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| Sail0r | now pebble gets #unlike, too ;) | 06:32 |
|---|---|---|
| Sail0r | http://www.theverge.com/2015/2/2/7947799/pebble-1-million-smartwatches-sold-new-hardware-coming | 06:32 |
| Sail0r | THE NEW SOFTWARE PLATFORM WILL BE UNLIKE ANYTHING BEFORE IT | 06:32 |
| Sail0r | ^^ | 06:32 |
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| Mikaela | I still think "truly different" is nicer than "unlike" and "aidosti erilainen" is what the Finnish slogan seems to be | 07:06 |
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| lpotter | "unlike the ordinary" | 07:23 |
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| Mikaela | how do I stop Android support so those apps don't send me notifications when I am not using them or I don't have them open as covers? | 07:43 |
| Nicd- | Mikaela: install "sailfish utilities" from the app store (only visible by searching for it), it has a "stop alien dalvik" feature | 07:44 |
| Mikaela | yes, but that is manual | 07:44 |
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| Mikaela | I understood some document as "Android support is not running when the last app is quit", but I am still seeing Facebook notifications and Facebook chats twice (because I use the Jolla messenger too and installed FB Messenger just to see one group discussion) | 07:45 |
| Mikaela | the only thing I find is https://together.jolla.com/question/76383/can-application-android-services-run-in-the-background-in-vaarainjarvi/?answer=76423#post-id-76423 which says that the services are not running after I close Facebook and Facebook is not open | 07:46 |
| tbr | Mikaela: do you have the google play store or GMS installed? | 07:48 |
| Mikaela | google play store yes, no idea what is GMS | 07:48 |
| tbr | ok, then you have the google services too | 07:48 |
| Mikaela | I don't think Facebook is part of Google Services | 07:49 |
| tbr | so, what I suspect is that the google background services _will_ run if something has started them once | 07:49 |
| tbr | does facebook use the google notification infrastructure or its own protocol? | 07:49 |
| Mikaela | if I understood correctly, those should be stopped after I close whatever starts them | 07:50 |
| tbr | google push notifications is very power efficient and reliable | 07:50 |
| Mikaela | no idea | 07:50 |
| tbr | I can see all sorts of those services running even after closing the last android app | 07:50 |
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| Mikaela | why closing the last android app doesn't also close android support? | 07:51 |
| tbr | 10010 11932 0.0 3.0 333116 25204 ? Sl Feb02 0:09 | \_ com.google.android.gms | 07:51 |
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| fennekki | I can't see why it should | 07:52 |
| tbr | that is a question you'd need to ask jolla, not me | 07:52 |
| Mikaela | who were the jolla people here? | 07:52 |
| tbr | I just see that lots of background apps are running | 07:52 |
| fennekki | it kinda feels like restarting android applications would be too long if that happened | 07:53 |
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| Mikaela | It takes a little longer, but I don't think it bothers me. Maybe there should be option? | 07:54 |
| Mikaela | there appears to be thread at together which I have voted and followed earlier https://together.jolla.com/question/20472/why-not-shutdown-aliendalvik-after-closing-last-android-app/ | 07:55 |
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| Mikaela | and https://together.jolla.com/question/77335/bug-android-app-processes-sometimes-running-without-app-open/ | 07:56 |
| fennekki | Background processes running is probably not a bug | 07:57 |
| Mikaela | depends on whether you want those to be there or wonder why android support doesn't quit with the last app | 07:58 |
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| fennekki | they're an integral part of some apps | 07:58 |
| Tomo2 | even with Dalvik stop it doesn't stop everything on the background | 07:58 |
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| fennekki | ? strange | 07:59 |
| Tomo2 | for example Skype and Viber are able to live on | 07:59 |
| fennekki | that sounds like a bug yeah | 07:59 |
| coderus | Mikaela: install sailfish utilities and stop android if you need so | 07:59 |
| Tomo2 | to me it's sort of nice behaviour to get notifications without the app being open... but i'd classify it as a bug, too, and unwanted behaviour for most ppl :) | 08:00 |
| Mikaela | that again requires me to open sailfish utilities every time I want to close it which is always when I close some android app | 08:00 |
| coderus | Mikaela: yes | 08:00 |
| coderus | until one user of 1000 asks this it will be so | 08:00 |
| coderus | s/until/while | 08:00 |
