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| Stskeeps | morn rigo | 06:19 |
|---|---|---|
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| rigo | moin Stskeeps o/ | 06:25 |
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| rigo | the self-healing forces of my jollaC are astonishing | 06:31 |
| rigo | I complained about bluetooth yesterday, even found a bug. Now listening to music over the headset that had problems and it just works flawlessly | 06:32 |
| Stskeeps | it's a bit more fragile than jolla1 physically though; wife already smashed her screen | 06:32 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 06:32 |
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| Tegu | more fragile & no warranty sounds like a great combination. at least for a primary phone. if you have more, i guess it matters less | 06:38 |
| Stskeeps | i'm still on edge if i'd return to jolla1 w/ a 4.4 android runtime and ext4+lvm instead of brtfs | 06:39 |
| Stskeeps | btrfs | 06:39 |
| Yaniel | abranson_: I did, but still the same. A couple of days later and it seems to have quieted down though | 06:40 |
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| abranson_ | Yaniel: you can check which files it has open with lsof. do you have a lot of flacs? mine seems to have left the flacs open. | 06:45 |
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| PaulePanter | Hi. Since the last update, the Jolla doesn’t receive any calls I get. I only get a text message afterward that somebody tried to call me. | 06:49 |
| PaulePanter | Restarting the phone sometimes helps. | 06:49 |
| PaulePanter | By the way, is anybody in here at Embedded Linux Conference Europe in Berlin? | 06:50 |
| Yaniel | abranson_: 1520 flacs, 326 mp3s | 06:50 |
| Yaniel | so yes, whenever flac parsing has issues, my jolla is screwed | 06:51 |
| abranson_ | Yaniel: you're a FLAC canary ;) | 06:51 |
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| abranson_ | i'll have a look at the flac parser to see if there's anything hanging | 06:52 |
| Yaniel | and currently so dead :P | 06:52 |
| abranson_ | i see a few mp4s too, but not every one. | 06:52 |
| Yaniel | what am I saying, always been | 06:52 |
| Yaniel | flac parsing has been broken in one way or another since 1.0.2.5 or whatever the first update was (I didn't get to try with the factory version) | 06:53 |
| abranson_ | what happened was the mime type for flacs got changed from audio/x-flac to audio/flac, but tracker's rules only gave x-flac to the built in parser. it was relying on libav, which didn't work well | 06:54 |
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| abranson_ | i fixed that, but that meant we were using an extractor that hadn't been used in a long time. i fixed the artist/album tag parsing (really silly substring matching error), but as you can see there are other side effects to bringing dead code to life. | 06:55 |
| Yaniel | I mean most of the times I tried, extractor would just segfault after a few files | 06:58 |
| Yaniel | And I've never seen the cover.png for any flac album :( | 06:59 |
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| abranson_ | no there's no cover extraction in the flac extractor. | 07:01 |
| abranson_ | you're not a dev by any chance are you? tracker's quite easy to build | 07:02 |
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| Yaniel | I might even have the sailfish sdk up and running | 07:10 |
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| mornfall | did anyone bother to unfuxxor the dependencies on -devel packages on jolla1? | 07:17 |
| mornfall | of* | 07:17 |
| Stskeeps | don't install -devel packages on device unless you want serious hurt | 07:17 |
| Stskeeps | just make a arm chroot | 07:17 |
| mornfall | that's stupid, arm chroot of what? | 07:18 |
| mornfall | another copy of sfos? | 07:18 |
| Stskeeps | it's not stupid given hw adaptation architecture | 07:19 |
| Stskeeps | basically arm chroot w/ compilers, devel headers, etc | 07:19 |
| Stskeeps | easily throwawayable too | 07:20 |
| Stskeeps | a sdk on device | 07:20 |
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| mornfall | Stskeeps: pain, pain, pain... on any other linux, I can just apt-get/yum/whatever the compiler/devel packages and build stuff | 07:26 |
| * mornfall puts updating his app back on the end of todo | 07:27 | |
| Stskeeps | mornfall: those linuxes aren't running on low battery devices | 07:28 |
| Tegu | you mean a chroot an the device or a chroot on another machine? | 07:31 |
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| Stskeeps | on the device | 07:34 |
