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| * Nc_ re-installs the SDK some more | 01:06 | |
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| anandrkris | hi, accessing irc using Jolla client | 05:51 |
|---|---|---|
| anandrkris | experience is not bad :) | 05:51 |
| anandrkris | guess only application that uses four pulley menus! | 05:52 |
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| * lachs0r is using the desktop version of that client | 06:32 | |
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| Summon | Hi. I've installed sailfish os sdk under linux. In the qtcreator I can "start sdk" and then I can "stop sdk". I also can "start emulator", but when it starts, the emulator button changes back to "start emulator" and I can't build any example because it look like qtcreator doesn't know about emulator is running. | 06:41 |
| Summon | The error I get is | 06:41 |
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| Summon | :-1: error: SailfishOS Emulator: Connection refused | 06:42 |
| Summon | If I look at the virtualbox settings for emulator, there is no network settings for it at all | 06:44 |
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| Summon | But for MerSDK virtual machine there are 2 network adapters (NAT and internal network). I copied this settings to emulator vm, but this didn't help. | 06:45 |
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| nycat | is there a way to install the sdk through rpm or tarball w/o running the installer? | 06:47 |
| tbr | nycat: you might be able to extract it and do things manually. check command line options for it | 06:48 |
| tbr | Summon: it might also be missing the port mapping | 06:49 |
| tbr | Summon: do you have a current version of vbox as recommended by the sdk? | 06:49 |
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| Summon | I have 4.3.20. The only error I get during install was Warning: VBoxManage: error: Invalid --audio argument 'pulse', but I don't think it is critical. | 06:52 |
| tbr | Summon: that's the VM setup failing | 06:53 |
| Summon | I understand, but it is sound setup | 06:53 |
| tbr | it probably ignores further parameters | 06:53 |
| Summon | that would be bad | 06:53 |
| tbr | I had something similar once when some vbox parameter changed | 06:53 |
| Summon | may be there are a way to make all parameters manually? | 06:54 |
| tbr | I simply looked at the setup script and set things up manually to match | 06:54 |
| Summon | That looks logical ) | 06:54 |
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| tbr | tigeli: ^^^ IIRC you were involved, might be worth checking befor you push out U10 sdk | 06:55 |
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| Summon | Ok. I found that command and chaged pulse to alsa and now emulator works with sound, network settings are applied and qtcreator can see emulator | 07:10 |
| Summon | but when I try to build an example I get "bash: /home/src1/: is a directory" and "...qmake" exited with code 126" | 07:11 |
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| tbr | maybe the home directory mapping is missing? | 07:20 |
| Summon | all folders that are listed in MerSDK VM exist and MerSDK VM had no errors during install. | 07:25 |
| Summon | folders that are listed in "shared folders" settings | 07:25 |
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| tbr | did you use an empty field for some name? | 07:28 |
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| Summon | which name? shared forlders for VM were created by the installer. I just provide a path where I want SDK to install everything | 07:32 |
| Summon | and src1 is successfully seen from MerSDK VM | 07:32 |
| Summon | I just tested it | 07:32 |
| tbr | I meant the example project you created | 07:34 |
| Summon | I just took the "Component gallery" example from SDK | 07:35 |
| Summon | and tried to build | 07:36 |
| tbr | it asks you for a name when you do that, did you fill something in? | 07:40 |
| Summon | It asks for a path to copy the example files, and I Wrote a path | 07:42 |
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| Summon | I've created empty sailfish os project and filled every field I was asked, but building results the same error =( | 07:46 |
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| Summon | it seems like somewhere is a space in command | 07:47 |
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| coderus | Nokius_: cool, follow my twitter to see my location :) | 08:34 |
| coderus | please suggest me sailfish/android application working on jolla to share my current location? not glimpse. | 08:36 |