| * coderus wake up not 100% yet | 08:00 | |
| Mikaela | while what I wish it to do is stop it when I quit the last app | 08:01 |
| coderus | you should do it yourself | 08:01 |
| coderus | android support is full android runtime | 08:01 |
| coderus | its not android emulator | 08:01 |
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| coderus | or any other similar thing | 08:01 |
| Lieke | it should be configurable | 08:02 |
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| Mikaela | I don't have skills to do it by myself if you mean writing a patch and I don't understand why manually. | 08:02 |
| coderus | just create simple applets for settings which you can add as favorites and be happy | 08:02 |
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| coderus | Mikaela: because 999 of 1000 like current behaviour | 08:03 |
| Mikaela | that requires opening the settings and pressing the favourite and pressing "stop android support" | 08:03 |
| coderus | ask more peoples to vote for tjc | 08:03 |
| coderus | and hope | 08:03 |
| Mikaela | currently there seem to be 66 votes requesting option to have it disabled automatically when the last app closes | 08:04 |
| coderus | 66 of thousands. sounds very close to 1:999 right? :) | 08:04 |
| Nicd- | Mikaela: you can install KillDroid from the app store, it will allow you to kill dalvik from the cover | 08:05 |
| Nicd- | if you keep it running | 08:05 |
| Mikaela | seems so | 08:05 |
| Mikaela | I am not sure if that is good solution either | 08:06 |
| coderus | Mikaela: also you can create simple desktop file with systemctl --user stop aliendalvik and place it to homescreen pull menu :D | 08:06 |
| coderus | see; we're trying to help your laziness | 08:06 |
| coderus | :D | 08:06 |
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| * coderus goes to create script for shutting down pc after closing IRC window, because coderus don't like when computer remains switched on when IRC is not opened :D | 08:07 | |
| Mikaela | that seems better solution, but I have no idea how to write desktop files for Sailfish or where to put them | 08:07 |
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| coderus | Mikaela: ask Schturman :D | 08:08 |
| coderus | he like creating icons for everything | 08:09 |
| Mikaela | I cannot see that nick on this channel | 08:09 |
| coderus | Mikaela: http://talk.maemo.org/private.php?do=newpm&u=30535 | 08:09 |
| Mikaela | I think it should be findable without registering to another forum | 08:09 |
| coderus | tmo is awesome forum | 08:10 |
| coderus | very legacy and friendly :) | 08:10 |
| Mikaela | I never understood forums | 08:10 |
| coderus | you can find many useful topics about sailfishos | 08:10 |
| Nicd- | Mikaela: check /usr/share/applications for .desktop examples | 08:10 |
| Nicd- | you could probably put your own into ~/.local/share/applications and it might load it from there | 08:11 |
| Nicd- | maybe: D | 08:11 |
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| * coderus goes out of here for a while, patience limit excedded maximum | 08:11 | |
| Mikaela | Thanks. Will those appear on launcher automatically? | 08:11 |
| Nicd- | I don't know | 08:11 |
| Mikaela | I will probably see it soon | 08:12 |
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| coderus | i just remembered aliendalvik service is under system, you can't call it to stop from userspace :D | 08:15 |
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| Mikaela | ok, so reading sudo documentation for NOPW | 08:16 |
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| Mikaela | do I understand this correctly that I must allow normal user to run all /bin/systemctl commands without password? This doesn't seem like a good idea | 08:18 |
| locusf | there is no sudo unless installed | 08:18 |
| Mikaela | it's installed | 08:18 |
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| locusf | ok | 08:19 |
| tbr | you could always write a wrapper script that takes no input | 08:19 |
| tbr | #!/bin/sh | 08:19 |
| Mikaela | I see | 08:19 |
| tbr | systemctl stop aliendalvik.service | 08:19 |
| tbr | and run that through sudo | 08:20 |
| tbr | make sure the script is owned by root to avoid a backdoor! | 08:20 |
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| tbr | I've seen insecure handling of such things and people pass it off as "perfectly fine" or "vanilla build" | 08:21 |
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| Mikaela | sudoers works, script works and now it's probably that desktop. I copied htop.desktop to stopandroid.desktop and it appears to be there. | 08:29 |
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| coderus | you can set NoDisplay=true after assigning to pulley menu | 08:30 |
| Mikaela | Yes, icon works too. Thanks | 08:31 |
