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| coderus | Locksreen player controls patch v006. Fixed some bugs, added playback progress. https://openrepos.net/content/coderus/patch-lockscreen-mediaplayer-controls | 01:39 |
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| mkpaa | Has someone succesfully used exfat formatted microsd card with Jolla? | 03:58 |
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| Nicd- | anyone exported their jolla contacts to OS X's address book? | 07:15 |
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| Nicd- | since my jolla hasn't synced its contacts to google in over 6 months, I should do a manual sync | 07:15 |
| Nicd- | but dunno what the options are | 07:15 |
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| tbr | I think there are some tjc items on that topic | 07:18 |
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| temmi_moo | what about hosting ones own sync server? | 07:19 |
| Nicd- | I don't have an owncloud set up yet. also I don't know if it would work because google contact sync doesn't work either | 07:19 |
| temmi_moo | google might alter their api to keep third parties forcefully on the move? | 07:21 |
| Nicd- | I really don't think it's broken for *everyone*. that would be bigger news | 07:21 |
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| Nicd- | how do I manually trigger the contact sync? I can check the logs | 07:22 |
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| temmi_moo | it would not be broken for android users or anybody using other g*apps | 07:24 |
| Nicd- | yeah, but all jolla users | 07:24 |
| Nicd- | and I figure I would've read about that here | 07:25 |
| temmi_moo | is broken for me too | 07:25 |
| temmi_moo | also, when entering new calendar entries, they don't show up on the calendar and supposedly are not synced anywhere either | 07:26 |
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| Nicd- | my calendar sync works to google | 07:28 |
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| temmi_moo | my calendar doesn't even show up entries i just wrote to it | 07:31 |
| chriadam | temmi_moo: some fixes to Google Calendar synchronization were made recently. | 07:31 |
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| chriadam | the fixes won't make it into the upcoming update (they came too late, would destabilise) but will the one after. | 07:31 |
| temmi_moo | i'm mostly using jolla as a phone that allows me to surf and occasionally play othello | 07:31 |
| chriadam | if you are feeling brave, you can build the updated packages yourself, of course. | 07:31 |
| temmi_moo | also access point for the laptop, a very important function | 07:32 |
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| Nicd- | hmh, I can't even get the error messages I used to get from the contact sync | 07:32 |
| chriadam | Nicd-: same goes for Google Contacts - a bunch of fixes recently. Similarly, a bunch of fixes to the carddav and caldav plugins, so that owncloud should be supported much better too. (again, not for the upcoming update, but for the next) | 07:32 |
| chriadam | Nicd-: use a separate terminal, `devel-su journalctl -af | grep google-con` | 07:33 |
| chriadam | after `SOCIALD_LOGGING_LEVEL=3 devel-su -p msyncd` in your other one. | 07:33 |
| Nicd- | ok | 07:33 |
| chriadam | but yeah, a lot of issues have been fixed recently. see the commits since Jan 9th in https://github.com/nemomobile/buteo-sync-plugins-social/commits/master | 07:34 |
| Nicd- | [C] Buteo::Synchronizer::initialize:105 - Failed to register to D-Bus (D-Bus not started or msyncd already running?), aborting start | 07:35 |
| Nicd- | do I have to kill it first? | 07:35 |
| chriadam | systemctl --user stop msyncd | 07:35 |
| chriadam | in nemo terminal | 07:35 |
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| Nicd- | nothing is happening | 07:39 |
| Nicd- | htop is saying msyncd is just sleeping with no activity. maybe it's downloading something big? | 07:39 |
| temmi_moo | is owncloud some specific thing or just a nice name for whatever one happens to run? | 07:39 |
| Nicd- | temmi_moo: https://owncloud.org/ | 07:40 |
| chriadam | Nicd-: err.. I forgot something: | 07:41 |
| chriadam | `MSYNCD_LOGGING_LEVEL=8 SOCIALD_LOGGING_LEVEL=3 devel-su -p msyncd` | 07:42 |
| Nicd- | ok | 07:42 |
| chriadam | then trigger sync. you should see the `devel-su journalctl -af | grep google-con` terminal scroll like crazy once you trigger a google sync, then. | 07:42 |
| chriadam | (assuming that you have the appropriate sync profiles etc... if not, that's a separate bug altogether) | 07:43 |
| Nicd- | ok, lemme test | 07:43 |
| Nicd- | now I'm seeing what I used to see | 07:44 |
| temmi_moo | i gotta say this looks very SYSVish to me | 07:44 |
| Nicd- | gisting | 07:44 |
| Nicd- | chriadam: https://gist.github.com/Nicd/96f004461f05f63c9171 | 07:45 |
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| chriadam | ok, that's scary | 07:48 |
| chriadam | actually similar to another bug report I received a little while ago :-/ we investigated but not sure how the DetailId could be zero. | 07:48 |
| chriadam | the "resource temporarily unavailable" issue is... even scarier | 07:49 |
| chriadam | I will ask mvogt if he has any idea... | 07:49 |
| Nicd- | I remember that invalid detail type has been the error since the start, when my contacts stopped syncing | 07:49 |
| Nicd- | guess I should just clear my contacts db but I already have changes there that I don't want to lose | 07:50 |
| chriadam | hmm. did that happen after doing an upgrade? | 07:50 |
| urs | is it possible that in the android compatibility layer, the on-screen keyboard for entering numbers is missing the 0? | 07:50 |
| Nicd- | I don't remember, it was around last summer | 07:50 |
| chriadam | by the way, you can export your contacts to vCard using the vcardconverter tool from https://github.com/nemomobile/nemo-qml-plugin-contacts/tree/master/tools/vcardconverter | 07:50 |
| urs | ah, in landscape mode its there, but in portrait mode, the 0 is missing for me | 07:51 |
| chriadam | if you need a backup | 07:51 |
| chriadam | Nicd-: when's last summer? July 2014? | 07:51 |
