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| ottulonen | hrm... I do not see the files on my SD card | 00:04 |
|---|---|---|
| chem|st | ottulonen: it is an elecronic device... you will always see some polycarbonate if you look at it^^ | 00:05 |
| chem|st | ottulonen: no srsly, do you mean in gallery and mediaplayer and stuff or do you mean on the sdcard | 00:06 |
| ottulonen | I mean File Browser | 00:06 |
| chem|st | "mounted" | 00:06 |
| ottulonen | earlier I remember I just stuck the card in and the files were there | 00:06 |
| chem|st | ottulonen: which path? | 00:06 |
| ottulonen | but now it just appears as an empty folder, regardless of the presence of the card :D | 00:06 |
| chem|st | what fs and what size does the card have | 00:07 |
| chem|st | so it is not mounted anymore which sounds weird | 00:07 |
| ottulonen | it's in /run/user/100000/media/sdcard and a 4GB FAT | 00:07 |
| ottulonen | or was it FAT32, I forget which one I formatted it to... | 00:08 |
| chem|st | what does df say? | 00:08 |
| chem|st | or mount | 00:08 |
| ottulonen | in terminal, I suppose | 00:08 |
| ottulonen | lemme check | 00:08 |
| chem|st | yes | 00:08 |
| chem|st | df -h | 00:08 |
| chem|st | shows size/usage of mounted volumes | 00:09 |
| chem|st | "mount" shows what is mounted to where and how | 00:09 |
| ottulonen | nothing around that size | 00:09 |
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| ottulonen | rootfs, devtmpfs, 6 times tmpfs, several /dev/mmcblk* | 00:10 |
| chem|st | is there /dev/mmcblk1* | 00:10 |
| ottulonen | nope, they're all mmcblk0p* | 00:11 |
| ottulonen | and mounted at other locations, clearly system stuff | 00:11 |
| chem|st | dmesg? | 00:11 |
| chem|st | lsblk | 00:12 |
| ottulonen | mmcblk2 179:64 0 3.7G 0 disk | 00:13 |
| ottulonen | └─mmcblk2p1 179:65 0 3.7G 0 part | 00:13 |
| ottulonen | that could be it | 00:13 |
| ottulonen | from lsblk | 00:14 |
| ottulonen | hum, it does show in dmesg when I just now removed the card | 00:15 |
| chem|st | yeah I think that is not gonna work... seems liek something got hung and you got enumerated +1 | 00:16 |
| chem|st | but it does enumerate as mmcblk2? | 00:16 |
| ottulonen | [189117.034221] mmc1: new high speed SDHC card at address 1234 | 00:17 |
| ottulonen | [189117.034313] mmc1: mmc_can_sanitize card is no | 00:17 |
| ottulonen | [189117.418900] mmcblk2: mmc1:1234 SA04G 3.67 GiB | 00:17 |
| ottulonen | [189117.424119] mmcblk2: p1 | 00:17 |
| chem|st | ok the mount script does mount the first partition of the second blk device iirc... | 00:17 |
| chem|st | 1sec | 00:17 |
| chem|st | yeah it does mount mmcblk1 only | 00:18 |
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| chem|st | did you reboot? | 00:19 |
| ottulonen | no, haven't tried yet | 00:19 |
| ottulonen | will do now | 00:19 |
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| chem|st | well just leave the card in | 00:20 |
| ottulonen | 'oops' | 00:20 |
| chem|st | oops what? | 00:20 |
| ottulonen | I was thinking I'll see if it detects it correctly when inserting, so I removed it before rebooting | 00:20 |
| chem|st | does not matter | 00:21 |
| ottulonen | well, seems to work now | 00:21 |
| chem|st | just push it in firmly all at once | 00:21 |
| ottulonen | I see the two files I have there (I really don't use the card much, at least yet) | 00:21 |
| chem|st | if it gets lost again your card might be loose somehow... | 00:21 |
| chem|st | what brand is it | 00:21 |
| ottulonen | Kingston, I think | 00:22 |
| ottulonen | I have a couple 4G cards and one is unbranded | 00:22 |
| ottulonen | but it has same text on it as another 4GB Kingston | 00:22 |
| chem|st | uSD cards are usually the same size but some cheap ones are a bit thinner | 00:23 |
| ottulonen | it could be that, it was in the package for an action cam | 00:23 |
| chem|st | usually the mount does not get lost but tracker messes things up and looses the sdcard files, it is mounted but not indexed | 00:24 |
| chem|st | a loose connection on the other hand can do things like having mmcblk2 recognized with mmcblk1 being jammed | 00:25 |
| ottulonen | I'll keep it in mind if I have problems in the future | 00:26 |
| ottulonen | thanks for the help | 00:26 |
| chem|st | lsblk shows all blockdevices | 00:26 |
| chem|st | np | 00:26 |
| ottulonen | well, seems like I have other issues now, but unrelated to the phone sw/hw | 00:28 |
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| ottulonen | so I guess I'll just get to bed and see tomorrow | 00:28 |
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| Nicd- | sometimes my jolla's notification LED doesn't stop blinking | 06:03 |
| Nicd- | after I've read the notification | 06:04 |
| Nicd- | also sometimes I get the email sound but when I check, I have no email | 06:06 |
| jussi | Nicd-: ghost messages!!! :D | 06:06 |
| Nicd- | exactly | 06:06 |
| Nicd- | even worse than ghost vibrations | 06:07 |
| jussi | ooooouuuuuuu.... | 06:07 |
| jussi | Nicd-: has a haunted phone... :P | 06:07 |
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| Nicd- | hehe, I do have phantom vibrations ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_vibration_syndrome ) on my left leg, where I keep my phone in my pocket | 06:08 |
| jussi | Nicd-: cripes, thats a real thing??? I have been suffering from that for ages! its scary! | 06:09 |
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| Nicd- | yep, it is. I've known about it for years | 06:10 |
| Nicd- | I don't know if there's an actual medical diagnosis for it but at least it exists for a lot of people :P | 06:11 |
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| Nicd- | I've always kept my phone in the same pocket since I got my first one so they always happen in that spot | 06:15 |
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| spiiroin | Nicd-: The notification leds should stop when display is unblanked via power key / double tap. If you can see some pattern to when the led stays active, I'd like to hear about it. | 06:24 |
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| Nicd- | spiiroin: I'll see if it happens again | 06:30 |
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| pawky | A few fundamental flaws in the SMS ... (app?) The send button is far to close to a potential word you would like to choose in the autocorrect/word guessing field. The cancel button in the upper left corner will still work underneath text you are editing , when writing long SMS messages... | 06:35 |
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| special | pawky: "cancel button"? | 06:37 |
| tbr | I think he means the glowing stack indicators | 06:37 |
| special | mm | 06:39 |
| special | the send button is improved with the next update. There is a small gap between it and the top of the keyboard, which makes it a lot harder to hit accidentally | 06:39 |
| special | it also doesn't stretch with the height of the message | 06:40 |
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| pawky | special: well on the uppe4r left side you have this white dot that, when you push on it, will do the same as a left swipe... | 06:44 |
| pawky | special: thus, if you want to mark a position in your text that will be near this dot, you can say good bye to your 1000+ character SMS.... :-( | 06:45 |
| special | I'd say that the proper fix there is saving draft messages | 06:45 |
| pawky | special: well... in a way I agree upon that, but i also believ the dot shouldn't work when havint text above it... | 06:46 |
| special | possibly.. | 06:46 |
| special | that gets tricky | 06:46 |
| pawky | special: it might be, but is the 'right' way to go... until this will be fixed, a save to draft will do as well.. Yesterday I believed i accidentally did a left swipe even though clearly not recalling having done so.. it took me another 4 tries of writing the same loooooong SMS message to notice this bug. | 06:48 |
| Sidde | pawky: send many short messages instead ;) | 06:48 |
| special | that does sound frustrating | 06:49 |
| pawky | Sidde: yeah, or continue using my N9 instead.... | 06:49 |
| special | the drafts are requested very often, it's a high priority | 06:49 |
| Sidde | pawky: *thumbs up* | 06:49 |
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| pawky | special: I also believe MMS messaging should be a priority.. | 06:49 |
| special | it is. | 06:50 |
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| special | I've posted on tjc before; we're working on MMS and it will be happening soon™ | 06:50 |
| pawky | special: heard anything about the send button being to close to your edit stuff? | 06:51 |
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| pawky | ohh.. and one REALLY frustrating thing, is always succeeding to be able to pick one key to the left when writing stuff... the unit really needs the same type of auto tuning function as the Iphone... | 06:52 |
| special | see how the send button feels after the next update. it should be better. | 06:52 |
| pawky | (i can see the stupid suggestions how to solve it hailing in....) | 06:53 |
| pawky | special: interesting... what has been done? | 06:53 |
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| pawky | a confirm to send box? | 06:54 |
| pawky | actually, shouldnt send be a scrollbar choice? | 06:54 |
| special | no, the design is the same | 06:54 |
| pawky | but it should... you do send in e-mail by scrollbar, right? | 06:54 |
| special | but the area to actually hit it is much closer to the size of the label ("Send") | 06:55 |
| pawky | but it SHOULD be on the scrollbar... just as E-mail.. not on the typing screen | 06:55 |
| pawky | if following the UI standard... | 06:55 |
| special | using a push up menu would be awkward with the keyboard open, I would think? | 06:56 |
| pawky | pushing, send when having conversations with customers, etc can have catastrophic effects... especially when you so easily accidentally might push the wrong keys on the keyboard... I almost did send a SMS message with the words "cock, yes?" | 06:57 |
| pawky | simply translated... | 06:57 |
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| pawky | yesteday... | 06:59 |
| special | at least for me, it's a lot harder to accidentally hit after the next update, without being harder to intentionally hit | 06:59 |
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| pawky | special: but, don't you agree it shouldn't be there, following the UI philosophy? | 06:59 |
| special | the philosophy is not "no buttons, ever" | 06:59 |
| pawky | otherwise, you should have a confirm button | 06:59 |
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| pawky | special: thus, on the scrollbar then :-) | 07:00 |
| special | SMS and IM are "real time", low friction | 07:01 |
| special | you write messages and send them quickly and often | 07:01 |
| special | they're usually short | 07:01 |
| special | that's why it's viewed as a conversation, that's why the keyboard stays open after you send a message, ready for the next one | 07:01 |
| pawky | special: trust me, sending "dick, yes" to a customer could be very high friction, any way you interpret it... | 07:02 |
| special | email is different | 07:02 |
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| special | the UI is different as a result; you go into a composer to write a new email, but you write messages from inside the conversation | 07:03 |