| Mikaela | I don't mind it being visible in the launcher | 08:31 |
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| coderus | okay, just in case your next request will be optional hiding unused icons from launcher automatically | 08:37 |
| coderus | because it should be configurable! | 08:37 |
| Mikaela | I have already requested automatic sorting to the launcher, it's becoming cluttered. | 08:38 |
| coderus | Automatic sorting my icons? No, thanks! | 08:38 |
| coderus | downvoting from 1000 accounts :D | 08:38 |
| Nicd- | it's a reasonable request if it's toggleable from the settings | 08:39 |
| coderus | i always hate when somebody arrande by name icons on my desktop | 08:39 |
| tbr | coderus: so you never update your apps? (because that moves icons to the bottom) | 08:43 |
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| tbr | ;-) | 08:44 |
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| coderus | tbr: update never moves icon | 08:45 |
| coderus | only remove/install | 08:45 |
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| coderus | tbr: you have outdated information or your phone is broken | 08:46 |
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| tbr | coderus: it does in case of android apps at least | 08:47 |
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| Mikaela | https://together.jolla.com/question/20472/why-not-shutdown-aliendalvik-after-closing-last-android-app/?answer=80131#post-id-80131 tjc has weird markdown parser | 08:49 |
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| Nicd- | I fixed the formatting for you | 08:54 |
| Nicd- | seems it wants to indent code by 4 spaces instead of surrounding with ```. at least it formats it better | 08:54 |
| Mikaela | weird, I thought surrounding by ``` is supported everywhere | 08:54 |
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| dr_gogeta86 | http://www.glistockisti.it/jolla-white-16gb.html | 09:21 |
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| Stskeeps | tbr: http://www.internetofuselessthings.io/ | 10:10 |
| tbr | :D | 10:11 |
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| entil | Mikaela: I installed killdroid for that | 10:19 |
| Mikaela | I think the pulley menu is easier than using covers | 10:20 |
| entil | yeah, you're probably quite right | 10:21 |
| leinir | Stskeeps: that... is glorious :D | 10:22 |
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| pp | lol, apparently someone has leaked a meltemi image :D | 10:26 |
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| pp | (timestamps from 2012 so very outdated...) | 10:27 |
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| jarkko_ | http://www.internetofuselessthings.io/ | 10:30 |
| jarkko_ | oops, sorry :) | 10:31 |
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| SK_work | jarkko_: welcome jarkko_ ! | 11:07 |
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| Yaniel | ...to the internet of useless things | 11:38 |
| Yaniel | and jolla users | 11:38 |
| yourname1 | Does anyone use latest sailfish and cuteSpotify? I am not able to play any tracks, just istalled androidSpotify and it works fine, but would cladly use native client. | 11:40 |
| *** yourname1 is now known as AjNieminen | 11:40 | |
| AjNieminen | I'm worried about battery usage, should I use dalvik stop everytime I close spotify? | 11:41 |
| joonahoi | AjNieminen: dalvik isn't much of a resource hog itself | 11:43 |
| joonahoi | so i wouldn't bother | 11:43 |
| AjNieminen | ok, thanks. | 11:43 |
| joonahoi | I'm using cutespotify with latest sailfish, and it's working fine | 11:43 |
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| Elleo | AjNieminen: make sure you're using lukedirtwarter's version (1.4+), not my old one (1.3) as mine will only work on old OS versions (and luke's will only work on new ones) | 11:44 |
| joonahoi | had a problem where it wouldn't start playing though, but checked that my headphones are ok by starting a playback on local mp3 file with the default media player, verified that the headphones are working -> went back to cutespotify and selected another track -> everything worked as expected | 11:44 |
| AjNieminen | I've got 1.1.1.27 and CuteSpotify just popups that play-bar on the bottom. | 11:44 |
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| AjNieminen | using cutespotify-1.5.2-1... | 11:46 |
| joonahoi | yup, the same version | 11:46 |
| AjNieminen | headphones are working, but cutespotify still not playing anything. | 11:47 |
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| joonahoi | yup, did you try to start (and stop) playback on the default media player? | 11:48 |
| AjNieminen | yup, i did. works fine. | 11:48 |
| joonahoi | that seems to be the way i got cutespotify playback back | 11:48 |
