Sunday, 2011-10-16

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Stskeepslbt / Sage :
Stskeepslet's extend on that - also, if it seems plausible to you08:25
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Stskeepslo smoku08:28
smokugood to see you Stskeeps08:28
Stskeepssmoku: think it would be possible to make automatic image installation and booting for cordiatab?08:29
smokuplease elaborate08:30
Stskeepsok, first off, you saw ? (check "All" -> "Merged")?08:30
smoku(be patient - GPRS here)08:31
Stskeepsit's a google web toolkit app so may not work on mobile browser at least08:32
smokuI'm at my laptop.08:32
smokubut my parents-in-law do not have a wire ;-)08:33
smokuso I'm tethering via n90008:33
Stskeepspoint ;)08:33
smokuBTW, I'm very pleased how the mobile networks support progressed in latest linux distributions.  it just works08:34
Stskeepswhen you've seen that.. the idea is that when a proposed merge comes in, we run tests as in which in the end gives a repository that vendors can use to make an image and test if the merge breaks their things08:34
smokuok. I have "Search for status:merged"08:34
smokuwhat to look at there08:35
Stskeepsand then hopefully be able to install automatically to a device and test it, reporting back if this change is good or bad08:35
Stskeepswell, anything, could try Add no-timestamps patch08:35
Stskeepsall mer packages are in git now so08:36
smokuso it should be possible with the i586 image I'm working on ATM08:36
Stskeepsfor example yes08:36
smokuas for ARM image... we don't have cordia arm hardware yet, so ...08:36
Stskeepsjust pondering if this seems to be a sane method to QA the core08:36
Stskeepswe'll of course help with tools to make it easier to automatically build images/flash them08:37
smokuany ideas how to do this automated testing, yet?08:37
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smokuor is it up to the vendor?08:37
dm8tbrI'd guess boards like Beagle, panda, snowball might be better suited08:37
dm8tbrfor on device testing, as they have a lot of helpful things exposed like reset, serial, etc08:38
Stskeepssmoku: we hope to help with some kind of standardized methods with a tiny part for hardware adaptation08:38
smokuyup. booting an image via nfs without flashing makes things a lot easier08:38
dm8tbrIIRC meego developed frameworks for automated testing, probably from the nokia side08:39
Stskeeps(n900 automatic installation)08:39
Stskeepsbasically a initrd and usb networking08:39
smokueven booting an image to the point it starts UX and an "report-boot-ok" script from ux autostart is a good test08:40
dm8tbrbonuspoints if you dump a screenshot or two08:41
lbtStskeeps: morning ...08:41
lbtreading test stuff too08:41
smokuStskeeps: BTW, should i build for Mer:Trunk:Core or Core:i586 ?08:41
Stskeepssmoku: on my OBS, Core:i58608:42
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Stskeepson COBS, the stuff in topic08:42
Stskeepsi hope we can set up some test rigs so we can do automated testing on various boards and move the checks ahead faster08:43
* dm8tbr has spare beagles08:44
dm8tbrcould also probably get a snowball08:44
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Stskeepsand well, since we have a i486 port we can utilize old crap too08:48
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araujo(early one for me)08:48
Stskeepsmorn araujo08:48
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araujoStskeeps, hello there o/08:49
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* Stskeeps tries to locate a usb power strip09:00
Mordae[n900]I love weekends.09:09
lbtso Stskeeps can yo look at and approve
Stskeepslbt: so, i see BOSS doesn't interpret the RPM spec files09:12
Stskeeps(Version: thing)09:12
lbthave you seen the spec file?09:12
Stskeepsyes i have09:12
lbtto work it would have to run rpm on it - I'm interested in how we'd do that09:12
lbtmaybe that's the answer....09:13
lbtthey guys who wrote that check are ex-debian09:13
lbtno macros .... WYSIWYG09:13
lbtrpm is more .... ethereal09:14
Stskeepsmacros make life so much easer09:14