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| Tofe | Stskeeps: I don't understand how a chroot on device can be more low-battery-device friendly than a plain compilation | 07:34 |
| abranson_ | Yaniel: https://git.merproject.org/mer-core/tracker | 07:35 |
| Tofe | I understand the "cleaner" argument | 07:35 |
| abranson_ | think i've found the flac fd leak too | 07:35 |
| Stskeeps | Tofe: the thing is that for a sane consumer experience you want to be able to upgrade + be able to replace on-device with hw adaptation bits - but apps should always build against mesa headers, for example | 07:35 |
| mornfall | Stskeeps: how is that even related to battery? | 07:35 |
| Stskeeps | not the particularities of a certain hw adaptation's .so files | 07:36 |
| Stskeeps | doesn't make sense that when you upgrade your device all hell breaks loose, either | 07:36 |
| Tofe | ok, so it's more separated and cleaner, that point makes more sense to me | 07:36 |
| mornfall | Stskeeps: that's just because the adaptation is bungled, I guess... why would you change headers for the adaptation? | 07:36 |
| Stskeeps | mornfall: that just happens in many cases, some implementations has custom EGL/GLES headers, others other android headers, etc | 07:37 |
| Stskeeps | you'll want to compile against a clean generic sysroot, always | 07:37 |
| mornfall | Stskeeps: if those headers aren't binary-equivalent, it's not going to work anyway | 07:37 |
| Stskeeps | we saw some pretty nasty problems back in meego for people building against device file systems | 07:38 |
| Stskeeps | anyway, there's the rationale, do what you want withi t | 07:38 |
| Stskeeps | just trying to prevent devices becoming unbootable by advising to use a clean chroot for development | 07:38 |
| Tofe | Even cleaner would be a desktop cross-compile chroot :) | 07:40 |
| Stskeeps | which is what the mer sdk essentially is + sb2 | 07:40 |
| mornfall | Tofe: "cleaner" | 07:40 |
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| Tofe | mornfall: "Don't risk to break the device" | 07:41 |
| mornfall | Tofe: sounds like a very damn fragile device, doesn't it? | 07:41 |
| mornfall | oh, I remember, btrfs / | 07:41 |
| Stskeeps | distribution jenga | 07:41 |
| Stskeeps | and btrfs should die | 07:41 |
| mornfall | so yeah, touching it the wrong way -> brick | 07:42 |
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| abranson_ | all mobile devices are fragile. you're just not usually allowed enough control over them to be able to break them. | 07:44 |
| Stskeeps | yeah, touch android the wrong way and it suddenly claims you're donald trump | 07:45 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 07:45 |
| abranson_ | Yaniel: fixed and pushed to git. I'm not sure how quickly it'll be released though. Will ask. | 07:46 |
| Yaniel | Yay | 07:46 |
| Yaniel | That leaves only cover art | 07:47 |
| Yaniel | Which is a bit of a surprise that it doesn't work tbh | 07:48 |
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| abranson_ | Yaniel: yeah. denexter added it for vorbis three years ago... | 07:50 |
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| abranson_ | i guess flac is more fringe than we think it is. strange - it's the obvious format for me if you've got a big sd card. | 07:51 |
| Yaniel | Does that handle per-file overrides? | 07:51 |
| abranson_ | just extracts from the metadata | 07:51 |
| Yaniel | If some files have embedded artwork and the album still has a cover.png | 07:51 |
| Yaniel | I have one case where I have cover.png and some files have a different image embedded | 07:52 |
| abranson_ | i haven't been near the cover.png handling yet i'm afraid | 07:52 |
| abranson_ | i thought that might be handled more generically - not in the individual extractors | 07:53 |
| Yaniel | http://jacoblincke.bandcamp.com/album/cloudbuilt-complete-original-soundtrack fwiw | 07:53 |
| Yaniel | The latter half has different art and one even has a unique image | 07:54 |
| mornfall | abranson_: everyone sucks => it's fine we suck, not a good mentality | 07:54 |
| abranson_ | mornfall: nothing to do with 'we'. 'we' don't make our own SoCs and flakey kernels to go with them, and we're not likely to be able to any time soon. | 07:56 |
| abranson_ | so we have to live with what we can use | 07:56 |
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| r0kk3rz | i do wonder how sony gets away with the whole flashable image thing | 07:58 |
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| Irah | Anyone here has fiddled with the Jolla tablet? More specifically the "random shutdown"-bug? | 10:17 |