| Elleo | joonahoi, AjNieminen: probably worth reporting that to lukedirtwater when he's next around | 11:48 |
| joonahoi | Elleo: not sure if it was a problem at all | 11:49 |
| joonahoi | just went to check the headphones to the default media player | 11:49 |
| AjNieminen | Elleo: ok, i'll keep that in mind. | 11:49 |
| joonahoi | and everything's been dandy since | 11:49 |
| AjNieminen | I can manage with androidversion for now. but I will ask lukedirtwater. | 11:50 |
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| jmlich | It seems, there is something wrong with SQL support in sailfish sdk http://pastebin.com/y9EdeYPU | 12:37 |
| RavenholmDX | Got a Pebble Steel | 12:38 |
| RavenholmDX | Surprised how well it works with Jolla | 12:38 |
| RavenholmDX | Was expecting some quirks, but runs flawless so far | 12:38 |
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| jmlich | There is message "kernel/qsqldatabase.cpp: No such file or directory" in backtrace http://pastebin.com/B2cJJDT3 | 12:40 |
| Nicd- | jmlich: maybe it's this? https://bugreports.qt.io/browse/QTBUG-35977 | 12:46 |
| coderus | QSqlDatabase working flawlessly for me | 12:46 |
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| jmlich | Nicd-, probably. The app crashes when closing. | 12:47 |
| Nicd- | jmlich: this should be in #sailfishos though | 12:48 |
| coderus | but i'm using QSQLITE driver | 12:48 |
| jmlich | Nicd-, sorry I was looking into topic of channel, but there is no link to #sailfishos nor description of channel. | 12:49 |
| jmlich | I am also using sqlite | 12:49 |
| jmlich | I have also found some weird behavior of Label/Theme. Two items have different look, but same font/color. | 12:50 |
| jmlich | You can try to debug it https://gitorious.org/devconf-sailfish/devconf-sailfish | 12:50 |
| coderus | jmlich: one item is rich/styled and latter is plain? | 12:50 |
| jmlich | coderus, Once it have primaryColor and second time secondaryColor | 12:51 |
| coderus | jmlich: give link to code with sql and with labels | 12:51 |
| jmlich | It have different color when i18n loaded | 12:51 |
| jmlich | coderus, https://gitorious.org/devconf-sailfish/devconf-sailfish/source/2bb7c2679241d0fdd89316f0115f85e0393c50e3:qml/MainPage.qml#L95 color | 12:52 |
| jmlich | https://gitorious.org/devconf-sailfish/devconf-sailfish/source/2bb7c2679241d0fdd89316f0115f85e0393c50e3:qml/Data.qml#L1 SQL. I don't know what to link it is on destructor. | 12:53 |
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| coderus | jmlich: ah you using qml | 12:53 |
| coderus | don't know about it | 12:53 |
| coderus | always using C++ code | 12:54 |
| coderus | about color print text values | 12:54 |
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| javispedro | Stskeeps: so which brand where those bone conducting HPs? | 12:57 |
| Stskeeps | javispedro: aftershokz | 12:57 |
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| jmlich | coderus, thanks for hint with font (it was different font.family. I don't understand why was there different font family) | 13:05 |
| javispedro | Amazon sells the "bluez2" (interesting names) for 76eur, which is interesting | 13:06 |
| Stskeeps | nod | 13:06 |
| Stskeeps | i took the older one as i can better prototype with cables, instead of debugging bluetooth shit | 13:07 |
| javispedro | however one review mentions the "subway podcast" usecase explictly and that you need to set the volume quite high | 13:07 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 13:07 |
| Stskeeps | well, i took mine on an airplane.. | 13:07 |
| javispedro | probably easier for me to actually prototype on bluetooth/sco =) | 13:07 |
| Stskeeps | during takeoff, fully legible.. | 13:07 |
| javispedro | oh well, since this is amazon, I guess I will just return them if they're not as good as manuf says =) | 13:08 |
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| javispedro | btw I'm starting to see more bt headphones using AAC as transport codec | 13:25 |
| javispedro | instead of proprietary aptX | 13:25 |
| javispedro | possibly interesting.. might try to also get a cheap AAC one for experimentation.. | 13:25 |
| Stskeeps | iphone-ish? | 13:25 |
| javispedro | I'd say so | 13:26 |
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| javispedro | correct -- iOS can send AAC https://developer.apple.com/hardwaredrivers/BluetoothDesignGuidelines.pdf | 13:27 |
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| Stskeeps | bluez2 does aac? | 13:28 |
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| javispedro | not sure yet | 13:30 |
| tbr | they are probably agnostic | 13:30 |
| javispedro | (possibly not, I'd guess they'd mention it) | 13:30 |
| tbr | and would dump the raw coded bitstream on you | 13:30 |
