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| dunp | http://ask.slashdot.org/story/14/01/26/1950237/ask-slashdot-life-after-n900 | 01:07 |
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| * SpeedEvil moderated quite a few times in that discussion. | 01:49 | |
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| tango_ | does jolla support WPA-EAP on wireless? it doesn't want to connect to my dept wifi | 07:01 |
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| pawky|3 | I believe it does, at least for me :-) | 07:03 |
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| pawky|3 | tango_: at least standard WPA works.. | 07:05 |
| tango_ | pawky|3: standard wpa works for me too | 07:05 |
| tango_ | ah https://together.jolla.com/question/3775/wpa-enterprise-eg-eduroam-support/ | 07:06 |
| pawky|3 | tango_: yeah, i realized you meant the enterprise part... | 07:06 |
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| tango_ | apparently there's a workaround | 07:07 |
| AL13N | you can set the connman profile, so that it connect automatically | 07:09 |
| tango_ | AL13N: that's what the workaround suggests | 07:09 |
| AL13N | yes | 07:10 |
| tango_ | I don't mind doing it, but it surely isn't user-friendly 8-) | 07:10 |
| AL13N | that's one of the things that'll be fixed in the future, i guess | 07:10 |
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| tango_ | otoh I get to learn about the connman configuration, which is good | 07:10 |
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| tango_ | cool, it works | 07:16 |
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| AL13N | tango_: can you document the exact configuration? | 07:22 |
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| Quu | it takes two to tango_ | 07:34 |
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| AL13N | :) | 08:01 |
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| pawky|3 | will one ever be able to acutally put sailfish on the N9? | 10:23 |
| Pnuu | isn't it already | 10:23 |
| pawky|3 | Pnuu: Not that I know of... firmware download URL? | 10:24 |
| AL13N | no idea, though i've heard that some people did something like this | 10:25 |
| Pnuu | atleast there's several youtube videos, and people here mentioning that they're running sailfishos on their N9 | 10:25 |
| pawky|3 | AL13N: I have heard they've done it on the N950... but not the N9 | 10:25 |
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| ballock | isn't n950 like n9 but with hw keyboard? | 10:26 |
| Pnuu | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5ii7k-OYM8 | 10:26 |
| pawky|3 | ballock: yes, kind of :-) | 10:26 |
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| ballock | so you mean kind of it isn't? | 10:26 |
| pawky|3 | ballock: I am no expert, but it does differ a bit, I believe not everything was implemented in the N950 that exists in the N9... | 10:27 |
| stephg_ | they differed slightly | 10:28 |
| pawky|3 | Pnuu: Ok, that video looks promising, now all I need is the firmware... | 10:28 |
| pawky|3 | I wonder if this means, you could actually put the N9 meego firmware on the Jolla? | 10:28 |
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| pawky|3 | Or... maybe not the firmware... but some version of Meego :-) | 10:29 |
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| ballock | I'm not sure I would be interested in installing Debian Potato anymore. | 10:31 |
| pawky|3 | ballock: because? | 10:32 |
| ballock | It's ancient. | 10:32 |
| ballock | Ok, you could say 'vintage' | 10:32 |
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| Yaniel | 'retro' | 10:32 |
| pawky|3 | ballock: cannot really say you will have more fancy options in any modern version of phone OS'es... | 10:33 |
| ballock | but I don't think it's that easy, there was no android hw compatibility layer in N9 | 10:33 |
| pawky|3 | ballock: you can call, surf, MMS bluetooth, NFC with it.. | 10:33 |
| ballock | they had total control over the hardware | 10:33 |
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| ballock | btw, can I use NFC as Visa Paypass thing? | 10:35 |
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| ballock | I mean, rip off stuff of the actual card, and use a piece of software to make phone-Visa? | 10:35 |
| ballock | I believe I saw that as a service from some local ISP | 10:36 |
| pawky|3 | ballock: I believe that would be quite hard to accomplish.. | 10:36 |
| ballock | So it's not just 'give me the card number' query? | 10:36 |
| pawky|3 | ballock: I believe you will need the computation logic behind it all a well.. | 10:37 |
| ballock | I saw some youtube videos as guys equipped with card readers were ripping the card numbers with it | 10:37 |
| ballock | by just 'passing by' ordinary people | 10:38 |
| pawky|3 | ballock: well, this you could probably do, yes.. | 10:38 |
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| ballock | aand, I don't believe visa paypass to be any real security or whatsoever | 10:38 |
| ballock | rip it off, run an app 'provide visa' and hand it over | 10:39 |
| pawky|3 | ballock: I will assume, there will be some kind of communication going on between the units to verify things. but just getting the card number might be doable | 10:40 |
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| artemma | QuickLauncher update is in harbour QA for four days by now, sigh | 11:25 |
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| artemma | Apparently I am always on the late extreme of the "estimated hours for approval: 48" interval the harbour dashboard tells about | 11:26 |
| ballock | really? I thought I saw it in Jolla storre already | 11:26 |
| stephg_ | ^that | 11:26 |
| artemma | ballock: I am talking about the update | 11:26 |
| stephg_ | ah | 11:26 |
| artemma | it's a pity as my time for jolla dev usually comes at bursts (not a dayjob), so it helps me a lot if reboew time was actually predictable | 11:27 |
| artemma | though.. it is actually quite predictable at something like 3.5-4.5 days on average, I just need to stop expecting that Harbour's "estimated hours for approval" somehow reflect reality | 11:27 |
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| AL13N | artemma: perhaps if you get things right from the first time, it is like reality? :-) | 12:00 |
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| minimec | Hi I have problems connecting my jolla phone to a WPA Personal(WPA) network. Encryption is set to TKIP/AES (auto). Could you give me a hint? | 12:14 |
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| minimec | (WPA2)... | 12:14 |
| tachikoma | i think the state was: not working in the UI. But working in principle with command line comands | 12:14 |
| Yaniel | what sort of problems? | 12:15 |
| Yaniel | no personal wpa2 works | 12:15 |
| Yaniel | eap does not | 12:15 |
| tachikoma | oh, i misread, sorry | 12:15 |
| Yaniel | minimec: did you typo your password? | 12:15 |
| minimec | Yaniel: Hi. Well. It finds the network, but after choosing it, it would not give me the possibility to enter the password. Just 'Connection failed'... | 12:15 |
| Yaniel | I had to reboot after typoing my wlan password | 12:16 |
| Yaniel | else it would not ask for a password again | 12:16 |
| tango_ | AL13N: I did exactly what the suggested workaround said | 12:16 |
| minimec | Yaniel: Well I can't enter the password... That is my problem. | 12:16 |
| Yaniel | try rebooting the device | 12:18 |
| minimec | Yaniel: Ok. Doing that now... | 12:18 |
| ballock | minimec: what's the name of your network? isnt't it something standard like 'dlink' or 'linksys' | 12:18 |
| Yaniel | and next question is: what os version? | 12:18 |
| ballock | Jolla might have remembered this network as an open access around on the street | 12:18 |
| minimec | ballock: something like abc-1234 | 12:18 |
| ballock | ok, not default | 12:19 |
| tango_ | minimec: I just had the thing. you can set up the connection manually in developer mode | 12:20 |
| minimec | Yaniel: THX. Had to reboot to get the possibility to enter the password. I am connected now. | 12:21 |
| tango_ | minimec: I'll give you the link I followed | 12:21 |
| tango_ | wut | 12:21 |
| tango_ | oh | 12:21 |
| tango_ | sorry | 12:21 |
| tango_ | I thought you ha eap | 12:21 |
| minimec | ballock: It's ok now. A simple reboot did it. Thx anyways | 12:21 |
| minimec | tango_: I will check that possibility, even though it's working now. Thx. | 12:22 |
| minimec | That's the power of the chat community. Problem solved in 2 minutes. GREAT! | 12:23 |
| tango_ | minimec: https://together.jolla.com/question/315/wpa2-pskaesothers-wifi-support-needed-workaround/ | 12:24 |
| Yaniel | minimec: the problem there is that if you are unlucky it might take as well 2 weeks | 12:25 |
