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| kimmoli | eekkelund: ping. how i'm supposed to close file if i open one by mistake? in tideditor. also got some typeerrors. | 06:51 |
|---|---|---|
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| eekkelund | kimmoli, pong. Not sure what do you mean:D Open the correct one? | 07:21 |
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| eekkelund | If you open the wrong one edit that, don't want to save,realize mistake and want to open new file without saving? | 07:22 |
| locusf | open the correct one :D | 07:22 |
| locusf | U USING IT WRONK | 07:22 |
| kimmoli | yes. i have only save button. i dont want to save. i want to open another. open button is disabled. | 07:24 |
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| eekkelund | oooh, yeah.. In tIDE it is possible to swipe back so I haven't realize this.. I think I had some really good reason why one had to save first before opening the new file but can't remember it now..:D So it is mistake/bug in the application | 07:26 |
| eekkelund | Should add dialog or something like that 'are you sure you want to open new without saving' | 07:27 |
| kimmoli | maybe. | 07:27 |
| kimmoli | also when first time click Open button, i see a - file... http://kimmoli.com/tauhkaa/tIDE1.jpg | 07:30 |
| kimmoli | it gives typeerror when clicked | 07:30 |
| kimmoli | also the icon sizes on toolbar look weirdo http://kimmoli.com/tauhkaa/tIDE-toolbar-onyx.png | 07:34 |
| kimmoli | save is kinda small compared to others | 07:34 |
| eekkelund | Do you have that '-' file? o.O That type error means usually that python can not open the file, so it is not txt file.(?) | 07:36 |
| eekkelund | Whaat :D Nice bugs you have found thanks. Your device is onyx? save button looks normal with j1, jc and jtab.. Interesting | 07:37 |
| kimmoli | scenario. I Open a file which is readonly, i want to just read it, i need to press save and get "cannot assign undefined" . i can't reopen the same file (for example a log file that i want to check is it changed) i need to open another. (?) | 07:38 |
| kimmoli | http://kimmoli.com/tauhkaa/tIDE-undefined.png | 07:39 |
| kimmoli | well, i just updated it and started it for 2nd time :) | 07:40 |
| eekkelund | Thanks a lot, that is a bug :) | 07:40 |
| eekkelund | I wonder have people noticed these bugs but haven't just reported them :( | 07:41 |
| eekkelund | Because I have been using it happily without noticing these.. :D | 07:41 |
| kimmoli | should reporting be done by github or something? | 07:41 |
| eekkelund | Well for me it is same, I just want to know if there is bugs. Github is the preferred way, but I check also Jolla store /warehouse comments and one can contact me in irc or telegram :) | 07:42 |
| eekkelund | That '-' file is mystery if you don't have that kind of file | 07:46 |
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| LarstiQ | stdin/stdout? | 07:49 |
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| chriadam | help appreciated: https://together.jolla.com/question/158893/caldavcarddav-testing-volunteers-requested/ | 07:50 |
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| kimmoli | eekkelund: i have that file :) | 08:01 |
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| kimmoli | didnt check what it contains. annoyingly it gets sorted before .. | 08:01 |
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| eekkelund | Oh okay, but true that is annoying, should be fixed. | 08:08 |
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| kimmoli | (it is annoying filename though) | 08:47 |
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| TMavica | ，， | 09:40 |
| TMavica | https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/gAZMQ8qI/Screenshot_20170625_001.png | 09:41 |
| TMavica | Wrong chann | 09:41 |
| TMavica | Channel | 09:41 |
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| King_DuckZ | about the support for xperia announced just now, that's great stuff! :) | 13:29 |
| King_DuckZ | I hope the beta testers will share their hands-on experience! | 13:30 |
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| leszek1 | :) | 13:39 |
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| King_DuckZ | reboot brb | 13:48 |
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| King_DuckZ | back | 13:52 |
| leszek1 | so sadly that means no xperia devices to buy directly with SailfishOS | 13:52 |