| javispedro | tbr: on your cheekbones, actually (yes, they named the headphones "bluez2") | 13:30 |
| javispedro | ;P | 13:31 |
| tbr | ah, we're not talking about kernel... | 13:31 |
| tbr | ugh | 13:31 |
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| tbr | and I was already wondering why we are calling bluez5 bluez2 now | 13:32 |
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| Teemu | i am the new number 2 | 15:25 |
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| anandrkris | Hi- If I want to set duckduckgo as search engine, is there a UI way to do it? | 16:38 |
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| Mikaela | the nearest is settings --> apps --> browser --> search engine, but it doesn't seem to allow custom ones | 16:40 |
| Mikaela | annd DDG is not listed | 16:41 |
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| anandrkris | TJC has so many requests for DDG | 16:41 |
| anandrkris | and PR in github is closed saying 3rd party packages... | 16:42 |
| sqozz | Mikaela: there should be a way to add it manualy over a shell | 16:42 |
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| anandrkris | https://github.com/sailfishos/sailfish-browser/pull/139 | 16:42 |
| sqozz | if i recall corectly, there is a tutorial on TJC about adding DDG to your search engines | 16:42 |
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| anandrkris | yeah saw that..my questions was UI way? :) | 16:43 |
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| anandrkris | #PrivacyMatters should translate to product features | 16:43 |
| sqozz | anandrkris: yeah, i just want to say it :) | 16:44 |
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| sqozz | and to answer your question: no, ther is no UI way | 16:44 |
| sqozz | unfortunately | 16:44 |
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| anandrkris | sqozz: stirred a topic..let's see where it goes ;) | 16:55 |
| RavenholmDX | Why didn't I get a Pebble sooner... | 16:56 |
| RavenholmDX | It changes everything | 16:56 |
| Teemu | :) | 16:57 |
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| Teemu | with pebble and a bluetooth headsfree, one could leave the phone in pocket unless you want to surf or something | 16:58 |
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| RavenholmDX | Yeah Teem | 16:59 |
| RavenholmDX | Teem | 16:59 |
| RavenholmDX | Damn autocorrect | 16:59 |
| RavenholmDX | This tablet is annoying sometimes | 16:59 |
| Teemu | then the phone could be a smallish tablet or phattish phone and you could encase it in a durable polycarbonate casing so it would actually stay alive in pocket conditions | 17:02 |
| Teemu | jolla is already too big to survive workman conditions, even if you add some surface protective case | 17:02 |
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| cvp_ | damn android. is it normal, that i get/see a massage only if i open the app and let it on? | 17:15 |
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| cvp_ | I mean, it's possible to have a continuous internet connection via Whatsapp? I get no notification until I open the program | 17:20 |
| nazanin | cvp_: yup | 17:20 |
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| cvp_ | an how ? :) | 17:20 |
| rigo | anandrkris: +1 and I have tons of ideas :) | 17:21 |
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| Speedy- | what's the last/still working ver. of Mitkuuluu? | 17:22 |
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| anandrkris | rigo - +1 here https://together.jolla.com/question/4959/add-more-search-engines-to-the-web-browser/ | 17:23 |
| rigo | anandrkris: make them configurable. I use ixquick most of the time but also nearly all others | 17:24 |
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| anandrkris | there is a request for that too in TJC | 17:24 |
| rigo | having them is one thing, making adding more easy is better. They can still sell the "default" to get money | 17:25 |
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| anandrkris | rigo https://together.jolla.com/question/627/browser-support-for-custom-search-engines/ | 17:25 |
| anandrkris | Btw, am just another user here...i just vote (sometimes prod in IRC) and forget about it :) | 17:26 |
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| cvp_ | nazanin, yup what ? :D | 17:33 |
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| AjNieminen | Elleo, joonahoi, did cutespotify just update later today? just downloaded 1.5.2-2 and now it works. | 17:44 |
| coderus | Baidu, DuckDuckGo, StartPage search engines for Sailfish Browser: https://openrepos.net/content/coderus/search-engines-sailfish-browser | 17:44 |
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| AjNieminen | or did i really download older version by accident... | 17:45 |