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| ggabriel | I have a jolla tablet | 10:23 |
| ggabriel | but I haven't had that bug just yet | 10:23 |
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| ggabriel | it did randomly reboot at times, but very rarely | 10:23 |
| ggabriel | the jolla1 did the same thing fwiw | 10:23 |
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| r0kk3rz | likely for different reasons though | 10:24 |
| Irah | Last time I tried to solve this was like half an year ago. My tablet has just stood on the shelf after that because it "shuts down" every time it tries to enter the deep sleep mode, and I have waited for an update to fix that. | 10:25 |
| Irah | And it does not actually shut down, it jams when entering the sleep mode and then it needs to be force-shut down by first pressing the power button for +10s. | 10:26 |
| ggabriel | maybe something triggers it, but never bothered me as much to find out | 10:27 |
| Irah | Mine does it every time left unattended for | 10:27 |
| Irah | ~20mins. | 10:27 |
| Irah | Might be even less than that. | 10:27 |
| ggabriel | found anything in the logs? | 10:27 |
| ggabriel | tried switching android off too? | 10:28 |
| Irah | Yeah, tried after every update, "full reset". | 10:28 |
| ggabriel | and logs? | 10:28 |
| Irah | I forced it to spam dmesg to a file, and the last thing I can see is some powersaving stuff. | 10:29 |
| Irah | Most logs get lost because of the forced poweroff. | 10:29 |
| ggabriel | spam dmesg to a file? did you try making journald to write to file? | 10:29 |
| r0kk3rz | Irah: there is a way to get the logs to persist | 10:29 |
| Irah | Still, the last thing is the info that the device is trying to enter the deep sleep mode. | 10:30 |
| r0kk3rz | 'coma mode' | 10:30 |
| Irah | I can redo the logs, but it will take a while. | 10:32 |
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| r0kk3rz | Irah: is there a tjc about this? maybe give that a prod | 10:33 |
| r0kk3rz | the adaptations team would've been busy with turing and intex before now | 10:33 |
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| Irah | Gah. I am sure there was a "tread" on together.jolla.com a while ago, but I am having a hard time finding it now... Can't remember my original search terms. :D | 10:36 |
| Irah | Here: https://together.jolla.com/question/129081/bug-jolla-tablet-randomly-shuts-down/ | 10:37 |
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| abranson_ | Irah: yes I get that. I really have to leave it on the charger all the time, or it'll be blank and unresponsive when I return. | 10:47 |
| Irah | It's really annoying because it kind of defeats the purpose of a 'mobile device' :-; | 10:47 |
| Irah | It can still be "resurrected" by just doing 15s press of powerbutton and then 5s press, but only if the thing still has battery left. :D | 10:48 |
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| r0kk3rz | larstiq: whats the changes of jolla working on a tablet specific bug ? | 10:52 |
| r0kk3rz | *chances | 10:52 |
| Irah | -5% | 10:53 |
| Irah | That's why I wanted to prod the community. | 10:53 |
| r0kk3rz | Irah: the problem is so few of us actually got one | 10:54 |
| Irah | I know. :D | 10:54 |
| Irah | But 'a few' is not 0 | 10:55 |
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| Irah | And people owning Jolla devices tend to be more tech-savvy people, so chances that someone would have encountered the same bug and found a solution is not 0. | 10:57 |
| Irah | If no one has solved it, then I guess I need to try and solve it myself. I just hate solving already solved problems. | 10:59 |
| r0kk3rz | yeah, and prodding for more info from jolla might be worth while | 11:01 |
| r0kk3rz | Stskeeps has probably purged all memory of the jtab | 11:02 |
| Stskeeps | r0kk3rz: what's a jtab? | 11:02 |
| tigeli | Stskeeps: jolla tablet? | 11:07 |
| * Stskeeps shakes head | 11:07 | |
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| tigeli | ;) | 11:08 |
| Jope | doesn't ring any bells | 11:08 |
| r0kk3rz | yeah i bet sailfish would be really nice on a tablet, someone should look into that | 11:09 |
| Stskeeps | i hear sony tablets has some ports | 11:11 |
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| pp_ | Oh right, I should upgrade my tablet to 2.0.4 | 11:15 |
| pp_ | where did I put it... | 11:15 |
| pp_ | it's always out of battery | 11:17 |
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| larstiq | r0kk3rz: company resources? Not likely. Better chances of convincing an individual developer. | 12:06 |