| leszek1 | hmm... :/ | 13:52 |
| King_DuckZ | no stock shortage at least ;) | 13:53 |
| leszek1 | still something that is bad marketing from Jolla they could've told earlier about this | 13:53 |
| leszek1 | I doubt very hard that this is a decision they made this week | 13:54 |
| King_DuckZ | well, it's not great for adoption rate, but I guess being in the highlights on the high street shops next to the iphone takes more than just being preinstalled anyways | 13:54 |
| leszek1 | that is true that was not the target | 13:54 |
| leszek1 | I think the many people asking about it should've made Jolla realize that their is demand and clearify this as soon as possible. I am sceptical that this "soon" is today | 13:55 |
| King_DuckZ | leszek1 that's true, they could post small snippets on diaspora more often instead of waiting to have enough to make a lengthy blog post | 13:55 |
| King_DuckZ | as I already mentioned, I think mollygos from chucklefish did a wonderful job as a community manager, as much as I don't like her personally | 13:57 |
| King_DuckZ | she should write a book or something: "how to survive the shitstorm and do effective PR" :) | 13:58 |
| r0kk3rz | leszek1: it sounds like they still havent decided, but are continuing development as a downloadable image | 13:59 |
| leszek1 | Jolla and PR is like men and mosquito | 13:59 |
| leszek1 | r0kk3rz: I think James said this in the comments: "The possibility of us selling the device is very close to zero." | 14:01 |
| leszek1 | r0kk3rz: thats clear to me they won't sell the devices | 14:01 |
| r0kk3rz | it seemed pretty unlikely from the get go | 14:02 |
| leszek1 | r0kk3rz: that might be but then Jolla should've told the many asking about it | 14:03 |
| leszek1 | or at least tell them "it's pretty unlikely" | 14:03 |
| r0kk3rz | indeed | 14:03 |
| leszek1 | and the statement that they are now thinking about how to make it easier for users to flash stuff onto the device speaks also for itself | 14:05 |
| LarstiQ | what does it say? | 14:05 |
| leszek1 | Somehow I am under the impression they avoided to answer that question maybe for themselves aswell | 14:06 |
| leszek1 | and just started porting and thought hey lets look how far we can come | 14:06 |
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| leszek1 | LarstiQ: read it yourself: https://blog.jolla.com/sony-xperia-project-update/ | 14:08 |
| leszek1 | also "Cbeta testing group" first time I hear about it | 14:10 |
| r0kk3rz | leszek1: its a secret club, its members are under NDA preventing disclosure of the secret club | 14:11 |
| leszek1 | I hope you are joking | 14:11 |
| r0kk3rz | nope | 14:11 |
| leszek1 | NDA wtf | 14:11 |
| leszek1 | the whole marketing of jolla seems to be under nda most of the times | 14:12 |
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| locusf | I doubt its a fight club sort of this, the members just want to remain in peace for testing cool stuff instead of everyone asking what the next release is going to be like :) | 14:16 |
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| leszek1 | locusf: that makes sense. Still NDA is the enemy of the open and free software thought | 14:17 |
| r0kk3rz | i thought it was to protect to-be-announced commercial products | 14:17 |
| r0kk3rz | which is standard practice | 14:17 |
| leszek1 | yeah apparantly the sailfishos image is commercial. You have to pay for it to get it. Which is also interesting | 14:18 |
| locusf | and sailfish isn't commercial? | 14:18 |
| locusf | indeed the jolla offered image apparently is commercial | 14:18 |
| leszek1 | jolla is | 14:18 |
| locusf | wondering if a separate community adaptation would get heat from jolla if it was offered from source up | 14:19 |
| King_DuckZ | that part is not very clear, because (I think in the comments) they say that if you pre-own an xperia then you're entitled to download the image for free | 14:19 |
| King_DuckZ | but then they also say you can't bu a pre-flashed xperia | 14:20 |
| leszek1 | King_DuckZ: I hope so because no one will buy an image if its quality is unknown | 14:20 |
| King_DuckZ | so which actions would lead me to the scenario where I have a phone and I still have to pay for the image? | 14:20 |
| leszek1 | so the article leaves more questions then it answers :P | 14:21 |
| leszek1 | again | 14:21 |
| King_DuckZ | leszek1: well there's people giving up on their refund which are going to pay for the image, so they clearly want people to pay | 14:21 |