| Yaniel | but with good timing and a bit of luck.. ^^ | 12:25 |
| minimec | tango_: That might be useful, for the 'alternate' eduroam network @my university. THX. | 12:26 |
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| dTA | hm oh, the qwertyoh dev doesn't have software side sorted yet. anyone know of a known implementation for the i2c communication in the first place? haven't seen official documentation either | 12:27 |
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| tachikoma | yess :) | 12:29 |
| tachikoma | just connected to the WPA enterprise network here :) | 12:29 |
| dunp | dTA, how about kernel http://lwn.net/Articles/353023/ | 12:29 |
| tango_ | minimec: yep, seems to be necessary for eduroam and any EAP network | 12:30 |
| tango_ | (I needed it for my department too) | 12:30 |
| dunp | http://wiki.analog.com/resources/tools-software/linux-drivers/input-keyboard/adp5588 | 12:30 |
| dTA | hm, might be very usable indeed | 12:31 |
| Nicd- | hey, anyone noticed one of their apps having a different colored name label in the app grid? | 12:32 |
| Nicd- | all my app names are white except for one android app which has a blue name | 12:32 |
| Stskeeps | Nicd-: screenshot? | 12:33 |
| Nicd- | will do | 12:33 |
| Nicd- | hmm | 12:34 |
| Nicd- | I clicked it and it didn't open but the text became white | 12:34 |
| Nicd- | so maybe it was left in a pressed state | 12:34 |
| artemma | AL13N: I have 4 apps in the jolla app store and something like 7-10 submissions including upgrade. I believe my data has a bit of relevancy and I learn a little about the submission process over time ;) | 12:50 |
| artemma | Still want it faster and more predictable certainly :) | 12:50 |
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| sejo | got the jolla! | 13:07 |
| Nicd- | happy sailing! | 13:07 |
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| sejo | thanks, I'll first need to see if I can get everything working the way I want it, then I'll switch sim :P | 13:08 |
| sejo | doing the system upgrade now | 13:09 |
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| sejo | now to get android store onto it :p | 13:31 |
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| joonahoi | sejo: i've migrated off the android apps already completely, start by checking out what you can get as native software | 13:50 |
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| mtd | is there a daemon one can kill or dbus command one can issue to reset/restart (sorry, wolly term) the baseband networking? My jolla won't see any networks, yet I'm sure it should... | 13:50 |
| mtd | (and as a learning exercise I'm trying to avoid rebooting) | 13:50 |
| Nicd- | mtd: does going to airplane mode and back help? | 13:51 |
| ballock | mtd: had the same issue | 13:51 |
| mtd | Nicd-: no, tried that :( | 13:51 |
| mornfall | So are we going to see a Sailfish tablet? :) I'd probably buy one, considering how I could stop abusing my laptop with a graphical web browser. ;-) | 13:51 |
| ballock | airplane didn't work too | 13:51 |
| mtd | ballock: sounds like the same symptoms, yeah | 13:51 |
| ballock | had to reboot, but would be glad to hear some outcome | 13:52 |
| ballock | might be blob-related | 13:52 |
| sejo | joonahoi: well I'm looking in the jolla store for following ones: twitter, spotify (offline use) xbmc, remote, task (with exchange sync using zimbra) | 13:52 |
| mornfall | sounds like airplane is not airplane enough | 13:52 |
| mtd | ballock: blob? | 13:52 |
| sejo | in the store there isn't that much yet | 13:52 |
| joonahoi | yeah | 13:53 |
| mtd | mornfall: heh | 13:53 |
| mornfall | mtd: baseband firmware | 13:53 |
| joonahoi | but you can get the rest from openrepos | 13:53 |
| * mtd notes that lipstick is not happy with the radio: lipstick[988]: Radio set to unsupported mode | 13:53 | |
| joonahoi | for ex: twitter, spotify | 13:53 |
| mtd | mornfall: ah, thx | 13:53 |
| sejo | openrepos? | 13:53 |
| * sejo googles | 13:53 | |
| joonahoi | what do you mean by remote? | 13:53 |
| joonahoi | sejo: http://www.jollatides.com/2014/01/08/tutorial-how-to-download-beta-apps-from-openrepos/ | 13:53 |
| rcg | hi | 13:53 |
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| rcg | my jolla seems to turn it self off | 13:54 |
| mornfall | mtd: also called a blob because that's what you get from the HW vendor :-) | 13:54 |
| rcg | is that a know issue? | 13:54 |
| Nicd- | rcg: sudden shutdown? were you using it at the time? | 13:54 |
| joonahoi | rcg: yes. there's a lot of speculation around it | 13:54 |
| mornfall | not unlike wifi baseband chips in laptops | 13:54 |
| joonahoi | but seems like it's got something to do with the mobile data and the link tower in use | 13:54 |
| mtd | mornfall: yup | 13:54 |
| rcg | Nicd-, one time i was listening music | 13:54 |
| joonahoi | rcg: it's a bug allright, https://together.jolla.com/question/7144/jolla-randomly-shuts-down/ | 13:55 |
| rcg | the other times i was doing nothing | 13:55 |
| Nicd- | I have the random shutdown bug too | 13:55 |
| Nicd- | hasn't happened for a few days now though | 13:55 |
| rcg | joonahoi, thanks for the link | 13:55 |
| rcg | Nicd-, it suddenly started today | 13:55 |
| ballock | phew, hopefully I never got random shutdowns | 13:55 |
| ballock | seems the blob is pretty darned | 13:55 |
| rcg | i am using the jolla since december and never had that issue | 13:55 |
| joonahoi | i have had a few, but only while travelling through one location | 13:55 |
| joonahoi | and it was related to mobile data | 13:55 |
| rcg | started today out of the blue | 13:56 |
| rcg | joonahoi, hmm ic | 13:56 |
| rcg | i might check that | 13:56 |
| joonahoi | i was listening to music from spotify | 13:56 |
| rcg | *err will :) | 13:56 |
| joonahoi | had three shutdowns | 13:56 |
| mornfall | joonahoi: must be a bug in baseband's embedded spyware | 13:56 |
| sejo | ooo thanks joonahoi | 13:56 |
| rcg | i also didn't do any update nor tinkering lately | 13:57 |
| ballock | regarding the baseband, I often got missed calls and no outbound calling functionality (lost range), while the screen happily reported half range on 2G or even 3G | 13:57 |
| rcg | just out of nowhere this issue popped up | 13:57 |
| joonahoi | sejo: np, just remember that there's no QA on the software on openrepos | 13:57 |
| mornfall | btw., is there a software switch that can cut off power to the GSM module? | 13:57 |
| joonahoi | so someone might upload something potentially harmful there | 13:57 |
| mornfall | that'd be really helpful | 13:57 |
| joonahoi | it's compareable to downloading software from the wild wild internet | 13:57 |
| sejo | joonahoi: ok thanks for the heads up | 13:57 |
| mornfall | joonahoi: millions of people do that every day, What Could POSSIBLY Go Wrong? | 13:58 |
| sejo | as soon as I have the basic apps I'll be switching ;P | 13:58 |
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| joonahoi | there hasn't been any issues on any of the packages on openrepo | 13:58 |
| ballock | joonahoi: I dont' think that's comparable. You'd need to be able to write some Linux stuff in the first place. | 13:58 |
| mornfall | not that we know of, no *wink* | 13:58 |
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| joonahoi | mornfall: well, basically anyone could upload a rpm which had rm -rf / in the pre install script | 13:58 |
| mornfall | (a little paranoia is good for your health) | 13:58 |
| joonahoi | name it something shiny | 13:59 |
| joonahoi | and sit back, have a beer and watch the havoc | 13:59 |
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| Stskeeps | joonahoi: recently people had problems with bluez package in openrepos.. | 13:59 |
| Stskeeps | blew up their bluetooth naturally | 13:59 |
| joonahoi | ok, i missed that | 13:59 |
| joonahoi | yeah | 13:59 |
| mornfall | Isn't there a bluez stack on the phone already? | 14:00 |
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| Stskeeps | yes, but if you add non-QA'ed repos, you get their updates too | 14:00 |
| mtd | ballock: are your missed called reported as such in th eUI, or do you just get voicemail /or people telling you they called? | 14:00 |
| ballock | the latter | 14:01 |
| sejo | Stskeeps: btw I've appreciated your works since my n900 | 14:01 |
| sejo | Stskeeps: thx! | 14:01 |
| mornfall | mtd: I don't think I have voicemail set up and nobody calls me anyway. ;-) | 14:01 |
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| ballock | It must have been bad enough that my carrier resigned from trying to deliver me a couple of SMS messages | 14:02 |
| mtd | mornfall: heh -- I'm in a similar situation :) | 14:02 |
