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| GentSir | Evening Gentlemen | 00:53 |
|---|---|---|
| chriadam | gmorning | 00:53 |
| GentSir | chriadam, you in Australia? | 00:56 |
| chriadam | yes | 00:56 |
| GentSir | I'll admit, I'm a little intimidated here, nobody of my age and limited experience | 00:58 |
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| chriadam | GentSir: we all start somewhere. the best thing to do to get experience, is to start experimenting :-) | 01:10 |
| chriadam | grab the SDK and start writing an application | 01:10 |
| chriadam | if you have any troubles / questions, just ask | 01:10 |
| GentSir | chriadam, I already have and I'm working on a port of something I designed as a desktop application | 01:11 |
| chriadam | great! | 01:11 |
| GentSir | I've just never touched Qt/QML before, though I have a little experience with C | 01:11 |
| lpotter | the qt examples are a great way to get acquainted with qml | 01:23 |
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| lpotter | and its much better than c | 01:26 |
| GentSir | lpotter, I've been looking at the Sailfish Silica page, reading the code in the examples provided with the SDK carefully, and looking at tutorials on QML. I also installed the regular version of Qt Creator so I can try stuff without having to start virtualbox or worry about bugs in the SDK | 01:44 |
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| GentSir | The examples I've seen for the Sailfish SDK are pretty much entirely just UI code, does anybody have any examples or applications with a fair amount of separated application logic as well? | 02:05 |
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| lpotter | youcan look at the qt examples for that. and there are tutorials for that in the qt docs | 02:12 |
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| GentSir | lpotter, I've been on qt-project.org . Is it good, or are there better resources I should be looking at that are more focused on mobile development? | 02:14 |
| lpotter | qt-project would be the place | 02:15 |
| GentSir | Thank you. This is my first foray into Qt/QML. My mobile experience is exclusively with Android | 02:17 |
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| chriadam | GentSir: take a look at http://quickgit.kde.org/?p=scratch/tolszak/qmlminer.git for an example of a minesweeper app written in QML | 02:30 |
| chriadam | I don't know how "exemplary" the code is, I haven't looked at it myself | 02:30 |
| chriadam | but it'll give you an idea | 02:30 |
| GentSir | chriadam, thanks for the example mate | 02:32 |
| GentSir | It would build for me but displayed as an empty screen with nothing, I'm trying this now: git://anongit.kde.org/kigo.git | 02:44 |
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| situ | Morning | 02:51 |
| GentSir | situ, evening | 02:53 |
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| niqt | morning | 08:13 |
| GentSir | niqt, morning mate | 08:25 |
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| Morpog_PC | GentSir, maybe you wanna take this course? https://t.co/PeOllZqM4f | 08:58 |
| Morpog_PC | meh, sounds too novice | 08:58 |
| GentSir | Morpog_PC, I'm not a *complete* novice | 08:59 |
| Morpog_PC | thats why I corrected me ;) | 09:00 |
| GentSir | I know the basics of programming and design, I'm just young and have never touched Qt/QML before | 09:00 |
| GentSir | I've been studying the examples provided with the SDK, especially the silica design stuff. Going through it item-by-item both on the emulator and in the code to see what everything does | 09:01 |
| GentSir | Also had my browser open to one page or another on qt-project.org since I installed the SDK | 09:01 |
| GentSir | I'm making progress, I've never never done much mobile or GUI stuff | 09:01 |
| GentSir | *just never | 09:01 |
| Morpog_PC | Maybe get some open source harmattan project and try to port? Yiu could stidy application code in it | 09:02 |
| Morpog_PC | You could study* | 09:02 |
| Morpog_PC | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=84333 | 09:03 |
| GentSir | Morpog_PC, I've got this open in Qt Creator and I've been reading through the code: https://projects.developer.nokia.com/QMLRSSReader | 09:04 |
| Morpog_PC | lloks like a symbian example | 09:05 |
| Morpog_PC | easier would be an harmattan one | 09:05 |
| GentSir | Yeah, I'm looking through the github link in that forum thread and I'll find something I find interesting to pore through | 09:06 |
| GentSir | thank you | 09:06 |
| GentSir | I'm starting a Computer Sciences degree this fall, and I've been programming in various languages since I was 16. But never really challenged myself | 09:09 |
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| SfietKonstantin | hello everybody | 10:52 |
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| GentSir | SfietKonstantin, morning | 10:53 |
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| GentSir | How's the Eurozone on this lovely day? | 10:57 |
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| niweber | cold and snowing | 11:16 |
| niweber | nice springday... | 11:16 |
| GentSir | niweber, I've been living in Florida for around three months now, I actually miss the cold | 11:17 |
| niweber | GentSir: so you mentioned | 11:19 |
| * niweber still would like some spring | 11:19 | |
| GentSir | niweber, sorry, memory isn't great right now, sick and loaded on meds | 11:19 |
| GentSir | How I manage to get the flu in 30 degree weather I do not know | 11:20 |
| niweber | better go to bed then | 11:21 |
| GentSir | I've slept plenty, just have to ride it out | 11:22 |
| GentSir | Plus, i've really been working on learning Qt/QML. I hate being lazy | 11:23 |
| Nicd- | I got my first fever in years when I went to Florida for two weeks | 11:23 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | well, for me it was to Barcelona for MWC :P | 11:25 |
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| GentSir | Nicd-, I honestly don't like Florida very much | 11:26 |
| blackish | greetings everyone | 11:30 |
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| GentSir | morning | 11:31 |
| blackish | i have a noob question about sdk. i've installed fresh new shiny sdk and now trying to port one of my old meego app to it. but it seems to miss openssl headers. i've tried to copy openssl folder to sailfish target but it didn't help. quick googling didn't help either. | 11:32 |
| blackish | what am i doing wrong? | 11:33 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | blackish: better use the SDK control panel | 11:35 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | click on the sailfish icon on the left | 11:35 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | then click on manage for the SailfishOS-i486 target | 11:36 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | and search if there is openssl dev things | 11:36 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | install it, and it should be ok | 11:36 |
| blackish | i missed this button. silly me. thanks | 11:36 |
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| Yaniel | ... now I want CalDAV support in the default calendar app even more :3 | 12:43 |
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| Yaniel | (uni has a caldav feed of events & schedule now) | 12:44 |
| GentSir | Yaniel, this is just speculation, but is there isn't native support you could always pull the feed and convert it to a format that's natively support | 12:50 |