| leszek1 | King_DuckZ: then this is the next big big failure for jolla | 14:22 |
| r0kk3rz | dalvik isnt free, someone needs to pay myriad | 14:22 |
| King_DuckZ | but still, if I'm entitled to get the free download because I own the xperia from ebay, then why should I trade my refund in? | 14:22 |
| King_DuckZ | not clear | 14:22 |
| leszek1 | r0kk3rz: yeah I know. But this was discussed before. If they get a license from myriad to sell it in an image they could've invested some time to make it available as payable download in the jolla store or even some other way to deliver the rpm | 14:23 |
| King_DuckZ | r0kk3rz: maybe they should get refunded by sony for the returned android licence? because I'm guessing android is also not free | 14:23 |
| King_DuckZ | as in free beer | 14:23 |
| King_DuckZ | or that ^ | 14:24 |
| leszek1 | r0kk3rz: the other question is if they even use the myriad technology | 14:24 |
| r0kk3rz | it has been said it will have alien-dalvik | 14:24 |
| leszek1 | android 4.4.4 support is soon outdated so this android support becomes worthless | 14:24 |
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| r0kk3rz | leszek1: they may have to update it for aarch64 support | 14:25 |
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| nh1402 | well technically speaking aarch64 should be backwards compatible | 14:26 |
| leszek1 | r0kk3rz: that aswell. But as long as the api is stuck at an older version they would've been better off using the underlying bare aosp system to run the android apps and push some investment in an free and open technology like sfdroid | 14:26 |
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| locusf | leszek1: and piss on their business partners by doing that? | 14:27 |
| leszek1 | locusf: why piss ? They paid for the support for jolla, jolla c and such already | 14:27 |
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| leszek1 | if myriad cannot provide what they need they invest in other solutions its that simple | 14:28 |
| leszek1 | maybe myriad has something in the pipeline already who knows | 14:28 |
| r0kk3rz | the other solutions are a long way from comercially viable | 14:28 |
| locusf | what makes you think jolla needs it rather than you need it ? | 14:28 |
| locusf | yes indeed | 14:28 |
| mal | King_DuckZ: the blog comments have "Downloading the software (Sailfish OS image) will not be free of charge" which in my understanding means you have to buy the phone and image separately, no price given for the image yet | 14:29 |
| King_DuckZ | mal: ok, I think I missed that | 14:29 |
| King_DuckZ | too many idiots trolling there | 14:30 |
| locusf | there is a whole metric ton of comments | 14:30 |
| r0kk3rz | tbh if details like those are available, they should've been in the post not the comments | 14:31 |
| leszek1 | exactly | 14:32 |
| mal | I never even thought it would be free | 14:33 |
| leszek1 | I thought they would sell it with an xperia x device included | 14:34 |
| ^7heo | leszek1: that's what would make sense; otherwise the image is gonna end up on tpb in minutes. | 14:36 |
| ^7heo | someone's gonna buy it and leak it. | 14:36 |
| ^7heo | and if they fingerprint it and find who does that, it's just gonna lose them a HUGE part of the market; because that's something one would expect from Android/Google/Apple, not from Jolla. | 14:37 |
| King_DuckZ | mal: there it is: "There will be a downloadable Sailfish OS image for your Xperia X if you have already bought it." | 14:37 |
| leszek1 | ^7heo: true | 14:37 |
| mal | King_DuckZ: yes, but that says nothing whether it's free or not | 14:37 |
| King_DuckZ | mal: it doesn't make much sense to me to interpret that as "you can only buy SF if you already bought an xperia first" | 14:37 |
| LarstiQ | King_DuckZ: as opposed to buying a preflashed device | 14:37 |
| King_DuckZ | so I interpreted it as it's going to be free | 14:37 |
| King_DuckZ | idk | 14:37 |
| ^7heo | personally I don't wanna run sailfish on an xperia yet; I have other things to pay first. | 14:38 |
| ^7heo | but around october, yeah. | 14:38 |
| ^7heo | that way I have both a usable device, and a development device, for ASOP and Sailfish | 14:38 |
| mal | King_DuckZ: that just says you are able to get sailfish on a phone you have already bought | 14:39 |
| ^7heo | but I would have expected the SailfishOS image to be available free of charge. | 14:39 |