| mornfall | mtd: I have a new SIM with a new number, and the old one is in an ancient nokia featurephone which is turned off. | 14:02 |
| mtd | ballock: ah | 14:02 |
| Nicd- | joonahoi: it can happen by accident too :) https://github.com/MrMEEE/bumblebee-Old-and-abbandoned/commit/a047be85247755cdbe0acce6f1dafc8beb84f2ac | 14:02 |
| mornfall | ballock: that usually takes a week of trying... | 14:02 |
| ballock | I was also puzzled. | 14:03 |
| mornfall | Nicd-: that's a pretty cool typo | 14:03 |
| joonahoi | Nicd-: yeah, that was hilarious | 14:03 |
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| ballock | It worked much better on Nokia phones | 14:03 |
| mornfall | Nicd-: someone made the same mistake yesterday in #haskell (not in a terminal, luckily for them :) | 14:04 |
| ballock | I wouldn't mind swapping the baseband chip in this for something more Nokish | 14:04 |
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| mornfall | ballock: might not be a baseband problem, the main chip needs to cooperate quite closely | 14:04 |
| mornfall | ballock: i.e. the drivers in the main kernel are probably not up to speed yet, happens with every new radio thing out there | 14:05 |
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| mornfall | wlan.ko: author: Qualcomm Atheros, Inc. | 14:07 |
| mornfall | license: Proprietary | 14:07 |
| mornfall | that's a little meh | 14:07 |
| Veneno_j | hi | 14:07 |
| Stskeeps | mornfall: supposedly the open version works too | 14:07 |
| Stskeeps | mornfall: qcom 4.1.2 in this particular combo had a closed source wlan, so we are using that for a supported config | 14:07 |
| mornfall | Stskeeps: that'd be nice... more interestingly, I can't see a GSM driver | 14:07 |
| Stskeeps | but later it was ossed | 14:08 |
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| Stskeeps | mornfall: ofono + RIL | 14:08 |
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| Veneno_j | hey Stskeeps :) | 14:09 |
| Stskeeps | moo Veneno_j, when do you arrive friday? | 14:10 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: late in the evening :) | 14:11 |
| Stskeeps | how late? | 14:12 |
| Tofe | Venemo: oh, maybe we'll meet, too | 14:12 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: 8:15 pm :) | 14:13 |
| Venemo | at charleroi | 14:13 |
| sejo | dang pebble not yet there :P | 14:13 |
| mtd | ballock, Nicd-: i wonder if this is relevant: "connmand[824]: Skipping disconnect of /ril_0/context1, network is connecting." | 14:13 |
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| Nicd- | I wouldn't know, sorry mtd | 14:13 |
| Stskeeps | Venemo: oki, see you at the beer event then, hopefully ;) | 14:14 |
| mtd | Nicd-: np,thx | 14:14 |
| Venemo | Stskeeps: well, it's gonna be like 9pm or later when I get to Brussels itself, so not sure if I'll show up at the beer event | 14:15 |
| mtd | ballock: aha, grep-ing for ril seems useful: "connmand[824]: Failed to change property: /ril_0 org.ofono.Modem.Powered: org.ofono.Error.Failed Operation failed" | 14:16 |
| Stskeeps | hehe, we'll see, try to make it a priority | 14:16 |
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| Venemo | Stskeeps: ok, I'll try! :) | 14:17 |
| ballock | Stskeeps: does it mean that we could get rid of the baseband blob and replace it with an open-source driver from kernel.org? | 14:18 |
| ballock | or the blob is still there, but uploaded by open-source kernel module? | 14:19 |
| mornfall | Stskeeps: RIL falls under -libhybris-sbj in your diagram? | 14:19 |
| sejo | Stskeeps: ask for SeJo at the beerevent, I'll buy you a beer | 14:20 |
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| Stskeeps | ballock: it goes roughly: sailfishos stack -> ofono -> socket connection to android RIL daemon -> which has loaded the QMI RIL library which speaks to the modem through hocus pocus kernel interfaces | 14:20 |
| Stskeeps | qmi ril library being the very closed part here | 14:20 |
| ballock | ok, thanks | 14:21 |
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| Stskeeps | mornfall: nah for once something else | 14:21 |
| Stskeeps | https://github.com/nemomobile-packages/ofono - ubuntu touch uses similar technology | 14:22 |
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| mornfall | Stskeeps: well, rild is in droid-system-sbj (the rpm, anyway) | 14:24 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 14:25 |
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| Stskeeps | rild is open source, the ril plugin that it loads, isn't | 14:25 |
| mornfall | (the whole droid- thing looks a little kludgy :-) | 14:25 |
| Stskeeps | uh-huh | 14:25 |
| mtd | ballock: FYI, 'systemctl restart ofono.service ; journalctl -e' just showed some log entries claiming that my SIM card was not in :( | 14:26 |
| ballock | without showing you a GUI that SIM card's out? | 14:26 |
| mtd | ballock: I didn't notice anything in the UI | 14:27 |
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| ballock | a number of people complained about SIM being lost, but that was mostly reported in UI | 14:27 |
| ballock | and I really believed I'm not experiencing that... | 14:27 |
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| mtd | ballock: yeah, I didn't think that was my problem, either. | 14:28 |
| ballock | ok, I'll need to try the same when I experience some real outages | 14:28 |
| ballock | the no baseband issue happened to me only once | 14:29 |
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| mtd | ballock: but looking at the logs, none of connmand, ofono, or stated thought that the radio was on / sim registered | 14:29 |
| ballock | so it's pretty rare | 14:29 |
| mtd | ballock: I could have missed something in the UI | 14:29 |
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| mtd | ballock: actually I don't think I did miss something - the operator name displayed on the lock screen didn't get my attention, and I would have probably noticed that. | 14:30 |
| mornfall | Stskeeps: so libril-qc-qmi-1.so is the main-CPU side of the blob? | 14:30 |
| Stskeeps | yes | 14:31 |
| mornfall | RIL is C++? | 14:31 |
| ballock | sounds like somebody is attempting a disassmbly? | 14:32 |
| mornfall | pff | 14:32 |
| Stskeeps | mornfall: can be everything but pretty certain it's not python | 14:32 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 14:32 |
| ballock | oh, sorry, I guess you're past that already | 14:33 |
| ballock | I heard there are some disassembly tools that can attempt a C or C++ code reconstruction | 14:33 |
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| ballock | but then I'm the nb for that kind of things | 14:34 |
| dschoepe | There's the boomerang decompiler, but in my experience it's easier to just read the disassembler output | 14:34 |
| Nicd- | yay, going to put my first app into harbour :) | 14:34 |
| mornfall | there's ARM callgrind | 14:34 |
| * mtd wonders what what vmtouch process with the huge library list is | 14:34 | |
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| mtd | s/what what/what that/ | 14:35 |
| Stskeeps | mtd: smoke and mirrors | 14:35 |
| mornfall | but of course the timing would be completely off, so not the best way to go about it if you suspect wrongdoing :-) | 14:35 |
| Stskeeps | mtd: and i think i owe you a beer for being the first person to ask | 14:35 |
| mtd | Stskeeps: heh | 14:35 |
| mtd | Stskeeps: I'm sure I'll be buying you a beer if we ever meet...enjoing the phone a lot. | 14:36 |
| Stskeeps | mtd: long story short it makes sure that basic libraries are never attempted to be flushed from memory when memory starts being so full it starts ejecting pages of code that it factually should keep running | 14:36 |
| sejo | anyone running the dvorak keyboard on sailfish? | 14:36 |
| mtd | Stskeeps: ah, interesting | 14:36 |
| Stskeeps | mtd: i'm in no way happy about it but it reduced the shit hits the fan scenario a fair bit | 14:36 |
| mtd | Stskeeps: I understand the choice of proces name, I think. | 14:37 |
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| mornfall | sejo: does it make it less painful to type on a touchscreen? | 14:37 |
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| Stskeeps | yes, compositor needs to keep running | 14:37 |
| mtd | Stskeeps: :) | 14:37 |
| sejo | mornfall: for me yes as I know there the keys are there :P, now I have to search for the letters ;P | 14:37 |
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| mornfall | sejo: I think it's a bother you still need to use letters... internet would do much better if it was more emoji-friendly. | 14:38 |
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| ballock | mornfall: yeah, just draw 'transparency' with your finger, and google-image will find a match ;) | 14:39 |