* Stskeeps goes check something on his exopc09:14
lbtI consdidered parsing the yaml ...   grep beta1 qt.yaml09:16
lbtso the yaml doesn't even mention the 'beta1'09:16
lbtgrep beta1 qt.spec09:16
lbt%define upstream_extra_version beta109:16
lbtthe spec has it in by magic09:16
lbtand the version is in a magical value that's not used in other spec files09:17
lbtso.... hmm09:17
smokulbt: and "rpm --showrc" is not scripting friendly ;-)09:18
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lbtsmoku: Ideally I'd like to run pre-check stuff without a full checkout09:19
lbtthe idea is simple sanity checks ... "did you add a changelog"09:19
lbtthings that RE should not need to do09:20
smokuosc does a lot of this magic with osc-validators09:20
lbtso ... you'd think ... "look in the spec file"... :)09:20
smokubut it has a working rpm and full checkout though09:20
lbtand can't be 'enforced'09:21
* lbt knows of a commercial place where the subcontract team just remove all the tests to make it build09:21
lbtthen ship to RE09:21
smokui guess it's easier to just bite the bullet and do it in minimal working env :/09:21
lbtthe yaml thing could address a lot of this09:22
lbtand so could policy09:22
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lbtlets be honest .. Debian actually did *some* things quite well :)09:22
lbtlike the changelog file being the master of certain data09:23
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lbtsmoku: ROFL :
lbtand Stskeeps ^^09:27
cxl000 Is there a way to see what packages Mer_Core_armvhl on COBS provides?09:27
Stskeepscxl000: osc ls Mer:fake:armv7hl09:27
Stskeepslbt: hah09:28
smokulbt: uechecheche09:28
smokuaw crap... osc copypac between two OBS instances is actually pulling stuff through my PC.   poor GPRS09:29
lbtsmoku: yeah09:30
lbtis there a remote link ?09:30
smokuStskeeps: you don't have link to COBS, right?09:30
lbta copypac from remote:PRJ pkg local:PRJ  is OK09:30
Stskeepscorrect, i don't09:30
smokuI will do it later then09:30
Stskeepslbt: so, does testing logic seem sane?09:31
lbtit seems like a significant change to what we do now09:31
lbtyou know I think the mastering in git is "the right way" - so I'm good with that09:32
Stskeepsit is, but it's also more in line with how the releases are structured in git now and the ability to follow mer change-by-change09:32
Stskeepsthere's a part i haven't written about how we check the changesets in the git repo that includes packages.xml09:33
lbtI feel like we're 99% to having some automation done and I don't want to change direction again without finishing it09:33
Stskeepssure, finish that in CE09:33
Stskeepsthat's fine with me, the Mer stuff can run semi-manually for a bit09:33
Stskeepsit's just to scope out what we need to do in order to have quality core :)09:34
Stskeepsand some of the stuff/checks from CE can be reused easily in this09:34
lbtthe mechanisms are new09:34
lbtwhat's a test?09:35
lbtbuild? boot?09:35
lbtmake image?09:35
Stskeepsvery good question too09:36
lbtespecially if HW gets involved09:36
lbtthen "what platforms must pass?"09:36
lbtwhat if 4/5 pass09:36
lbtso I kinda know the answers in the process around OBS09:36
Stskeepswell, there'll be a manual step for approving so we'll set up criteria - it's feedback to the contributor and the approver09:37
lbtand how do we handle the funnel effect?09:37
lbtwhere patches build up in a couple of upstreams and then finally come to 'trunk'09:38
Stskeepsand combined they break?09:38
Stskeepsthat's one of the steps i haven't made yet :)09:38
lbtor a place for a couple of dependent things to be integrated09:38
lbt"Team areas"09:38
lbtyeah - it's something I want to introduce conceptually without getting too bogged down in09:39
Stskeepsi basically would like simple testing to get working fairly soon, ie, localdep and single-build09:39
lbtthe main thing is so we don't get all "I never thought about threading"09:39
Stskeepsgerrit also has "depends on change" feature09:39
lbtI am thinking we should assume multiple gerrits09:40
Stskeepsi guess also possible09:40
lbtI have another suggestion ....09:41