| GentSir | *supported | 12:50 |
| GentSir | If you have a private server or vps you can use, it could be almost transparent | 12:50 |
| Yaniel | I used to download my schedule as an xml file and run it through an app that converted it to vcs, then import to ical and sync to my phone with isync | 12:51 |
| Yaniel | now I can skip everything up to the sync | 12:51 |
| GentSir | Yaniel, don't know if it fits your use case, but a mate of my swears by ownCloud for device integration: https://owncloud.org/features/ | 12:58 |
| Yaniel | I've taken a quick look at that | 12:59 |
| Yaniel | it's a bit too massive for my private use though :D | 12:59 |
| Yaniel | + I doubt it is a good idea to run that on a raspberry pi | 12:59 |
| Yaniel | still planning to try set up radicale | 13:00 |
| GentSir | Yaniel, I know how you feel. Sometimes we have to make sacrifices to stick to FOSS software | 13:01 |
| GentSir | Radicale does look like a good solution, I'd assume the native calendar app will have WebDAV support | 13:02 |
| Yaniel | I do hope so | 13:03 |
| GentSir | and if not, we're always free to implement it ourselves | 13:03 |
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| GentSir | Sailfish may still be in its infancy, but it's a joy to work with after Android | 13:04 |
| Yaniel | quite a psychic michelangelo for an infant | 13:06 |
| GentSir | Yaniel, it IS based off the best operating system core ever made. I've been using Linux as my primary OS since I was 14, I felt right at home delving into the command line for the emulator | 13:09 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: don't say that to all the iOS / Android devs | 13:09 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | they will cry if you separate them from their beloved XCode, or eclipse and their shiny macs | 13:09 |
| Yaniel | GentSir: I've "taken a tour" through the emulator & sdk VMs too :) | 13:09 |
| Yaniel | via ssh ofc | 13:10 |
| GentSir | Sfiet_Konstantin, when I was going to school at Northwood I had to step in and clean up the mess of an app the seniors made for the auto show week. I despise working with Android | 13:10 |
| GentSir | Yaniel, "taken a tour"? Did I miss a reference there? | 13:11 |
| Yaniel | playing on the command line | 13:11 |
| GentSir | Yaniel, I did for quite awhile as well. Been learning Qt/QML, it's starting to make sense to me | 13:12 |
| Yaniel | knowing HTML and JS helps a lot on the QML side | 13:13 |
| GentSir | I know the basics of HTML, have never touched JS | 13:13 |
| GentSir | But I'm only nineteen, I pick up new stuff quickly | 13:13 |
| Yaniel | same here :D | 13:14 |
| GentSir | I feel a little intimidated in here, all the old-guard ex nokia guys | 13:14 |
| Yaniel | not sure if I can call myself that though :D | 13:15 |
| mikhas | I met a bunch of lost souls yesterday who thought HTML5 is the futgure | 13:17 |
| mikhas | *future | 13:18 |
| Yaniel | it is part of the future | 13:19 |
| Yaniel | but by far not everything | 13:19 |
| GentSir | Was it said by the same brogrammers that code in Ruby and sip $10 lattes? | 13:20 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: so, why are these old nokia guys intimidating ? :D | 13:20 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | they are nice :) | 13:20 |
| Yaniel | Sfiet_Konstantin: they can tell how you fscked up before you get to ask? :D | 13:21 |
| GentSir | Sfiet_Konstantin, they've all been perfectly polite and helpful the novices such as myself. Everything I can do just feels trivial compared to their decades of experience. | 13:22 |
| GentSir | I second Yaniel on that as well | 13:22 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: haha | 13:22 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | that's really true | 13:22 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | however the best way to learn is to ask, and they know that | 13:22 |
| Yaniel | just like ##OpenGL | 13:22 |
| GentSir | Sfiet_Konstantin: Yes, and young blood is important to every product | 13:23 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: indeed | 13:23 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | young guys are flexible | 13:23 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | and have thrist of knowledge | 13:23 |
| GentSir | and we're naive enough to believe that Sailfish can actually take off :) | 13:24 |
| Yaniel | I think that can be said of all sailors regardless of age | 13:25 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: lol, and you don't need to be naive for that | 13:25 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | Sailfish will get it's niche | 13:25 |
| GentSir | Yes, Jolla is small enough that even modest sales will keep it going | 13:25 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | it will not be like iOS or android, but it has enough strength to seduce | 13:25 |
| GentSir | I was going to say "even modest sails will keep it afloat", but sometimes puns are lost on non-native speakers :) | 13:26 |
| Yaniel | :D | 13:27 |
| GentSir | The interface isn't perfect, but there's plenty of time to improve. Hopefully it's released on good hardware in addition to the el cheapo ZTE and other chinese bargain gear | 13:29 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: I'm curious about what you want to improve :) | 13:34 |
| GentSir | Sfiet_Konstantin, I've gotten very used to having a status bar at top with the time/signal info. But I guess the swipe transparency solves that issue for the most part. | 13:35 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: with the iconia tab, I have never experienced troubles in checking battery, clock with the transparency push | 13:36 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | on windows phone neither | 13:36 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | so that's definitely not a trouble | 13:36 |
| GentSir | Honestly, I'm sure the final release will be incredibly fluid and comfortable to use | 13:36 |
| GentSir | I'm especially happy the transparency push works from both sides, I have trouble with many touch gestures used in Android because I'm left handed | 13:37 |
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| Yaniel | as someone criticized it, pushing the app to the side should actually move the app instead of just fading | 13:38 |
| GentSir | Yaniel, but then to see the entire cover view you'd have to move it all the way, and then the app would go into its background state. The transparency works fine. | 13:39 |
| Yaniel | um, s/instead/in addition to/ | 13:40 |
| GentSir | I get you now. I don't see any reason that can't be implemented though | 13:40 |
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| Sfiet_Konstantin | Yaniel: it was me who blogged about that issue (moving window instead of fading) | 13:42 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | well, I have to say that for using the iconia, it bothers me a bit less :D | 13:43 |
| GentSir | Yeah, I'm sure the little "issues" will be less pronounced using it on actual hardware. | 13:45 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | the last time I have seen so lovely UI was with the N9 | 13:46 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | a radical departure | 13:47 |