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| Nokius | coderus: wait there is on inho | 09:00 |
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| Nokius | let me check iirc | 09:00 |
| Nokius | /var/brain was correct not sure if its the wanted but check Miataru (openrepos) | 09:03 |
| Nokius | check miataru.com | 09:04 |
| Nokius | coderus: ^ | 09:04 |
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| tigeli | tbr: not me but Jare.. :) | 09:07 |
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| sandsmark | Summon: have you tried launching the VM manually from the vbox ui? | 11:21 |
| sandsmark | I sometimes do that | 11:21 |
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| sandsmark | hmm, all android applications suddenly have invalid .desktop files | 11:41 |
| sandsmark | but they look just fine | 11:41 |
| sandsmark | unfortunately whatever sailfish uses isn't as verbose as KDE when it comes to parsing .desktop files... | 11:42 |
| sandsmark | http://pastie.org/pastes/9801811/text looks just fine to me | 11:43 |
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| beidl | sandsmark: have you noticed that the oc daemon SIGABRT's pretty much after starting? | 11:51 |
| sandsmark | beidl: hmm, nope | 11:51 |
| sandsmark | I've only tested it with a manually created config file, btw. | 11:51 |
| sandsmark | I'll see how it works without that :D | 11:51 |
| sandsmark | yeah, got that now :p | 11:52 |
| beidl | haha :D | 11:52 |
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| sandsmark | hmm, the SIGABRT comes from an assert in dbus, that is really weird | 11:53 |
| sandsmark | _dbus_check_is_valid_interface, I probably fucked up something there :p | 11:54 |
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| sandsmark | dbus is weird... | 12:00 |
| beidl | what have you found? | 12:01 |
| Sidde | with qt 5.2 now in sailfish. Are all the GPS features working now? | 12:01 |
| Sidde | like getting info about how many satellites connected? | 12:02 |
| sandsmark | beidl: well, the interface is invalid, somehow, but it doesn't tell me why | 12:03 |
| Sidde | there is very little info about whats new in QT5.2 in sailfish compared to 5.0 | 12:03 |
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| sandsmark | Sidde: ? | 12:05 |
| sandsmark | Sidde: have you looked at the qt 5.2 release notes? | 12:05 |
| Sidde | sandsmark: i mean is everything in qt 5.2 implemented in sailfish? | 12:06 |
| sandsmark | yes? | 12:06 |
| sandsmark | or what do you mean with "implemented" | 12:06 |
| Sidde | i mean are all modules in place... | 12:06 |
| Sidde | sandsmark: but if yes, then i have no furthen questions | 12:07 |
| sandsmark | ok :D | 12:07 |
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| sandsmark | I'd expect them to note if any module wasn't available | 12:07 |
| Sidde | sandsmark: :) | 12:07 |
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| Sidde | sandsmark: info has not been jollas strong side. What's why i was asking | 12:08 |
| sandsmark | the other way around seems a bit backwards | 12:08 |
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| sandsmark | well, they're spending their time coding instead of writing docs, apparently | 12:09 |
| Sidde | sandsmark: :) | 12:09 |
| sandsmark | which is a bit annoying at times, but I guess for the best | 12:09 |
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| sandsmark | (not that I seem to read docs... I've been using the dbus API completely wrong :D) | 12:14 |
| beidl | :D | 12:15 |
| beidl | I've never used the qdbus bindings, only dbus-cpp | 12:16 |
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| Sidde | dbus is the horror... it's complicated. Much like systemd, pulseaudio and so many other modern linux stuff... | 12:16 |
| sandsmark | yeah, I miss dcop | 12:16 |
| sandsmark | it was so straightforward | 12:16 |
| beidl | Sidde: let's please not turn this into a flame war. All I want to say is that I disagree | 12:17 |
| sandsmark | (unfortunately based completely on the X11 ICE stuff, so wouldn't work in wayland) | 12:17 |
| beidl | the problem is that current APIs are way too verbose for app developer consumption | 12:18 |
| Sidde | beidl: sorry. i felt like a bit of trolling for a minute | 12:18 |
| beidl | they are supposed to be easier | 12:18 |
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| beidl | Sidde: np :) | 12:19 |
| sandsmark | well, the qdbus stuff isn't very verbose, you just have to actually read the docs before using them :p | 12:19 |
