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| xkr47 | for the record, I'd like to report that Bose QC15 (Quiet comfort 15) headphones works great as headset with the Jolla phone (when using the included apple headset cable) - with the minor imperfection that only the play/pause button of the available three buttons seems to work | 07:56 |
|---|---|---|
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| xkr47 | if anyone knows if it's possible to try to tweak those remaining two buttons to work, let me know! | 07:57 |
| coderus | next/previous buttons? | 07:57 |
| coderus | need to check journalctl or something to see if systemreceiving any signals of these buttons | 07:58 |
| xkr47 | how? | 07:59 |
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| kimmoli | or with evdev_trace -t | 08:24 |
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| xkr47 | journalctl only showed anything when pressing the play/pause buttons, the others produced nothing | 08:30 |
| xkr47 | kimmoli, in what package is evdev_trace ? | 08:30 |
| kimmoli | xkr47: mce-tools | 08:32 |
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| ikke-t | aaargh... my phone got "permanently locked" while bicycling to work. Any ideas how to recover without loosing all stuff? | 09:09 |
| ggabriel | ikke-t: search tjc | 09:09 |
| ikke-t | ggabriel, i got this: https://together.jolla.com/question/41823/howto-permanent-device-lock-recover-your-data-onto-sdcard-if-you-know-the-pin/ | 09:09 |
| ggabriel | the last time I did it, i had to enter to the recovery console, tgz my home, restore factory settings, update to latest sfos, reinstall apps, restore tgz, happy days | 09:10 |
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| flux | yeah, I've managed to pocket-type one or two times the PUK-code before I noticed it.. | 09:10 |
| flux | they really should make that more difficult :) | 09:10 |
| ikke-t | ggabriel, damned what a job... | 09:10 |
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| ggabriel | ikke-t: it takes a couple of hours if you're technically savvy | 09:10 |
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| ggabriel | but it's the price you pay for a certain level of security | 09:10 |
| ggabriel | else anybody could steal your phone, wipe it, sell it in another country where they don't care where phones comes from | 09:11 |
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| ikke-t | yeap, i was thinking more like a support store would have a tool to unlock it | 09:11 |
| ggabriel | you can always set the numbre of tries to unlimited though ;) | 09:11 |
| ikke-t | can i? | 09:11 |
| ggabriel | ikke-t: but then the support store could steal your phone and sell it :) | 09:11 |
| ggabriel | ikke-t: i'm 99% sure you can | 09:11 |
| flux | let's say it has 2^n second delay between asking security code | 09:11 |
| ggabriel | wait | 09:11 |
| flux | I'm pretty sure it would never be brute forced unless you were super unlucky.. | 09:12 |
| ikke-t | flux, i like that ide | 09:12 |
| ikke-t | a | 09:12 |
| ggabriel | ikke-t: you can't, max 50 :( | 09:12 |
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| flux | hmm, I have number of tries 'Unlimited'? | 09:12 |
| ggabriel | flux: yeah, but then i telnet to recovery mode and leave the computer to do the brute force, wait, etc | 09:12 |
| flux | is it still 50? | 09:13 |
| ggabriel | flux: how did you set unlimited? | 09:13 |
| flux | ggabriel, realize that brute forcing 20 entries would take a bit less than a month | 09:13 |
| ikke-t | it's the microsoft exchange that forces the lock to be on, perhaps it also forces the amount of retries | 09:13 |
| flux | I don't know, it's just at the right edge of the bar and it says Unlimited | 09:13 |
| flux | I'm not touching it :-) | 09:13 |
| ggabriel | flux: cool, computers can wait | 09:14 |
| ggabriel | flux: interesting... mine says 50 | 09:14 |