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| Sfiet_Konstantin | right now, all others UI are not innovating much | 13:47 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | even BB10 | 13:47 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | rip of of N9 | 13:47 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | maybe ubuntu | 13:47 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | but I did not find it nice | 13:47 |
| GentSir | Sfiet_Konstantin, look closely at the Ubuntu mobile UI and designing for it, it's a mess | 13:48 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: well, I think I looked at it close enough | 13:48 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | I went to MWC for that | 13:49 |
| GentSir | Sfiet_Konstantin, okay, fair enough | 13:49 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | :P | 13:49 |
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| GentSir | I just don't like the approach desktop ubuntu is taking, I'm scared to have their OS on something I count on to be stable | 13:50 |
| mikhas | Sfiet_Konstantin, how did you like the Ubuntu Touch demos? | 13:54 |
| mikhas | actually, young blood is required for solving impossible-to-solve problems | 13:55 |
| mikhas | they have the advantage of not knowing it's impossible | 13:56 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | mikhas: no | 13:56 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | I won't say: "a bit", "some good ideas" etc. | 13:56 |
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| Sfiet_Konstantin | for me it is np | 13:56 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | no | 13:56 |
| mikhas | yes | 13:56 |
| GentSir | mikhas, I like to say that I don't have any bad habits ingrained in me yet | 13:56 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: don't be too optimistic about that :D | 13:57 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | you already have, but you don't know :D | 13:57 |
| GentSir | Aside from rampant abuse of mountain dew? | 13:59 |
| GentSir | At least I don't build cloud apps in Ruby on Rails with node.js and a NoSQL database to provide dynamic solutions | 14:02 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: why not | 14:04 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | that's a good thing to do :P | 14:04 |
| GentSir | Sfiet_Konstantin, I hope you realize that was sarcasm! | 14:04 |
| GentSir | That sentence made my head hurt | 14:04 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: I do, and it was sarcasm as well :D | 14:04 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | I know that kind of talk | 14:04 |
| GentSir | Usually the person talking like that is also holding a brand new macbook | 14:04 |
| GentSir | Nothing against macbooks, I love the hardware and I'm using one right now | 14:05 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: depends | 14:05 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | it is suited for some activitiew | 14:06 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | my personnal favourite are thinkpads | 14:06 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | but macbooks aren't that bad | 14:06 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | just very expensive | 14:06 |
| GentSir | Mine is a 2008 4, 1 model | 14:06 |
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| GentSir | It's getting a little old, will need to be replaced fairly soon. I doubt I'd buy a newer one though, too much of a pain to get Linux on them | 14:06 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: yeah, for linux, it is better to get the good old PCs | 14:07 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | but now the "ultrabooks" are pretty beautiful | 14:07 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | even if my good old thinkpad X200 is still my favourite | 14:07 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | (a bit like my companion cube, I will never throw it into an emergency intelligence incinerator) | 14:08 |
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| GentSir | Sfiet_Konstantin, I'm building a nice development desktop in the next few months. Something with a nice processor and globs of RAM. Two or three monitors, nice keyboard and mouse. I'll probably keep using my Macbook until it dies | 14:08 |
| GentSir | I really don't need a more powerful laptop | 14:08 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: haha, that's nice | 14:09 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | I cannot have a desktop though, will move often these years :( | 14:09 |
| GentSir | As soon as I get back to University :/ | 14:09 |
| GentSir | I had to leave where I was attending in Michigan for various personal reasons | 14:09 |
| GentSir | So I'm sitting on my lazy butt until I head back to a school down here this fall | 14:10 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: no, you are not | 14:10 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | you are learning QML | 14:10 |
| GentSir | Good point | 14:11 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | and how to be a super Sailfish hacker | 14:11 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | go on | 14:11 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | the world needs more super sailfish hackers | 14:11 |
| GentSir | Being lazy does not appeal to me | 14:11 |
| GentSir | But I'm having a really hard time getting accepted into a University with a good Computer Sciences department. I skimped on my grades in high school to go to a business vocational school and get good hands on experience. | 14:12 |
| GentSir | My standardized test scores, resume, work experience, essay, they don't mean anything if my application doesn't make it past the automated GPA filter. | 14:14 |
| GentSir | Sorry for venting, I'm still sick | 14:14 |
| mikhas | go study in Europe ;-) | 14:25 |
| mikhas | lots of good CompSci universities here | 14:25 |
| GentSir | I have a really good friend that lives in germany, and she told me that classes there are primarily taught in german | 14:30 |
| GentSir | I also get free college here in the states because I'm legally disabled | 14:31 |
| GentSir | mikhas, I'm gassing subsidized University in most of Europe is for citizens only? | 14:31 |
| mikhas | no? | 14:32 |
| GentSir | Sorry, I'm just not familiar with how it works | 14:32 |
| mikhas | and it really depends on the country/science whether majority of course will be English or not | 14:32 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: well universities here in CH are pretty good, and often (or always in english) | 14:33 |
| mikhas | you can bet on anything MBA related being purely English | 14:33 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | whereas in fr, it is mostly fr | 14:33 |
| mikhas | ETH Zurich comes to mind for CompSci | 14:33 |
| GentSir | mikhas, aren't you German? What's the language situation like there? | 14:33 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | mikhas: or EPF Lausanne ? | 14:33 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | both are good | 14:33 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | :) | 14:33 |
| mikhas | We expect you to speak German of course, but if you live in bigger cities you'll get along just fine with English. Even when trying to open a bank account (you just have to make appointments in advance more often so they get you a skilled enough speaker). | 14:34 |
| GentSir | mikhas, I understand it's important to learn the language and culture of a country you want to dwell in. It's just not something that can be done overnight | 14:35 |
| mikhas | I agree with that. | 14:35 |