| beidl | I'm talking out of experience with libdbus-cpp :) | 12:20 |
| sandsmark | yeah | 12:20 |
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| inte | hello | 12:21 |
| inte | just wanted to ask | 12:21 |
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| inte | I found this site for sailfishOS images: http://images.devaamo.fi/sfa/ | 12:22 |
| inte | however, there is no image for the s3lte (i9305) available from there | 12:22 |
| sandsmark | inte: try #sailfishos-porters (iirc) | 12:22 |
| inte | ah thanks | 12:22 |
| sandsmark | (I never remember the channel name, but it is something like that) | 12:23 |
| beidl | sandsmark: that's the right one, it's how I've come to sailfish (porting it to the galaxy nexus) :) | 12:26 |
| sandsmark | ah, cool | 12:26 |
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| beidl | which reminds me... maaaaybe I should finally release a 1.1.1.27-based image | 12:29 |
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| tbr | GPL source drop from Jolla/ Stskeepz now available from my server - as usual | 12:39 |
| M4rtinK | downloading already :) | 12:40 |
| M4rtinK | all that Maemo/MeeGo bitrot made me paranoid :) | 12:40 |
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| sandsmark | beidl: there, fixed it, I think :D | 12:47 |
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| beidl | sandsmark: I'll try :) | 12:59 |
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| sandsmark | forgot to pull first :p | 13:08 |
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| beidl | sandsmark: the daemon is now packaged into its own subpackage (for OpenRepos) and started as a user service :) | 13:10 |
| sandsmark | <3 | 13:11 |
| sandsmark | you're awesome | 13:11 |
| beidl | :D thanks | 13:11 |
| sandsmark | I'll work a bit on the swiping keyboard now, and try to fix some config UI later today | 13:11 |
| gogeta | http://saidinesh5.wordpress.com/ | 13:11 |
| gogeta | sbav | 13:11 |
| gogeta | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jcJE6J5QJug | 13:11 |
| beidl | sandsmark: great! and thanks for those wonderful PRs :) | 13:12 |
| sandsmark | np | 13:12 |
| sandsmark | beidl: created a PR for the fixed dbus stuff | 13:15 |
| sandsmark | gogeta: that's my finger :D | 13:17 |
| gogeta | great | 13:17 |
| gogeta | I hope into a release soonish as this eve :-D | 13:18 |
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| gogeta | sandsmark, this will be a** breaker | 13:19 |
| gogeta | http://minuum.com/minuum-on-smartwatch/ | 13:20 |
| sandsmark | well, there's a ton of stuff to iron out | 13:21 |
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| gogeta | ping me if you want | 13:22 |
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| beidl | sandsmark: for some reason I don't see the daemon exposed as a service on the session bus | 13:32 |
| sandsmark | hmm | 13:32 |
| beidl | dbus-send --session --dest=org.freedesktop.DBus --type=method_call --print-reply /org/freedesktop/DBus org.freedesktop.DBus.ListNames | 13:33 |
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| sandsmark | neruval: ~/ dbus-send --session --dest=org.freedesktop.DBus --type=method_call --print-reply /org/freedesktop/DBus org.freedesktop.DBus.ListNames | grep beidl | 13:33 |
| sandsmark | string "com.github.beidl.HarbourOwncloud.Daemon" | 13:33 |
| sandsmark | humhum | 13:33 |
| sandsmark | and it should ASSERT out if it can't register on the bus | 13:33 |
| beidl | right | 13:34 |
| beidl | also, what I've noticed, is it needed to expose the Uploader object instead of the dbus handler? | 13:34 |
| sandsmark | well, the dbus adaptor only somehow wraps a normal qobject | 13:35 |
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| sandsmark | yeah, something fails here, when trying to launch it manually at least: [F] qt_assert:2096 - ASSERT: "QDBusConnection::sessionBus().registerService("com.github.beidl.HarbourOwncloud.Daemon")" in file ../../harbour-owncloud/daemon/main.cpp, line 35 | 13:41 |
| sandsmark | hmm, probably because the environment isn't set up properly when I launch it manually | 13:42 |
| beidl | sandsmark: remember that the service is started as part of daemon rpm installation. systemctl --user status harbour-owncloud-daemon | 13:44 |
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| beidl | just to check if the dbus service name is already claimed as part of that | 13:44 |
| beidl | also, the assert doesn't work here. seems like running 2 instances of the daemon doesn't cause one to fail | 13:46 |
| beidl | well... | 13:46 |