| pawky | special: but yes, maybe a scrollbar function might over do it... | 07:03 |
| special | SMS loses its value if you put barriers to sending a SMS | 07:03 |
| special | imagine how annoying it would be if we had to move our mouse over to a "Send" button instead of pressing enter on IRC | 07:03 |
| pawky | special: I highly doubt that, people are to addicted to it for its functionality.. | 07:03 |
| special | it'd completely change how we write | 07:04 |
| pawky | pulling down with your thumb to release on send, would be about the same speed as pressing the button. | 07:04 |
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| pawky | and as pull down menues seems to be Jollas philosophy they should stick to it... | 07:04 |
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| pawky | special: But I clearly see your point. | 07:05 |
| special | the other part of the reason pulley menus have been avoided there, I expect.. | 07:06 |
| Venemo_j | morning | 07:06 |
| special | is that the conversation view scrolls (almost) infinitely upwards | 07:06 |
| pawky | maybe a swipe right, then up would do? | 07:06 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: jo... | 07:06 |
| Stskeeps | morn Venemo_j | 07:06 |
| Venemo_j | pawky: what're you suggesting? | 07:07 |
| Venemo_j | hey Stskeeps :) how're you? | 07:08 |
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| pawky | Venemo_j: The send button shouldn't be on the typing screen... | 07:08 |
| special | there have been a lot of suggestions on that topic on https://together.jolla.com/question/3162/send-button-in-message-screen-is-in-bad-place/ | 07:08 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: in the SMS view, when typing... | 07:08 |
| special | more than I expected | 07:08 |
| pawky | special: ha, I just voted for it :-D | 07:09 |
| Venemo_j | pawky: where should it be then? | 07:09 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: the scroll down menue.. | 07:09 |
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| pawky | if following the UI design fphilosophy... | 07:09 |
| pawky | just as with E-mail.. | 07:10 |
| special | I pointed one of the designers to that thread, maybe we'll see what they think ;) | 07:12 |
| pawky | special: Thanks... :-) | 07:13 |
| pawky | special: I think its a healthy thought... | 07:13 |
| pawky | special: Then again, it worked ok 98% of the time on the N9, thus a well positioned button might do the trick as well. There seem to be another bug in the SMS app, making your text fly a bit all over the place when writing long texts, combined with the ability to push keyboard keys slightly wrong makes the need to move within the message of higher importance, which results in accidental sends.. | 07:17 |
| special | should be improved | 07:18 |
| pawky | special: If Jolla would increase the keyboard to use some sort of an adaptive alignment algorithm, the need to edit the SMS will sink, making the send button position less of an issue in the first place... | 07:19 |
| Venemo_j | could it be in a pushupmnu? | 07:19 |
| pawky | I always used Swype on the N9... | 07:19 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: I believe the scrollmenue would be a better choise... | 07:19 |
| Venemo_j | what is a scrollmenue??? | 07:20 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: do you have a Jolla? | 07:20 |
| Venemo_j | yep | 07:20 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: have you ever send an e-mail? | 07:20 |
| Venemo_j | yep | 07:20 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: how did you press send? | 07:20 |
| Venemo_j | that is a pulldownmenu | 07:21 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: and the difference is?.... | 07:21 |
| Venemo_j | not a scrollmenue | 07:21 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: it is a scrollmenue.. | 07:21 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: the menue scrolls.. | 07:21 |
| suy | <special> imagine how annoying it would be if we had to move our mouse over to a "Send" button instead of pressing enter on IRC // So, after the update, Messages has changed to send pressing the enter key? Because if messages are supposed to be short, we rarely want \n there... | 07:22 |
| pawky | suy: point is? | 07:22 |
| special | suy: no, that didn't change | 07:22 |
| Venemo_j | pawky: it is called PullDownMenu | 07:22 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: no.. pull down menues fall down, like... on windows.. | 07:22 |
| Venemo_j | and I'm suggesting the same thing....... | 07:22 |
| Venemo_j | pawky: man | 07:23 |
| suy | pawky: in other devices/apps, the enter key sends the message, instead of a dedicated button | 07:23 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: you started it.. i believe you fully got what i meant in the first place :- | 07:23 |
| pawky | :-) | 07:23 |
| Venemo_j | pawky: the name of that silica component is PullDownMenu | 07:23 |
| suy | send the message or accept the text | 07:23 |
| special | the enter key does not send in most smartphone SMS applications | 07:23 |
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| suy | it does on most smartphone messaging, I think | 07:24 |
| pawky | suy: in other devices, the possibility of miss spelling is a lot lower due to adaptive positioning algorithms etc.. | 07:24 |
| pawky | suy: the lower the risk of miss spelling, the less the importance of where the send button is located... | 07:24 |
| suy | I would prefer a remorse action for SMS, since you *pay* for them. But immediate sending with the return key for other messaging. But well, is user preference I suppose | 07:25 |
| pawky | suy: using the Jolla keyboard compared to the N9 accidentally pushing the key to the left of the one you want is annoyingly high.. | 07:25 |
| Venemo_j | pawky: I'm suggesting a PushUpMenu: the same thing essentially, you just scroll it from the bottom | 07:25 |
| pawky | suy: you've got to be kidding me.. a remorse button??? | 07:25 |
| suy | pawky: A remorse action. Like when deleting. It's been a while since I used the N9, so I can't remember, but I can assure you with BB10 the messaging is much better to me. :-/ | 07:26 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: well.. if you want to go that way, there are no menues, just pixels giving you the impression there is stuff... but then again, its totally out of the point isn't it?... | 07:26 |
| Venemo_j | pawky: my point is, I'm suggesting the same thing as you, only the variant that starts from the bottom | 07:27 |
| suy | pawky: and the remorse thing was just an idea, and only for stuff you pay for, like sms/mms. And only an idea, or an option. | 07:27 |
| suy | not necessarily the default | 07:27 |
| pawky | suy: well, there should be a way to cancel your SMS message, if thats what you mean I agree with you... and trust me there is one.. i pushed it all to often (read the back log) | 07:27 |
| special | it's an interesting theory | 07:28 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: Ahh... ok, yes that might do it as well :-) | 07:28 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: But as the E-mail uses it at the top, the SMS page should have the same.. | 07:29 |
| Venemo_j | pawky: you wanna scroll to top every time you send an sms? | 07:29 |
| special | I think that overvalues consistency | 07:29 |
| special | convenience and intuitiveness are more important | 07:29 |
| pawky | Venemo_j: well, as special put it, i think... most of the time your messages are short enough to not having to scroll... | 07:29 |
| special | consistency contributes to intuitiveness, but there is more to it than that | 07:29 |
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| pawky | special: well.. i believe going in a backwards motion, oposite to your typing will alert your brain, other things might happen... and go wrong... thus watch out and scroll right :-D | 07:30 |
| pawky | or up... i mean... right? | 07:31 |
| pawky | one thing is for sure though, there should be NO word suggestion option directly underneath the send button... thats really a no no... | 07:32 |
| pawky | the button really needs a "restricted area" | 07:32 |
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| pawky | I believe the N9 had the word suggestions to the left of the button... thats probably why the margin of error is far less on that one.. combined with the keyboard interpreting your key presses more correctly... | 07:33 |
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| Acce | do you think sending by swiping would not work? I think it would be great.. Do people miss-swipe much? | 07:44 |
| pawky | Acce: I do... :-( | 07:44 |
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| Acce | well, add optional remorse timer then | 07:44 |
| pawky | Acce: being used to the N9 | 07:45 |
| Acce | it's better feedback than the small "sending" text below your message | 07:45 |
| pawky | Acce: no.. that would be a hassle when wanting a quick conversation.. | 07:45 |
| Acce | > optional | 07:45 |
| pawky | Acce: dealing with the stock market, waiting seconds to send a reply cand be costly... | 07:45 |
| pawky | Acce: nah.... | 07:46 |
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| Acce | what was it like in N9 then | 07:47 |
| pawky | I believe the answe is: If wanting a send button, isolate it A) (no other stuff to press nearby), B)and make the keyboard adaptively learn which keys you are trying to press. C) but it at the same spot as E-mail, most of the time you are writing short messages anyway, and ending with a short swipe up (or down depending upon how you look a it) will work. | 07:48 |
| Acce | I never had one so I don't have it's use patterns in my muscle memory | 07:48 |
| pawky | Acce: I mean, as I am very used to the N9, i do many times 'miss swipe'.. | 07:48 |
| Acce | oh, ok | 07:48 |
| pawky | Acce: due to some unknown reason, someone desided to change the direction of moving between, your screens... :-( | 07:49 |
| pawky | making using the Jolla after the N9, quite a hassle.. | 07:50 |
| pawky | it gives the sentence "To fast, to furious" a new meaning... ;-) | 07:51 |
| Pnuu | "too" | 07:51 |
| pawky | Pnuu: tooo fast tooo furious... | 07:52 |
| Pnuu | ;-D | 07:52 |
| pawky | Pnuu: I can asure you, that is certainly not my only miss spelling I have done here... | 07:53 |
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| pawky | maybe I should have written two fast, two furious... :-D | 07:54 |
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| pp_ | hmn, is there any useful equivalent to "yum list extras"? zypper se -si | grep System sort of, but it also lists system packages that aren't really "extra" :-) | 09:10 |
| pp_ | (basically want to figure out what cruft I have around from 3rd party packages) | 09:11 |
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| flux | someone should test if those humble bundle android games work on jolla ;) | 09:12 |
| flux | oh, /lastlog reveals leinir tried at least one of them | 09:13 |
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| leinir | yup, at least some work just fine :) | 09:13 |
| flux | now how about the rest :) | 09:13 |
| leinir | why not give them a try? ;) | 09:14 |