| Nicd- | I don't remember exactly. is there a way to find out the last successful sync? | 07:51 |
| chriadam | the /home/nemo/.local/share/system/Privileged/Sync/sync.db should have a timestamp in it | 07:52 |
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| Nicd- | you mean: -rw-r--r-- 1 nemo privileged 3072 2015-01-28 22:25 sociald-sync.db ? | 07:53 |
| chriadam | devel-su -p sqlite3 /home/nemo/.local/share/system/Privileged/Sync/sync.db; then do: ` .tables` to see the tables, `.schema some_table` to see the fields, then can select on it | 07:53 |
| chriadam | ah yes | 07:53 |
| chriadam | that one | 07:53 |
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| Nicd- | the syncTimestamps table only has timestamps from today and yesterday so no help | 07:55 |
| chriadam | :-/ | 07:55 |
| Nicd- | so... do I just say vcardconverter -e file and it will put my contacts there? | 07:58 |
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| Nicd- | if I can import them to google, I can try just deleting the whole account and starting from scratch | 07:58 |
| chriadam | should work | 07:58 |
| chriadam | delete the account and rm -rf both of the contacts dbs - the Privileged one and the non privileged one (under ~/.local/share/system/Contacts/) | 07:59 |
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| chriadam | but yeah, make sure the vcard has all of your contacts first | 07:59 |
| chriadam | just in case... | 07:59 |
| Nicd- | hmm, it only backed up the changes I have made | 08:00 |
| Nicd- | so like 10-20 contacts | 08:00 |
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| Nicd- | I'll try merging them to my google contacts | 08:00 |
| temmi_moo | many tools to import/merge from vcards? | 08:00 |
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| chriadam | google contacts' web application is pretty great. does duplicate detection and merge support etc pretty well, afair. | 08:01 |
| Nicd- | fuu, fire alarm | 08:01 |
| Nicd- | gotta go | 08:01 |
| chriadam | \o | 08:01 |
| temmi_moo | o/ | 08:01 |
| Nicd- | oh, it was a test | 08:02 |
| chriadam | phew | 08:02 |
| Nicd- | it did break my äöå | 08:03 |
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| TemeV | Nicd-: you had some alarm test too? So it is some common Hermia thing | 08:09 |
| temmi_moo | say hi to raymond | 08:09 |
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| Nicd- | TemeV: yes, just now | 08:10 |
| Nicd- | chriadam: seems everything went better than expected. I'll try to recreate my account on the phone now | 08:10 |
| chriadam | good luck, fingers' crossed | 08:10 |
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| chriadam | note that most of the bugs fixed in the google-contacts adapter were related to upsync... downsync should be ok. | 08:11 |
| chriadam | google calendar the fixes were related to the way we parsed recurrence rules and dates, and exception dates, IIRC. | 08:12 |
| TemeV | Nicd-: We had here in the next building just about the same time | 08:13 |
| Nicd- | chriadam: should I delete the account first before moving those contact dbs? | 08:13 |
| chriadam | yes | 08:13 |
| chriadam | ideally, after rming the contact dbs, you should then reboot the device. | 08:14 |
| chriadam | because a few different things might be holding handles to the old file open | 08:14 |
| chriadam | contactsd/commhistoryd/msyncd/jolla-contacts/jolla-calendar/lipstick/... ... | 08:14 |
| Nicd- | ok | 08:14 |
| gabriel9|work | morning | 08:17 |
| gabriel9|work | does anyone knows what fonts are used in jolla? | 08:18 |
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| Nicd- | gabriel9|work: Droid Sans | 08:18 |
| Nicd- | http://forum.jollausers.com/sailfish-news/default-font/msg6421/?PHPSESSID=gu8vs0qtcosrj1kk8lj2tjt181#msg6421 | 08:19 |
| Nicd- | and Roboto and some others | 08:19 |
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| gabriel9|work | thanks Nicd | 08:19 |
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| Nicd- | chriadam: is the privileged one ~/.local/share/system/privileged/Contacts/qtcontacts-sqlite/contacts.db? | 08:23 |
| chriadam | yes | 08:23 |
| Nicd- | or should I rm everything under Contacts? | 08:23 |
| chriadam | rm everything under Contacts is what I do | 08:23 |
| chriadam | there are sqlite write-ahead logging files and other things which need ot be removed also | 08:23 |
| Nicd- | hm, I have an fb account with contacts too. I'll just delete and readd that as well | 08:24 |
| Nicd- | other accounts don't have contact sync on, so I don't have to worry about them? | 08:25 |
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| chriadam | Nicd-: can just retrigger sync with the FB one, it should just resync from scratch. | 08:28 |
| chriadam | and yeah, the other ones shouldn't matter at all. | 08:28 |
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| Nicd- | well, I removed the FB one already | 08:29 |
| Nicd- | no problem recreating it | 08:29 |
| chriadam | cool | 08:29 |
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| Nicd- | chriadam: well the sync did work... once, it seems | 08:52 |
| Nicd- | I'll test more later | 08:52 |
| chriadam | thanks | 08:52 |
| Nicd- | also now I have all calendars as duplicates | 08:52 |
| Nicd- | :D | 08:52 |
| chriadam | urgh | 08:52 |
| Nicd- | didn't remove them before recreating account | 08:52 |
| chriadam | shouldn't need to... | 08:53 |
| chriadam | should be removed automatically by the sync adapter :-/ | 08:53 |
| chriadam | but sounds like a nother bug in my code somewhere | 08:53 |
| chriadam | thanks, I'll hunt for it tomorrow if I get a chance | 08:53 |
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| Nicd- | chriadam|away: tammi 29 11:26:29 Jolla google-contacts-client[5053]: [W] enforceDetailConstraints:2545 - "Invalid detail type: 0" | 09:26 |
| Nicd- | still :( | 09:26 |
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| Nicd- | maybe I have some strange contact in google that messes up the sailfish sync | 09:28 |
| Nicd- | also it says "Google contact sync with account 11 got remote changes: a/m: 364 r: 0.", even though I only modified a couple of contacts (removed a few and added one) | 09:29 |
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| faenil | thp, hey, calm down! you're on a PR spree this morning! :D | 10:37 |