| mornfall | the qmi blob is full of shit... you'd thought ril itself would provide most of that stuff | 14:39 |
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| mornfall | somebody should nick the code from the vendor whoever that is so we could make fun of them | 14:40 |
| mornfall | must pay engineers by the line | 14:40 |
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| Stskeeps | tbh i'm fairly happy to have a known working telephony stack | 14:42 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 14:42 |
| mornfall | rild would be a *great* target for apparmor/selinux policy | 14:42 |
| Stskeeps | that apps/OS doesn't use directly | 14:42 |
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| mornfall | well, realistically, the particular QMI blob is probably not much of a problem in itself, the thing I could possibly worry about if I were paranoid was that it's probably full of RCE bugs on the baseband-facing side | 14:46 |
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| mornfall | so malicious baseband can splice anything it wants to into your running rild, and from there into your kernel | 14:46 |
| Stskeeps | there's nothing stopping anybody from wiring up a different modem over bluetooth or something like that | 14:47 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 14:47 |
| mornfall | N900 :D | 14:47 |
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| mornfall | makes you wonder if there are illicit GSM modules out there | 14:47 |
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| mornfall | of course that could land you in trouble with your carrier | 14:48 |
| mornfall | but it's pretty nice that rild is non-root | 14:48 |
| ballock | Stskeeps: the idea is cool, how do I do it? | 14:49 |
| Stskeeps | well, ofono documentation, perhaps a bit of pulseaudio a2dp etc | 14:49 |
| mornfall | (assuming the kernel is mostly free of local root exploits) | 14:50 |
| ballock | ok, so audio through bluetooth, not the whole telephony stack | 14:51 |
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| tbr | you could talk to a modem over BT-SPP | 14:51 |
| tbr | if you'd want the audio on your jolla, you'd need to route it back over A2DP | 14:52 |
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| Stskeeps | ballock: well, ofono does bluetooth modems too | 14:52 |
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| Stskeeps | with whatever protocol, maybe AT | 14:52 |
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| tachikoma | mornfall: you know the calypso baseband modules? | 14:52 |
| mornfall | what I'm less happy with is that lipstick is kinda all-powerful :) | 14:53 |
| tachikoma | the stuff osmocombb supports | 14:53 |
| Venemo | :) | 14:53 |
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| tachikoma | I have two cheap motorola phones laying here on my desk - waiting for the day that i have too much time ;) | 14:55 |
| tachikoma | fun fact - since the "let me answer that for you" talk on the ccc they price of these phones nearly doubled :) | 14:56 |
| ballock | Stskeeps: so if ofono can handle my bluetooth modem, so that would be the whole of communication, right? why do I need a2dp | 14:56 |
| Stskeeps | ballock: audio to the other side? | 14:56 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 14:56 |
| Stskeeps | may be HFP i'm talking about | 14:56 |
| Stskeeps | anyway, this is just hacking suggestions | 14:56 |
| ggabriel | tachikoma: which ccc? | 14:56 |
| tachikoma | petitionen ... da schreib ich leiber was an die wand vom bahnhofsklo | 14:56 |
| tachikoma | ups, wrong windows, sorry | 14:56 |
| tachikoma | ggabriel: i think 29c3 | 14:57 |
| ggabriel | ATZ0 | 14:57 |
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| ggabriel | oops, wc | 14:57 |
| ggabriel | ;) | 14:57 |
| ggabriel | tachikoma: i think i went to 26 or 27 and an interesting mention of the modem on those old motorolas was made too ;-) | 14:57 |
| mornfall | which version of Adreno is in Jolla again? | 14:57 |
| tachikoma | ggabriel: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a1iZV2nl28A | 14:57 |
| Stskeeps | mornfall: 305 | 14:58 |
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| mornfall | (lipstick being all-powerful doesn't really matter much when the GL linked into everything and their dog is a big questionmark) | 14:58 |
| tachikoma | basically they show how to disbale agsm network with just a handful of phones (wherer the baseband chip is running custom software) | 14:58 |
| ballock | Stskeeps: so ofono would handle the call handling (without voice) but that leaves the audio on the modem side? | 14:58 |
| tachikoma | you need to solder something inside the phone as well to make this work, but don;t ask me details, I was just watching for fun | 14:59 |
| Stskeeps | ballock: yeah, that's what i'm implying | 14:59 |
| Stskeeps | mornfall: you could probably get rid of that at major loss of performance and camera ability/media playback with mesa llvmpipe | 14:59 |
| mornfall | Stskeeps: that's indeed a major loss of performance :-) | 14:59 |
| ballock | this was running through my head already, still I did not get myself to doing it | 14:59 |
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| Stskeeps | anyway, a lot of crazy experiments are possible on the device | 15:00 |
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| Stskeeps | :P | 15:00 |
| mornfall | Stskeeps: although considering it's qHD and the CPU isn't exactly wimpy, you could possibly squeeze 30fps out of it... battery will suffer of course | 15:00 |
| mornfall | not that it's something I'd want to try | 15:01 |
| Stskeeps | mornfall: indeed, i did this on n4 | 15:02 |
| mornfall | phone's a phone, life's too short for trying to make it into a secure thing | 15:03 |
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| ggabriel | tachikoma: sounds like the follow up to the one i've been to. sadly, i'm meant to be working now so i can't watch :( | 15:03 |
| mornfall | I'll stick with a laptop with all radios gutted for my shady stuff ;-) | 15:03 |
| TheBootroo_ | Will qt5.2 be part of the update of this month ? | 15:03 |
| mornfall | TheBootroo_: what makes you think there'll be an update this month? :P | 15:04 |
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| ggabriel | mornfall: public announcements? | 15:04 |
| tachikoma | ggabriel: what i really like is the fact that the whole osmocombb stuff is already packaged ready to be used for opensuse ;) | 15:04 |
| TheBootroo_ | momfall: they promised it "very soon (TM)" | 15:04 |
| mornfall | TheBootroo_: very soon is very vague :) | 15:04 |
| * mornfall gives his calendar an incredulous look | 15:04 | |
| TheBootroo_ | momfall: january is nearly over | 15:04 |
| mornfall | exactly | 15:05 |
| Eztran | It's tagged [jan14] on together. | 15:05 |
| mornfall | TheBootroo_: also, use tab | 15:05 |
| HarhaanJohtaja | they said january.But what year? | 15:05 |
| mornfall | TheBootroo_: and get a font with proper kerning, whatever you have is busted | 15:05 |
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| TheBootroo_ | mornfall: nope, only my IRC client is kinda PITA with tab | 15:05 |
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| TheBootroo_ | have to type lot of chars to get the right nick | 15:06 |
| mornfall | TheBootroo_: what is it, ofc? | 15:06 |
| TheBootroo_ | CIRC | 15:06 |
| TheBootroo_ | nice client for the rest, but tab behavior kinda annoying | 15:06 |
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| mornfall | interesting | 15:06 |
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| Pnuu | TheBootroo_: irssi! | 15:07 |
| TheBootroo_ | Pnuu: i wont change, don't start proposals | 15:07 |
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| TheBootroo_ | ;-) | 15:07 |
| mornfall | TheBootroo_: you could at least change the font :P | 15:08 |
| Pnuu | TheBootroo_: not a proposal, but a statement ;-D | 15:08 |
| Pnuu | font? | 15:08 |
| TheBootroo_ | i know irssi, Konversation, Xchat, and the usual folks but i don't like them | 15:08 |
| mornfall | Pnuu: if rn looks like m, the font is busted | 15:08 |
| mornfall | or the renderer, pick your poison | 15:08 |
| TheBootroo_ | mornfall: the issue is more on my eyes size than on the font itself | 15:08 |
| Pnuu | oh, missed that | 15:09 |
| TheBootroo_ | anyway, i find Mom Fall cool too XD | 15:09 |
| mornfall | couldn't happen with -misc-fixed-medium-r-semicondensed--13-*-*-*-c-*-iso10646-1 | 15:09 |
| mornfall | TheBootroo_: :D | 15:09 |
| TheBootroo_ | omfg | 15:09 |
| TheBootroo_ | i would go Ubuntu Light or Ubuntu Mono if i could change the font | 15:10 |
| TheBootroo_ | more legible | 15:10 |
| mornfall | and while we are at it, together sucks in w3m-mode | 15:10 |