| flux | well, it involves a monetary transaction. not a big one though, I suppose.. | 09:14 |
| flux | but I think on principle I would rather not pay for something I cannot use | 09:14 |
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| leinir | well, for that you can always set your donation amount to be 100%... that way you can tell yourself it's a charity donation and some free games ;) | 09:17 |
| chem|st | so my playback system was gone completely followed by being late to work... | 09:19 |
| chem|st | and the UI is like 10 times more responsive after a reboot with the same apps open... | 09:20 |
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| pp_ | hmn, looks like everything listed as "System Packages" was really old cruft :) | 09:23 |
| pp_ | (got emacs from somewhere and that pulled in X11 stuff etc.) | 09:23 |
| Nicd- | I love it that when you use package managers, X11 or Wayland is bound to be installed at some point | 09:24 |
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| pp_ | looks like some stuff had src.rpm in the jolla repo, but no binaries | 09:25 |
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| pp_ | e.g. | libX11 | srcpackage | 1.5.0-1.1.1 | noarch | jolla | 09:25 |
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| pp_ | (binary in repo for 1.0.2.5 but not 1.0.3.8, looks like) | 09:27 |
| pp_ | not that I really want libX11 on my phone, text-mode emacs would be great | 09:27 |
| Stskeeps | libx11 is gone from 1.0.2.5 or 1.0.3.8 or above i think | 09:27 |
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| pp_ | source rpm is still there | 09:31 |
| flux | aww, Fatal error: nothing provides libXaw.so.7 needed by emacs-24.1-5.5.1.armv7hl | 09:33 |
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| flux | ah, phew, there is the emacs-nox package | 09:33 |
| flux | but then I cannot use X-forwarding to run graphical emacs from my Jolla! | 09:34 |
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| pp_ | is there now a sensible repo for stuff like that?-) | 09:34 |
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| flux | dunno, that probably comes from mer-tools | 09:35 |
| pp_ | ah, emacs yes, wget & mosh no (which I have from "somewhere") | 09:37 |
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| clau | Stskeeps, will there be any improvements on the interaction between android vm and sailfish os? I'm specifically interested in the notifications and possibility to use apps that do voice and video. | 09:45 |
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| Stskeeps | clau: i think we're always improving it | 09:45 |
| Stskeeps | it used to be much much more lousy :) | 09:45 |
| clau | true that :) | 09:45 |
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| ggabriel | interesting, not sure whether sailfish uses gnutls or not: http://arstechnica.com/security/2014/03/critical-crypto-bug-leaves-linux-hundreds-of-apps-open-to-eavesdropping/ | 09:46 |
| clau | the thing is, I need to buy a new phone for my wife and she requires some things to just work. | 09:46 |
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| flux | stskeeps, it would be awesome if you could fake it so that each 'running' android app had its own window | 09:47 |
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| flux | but I guess Android doesn't make it too easy | 09:47 |
| clau | ggabriel, gnutls-2.12.18-1.1.2.armv7hl is present on my phone | 09:47 |
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| leinir | it did take blackberry some time to work out how to do that right, yeah | 09:48 |
| flux | interesting to see how Jolla handle security updates, or if the handle them ;-) | 09:48 |
| flux | missing letters for completeness: s and y | 09:49 |
| pp_ | glib-networking, connman & telepathy-gabble | 09:49 |
| ggabriel | i guess this is a critical bug and they'll backport the patch | 09:49 |
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| Stskeeps | this day was brought to you by the letters o h d a m n | 09:50 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 09:50 |
| chem|st | clau: 150eur galaxy ace 3 | 09:50 |
| pp_ | hmn, my google talk password is under jeopardy! | 09:50 |
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| clau | chem|st, why? | 09:50 |
| pp_ | oh wait, macos x mavericks probably already leaked it | 09:50 |
| pp_ | :-) | 09:50 |
| pp_ | Stskeeps: you do have an opportunity to prove you're open :-) | 09:51 |
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| pp_ | "1.0.4.x Fixes CVE-2014-whatnot. If you used xmpp you might want to change your password to be sure" | 09:52 |
| clau | chem|st, will it run sailfish? | 09:52 |
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| pp_ | advisories done quickly and professionally are free advertising! | 09:52 |
| ggabriel | i wouldn't go that far ;) | 09:53 |
| chem|st | clau: cheap and the hardware might support sailfish as it has the same CPU as the nexus4 | 09:55 |
| chem|st | oh actually it does not or what is the difference between snapdragon S4 and S4+ ? | 09:56 |
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| chem|st | clau: but if sailfish is not ready for your wife yet, a device ready for her with the option to adopt the fish later is probably a good idea | 09:57 |
| chem|st | I found the ace3 while looking for a new cheap device to replace a underpowered android one, also looking for fish | 09:58 |
| clau | chem|st, thanks for the advice | 09:59 |
| chem|st | not sure about the S4 vs S4+ thing | 09:59 |
| clau | I'm going to wait for the next update before deciding, I guess | 09:59 |
| chem|st | that is a very good idea | 09:59 |
| ggabriel | so, wait for next week then :D | 09:59 |
| chem|st | but I doubt you get better hardware/dime than things like ace3 or 100eur china imports | 10:00 |
| ggabriel | the "better hardware" argument depends i believe | 10:01 |
| clau | it doesn't look bad, indeed | 10:01 |
| clau | ggabriel, is the countdown timer on? :) | 10:01 |
| ggabriel | clau: we are still waiting for the ETA application | 10:01 |
| ggabriel | i'm getting a sony xperia sp soon, which has a faster cpu than the jolla, and allegedly good call quality+reception | 10:02 |
| ggabriel | let's see how they compare ;-) | 10:02 |
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| clau | multitouch: "up to 10 fingers" | 10:03 |
| clau | http://www.gsmarena.com/sony_xperia_sp-5364.php | 10:04 |
| stephg_ | emacs! | 10:04 |
| clau | hahahaha | 10:05 |
| ggabriel | not enough, i've got 20 | 10:05 |
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| Pnuu | "ook" - the Librarian | 10:06 |
| Acce | ggabriel: the official ETA app? | 10:06 |
| ggabriel | Acce: yeah, of course! | 10:06 |
| * ggabriel doesn't quite care about when the update comes :) | 10:07 | |
| Acce | the unofficial one exists already though | 10:07 |
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| clau | regarding the android vm, wouldn't it be better to treat the minimized vm as a suspended android phone? then you wouldn't need to run an app over another app, just to make the second one think it's in background. | 10:10 |
| ggabriel | clau: you'd lose multitasking in the foreground application that way | 10:10 |
| clau | well, the notifications still need some love, as in the current implementation I never got any sound or LED activity from an android notification | 10:10 |
| ggabriel | it would be a good switch tho | 10:10 |
| ggabriel | (as in a settings switch) | 10:11 |
| clau | I agree | 10:11 |
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| goroboro | uuurgh now gnutls suffering from similar to the apple goto fail | 10:14 |
| Nicd- | sort of similar | 10:14 |
| ggabriel | life is boring without bugs | 10:14 |
| goroboro | yeah... but much wider impact :( | 10:14 |
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| ggabriel | also, all your encrypted information are belong to me | 10:14 |
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| goroboro | ggabriel: lol | 10:14 |
| sharpneli | It's funny that they call it "goto fail" even though it's more of an if fail :D | 10:14 |
| clau | http://tech.slashdot.org/story/14/03/05/0329252/one-in-ten-americans-thinks-html-is-a-type-of-sexually-transmitted-infection | 10:14 |
| clau | :D | 10:14 |
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| goroboro | I have html | 10:15 |
| clau | :) | 10:15 |
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| sharpneli | Well no wonder. All C++ guys always fiddle around with std:: ;) | 10:15 |
| * goroboro checks for security updates on his servers | 10:15 | |
| ggabriel | goroboro: sorry to hear that, i've got html5, which is worse | 10:15 |
| ggabriel | sharpneli: lol | 10:16 |
| goroboro | you should see my javascript | 10:16 |
| leinir | and 1 in 10 geeks think a crank shaft is a dirty word... specialist knowledge isn't useful outside its context :P | 10:16 |
| goroboro | hurr hurr... check out this crank shaft | 10:16 |
| clau | :)) | 10:16 |
| ggabriel | pass me the hydrospanner | 10:17 |
| goroboro | now *that* *is* a dirty word! | 10:19 |
| clau | http://portaudit.freebsd.org/8e5e6d42-a0fa-11e3-b09a-080027f2d077.html --- Python -- buffer overflow in socket.recvfrom_into() | 10:19 |
| jrayhawk | nothing beats shaft bearing knockers | 10:19 |
| Andy80 | hi, a quick question. I've just received the Aloa other half. I've applied it, itdownloaded the Aloa theme from the store, changing the theme etc... but the ringing tone is still the default one and I cannot find the new one. Any idea? | 10:19 |
| goroboro | crikey the OSS community is under attack! | 10:20 |
| goroboro | ah... nice... just checked a couple of my servers... libgnutls-openssl27 libgnutls26 security updates available | 10:21 |
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| goroboro | of course... I have no idea whether those updates address the same issue :) | 10:23 |
| sharpneli | leinir: And they can laugh at it just as we laugh at that. | 10:23 |
| sharpneli | It's partly funny precisely due to that | 10:23 |
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| clau | Andy80, maybe a reboot will help? or a search on together.jolla.com, maybe someone else had the problem and there's a known fix for it. | 10:25 |
| inffy_ | Andy80: the ringtone won't change in the settings section if you look there | 10:26 |
| inffy_ | it just changes in the background but the change is not seeable in the Settings app | 10:26 |
| inffy_ | so the Settings app will always show the default ringtone (or whatever you have selected there) | 10:27 |
| inffy_ | but the other half overrides that, which is kind of "stupid" | 10:27 |
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| Andy80 | kinda user unfriendly I would say... | 10:30 |
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| inffy_ | well yeah, and it's not good that if you change the ringtone in the settings app the other half still makes the phone use the ringtone that is tied to the ambience | 10:31 |
| inffy_ | and you can't (atleast i haven't found a way) change the ringtone in the ambiences that come with the phone or the other halfs | 10:31 |
| inffy_ | i just made my own ambience and changed the ringtones for it | 10:32 |
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| chem|st | inffy_: overwrite toh ringtones with your ringtones, or extract the image and make a new ambience | 10:46 |