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| SK_work | faenil: PR cleanup | 11:06 |
| SK_work | :) | 11:06 |
| faenil | yep | 11:06 |
| faenil | someone had to do it :) | 11:06 |
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| HtheB | cybette: ping | 13:10 |
| cybette | HtheB: pong | 13:11 |
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| pp_ | fg | 13:18 |
| pp_ | err | 13:18 |
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| Sail0r | is the android layer on the table, too? | 14:24 |
| dr_gogeta86 | ? | 14:24 |
| Sail0r | ah ok it has | 14:24 |
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| Sail0r | wondered if it is possible to run android apps on the jolla tablet, too | 14:25 |
| Sail0r | maybe I should buy one | 14:25 |
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| fennekki | presumably, seeing as Android works on x86 too... as long as Alien has x86 builds | 14:27 |
| Sail0r | because I need tapatalk on my tablet ;) | 14:28 |
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| SK_work | fennekki: what do I wonder is how will android apps built via the ndk work on a x86 tablet | 14:29 |
| SK_work | especially the jolla tablet | 14:29 |
| Stskeeps | magic. | 14:29 |
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| dr_gogeta86 | Stskeeps, i' was more interested on 6500 mAh battery | 14:29 |
| tadzik | are there no x86 android tablets? | 14:29 |
| dr_gogeta86 | there are many | 14:30 |
| Stskeeps | meanwhile https://twitter.com/JollaHQ/status/560804800569159680 | 14:30 |
| cvp_ | its really a good deal with 32 to 64gb Upgrade? 25$ for 32gb more space? in Germany cost over amazon a 64gb microsd card 27-30 | 14:30 |
| tadzik | :o | 14:30 |
| dr_gogeta86 | Stskeeps, how much did you stressed efi | 14:30 |
| dr_gogeta86 | ? | 14:30 |
| SK_work | cvp_: you can have 64 gb + 64 gb with this setup | 14:30 |
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| dr_gogeta86 | a friend of mine almost trashed a tablet to run ubuntu | 14:31 |
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| fennekki | SK_work: if there's an x86 build it will work | 14:32 |
| cvp_ | SK_work, i think the tablet support up to 128gb microsd ? | 14:32 |
| fennekki | if there isn't, well, it won't | 14:32 |
| Scelt | cvp_: in iPhones it costs 100 euros to updates 16->64 GB | 14:38 |
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| dr_gogeta86 | Stskeeps, is something like this inside | 14:49 |
| dr_gogeta86 | http://ao2.it/it/blog/2014/11/21/teclast-x98-air-3g-cheap-intel-bay-trail-tablet-getting-acquainted | 14:49 |
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| chem|st | cvp_: SK_work yes 128GB µSD + 64GB internal | 14:53 |
| SK_work | :) | 14:53 |
| cvp_ | i dont know why, but i upgrade now :D | 14:53 |
| chem|st | even before the upgrade it outperformed apples 128gb internal | 14:54 |
| cvp_ | but i mean its better to have external memory as internal... | 14:54 |
| chem|st | 64gb internal means for me that I can finally use sdcards to actually have removeable storage instead of an extension to my internal storage | 14:55 |
| Scelt | Stskeeps: well done, son | 14:55 |
| cvp_ | so... than comes 3G Upgrade for 30$ ... LTE upgrade for 30$.... Amoled Display wit LPS Upgrade for 50$..... and we have a price same like a ipad :P | 14:55 |
| chem|st | cvp_: I do not need external if internal is big enough... | 14:55 |
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| chem|st | cvp_: I guess the hardware is now finalized... just before chinese new year holidays | 14:56 |
| chem|st | so they save two weeks of the lead time effectively | 14:57 |
| cvp_ | i just kidding :) | 14:57 |
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| cvp_ | but the missing status led is bad :( | 14:57 |
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| chem|st | 10 people where still in need for shipping perks^^ | 14:58 |
| chem|st | were | 14:58 |
| chem|st | cvp_: ? no status led? | 14:58 |
| cvp_ | or is it includid ? | 15:00 |
| cvp_ | RGB LED | 15:00 |
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| chem|st | cvp_: OT: are you any good with ARM flashing? | 15:15 |
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| cvp_ | chem|st, hm, what you mean exactly ? | 15:18 |
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| chem|st | cvp_: I have an nuvoton chip mini51 series and I do not get it working with my stlinkV2 (says SWD transport not supported) | 15:28 |
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| chem|st | I took it you do hardware stuff right? | 15:28 |
| chem|st | if not ignore me please :) | 15:28 |
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| cvp_ | chem|st, sorry my friend :) i think i cant help you with it :) | 15:39 |
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| andybranson | So there's no exfat on the tablet, and >64GB cards 'won't be accessible from windows'. Which filesystems are available? Can we has UDF plz??? | 15:39 |
| tadzik | "We have decided to move forward with using an open source file system (ext2/3/4) for the memory card." | 15:40 |
| tadzik | (from https://together.jolla.com/question/78734/official-announcement-jolla-tablet-returns-to-indiegogo-with-updated-tech-specs/) | 15:41 |
| andybranson | thanks | 15:42 |
| Scelt | for me it is a kind of a surprise how much people use sd cards | 15:42 |
| Scelt | I only use them if they are the only solution, like in digital cameras | 15:43 |
| ryukafalz | They're useful since you can move them between devices | 15:43 |
| Scelt | "only" | 15:43 |
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| andybranson | if you want to load your tablet up with movies, it's very handy to be able to move the sd card to a pc for the copy | 15:44 |
| Scelt | I guess I just haven't had enough data in my mobile phone to use SD cards | 15:44 |
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| * ryukafalz nods | 15:44 | |
| ryukafalz | tablets are a bit different though, you tend to load them up with media | 15:44 |
| Scelt | I believe that | 15:44 |
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| ryukafalz | I'm gonna love that high-res screen :D | 15:45 |