lbtcan you help me nail CE09:41
Stskeepssure, what can i do?09:41
lbtand then we can both work on Mer?09:41
smokuStskeeps: how is meego snapshot linked in your OBS?09:41
lbtget all Sage's commits fixed09:41
Stskeepssmoku: fakeobs:Trunk09:41
Stskeepsmmkay, which is..?09:41
smokuStskeeps: thx09:41
lbtand fix/decide on the criteria like Version09:41
lbtsage wants home:sage09:42
lbtpromoted to CE:MW:Shared09:42
lbt2 down :)09:42
Stskeepsso, am i supposed to see some SR requests anywhere?09:43
Stskeepsfor review09:43
lbtwell, that one this morning09:43
Stskeepsright, approved that one09:44
lbtso that's just finished the trial build09:44
lbtthe 30m timeout was too short.... the process went into error/call admin09:44
lbtwhich is kinda cool09:44
lbtso I just said "oontinue process"09:45
Stskeepsi'll probably have to use the process too as i'll rebase N900/N950 hw adaptation for CE/Mer09:45
Stskeepswhich is my list tomorrow09:45
lbtand boss just promoted qt09:45
Stskeepsyeah, i get the mails09:46
lbtI *love* the whole "restart and manage process thing"09:46
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lbtimagine having all your scripts running in a gdb :)09:46
lbtit's kinda like that09:46
Stskeepshopefully better09:47
lbtpdb then :)09:47
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dm8tbr - still have to add it to a cron job and figure out how to make it process things to enable indexing etc09:59
Stskeepsadding to topic09:59
*** ChanServ sets mode: +o Stskeeps09:59
*** Stskeeps changes topic to "Mer is back! - - | Temporary location for wiki: | Contribution to packages: | Building against Mer in COBS: | This channel is logged,"10:00
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dm8tbrbugzilla module is loaded and waiting for bugs.pmc to activate10:00
dm8tbrand if we can get a full mail feed it will also do announcements of new bugs, state changes etc10:01
dm8tbrbtw: my mind just wandered a bit further. did I already ask if we care about security/vulnerabilities? or is that something the vendor needs to track if they productize and we just use 'close to upstream'?10:03
Stskeepswe care about security/vulnerabilities and if you have some thoughts on handling, write them up on wiki10:03
dm8tbr'not such a screw up like meego' - does that count?10:04
Stskeepsa little more elaborate10:04
Stskeepsperhapshow other distros handle it10:05
dm8tbrthey do have some scripts to import CVE which seemed like not a bad idea, but execution sucked10:06
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smokuwill we be signing Mer packages?10:21
smokusince dm8tbr mentioned security10:22
smokuif so, it needs defining who has access to the signing key and signing procedure10:23
Stskeepsthat's another funny issue - especially considering that Mer is fairly made for being-able-to-build-entire-stack yourself10:25
Stskeepsie, should the security be on the packages in git instead10:25
BostikStskeeps: I'd take the same approach every other distro does - security patches are indeed patches, and they are dropped as newer releases come along where the fixes are already in10:26
Stskeepsin practice, i think that each OBS that does a port will have own signing key, ie, just as an example, signing with "Mer armv7l port build, hosted by Nomovok"10:27
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dm8tbryay, found the right way to run log conversion. last step add to cron :)10:38
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Stskeepslbt:  -ish for single package build check11:19
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lbtit's feeling a bit like a rewrite of osc build11:30
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smokuStskeeps: so Mer is going to provide only git repo with .specs? no pre-built .rpms?12:07
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cxl000Stskeeps I get 404 Not Found for osc ls Mer:fake:armv7h12:12
Stskeepscxl000: Mer:fake:Core:armv7l12:12
Stskeepscxl000: Mer:fake:Core:armv7hl12:12
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* Stskeeps glances at yocto governance page13:04