| chem|st | Andy80: as they said TOH special things are by default only available when the ambience is active and overwrite user-defaults | 10:47 |
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| SpeedEvil | Anyone recommend a SIP client? I assume android :/ | 11:49 |
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| TheBootroo_work | will the connection loop bug be fixed in the next releas e? | 13:21 |
| TheBootroo_work | rly annoying as hell, my phone is unusable on 3G | 13:22 |
| TheBootroo_work | only wifi works fine | 13:22 |
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| ShadowJK | kinda other way around for me :) | 13:31 |
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| ShadowJK | (wifi unstable, 3g stable) | 13:32 |
| Jare | does any android sip client actually work with jolla? I've tried csipsimple and linphone..cannot make calls with either one | 13:32 |
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| goroboro | Jare: it looks like telepathy-rakia is available... so sooner or later, someone is going to develop a SIP client based on this | 13:50 |
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| Jare | gorobo: yes i'm aware that the missing thing is basically the glue between rakia and jolla dialer :) | 13:57 |
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| goroboro | Jare: yeah... bit of a pain that... there is a tjc for this: https://together.jolla.com/question/415/sip-voip-native-integration/ | 14:01 |
| goroboro | sorry I can't be more helpful... I don't really have a SIP account | 14:03 |
| goroboro | and so I haven't tried installing a client or anything :D | 14:03 |
| pp__ | :-) | 14:03 |
| pp__ | setting up your own asterisk isn't that bad | 14:03 |
| goroboro | mmm been meaning to do it for a while | 14:03 |
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| goroboro | was thinking of doing it on a pi | 14:04 |
| pp__ | it's a fun little project that's educational | 14:04 |
| goroboro | yeah... and once there is a sailfish client... it would mean that I could dial out of my landline from my mobile | 14:04 |
| goroboro | I just need to find the time to set aside for it | 14:05 |
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| Jare | goroboro: if you're going to start from scratch, i would suggest using freeswitch rather that asterisk. It has a more stable core and offers a lot of things that cannot be done with asterisk. There might be a bit steeper learning curve though | 14:18 |
| goroboro | Jare: I'll check it out... | 14:21 |
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| goroboro | although I need to avoid steep learning curves at the moment :D:D:D | 14:21 |
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| Jare | well if you don't want to spend time learning the configuration structure, syntax etc. atm, there's multiple web based configuration tools available. You can use for example blue.box for both freeswitch and asterisk ;) | 14:29 |
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| chem|st | Jare: we were told that SIP works from cli just the UIs are missing | 14:45 |
| chem|st | my landline is SIP and direct IP dialing would be nice though | 14:46 |
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| tbr | it's not just UI, it's also setting the right audio parameters on the call. currently it turns on the wrong microphone and doesn't enable the audio path for output | 14:56 |
| tbr | it could be done as part of the UI work though | 14:57 |
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| chem|st | tbr: thanks for elaborating hope this is roadmapped | 15:00 |
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| tbr | chem|st: it was stated that there is no immediate plan due to other things with higher priority, BUT if the community steps up and tries things out, makes a proof of concept, then it could happen much faster. | 15:04 |
| chem|st | tbr: so someone building an non-unified SIPclient is needed? | 15:05 |
| tbr | chem|st: no, just someone who makes audio work and shows that you can dial/receive calls | 15:07 |
| tbr | I don't remember if it was here or on #sailfishos, but you should be able to find the exact statement in the public logs | 15:08 |
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| cvp | hello :) | 15:11 |
| cvp | kimmoli: you are here ? :) | 15:12 |
| cvp | or maybe some other know if is it possible to refresh/rescan/ the batterie state over the terminal? | 15:15 |
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| chem|st | tbr: ok | 15:20 |
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| szopin_sailing | cat in /var/lib/power? | 15:24 |
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| szopin_sailing | or is it stuck there? | 15:25 |
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| cvp | no stuck, a ittle test if i change the internal batterie to external batterie | 15:26 |
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| cvp | if i change it, than the batterie state show me on home screen the same % like befor | 15:26 |
| cvp | my interneal batterie have at this moment 69%, my external batterie have 92%, if i change it to external, than the phone shows me 69% and not 92% and this i want refresh | 15:28 |
| szopin_sailing | it should start adding values with new capacity in var/lib/power, maybe recalculatioj to percentage breaks | 15:28 |
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| cvp | aha... importent .... i dont reboot the phone i if i change it.... | 15:29 |
| cvp | have builed a switcher between two batteries | 15:29 |
| tbr | so you're not going through the ToH pins? | 15:30 |
| szopin_sailing | t=92693 in tmo | 15:30 |
| cvp | tbr, not for this solution... i test both at same time. but the effizience are not good | 15:31 |
| cvp | sorry of course, not in same time :D | 15:31 |
| tbr | ok | 15:31 |
| cvp | one charge with 3200mAh batterie give me only 85% charge (for 2100mAh) | 15:32 |
| tbr | if you go through the regular battery pins, then you might have the problem, that the phone does its battery estimation continuously and builds cell statistics | 15:33 |
| tbr | so you'll be confusing it by the voltage jump | 15:33 |
| tbr | and it won't know the discharge behaviour | 15:33 |
| cvp | that right | 15:34 |
| tbr | I don't know if you can 'reset' the battery state | 15:34 |
| ShadowJK | .8 * .8 * 3200 = 2048 | 15:34 |
| ShadowJK | Though he's using the 5V input pin, not direct to battery | 15:35 |
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| cvp | think reset is not good, but a read refresh from batterie ? | 15:35 |
| cvp | Shadow.... no, not for this method | 15:35 |
| cvp | i use it before with a step-up regulator/booster | 15:35 |
| cvp | tbr you are today on c-base ? | 15:37 |
| tbr | cvp: no, I'm on my way home from Helsinki, actually visited JollaHQ today. :-) | 15:37 |
| cvp | ah cool :) | 15:37 |
| ShadowJK | cvp; what do you do now? | 15:38 |
| cvp | moment, i make a picture, my english isnt good enough to explain it :D | 15:38 |
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| ShadowJK | Probably a full charge + full discharge resets the battery meter | 15:45 |
| ShadowJK | bypassing the charge meter makes it impossible for it to have good results | 15:45 |
| cvp | http://i62.tinypic.com/2py41tl.jpg | 15:46 |
| cvp | http://i58.tinypic.com/hw9ufs.jpg | 15:46 |
| cvp | http://i58.tinypic.com/2lmq5c4.jpg | 15:46 |
| cvp | and last http://i58.tinypic.com/wklif9.jpg | 15:47 |
| cvp | i do that today fast, sorry, looks bad :) want show this on c-base | 15:47 |
| cvp | problem is what tbr write here... | 15:48 |
| tbr | cvp: btw, did you get anything in the mail? :) | 15:48 |
| Stskeeps | cvp: what on -earth- are you doing | 15:48 |
| cvp | tbr, wich mail ? | 15:49 |
| tbr | cvp: snail mail | 15:49 |
| cvp | Stskeeps.... its a combo from both method | 15:49 |
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| cvp | oh i check fast... today iam home | 15:50 |
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| cvp | Stskeeps: understand what i am doing ? | 15:51 |
| Stskeeps | not 100% :P | 15:51 |
| Stskeeps | but nm me :) | 15:51 |
| kimju | hmmm.. I got Jolla yesterday and now have twice gotten it into mode where it displays the application icons and only thing that I can do is pull it down "one row" to see the phone/message/browser/camera icons. it doesn't go further nor does any of the icons react to presses. | 15:51 |
| kimju | what I'm doing wrong? :D | 15:52 |
| Stskeeps | did you upgrade to 1.0.3.8? | 15:52 |
| kimju | yes | 15:52 |
| cvp | tbr: no nothing here :( | 15:53 |
| kimju | and these have happened after that. | 15:54 |
| chem|st | kimju: while connected to the internet? | 15:54 |
| chem|st | or any network... | 15:55 |
| szopin_ | does 'upower -d' show new max values? | 15:55 |
| szopin_ | energy-full | 15:56 |
| kimju | and when that happens, it also shows top of the ambiance (snow white, the vertical bars, normally shown behind the clock) behind the icons. | 15:57 |
| kimju | chem|st, yes, wifi active on both times | 15:57 |
| cvp | Stskeeps: .... ok left the batterie... on the batterie right with green pcb this is the Liion charger. left from the batterie: this going to the two pins, the red pcb on the batterie is the step-up booster....... so this is the first what i have do it, than the second test: right from the TOH: with this i disconnect the internal batterie to the phone, but i grab, so than i connect the bexternal batterie to the black band, you see a | 15:58 |
| cvp | the batterie from internal to external ... without rebooting | 15:58 |
| Stskeeps | ah | 15:59 |
| cvp | i use two switcher... frist i switch both batterie parallel... than i cut the connection from the internal batterie with the second switcher | 15:59 |
| szopin_ | hot-swap? | 16:00 |
| cvp | yes.... | 16:00 |
| tbr | cvp: too bad, show pictures then. If there are people interested, I can probably make a bulk shipment. 2€ per blank pcb covers our costs. also my best wishes to the audience, keep those events coming! | 16:00 |
| szopin_ | upower -d should let you know if phone got the new capacity reading | 16:00 |
| tbr | the capacity is probably hardcoded | 16:01 |
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| tbr | the question is if the remaining charge reading is going to be sensible in any way | 16:02 |
| szopin_ | the dump has both values | 16:02 |
| tbr | also if anyone attempts such a stunt, better make sure that both batteries have about the same nominal voltage, else you might get surprises while charging. explosive surprises | 16:02 |
| cvp | tbr: maybe it will come i next days ... .hope so | 16:03 |
| tbr | cvp: I think it only went out on monday, so it would have been luck if it would have made it | 16:03 |
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| cvp | hmm | 16:04 |
| cvp | .... tbr.. than better i stop with this method.... | 16:05 |
| cvp | but the efficience are muuuch better... real 3200 mAh :) | 16:05 |
| tbr | cvp: just be careful | 16:06 |
| tbr | what's the nominal voltage for the jolla battery? | 16:06 |
| cvp | 3,8? | 16:06 |
| tbr | ok that's fairly high, so you should be safe, regardless of what cell you have there | 16:07 |