| ggabriel | what version are you on? | 09:14 |
| flux | ggabriel, also 30 tries would be 34 years | 09:14 |
| tbr | yes ActiveSync can enforce such things through its device policy | 09:14 |
| flux | ggabriel, at some point it just becomes simpler to crack the device open and read the flash directly | 09:14 |
| ggabriel | flux: i get your point, i think you can still brute force it though | 09:14 |
| ggabriel | e.g., reboot the device between tries | 09:15 |
| ggabriel | fwiw, the delay thing is just a program that could be bypassed | 09:15 |
| ggabriel | anyway | 09:15 |
| ggabriel | anything could be bypassed | 09:15 |
| ggabriel | i think somebody discovered where this pin is stored as well and made a tjc about it | 09:15 |
| ggabriel | which is useful if you know the code | 09:15 |
| ggabriel | i..e, you don't have ot wipe the device | 09:16 |
| ggabriel | flux: i'm thinking this unlimited vs 50 tries could be ba bug :) | 09:16 |
| flux | ggabriel, if you truly want something to be protected on the device, it would need to be protected with encryption and using a key longer than 5 digits | 09:16 |
| flux | device locking is just to keep the standard thief out from it | 09:17 |
| ikke-t | i do know the pin, that's no problem. how does it help if i know it? | 09:18 |
| ikke-t | ah, i assume recovery asks for it | 09:18 |
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| ggabriel | flux: agree | 09:27 |
| ggabriel | ikke-t: you assume well | 09:27 |
| ikke-t | https://together.jolla.com/question/91297/how-to-recover-from-permanent-device-lock/ | 09:27 |
| ikke-t | that perhaps sets it open? ^ | 09:27 |
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| ggabriel | flux: actually, I wouldn't mind mind remotely exploding the device | 09:27 |
| ggabriel | ikke-t: i'm afraid you'll have to do the research :) ENOTIME atm | 09:28 |
| ggabriel | but arm yourself with patience | 09:28 |
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| ikke-t | sweet: https://together.jolla.com/question/91297/how-to-recover-from-permanent-device-lock/ | 09:39 |
| ikke-t | trying | 09:39 |
| ikke-t | the max retry thingie | 09:39 |
| ikke-t | yay! | 09:40 |
| ikke-t | worked | 09:40 |
| ikke-t | pheeew | 09:40 |
| * ikke-t <3 communities | 09:41 | |
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| Sail0r | http://www.jollausers.com/2015/05/sailfish-os-to-become-russias-official-operating-system-for-mobile/ | 10:35 |
| Yaniel | whoa, easy there | 10:35 |
| ggabriel | a it of an excessively exaggerated title perhaps? | 10:35 |
| ggabriel | (since tizen was in the equation as well) | 10:35 |
| ggabriel | s/it/bit | 10:35 |
| ggabriel | i should say TIZEN | 10:36 |
| ggabriel | because people write it in capitals, must be a korean thing ;) | 10:36 |
| Sail0r | hehe | 10:36 |
| Yaniel | seems to be a common thing in the CJK area | 10:36 |
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| Acce | I thought they said they want to build their own system using some parts of Sailfish | 10:36 |
| ggabriel | not sure what's in it for them | 10:38 |
| ggabriel | and if they will use parts, then they'll use mer more than sailfish | 10:38 |
| Yaniel | sailfish-secure? | 10:39 |
| Aciid | Добро пожаловать в наши новые повелители | 10:40 |
| Aciid | есть какие-либо новые адаптеры? | 10:40 |
| flux | in other news: Russian will be the official language of #jollamobile as of 2016-04-01? | 10:42 |
| Stskeeps | ah no | 10:42 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 10:42 |
| ggabriel | how hard can it be | 10:42 |
| narchie | thanks jolla! | 10:45 |
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| andybranson | i think my mounting may be broken. can i check my fstab with someone? | 10:52 |
| andybranson | is this right? | 10:52 |
| andybranson | UUID=0f8a2490-53ed-4ff6-ba34-b81df3430387 / btrfs defaults,autodefrag,noatime 0 0 | 10:53 |