| GentSir | If you drive a couple hours south of where I live you can walk through many neighborhoods and hear nothing but Spanish | 14:36 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: or what about going to northern countries | 14:36 |
| GentSir | It drives me crazy when people wont' learn English here | 14:36 |
| mikhas | Typical weekend in Berlin. | 14:36 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | they are very english-friendly | 14:36 |
| mikhas | Nothing but Spaniards on the streets ;-) | 14:36 |
| mikhas | (they take cheap flights to Berlin for party weekends) | 14:37 |
| GentSir | Sfiet_Konstantin, I've always wanted to go to Iceland, but it's not the greatest educational destination | 14:37 |
| mikhas | let me see … | 14:37 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: i see | 14:37 |
| mikhas | if I drive a couple hours north they all speak Danish | 14:37 |
| mikhas | a couple hours west and it's all French | 14:38 |
| mikhas | 2 hours to the East and it's Polish! | 14:38 |
| mikhas | 1 hour to the south and I am completely lost | 14:38 |
| Yaniel | :D | 14:38 |
| mikhas | I dont even know what language that's supposed to be | 14:38 |
| GentSir | I can drive for at least a week and English will do me just fine | 14:38 |
| GentSir | No joke | 14:38 |
| Yaniel | mikhas: boarisch? | 14:38 |
| mikhas | Yaniel, I dont even make it that far! | 14:39 |
| Yaniel | oh... | 14:39 |
| mikhas | There'S another foreign country between Prussia and Bavaria. | 14:39 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | mikhas: :D | 14:39 |
| merlin1991 | heh I only have to drive a few hours west, still staying in my country and don't understand a word :D | 14:40 |
| GentSir | We're pretty homogenized here. Very little cultural differences for thousands of miles. It's why us americans are such buffoons. | 14:40 |
| mikhas | Yeah well, I'd find that pretty boring. | 14:41 |
| GentSir | mikhas, I've never experienced anything different | 14:42 |
| mikhas | So come study in Europe ;-) | 14:43 |
| GentSir | if I could get accepted in a decent university in Europe, get a student visa, and if there weren't any financial concerns I'd love to | 14:43 |
| mikhas | You might not learn how to become rich, or how to run a startup, but it'll be fun. | 14:43 |
| GentSir | I also have an ostomy, but I could get my parents to ship supplies from the US | 14:43 |
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| mikhas | They used to re-label German groceries for the GIs stationed in Germany, to make it look US-ish. | 14:45 |
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| mikhas | German food products* | 14:45 |
| GentSir | I'll look up some information on studying in Europe | 14:46 |
| GentSir | But germany isn't a likely option, if it's all german language classes | 14:46 |
| GentSir | I can already drive a stickshift just fine, so I'm not worried about getting around | 14:47 |
| Yaniel | The university of helsinki has an open online programming course that can get you accepted to the university | 14:47 |
| Yaniel | but that is in finnish | 14:48 |
| GentSir | That's the issue, I'm limited to English for now :/ | 14:48 |
| GentSir | Perfectly willing to learn another language, but it takes time | 14:48 |
| Yaniel | http://mooc.cs.helsinki.fi | 14:48 |
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| GentSir | My plan right now is to go to a lower tier school for a couple years, then figure out my transfer options after that | 14:49 |
| GentSir | I can learn to be a good programmer and designer no matter where I go to school, it's mostly about experience and experimentation. | 14:49 |
| * merlin1991 wonders what stance the industry has on the vienna university regarding quality | 14:49 | |
| GentSir | Yaniel, Not helpful, I can't read a word of that :) | 14:50 |
| mikhas | If I were to come to study to Europe, I would check for one of the smaller countries, not Germany (and probably not southern Europe either) | 14:50 |
| Yaniel | too bad, apparently even google translate is clueless :D | 14:50 |
| GentSir | mikhas, what countries have subsidized university available to foreign students? | 14:52 |
| GentSir | As I said, I can go to pretty much any college that will accept me for free here because I'm disabled | 14:52 |
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| mikhas | all of them really, if you avoid UK | 14:52 |
| mikhas | but UK doesn't really count as Europe, in many ways … | 14:52 |
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| GentSir | At least the UK is English | 14:53 |
| GentSir | Only some minor language differences to what I'm used to | 14:53 |
| merlin1991 | heh | 14:54 |
| merlin1991 | the uk is as much part of europe as russia | 14:54 |
| GentSir | Oceania has always been at war with Eurasia, I know :) | 14:54 |
| GentSir | But I'll look into it | 14:55 |
| GentSir | Getting away from the states could be nice | 14:55 |
| mikhas | some say the UK lend its name for the popular 90ies game Monkey Island | 14:56 |
| mikhas | but that's of course completely unconfirmed rumors | 14:56 |
| GentSir | We have a different use of the term "Monkey" here | 14:56 |
| GentSir | It's, of course, very offensive as well | 14:57 |
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| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: as I said, you might apply for EPFL or ETHZ | 14:59 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | in Fr and Ger part of CH | 14:59 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | the courses are IIRC in english for the CS section | 14:59 |
| GentSir | Heck. I could even head into c | 15:00 |
| GentSir | Canada | 15:00 |
| GentSir | Nah, we don't like Canada | 15:01 |
| merlin1991 | GentSir: half of europe doesn't like germany, people still go there to study and work ;) | 15:01 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | merlin1991: that's half true | 15:01 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | ;) | 15:02 |
| GentSir | What, they only like one half of Germany? | 15:02 |
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| GentSir | Okay, that was mean | 15:02 |
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| merlin1991 | half true, as in all of europe doesn't like germany? | 15:02 |
| GentSir | I'm looking at ETH right now. At least they have their website in English | 15:02 |
| GentSir | Both of those are Swiss schools? | 15:04 |
| GentSir | Sfiet_Konstantin, do those schools teach in English? | 15:05 |
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| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: searching for a bachelor ? a master ? | 15:07 |
| GentSir | Sfiet_Konstantin, bachelors in CompSci | 15:07 |
| GentSir | or comparable | 15:07 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: then forget about it | 15:08 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | at least in EPFL | 15:08 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | it is half in fr | 15:08 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | I nthought it was fully english :S | 15:08 |
| GentSir | Oh well | 15:08 |
| GentSir | This has given me a lot to think about though | 15:09 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | try ethz | 15:09 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | seems to be fully in english | 15:09 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | although I'm not sure | 15:09 |