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| Sail0r | is the talk of lbt on fosdem available anywhere to watch? | 18:12 |
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| tbr | it was most likely recorded | 18:15 |
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| Sail0r | ok so it will be available in the next days | 18:16 |
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| Nightmare__ | fyi: http://www.heise.de/ct/artikel/Beemer-Open-Thyself-Security-vulnerabilities-in-BMW-s-ConnectedDrive-2540957.html | 18:31 |
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| Sail0r | https://cuteoverload.files.wordpress.com/2015/02/img_9952.jpg?w=770&h=1090 | 18:49 |
| Sail0r | kitteh11 | 18:50 |
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| the_mgt | will the tablet ship with icedtea or java? | 19:05 |
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| tbr | why would it need java in the first place? | 19:12 |
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| the_mgt | not it, me. for some tools I use | 19:15 |
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| r0kk3rz | dalvik is kindof java | 19:23 |
| r0kk3rz | but it would take someone porting a proper JRE to sailfish | 19:23 |
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| tbr | if you don't need a UI, then it will just work. | 19:26 |
| tbr | but java is generally pretty meh | 19:27 |
| tbr | especially if it comes from oracle | 19:27 |
| r0kk3rz | oracle, the company where projects go to die | 19:28 |
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| kimmoli | reminds me (not java actually) but what becomes if node.js and io.js merges? no.js ? | 19:31 |
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| * kimmoli respawns | 19:32 | |
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| r0kk3rz | wasnt io.js just a fork of node.js anyway | 19:35 |
| r0kk3rz | so presumably, an unfork would still be node.js | 19:35 |
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| keithzg | doubleplusnode.js | 19:42 |
| Sail0r | noio.js | 19:46 |
| tbr | yolo.js | 19:46 |
| keithzg | Surely *someone* has made that already? | 19:48 |
| keithzg | Yup: https://github.com/svmatthews/yolo.js | 19:49 |
| keithzg | Although https://code.google.com/p/yolo/source/browse/scripts/yolo.js appears to predate it | 19:49 |
| Teemu | argh pargh | 19:49 |
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| Yaniel | nope.js? | 20:02 |
| keithzg | hehe | 20:02 |
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| r0kk3rz | nopenopenope.js | 20:08 |
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| Obi-Lan | i suppose there was no software for automatic camera image backups to owncloud yet? | 20:20 |
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| Yaniel | cron | 20:21 |
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| keithzg | Cron is the All-App, Cron is the beginning, Cron is the end. | 20:35 |
| M4rtinK | I think you meant systemd ? :) | 20:37 |
| nazanin | cvp_: yup == it doesnt work unless you have the app open :p | 20:38 |
| Obi-Lan | that was going to be my another question | 20:38 |
| Obi-Lan | how to do the actual copy | 20:39 |
| keithzg | M4rtinK: heh true enough | 20:40 |
| M4rtinK | and I don't really mean it in a negative way :) | 20:40 |
| M4rtinK | it really does handle a lot of stuff in usually a rather good way :) | 20:41 |
| keithzg | Obi-Lan: You mean, copy up to ownCloud? I'd suppose either directly via WebDAV, or via a CLI frontend for ownCloud like https://github.com/csawyerYumaed/pyOwnCloud | 20:45 |
| keithzg | M4rtinK: I mostly agree, but, more for things that are tightly integrated and prepackaged like SailfishOS. I was recently trying to set audio recording back up on my laptop after a long time not bothering, and these days, the existence of PulseAudio makes that a *nightmare* for my specific hardware. | 20:46 |
| keithzg | So I've definitely been shaking my fist at the air and yelling "Poettering!" a lot lately :P | 20:47 |
| Obi-Lan | geez no 5eur app with just check box to check-in? | 20:47 |
| Obi-Lan | keithzg: something that WP has, whenever you take picture, it gets uploaded to onedrive | 20:48 |
| keithzg | Obi-Lan: Android can do the same thing with Google Photos. But it really shouldn't be that hard to write a job to do so automatically for ownCloud. | 20:49 |
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| keithzg | The first quick-and-dirty way that occurs to me is to write a script that watches for changes in your camera photos folder, then if it sees a new photo mounts your ownCloud instance via something like davfs2 and rsync's to the mounted folder. That'd be my lazy method, at least. | 20:59 |
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| Obi-Lan | theres also apparently this: https://github.com/beidl/harbour-owncloud | 21:02 |