| andybranson | UUID=0f8a2490-53ed-4ff6-ba34-b81df3430387 /home btrfs noatime,subvol=@home 0 0 | 10:53 |
| chem|st | andybranson: pastebin your /proc/mounts | 10:53 |
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| Yaniel | andybranson: note the subvol=@home on the 2nd line | 10:54 |
| chem|st | and yes fstab is fine | 10:54 |
| andybranson | http://pastebin.com/tcRfNEMq | 10:55 |
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| chem|st | andybranson: and what exactly is your problem? | 10:55 |
| andybranson | my .local/.../privileged seems to be broken, and the last thing i installed was fishNetMount from openrepos | 10:56 |
| andybranson | i wondered if it had broken something in my mounts | 10:56 |
| chem|st | your mounts look fine to me | 10:58 |
| andybranson | thanks | 10:58 |
| andybranson | specifically, the jolla-calendar no longer has access to Calendars/mkcal, though caldav seems to still be able to write to it | 10:59 |
| chem|st | did you tinker with any permissions? | 11:00 |
| chem|st | is there space (for user) left on device | 11:00 |
| andybranson | no, but i did remove the sqlite dbs to try to fix it. they were recreated. | 11:00 |
| andybranson | will check btrfs space | 11:01 |
| andybranson | used 11.12GiB, so that's fine | 11:02 |
| chem|st | you better move some stuff to uSD... | 11:03 |
| andybranson | well, actual used is 8.18GiB | 11:03 |
| andybranson | Total devices 1 FS bytes used 8.18GiB | 11:04 |
| andybranson | devid 1 size 13.75GiB used 11.12GiB path /dev/mmcblk0p28 | 11:04 |
| andybranson | it seems to me that the calendar process doesn't get to join the 'privileged' group. is that how that works? | 11:04 |
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| chem|st | ps faux under what mapplauncher process does your calendar run? | 11:09 |
| chem|st | I guess you did reboot already | 11:10 |
| andybranson | nemo 1367 0.0 0.8 58212 7220 ? Ss 12:14 0:00 \_ /usr/libexec/mapplauncherd/booster-silica-qt5 --systemd | 11:13 |
| andybranson | nemo 1406 0.2 5.2 123672 43164 ? Ssl 12:14 0:08 | \_ /usr/bin/voicecall-ui -prestart | 11:13 |
| andybranson | nemo 7135 0.1 5.5 127184 46012 ? Ssl 12:27 0:04 | \_ /usr/bin/jolla-calendar | 11:13 |
| andybranson | is that the right bit? yes i've rebooted several times | 11:13 |
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| andybranson | /proc/<calendar pid>/status contains: | 11:26 |
| andybranson | Groups: 39 100 992 995 996 999 1000 1002 1003 1004 1005 1006 1024 100000 | 11:26 |
| andybranson | and privileged is 998. should that be in there? | 11:26 |
| andybranson | ah but Gid: 100000 998 998 998 | 11:27 |
| andybranson | so that should be correct | 11:27 |
| andybranson | if i chown privileged to nemo and give it user access, i don't get that error from the calendar though. | 11:28 |
| andybranson | although then it complains that the db is corrupt | 11:28 |
| ggabriel | wait.... have you tried accessing the db? maybe that's your issue... | 11:29 |
| andybranson | sqlite3 opens it no problem, and it's been recreated and updated by caldav | 11:33 |
| ggabriel | ok then | 11:33 |
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| andybranson | thanks for the suggestions all, my sailfish knowledge increasing :) | 11:48 |
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| phlixi_mobile_ | hi, my jolla jusr turned off... is there something like /proc/bootreason or similar? | 18:15 |
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| phlixi_mobile_ | ...it never did ut again after i put a paper under the battery and set it to prefer 3g (both around september last year) | 18:17 |
| Mikaela | I think that the answer is journalctl, alternatively dmesg, but I am not sure | 18:17 |
| phlixi_mobile_ | ...and now twice today ;( | 18:17 |
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| phlixi_mobile_ | thanks Mikaela, ill google that ;) | 18:18 |