| r0kk3rz | yeah i guess the ROI just isn't there, shame really | 12:09 |
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| Pawky|2 | I really like my good old Nokia N9.... is it possible to install Sailfish on it and get a fully working phone (including alien dalvik)? | 17:23 |
| phlixi_o | i am sure its not possible leagaly, because alien dalvik only runs (legaly) on devices you bought with it | 17:24 |
| Yaniel | No | 17:24 |
| phlixi_o | thus alien alvic only (legaly) avail on jp1301, jolla c and aquafish, end of story | 17:24 |
| phlixi_o | however, if you dont need alien dalvic, its another story | 17:24 |
| phlixi_o | if you need android apps (without alien dalvic), there is, what was it called, sfdroid? | 17:27 |
| phlixi_o | but on n9, dont thinks its avail... | 17:28 |
| klopsi-u3 | live spoken-voice language translation is becoming a killer-app for mobiles | 17:29 |
| klopsi-u3 | for people who travel at least | 17:29 |
| phlixi_o | gn8 | 17:29 |
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| Eyea | )0!1@ | 18:49 |
| Eyea | )0h | 18:49 |
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| Pawky|2 | klopsi-u3: Until they realise its used by agencies for voice fingerprinting.... | 21:11 |
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| klopsi-u3 | Pawky|2: yeah well any hackable networked device with a microphone is insecure | 21:12 |
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| Pawky|2 | but this is centralised... which makes it even easier | 21:13 |
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| klopsi-u3 | yeah. telegraph.co.uk said the voice translation worked offline - is that true? | 21:13 |
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| klopsi-u3 | you could get a phone with maps and translation and leave the sim out | 21:13 |
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| Pawky|2 | klopsi-u3: I doubt it... voice recognition and translation needs quite some computer power... and if there's one thing you want is to save battery when having a phone | 21:15 |
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| klopsi-u3 | Jul 12, 2013 - Google did quietly enable offline recognition | 21:16 |
| Pawky|2 | klopsi-u3: on? | 21:16 |
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| klopsi-u3 | android | 21:16 |
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| Pawky|2 | ... | 21:16 |
| klopsi-u3 | but not for all languages in the world | 21:16 |
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| klopsi-u3 | i haven't found another site that confirms android voice translation works offline | 21:17 |
| Pawky|2 | as of my knowledge, it doesnt... | 21:17 |
| klopsi-u3 | also another site claims the offline voice recognition is 'new in 2016' | 21:18 |
| Pawky|2 | You cant really say google promotes off line usage of anything... | 21:18 |
| klopsi-u3 | correect | 21:18 |
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| klopsi-u3 | and yet they appear to have done it | 21:19 |
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| Pawky|2 | I loved Samsung Warning notes for people buying their voice controlled TVs... | 21:19 |
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| klopsi-u3 | yeah i bought my tvs before they implemented that | 21:20 |
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| klopsi-u3 | but this world is fallen Pawky|2 | 21:20 |
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| Pawky|2 | They took away the warnings once it got attention though.. | 21:20 |
| klopsi-u3 | a dark cloud hangs over all | 21:20 |
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| Pawky|2 | Well I believe the STASI people must laugh and cry in their graves.. they spent a ton of money and time and sweat on trying to spy on people... where they where, what they thought, what they read and who they knew.... | 21:21 |
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| Pawky|2 | and then came internet... and facebook... and google.. | 21:22 |
| Pawky|2 | They probably tear their hairs and eat their hats.. | 21:22 |
| Pawky|2 | or boots. | 21:22 |
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| Pawky|2 | NSA laughs though.. they don't even have to do the dirty work | 21:23 |
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| klopsi-u3 | Correct Pawky|2 | 21:23 |
| Pawky|2 | I just think its funny.. | 21:24 |
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| klopsi-u3 | Maybe we are living in the last decades of relative freedom | 21:26 |
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