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| cvp | or i shut down the phone change the switcher and boot again... than its all safe | 16:09 |
| tbr | that was not my point though | 16:09 |
| tbr | but my train arrives in Tampere, gtg, ttyl. | 16:09 |
| cvp | o/ | 16:10 |
| cvp | szopin_: is this "upower -d" a command ? | 16:11 |
| grzywacz | interesting; frame rate display in the launcher is consistently red but if I scroll it even by one pixel it gets green&smooth | 16:11 |
| szopin_ | yeah | 16:12 |
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| cvp | oh cool nice information about the batterie | 16:12 |
| cvp | wait i test is :) | 16:12 |
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| szopin_ | if the values update after switch it means ui element showing % ignores jumps | 16:13 |
| szopin_ | possibly | 16:14 |
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| cvp | no he dont update it | 16:17 |
| szopin_ | hmm | 16:18 |
| cvp | yeah will see, maybe we find a soluton for it :) | 16:19 |
| cvp | so, i out, c-base waiting :) | 16:19 |
| szopin_ | cu | 16:19 |
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| cvp | cya | 16:21 |
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| szopin_ | maybe upowerd needs restarting | 16:23 |
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| XenGi | tonight we have a sailfish os meetup at c-base space station. feel free to drop in if you are near the landing site in berlin. | 16:32 |
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| chem|st | kimju: that sounds nasty, connection errors can stall the UI and do lots of funky stuff to it, we are all waiting for the upgrade promised for next week | 16:56 |
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| tehdely | two days now, no support from care@jolla :( | 18:10 |
| tehdely | any sailors here able to escalate my issue? | 18:10 |
| tehdely | it's ticket #8376 | 18:11 |
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| VDVsx | tehdely, I'm not from care, but such things take a bit of time, you are probably the first case from your country, needs to be checked with external parties most probably | 18:17 |
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| tehdely | well i hope that is the case, and i am not just being blown off | 18:24 |
| VDVsx | ticket is assigned already, you will get a reply for sure :) | 18:25 |
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| dwangoAC | I made the difficult decision to borrow an Android phone from work until a neo900 or Jolla device is available in the United States. Godspeed to both projects! | 18:41 |
| Yaniel | dwangoAC: why not sign up for sailfish on android alpha testing? :P | 18:42 |
| dwangoAC | Yaniel: I'm game | 18:42 |
| Yaniel | /msg sledges | 18:42 |
| dwangoAC | Yaniel: But I do need it to be *just barely* reliable | 18:42 |
| Yaniel | if your device can run cyanogenmod 10.1 you have a chance | 18:43 |
| dwangoAC | Rebooting twice a day I can handle, destroying all of my data I can't :) | 18:43 |
| dwangoAC | Yaniel: Truth be told, it's a Samsung Galaxy S4 | 18:43 |
| dwangoAC | Yaniel: Not sure if it can handle 10.1 but I'm willing to try | 18:43 |
| Yaniel | (I have a jolla so wouldn't know any details) | 18:43 |
| dwangoAC | Yaniel: Unfortunately, the model I have is incompatible with LTE band 4 that T-Moble USA uses | 18:44 |
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| sledges | dwangoAC: make a full backup of your data via recovery mode ;) | 19:09 |
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| dwangoAC | sledges: Not a bad idea, of course :) | 19:10 |
| dwangoAC | sledges: Are you the person handling the alpha? | 19:10 |
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| sledges | handling you as early adopter :) | 19:11 |
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| dwangoAC | sledges: Heh = handling :) | 19:11 |
| dwangoAC | er, - | 19:11 |
| dwangoAC | sledges: Is there something you are specifically looking for? I am a test engineer / beta tester by trade. | 19:12 |
| dwangoAC | ...in the telecom field. | 19:12 |
| dwangoAC | So, yeah, this is sort of right up my alley. | 19:12 |
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| sledges | we'll have images for n4 and s3 , self-porting instructions for the rest of devices come later | 19:13 |
| dwangoAC | sledges: OK - what's an n4? | 19:13 |
| dwangoAC | Note 4? | 19:14 |
| sledges | nexus4 | 19:14 |
| Stskeeps | nexus 4, samsung galaxy s iii (lte, i9305) | 19:14 |
| dwangoAC | sledges: OK, my wife has a Nexus 4 | 19:14 |
| sledges | dwangoAC: pm me your name and email to become an early adopter | 19:16 |
| dwangoAC | sledges: Will do. | 19:16 |
| Nicd- | sledges: is there any hope for Galaxy Gio? | 19:17 |
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| dwangoAC | sledges: One other question, is dual-booting a possibility or is it an all or nothing propisition? | 19:17 |
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| sledges | Nicd-: will release instructions to DIY for any device that can run CM >=10.1 | 19:18 |
| Nicd- | great :) | 19:19 |
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| sledges | dwangoAC: that will be in hands of community once instructions are out and you see where rootfs is held | 19:19 |
| Nicd- | I'll try it on the Gio then. it has very low memory but supposedly should run CM 10.1 and android 4.2.2 | 19:19 |
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| M4rtinK | what about HP TouchPad ? :) | 19:28 |
| Stskeeps | also +official cm10.1 | 19:29 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 19:29 |
| M4rtinK | is like a Jolla spec wise (dualcore 1.4 GHz Qualcom + 1 GB RAM) | 19:29 |
| M4rtinK | and you have it :) | 19:29 |
| M4rtinK | last point is probably the most important :) | 19:29 |
| Stskeeps | i have a touchpad, fwiw, too | 19:29 |
| M4rtinK | that's what I mean :) | 19:30 |
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| M4rtinK | (and I have it too :) ) | 19:30 |
| Stskeeps | so maybe at some point | 19:30 |
| Stskeeps | it's a nice device | 19:30 |
| sledges | ahhh what a nostalgic reminiscence (1 year old!): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEgdW3KSxkM | 19:30 |
| M4rtinK | yeah & many developers might still have it :) | 19:30 |
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| M4rtinK | that's x86 == cheating :) | 19:31 |
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| Stskeeps | but yeah, i should get the touchpad back alive at some point.. | 19:37 |
| Stskeeps | as well as .. sailfishos on nook color! | 19:37 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 19:37 |
| sjtoik | Stskeeps: any estimate on stable release? | 19:40 |
| Pnuu | random.random() | 19:40 |
| Pnuu | 0.04112110734491936 | 19:40 |
| Pnuu | very soon! | 19:40 |
| sledges | M4rtinK: that's why it's 1y.o. ;) i wonder how 'long' the port took for vgrade_ :) | 19:40 |
| Stskeeps | sjtoik: hw adaptation or sailfishos itself | 19:41 |
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| sjtoik | the os itself | 19:41 |
| dwangoAC | Stskeeps: I'm looking at buying a Glaxy S3 for alpha testing but it is not clear from the Craigslist posting which varient it is; if it turns out to be non-LTE, is that OK? | 19:41 |
| Stskeeps | dwangoAC: i9305 is what we're working on | 19:41 |
| Stskeeps | community should take i9300 fairly easily though | 19:41 |
| dwangoAC | Stskeeps: When the "community" is referenced here, is there a particular web presence for said "community"? I spend most of my time on the maemo forums but I suspect there's better places | 19:42 |
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| Stskeeps | dwangoAC: pretty much here and together.jolla.com for now | 19:42 |
| Stskeeps | basically we're focusing initially on two 'official' adaptations and at same time, giving the keys to the kingdom, to teach how to do the porting | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | so other adaptations can get to same quality levels | 19:43 |
| Stskeeps | two very different chipsets to make sure we get things done properly | 19:43 |
| dwangoAC | They are indeed very different chipsets | 19:44 |
| Sail0r | and why is always said be 10.1 compatible? | 19:45 |
| Sail0r | +cm | 19:45 |
| Stskeeps | Sail0r: it's possible to take anything with a aosp-based source tree but cm10.1 is just easier | 19:46 |
| Sail0r | kk thx | 19:46 |
| Stskeeps | and it means a lot of infrastructure is there already | 19:46 |
| Sail0r | you are using the cm kernel and drivers? | 19:47 |
| Stskeeps | yeah | 19:47 |
| Sail0r | cool | 19:47 |
| Stskeeps | but more meant in terms of delivery | 19:47 |
| Stskeeps | such as clockworkmod etc | 19:47 |
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| Sail0r | are you trying to make a "one-click installer" ? | 19:48 |
| Sail0r | like cm did? | 19:48 |
| Stskeeps | it's pretty easy atm | 19:48 |
| Stskeeps | two zip files, boom | 19:48 |
| Sail0r | nice | 19:49 |
| Nicd- | this all sounds very good :) | 19:49 |
| Sail0r | I hope for a nexus7 port :) | 19:49 |
| Sail0r | or a Jolla Tablet | 19:49 |
| Sail0r | which ever comes first ;) | 19:50 |
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| chem|st | sledges: the rumour has that omap devices won't be supported... I have a galaxy tab 2 7" with gsm... how about some alpha testing (I just thought of flashing latest cyano nightly then I thought of reading irc and find you guys about alpha testing) | 20:02 |
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| chem|st | Sail0r: yeah jolla tablet | 20:04 |
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| sledges | chem|st: n4 and sgs3 images will be made available. instructions how to port to other CM-supported devices will also be published | 20:06 |
| chem|st | ok so you do no public alpha testing | 20:07 |
| Sail0r | why are you not doing public alpha testing? | 20:07 |
| Stskeeps | we start out with images to early adoptors, to set expectations straight | 20:08 |
| chem|st | understandable | 20:08 |
| sledges | chem|st: you confused with (keywords): rumours, omap, galaxy tab, alpha testing ;) | 20:08 |
| chem|st | sledges: I was just wondering if I have anything to test and brick my tablet with... | 20:09 |
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| Sail0r | lol | 20:10 |
| chem|st | sledges: I sit in my room and play BSbingo | 20:11 |
| sledges | i guess what we just said reveals pretty well of what will be at hand :) | 20:11 |
| chem|st | yes | 20:11 |
| sledges | glad we cleared the rumours away :) | 20:13 |
| chem|st | :/ | 20:13 |
| Sail0r | :) | 20:14 |
| Sail0r | maybe Jolla should start their own newssite | 20:16 |
| Sail0r | that would prevent much rumours ;) | 20:16 |
| Stskeeps | but anyway, let's see how this all turns out - early adoptor signup is still ongoing; not going to be something silly like NDAs; the important thing is just that people understand what they have and not present it as something else | 20:16 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 20:16 |
| Stskeeps | also, what rumours.. | 20:16 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 20:16 |
| Sail0r | that's what I would also wish for Updates straight announcements ;) | 20:17 |
| stephg | ah, the ETA app! | 20:17 |
| Sail0r | but you are getting better :) | 20:18 |
| Sail0r | not the ETA | 20:18 |