| GentSir | All German: http://www.rektorat.ethz.ch/students/admission/bachelor/foreign_qual/index_EN | 15:09 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | well no :P | 15:10 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | yeah | 15:10 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | just found that | 15:10 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | hum ... they need to put some effort in that | 15:10 |
| GentSir | I could just go to school here for 2 years as planned, work hard to learn German | 15:10 |
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| merlin1991 | and then give up because not even germans can do german properly ;) | 15:12 |
| Yaniel | GentSir: something like this? http://www.tut.fi/admissions/studies/master-s-studies/information-technology | 15:12 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | merlin1991: LOL | 15:12 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: or come to the french side | 15:12 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | it is better :P | 15:12 |
| GentSir | merlin1991, Americans can't speak English properly either | 15:12 |
| Yaniel | properly vs understandably is a big difference | 15:12 |
| merlin1991 | GentSir: well speaking is no problem, writing there lies problem | 15:13 |
| GentSir | merlin1991, if you need some entertainment at the expense of american grammar skills then look here: http://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm | 15:13 |
| GentSir | Don't get lost there | 15:15 |
| GentSir | I wish we were taught another language from a young age here in the US, it seems like that's the standard in most of the world. | 15:16 |
| Yaniel | because english is not the main language there | 15:17 |
| GentSir | I understand. I've heard it's much easier to learn a second language at a young age | 15:17 |
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| GentSir | But at least I can go to university for free in the states, I'll be fine | 15:19 |
| niweber | GentSir: in CompSci usually there are a couple of students not speaking German in the German universities, somehow they manage | 15:19 |
| niweber | GentSir: and usually it is ok to hand in stuff etc in English | 15:19 |
| merlin1991 | I did that by mistake once, but they took it without a question :) | 15:20 |
| GentSir | niweber, then I could go to University for two years here and then transfer somewhere else, I could probably learn enough German in two years to get by | 15:20 |
| GentSir | How does the subsidized education work there? That's a foreign concept to me at the University level. | 15:21 |
| niweber | GentSir: you have to be prepared to get some more books about the topics if you don't understand what the teachers say, but that is usually not a problem | 15:21 |
| merlin1991 | and usually the courses have english reference literature anyways | 15:21 |
| GentSir | I enjoy reading anyway, and i can teach myself easily | 15:22 |
| niweber | GentSir: well, you simply go to the uni | 15:22 |
| GentSir | niweber, elaborate please | 15:22 |
| niweber | GentSir: you have to pay a small fee (about 100 euros) | 15:22 |
| GentSir | That's nothing | 15:22 |
| niweber | but that includes public transport in most cities | 15:22 |
| GentSir | How hard would it be for me to get a valid drivers license in Switzerland or Germany? | 15:23 |
| Yaniel | should be doable | 15:24 |
| GentSir | Us americans love to drive, I can't give that up | 15:24 |
| GentSir | But it's really subsidized for foreign students as well? | 15:24 |
| merlin1991 | holy shit tu vienna wants 726,72€ per semester from people outside austria | 15:25 |
| GentSir | Most Americans can't tell the difference between Austria and Australia | 15:25 |
| merlin1991 | gotta love it though, that the official webpage tells me I'd have to pay 380,86€ starting this semester whilst the actual system only wanted 17.50€ from me | 15:27 |
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| merlin1991 | seems like they didn't bother to update the webpage after they decided not to collect that money | 15:27 |
| GentSir | merlin1991, is that 380.86 or 380,86? | 15:27 |
| niweber | GentSir: in which state did you aquire your driving license? | 15:28 |
| merlin1991 | 380€ 86 cents (atm I'm confused which one is the german notation and which one the international one) | 15:28 |
| GentSir | Usually it's a dot/period | 15:29 |
| GentSir | At least here in the us | 15:29 |
| GentSir | Didn't know if you mistyped and dropped a digit at the end | 15:29 |
| merlin1991 | worst thing is, here we theoretically use 13,80 for 13€ 80 cents, and a . would mean 13thausand, but sometimes a . is used anyways | 15:29 |
| GentSir | Ah, I wasn't aware of that | 15:29 |
| merlin1991 | basically one never knows :D | 15:30 |
| GentSir | Is English your second language? Do you primarily use another language? | 15:30 |
| merlin1991 | german is my primary language (see austria) | 15:31 |
| niweber | GentSir: it depends on the state whether exchanging your driving license is easy or not | 15:31 |
| merlin1991 | and as you stated, no kangaroos live here :) | 15:31 |
| GentSir | niweber, on the European country or the US state my license was issued in? | 15:32 |
| niweber | GentSir: US state | 15:32 |
| GentSir | niweber, I currently have a Florida drivers license, but I'm still only a temporary resident of the state until August 28th. I can head back up to Michigan and they'll issue me a Michigan drivers license anytime before then. | 15:33 |
| niweber | GentSir: so, it seems with a Michigan license, you could simply exchange it into a German license | 15:34 |
| niweber | GentSir: with the Florida one, you would have to pass a theoretical exam | 15:34 |
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| GentSir | When my friend Aileen came to Michigan I knew they'd accept her German license | 15:35 |
| GentSir | An exam isn't an issue though | 15:35 |
| GentSir | At least in germany I wouldn't have to learn to drive on the other side of the road | 15:35 |
| niweber | GentSir: that isn't as hard as people think | 15:36 |
| merlin1991 | oh I wouldn't say that too fast, though the theoretical exam is rather easy | 15:36 |
| GentSir | merlin1991, I've taken theoretical driving exams here in the states, can't be too different | 15:36 |
| GentSir | I'll just have to learn the traffic laws | 15:37 |
| GentSir | niweber, I have driven a right hand drive car, but never driven in the left side of the road | 15:37 |
| merlin1991 | well the test I took basically consisted of the corner cases | 15:37 |
| merlin1991 | where in some cases plain logical thinking would tell you otherwise :D | 15:37 |
| GentSir | merlin1991, we have questions that make absolutely no sense on the exam here as well | 15:38 |
| GentSir | Most states make it very easy to get a drivers license, but also very easy to lose it if you have repeated traffic violations or a bad at-fault crash. | 15:39 |
| merlin1991 | hm did you take your exam in an automatic or not, because interestingly, if you do it with an automatic gearbox you're restricted to them | 15:39 |
| merlin1991 | no idea how that applies to licenses issued by other countries though | 15:39 |
| GentSir | merlin1991, here in the states they have to get a special examiner out if you want to do it on a manual, and it costs a lot extra. So I just took my test on an automatic | 15:39 |
| niweber | GentSir: If you'd come to Berlin for example, I would think twice about using the car though, at least as long as you live near the centre | 15:40 |