| andybranson | you can format cards larger than 32GB with a FAT32 fs anyway - the windows tool just refuses to do it | 15:46 |
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| mkpaa | is there any experimental exfat support available for the fs / sd cards? all my camera memory cards are in that format and it'd be very nice to access them from phone. :) | 15:47 |
| Scelt | why can't you format that sd card to UDF? | 15:47 |
| Scelt | I thought it was universal and works for win, mac and linux | 15:47 |
| mkpaa | I doubt Olympus and GoPro cameras play nice with it. | 15:48 |
| Scelt | I meant generally | 15:48 |
| Scelt | do you really have to use extN | 15:48 |
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| cvp_ | what is exactly mean with laminated display ? | 15:50 |
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| andybranson | maybe camera won't like UDF, but having an open FS that's accessible by win/mac/linux would be wonderful | 15:52 |
| chem|st | cvp_: one piece | 15:53 |
| andybranson | stskeeps: any chance of throwing the udf module in the kernel, just for fun? | 15:54 |
| Stskeeps | everything's possible | 15:54 |
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| andybranson | :D | 15:55 |
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| tiwake | what is this email talking about 64gig tablet? | 16:27 |
| fennekki | I'd reckon reading the email would reveal | 16:27 |
| tiwake | I am! | 16:28 |
| ahjolinna | http://www.jollausers.com/2015/01/jolla-tablet-returns-to-indiegogo-new-storage-and-new-battery-size/ | 16:28 |
| tiwake | now its talking about using open source file systems | 16:28 |
| tiwake | bigger battery? | 16:28 |
| tiwake | oh, thats not much bigger | 16:29 |
| tiwake | meh, not terribly interested | 16:30 |
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| ikarus | the whole tablet was a lucky accident for me as I needed a new 7" tablet anyway | 16:30 |
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| tiwake | I do like the open source file system thing... if I'm reading this correctly, they are not going to pay for exfat licensing? | 16:31 |
| ikarus | exactly | 16:31 |
| tiwake | woo | 16:31 |
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| thp | faenil: just thought i'd kick all old PRs a bit forward ;) we're now down to ~ 60 open ones from initially ~ 80 | 16:35 |
| tiwake | so they cant advertise SDHC slot or whatever its called | 16:35 |
| faenil | thp, ehhee yeah :) | 16:35 |
| faenil | thp, I woke up "You have 132 unread emails"...waaaaaaaat? | 16:35 |
| tiwake | or SDXC | 16:36 |
| tiwake | its SDXC with a google search | 16:36 |
| thp | faenil: ;) | 16:36 |
| tiwake | anyway, good for jolla | 16:38 |
| tiwake | maybe when I get my tablet I'll make a machined anodized aluminum housing for it | 16:39 |
| andybranson | i think the tablet should carry an SDXD badge with a line through it | 16:43 |
| andybranson | drawn by a penguin | 16:43 |
| tiwake | HA | 16:43 |
| tiwake | should make stickers for that | 16:43 |
| tiwake | hmmm | 16:43 |
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| Sail0r | there is no hope for a 4G tablet? Am i right? | 17:57 |
| SK_work | Sail0r: I guess no | 17:57 |
| SK_work | you need a companion Jolla | 17:57 |
| Sail0r | damn | 17:57 |
| Sail0r | well I have one but draining battery on both devices for surfing on the tablet is not preferred ;) | 17:58 |
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| r0kk3rz | charge the jolla using usbotg | 18:00 |
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| SK_work | Sail0r: yeah I know ... | 18:02 |
| Sail0r | hmdi our? | 18:02 |
| SK_work | hoping for the external modem thing | 18:02 |
| SK_work | that they wanted to deliver @ 2.5M | 18:02 |
| SK_work | we didn't reached 2.5M :( | 18:02 |
| Sail0r | ok no | 18:02 |
| Sail0r | two things i wanted to have on my next tablet | 18:03 |
| Sail0r | no hdmi out is a show stopper for me :x | 18:03 |
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| SK_work | I'm getting the Jolla tablet as I know that I'm gonna have fun with it | 18:04 |
| Sail0r | yeah, I would too. But I cannot use it for presentations with no hdmi | 18:04 |
| SK_work | not exactly because of some nice (sw / hw) features | 18:04 |
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| Sail0r | but on the other hand I just want to have it :P | 18:04 |
| r0kk3rz | yeah im considering jumping on the tablet bandwagon | 18:04 |
| SK_work | Sail0r: I'm thinking ... chromecast / matchstick support | 18:04 |
| SK_work | we need this | 18:04 |
| SK_work | r0kk3rz: I guess you should: the specs are actually up-to-date | 18:05 |
| Sail0r | true | 18:05 |
| SK_work | unlike the jolla phone | 18:05 |
| Sail0r | jolla stick | 18:05 |
| Sail0r | ;) | 18:05 |
| Sail0r | with jollacast | 18:05 |
| Sail0r | would be great | 18:05 |
| SK_work | Sail0r: I'm also thinking about this pet project of mine "Harmony" | 18:05 |
| SK_work | basically a web server on your jolla, to access services and all | 18:05 |
| SK_work | send sms, show photos | 18:05 |
| SK_work | from a web browser | 18:06 |
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| r0kk3rz | well, im still stuck at the "i dont know what tablets are for" phase | 18:06 |
| SK_work | could be merged with kdeconnect too | 18:06 |
| SK_work | etc; | 18:06 |
| r0kk3rz | but being actual linux | 18:06 |
| r0kk3rz | im sure i can do things with it | 18:06 |
| SK_work | r0kk3rz: I had this feeling | 18:06 |
| Sail0r | r0kk3rz: was stucked in that too | 18:06 |
| SK_work | until: let's use it for reverse engineer stuff :D | 18:06 |
| Sail0r | but now I reanimated my Kindle fire hd and put cm 11 on it | 18:06 |
| Sail0r | and i must say for surfing and smth it's great | 18:06 |
| SK_work | and then my GF decided to have an option on the Nexus 7 | 18:06 |
| r0kk3rz | well, developing apps for the phone is pretty fun | 18:06 |
| SK_work | leaving me with the laptop ... | 18:06 |
| SK_work | yeah, /me getting the tablet to develop apps | 18:07 |
| temmi_moo | nexus 7 is good with either shifter | 18:07 |
| temmi_moo | nexus 8 is supposedly really good | 18:07 |
| SK_work | nexus 7 is quite nice | 18:07 |
| SK_work | and inexpensive | 18:07 |