| Mikaela | they are terminal commands | 18:18 |
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| phlixi_mobile_ | journalctl says something like no journal files where found | 18:25 |
| Mikaela | :( | 18:25 |
| Acce | phlixi_mobile_: devel-su? | 18:26 |
| phlixi_mobile_ | ...and dmesg outputs too much... ill look into that via ssh | 18:26 |
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| phlixi_mobile_ | well, seems like i can not enter the pass in fingerterms keyboard ;) | 18:28 |
| narchie | when russian here? | 18:32 |
| narchie | official langage | 18:32 |
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| Aciid | Добро пожаловать в наши новые повелители | 18:34 |
| r0kk3rz | narchie: my guess would be shortly after they get their translation server up and running | 18:34 |
| phlixi_mobile_ | pasting password works ;) | 18:36 |
| phlixi_mobile_ | as root i get a lot of stuff ... | 18:36 |
| mdxth | there is also /var/log/systemboot.log | 18:37 |
| phlixi_mobile_ | on a first glance it seems to begin at boot | 18:38 |
| phlixi_mobile_ | while it cirectly states poweronbutton as bootreason, rhis doesnt tell anytging avoutvwhat was going onwhen it crashed ;( | 18:39 |
| r0kk3rz | phlixi_mobile_: journalctl -b -1 shows previous boot | 18:42 |
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| phlixi | unfortunately "[root@Jolla nemo]# journalctl -b -1" returns "Failed to look up boot -1: Cannot assign requested address" :-( | 19:02 |
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| kimmoli | you need to have persistent logs enabled | 19:05 |
| kimmoli | https://together.jolla.com/question/4842/how-to-enable-more-detailed-and-persistent-logs-on-jolla-device/?answer=27827#post-id-27827 | 19:06 |
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| phlixi | ok, so there is no data for the last two crashes... | 19:07 |
| phlixi | makes sense while there is no logging :-) | 19:08 |
| Mikaela | I could probably do that too just in case | 19:08 |
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| phlixi | however, this seems to be quite chatty, would i have to delete this file regualry? to prevent it fills up my "drive" to quickly? | 19:09 |
| kimmoli | there is limit of Mbytes or something | 19:10 |
| phlixi | ok, so no problem | 19:10 |
| kimmoli | journalling purges it automatically | 19:10 |
| phlixi | this means i should have to write down the time of the next "incident", in order to look it up the next time ... | 19:11 |
| r0kk3rz | is also binary format, so likely to be a bit better size wise compared to text file | 19:11 |
| phlixi | ok | 19:11 |
| kimmoli | journal has some reboot tag, but i'm not sure is it written at powerup or down | 19:12 |
| kimmoli | https://together.jolla.com/question/57254/personal-log-battery-contact-issue-observations/ | 19:12 |
| kimmoli | this is something i collected about the bad connection issue | 19:12 |
| M4rtinK | inserting a piece of paper around the battery fixed it completely for me | 19:15 |
| M4rtinK | just a piece of normal 8Og paper folded once or twice for for added thickness | 19:15 |
| M4rtinK | no spontaneous reboots since then | 19:15 |
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| Yaniel | wut | 19:19 |
| Yaniel | suddenly no python | 19:20 |
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| tuomasjjrasanen | Yep, a piece of folded paper worked here, too. | 19:21 |
| Yaniel | interesting how it just disappeared | 19:21 |
| Yaniel | since I didn't really do anything special and ytplayer needs it | 19:22 |
| r0kk3rz | Yaniel: did you remember to feed it? | 19:22 |
| r0kk3rz | you cant blame it for escaping if you dont feed it | 19:22 |
| r0kk3rz | poor python | 19:22 |
| Yaniel | I'm pretty sure I've tended to both of them properly | 19:23 |