| GentSir | I've only owned manual cars though | 15:40 |
| GentSir | niweber, it's just an american thing | 15:40 |
| niweber | GentSir: I know, public transport is way better in germany though | 15:40 |
| GentSir | Getting your drivers license and first car is a rite of passage for american boys | 15:40 |
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| merlin1991 | heh here it's a rite of passage aswell | 15:42 |
| merlin1991 | sudenlly you have a lot less money yearly | 15:42 |
| merlin1991 | :D | 15:42 |
| GentSir | Except with less fun cars | 15:42 |
| merlin1991 | once you had money, then you have a car | 15:42 |
| GentSir | once you had a car you spent all your money on your car? | 15:43 |
| merlin1991 | yep | 15:43 |
| GentSir | I know how that feels | 15:43 |
| merlin1991 | because you have to have it checked yearly and anything that's bad fixed | 15:43 |
| merlin1991 | no driving around with cars made out of rust | 15:43 |
| GentSir | My last car, that I sold before I came to Florida, was a 1988 Cutlass Supreme with a 454 Chevy Big Block | 15:43 |
| GentSir | I bought it off an uncle | 15:43 |
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| merlin1991 | my car takes about 500€ yearly just for repairs | 15:44 |
| merlin1991 | man we're wayyy offtopic :D | 15:44 |
| GentSir | It got around 8-10 miles to the gallon. that's 4 km to a liter I believe | 15:45 |
| GentSir | That's okay | 15:45 |
| GentSir | The nokia old guard isn't here to complain | 15:45 |
| Yaniel | :D | 15:45 |
| merlin1991 | 4 km to a liter, jesus | 15:45 |
| Yaniel | "nokia old guard" is that something like the storm guards in skyrim? | 15:45 |
| merlin1991 | I do 16km a liter | 15:45 |
| GentSir | Yeah, but I topped out at 145 mph | 15:45 |
| merlin1991 | but then again I drive a small french car, and gas is cheaper over there | 15:46 |
| GentSir | That car probably weighed as much as ten of your car | 15:46 |
| GentSir | I used to joke that my engine was larger than a smartcar | 15:47 |
| merlin1991 | I topped out at about 105mph :D | 15:47 |
| merlin1991 | and yeah the car is ~800kg | 15:47 |
| GentSir | My car weighed around two tons | 15:47 |
| GentSir | ~1800kg | 15:47 |
| GentSir | Before that I had a little ford escort, got hit by a girl who ran a red light. Right into my driver door, spent a month in the hospital and had to have lots of back surgery | 15:48 |
| GentSir | So I wanted to drive a tank once I got back on the road | 15:48 |
| GentSir | Maybe my next car will have an embedded navigation system running on Sailfish | 15:49 |
| GentSir | there we go, back on topic | 15:49 |
| merlin1991 | hm if someone runs right into my driver door they probably don't even have to bother bringing me to the hospital | 15:50 |
| GentSir | It was very very bad | 15:52 |
| GentSir | I still have a lot of back pain | 15:52 |
| GentSir | The girl that hit me lost her drivers license | 15:52 |
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| GentSir | Yaniel, anything like this but at the bachelors level? http://www.tut.fi/admissions/studies/master-s-studies/information-technology | 15:54 |
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| Yaniel | you might want to look at open university studies too | 16:06 |
| GentSir | What I'm thinking is two years of University here in the states, spend that time learning German, and then look into ETH or another school | 16:06 |
| Yaniel | looks like bachelor's degree studies are only in finnish | 16:11 |
| GentSir | A shame. I could look into german schools | 16:11 |
| GentSir | One of my best friends lives an hour from frankfurt | 16:12 |
| Yaniel | a good reason to go there then :) | 16:12 |
| GentSir | She's actually taking a vacation here in florida in a couple weeks | 16:12 |
| GentSir | But anywho | 16:12 |
| Yaniel | when I had to decide where I wanted to study it boiled down to "I like that city" | 16:12 |
| GentSir | Where did you study? | 16:13 |
| GentSir | Is Morpog_PC around? | 16:14 |
| GentSir | Yaniel, do you know of any CompSci schools in Germany that could be good options? | 16:15 |
| Yaniel | I don't really know german schools/universities | 16:16 |
| GentSir | I'm pretty sure Morpog_PC is a professor at one, I'll ask him when he's around | 16:16 |
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| Yaniel | studying @Tampere University of Technology atm | 16:17 |
| Morpog_PC | GentSir: no, I'm really not a professor at one :-) | 16:17 |
| Morpog_PC | Didn't even study at all.... | 16:17 |
| GentSir | I'll admit, Morpog_PC, I took a look at the name on your whois and tried to connect the dots | 16:18 |
| GentSir | that sometimes isn't very useful :) | 16:18 |
| Morpog_PC | haha, but was a good laugh for me though ;) | 16:18 |
| GentSir | Well, in any case, are you familiar with german CompSci universities? | 16:19 |
| GentSir | I could learn German | 16:19 |
| Morpog_PC | sorry, no | 16:19 |
| GentSir | oh well | 16:20 |
| mikhas | FHTW Aachen has a good reputation, but best one is *probably* Munich (compsci) | 16:21 |
| merlin1991 | hm nobody can tell me how good vienna is | 16:21 |
| Morpog_PC | maybe thp4 can? | 16:21 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | lool, #sailfishos is _the_ chan to prepare a travel or study in europe | 16:22 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | people from all over europe here :D | 16:22 |
| mikhas | yeah well, have you seen thp's code? | 16:22 |
| Morpog_PC | nope :-) | 16:22 |
| mikhas | that alone will make you avoid Vienna | 16:22 |
| merlin1991 | mikhas: yeah he is the master of mad code | 16:23 |
| mikhas | and the accent … | 16:23 |
| mikhas | but great food, cant deny that | 16:23 |
| merlin1991 | but he's fun to work with | 16:23 |
| mikhas | nah, he's great guy | 16:23 |
| GentSir | This is the english page, I think 3 words on the entire thing are in english: http://www.fh-aachen.de/en/ | 16:23 |
| merlin1991 | well he is in a position to talk about the real quality of it, but I'm interested how the industry sees it | 16:24 |
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| merlin1991 | oh shit, they take their english seriously :D | 16:24 |
| mikhas | GentSir, wronng uni | 16:25 |
| merlin1991 | at least we trump in that: http://www.tuwien.ac.at/en/tuwien_home/ | 16:25 |
| mikhas | hang on | 16:25 |
| mikhas | GentSir, http://www.rwth-aachen.de/ | 16:25 |
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| GentSir | Sorry, not familiar with a single school there | 16:25 |
| GentSir | thanks mikhas | 16:25 |
| mikhas | I mixed up the character soup again, but I really meant "RWTH" | 16:26 |
| GentSir | No worries | 16:26 |
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| mikhas | Aachen, whilst perhaps boring in itself, is right on the border to France/Germany | 16:27 |
| GentSir | mikhas, it's just an entrance examination for admission? | 16:27 |
| mikhas | so you get exposed to different cultures very easily | 16:27 |
| mikhas | that really depends on the year and uni | 16:27 |
| mikhas | if there are too many students, there can be | 16:27 |
| mikhas | Sfiet_Konstantin, who needs couch surfing if there's #sailfishos ;-) | 16:28 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | mikhas: ;) | 16:29 |
| GentSir | I meant. I have a high school diploma and a few college credits here in the states. But I doubt they can compare that easily to students coming inside germany | 16:29 |
| GentSir | you guys are awesome though | 16:29 |