| SK_work | will skip the N8 though | 18:07 |
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| temmi_moo | never tried | 18:08 |
| Sail0r | and i hope if not that many android apps run on the x86 tablet | 18:08 |
| temmi_moo | nexus 3 is annoying | 18:08 |
| Sail0r | there will be more native sailfishapps | 18:08 |
| temmi_moo | i guess nexus 4 is okay but that was really shortlived | 18:09 |
| r0kk3rz | well | 18:09 |
| r0kk3rz | more devices means more people | 18:09 |
| r0kk3rz | and more developers | 18:09 |
| r0kk3rz | particularly since they dont ship the jolla phone to aus and us | 18:10 |
| Sail0r | and not running android apps, too | 18:10 |
| temmi_moo | SK_work: in a nice well build wheel the nexus 7 should last nearly for ever | 18:10 |
| temmi_moo | well not like the sturmey-archers but still | 18:11 |
| r0kk3rz | but crucially, this time ive been back at work for a couple of months | 18:12 |
| HtheB | meow | 18:12 |
| r0kk3rz | and can afford to spend 160 pounds on a toy | 18:12 |
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| ShadowJK | silly question, how do I know if I added for shipping vack in nov-dec campaign? :D | 18:59 |
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| r0kk3rz | wouldnt you have needed to? | 19:02 |
| r0kk3rz | unless you werent going to get your tablet shipped to you | 19:02 |
| r0kk3rz | which is an odd thing to do, but ok | 19:02 |
| ShadowJK | uhh, iircl you were supposed to add $20 manually? | 19:03 |
| ShadowJK | which would work out if there was a $209 tablet tier, as it says I spent 229 | 19:03 |
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| ln- | r0kk3rz: it was definitely possible to pre-order it without shipping. | 19:08 |
| r0kk3rz | possible maybe, but a silly thing to do | 19:08 |
| r0kk3rz | which would no doubt get fixed once it came time to actually ship it to you | 19:08 |
| ShadowJK | ok so there was a $209 tier, so I probably picked that one and added $20 for shipping | 19:10 |
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| RavenholmDX | ShadowJK, yeah, I got the same | 19:19 |
| RavenholmDX | so works out at $254 with the 64GB upgrade | 19:19 |
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| RavenholmDX | I wish the saving was more than $16 for earlier backers | 19:20 |
| ShadowJK | 209 was probably the last tier or something | 19:20 |
| RavenholmDX | yeah I guess | 19:20 |
| r0kk3rz | be glad you get a saving at all | 19:21 |
| ShadowJK | What I'm really concerned about, since the upgrade is so cheap, will the 64g memory be slower? | 19:21 |
| r0kk3rz | was only a couple of months ago | 19:21 |
| r0kk3rz | ShadowJK: the cost of the chips isnt much more expensive | 19:21 |
| r0kk3rz | players like apple use it to increase profit margins | 19:22 |
| temmi_moo | silicon is cheap if it's just about the amount of it | 19:22 |
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| ShadowJK | I would've still expected non-suck emmc to cost more per gig than this | 19:24 |
| temmi_moo | think about how much a raspberry pi costs while thinking that they are manufactured in england instead of china | 19:26 |
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| temmi_moo | whatever goes on silicon is cheap, it's the putting that on pcb that costs | 19:26 |
| temmi_moo | designing said pcb costs etc etc etc | 19:27 |
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| temmi_moo | the chips are less than 10% of the price | 19:27 |
| Stskeeps | pcb design, you mean, you don't just glue on the components? | 19:28 |
| Stskeeps | :P | 19:28 |
| temmi_moo | the chips also get cheaper the more you buy so that while you can spread the design costs thinner on more devices you'll also get the hardware cheaper per unit | 19:28 |
| temmi_moo | stskeeps hush :) | 19:28 |
| temmi_moo | artesan deadbug mass manufacturing would be interesting | 19:29 |
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| r0kk3rz | design? you mean you dont just order a reference design from china | 19:30 |
| M4rtinK | breadboard FTW! :) | 19:31 |
| Stskeeps | r0kk3rz: oh if it was just that easy.. | 19:31 |
| r0kk3rz | "thanks for joining the jolla tablet! heres your bag of components and half written wiki" | 19:31 |
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| r0kk3rz | Stskeeps: twas sarcasm | 19:31 |
| Stskeeps | r0kk3rz: you're on to us :( | 19:31 |
| M4rtinK | there are kickstarters with tiers like this :) | 19:32 |
| M4rtinK | but usually not for devices of this complexity :) | 19:32 |
| ShadowJK | well atleast intel is supposedly giving away reference designs when they give away atoms | 19:32 |
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| ShadowJK | hm | 19:37 |
| ShadowJK | chinese clone manufacturers were offering rpi at 30% lower price | 19:37 |
| ShadowJK | (until broadcom stopped selling chips) | 19:38 |
| temmi_moo | i'd love if chinese manufacturers would start manufacturing ell-i devices | 19:39 |
| ShadowJK | Though the china price is wholesale and I'm looking at retail price for official | 19:40 |
| ShadowJK | ell-i? | 19:40 |
| HtheB | meow | 19:41 |
| temmi_moo | ShadowJK: internet of things developer boards, basically small end arm mcu with ethernet and power over ethenernet | 19:42 |
| temmi_moo | naturally we're also creating other things on top of this | 19:42 |
| r0kk3rz | obviously jolla should make an internet of things | 19:42 |
| r0kk3rz | because thats what all the cool kids are doing | 19:43 |
| temmi_moo | :) | 19:43 |
| temmi_moo | oh like all the cool kids are using sublime text and javascript? | 19:43 |
| ShadowJK | I was tempted getting the breadbord toh for that | 19:43 |
| temmi_moo | ShadowJK: you could program an ell-i device using that | 19:44 |
| r0kk3rz | well once i get mqtt doing its thing, we could have an internet of jollas | 19:44 |
| Mikaela | "thats what all the cool kids are doing " - "unlike" | 19:44 |
| r0kk3rz | actualy, i just realised something | 19:44 |
| Mikaela | I prefer the Finnish slogan though, "aidosti erilainen" which I would translate as "truly different" | 19:44 |
| r0kk3rz | internet of things is just another name for botnet | 19:44 |
| r0kk3rz | so we could have a botnet of jollas | 19:46 |