| mornfall | when is the sailfish tablet coming out again? :-) | 15:11 |
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| TheBootroo_ | oh and proper duplex caldav support in calendar ! | 15:12 |
| TheBootroo_ | my phone is primarly a personal assistant, so ATM without my GCal synced on it it's pretty useless alone, still need to open a computer many times a day | 15:13 |
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| mornfall | hmm, a calendar | 15:13 |
| mornfall | I have upgraded from gcal to paper taped on wall. | 15:14 |
| mornfall | but it's fairly unportable | 15:14 |
| mornfall | and doesn't give out reminders | 15:14 |
| TheBootroo_ | mornfall: i'm rarely at home and i can't always bring a 100x80cm paper with me | 15:14 |
| mornfall | owncloud runs on caldav doesn't it? | 15:14 |
| TheBootroo_ | and yeah, reminders.... | 15:14 |
| sejo | is the full sailfish theme somewhere described? | 15:14 |
| sejo | what icons are there (covericons fex) | 15:15 |
| mornfall | sejo: where did you find a dvorak layout btw? | 15:17 |
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| sejo | mornfall: I haven't installed one yet on my jolla, I do have one on my htc one | 15:20 |
| sejo | and all my computers | 15:20 |
| mornfall | I see. | 15:20 |
| sejo | swiftkey for android | 15:20 |
| mornfall | I don't have any android devices. | 15:20 |
| sejo | I'm going to play around with the jolla tonight | 15:20 |
| sejo | maybe I can figure out how to create one | 15:20 |
| mornfall | I type dvorak on real computers though. | 15:20 |
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| sejo | since I switched 6 years ago I haven't looked back to another keyboard layout | 15:21 |
| tachikoma | i wonder how high the dvorak user rate is among the jolla customers and how that compares to the normal world ... | 15:21 |
| zutto | learning dvorak after using qwerty for so long is painful :< | 15:22 |
| mornfall | sejo: pah, 6 years, I'm approaching 12 | 15:22 |
| sharpneli | zutto: Which is why I'm not going to bother. Also very very rarely typing speed is an issue anywhere. | 15:22 |
| zutto | mornfall: swiftkey hasnt been around 12 years tho | 15:22 |
| mornfall | zutto: neither has android (at least not in a commercial form) | 15:23 |
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| zutto | well technically it has | 15:23 |
| zutto | since linux | 15:23 |
| ballock | darn, seems I'm past 20 years of qwerty keyboard usage | 15:23 |
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| mornfall | zutto: that's like saying sailfish was created in 93 | 15:23 |
| ballock | I didn't think I'm *that* old | 15:23 |
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| entil | I'd like something like swiftkey too. there were some circular keyboards that worked the same way | 15:24 |
| mornfall | ballock: unless you switched from non-qwerty that probably makes you fairly young :P | 15:24 |
| Venemo | guys there're only 4 days left of this month. it's high time to see the new update :) | 15:24 |
| zutto | mornfall: well sailfish is just softwares dumped ontop of linux, so technically you could say that | 15:24 |
| zutto | :P | 15:24 |
| zutto | same thing with android | 15:24 |
| ballock | mornfall: phew, thanks, that's a relief | 15:25 |
| mornfall | zutto: and linux is just softwares dumped ontop of a C compiler, you could say it was invented in the 70s | 15:25 |
| zutto | basicly, yeah | 15:25 |
| mornfall | actually... :D stone age anyone? | 15:25 |
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| mornfall | and you know, it's all made of atoms anyway | 15:26 |
| entil | I did ask about this once and no one said anything, but is it possible to change the keyboard app with jolla? or what would be the procedure to start doing that? | 15:26 |
| Stskeeps | entil: google around for jolla keyboard layouts at least | 15:26 |
| mornfall | entil: I'd start by checking the hangul/emoji packages on openrepos | 15:26 |
| Eztran | Changing the 'app': not so easy. Changing layouts is. | 15:26 |
| entil | a layout is slightly different from the app | 15:27 |
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| entil | because changing the app would mean something like swiftkey or a circular keyboard could work | 15:27 |
| mornfall | Venemo: I haven't seen this much restlessness (in others or myself) for a new release of a piece of software for a long while :) | 15:27 |
| mornfall | entil: what I really want is a chorded OH keyboard anyway | 15:28 |
| mornfall | slideout qwerty might be a close second | 15:28 |
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| entil | OH keyboards sure, but you got what I'm after here? and the answer is it's not really possible? | 15:28 |
| Eztran | Hmm. Wonder if maliit could do a chorded keyboard? Never really looked up its limitations. | 15:28 |
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| mornfall | entil: did you even look? | 15:28 |
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| Venemo | mornfall: I have. it was when we were waiting for Harmattan PR1.1 for the N950 ;) | 15:29 |
| mornfall | Venemo: I skipped N9(50) | 15:29 |
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| entil | oh crap, this article http://linuxg.net/how-to-install-the-emoji-keyboard-on-jollas-sailfish-os/ is newer than the last time I cared about this | 15:29 |
| entil | rapid development, let's see if there's any value in that | 15:29 |
| Venemo | mornfall: well, it was the same when people were waiting for PR1.x on the N900 ;) | 15:29 |
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| mornfall | entil: the hangul one is probably more interesting to you btw. | 15:30 |
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| tachikoma | so, any updates on the horizon and will my jolla store work again after that? ;) | 15:30 |
| mornfall | Venemo: I'm a N900 latecomer, actually. I got it after I lost my 3310 in Brazil. | 15:30 |
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| mornfall | Venemo: I think it was around the time N9 came out. | 15:30 |
| entil | https://github.com/peremen/jolla-input-ko this? mornfall? | 15:30 |
| mornfall | entil: presumably (I really don't like github atm :-) | 15:31 |
| mornfall | lemme make a clone | 15:31 |
| Venemo | mornfall: ah, then you missed out on the good times :) | 15:31 |
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| entil | ok.. I can't install anything right now, so I'll have to contemplate that later | 15:31 |
| mornfall | yeah, that | 15:31 |
| entil | but if it's rather a new app than a layout, we're on to something | 15:32 |
| mornfall | Venemo: my wife uses the N900 now :-) I'd probably get her a Jolla but it's kinda expensive right now and she doesn't complain. :-) | 15:32 |
| mornfall | Has better use for money I guess. | 15:33 |
| mornfall | Anyway, #sailfishos is dozing off, anyone know if I can point OBS at a git repo to get RPMs? | 15:33 |
| mornfall | My SDK is busted and I wanted to upload a fix to Harbour. | 15:33 |
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| Venemo | ok, so everyone who's interested, here's a demo of our IRC app for Jolla: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJs3599Nj20 | 15:35 |
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| * ballock wonders how difficult it would be to sailhack his wife's Samsung Galaxy Young | 15:35 | |
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| ballock | somebody rooted it, at least that's what google says | 15:36 |
| ballock | so just need a disaster recovery scheme | 15:37 |
| ballock | and a way to upload a rom | 15:37 |
| faenil | Venemo, do I see it right, you didn't join #nemomobile | 15:39 |
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| * faenil looks for a whip | 15:42 | |
| Venemo | sorry faenil but it's not (yet) a Nemo app | 15:42 |
| mornfall | a whip? | 15:42 |
| faenil | mornfall, yes, I've got a whip for naughty boys like Venemo who don't promote nemomobile | 15:43 |
| Venemo | lol | 15:43 |
| mornfall | faenil: you are naughty yourself | 15:43 |
| * faenil grins | 15:44 | |
| vatte | is there an easy way to backup address book from jolla? | 15:45 |
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| vatte | I can't seem to find that info, and I _need_ to factory reset :D | 15:46 |
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| mornfall | vatte: I'd start by rsyncing $HOME to a computer | 15:46 |
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| kontio | vatte: https://together.jolla.com/question/384/export-vcf-from-people/#post-id-758 | 15:47 |
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| vatte | kontio: ok, great! | 15:48 |
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| Venemo_j | Stskeeps: btw, how long is the beer event? | 16:09 |