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faenilgood sunday afternoon everyone! :)13:25
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Stskeepshttp:// <- some draft ideas - comments more than welcome14:38
Stskeepsthe idea is technically driven and that contribution creates influence14:39
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dm8tbrStskeeps: I wonder where Mer IT fits into this14:54
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Stskeepshmm, good question14:59
Stskeepswhere do you think it should be?14:59
dm8tbrI can't put my finger on it. at least not in the way of getting things done like certain RE15:01
dm8tbrJucato: there are a few things that need to be run, like OBS/fakeOBS, mailing lists, irc bots, ...15:03
dm8tbrBOSS instance15:03
Stskeepsdm8tbr: technically you can see it as a subproject15:03
dm8tbrOTS instance15:03
Stskeepsie, technical leaders, maintainers, contributors..15:03
Stskeepstechnically each of the functions like BOSS/etc would belong under different projects15:04
dm8tbrsubsubprojects? ;)15:04
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Jucatodm8tbr: more like wondering what the IT stands for. now I'm guessing "Infrastructure Team"?15:07
dm8tbryes you can read it that way ;)15:08
dm8tbr - now auto-updates every minute15:12
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Stskeepssmoku: no no, i'm not that crazy (no rpms)16:48
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Stskeepssmoku: just that it's not centrally built :)16:48
Stskeepsthat it can be either from official codelines (ie, published repos) or built in your own obs16:48
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Stskeepsafternoon vgrade17:01
vgradeStskeeps, hi17:02
Stskeepsit can't be true that programmable power strips are so expensive..17:04
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dm8tbrStskeeps: hm?17:07
Stskeepsdm8tbr: trying to find a way to control power plug through usb17:09
Stskeepsdm8tbr: ie, for netbook testing for instance17:09
Stskeepsideally one with a linux driver ;)17:09
Stskeepsrs232 is okay too17:10
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dm8tbrStskeeps: there is one, I'm looking for it. it used to be sold by european versions of 'dealextreme'17:10
* dm8tbr checks17:10
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dm8tbrStskeeps: 'Silvershield Power Manager Modell: SIS-PMS'17:12
dm8tbrrandom deal: - 30EUR17:13
Stskeepslooks quite good17:13
dm8tbrdouble-check though that it's the USB version before you buy it :)17:15
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dm8tbrbtw: the DIY version: printer port and 8 230V relays ;)17:15
Stskeepsyeah, i am not good with electronics :P17:16
dm8tbrand the deluxe version: look into RF remote controlled power sockets, there are linux interfaces to the transmitter17:16
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Stskeepshrm, is getting sold in a shop in my old uni city17:17
dm8tbrcheck that polish ebay thing ;)17:19
Stskeepsi think as a start we can do testing with vm's and perhaps get some n900's set up17:20
dm8tbrI also have BBc4 and an snowball17:21
Sagelbt: I think I can fix all of those MW:Shared packages tomorrow and probably some others as well.17:24
Stskeepsdm8tbr: hrm, so you flash the emmc or how does it work?17:26
Stskeepsdm8tbr: on snowball17:26
dm8tbrStskeeps: that's one of the options, need to check if you can usb-boot it too17:27
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lbtSage: I did qt - see the boss.conf file18:04
lbtStskeeps: I use a velleman usb controlled i/o board and 240v relays18:05
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lbtit doesn't class as 'electronics' ... more switches and wiring18:06
Sagelbt: the qt will be removed once we get the mer core updated. Just FYI :)18:15
Stskeepswhat's missing in the core one we have atm18:16
SageStskeeps: well, the core that we are building against is old AFAIK18:16
Sagei.e., my repos are not building against the fake thing18:16
Sagemy repos are compiling against Mer:Trunk:Base and AFAIK that is the old one18:17