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| r0kk3rz | doing..... something..... presumably | 19:46 |
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| Mikaela | making more jollas? | 19:46 |
| temmi_moo | uhhh | 19:47 |
| temmi_moo | this is sounding a lot like the 3d printing crowd | 19:47 |
| temmi_moo | at beginning of helsinki hacklab, we had plenty of that | 19:47 |
| temmi_moo | "what do you print with the 3d printer then?" "DUUHHHHHH isn't that obvious?" "no, seriously, do you print rc car parts or what?" "MOAR PRINTARS" | 19:48 |
| Mikaela | I wonder when will I find my way to helsinki hacklab | 19:48 |
| Mikaela | oh, I see | 19:48 |
| temmi_moo | it was pretty boring truly | 19:48 |
| * Mikaela is just alone in Kotka and even boring somewhere else would be improvement | 19:49 | |
| Miski | do they yet have 3d printers that can actually print new printers? | 19:49 |
| temmi_moo | every discussion related to how to print this or that kind of part was rendered useless as soon as someone found out we were not talking about printing printers | 19:49 |
| temmi_moo | Miski: no, that's the worst part | 19:49 |
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| Miski | temmi_moo: :( | 19:50 |
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| temmi_moo | 95% of the devices are non-replicatable and the guys are still going on about how they'll print more printers | 19:50 |
| temmi_moo | i mean 95% of a single printer parts | 19:50 |
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| temmi_moo | not to mention that a boxed design is just better than one that has plastic joints connecting metal rods | 19:51 |
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| Nicd- | thanks kimmoli :) | 19:56 |
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| kimmoli_ | öö | 19:56 |
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| Nicd- | kimmoli_: G+ :D | 19:58 |
| kimmoli_ | :) | 19:58 |
| M4rtinK | temmi_moo: well, people actually print printer parts a lot :) | 19:58 |
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| M4rtinK | or at least initially after building a new printer | 19:59 |
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| M4rtinK | until you find which ones are too weak and replace them with stronger ones | 19:59 |
| M4rtinK | also upgrades | 19:59 |
| temmi_moo | M4rtinK: yes but that's not printing a printer | 20:00 |
| M4rtinK | we for example printed a completely new carriage for our printer so that we could add a cooling fan and a Z probe | 20:00 |
| temmi_moo | the guys were (some still are) ranting about how the printers are self-replicating where they're not | 20:00 |
| temmi_moo | of course | 20:00 |
| M4rtinK | you can call it regeneration :) | 20:00 |
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| r0kk3rz | yeah the guys at the newcastle makerspace are like that as well | 20:00 |
| M4rtinK | well the aim is usually to print the hard to get stuff | 20:00 |
| r0kk3rz | using printers to make more printers | 20:01 |
| r0kk3rz | or upgrade printers | 20:01 |
| M4rtinK | like the connecting parts on the I2 | 20:01 |
| M4rtinK | no need to drill in precise angles, just print the parts, get some rods and that's it | 20:01 |
| temmi_moo | i'd laser cut or cnc drill the boards to do a box design | 20:01 |
| M4rtinK | if you have a laser cutter or CNC drill, then why not | 20:02 |
| M4rtinK | we just have the printer :) | 20:02 |
| r0kk3rz | i need to get back up there and get printing tohs | 20:02 |
| temmi_moo | possibly i'd personally just hand mark and hand drill on a normal drill press the boards | 20:02 |
| temmi_moo | that's just me | 20:02 |
| M4rtinK | BTW, anybody managed to do that with a normal FDM RepRap ? | 20:02 |
| M4rtinK | I tried that and couldn't make the tiny little tabs that hold the TOH on the Jolla come out right | 20:03 |
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| temmi_moo | i learned to actually wield macromechanical tools instead of just chatting about how cool it'd be if this screwdriver was computer controlled | 20:03 |
| M4rtinK | the local hackerspace has a computer controlled egg painting machine they use to make cool easter eggs :) | 20:04 |
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| temmi_moo | i repair my car and maintain the house i live in | 20:04 |
| temmi_moo | cnc egg painter machine sounds cool | 20:04 |
| temmi_moo | also it sounds like that someone had fun making it | 20:05 |
| r0kk3rz | temmi_moo: sounds like me, i want a CNC router for bike parts | 20:05 |
| temmi_moo | mmmm bike parts | 20:06 |
| kimmoli | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYVHDd8UrsQ | 20:07 |
| kimmoli | ? | 20:07 |
| temmi_moo | we have a human controlled metal lathe and human controlled metal mill at helsinki hacklab | 20:07 |
| HtheB | im bored guys :( | 20:07 |
| temmi_moo | kimmoli: we need to meet face to face so as to see how about flashing some things to an elli board from a jolla | 20:08 |
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| kimmoli | temmi_moo: have to find some spare time | 20:08 |
| temmi_moo | where do you spend your daycare moments? i suppose you're doing something prearranged during the daylight hours | 20:10 |
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| kimmoli | yeah. close to iso-omena | 20:17 |
| temmi_moo | ah okay | 20:18 |
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| temmi_moo | i'm more free as i'm full-time on evangelising ell-i as open source platform for stuff | 20:19 |
| temmi_moo | i'm not digging up my calendar but i can come near you for lunch hour date or something? | 20:19 |
| temmi_moo | how about classic pizza? | 20:19 |
| kimmoli | classic is ok'ish | 20:20 |
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| kimmoli | next week any day | 20:21 |
| temmi_moo | is their quality going downhill or just that at lunchtime one has to wait? | 20:22 |
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| kimmoli | iirc they changed the menu | 20:22 |
| kimmoli | and for me it has been too crispy | 20:23 |
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| kimmoli | little later, 11:30-12 no waiting. | 20:24 |
| temmi_moo | if you dislike that sort of pizza, there's a nice umm more känkky style pizzeria in olari | 20:26 |