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| Stskeeps | Venemo_j: Friday, 31 January 2014 from 18:00(-ish) onwards, but feel free to join the party at any time of the evening. We will be there until the bar closes (well after midnight). | 16:17 |
| Stskeeps | https://fosdem.org/2014/practical/beerevent/ | 16:17 |
| Venemo_j | Stskeeps: ah, ok. I stay at the place of a relative and don't want to upset him by showing up too late | 16:19 |
| Stskeeps | nod | 16:19 |
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| kehnoo | solution: show up early in the morning :p | 16:19 |
| ggabriel | solution: invite the relative to the beer event | 16:20 |
| Pnuu | relativistic beer event | 16:20 |
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| mornfall | Venemo_j: You are Hungarian btw.? | 16:25 |
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| Venemo_j | mornfall: yep | 16:26 |
| Venemo_j | :) | 16:26 |
| Venemo_j | mornfall: why? | 16:27 |
| mornfall | I was watching your communi video. :-) | 16:27 |
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| Venemo_j | ggabriel: the relative isn't a developer so the event is not of interest to him | 16:28 |
| Venemo_j | mornfall: is my accent so bad? | 16:28 |
| ggabriel | Venemo_j: but but beer!! | 16:28 |
| ggabriel | Venemo_j: i was just joking anyway ofc you have to be considerate | 16:28 |
| mornfall | Venemo_j: not bad, but recognizably Hungarian | 16:28 |
| Venemo_j | mornfall: ah, you are the first to recognize it | 16:29 |
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| mornfall | Venemo_j: might be it's only recognizable because I lived on Hungarian border for 15 years, give or take... | 16:29 |
| Venemo_j | mornfall: maybe I'm out of practice | 16:29 |
| mornfall | in Komárno, specifically | 16:29 |
| kehnoo | watched that video too, super impressive :) | 16:30 |
| kehnoo | was the laptop some sort of asus zenbook? :p | 16:30 |
| Venemo_j | mornfall: I've never been there | 16:30 |
| Venemo_j | kehnoo: yes, UX31A | 16:30 |
| Venemo_j | kehnoo: thanks for the nice words :) | 16:30 |
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| Venemo_j | mornfall: and where do you live now? | 16:31 |
| mornfall | I'm kinda surprised it's not on jollausers yet. | 16:31 |
| mornfall | Venemo_j: Břeclav, CZ | 16:32 |
| Venemo_j | nah, I just made it less than an hour ago | 16:32 |
| mornfall | I know. :D | 16:32 |
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| mornfall | I can be seen complaining about the lipstick monolith in the vid. | 16:33 |
| kehnoo | yeah, I've got one as well, it has some silly ssd cache which I just used to install Linux for dual boot goodness :) | 16:34 |
| Stskeeps | mornfall: forever locked away in the evil empire.. | 16:34 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 16:34 |
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| nander | Awesome, a new transatlantic album | 16:39 |
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| entil | :O http://www.radiantrecords.com/category/2-transatlantic.aspx | 17:12 |
| entil | out tomorrow | 17:12 |
| entil | nander: thanks, I would've completely missed that otherwise | 17:12 |
| nander | oops, that means it has leaked | 17:13 |
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| nander | entil, I aquired it otherwise ;) | 17:14 |
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| Nicd- | remember to buy if you like ;) | 17:14 |
| nander | if I like it enough to spend the budget I have for music on it ;) | 17:14 |
| nander | I already preordered an album for this year | 17:15 |
| nander | Stream of passions 4th studio album ;) | 17:15 |
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| nander | I found out that transatlantic has a new album through hakens facebook ;) | 17:15 |
| Nicd- | well I can't judge, I copy music from the library quite often... | 17:16 |
| Nicd- | it' legal though | 17:16 |
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| nander | This wasn't legal | 17:16 |
| Venemo_j | so, where's this month's sailfish update? | 17:16 |
| nander | I aquire most of my music from the network that does *not* exist on my campus | 17:16 |
| nander | Venemo_j there was no update confirmed this month | 17:17 |
| ggabriel | Venemo_j: arriving latest this Friday | 17:17 |
| ggabriel | yes it was :P | 17:17 |
| ggabriel | there's a twitter about it | 17:17 |
| nander | Everyone thought it'd be in january, but.. | 17:17 |
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| Venemo_j | nander: not true | 17:17 |
| nander | I thought it was only confirmed to be monthly | 17:17 |
| nander | Not every month | 17:17 |
| ggabriel | there was a tiny leak and everything | 17:17 |
| Venemo_j | ggabriel: link please | 17:17 |
| ggabriel | nander: they said there would be one on January | 17:17 |
| entil | wait wat stream of passion.. wasn't that a.a.lucassen's project originally? | 17:17 |
| ggabriel | Venemo_j: somebody posted a link yesterday, mentioned in tmo, original is in finnish as it was done in a dna store | 17:18 |
| nander | Jup | 17:18 |
| ggabriel | sorry can't search now | 17:18 |
| nander | Entil, it continued after arjen left | 17:18 |
| entil | yeah, seems like there was a spinoff or something | 17:18 |
| Venemo_j | they said there'd me one every month. I don't see why you need additional confirmation for january | 17:18 |
| nander | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0nzRCJnumNY&list=PLjoyJiXc-d6A1JGqvOwXbGYCmw9k2f9zt | 17:18 |
| nander | It was intended this way | 17:18 |
| ggabriel | my point is that they said specifically jan '14 in some twitter post | 17:18 |
| nander | Arjen wanted to kickstart Marcela Bovios carreer | 17:18 |
| ggabriel | anyway | 17:18 |
| ggabriel | i won't die if there isn't one :) | 17:19 |
| nander | Lol | 17:19 |
| nander | That's fun | 17:19 |
| Venemo_j | I will | 17:19 |
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| entil | nander: I'll get on youtube later | 17:19 |
| ggabriel | actually, i'll die regardless, eventually | 17:19 |
| nander | ggabriel, you'll turn immortal if jolla doesn't release it this month? | 17:19 |
| nander | ;) | 17:19 |
| ggabriel | nander: way ahead of you mate | 17:19 |
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| entil | I'm off anyway, thanks for the heads-up on the transatlantic album, and maybe I'll look into stream of passion's newer stuff | 17:21 |
| nander | entil - Stream of Passion ditched their label and are now an independent band ;) | 17:21 |
| entil | yeah, I read on wikipedia | 17:21 |
| entil | unfortunately I got to go now, bye-> | 17:21 |
| nander | bye ;) | 17:21 |
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| nander | awesome, a nights in white satin cover on the new transatlantic album ;) | 17:31 |
| dafox | hi guys. I seem to be having a small problem with my camera; since this morning it doesn't show the picture any more, just a black screen. | 17:31 |
| dafox | I can still take a picture and see it in the gallery, so the hardware is still working | 17:32 |
| dafox | I've tried rebooting the phone, but didn't help | 17:32 |
| dafox | any ideas? | 17:32 |
| nander | Did you put paint on it? | 17:32 |
| dafox | if so, then I wouldn't be able to see it in the gallery either ;) | 17:33 |
| cb400f | this black screen doesn't have icons for flash etc. either? | 17:34 |
| dafox | no, those are there, and so is the 'take picture' button, just everything that the camera sees is black | 17:34 |
| mornfall | hmm, the SSL handling in the browser is grossly inadequate | 17:34 |
| dafox | Switching between front/rear camera does not help either | 17:35 |
| nander | I use a different browser | 17:35 |
| nander | I think it was called webcat | 17:35 |
| Pnuu | mornfall: both in the jolla version and webcat :-/ | 17:35 |
| mornfall | if it encounters an invalid certificate, it gives me no info at all to figure out what's wrong... | 17:35 |
| nander | seems to work quite decently | 17:35 |
| dafox | Also the camera application often gets unresponse (I get the blue popup) | 17:35 |
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| mornfall | most likely, it's missing Terena's CA in the bundle... but I can't know, it doesn't tell me anything about the cert it doesn't like | 17:36 |
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| Pnuu | mornfall: fails for every https I've tried | 17:37 |
| Pnuu | both of the browsers | 17:37 |
| mornfall | webcat gives SSL handshake failed | 17:38 |
| mornfall | builtin works if I take it on blind faith | 17:38 |
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| Nokius | if i remember right some one post on together how to add cer to Browser | 17:45 |