| Obi-Lan | but no syncing stuff there | 21:03 |
| keithzg | Yeah, I would've hoped by now the library the actual desktop sync client would've been adapted (it's Qt, after all, albeit not QML, but the backend itself should be entirely portable to SailfishOS) but that doesn't seem to have happened yet. | 21:04 |
| keithzg | Hopefully interest in Jolla for these projects picks up once the tablet is out. | 21:05 |
| keithzg | Folks are making the much harder effort to port such things to Android since that's where the devices they use themselves are. Alas! | 21:05 |
| Obi-Lan | I wonder if possibility for payments in jolla store would speed things | 21:07 |
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| attah | Maybe.. a few more APIs woudn't hurt though | 21:10 |
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| keithzg | Yeah I think it's more an API and a general popularity (ie. getting devices into actual hands) issue. I mean, it's not like KDE needed payment methods to get people to write apps for that desktop environment ;) | 21:16 |
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| keithzg | And generally speaking, although I'm by no means against giving devs money, I'd rather FOSS be encouraged rather than the kind of app goldrush of the major platforms. | 21:17 |
| keithzg | IMHO the app situation for the N9 was in many respects worse than for the N900 for exactly that reason. | 21:17 |
| Obi-Lan | one cant pay for foss? | 21:18 |
| keithzg | Of course one can pay for FOSS, but generally speaking the lack of being able to charge for apps isn't likely to be what's holding back FOSS apps from Harbour. | 21:19 |
| Obi-Lan | ok | 21:21 |
| attah | I don't mind people being able to live off apps that are good and useful.. it bridges the gap between hobbyists and companies | 21:21 |
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| keithzg | I definitely love it when devs add simple donate/flattr buttons, so I can throw money their way. But we don't necessarily need an app store gating access based on fixed-price purchases for that. | 21:21 |
| attah | I think people generally are to shy/lazy do donate... | 21:22 |
| attah | probably not too cheap.. but effectively the same | 21:22 |
| keithzg | Well, I won't disagree there. The donation process needs to be as frictionless as possible. | 21:23 |
| Obi-Lan | I was thinking that if Jolla makes same style payment as google play that you add credit card and pay/donate buy just tapping button | 21:23 |
| attah | non-fixed-price á la humble bundle works well though | 21:23 |
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| keithzg | Yeah, if purchases are added to harbour I'd definitely be on board with a humble-bundle/bandcamp style where devs could list free, fixed price, or pay-what-you-want. | 21:24 |
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| keithzg | The problem with app stores as they are is that all apps are either free or a fixed price, which creates a quandry for FOSS devs. | 21:25 |
| attah | me too, that wold be the logical progression of paid apps :) | 21:25 |
| attah | especially when spanning over multiple markets with radically different income levels | 21:25 |
| keithzg | ja, definitely | 21:25 |
| * Stskeeps could go for 'pay what you feel it's worth' | 21:25 | |
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| attah | as long as payment at all is part of the process and not an optional detour it will make much more than pure donations | 21:27 |
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| Obi-Lan | yes, its easy to give away few € or $ when you dont need to enter paypal or credit card info every time | 21:29 |
| M4rtinK | another +1 fro donations support in store from me | 21:29 |
| keithzg | Yeah, that'd definitely be an app store setup I could get behind. And at this rate it doesn't look like Apple or Google are in any danger of implementing it, so Jolla could beat them to the punch! | 21:29 |
| M4rtinK | I think that just paying for apps makes many users not bother | 21:29 |
| attah | or rather the difference of €1 and €5 is much less than having to enter payment info and not | 21:30 |
| M4rtinK | and double so for donations (they are getting the app for free, so why bother with complicated payment methods) | 21:30 |
| Obi-Lan | and jolla could take 5% slide ;) | 21:30 |
| M4rtinK | so especially for donations it should be as easy as possible to donate and the application store/repository can help with that | 21:30 |
| Obi-Lan | so that they dont need to run on goverment money | 21:31 |
| M4rtinK | just check: https://addons.mozilla.org - every Firefox extension has a contribute button right under it | 21:31 |