| Sail0r | but what can we expect from next update | 20:18 |
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| Acce | Let's make Jolla BB app, it shows Jolla's office where everyone is coding | 20:19 |
| Sail0r | the mystic marking in tjc is strange sometimes ;) | 20:19 |
| Sail0r | Jolla webcam? | 20:19 |
| Acce | if you pay for 24h pack, you'll see what happens at night ;) | 20:19 |
| Sail0r | hehe | 20:19 |
| Acce | (spoiler: more coding) | 20:19 |
| sledges | actual coding | 20:19 |
| Sail0r | coding porn? | 20:20 |
| Pnuu | in whitespace! | 20:20 |
| Acce | "What happens in Jolla, stays in Jolla" | 20:20 |
| Sail0r | it's like cable porn for neteng ^^ | 20:21 |
| * tbr gets more popcorn | 20:21 | |
| Stskeeps | jolla office at night is not that terribly exciting | 20:22 |
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| tbr | except during work-week | 20:22 |
| tbr | or whatever it was called | 20:23 |
| chem|st | Stskeeps: signup? | 20:23 |
| sledges | what is <insert any time period here> ? | 20:23 |
| tbr | sledges: I'm refering to one specific week in october or november last year | 20:23 |
| tbr | furry other halves ensued | 20:24 |
| Stskeeps | tbr: that was in daytime | 20:24 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 20:24 |
| Stskeeps | chem|st: yeah, if you spotted the nexus 4 video, there's an instruction to come here | 20:24 |
| chem|st | tbr: don't feed beyond midnight and don't pour water on them | 20:24 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 20:24 |
| sledges | tbr: im referring to famous sailors' quote ("what is holiday, what is weekend, ...") :) | 20:24 |
| chem|st | Stskeeps: hehe | 20:25 |
| sledges | *quotes | 20:25 |
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| tbr | sledges: yes, I'm aware, just wanted to qualify my statement. | 20:28 |
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| sledges | that sounds funny too - "hey all, we'll have a work-week next month" :)) | 20:29 |
| AL13N | it does | 20:30 |
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| Acce | so.. what would be the partner-screen for Furry TOH? | 20:31 |
| Stskeeps | pink or blue? | 20:31 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 20:31 |
| chem|st | Acce: PETA | 20:31 |
| Pnuu | :-D | 20:32 |
| stephg | eep | 20:32 |
| CoderCandy | Soo, should I send in my Jolla on service? | 20:32 |
| Pnuu | that would be a PITA | 20:32 |
| CoderCandy | My random-crash problem has only gotten worse | 20:32 |
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| CoderCandy | It's at the point now where my jolla can't even boot without it happening | 20:32 |
| CoderCandy | It tries to boot, crashes | 20:32 |
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| AL13N | did you take out battery for 10min? | 20:32 |
| CoderCandy | Tries to boot, crashes | 20:32 |
| CoderCandy | AL13N: no, I had it out for 1.5 hours | 20:32 |
| CoderCandy | Didn't work | 20:32 |
| slate | CoderCandy: crash means reboot or shutdown? | 20:32 |
| chem|st | CoderCandy: recover the btrfs | 20:33 |
| AL13N | did you try to charge it "without turning it on" | 20:33 |
| CoderCandy | slate: crash means quick red flash on led | 20:33 |
| CoderCandy | then another attempt to boot | 20:33 |
| Stskeeps | CoderCandy: send it in for care@ if it's an immense problem for you | 20:33 |
| AL13N | chem|st: how does one recover the btrfs? | 20:33 |
| chem|st | AL13N: recovery mode over telnet | 20:33 |
| AL13N | ah | 20:34 |
| CoderCandy | Yeah, I've had enough problems with it now that I feel like there's something faulty on it | 20:34 |
| Stskeeps | CoderCandy: :nod: | 20:34 |
| CoderCandy | Random crash/overheating while charging | 20:34 |
| Stskeeps | sorry for the issues, hope it'll be fixed in an upcoming software release or in repair | 20:34 |
| CoderCandy | Shutdowns to the point where I can't make a single call | 20:34 |
| chem|st | CoderCandy: the whole 1.0.3.8 makes you feel you have a faulty hardware batch | 20:34 |
| CoderCandy | and now I can't even start it... | 20:34 |
| AL13N | chem|st: does the recovery mode with power+vol down work enough to recover btrfs? | 20:35 |
| AL13N | does it have enough tools to do it? | 20:35 |
| chem|st | AL13N: when you go over telnet it has an item to recover the btrfs | 20:36 |
| AL13N | oic | 20:36 |
| CoderCandy | Stskeeps: I can try that recovery thing | 20:36 |
| chem|st | and yes there is shell but only with built in cmds | 20:36 |
| AL13N | automagical... sounds dangerous | 20:36 |
| CoderCandy | And if that don't work I'll send it in. | 20:36 |
| AL13N | busybox stuff | 20:36 |
| ale | hello, is the release date announced for the new sailfishos update? | 20:36 |
| CoderCandy | Anyone have a guide? | 20:36 |
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| Sail0r | next week ale | 20:36 |
| AL13N | chem|st: i wonder if in recovery mode, you could mount nfs a chroot | 20:37 |
| chem|st | CoderCandy: https://together.jolla.com/question/22079/howto-all-pc-users-recover-or-reset-a-device-that-is-stuck/ | 20:37 |
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| ale | Sail0r: okay, thank you | 20:37 |
| chem|st | CoderCandy: when you are in over telnet just try 5) Try btrfs recovery... that worked for my sister and many others by now | 20:38 |
| CoderCandy | Ah, I'll try that | 20:38 |
| chem|st | CoderCandy: and till the update, leave your connectivity offline if not really needed | 20:39 |
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| CoderCandy | chem|st: will it work if I don't update to the latest update? | 20:39 |
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| Sail0r | why does Jolla use such an old kernel? And not one which has many bugfixes for btrfs? | 20:39 |
| CoderCandy | Since that's when everything seemed to go wrong. | 20:39 |
| Sail0r | does this cause the many issues with btrfs? | 20:39 |
| chem|st | CoderCandy: the only network I go online is my home wlan with 99% coverage | 20:39 |
| chem|st | CoderCandy: the btrfs recovery does not alter or reset anything | 20:40 |
| CoderCandy | If I factory reset on top of that to rollback the updates? | 20:40 |
| CoderCandy | I did a factory reset a while ago in hopes that it'd solve the problems | 20:40 |
| CoderCandy | Then I reupdated to latest patch. | 20:40 |
| chem|st | you should be fine with not updating to 3.8 | 20:40 |
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| chem|st | at least with 2.5 everything was working fine for me | 20:41 |
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| chem|st | but before you do that boot up properly and backup your data to your sdcard and reset from withtin the running system | 20:42 |
| chem|st | Sail0r: don't think so | 20:43 |
| Sail0r | chem|st: but there are so many improvements in the newer kernels for btrfs for stability and performance | 20:44 |
| chem|st | CoderCandy: I'd wait with sending it in at least till the next upgrade | 20:44 |
| Stskeeps | Sail0r: we actually backported a boatload of stuff | 20:44 |
| CoderCandy | chem|st: yeah, I'm gonna do that | 20:44 |
| CoderCandy | Unless I still get problems with pre-3.8 versions | 20:44 |
| Sail0r | Stskeeps: wow you really do the backporting stuff? Why not just use a up to date kernel? | 20:45 |
| chem|st | Sail0r: you can patch new stuff into old kernels (that is how you actually get new kernels...) | 20:45 |
| chem|st | CoderCandy: don't know if any firmwares were patched | 20:45 |
| Stskeeps | Sail0r: oh where do i start.. | 20:45 |
| Sail0r | chem|st: I know but why do this ? Isn't it much additional work? | 20:45 |
| * pp_ guesses forward-porting android stuff on your own is a pain too :-) | 20:46 | |
| Stskeeps | Sail0r: there's a mainline linux kernel and then there's all the non-mainlined stuff a SoC vendor puts on and then there's the stuff a ODM puts on | 20:46 |
| Sail0r | Stskeeps: Just in short. I just wonder why it's better to do backporting then just using actual stuff :) | 20:46 |
| chem|st | Sail0r: compatibility | 20:46 |
| Stskeeps | and then on top of it, what jolla puts on.. | 20:46 |
| Sail0r | Stskeeps: ok so it's mainly for the driver stuff? | 20:47 |
| Pnuu | ODM? obscure diffuser manufacturer?-) | 20:47 |
| chem|st | Sail0r: it is only for the driver stuff | 20:47 |
| Stskeeps | Sail0r: in practice a SoC vendor gives a supported configuration to a ODM and any attempt to move forward on your own in kernel space is akin to bashing yourself in the head with a overheated jolla | 20:47 |
| pp_ | maybe one day :) | 20:47 |
| Stskeeps | a certain kernel, certain userland bits, etc | 20:47 |
| Sail0r | Stskeeps: thx :). Now I unterstand it :) | 20:47 |
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| Sail0r | Stskeeps: so it's the same like IBM behaves with it's fu***ing raid controllers and SSL offloading cards ;) | 20:48 |
| chem|st | Sail0r: you know what pain USB3 is? | 20:49 |
| Sail0r | chem|st: yep | 20:49 |
| Sail0r | Stskeeps: why did you decided to use btrfs over ext4 ? | 20:49 |
| chem|st | and the actual lady doing it is one of intels best on that matter and she actually developed the whole stack on linux... now guess what makes it crash in 3.x kernels?! | 20:49 |
| Stskeeps | Sail0r: i didn't decide, but it was useful for what we needed to do | 20:50 |
| Sail0r | Stskeeps: like snapshots and so on? | 20:50 |
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| Stskeeps | nod | 20:50 |
| CoderCandy | There we go, factory resetting device | 20:50 |
| chem|st | Sail0r: you can just google pro and cons for that | 20:50 |
| Sail0r | Stskeeps: but it was a risky decision to use a non stable fs | 20:51 |
| chem|st | CoderCandy: so it worked? | 20:51 |
| CoderCandy | Yup, no more bootloop at least | 20:51 |
| Stskeeps | Sail0r: everything is risky | 20:51 |
| M4rtinK | well, at least the Kernel 3.4 is LTS | 20:51 |
| chem|st | CoderCandy: good :) | 20:51 |
| Stskeeps | we have a device that's built on technology that in december 2012 was crazy talk | 20:51 |
| Sail0r | chem|st: we are testing btrfs in production right now in our servers | 20:51 |
| Sail0r | Stskeeps: true that | 20:51 |
| M4rtinK | but 3.10 would be a better bet IMHO | 20:51 |
| Stskeeps | in terms of wayland/qt5/hybris | 20:51 |
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| Sail0r | chem|st: Stskeeps thanks for the answers :). That's why I like Jolla :) | 20:52 |
| chem|st | Sail0r: I consider btrfs pretty stable and a good choice for non-moving disks | 20:52 |
| Sail0r | chem|st: that's the reason why we consider it for the new database servers | 20:52 |
| Sail0r | chem|st: ssds allover | 20:52 |
| chem|st | you see... jolla does not have a turning disk hdd^^ | 20:53 |
| M4rtinK | well, you can always use LVM+thin provisioning+EXT4/XFS to basically get BTRFS, but more Unix-like & based on time tested stuff :) | 20:53 |
| Sail0r | chem|st: yep :). I know but android does not use btrfs or? | 20:53 |
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| CoderCandy | .. God I hate the forced tutorail when I do the factory reset... | 20:54 |
| M4rtinK | HP TouchPad actually uses LVM BTW :) | 20:54 |
| chem|st | M4rtinK: I do not have 64GB of ram to do things like that | 20:54 |
| chem|st | I had a setup alike and it cranked down to 30MB/s | 20:55 |
| M4rtinK | well, as long as you don't need to fsck a TB+ XFS volume, it should be fine | 20:55 |