| phlixi | M4rtinK: last september i started to use the jolla, and it had (for me) to main problems, "random" shutdowns (well, not completely random) and a second thing, that bluetooth and wlan sharing (always both together) stop working, after that only reboot helps | 19:23 |
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| phlixi | ...around the time i said "prefer 3g" and i also added paper... since then no shutdowns, (maybe one...or two over the moths) | 19:24 |
| phlixi | ...until today, now TWO "random shutdowns" | 19:24 |
| Yaniel | clean battery contacts | 19:24 |
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| phlixi | ah, and the '"bluetooth + wlan sharing" both disappears and only works again after reboot thing' is also gone, but i also do not have bluetooth enabled anymore. I have no indication whether this is related to not having bluetooth on, the paper, os-updates, or maybe temperature | 19:30 |
| phlixi | (or maybe due to "prefer 3g") | 19:31 |
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| Eli2_ | hi, is it possible to use jolla phone without an account ? | 19:32 |
| tigeli | Eli2_: yes | 19:32 |
| r0kk3rz | wont that mean you wont get updates though? | 19:33 |
| Eli2_ | can't i just manually flash an image ? | 19:34 |
| r0kk3rz | nope | 19:34 |
| Eli2_ | hmmmm, jolla might not be for me then :/ | 19:35 |
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| r0kk3rz | you will also have trouble enabling developer mode without a store account | 19:36 |
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| r0kk3rz | might be possible otherwise, but im not sure anyones really tried | 19:36 |
| Eli2_ | hmmm, so jolla is more closed than android ? | 19:36 |
| phlixi | i guess you will be stuck with something like 3210 then | 19:36 |
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| Nicd- | Eli2_: needing an account doesn't mean it is closed | 19:37 |
| Nicd- | they are different things | 19:37 |
| Eli2_ | what do you mean ? | 19:37 |
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| Eli2_ | i don't want an account | 19:38 |
| Eli2_ | so its closed for me, very simple | 19:38 |
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| Nicd- | sure, if that's what you define as closed | 19:39 |
| Eli2_ | how would you define it ? | 19:39 |
| Nicd- | I was thinking more about source and philosophy | 19:42 |
| Nicd- | they have pragmatic reasons for requiring accounts (stuff like managing updates, but I'm not an expert on that) | 19:42 |
| Eli2_ | i have not found any info on how to build the os, so nothing about it seems open at all | 19:43 |
| Yaniel | you have the wrong keywords | 19:43 |
| Yaniel | look for mer / nemomobile | 19:43 |
| phlixi | Eli2_: i guess you want to look for mer | 19:43 |
| phlixi | and yes there are closed parts, roughly some UI stuff and some driver stuff. afaiu thats not part of mer | 19:44 |
| Eli2_ | ahhh so jolla is a proprietary gui for mer | 19:44 |
| Eli2_ | and the phone is tied to the closed os | 19:44 |
| phlixi | kind of | 19:44 |
| Tegu | mer doesn't have a gui, though? | 19:44 |
| Eli2_ | so jolla is not at all what i am looking for | 19:45 |
| Eli2_ | thanks for your info | 19:45 |
| Nicd- | Eli2_: well, what is? | 19:45 |
| Tegu | but iirc there was some other project (glacier?) that was making a mer gui | 19:45 |
| Eli2_ | that clarified a lot | 19:45 |
| phlixi | well, i guess its a pretty good compromise, compared to the alternatives out there | 19:45 |
| Tegu | or nemo | 19:45 |
| tigeli | Eli2_: there isn't 100% open source mobile os | 19:45 |
| tigeli | at least with hardware adaptation | 19:45 |
| Eli2_ | jeah, thats the problem :/ and i got excited for a bit :( | 19:46 |
| Tegu | oh, Glacier has been renamed to Grog, apparently | 19:46 |
| Eli2_ | cyanogenmod with fdroid is not too bad | 19:46 |
| Tegu | but there's still that driver stuff :/ | 19:47 |
| Tegu | blobs all around | 19:47 |