| beidl | I guess asserts are kept out of release builds | 13:46 |
| beidl | yup... | 13:47 |
| beidl | I should stop building everything in release mode :) | 13:49 |
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| sandsmark | beidl: ah, should probably do proper error checking instead of relying on asserts :p | 13:58 |
| beidl | sandsmark: done that ;) | 13:58 |
| beidl | !registerService => exit(1).... as proper as it can be :D | 13:59 |
| Merbot` | beidl: Error: "registerService" is not a valid command. | 13:59 |
| DevBot | beidl: Error: "registerService" is not a valid command. | 13:59 |
| beidl | lol | 13:59 |
| sandsmark | haha | 13:59 |
| sandsmark | but hmm | 13:59 |
| sandsmark | why won't it register | 13:59 |
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| beidl | it works for me now. are you sure the systemd user service is not running? | 14:01 |
| sandsmark | ah, it was :D | 14:01 |
| sandsmark | silly me | 14:01 |
| sandsmark | too much automagic | 14:01 |
| beidl | :P | 14:02 |
| sandsmark | hmmhmm, doesn't seem like the debug output from it shows up in the journal? | 14:02 |
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| beidl | yeah, wth | 14:08 |
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| beidl | thank god my owncloud instance just decided to bail out completely.. exposed a regression in the login handling | 14:26 |
| sandsmark | o.O | 14:26 |
| beidl | probably some debian packaging shenanigans with InnoDB | 14:28 |
| sandsmark | well, I use postgres, luckily :p | 14:29 |
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| sandsmark | hmm, FolderListModel is not overly fond of paths with fragments in them, apparently | 14:31 |
| beidl | my teacher sweared by postgres, I never tried it though. how is its memory footprint? (running my oC instance off of 128mb RAM) | 14:31 |
| sandsmark | it scales very well up and down | 14:31 |
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| sandsmark | ime it runs just as fine on an embedded machine with ~no memory, as a beefy server with 128GB ram | 14:32 |
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| sandsmark | a ton of people use it on tiny machines for quassel as well | 14:33 |
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| beidl | I should switch. MySQL causes me to pull my hair. | 14:40 |
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| sandsmark | postgres is a bit more strict ime, but it also has okay error messages so it makes it easy to fix bugs | 14:42 |
| stephg | beidl: innodb is fine, I don't know what debian does but myisam is default out of the box most elsewhere | 14:43 |
| stephg | and that's the problem | 14:43 |
| stephg | innodb is fire-and-forget | 14:43 |
| sandsmark | (ime. mysql accepts too much broken stuff implicitly, sometimes without warnings, a bit like PHP) | 14:43 |
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| beidl | stephg: not if you are running your server on a low-spec ARM device | 14:59 |
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| Nc_ | sandsmark, following up on yesterday's talk, I think I'm officially insane - just installed SDK v1410 instead of v1407, and initial tests don't reproduce the same behaviour as yesterday night | 15:11 |
| sandsmark | o.O | 15:11 |
| sandsmark | maybe 1407 just is extremely buggy | 15:11 |
| sandsmark | or maybe not working with sailfishos 10? | 15:11 |
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| Nc_ | but ... deleting random objects is a very severe bug ... just doesn't ... seem likely | 15:11 |
| sandsmark | though that should be unlikely, unless you link against something without stable ABI | 15:11 |
| sandsmark | yeah... | 15:11 |
| * Nc_ goes and fetch a couple of straightjackets | 15:12 | |
| sandsmark | :D | 15:12 |
| Nc_ | yesterday it was pretty stable - 2nd time I updated colour on the lights, it would hit the destructor on one of them | 15:12 |
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| Nc_ | now changing colours repeatedly, no crashes (*knock on wood*) | 15:13 |
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| sandsmark | sounds like a bug in qt itself, tbh... | 15:14 |
| Nc_ | going berserk on temperature-settings, brightness, saturation ... no crashing ... | 15:14 |
| Nc_ | guess that means I have to wrap up v0.2 for release, and get to work on the Logitech Harmony support | 15:15 |
| sandsmark | :D | 15:15 |
| sandsmark | what are you making= | 15:15 |
| sandsmark | ? | 15:15 |
| Nc_ | (family whining that lights in living room are ...unstable) | 15:15 |