| mikhas | high school diploma should grant admission | 16:29 |
| GentSir | mikhas, that's all it takes? | 16:29 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | GentSir: in france it is also the case, but well, universities in france are not that good | 16:29 |
| mikhas | for most unis in Germany? yes | 16:30 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | you can try Paris XI that is ok though | 16:30 |
| mikhas | most unis in Germany also have waaaay too many students, and that can be a serious downside | 16:30 |
| GentSir | mikhas, wow. Schools here are way more selective. I'm having a heck of a time getting accepted into ANY university with a proper CompSci program | 16:30 |
| mikhas | you are more on your own here | 16:31 |
| GentSir | mikhas, more on your own? | 16:31 |
| mikhas | well, how to explain … if you plan a top-notch academic career, then stay in the US | 16:31 |
| merlin1991 | heh when I started studying they didn't even have any weird limiting exams in the first semester | 16:32 |
| merlin1991 | it was plain who wants can education :) | 16:32 |
| mikhas | if you want to become a well-rounded person and see different cultures while having good enough education, come to Europe | 16:32 |
| thp | mikhas, merlin1991: what's wrong with my code? :p | 16:32 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | mikhas: +1 | 16:32 |
| mikhas | the quality of your education really depends a lot on your own dedication | 16:32 |
| mikhas | (here in Europe) | 16:32 |
| mikhas | dont expect others to constantly tell you what to do | 16:33 |
| merlin1991 | thp: just saying, transfer data from python -> qml via string json list to be evalueted by js inside qml? ;) | 16:33 |
| GentSir | mikhas, that sounds perfect | 16:33 |
| mikhas | well, it'S a challenge in its own | 16:33 |
| mikhas | but it allows you to grow as a person, if you understand the challenge | 16:33 |
| GentSir | mikhas: Here in the states, especially in public schools, you get spoon fed for your education | 16:33 |
| GentSir | I really enjoy learning on my own | 16:33 |
| mikhas | I find being 19yo being too youn to really understand all those implications, I wish someone had told me back then what it's all about ;-) | 16:34 |
| mikhas | *young | 16:34 |
| GentSir | I went to a business vocational school for two years during high school, and it was very much a "learn at your own pace" setup | 16:34 |
| GentSir | I absolutely loved it | 16:34 |
| mikhas | :-) | 16:35 |
| GentSir | I actually taught (very basic) C and Python to some students there | 16:35 |
| mikhas | thp, if you have to ask that question then you're not ready for the answer yet | 16:36 |
| mikhas | nah just kidding … I have to admit that I do read your code for educational purpose, too | 16:37 |
| GentSir | Can someone provide a link to his code? | 16:37 |
| GentSir | It can't be worse than mine | 16:37 |
| GentSir | I'm entirely self-taught | 16:37 |
| thp | i should put in more puns in variable names and comments so you can read it for entertainment purposes ;) | 16:37 |
| Yaniel | :D | 16:37 |
| merlin1991 | GentSir: http://github.com/thp/ has a lot | 16:37 |
| mikhas | thp, infotainement! | 16:38 |
| mikhas | or actually, edutainment | 16:38 |
| GentSir | Perl? I'm scared already | 16:38 |
| mikhas | hahaha | 16:38 |
| GentSir | Does that mean ALL his code is write-only? | 16:38 |
| mikhas | yes, he renamed himself after he found the love of his life: Perl | 16:39 |
| GentSir | That's beautiful | 16:39 |
| mikhas | nah, I dont think thp likes to write Perl at all | 16:39 |
| GentSir | somebody had the bright idea when I was 15 to tell me that if I wanted to learn "database programming" I needed to learn Perl | 16:40 |
| GentSir | The rest is a story I don't care to recount... | 16:41 |
| merlin1991 | dafaq? | 16:41 |
| GentSir | merlin1991, I think the same thing now | 16:41 |
| mikhas | Perl has a beautiful DBI module | 16:41 |
| GentSir | I wrote code exclusively in Perl for 2 years before I wised up | 16:41 |
| mikhas | prepared statements, parameter binding … | 16:41 |
| mikhas | Perl doesn't write bad code, people do. | 16:42 |
| GentSir | Yes | 16:42 |
| ajalkane | Perl is pretty good but requires too much discipline from the coder | 16:42 |
| GentSir | but I just like to rip on Perl now | 16:42 |
| ajalkane | But I like it - except the overly stupid object syntax | 16:42 |
| thp | python's DBI equivalent is DBAPI2 http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0249/ | 16:42 |
| ajalkane | At least that was the case with Perl5, haven't done anything in it since | 16:42 |
| GentSir | I moved to Python/C after that, dabbled a little in Android/Dalvik Java | 16:43 |
| thp | but i guess most people use some ORM framework these days | 16:43 |
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| mikhas | if it ever becomes hip to bash SailfishOS then we know the Jolla guys did it | 16:43 |
| mikhas | bargh, ORM … | 16:43 |
| mikhas | a disease really | 16:43 |
| merlin1991 | I still have no idea how to properly map into datagrids in C# | 16:44 |
| merlin1991 | and I sort of plan to never find out | 16:44 |
| GentSir | Let's see if the app I updated for Northwood got pulled from the Play store yet... | 16:46 |
| GentSir | It's not there | 16:46 |
| GentSir | Oh it was a mess | 16:46 |
| merlin1991 | you don't get notified if it gets pulled? | 16:48 |
| GentSir | merlin1991, was done under the university account | 16:48 |
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| GentSir | Anywho | 16:50 |
| GentSir | It was to show information on the various teams and attractions at the annual auto show | 16:51 |
| GentSir | and the seniors make the app every year | 16:51 |
| GentSir | but they had some weird idea to populate xml files from a MySQL database that contained all the info, and they'd poll the teams beforehand to get it | 16:52 |
| GentSir | they're kludged together system didn't work, and it was only compatible with API's past 15, that's ICS, which was the latest version at the time | 16:52 |
| GentSir | My MIS professor asked me if I could help with it, because they were all "busy", and that was when I learned all this | 16:53 |
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| merlin1991 | MIS? | 16:53 |
| GentSir | Think a mix if Into to MBA and Information Sciences | 16:54 |
| GentSir | *Intro | 16:54 |
| GentSir | I did an awfully shoddy job hard coding all that info in from the surveys and getting it build and run for Android 2.3. I wish I had the code so you all could laugh at it | 16:54 |
| GentSir | But it WORKED | 16:54 |
| GentSir | And that's what matters | 16:55 |
| GentSir | I aspire to be a better programmer for Sailfish | 16:58 |
| merlin1991 | step 1, don't copy thp ;) | 17:00 |
| GentSir | He even managed to make Python code look bad | 17:02 |
| GentSir | I'm looking through his repo | 17:02 |
| GentSir | Nowhere near as bad as me in Java though | 17:02 |
| thp | feel free to point out concrete issues | 17:05 |
| ajalkane | Python code always looks to me like something's off with it. But that's just because I like Ruby's syntax when it comes to scripting languages. | 17:05 |
| GentSir | thp, I was just joking | 17:11 |
| GentSir | ajalkane, I've always heard Ruby described as a "Bro" language at Universities here | 17:11 |
| GentSir | Normally you sip on an expensive latte and code in it on a brand new Macbook | 17:12 |
| merlin1991 | hm expensive latte and brand new macbook, there's a few like that @ the university here | 17:14 |