| attah | yeah.. and i bet the donation rate is ridiculously low | 21:32 |
| keithzg_mobile | M4rtinK: yeah, 'friction' really is the main hurdle for getting donations. Integrate it into the existing experience and it's likely a change of orders of magnitude. | 21:32 |
| attah | so even if people give €10 its far less than €1 per user | 21:33 |
| attah | (by orders of magnitude) | 21:33 |
| M4rtinK | would still probably not give developers a survivable income | 21:34 |
| M4rtinK | but could make people put some more effort into Sailfish OS development :) | 21:34 |
| M4rtinK | also makes it possible to stay open source and still get some of the "investment" back :) | 21:34 |
| attah | M4rtinK: for now.. being the small platform that it is, the maximized price would maybe not do that.. but in a year and with a J2.. who knows? | 21:35 |
| cvp_ | nazanin, lol ok i think you have a solution for me :D | 21:35 |
| M4rtinK | attah: I basically think that donation support is yet another think that could bring more developers and this more users | 21:37 |
| M4rtinK | well, considering how actively hostile Jolla Store/Harbor is against native developers | 21:37 |
| M4rtinK | this might not help much :) | 21:38 |
| attah | definitely.. but still.. "friction" | 21:38 |
| attah | that could keep devs from doing that 2nd and 3rd apps | 21:38 |
| M4rtinK | attah: what could ? | 21:38 |
| M4rtinK | missing donation support ? | 21:38 |
| attah | what keithzg_mobile expressed better than id did in his last msg | 21:39 |
| M4rtinK | attah: oh, yeah - agree completely! | 21:39 |
| attah | :) | 21:40 |
| kimmoli | so next to "like" button in store app-page would be donate button? | 21:40 |
| M4rtinK | that's basically why all my apps are free (and open) - I want them to be as accessible to users as possible | 21:40 |
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| attah | i' just saying there should be a sliding scale and an option for minimum payment along with a suggested | 21:41 |
| M4rtinK | if they were paid, it would probably slash the user count many orders of magnitude and there still wound not be significant money made | 21:41 |
| attah | depends on the app i think.. hopefully you could do as good as just halving the user base | 21:42 |
| M4rtinK | so I like them to have as many users as possible :) | 21:42 |
| M4rtinK | well | 21:42 |
| attah | M4rtinK: and i commend you for it | 21:42 |
| M4rtinK | I think you can expect at least 90% user drop in such a case | 21:42 |
| M4rtinK | attah: thanks! :) | 21:42 |
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| attah | heck.. i even feel embarrassed for wanting to make a pid app now (given that i have a well-paid job) | 21:43 |
| attah | still i do feel there should be the option of apps where the minimum price is not 0 | 21:44 |
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| Obi-Lan | give developer the options: a) user decides what he pays b) fixed price c) in-app pays | 21:45 |
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| attah | i could do without the last one.. but yeah, basically | 21:46 |
| attah | maximizing the value for customers, revenue for devs while minimizing the asshattery :) | 21:47 |
| Obi-Lan | latter would work some where you subsribe new content ect | 21:47 |
| Obi-Lan | jolla store should just have clear payment info box where it would be clearly stated that this app has in-app pays or needs paid subscription | 21:47 |
| attah | yeah.. that is the good version.. but it seems all serious services have too slim margins for that in the usual app stores | 21:48 |
| attah | so it just leaves the frauds and asshats | 21:48 |
| * attah is generalizing massively | 21:49 | |
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| Obi-Lan | possibly | 21:49 |
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| attah | seems we all just about agree.. so I'll go to bed now before we discover otherwise :) | 21:50 |
| keithzg | heh, g'night | 21:50 |
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| Obi-Lan | yeah, I'll probably need to figure how to reset windows tab so that kid can watch netflix again tomorrow | 21:55 |
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| nazanin | cvp_: unfortunately no :D | 22:06 |
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| cvp_ | where you can download all the update pictures? | 22:58 |
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| phlixi | ich got a strange message, do not now what is causing it, something like "free at least 10.xx KB to download this message" | 23:25 |
| phlixi | according to setings app, there are a few gigs free space | 23:25 |
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| phlixi | restarted threema and got 2 messages, strange... | 23:31 |
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