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| M4rtinK | chem|st: thinP or normal LVM/LVM2 ? | 20:55 |
| chem|st | lvm2 | 20:55 |
| Sail0r | maybe we should use reiserfs on next jolla ;) | 20:56 |
| pp_ | kill that idea now! | 20:56 |
| Sail0r | :P | 20:56 |
| M4rtinK | chem|st: that's weird, it should really have that big performance penalty | 20:57 |
| M4rtinK | chem|st: might be bug-reportable to the LVM guys if reproducible | 20:58 |
| chem|st | on a 2GB ram machine | 20:58 |
| chem|st | oh I do not have that system anymore | 20:58 |
| Stskeeps | i just want to have zfs on my mobile device.. | 20:58 |
| chem|st | Stskeeps: yeah and 16GB ram to manage it^^ | 20:59 |
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| M4rtinK | we routinely test Fedora install on VMs with 1 GB RAM, and LVM2 is the default | 20:59 |
| chem|st | hardware raid ssd built in^^ | 20:59 |
| M4rtinK | and don't really see any horrendous performance degradation | 20:59 |
| M4rtinK | well if we can get Kernel 3.10 | 21:00 |
| chem|st | M4rtinK: maybe it was a configuration error on my side, it was also my desktop | 21:00 |
| * Stskeeps scrubs his zfs tank | 21:00 | |
| M4rtinK | we can use part of the eMMC as bcache for the uSD :) | 21:00 |
| chem|st | my 1.2GHz netbook does quiet well even with full bloated encryption on | 21:00 |
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| chem|st | M4rtinK: I don't think that the lvm is what is making it slow | 21:02 |
| Stskeeps | i'd really like sailfish on the desktop because i don't understand how my 8gb ram machine can be so **** damn non-interactive and crap at times.. | 21:02 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 21:02 |
| M4rtinK | Firefox :) | 21:02 |
| Sail0r | lol | 21:02 |
| chem|st | Stskeeps: you know there is only one replacement for ram... | 21:02 |
| Sail0r | more ram? | 21:03 |
| CoderCandy | more ram? | 21:03 |
| Stskeeps | chem|st: i run with swap disabled | 21:03 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 21:03 |
| Stskeeps | trashing is a fun issue | 21:03 |
| CoderCandy | I should disable swap | 21:03 |
| CoderCandy | I have 16 gigs of ram | 21:03 |
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| Sail0r | i have 24gb of ram :x | 21:03 |
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| chem|st | Stskeeps: you can crank your performance by putting everything not needed after a reboot into a ramdisk, like your firefox cache and stuff | 21:03 |
| CoderCandy | I ordered 32 gigs of ram, but canceled the order after I realized my motherboard only supported 16 :P | 21:03 |
| Sail0r | because it was cheaps a few months ago ^^ | 21:03 |
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| M4rtinK | yeah, really: | 21:04 |
| M4rtinK | 7764 m4rtink 20 0 5938872 4,009g 27896 S 12,5 52,1 124:38.21 firefox | 21:04 |
| chem|st | is that bit? | 21:06 |
| M4rtinK | BTW, a friend has been experimenting with bcache & XFS, he uses bcache on SSD as a cache for a mechanical disk and also has inodes for the fs on the mechanical disk on the SSD (yeah, XFS really can do that) | 21:07 |
| M4rtinK | and so far his experience with this has been rather good :) | 21:07 |
| M4rtinK | chem|st: about 4GB of RAM being used by Firefox | 21:08 |
| chem|st | yeah guessd so | 21:08 |
| chem|st | I have like 1.3GB used right now | 21:08 |
| chem|st | the caches are alot smaller but get written to disks by default | 21:09 |
| ShadowJK | emmc as cache for usd? get a better usd? :) | 21:09 |
| chem|st | :D | 21:10 |
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| chem|st | ShadowJK: the internal mamory of the N9 seems still faster than any uSD I have | 21:10 |
| ShadowJK | Swap disabled doesn't actually prevent pages getting dropped from memory, and then the swapin latency hits later anyways | 21:10 |
| ShadowJK | My current uSD in my N800 actually outperforms some early jmicron type SSDs :) | 21:12 |
| chem|st | I have 50% of my ram donated to the cause of tmpfs | 21:12 |
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| ShadowJK | It doesn't help latency that developers these days pretty much assume all storage has the performance characteristics of RAM | 21:13 |
| matoking | I was a bit bored so I decided to compile a Litecoin miner on Jolla | 21:14 |
| ShadowJK | And think they need to fsync() every bit | 21:14 |
| chem|st | matoking: and how many hashes? | 21:14 |
| matoking | According to one calculator I would earn about $0.41 every 30 days if I ran it 24/7 :P | 21:14 |
| matoking | I think it was about 1.74 kh/s per thread aka core | 21:14 |
| M4rtinK | well, VFS is being cached in RAM, not bullet-proof, but still... | 21:14 |
| matoking | But yeah, one of the nice things about Sailfish OS is that you can compile and run all kinds of applications even if it doesn't make any sense to do so :P | 21:15 |
| ShadowJK | M4rtinK; writes stall everything :P | 21:16 |
| M4rtinK | well, yeah | 21:16 |
| ShadowJK | Jolla's emmc isn't too bad | 21:17 |
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| chem|st | ShadowJK: does not matter with mtp in between... | 21:17 |
| ShadowJK | device spends about 25% of websurf waiting on I/O.. my android tablet spends about 80-90% waiting for I/O when browsing web | 21:18 |
| chem|st | ShadowJK: that is cause android needs to read the whole system and upload it to google while you browse the web... | 21:18 |
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| ShadowJK | Nah it's the browser disk cache writes, and browser history writes that stall it | 21:19 |
| ShadowJK | mtp? that usb thing for transfering things? never used it | 21:20 |
| ShadowJK | and only used mass storage mode on previous devices once.. | 21:20 |
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| Sail0r | I use rsync ^^ | 21:22 |
| CoderCandy | I know what will make my jolla more stable! I'll just write my own kernel! | 21:22 |
| CoderCandy | That oughta do it! | 21:22 |
| ShadowJK | rsync <3 | 21:22 |
| Sail0r | and mtp on fedora 20 works like a charm | 21:22 |
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| CoderCandy | But yeah, I hope it keeps its cool in the non updated state | 21:23 |
| szopin_sailing | did anyone manage to get wlan in Montreal mode? | 21:23 |
| CoderCandy | Speaking of updates | 21:23 |
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| CoderCandy | Is it safe to update to the 2.5 version? | 21:23 |
| szopin_sailing | lol, autocorrect, monitor | 21:23 |
| CoderCandy | Or should I stick to the 0.5 version until the new fix comes out? | 21:23 |
| ShadowJK | I periodically rsync over wifi, so if I need a file on PC I usually dig it out of the backup folder rather than rsync new copy or usb | 21:23 |
| ajaijjaj | Sail0r: mpt does not work for me on fedora 20. Or is there anything I need to install? | 21:24 |
| Sail0r | for me it works out of the box | 21:24 |
| Sail0r | just plugged in and worked | 21:24 |
| Sail0r | but for a teammate it does not work | 21:24 |
| Sail0r | very weird | 21:24 |
| Sail0r | ^^ | 21:24 |
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| Sail0r | did you run journalctl -f while plugging it in @ ajaijjaj | 21:25 |
| ajaijjaj | Sail0r: I can view the jolla in the list of devices, but whan I try to access it I get "Failed to get folder list: -1: Unspecified error". Will check journalctl | 21:26 |
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| Sail0r | it works with every jolla on my fedora :x | 21:30 |
| Sail0r | just tested another one | 21:30 |
| Sail0r | so it's not jolla specific | 21:30 |
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| ajaijjaj | Sail0r: looks so as there are no messages in journalctl when accessing jolla | 21:32 |
| Sail0r | oO | 21:33 |
| ajaijjaj | there is only | 21:33 |
| ajaijjaj | [W] USBConnection::openUSBDevice:137...e | 21:33 |
| ajaijjaj | [C] meegomtp1dot0::MTPTransporterUSB...e | 21:33 |
| ajaijjaj | and that's it | 21:33 |
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| Sail0r | http://nopaste.penguinfriends.org/view/109342/ | 21:36 |
| Sail0r | that's what my fedora says | 21:36 |
| chem|st | CoderCandy: update to 2.5 | 21:37 |
| Sail0r | and it immediatly popsup in filemanager | 21:37 |
| Sail0r | and i can browse copy and everything | 21:37 |
| ajaijjaj | ah, ok, I'll check Fedoras journal , not jollas | 21:38 |
| Sail0r | ah sorry | 21:38 |
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| Sail0r | Mar 05 22:34:41 jolla msyncd[997]: [C] meegomtp1dot0::MTPTransporterUSB::activate:76 - MTPTransporterUSB::activate that's the only thing my jolla says | 21:40 |
| M4rtinK | ajaijjaj: also you need to check the jollas journal as root | 21:42 |
| M4rtinK | ajaijjaj: or else you won't see many system level (and potentially sensitive) messages | 21:42 |
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| ajaijjaj | M4rtinK: yes, I checked as root | 21:45 |
| ajaijjaj | Sail0r: the beginning of Fedora's journal is pretty much the same, except in the end: | 21:45 |
| ajaijjaj | mtp-probe[2789]: bus: 2, device: 17 was not an MTP device | 21:45 |
| Sail0r | interesteing | 21:46 |
| Sail0r | the not an mtp device comes until i select the pc mode | 21:46 |
| M4rtinK | for the record I also have Fedora 20 | 21:46 |
| ajaijjaj | yup, the line 8, is the only difference, that "not" | 21:46 |
| M4rtinK | but haven't tried MTP | 21:46 |
| Sail0r | afterwards it's reinitialized and detected as mtp | 21:46 |
| M4rtinK | just exchanged keys and run everything over SCP over USB | 21:47 |
| M4rtinK | ultra convenient & I need to SHH to it very often anyway | 21:47 |
| M4rtinK | *SSH | 21:47 |
| Sail0r | i use rsync most of the time ^^ | 21:48 |
| grzywacz | Interesting. Sometimes I get the (delayed) auto lock screen *under* the last app that was running. So I leave the Gallery open, the phone locks itself after a while, I double-tap the screen and I'm back to the Gallery with the lock screen "under it". So I can, for example, peek at it, but I can still use the application until I swipe it away. | 21:48 |
| Sail0r | but sometimes it's nice to use mtp | 21:48 |
| Sail0r | and it's very fast | 21:48 |
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| pdanek1 | Did anyone test 128G MicroSD in Jolla? | 21:50 |
| pdanek1 | I'm about to buy it. | 21:50 |
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| ajaijjaj | M4rtinK: I use SCP as well | 21:54 |
| jrayhawk | pdanek1: The only hardware changes within the SDXC standard are for increased speed; addressing remains the same. | 21:54 |
| jrayhawk | Out to 2 terabytes. | 21:54 |
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| ajaijjaj | Sail0r: there are no more messages, jolla is mounted, but I can't browse. However, tracker-miner tries to do something and suggest me to open Shotwell | 21:56 |
| pdanek1 | jrayhawk: so whatever SDXC will work? | 21:57 |
| pdanek1 | = I can safely buy 128G? | 21:57 |
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| pp_ | just need to format as something the phone supports | 21:58 |
| jrayhawk | well, safely buying media that's hidden behind an FTL is always a risk. Shady Chinese manufacturers sell counterfit media that advertises itself at the logical level as being larger than it is. | 21:58 |
| pp_ | which isn't exfat :-9 | 21:58 |
| jrayhawk | But interface-wise, yeah, should be safe. | 21:58 |