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| Nokius | https://together.jolla.com/question/835/browser-personal-certificates-import/ | 17:47 |
| Nokius | here | 17:47 |
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| Stskeeps | http://www.engadget.com/2014/01/16/lg-optimus-f3q-leak/ | 18:45 |
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| dafox | Hi again. I had to disconnect for a bit, did anyone reply to my camera-app-shows-only-black-screen problem while I was gone? Or does anyone have an idea why the camera might have suddenly stopped working? | 18:52 |
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| AL13N_lappy | i was certain there was a regulatory domain post on together, but i can't find it | 19:24 |
| AL13N_lappy | anyone help me out? | 19:24 |
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| clau | I think my Store just went berserk: it keeps telling me there's an update for Quick Launcher, and it fails to update it | 20:21 |
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| Quu | that happens | 20:21 |
| clau | pkcon get-updates shows no such thing, so it must be Store, I guess | 20:21 |
| clau | is it related to the bug that offers 1.0.2.5 again and again? | 20:22 |
| Raim | clau: do you also have the repo from OpenRepos/Warehouse enabled? | 20:26 |
| clau | yes | 20:26 |
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| clau | I had some similar issues because of it, but only for apps that were present in both Store and Warehouse | 20:26 |
| clau | currently I can't find Quick Launcher in Warehouse | 20:27 |
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| clau | I'll try to identify the repo it was using and disable it | 20:27 |
| Raim | hm, right, it's not available in OpenRepos, my bad | 20:28 |
| clau | I had it installed initially from openrepos though | 20:28 |
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| Abby30 | I give you some pictures. I hope you like! http://bit.do/my_videos69 | 21:10 |
| Quu | eh | 21:10 |
| Quu | fucking spambots | 21:10 |
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| Quu | do not open that pornvideo url. | 21:10 |
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| Acce | There she goes, our lovely lady | 21:11 |
| Quu | and its ref-link lol | 21:11 |
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| Acce | one more function and I can finally submit this update | 21:15 |
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| vanadis | is there a way to access the gps data by ssh? | 21:45 |
| vanadis | can't find my jolla ;_; | 21:46 |
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| narchie | anyone else feel severely gimped by non-sailfsh devices? | 21:49 |
| narchie | bought an ipad mini this summer | 21:50 |
| narchie | great device | 21:50 |
| narchie | but when i got jolla the ux feels like something from the 1600s | 21:50 |
| narchie | don't use it too much anymore ;_; | 21:51 |
| narchie | other mobile devices are ruined for me | 21:51 |
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| narchie | ;_; | 21:51 |
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| mornfall | narchie: well, sailfish did kinda ruin N900 for me | 22:00 |
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| mornfall | only whenever I flip jolla to landscape, I reflexively try to slide out the keyboard | 22:00 |
| mornfall | and then cry a little and misspell everything on the onscreen kbd | 22:01 |
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| * SpeedEvil sighs. | 22:06 | |
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| FIQ | I had to use a galaxy gio at some point because my N900 decided to break | 22:08 |
| FIQ | it had a very sucky touch screen | 22:09 |
| FIQ | and no hw kbd | 22:09 |
| FIQ | the horror... | 22:09 |
| * FIQ has yet to find a vkbd he likes | 22:09 | |
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| keithzg | FIQ: The N9 vkbd is the only one that I've ever enjoyed using. Everything else is a slog (although some more recent Android devices like the N4 and N5 have gotten less terrible). | 22:23 |
| keithzg | But of course my fingers still long for the N900's keys ;) | 22:23 |
| tehdely | i miss swype | 22:24 |
| tehdely | i really hope they port it to jolla, but i'm not keeping my fingers crossed... | 22:24 |
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| keithzg | Yeah the clout and (at the time) market strength of Nokia, plus their existing relationship (at least, I vaguely remember Swype being available for Symbian) brought it build-into the N9. Certainly Swype hasn't really bothered with non-Android OSes since then. | 22:27 |
| AL13N_lappy | Stskeeps: did you know the regulatory.bin file has a bad sign? | 22:28 |
| AL13N_lappy | (crda) | 22:29 |
| keithzg | But I dunno, I'm accurate enough on the N9 I never find myself using it. And also I can reach the full screen easily enough with one hand. The addition of Swype-style usage to the default Android keyboard was good and I've used *that*, but nonetheless never felt the need on my N9. | 22:29 |
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| tehdely | keithzg: wasn't strong enough to get a working release for Belle FP2 | 22:29 |
| tehdely | swype is utterly broken on my 808pv and will never be fixed :/ | 22:29 |
| keithzg | tehdely: Well sure, but by *that* point Swype would be quite justified in knowing that a relationship with Nokia would no longer get them anywhere, since the OS side was now Microsoft (and they aren't terribly amenable to core components of their mobile OS being modded). | 22:30 |
| jake9xx | tehdely: :( 808pv was/is iconic device | 22:31 |
| tehdely | jake9xx: i bought one only a few months ago. it's so abandoned and a lot of stuff half works | 22:31 |
| tehdely | but i love it | 22:31 |
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| tehdely | plus, i wanted to say i owned the last symbian handset ever made ;) | 22:31 |
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| tehdely | keithzg: i find it interesting how alien dalvik was originally slated for release with the n9 | 22:32 |
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| tehdely | and was shelved at the last moment | 22:32 |
| tehdely | presumably due to nokia's new microsoft partnership | 22:32 |
| tehdely | i wonder what other features were left out of the n9 right at release time due to the New State of Affairs | 22:32 |
| tehdely | as it was, the N9 was nokia's flagship in a few markets, but i'm just trying to imagine what it would have been like if it had launcheda s their _true_ flagship | 22:33 |
| tehdely | with all the bells and whistles | 22:33 |
| jake9xx | guess eelop did not want to see that happen | 22:34 |
| jake9xx | even with zero marketing n9 was sold out | 22:34 |
| keithzg | Well, there were at least a few things that made it in just barely and might well have been overridden if Nokia management was more hands-on, like Felipec's swipe-down-to-close. | 22:34 |
| tehdely | heh, didn't realize that was on the chopping block | 22:35 |
| tehdely | that seems so key to the interface! | 22:35 |
| keithzg | http://felipec.wordpress.com/2011/08/14/n9-swipe-undocumented-feature-activate-sane-behavior/ | 22:35 |
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| keithzg | Apparently he coded that himself after being fed up by nobody taking his arguments seriously ;) | 22:35 |
| tehdely | reminds me of the other undocumented features | 22:36 |
| tehdely | such as traffic routing in maps | 22:36 |
| tehdely | that you could enable just by uncommenting a bunch of stuff in the qml | 22:36 |
| tehdely | really in a lot of ways my jolla feels like a step _back_ from what shipped with the n9, but it has a future, and the n9 had none | 22:36 |
| tehdely | i hope we get a real HERE Drive for jolla, but i'm not counting on it | 22:36 |
| tehdely | i'm just imagining my n9 with an android runtime, and a full office suite | 22:37 |
| special | what we have now is only the beginning. | 22:37 |
| tehdely | the good news, special | 22:37 |
| tehdely | is that i believe you 110% | 22:37 |
| tehdely | :) | 22:37 |
| special | it's especially amazing when looking back at what we had, say, 8 months ago | 22:37 |
| tehdely | i have to hand it to google, btw. they have inadvertently created the equivalent of the PC clone market | 22:38 |
| special | certainly doesn't feel like we've slowed down at all.. | 22:38 |
| tehdely | which is what made room for desktop linux | 22:38 |
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| tehdely | just like it's making room for firefoxOS/sailfish/etc. | 22:38 |