| Nc_ | control-app for LIFX lightbulbs, along with library for detecting and controlling IoT stuff | 15:15 |
| sandsmark | oh, cool | 15:16 |
| Nc_ | for now, library only really support LIFX, which is why the app is limited to that | 15:16 |
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| meekygeek | Hi, Was trying to compile mozilla-central on Jolla phone. Unable to find Skia libraries. The error is : BasicCompositor.cpp:20:56: fatal error: skia/SkCanvas.h: No such file or directory | 15:42 |
| meekygeek | Any prebuilt Skia libraries in repository which can be installed through pkcon or zypper? | 15:43 |
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| tbr | building moz central *on* the jolla? that's bold | 15:48 |
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| sandsmark | mozilla uses skia? | 15:48 |
| sandsmark | I thought that was a chrome thing | 15:48 |
| meekygeek | seems so. | 15:48 |
| meekygeek | it uses skia foe canvas 2D | 15:48 |
| meekygeek | *for | 15:48 |
| Nc_ | Are there any advantages on Jolla/SailfishOS to use Qt::VeryCoarseTimer instead of Qt::CoarseTimer? e.g. power-consumption? | 15:50 |
| sandsmark | yeah | 15:51 |
| sandsmark | it's for timer coalescing, iirc | 15:51 |
| Nc_ | yeah | 15:53 |
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| meekygeek | the skia folder is there in gfx directory. Tried to get the latest and build skia manually as well using gyp/ninja. However got an error while compile SkData.cpp | 15:56 |
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| meekygeek | the error was error: ‘SkLazyPtr’ does not name a type | 15:57 |
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| meekygeek | Thought if there was a prebuilt binary perhaps can somehow bypass and continue the build on it..... | 15:58 |
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| meekygeek | *sigh* believe there is a —disable-skia flag in configure. It never gets honoured during build. Perhaps shall check in mozilla’s bugzilla to see any other settings. | 16:08 |
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| meekygeek | btw, just curious. Does Jolla Browser use skia? or what library does it use to support Canvas API? | 16:10 |
| sandsmark | I *think* it uses Qt for everything | 16:12 |
| sandsmark | but don't quote me on that | 16:12 |
| JoshStrobl | I uses Gecko rather than QtWebkit however. | 16:12 |
| sandsmark | yeah | 16:12 |
| sandsmark | which is annoying :D | 16:13 |
| Tegu | why? | 16:13 |
| sandsmark | gecko feels sluggish | 16:13 |
| JoshStrobl | Nah, I prefer it that way | 16:13 |
| JoshStrobl | Not really | 16:13 |
| Tegu | yea, I kinda like gecko | 16:13 |
| JoshStrobl | Build a better web application. | 16:13 |
| sandsmark | it does | 16:13 |
| sandsmark | ... | 16:13 |
| sandsmark | there's no reason to use gecko | 16:13 |
| sandsmark | and it is behind on standard support | 16:13 |
| JoshStrobl | Yes, there is a reason to use Gecko | 16:13 |
| JoshStrobl | No...just no. | 16:13 |
| sandsmark | that's why webrtc isn't supported in the official browser | 16:13 |
| sandsmark | JoshStrobl: what is the reason? | 16:13 |
| Tegu | and if I need webkit, I just use webcat | 16:13 |
| sandsmark | it also means wasting reasources on supporting yet another browser engine | 16:14 |
| JoshStrobl | sandsmark, WebRTC is supported in Gecko: http://caniuse.com/#search=webrtc | 16:14 |
| sandsmark | and because they are the only (afaik) users of it, they don't get any help for it | 16:14 |
| sandsmark | JoshStrobl: not in sailfishos | 16:14 |
| JoshStrobl | sandsmark, then that is the fault of Jolla for not using a newer Gecko version. | 16:14 |
| sandsmark | JoshStrobl: and I prefer the appear.in tester, that *actually* tests for support | 16:14 |
| sandsmark | JoshStrobl: that is exactly the problem... | 16:14 |
| JoshStrobl | Good for you | 16:14 |
| sandsmark | JoshStrobl: http://iswebrtcready.appear.in/ | 16:15 |
| sandsmark | open that in the default browser | 16:15 |
| sandsmark | also, the gecko codebase is a huge mess... | 16:15 |
| JoshStrobl | sandmark, if people were to simply go only WebKit and/or Blink, we've have yet another browser monopoly, this time just revolving around an engine controlled by a few corporations. | 16:15 |
| JoshStrobl | Yes, so is Webkit | 16:15 |
| sandsmark | no | 16:15 |
| tbr | as if blink would be that much better | 16:15 |
| JoshStrobl | Yes it is | 16:15 |
| sandsmark | have you even looked at the code? | 16:15 |
| JoshStrobl | There is a reason Google forked it | 16:15 |