| merlin1991 | no idea what they typo into their laptops though :) | 17:14 |
| ajalkane | Lol... dunno about that, but I guess it's more the Ruby on Rails types. With their newfangled Mac developing stations and what not. | 17:15 |
| merlin1991 | the best thing so far I had was a duo of that kind of students that was all like we'll make a startup for $idea and we'll do it all in django because that's awesome and hipster | 17:16 |
| merlin1991 | I gave them a card for the local python usergroup, but they never showed :D | 17:16 |
| ajalkane | I've done some Ruby scripting but never Rails stuff. So I have no educated guess if it's good beyond looking hipster. But I like Ruby as a language. | 17:16 |
| GentSir | merlin1991, that's funny | 17:17 |
| GentSir | Ruby on Rails is the hipster stereotype here | 17:17 |
| GentSir | Normally they aren't typing. They sit in starbucks and dick around in iTunes, pretending that everyone around them thinks they're writing a novel or something. | 17:18 |
| ajalkane | I have to admit I am interested in doing something with Ruby on Rails, just because I like Ruby | 17:18 |
| merlin1991 | I just love how rails had that huge security problem | 17:19 |
| ajalkane | Yeah but you're right... it's hard admitting doing something with Ruby on Rails because you get the hipster admiration. And all I want is be geek, but my beard don't grow :( | 17:19 |
| merlin1991 | or when github started filtering searches for the deploymentkey thingy | 17:19 |
| ajalkane | I remember reading something about that Rails vulnerability and it seemed pretty bad. | 17:20 |
| GentSir | Nah, they just want to "make it work" and they'll add security later! | 17:20 |
| ajalkane | Of course when you get to the bottom of it, there's no system out there without vulnerabilities. But the Rails one, if I remember correctly, seemed a bit basic | 17:20 |
| merlin1991 | well there was the fact that you have some private deploy key which pretty much everyone had in their source control | 17:21 |
| merlin1991 | then there was the thing that it did map ids directly and you had to eplecitely tell it not to take user input for specific things | 17:22 |
| ajalkane | Oh the github one... I was thinking about some earlier exploit | 17:22 |
| merlin1991 | (that was used on github for a funky bugreport in the future from bender) | 17:22 |
| ajalkane | ah the latter is the one I was thinking about | 17:22 |
| GentSir | When I ask for input, I expect ANYTHING other than what I asked for | 17:22 |
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| merlin1991 | GentSir: well it went as far as getting input and if there was id=something in it that that got used by the database mapper | 17:23 |
| merlin1991 | you have to tell it explecitely which mapped keys should not be taken from the user input | 17:23 |
| GentSir | I see. I've never used Ruby | 17:23 |
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| merlin1991 | very handy to hijack sessionkeys, userids, anything else that was expected to be generated only | 17:24 |
| merlin1991 | imho weird for a web framework to initally trust any user input | 17:26 |
| GentSir | So, isn't Aachen right by the French border? | 17:27 |
| GentSir | French women! | 17:27 |
| merlin1991 | I can see the appeal when the alternative are german women :D | 17:27 |
| GentSir | Ruby on Rails just attracts programmers that don't care about security | 17:27 |
| GentSir | merlin1991, we all know how promiscuous french women are: http://www.ibdna.com/regions/UK/EN/?page=paternity-testing-ban-upheld-in-france | 17:28 |
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| Stskeeps | i think we're drifting a bit off topic, guys.. | 17:28 |
| merlin1991 | GentSir: we've been found | 17:29 |
| GentSir | merlin1991, do you think the latte sipping Macbook natives will ever take up Sailfish? | 17:29 |
| merlin1991 | maybe we should swap to #jollamobile ;) | 17:29 |
| GentSir | The gestapo is here | 17:29 |
| ajalkane | Does Sailfish have Ruby and C++ bindings for it? :-P | 17:29 |
| merlin1991 | tbh I heaven't seen anybody interested in sailfish at the university | 17:30 |
| merlin1991 | but I didn't look that much | 17:30 |
| GentSir | I doubt they can code in C++ | 17:30 |
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| merlin1991 | actually I didn't see much of sailfish at all anywhere | 17:30 |
| GentSir | So there just needs to be an active movement against ruby bindings and we're safe | 17:30 |
| merlin1991 | ruby bindings, js frameworks and perlmadnes | 17:31 |
| merlin1991 | but the war vs perl has begun | 17:31 |
| merlin1991 | sailfish isn't deb based anymore --> no dpkg --> perl not that mandatory anymore :) | 17:32 |
| lbt | ajalkane: Mer has ruby | 17:32 |
| lbt | in fact the SDK has a Control Centre in it - that's ruby on sinatra | 17:33 |
| ajalkane | Cool | 17:33 |
| lbt | or sinatra on ruby if you prefer | 17:33 |
| ajalkane | Now all we need is bindings to Qt libs | 17:33 |
| merlin1991 | I want pyside bindings for the nfc part of qt mobility | 17:34 |
| lbt | and, as with anything opensource, someone to maintain it :) | 17:34 |
| GentSir | It's still all quiet on the eastern front, I think I'm the only macbook owner here | 17:34 |
| merlin1991 | so you admit you're a hipster too? | 17:34 |
| GentSir | merlin1991, it's an "antique" Macbook. From way back in 2008 | 17:35 |
| GentSir | It runs Debian just fine, thank you very much :) | 17:36 |
| merlin1991 | now don't tell me it runs ubuntu | 17:36 |
| merlin1991 | ah debian, that's fine | 17:36 |
| GentSir | I used Ubuntu from 8.04 to 10.04 | 17:36 |
| GentSir | Then I heard the mad ravings of Gnome Shell and Unity | 17:37 |
| merlin1991 | I kinda would have liked it if the sdk would be able to run on qemu-kvm aswell as on virtualbox | 17:37 |
| merlin1991 | ah yeah gnome shell and unity :D | 17:37 |
| merlin1991 | it feels like such a waste to have the extensions in the cpu and then use the virtualbox way | 17:38 |
| GentSir | Yes, so I fled to the sacred ground of Debian | 17:38 |
| merlin1991 | gotta catch a flight, have fun | 17:38 |
| GentSir | I'm an avid openbox user now | 17:38 |
| GentSir | later mate | 17:38 |
| merlin1991 | awesome here ;) | 17:39 |
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| ajalkane | I'm still on Ubuntu 10.04 | 17:53 |
| ajalkane | I've installed Ubuntu 12.04 for some development environments. I don't Unity shocking. Only thing I don't like is the Alt+Tab grouping of windows. | 17:54 |
| ajalkane | * don't find | 17:54 |
| ajalkane | Ok, and the top menu bar pisses me off | 17:54 |
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| GentSir | ajalkane, I just can't stand heavy DE's | 17:58 |
| ajalkane | It runs fine for on VirtualBox so I'm not sure how heavy it is comparatively speaking. Of course I haven't used it as a daily driver so I have no extensive experience. But the little I've had does not make me afraid to upgrade. Everything else going wrong with upgrade makes me delay it :) | 18:00 |
| GentSir | Check out crunchbang.org | 18:02 |
| GentSir | That's what I've used since Ubuntu 10.04 | 18:02 |
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| ajalkane | I dunno man... I'm not a student anymore. I just want my computer to work with minimal fuss. If the DE uses a bit more CPU cycles, I'm down with it. I'm boring and old, you know. | 18:05 |
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| GentSir | haha, fair enough | 18:07 |
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