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| temmi_moo | their pizzas are good though | 20:26 |
| temmi_moo | olarin wanha mestari if you happen to know | 20:26 |
| kimmoli | ah yes next to espital | 20:29 |
| * Stskeeps looks around for pitchforks | 20:30 | |
| temmi_moo | i like both kinds so i guess owm is better | 20:30 |
| * Yaniel looks around for a domain name | 20:31 | |
| tbr | Stskeeps: huh? in need of the other kind of hardware store? | 20:31 |
| Stskeeps | tbr: nah, just pitchforks after me or others :P | 20:31 |
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| * Stskeeps has to get up at 5am and ponders how to accomplish that | 20:32 | |
| temmi_moo | kimmoli: i'm in otaniemi on monday but tuesday could do | 20:32 |
| kimmoli | tuesday it is then 11:30 ? @ olarin vanha mestari | 20:35 |
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| temmi_moo | i kinda promised to not look at my calendar but now i have to :) | 20:40 |
| kimmoli | :) | 20:40 |
| temmi_moo | looks like i've got a meeting at that point | 20:41 |
| temmi_moo | the agenda being pizza and jolla-stm32 | 20:41 |
| temmi_moo | so yes, we're on | 20:42 |
| temmi_moo | i bring my toys you bring yours | 20:42 |
| temmi_moo | then we notice one cable is missing | 20:42 |
| kimmoli | uh | 20:43 |
| kimmoli | i have always some pigtail wires (and 232-ttl adapter) on my pocket | 20:44 |
| kimmoli | usb-ttl* | 20:44 |
| temmi_moo | oh okay np then :) | 20:44 |
| kimmoli | but i try to collect what i have | 20:44 |
| temmi_moo | i need to bring an elli device and a poe injector | 20:45 |
| kimmoli | we're going to get thrown out from the bar | 20:45 |
| temmi_moo | cat5+ cabling is everywhere | 20:45 |
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| temmi_moo | ummm that'd be bad for business :) | 20:47 |
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| r0kk3rz | you'd be surprised what you can do in a bar | 20:51 |
| temmi_moo | i have worn dirty clothing with lots of pockets full of tools | 20:52 |
| temmi_moo | legitimately thouhg | 20:53 |
| kimmoli | worst thing is that someone comes and starts to give advices... | 20:53 |
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| temmi_moo | that confirmed to me what mitnick wrote a long ago that with suitable disguise you'll get everywhere | 20:53 |
| r0kk3rz | absolutely | 20:54 |
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| r0kk3rz | i remember in australia, there were some comedians who dressed up like a foreign officials with motorcade | 20:54 |
| temmi_moo | when reading his writeup i didn't believe it | 20:54 |
| r0kk3rz | and got into the apec summit | 20:54 |
| temmi_moo | just get some dirty workman clothing, a badge with xyz text and your face on it and lots of tools | 20:55 |
| temmi_moo | everywhere | 20:55 |
| temmi_moo | people even open the doors and give you detailed directions if you don't happen to have a map | 20:55 |
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| temmi_moo | i tried to become an electrician but was tricked back into bitbanging world by pekka nikander | 20:56 |
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| r0kk3rz | nothing wrong with banging bits | 20:58 |
| temmi_moo | i like working with hands on more concrete problems | 20:58 |
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| r0kk3rz | so do i | 20:59 |
| r0kk3rz | i find it a welcome change after spending all day being a software engineer | 21:00 |
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| kimmoli | speaking of, small part of todays concrete stuff https://app.younited.com/?shareObject=aeecebc3-eb06-2b10-f795-907ce3ab7849 | 21:06 |
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| r0kk3rz | is that the back of a eurosocket? | 21:09 |
| r0kk3rz | maybe i should enlarge the picture before commenting | 21:09 |
| r0kk3rz | i have no idea what that is :P | 21:10 |
| raa700 | three phase euro socket | 21:10 |
| r0kk3rz | oh, 3 phase, of course | 21:10 |
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| temmi_moo | i'm still downloading... | 21:11 |
| r0kk3rz | looks pretty similar to the 3 phase we use in aus | 21:11 |
| M4rtinK | looks like that 380-400V outlet | 21:11 |
| raa700 | http://regmedia.co.uk/2014/01/29/three_phase_coupling.jpg | 21:11 |
| temmi_moo | raa700 i've installed those | 21:12 |
| kimmoli | yep, had to add few more | 21:12 |
| kimmoli | getting rid of extension-cords from floor | 21:12 |
| temmi_moo | i mean, i went to trade school and got the paper and got a job | 21:12 |
| temmi_moo | then i met pnr and this happened and look at me now | 21:13 |
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| kimmoli | now i have socket for all 4 devices, no need to toggle cables | 21:14 |
| *** dazo is now known as dazo_afk | 21:15 | |
| temmi_moo | ... still downloading | 21:15 |
| temmi_moo | wife is upgrading a game and i've got no throttling features in the router | 21:16 |
| temmi_moo | was it expensive to install individual sockets? | 21:16 |
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| kimmoli | 4,99 each | 21:18 |
| temmi_moo | so you didn't pay someone to do the job for top dollar? :) | 21:18 |
| temmi_moo | ... finally got that downloaded :) | 21:19 |
| kimmoli | really worth waiting :) | 21:19 |
| temmi_moo | truly | 21:22 |
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| ShadowJK | what do you have that you run on 3 phase? | 21:22 |
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| ShadowJK | also, that can't have been done by a real electrician, the wiees are in the correct order. | 21:23 |
| ShadowJK | wires* | 21:23 |
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| kimmoli | tig, mig and 2 plasmacutters | 21:23 |
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| temmi_moo | ShadowJK: :D a real electrian would have complained a lot about rcd breakers and then would have cut the yellow green wire as it is not needed for operation and occasionally its presence blows fuses and trips rcd switches | 21:25 |
| temmi_moo | where do you live kimmoli? | 21:25 |
| ShadowJK | ive also seen outlets with cut blue | 21:25 |
| temmi_moo | interesting | 21:26 |