| meekygeek | I believe gecko (firefox) is perhaps one of the most compliant rendering engine. | 16:15 |
| sandsmark | NSS is horrible | 16:15 |
| sandsmark | JoshStrobl: because they didn't want to wait for webkit maintainers to apply patches | 16:16 |
| sandsmark | meekygeek: no | 16:16 |
| JoshStrobl | sandsmark, and because Webkit is an absolute mess with a lot of compliance issues. | 16:16 |
| sandsmark | JoshStrobl: if you press tab your irc client it complets the nick, btw | 16:16 |
| sandsmark | JoshStrobl: there is no good web standards | 16:16 |
| JoshStrobl | sandsmark, thanks captain obvious | 16:16 |
| sandsmark | it is only defined by what browsers support and implements | 16:16 |
| sandsmark | JoshStrobl: you spelled my nick wrong | 16:16 |
| JoshStrobl | sigh, time to use HexChat ignore functionality | 16:17 |
| sandsmark | ... | 16:17 |
| * tbr hauls in a strategic bucket of popcorn | 16:17 | |
| sandsmark | well, you obviously have no idea what you're talking about | 16:17 |
| JoshStrobl | There done. Ah, much more peaceful now. | 16:17 |
| sandsmark | saw that when you compared the webkit codebase to gecko | 16:17 |
| JoshStrobl | Tegu, you pretty much highlighted what I do. If I need to test QtWebkit, which Webcat uses, I use Webcat :D | 16:18 |
| sandsmark | ... | 16:18 |
| Tegu | also I use Firefox on desktop ^^ | 16:18 |
| sandsmark | that just highlights the problem with gecko not following the standards | 16:18 |
| JoshStrobl | Same | 16:19 |
| JoshStrobl | And Chrome | 16:19 |
| meekygeek | sandsmark: webkit has limited support for webcomponents. They removed support for shadowdom and again indexeddb doesnt have blob support. | 16:19 |
| sandsmark | Tegu: that's a really bad idea, it doesn't do proper sandboxing | 16:19 |
| sandsmark | Tegu: => pretty huge security risk | 16:19 |
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| tbr | *munchmunch* | 16:19 |
| sandsmark | Tegu: it needs to do stuff like this before I would even consider using it: https://code.google.com/p/chromium/wiki/LinuxSandboxing#The_seccomp-bpf_sandbox | 16:20 |
| JoshStrobl | tbr, hey, share that popcorn! | 16:20 |
| * tbr hands JoshStrobl a bowl | 16:20 | |
| * JoshStrobl starts munching. | 16:20 | |
| sandsmark | unfortunately mozilla is wasting their extremely limited manpower on stuff like a custom pdf parser/renderer | 16:20 |
| sandsmark | and because of the state of the gecko codebase they attract very few third-party developers | 16:21 |
| Stskeepz | O_o | 16:22 |
| tbr | Stskeepz: popcorn? beer? have a seat… | 16:23 |
| JoshStrobl | tbr, is the drama still occurring? | 16:23 |
| Nc_ | sandsmark, firefox might be insecure, but at least it is buttslow | 16:23 |
| JoshStrobl | I'll take Nc_ remark as a yes. | 16:24 |
| Stskeepz | now, guys, we can flame all we want somewhere else.. :P | 16:24 |
| sandsmark | yeah, hopefully heap spraying might be interrupted before it finishes :P | 16:24 |
| sandsmark | though their javascript engine is faster than v8 now, iirc. | 16:24 |
| kimmoli | hmm why merobs not updating rpm in repo? | 16:24 |
| * Stskeepz gets out the firehose | 16:24 | |
| * Nc_ gets undressed | 16:25 | |
| kimmoli | sepelipaini? | 16:25 |
| sandsmark | haha | 16:25 |
| * tbr goes to sauna | 16:25 | |
| * JoshStrobl just sits here, continuing to eat popcorn. | 16:25 | |
| Outlander | mozilla yeah, i worry about them sometimes | 16:26 |
| Outlander | investing in pdf files...hmm lol | 16:26 |
| kimmoli | lbt: around ? | 16:26 |
| Outlander | they're trying to rewrite their browser in rust to be 100% memory safe? | 16:27 |
| Outlander | sounds noble | 16:27 |
| JoshStrobl | Outlander, last I checked they aren't rewriting it yet. | 16:27 |
| sandsmark | well, it will probably help a lot, but they haven't even started on a js engine | 16:27 |
| sandsmark | JoshStrobl: servo | 16:27 |
| meekygeek | PDF renderer, wasnt lot of effort. It was a javascript, renderer and thought it was a crosscompiler using emscripten and asm.js | 16:27 |
| JoshStrobl | Outlander, they are waiting for Rust to be in an API stable state. | 16:27 |
| sandsmark | rust and servo are developed more or less in lockstep | 16:28 |
| sandsmark | meekygeek: it was just an example of what they're using engineers on, they have a lot of projects like that | 16:28 |
| Outlander | yeah rust is reallly really annoying when it changes all the time | 16:28 |
| sandsmark | but yeah, stop ranting | 16:28 |
| JoshStrobl | Any programming language is. | 16:29 |
| sandsmark | rust is nice, though | 16:29 |
| Outlander | rust looks cool, really cool. | 16:29 |
| Nc_ | rust? | 16:29 |