| M4rtinK | jrayhawk: so still MBR ? :) | 21:59 |
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| M4rtinK | jrayhawk: ore maybe that's why it is capped to 2TB ? :) | 21:59 |
| M4rtinK | IIRC you need GPT for >2TB partitions | 21:59 |
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| pdanek1 | Because I need external drive with 100+ capacity | 22:00 |
| pdanek1 | I have none. | 22:00 |
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| pdanek1 | Leaving the company and need to store some data. :D (until now I used business laptop only) | 22:00 |
| pdanek1 | so 128G MicroSD is enough, I don't want to buy external USB hard-drive | 22:01 |
| pdanek1 | so Jolla will be my external HDD | 22:01 |
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| jake9xx | pdanek1: I've got a friend who carries a bootable 32Gb usb stick where his 'desktop' is. Always with him | 22:02 |
| M4rtinK | as long as yo don't need to connect it to machines that don't support SCP or MTP, why not :) | 22:02 |
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| pdanek1 | M4rtinK: why? exFAT should be fine on 128G MicroSD right? | 22:03 |
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| pdanek1 | and USB Mass Storage | 22:04 |
| pdanek1 | whatever Windows I connect it into | 22:04 |
| M4rtinK | well, there is no mass storage support at the moment | 22:04 |
| pdanek1 | what | 22:04 |
| M4rtinK | for the card | 22:04 |
| pdanek1 | I didn't know! | 22:04 |
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| pdanek1 | but N900 had it | 22:04 |
| pdanek1 | That's very sad. | 22:05 |
| M4rtinK | two main issues | 22:05 |
| M4rtinK | both because mass storage works on the block layer | 22:05 |
| M4rtinK | you need to unmount the filesystem to export it with mass-storage | 22:06 |
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| M4rtinK | and the second is that it forces what file system you can use (because that is above the block layer) | 22:06 |
| pdanek1 | I'm ok with that. | 22:06 |
| M4rtinK | so it basically forces you to have a big partition formatted with FAT32 that can be unmounted at any moment | 22:07 |
| pdanek1 | w8, FAT32? | 22:07 |
| M4rtinK | well, as there is basically zero support for extFAT on Linux... | 22:07 |
| jrayhawk | You could do exFAT or NTFS with FUSE, but there'd be a performance cost. | 22:08 |
| jrayhawk | *lots* of context switching. | 22:08 |
| M4rtinK | yeah, loop file :) | 22:08 |
| pdanek1 | alright | 22:08 |
| M4rtinK | the biggest issue is the lack of universally supported high level file transfer interface | 22:08 |
| M4rtinK | MTP is probably the closest | 22:09 |
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| M4rtinK | and BlackBerry 10 uses Samba over network | 22:09 |
| M4rtinK | other than that, nothing really that would work on Linux/Win/MacOS | 22:09 |
| jrayhawk | NFS works fine up until Windows 8.1. | 22:10 |
| pdanek1 | so actually | 22:11 |
| jrayhawk | http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/dn328991.aspx whoops, even 8.1 works fine | 22:11 |
| pdanek1 | all the data has to go to internal Jolla disk 1st and then to MicroSD card | 22:12 |
| pdanek1 | with whatever file transfer protocol I use | 22:12 |
| jrayhawk | If you use other networking technologies than USB, it's fairly arbitrary how what goes where, but dependent upon the amount of work you want to do preparing your phone for it. | 22:13 |
| pdanek1 | what about the speed of mass storage over usb 3.0 vs scp/rsync/mtp over usb 3.0? | 22:14 |
| pdanek1 | any radical performance difference? | 22:14 |
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| pdanek1 | or NFS mount... | 22:16 |
| pdanek1 | if not, I'm good to go for jolla microsd instead of external HDD | 22:17 |
| jrayhawk | I'm not seeing rsync support for serial devices, so I am suspecting rsync's speed over USB 3.0 would be zero. | 22:17 |
| pdanek1 | :D | 22:17 |
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| pdanek1 | what blocks me from constant removal of MicroSD from phone and using directly | 22:20 |
| pdanek1 | is that I have to remove that back cover, it always cracks so badly :D | 22:21 |
| chem|st | how do I actually get ssh key authentication working? | 22:24 |
| M4rtinK | chem|st: ssh-copy-id | 22:24 |
| chem|st | ? | 22:25 |
| jrayhawk | I'm not seeing any compression support on MTP, so, at best, you'd just be able to make better use of slave host pagecache on reads and only very marginal advantage of not having to do any indexing of allocatable sectors on writes. | 22:25 |
| jrayhawk | Which is not typically noticable until you get to 90% disk usage. | 22:26 |
| M4rtinK | chem|st: ssh-copy-id user@<jolla ip> | 22:26 |
| M4rtinK | chem|st: or dou you mean something else ? | 22:27 |
| M4rtinK | jrayhawk: on the other hand you get rid of the SSH compression overhead | 22:27 |
| M4rtinK | jrayhawk: not sure how big that is though | 22:27 |
| chem|st | M4rtinK: I have my keys in authorized-keys and have it active in the sshd_config | 22:27 |
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| M4rtinK | chem|st: then I guess it should work | 22:28 |
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| chem|st | so I now copied all available keys to my jolla, still asking for password | 22:29 |
| chem|st | how do I restart sshd? | 22:30 |
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| CoderCandy | I don't really get why the Jolla has NFC capabilities, but they are limited to TOH's... | 22:30 |
| chem|st | CoderCandy: not implemented yet | 22:30 |
| CoderCandy | Oh | 22:30 |
| chem|st | CoderCandy: you are having a BETA OS! | 22:31 |
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| CoderCandy | So we WILL be able to use the jolla as a normal NFC-device? | 22:31 |
| chem|st | CoderCandy: in case you didn't know that | 22:31 |
| CoderCandy | I heard stuff about the antenna being to small to actually reach anything | 22:31 |
| CoderCandy | chem|st: I'm not talking about sailfish in this case | 22:31 |
| CoderCandy | But the physical device itself | 22:31 |
| merlin1991 | chem|st: folder settings on .ssh | 22:31 |
| chem|st | merlin1991: ehrm drwxrwxr-x should do... | 22:32 |
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| chem|st | CoderCandy: you could mess with two TOH at once so you can put something else in range too | 22:33 |
| merlin1991 | chem|st: it has to be drwxr-xr-x | 22:33 |
| merlin1991 | also systemctl restart something.service | 22:34 |
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| CoderCandy | HEY MY JOLLA JUST REBOOTED WHIL.... oh right | 22:34 |
| CoderCandy | I'm doing a system upgrade | 22:34 |
| CoderCandy | please ignore that. | 22:34 |
| chem|st | merlin1991: thanks... the g-w did it... how stupid is that.. well security measures and stuff right | 22:35 |
| CoderCandy | Anyway, I'm sticking to 2.5 for now | 22:35 |
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| CoderCandy | Me a couple of minutes ago: "Meh, TOH that only make cosmetic changes are pointless!" | 22:49 |
| CoderCandy | Mue now: "OMG I HAVE TO GET THE BLACK COVER!" | 22:49 |
| CoderCandy | Me* | 22:49 |
| CoderCandy | Can someone tell me what happened? | 22:50 |
| raa70 | i think you went full retard, and man should never go full retard | 22:50 |
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| CoderCandy | But full retard is fun :( | 22:51 |
| keithzg | CoderCandy: It means Jolla's R&D into mind control is finally getting to the beta stage ;) | 22:51 |
| CoderCandy | keithzg: o.O | 22:51 |
| ottulonen | they're also using indirect paths to mind control | 22:52 |
| CoderCandy | That's even worse! | 22:52 |
| ottulonen | like, I showed the Angry Birds TOH demo to my gf, and she told me I better get one | 22:53 |
| raa70 | "screw the nsa, we read & write directly to brains" | 22:53 |
| CoderCandy | chmod 700 brain | 22:54 |
| slate | is the Makia-TOH coated with fabric? | 22:54 |
| slate | or just plastic | 22:54 |
| kehnoo | as owner of black TOH I can say that it improves the Jolla ownership experience by 250% | 22:55 |
| CoderCandy | kehnoo: I have a snow white cover, wanna trade? | 22:55 |
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| kehnoo | only drawbacks are that you can't tell which side is the screen if you're reaaaally drunk | 22:55 |
| CoderCandy | kehnoo: oh... Uhm, that MIGHT become a really big problem for me actually | 22:56 |
| * CoderCandy tends to get drunk... a lot. | 22:56 | |
| CoderCandy | University life WOO! | 22:56 |
| kehnoo | yeah but just have someone call you and you can tell by the green blinking led | 22:56 |
| CoderCandy | hehe | 22:56 |
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| kehnoo | you could try painting it black for easy diy? | 22:57 |
| CoderCandy | Then I won't get the exclusive ambiance! | 22:58 |
| chem|st | kehnoo: ROFL | 22:58 |
| kehnoo | just get the wallpaper from the website and use own ringtones, that's what I do :) | 22:58 |
| kehnoo | I didn't per se pay for my black TOH, I just have it :p | 22:59 |
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| chem|st | what is the 300MB sp in %h? | 23:01 |
| pdanek1 | A-data vs Kingston for MicroSD cards? | 23:01 |
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| pdanek1 | Sandisk is too expensive. | 23:01 |
| chem|st | pdanek1: size matters! | 23:01 |
| pdanek1 | chem|st: well, I finally decided for 64G, A-Data offers much cheaper 64g sdxc class 10 than kingston does, and sandisk is too expensive | 23:03 |
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| keithzg | At least where I live, I've been able to buy a Sandisk 64GB for $55, while a Kingston . . . also costs $55. | 23:03 |
| pdanek1 | hm | 23:03 |
| kehnoo | cheapest one you can return the easiest | 23:03 |
| pdanek1 | what about Samsung cards? | 23:04 |
| pdanek1 | are they trustworthy? | 23:04 |
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| pdanek1 | jrayhawk: purchasing already, either Sandisk Ultra, 30 mbps or Sandisk Extreme 45 mbps, do you think it's worth to go for faster one? Will I even be able to reach such speed with serial usb copy? | 23:21 |
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| chem|st | pdanek1: I have samsung all over | 23:27 |
| jrayhawk | oh, it does support usb network emulation. didn't even know. | 23:30 |
| jrayhawk | hurf. | 23:30 |
| pdanek1 | chem|st: adata, any experience? | 23:30 |
| jrayhawk | anyway, USB speeds won't be the limiting factor, no. | 23:31 |
| chem|st | pdanek1: I have like 5 samsung and had 2 transcend | 23:31 |
| jrayhawk | and whether or not the speed is worth it entirely depends on what your usage profile is. | 23:32 |
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| pdanek1 | Actually. | 23:35 |
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| pdanek1 | ADATA absolutely wins by price. | 23:35 |
| pdanek1 | http://adata.com/index.php?action=product_feature&cid=7&piid=178 | 23:35 |
| pdanek1 | I mean, that one: | 23:36 |
| pdanek1 | http://adata.com/index.php?action=product_feature&cid=7&piid=203 | 23:36 |
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| pdanek1 | ok ordered, thanks to all :D | 23:39 |
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| pdanek1 | Actually together.jolla.com has become a nice knowledge base | 23:43 |
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