| temmi_moo | must be someone from industrial experience | 21:26 |
| ShadowJK | yes, it sas in an industrial setting | 21:27 |
| ShadowJK | was* | 21:27 |
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| temmi_moo | ah okay | 21:27 |
| temmi_moo | makes sense | 21:27 |
| kimmoli | motors typically need just phases | 21:27 |
| temmi_moo | the machines don't use zero at all | 21:27 |
| ShadowJK | ("motors run without the 'extra' green and blue, why bother?") | 21:27 |
| temmi_moo | it's a very bad idea to connect anything to the star point if a machine has one | 21:27 |
| temmi_moo | ShadowJK: :D | 21:27 |
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| temmi_moo | well yes | 21:28 |
| ShadowJK | but then later someone added stuff that needed N, and well, it ended up with energized chassis | 21:28 |
| temmi_moo | i was somewhat outcast in the electrician circles with my ideas that the greenyellow thing is 1) not hard 2) a really frickin' good idea and that 3) rcd breakers are even better | 21:28 |
| ShadowJK | which kind of proved you never leave ohtlets partially wired, no matter what the use | 21:29 |
| temmi_moo | oh an outlet, yes, always fully wired | 21:29 |
| temmi_moo | likewise in audio the outlet always has everything connected and any possible ground lift happens optionally at input | 21:30 |
| temmi_moo | also all cables have all connected | 21:30 |
| temmi_moo | patch bays as well | 21:30 |
| ShadowJK | as for phases, in my experience electricians wire them randomly, turn on machine, if there's mktor spinning backwards then swap two random phasss | 21:31 |
| ShadowJK | phases | 21:31 |
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| kimmoli | it s**ks when someone has made that swap on extension cord | 21:34 |
| ShadowJK | lol, yes | 21:34 |
| temmi_moo | ShadowJK: the phase detector thingy is too hard to use... | 21:34 |
| temmi_moo | also it's just too damn hard to use the same colours everywhere | 21:34 |
| ShadowJK | no, it's too expensive | 21:34 |
| temmi_moo | so that when you _do_ use the phase detector thing, it will tell you that yes good job lad go have some tea | 21:35 |
| kimmoli | making installation on old houses from 50-60's isnt fun | 21:36 |
| ShadowJK | my last petition for a installation tester was rejected | 21:36 |
| kimmoli | red for PE | 21:36 |
| temmi_moo | kimmoli: red is just a colour, it might be PE or it might be L that went through a switch | 21:36 |
| kimmoli | yeah | 21:37 |
| temmi_moo | not so funny thing is, in the new system, when greenyellow is sacred and only for PE, it is often used for other uses | 21:37 |
| ShadowJK | i dont trust colours. They change too frequently | 21:37 |
| temmi_moo | measure before touching | 21:38 |
| kimmoli | :) | 21:38 |
| kimmoli | good example: car typically has brown as ground | 21:38 |
| temmi_moo | ShadowJK: dunno about installation testers but in herewise most electricians carry a fluke duspol with them everywhere as it's pretty handy in low voltage ac installations | 21:39 |
| kimmoli | blown one CB radio which other end of cable was wired according that, and i use blue -, brown + | 21:39 |
| ShadowJK | Dealing with 0-80 yo industrial kit from 3 continents, wire colours are just a distraction attempt :P | 21:39 |
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| temmi_moo | i kind of love any industrial electrical stuff older than 30 years old | 21:39 |
| temmi_moo | except one family of strömberg motors, they're horrible | 21:40 |
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| temmi_moo | ShadowJK: why are you here if you have industrial electrity toys at playground? | 21:44 |
| ShadowJK | i dont get much playtime, they're supposed to be producing stuff | 21:45 |
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| temmi_moo | :) | 21:48 |
| kimmoli | found one pic from same location, red is one phase in this 4-pin three-phase outlet https://app.younited.com/?shareObject=1ced2d6a-b13a-3830-b78d-f5392108258c | 21:49 |
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| cvp_ | o/ | 22:15 |
| cvp_ | what is the font of the jolla logo? | 22:15 |
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| HtheB | cvp_: I think it's Jolla's own hand written logo, no font | 22:26 |
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| cvp_ | HtheB, make sense | 22:28 |
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| chem|st | HtheB: they should find a font designer and make it their own font | 22:28 |
| HtheB | well, the 2 l's are different... | 22:29 |
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| cvp_ | or the Sailfish font... maybe this is more interessting for me : ) | 22:31 |
| cvp_ | http://www.mobilelinuxnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Jolla-Mobile-Logo.png | 22:31 |
| chem|st | true but that is in handwriting fonts an issue anyway, characters ending top and bottom | 22:31 |
| HtheB | i wonder what font is using Sailfish logo either | 22:33 |
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| Miski | HtheB: looks more like custom made than an actual font | 22:33 |
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| Miski | the connection between s and h might be just a tad difficult with other letters | 22:34 |
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| cvp_ | s to h is selfmade, but the rest ? | 22:35 |
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| Miski | no idea, but my guess would be it's entirely custome mafe | 22:37 |
| Miski | s/f/d/ | 22:38 |
| Miski | ... s/me/m/ | 22:39 |
| cvp_ | hmm "Swis721 BT" looks like a bit | 22:41 |
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| Miski | hmmm... the f wouldn't connect with i, I think, and Sailfish logo is thinner than a quick google of "Swis721 BT". But yes, the curves on s, a and h have a lot in common. Maybe a customized version of that? | 22:50 |
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| HtheB | why cant i stop laughing at this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BbVqzZ5dOIY | 22:50 |
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| pdanek | Hey | 23:53 |
| pdanek | Tizen's success helps Jolla, right? | 23:53 |
| HtheB | pdanek: who says so?... | 23:58 |
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