StskeepsSage: ah18:17
StskeepsSage: makes sense18:17
StskeepsSage: i'll work on HW adaptation side for n900 tomorrow18:18
SageCE:Adaptation:N900 ?18:18
Stskeepsyeah, getting it to run on top of mer core18:19
Stskeepsbtw, there's a new qt 4.8 out18:19
Sageok, cool. I was wondering if we should put packages to CE:Adaptation that are common between the adaptations but are not in mer:core18:19
Sagebut not sure if we have any such packages though18:20
Stskeepsi think some of the stuff can reasonably go into core18:20
Stskeepslike newt18:20
Stskeepspossibly linux-firmware18:21
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Stskeepsor some kind of dummy for it, not sure why kernel needs firmware18:21
smokuany idea what provides xml-common in meego?18:32
Stskeepsi'd recommend to simply hack the packages and remove the deps on whatever needs docbook and such, tbh18:35
smokuthat was the first idea18:35
smokubut I would like a full gnome development env, and that needs gtk-doc support18:36
Stskeepsfair enough18:36
Stskeepssmoku: sgml-common18:37
smokuSage: how reliable is COBS?  maybe I could move my i586 adaptation effort and cordia UX there?  we could share the work then18:38
smokuStskeeps: thx18:38
Stskeepssmoku: lot more reliable after they ditched the link18:38
smokudo they keep a local snapshot to copy from?18:38
Stskeepsyes, check topic18:39
Stskeepsnot of build.meego.com18:39
Stskeepsbut of mer :P18:39
smokuStskeeps: and my concern is more in reliable as 'will not shut down tomorrow'18:39
smokumer is cool.  but I'm doing a lot of copypac from MeeGo:Trunk :)18:40
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smokuStskeeps: how did you find this sgml-common?  do you have a meego installation to query?18:46
Stskeeps"packagename" site:build.meego.com18:46
smokuyour google-fu is stronger tham mine :)18:47
Stskeepsi once had an idea i could do a phd by just being good at googling18:47
Stskeepsof course they wouldn't let me even try..18:47
Stskeepsso, here i am18:52
smokuthe package that provides 'scrollkeeper' dependency is called rarian18:52
Stskeepsyeah, that too..18:52
smokuit's a replacement for scrollkeeper18:52
Stskeepsthe gnome stack is really fucked at some points18:52
smokui wonder, whether they called it 'rarian' to have :)18:52
smokucute :)18:53
smokuStskeeps: your obs is freakin' fast :D18:58
smokuhow much of RAM do you have there?19:00
Stskeepsi run 4 workers with that19:01
Stskeepsi could probably do a lot more with 24g19:03
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smokuStskeeps: have you considered building arm* using linaro compiler?20:11
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jrayhawkStskeeps: Would you be interested in a vserver on a severely underutilized dual E5260 system with 24GB of RAM, and, if so, what distribution would you want on it and how much disk space?20:33
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jrayhawkerrr Dual E5620 system20:34
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cxl000Stskeeps: linux-firmware probaling included to allow compiling bits in. I removed it as a build dep ok.21:13
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jrayhawkI assume you'd want reliable storage for build products and source packages, and several gigabytes worth of tmpfs for unpacking and building? I'm not all that familiar with typical OBS setups.21:43
ali1234pretty much21:54
ali1234OBS uses build inside chroot or VM21:55
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lbtactually you don't need reliable storage or persistence - you need raw speed.22:08
lbtYou also need trust - a distributed/contributed build environment is very untrustworthy22:08
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berndhsyou might also want a commitment to uptime > 5 days a week :)22:11
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berndhsonly 154M, nice23:46
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ali1234smoku: is that x86?23:50
ali1234oh nvm, derp23:50
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