| Outlander | they just need to get to 1.0 really fast, cos they're annoying lots of developers | 16:29 |
| sandsmark | Nc_: mozilla's new programming language | 16:29 |
| meekygeek | hmmm hope mozilla doesnt *rust* using rust | 16:29 |
| sandsmark | Outlander: it is pretty fast already | 16:29 |
| Nc_ | http://www.rust-lang.org/? | 16:29 |
| JoshStrobl | I just start writing in Go (I dabbled with it back in 2011). Really loving it. | 16:29 |
| Outlander | golang kinda makes me vomit in my own mouth a bit | 16:29 |
| JoshStrobl | Outlander, how so? | 16:29 |
| sandsmark | Outlander: yeah, same here | 16:29 |
| sandsmark | tried using it for a small project, just gave up half-way through | 16:30 |
| Outlander | the fact that it's not actually offering anything over other languages other than speed, traded off by being just easier to use than C | 16:30 |
| meekygeek | never tried either rust or go. perhaps shall give rust a try | 16:30 |
| Outlander | it just seems like golang will leave a horrible legacy of unmaintainable filthy code | 16:30 |
| JoshStrobl | Outlander, it's concurrency model is boss, its core packages are awesome, and it is fast (which you already stated) | 16:30 |
| sandsmark | yeah, rust is getting pretty fast as well | 16:31 |
| sandsmark | I *think* it has surpassed golang, at least using idiomatic code | 16:31 |
| JoshStrobl | I mean, I'm not one to get into a holy war over programming languages. Rust seems interesting and I think it'll fill the niche of writing a browser engine better than golang. | 16:32 |
| Outlander | the promise of memory safe code, along with concurrency is a better one from Rust from the initial looks I've had at both | 16:32 |
| JoshStrobl | I look forward to Rust being API stable and Mozilla working on a new engine with it. | 16:32 |
| sandsmark | something completely different; has anyone gotten Qt.labs.folderlistmodel to work with folders with #'s in their name? | 16:33 |
| JoshStrobl | Outlander, whether one someone likes a concurrency model of a language over another is subjective. I don't argue with subjective statements ;) | 16:33 |
| JoshStrobl | *whether someone | 16:33 |
| Outlander | my point was, rust does it good enough not to choose golang over it | 16:34 |
| JoshStrobl | Outlander, it depends on your use case. I don't see myself writing web application backends in Rust. | 16:34 |
| Outlander | and the compiler for rust is awesome at giving you hints on what to fix | 16:34 |
| JoshStrobl | Outlander, yes, go build does the same. | 16:34 |
| sandsmark | ah, yes | 16:34 |
| sandsmark | the rust error messages are awesome | 16:35 |
| sandsmark | at least if you're coming from c++ | 16:35 |
| Outlander | I was trying to get a library working that was broken due to rust changes, I also had to fix a few dependent libraries as well, and without knowing all that much, I was able to get pretty far by using the compiler hints on how to fix what was broken | 16:35 |
| meekygeek | *going to sleep* *yawn* | 16:35 |
| Outlander | it was a nice change from obscure errors | 16:35 |
| Outlander | nigth meekygeek | 16:35 |
| Outlander | night even | 16:35 |
| JoshStrobl | Outlander, right. That isn't something specific to Rust though, a lot of modern compilers like tsc (Typescript compiler) and golang's go compiler(go build) provide the same pointers to errors. | 16:36 |
| meekygeek | Outander, sandsmark, JoshStrobi: Happy hacking, catch you later !!! | 16:37 |
| sandsmark | meekygeek: goodnight! | 16:37 |
| JoshStrobl | bye meekygeek! | 16:37 |
| sandsmark | another problem (in my personal opinion) with golang is that I'm not really a big fan of google | 16:37 |
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| JoshStrobl | Outlander, one of the things I do like about Rust is the fact you need to declare a variable as mutable, rather than most languages which require you to state a variable as immutable. | 16:38 |
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| kimmoli | this looks ok https://build.merproject.org/package/binaries/home:kimmoli:randomapps/sailfish-utilities?repository=sailfish_latest_armv7hl but in download repo, still old version http://repo.merproject.org/obs/home:/kimmoli:/randomapps/sailfish_latest_armv7hl/armv7hl/ | 16:43 |
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| Outlander | yeah that's a nice default | 16:47 |
| Outlander | adding to more safety and to being forced to think ahead | 16:48 |
| Outlander | some of the ideas used in Rust are really exciting, to the point where if I was to contribute to a language by writing libraries, I'd probably spend my valuable time contributing to something like Rust | 16:48 |