| ^7heo | if not; I'm not that interested, it's already ported free of charge on other phones. | 14:39 |
| leszek1 | hmm... if jolla isn't going to sell the Xperia X with SailfishOS on it and the Image will be free either without Alien Dalvik or by community porters recreating the image without AD. Then one could start its own business buying Xperia X and reflashing them with SailfishOS and selling them worldwide | 14:39 |
| ^7heo | leszek1: hopefully the license is gonna prevent that. | 14:39 |
| leszek1 | ^7heo: why should it ? | 14:39 |
| mal | considering the included licenced software in the image free is not a very logical assumption | 14:40 |
| ^7heo | leszek1: like a license saying: free for personal use; repay us 20% on resells. | 14:40 |
| ^7heo | leszek1: because that way it's both accessible for the end users; and commerciable for the people wanting to provide support | 14:40 |
| ^7heo | leszek1: while still providing Jolla some pesos | 14:40 |
| leszek1 | I saw people selling reflashed Nexus 5s with SailfishOS images already | 14:40 |
| ^7heo | yeah but that's not supported, that's just a port. | 14:41 |
| ^7heo | there's a giant difference here: support. | 14:41 |
| mal | leszek1: really? never heard of that | 14:41 |
| ^7heo | support, for many, means: it will work. | 14:41 |
| King_DuckZ | if community supports something, then it's supported | 14:41 |
| ^7heo | because not everyone has the skills, means, and time (all of that) to fix their software on their phones. | 14:41 |
| ^7heo | King_DuckZ: no. | 14:41 |
| ^7heo | King_DuckZ: commercially supported != community supported. | 14:41 |
| leszek1 | ^7heo: depends | 14:42 |
| ^7heo | King_DuckZ: that https://thehftguy.files.wordpress.com/2017/02/pic-i-dont-always-make-working-code-but-when-i-do-it-works-on-my-machine.jpg | 14:42 |
| ^7heo | King_DuckZ: that does not mean "it works" | 14:42 |
| King_DuckZ | ^7heo: there's plenty of community supported stuff I run everyday | 14:42 |
| ^7heo | King_DuckZ: and that is "community support" | 14:42 |
| leszek1 | I have seen community projects offering better support | 14:43 |
| ^7heo | King_DuckZ: good that "it runs on your machine" | 14:43 |
| ^7heo | King_DuckZ: I'm glad for you. | 14:43 |
| leszek1 | and far better marketing aswell :P | 14:43 |
| ^7heo | leszek1: it's undeniable that there are rotten companies out there | 14:43 |
| ^7heo | leszek1: and very good communities | 14:43 |
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| ^7heo | leszek1: so yeah, for example, the postgresql community offers top notch support. | 14:43 |
| leszek1 | ^7heo: I was directly refering to Jolla and SailfishOS | 14:44 |
| ^7heo | leszek1: and that's part of what makes the product so great. | 14:44 |
| King_DuckZ | ^7heo: on yours too probably, first thing that comes to my mind is archlinux-arm | 14:44 |
| King_DuckZ | I might be wrong, but I don't think there's any big commercial company behind that | 14:44 |
| ^7heo | King_DuckZ: yeah archlinux is the typical "I don't always make working code, but then I do it works on my machine" kinda people. | 14:44 |
| ^7heo | I wouldn't run ANYTHING on archlinux, not even my leisure machines. | 14:45 |
| ^7heo | it's way too fragile. | 14:45 |
| ^7heo | Anyway, I'm spamming too much, and I should write code instead; that's what I'm paid for. | 14:45 |
| ^7heo | ciao! ;) | 14:45 |
| leszek1 | ^7heo: if someone asks just tell them: "Its compiling" :) | 14:46 |
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| ^7heo | leszek1: unfortunately I'm not working with java | 14:47 |
| leszek1 | "unfortunately" :P I think "not working with java" is great | 14:48 |
| ^7heo | well, it's not, when you wanna slack off. | 14:49 |
| ^7heo | Java and C++ are the #1 languages for slacking off. | 14:49 |
| leszek1 | ah building some linux packages like libreoffice or firefox takes sometimes ages to compile aswell and this not java | 14:49 |
| ^7heo | yeah but it's C++ | 14:49 |
| ^7heo | and rust now. | 14:49 |
| leszek1 | yep | 14:50 |
| ^7heo | anyway, https://www.xkcd.com/303/ | 14:50 |
| leszek1 | :) | 14:50 |
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| King_DuckZ | archlinux a bad distro? not working? only working for me? idk if you're on drugs but that pretty much ends the discussion for me | 15:13 |
| King_DuckZ | go tell that to my servers | 15:13 |
| King_DuckZ | anyways, I also need to code, so ttyl | 15:14 |
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