are cheap on ebay | 22:12 |
| tiwake | https://store.google.com/product/nexus_5_black_16gb?playredirect=true | 22:12 |
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| chiromante | when I buy a new Jolla, how much of it is proprietary? I suppose some bits must be non-free like some firmware or driver | 22:33 |
| eugenio | most of the UI | 22:34 |
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| chiromante | oh | 22:35 |
| phlixi | thats probably the most you can get atm | 22:36 |
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| phlixi | well, if you do not count open moko (do they still exist?) | 22:36 |
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| tiwake | I don't care open or closed source... I just want sane... lol | 22:38 |
| phlixi | tiwake: then you should probably get ios/android :D | 22:39 |
| tiwake | what | 22:39 |
| tiwake | iOS is... not very sane | 22:39 |
| tiwake | esp. if you are a programmer | 22:39 |
| eugenio | chiromante, you can _still_ modify it as most parts are written in QML | 22:40 |
| phlixi | you can have your own certificate now on ios | 22:40 |
| tiwake | donno about android, last I knew the UI was not that great, but as far as I know they changed up a bunch of stuff with android version 5 | 22:41 |
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| tiwake | but then again, vendor lockdown, unless you count custom roms? | 22:41 |
| tiwake | donno, I havent looked that much into android | 22:41 |
| chiromante | on wikipedia it's written that "some parts are free, some are proprietary". Is there any list of which of which? | 22:42 |
| phlixi | tiwake: i use some android and ios devices at work, i can see pretty much no reason at all to use not one of the two... except one, which is not at all technical, but only ideology/politics... if you do not like google/apple(/ms) then you have a reason | 22:43 |
| eugenio | chiromante, https://sailfishos.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/Sailfish_Architecture_v0.5.1.png | 22:43 |
| chiromante | eugenio, thank you, that was exactly what I was looking for | 22:43 |
| eugenio | also https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/SailfishOSS, but it's a year old | 22:43 |
| tiwake | phlixi: I like being able to do whatever I want with the stuff I buy :P | 22:43 |
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| eugenio | they have promised to open source more parts soon, though | 22:44 |
| phlixi | tiwake: you can doo much nore with both of them | 22:44 |
| chiromante | is the android runtime proprietary? | 22:44 |
| tiwake | phlixi: including if I want to make my own programs? | 22:44 |
| phlixi | chiromante: yes | 22:44 |
| phlixi | tiwake: yes of course. | 22:44 |
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| phlixi | there is a sideload checkbox in android, just like in sailfish. and in ios its the same, just a bit more sophisicate, you can make your own "enterprise certificate" and run your own code | 22:45 |
| tiwake | sideload? | 22:46 |
| phlixi | install apps not from the offial store | 22:46 |
| tiwake | oh | 22:46 |
| phlixi | of course not every android phone is the same, i would watchout for some nexus devices, others might have closed bootloadder etc... but if you look for the best thing, its never jolla... its only selling point is that you do not pay with your private data to google or apple | 22:47 |
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| phlixi | and even if you really like the UI, you can still install jolla launcer on android (i guess... never tried that. i dont thinnk the jolla UI is that much better... actually the n9 was better a lot ;-) | 22:49 |
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| tiwake | maybe sometime soon I'll research cellphones in USA that can run sailfishOS without issues | 22:50 |
| tiwake | cause I like doing nerdy things like that (go figure, talking about cellphones on IRC) | 22:51 |
| phlixi | :) | 22:51 |
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| tiwake | phlixi: I also don't like paying for things that I don't think should exist... I kind of loved it when jolla didnt go with the exFAT license for the tablet | 22:57 |
| phlixi | frankly, money wise, you get way more at android | 22:57 |
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| phlixi | (remember, you pay with data^^) | 22:58 |
| tiwake | yeah, not gonna get a data plan | 22:59 |
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| tiwake | I bought my nokia N900 right out so I didnt have to pay for data | 22:59 |
| tiwake | or any kind of cellphone plan | 22:59 |
| tiwake | saved a bunch of money :P | 23:00 |
| phlixi | i do not talk about data plans | 23:00 |
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| phlixi | i talk about privacy | 23:00 |
| tiwake | oh, gotcha, yeah | 23:00 |
| phlixi | at google you pay with your personal data | 23:00 |
| phlixi | and apple also soaks everyting into their icloud | 23:01 |
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| tiwake | yeaaaah... not for me | 23:05 |
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| r0kk3rz | phlixi: i dont think apple really cares for spying on their users, its their other policies which are user-hostile | 23:21 |
| phlixi | if they let me install my own icloud on my own server and configure that in the iphone, i am sold | 23:22 |
| r0kk3rz | with the more recent stuff, it seems apple is pretty good on privacy related things | 23:22 |
| phlixi | but they insist on using their infra, i dont like that | 23:22 |
| r0kk3rz | yeah well, they insist on vendor-lockin | 23:22 |
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