| phlixi | cyanogen + fdroid doesnt seem better to me in this aspect | 19:47 |
| Eli2_ | i don't need an account | 19:47 |
| Eli2_ | i can get the full sources | 19:48 |
| phlixi | maybe open moko or the like... | 19:48 |
| Nicd- | Eli2_: isn't the hardware adaptation still closed? | 19:48 |
| Yaniel | please do tell me where you get the full sources for the drivers | 19:48 |
| Nicd- | and when you go to hardware, all modems are closed | 19:49 |
| Tegu | :( but at least more of it is open in cyanogen? | 19:49 |
| Yaniel | hardly | 19:49 |
| phlixi | if you are not investing millions (not 1-2, probabably more like 10 or 100) you will have to live with blobs, or end up with something that is not "smart" | 19:50 |
| Tegu | sorry ambiguous "it", I meant the ui stuff | 19:50 |
| Tegu | and os | 19:50 |
| Tegu | not drivers | 19:50 |
| Eli2_ | jeah, i think ill just give up on all the smart crap for now then | 19:50 |
| Tegu | let's go the RMS way! | 19:50 |
| Tegu | RSM? I don't know the abbreviation | 19:50 |
| tigeli | Tegu: maybe vanilla android ui, but not any OEM's ui-side is open | 19:50 |
| Eli2_ | well nokia is still rock solid | 19:51 |
| Eli2_ | the non smart stuff | 19:51 |
| Tegu | tigeli: yea ofc, but at least the vanilla | 19:51 |
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| Eli2_ | so anyways, thanks all, ill keep an eye on this project | 19:52 |
| Tegu | yea, s40 is just fine. I have tried some samsung's dumbphone os and s40 felt better | 19:52 |
| Tegu | not much experience of others | 19:52 |
| phlixi | i do not remember if i needed some "account" to use the n900, which is pretty "smart" compared to s40 | 19:53 |
| phlixi | however, there is also a lot of closed stuff in it | 19:53 |
| Tegu | well I just thought about that "non-smart" stuff | 19:53 |
| phlixi | the "non smart stuff" is usually even more closed. any open baseband anywhre? | 19:54 |
| Nicd- | phlixi: not even Neo900 has open baseband | 19:55 |
| phlixi | did openmoko based deviced had them? | 19:55 |
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| Eli2_ | openmoko actually seems to be able to run a libre baseband http://bb.osmocom.org/trac/wiki/Hardware/Phones | 20:04 |
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| phlixi | yeah, but thats really hardcore stuff | 20:11 |
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| phlixi | simplyfied i think it looks like this: http://phlixi.de/qFDmkfC7FP4XFLAWJDd4/tradeoff.png and openmoko is for sure more on the right side, while jolla (at the moment) seems to be the best tradeoff, if you do not like that google (or other $evilcompany) records everything possible... | 20:15 |
| phlixi | oh, Eli2_ already left... nvm | 20:15 |
| phlixi | :-) | 20:15 |
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| r0kk3rz | i wonder if you could make a HADK style image for the jolla phone, based on available sources | 20:26 |
| r0kk3rz | you'd lose dalvik, but some might consider that a feature | 20:27 |
| phlixi | well, since Eli2_ is no longer here, i will answer for him: that changes pretty much nothing. | 20:28 |
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| phlixi | :-) | 20:28 |
| r0kk3rz | cant say it bothers me whether or not that person buys a jolla or not | 20:29 |
| r0kk3rz | we all make our own choices | 20:29 |
| phlixi | and frankly, then i would not see a reason to use the jolla hardware; if the "losses" are the same compared to superior hardware | 20:30 |
| phlixi | (besides supportting jolla, by buying the hardware) | 20:30 |
| r0kk3rz | well that depends on how tight your tinfoil hat is | 20:31 |
| r0kk3rz | maybe you want to build it from sources you can inspect and verify | 20:31 |
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| phlixi | as i understand, you wont be able to do so, because lack of hardware stuff | 20:32 |
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