| keithzg | Yeah the N9 features are kindof a mix, some things that folks snuck in under the radar and other things that were intended officially and never got quite finished thanks to the change in direction. Jolla doesn't have that backing behind it, but has that heart and head that made the truly unique things about the N9/Harmattan :) | 22:38 |
| tehdely | would you say the existence of a common specification for android, and libhybris, probably chopped your development time in half | 22:38 |
| tehdely | in terms of bringing a phone to market? | 22:38 |
| * keithzg is really looking forwards to his Jolla, even if it'll be sadly wifi-only. | 22:39 | |
| special | not my area. libhybris is amazing as hardware adaptation goes, though, having seen for example the n9 adaptation of nemo | 22:39 |
| tehdely | and by common specification i'm refering to the HAL | 22:39 |
| tehdely | keithzg: wifi-only? | 22:39 |
| keithzg | tehdely: que my normal sad rant about how almost nobody supports pentaband UMTS anymore :P | 22:40 |
| tehdely | keithzg: did anyone oterh than Nokia ever support pentaband UMTS? | 22:40 |
| mornfall | keithzg: where are you? | 22:40 |
| tehdely | thing is jolla doesn't even have the AT&T bands | 22:40 |
| tehdely | i'm surprised anyone even ships a radio without support for at least one NAM UMTS band | 22:40 |
| tehdely | perhaps one just needs to flip a bit in the baseband and they will be magically activated | 22:40 |
| tehdely | ~*~ i can hope ~*~ | 22:40 |
| keithzg | tehdely: Google does, ie. N4, N5 and N7. Most others though only support Band IV on certain models, few pentaband devices. | 22:41 |
| tehdely | anyhow i've gotten used to using jolla on GSM here | 22:41 |
| keithzg | mornfall: I am in Soviet Canuckistan ;) | 22:41 |
| tehdely | i keep it tethered to an LTE MiFi in my backpack for data | 22:41 |
| tehdely | only problem si the wifi connection goes out a lot, and i haven't had time to debug | 22:41 |
| mornfall | I don't think I know what that means. :-) | 22:42 |
| tehdely | also every now and then i get into this awful "Problem with Connection" loop | 22:42 |
| tehdely | where some service keeps INSISTING on trying to grab a data connection and just pegs the shit out of the phone | 22:42 |
| keithzg | mornfall: heh, I live in Canada. | 22:42 |
| tehdely | i can't even navigate into settings to try to fix it | 22:42 |
| tehdely | because i'm just being constantly assaulted with "Problem with Connection" | 22:42 |
| tehdely | and end up rebooting the phone | 22:42 |
| tehdely | but that only happens once every two or three days or so ;) | 22:42 |
| tehdely | mornfall: means i have a mobile access point in my backpack that sits on AT&T's LTE network | 22:43 |
| tehdely | and i tether my jolla to it over wifi | 22:43 |
| mornfall | keithzg: so you only get 2G on Jolla itself? | 22:43 |
| tehdely | yes | 22:43 |
| keithzg | tehdely: Yeah, I might have to do something similar to that, just carrying around a wifi hotspot device of some kind. I have two SIMs and one is data-only, anyways. | 22:43 |
| tehdely | (i can answer for both of us) | 22:43 |
| keithzg | Yup. | 22:43 |
| tehdely | keithzg: i had one anyway, for work | 22:43 |
| mornfall | Hm. | 22:43 |
| tehdely | so it's no sweat off my back to use it w/ the jolla | 22:43 |
| tehdely | i mean, it's a clunky arrangement | 22:43 |
| tehdely | and requires some setup/etc. but it does work, more or less | 22:44 |
| mornfall | And when Jolla gets 4G that won't help because it's still in the wrong bands hm? | 22:44 |
| tehdely | correct. | 22:44 |
| mornfall | That sucks. | 22:44 |
| keithzg | Have the bands actually been announced yet? | 22:44 |
| tehdely | someone asked | 22:45 |
| tehdely | and got the info | 22:45 |
| tehdely | i forget where it's posted | 22:45 |
| tehdely | it's around :) | 22:45 |
| mornfall | t.m.o probably | 22:45 |
| mornfall | also someone took the phone apart and looked at part numbers | 22:45 |
| tehdely | anyhow i still wonder about the actual parts | 22:45 |
| tehdely | whether the physical radio chipset actually supports more bands than the phone itself supports | 22:45 |
| tehdely | and the additional ones simply aren't enabled in firmware | 22:45 |
| tehdely | i could see an upstart phone manufacturer doing that who didn't have time to pursue certification in the US ;) | 22:45 |
| mornfall | tehdely: that probably depends on antenna geometry | 22:45 |
| keithzg | I mean, won't matter for me anyways since my carrier had to drop out of the 700mHz auction here in Canada thanks to the steep entrance bids, which was their only hope of LTE coverage really. | 22:46 |
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| keithzg | tehdely: That certainly happens quite a lot, I remember some Android phones out there that one could make work on AWS just by flashing different radio firmware. | 22:46 |
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| mornfall | keithzg: you could try to look for a US/Canada android phone with the same radio | 22:48 |
| tehdely | well first one must find out what radio is inside | 22:48 |
| keithzg | ^this | 22:49 |
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| mornfall | Location: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=92243 | 22:49 |
| tehdely | actually, someone from Jolla just got back to me w/ instructions for enabling US 3/4G | 22:50 |
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| tehdely | i can't believ ethis | 22:50 |
| tehdely | it is so simple | 22:50 |
| mornfall | The main RF amplifier it's an ACPM-7251 manufactured by "Avago Technologies". | 22:50 |
| mornfall | Teoricaly, it supports GSM (850/900), EDGE (1800/1900), UMTS (850/900/2100) and LTE (850) | 22:50 |
| tehdely | press left right left right up down up down start select | 22:50 |
| tehdely | :P | 22:50 |
| mornfall | tehdely: ? | 22:50 |
| tehdely | NES reference ;) | 22:51 |
| keithzg | heh Konami code | 22:51 |
| mornfall | yeah, ok, I get that bit | 22:51 |
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| tehdely | mornfall: well that is promising! | 22:52 |
| tehdely | hmm, no 1900 though | 22:52 |
| tehdely | i'm trying to remember what band AT&T UMTS uses | 22:52 |
| mornfall | also, JollaHQ already confirmed LTE bands to be bands 3 (1800 MHz), 7 (2600 MHz), 20 (800 MHz). | 22:52 |
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| keithzg | Hmmm. | 22:54 |
| keithzg | So the one RF amplifier definitely doesn't support 1700, but there are at least two, and that second one appears to be doing at least some of those LTE frequencies. | 22:54 |
| mornfall | and the ACPM seems to be not used for LTE anyway | 22:54 |
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| tehdely | keithzg: well it doesn't support 1900 for UMTS either | 22:55 |
| tehdely | so i'm still out of luck on AT&T | 22:55 |
| tehdely | AT&T 3G is 850/1900 IIRC | 22:55 |
| mornfall | the whole band allocation thing is a huge mess | 22:56 |
| tehdely | oh yeah it's a disaster | 22:56 |
| tehdely | each subsequent standard has actually multiplied the number of bands and band combinations in use | 22:56 |
| tehdely | even as the world has converged on more or less one air interface | 22:57 |
| keithzg | tehdely: Is that actually a pair like UMTS IV is (which requres both 1700 AND 2100 to function), or are those separate? In the latter case, couldn't you just use 850mHz and live with lower thoroughput? | 22:57 |
| tehdely | it's become less and less possible to create an actual "world" phone | 22:57 |
| tehdely | which is a sweet irony which I imagine phone manufacturers don't mind one bit :) | 22:57 |
| tehdely | well, at least until tunable antennas become practical | 22:57 |
| keithzg | Yeahhhh, everyone finally decided on LTE, so they had to offset that by using a dozen different frequencies. | 22:57 |
| keithzg | Software Defined Radio will save us! ;) | 22:57 |
| tehdely | good question re: whether it's a pair | 22:58 |
| keithzg | I actually suspect it isn't (certainly not to the degree that Band IV is), but carriers have certainly done annoying things like specify voice on one frequency and data on another, making you screwed if you don't have both. | 23:00 |
| keithzg | tehdely: Looks like it'd be fine just as long as you actually *do* have 850MHz coverage in your area. http://www.howardforums.com/showthread.php/1732720-If-one-had-a-phone-that-only-had-3G-850MHz-for-the-Americas-will-it-roam-on-AT-amp-T!?s=6df44af6ee4c3dd7da5cf79a90e0d565&p=14540658#post14540658 Although I assume by now that rollout is fairly complete. | 23:03 |
| tehdely | in any case, sure didn't pick up any 3G here in SF | 23:05 |
| tehdely | i imagine there'd be a firmware component as well | 23:05 |
| tehdely | or perhaps even a pin that needs to be wired, and isn't | 23:06 |
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