| JoshStrobl | Where do you see Rust being adopted aside from Mozilla? | 16:49 |
| Outlander | anywhere that needs to be memory safe | 16:49 |
| Outlander | which might be any attack vector where buffer overflows and other memory attacks are common ways in | 16:50 |
| Outlander | that being said, how many memory type attacks happen to erlang? | 16:50 |
| Outlander | APIs, services, but perhaps just any large software project too that would benefit from memory safety being baked in from the start up front | 16:51 |
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| Outlander | you need a rockstar app/company to promote a language though I rekon, to get it market share | 16:52 |
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| Outlander | not sure mozilla is the rockstar company, so might instead need a rockstar browser instead, but browsers are not quick things to code and get mature | 16:52 |
| JoshStrobl | It isn't just about promotion, it is also about integration with services likes Google Apps Engine. | 16:53 |
| JoshStrobl | If people are going to be using a language for web applications, they'll also want to be able to scale it easily. So, having support for the language, including any necessary libs for that particular engine they'll be running it on, is important. | 16:54 |
| JoshStrobl | I think providing a web engine as a sole "major" example of the programming language's use case is too niche. If you want to appeal to a larger developer audience, you need grander developer stories. | 16:55 |
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| r0kk3rz | hey guys, I wrote up a how-to guide for getting your sailfishos app built on MerOBS >> http://sailfishwayfarer.blogspot.co.uk/2014/12/building-apps-with-merobs-and-github.html | 17:17 |
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| r0kk3rz | for anyone interested | 17:17 |
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| stephg | r0kk3rz: cool | 17:18 |
| r0kk3rz | since I figured it out yesterday and was surprised at how easy it was | 17:19 |
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| Outlander | What's the experience like for getting SailfishOS apps into the app store (Jolla app store I guess?) | 17:22 |
| Outlander | JoshStrobl: yeah support for what you want to do with a language is kinda a big point | 17:24 |
| Outlander | I mean, there's the std lib for all language usually, but there should also be some kind of standard library support list that people can check against a new language to know if it's "ready" | 17:24 |
| Outlander | along with the maturity details of each of the libraries in that list | 17:24 |
| arvut | how come changing mac address makes the wlan unconnectable? I was able to set a new one on my n9 with the same commands and get a new ip, but when I do it on my jolla I just get a 169... address | 17:25 |
| Outlander | potentially with levels of library support, where level 1 is the base and supports the top x cloud providers, top x database technologies,etc,etc | 17:25 |
| arvut | ifconfig wlan0 down && ifconfig wlan0 hw ether 00:11:22:33:44:55 && ifconfig wlan0 up | 17:27 |
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| arvut | is what I did | 17:27 |
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| r0kk3rz | Outlander: if the harbour validator in the sailfishos sdk passes, then getting your app in harbor is normally pretty easy | 17:40 |
| r0kk3rz | but the list of allowed includes is fairly short | 17:40 |
| Nokius | kimmoli: still a bit shocked when my Jolla starts to blink :P Thanks | 17:42 |
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| kimmoli | Nokius: .) | 17:51 |
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| kimmoli | r0kk3rz: there is also wh -script which handles creation of mer-obs project and _service file | 17:57 |
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| r0kk3rz | yeah i know, but that involves being setup with OSC | 17:58 |
| r0kk3rz | where as its not such a big deal to do it through the web interface anyway | 17:58 |
| kimmoli | btw, for me, my repo is not updating | 18:00 |
| kimmoli | there hasn't been much activities today, so can't say is it just me or something wron with mer-obs | 18:01 |
| r0kk3rz | sounds like a job for tbr and lbt | 18:01 |
| r0kk3rz | i got nfi, only really figured out how to use OBS over the last couple of days | 18:02 |
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| kimmoli | i admit, i s**k with these abbreviations and searched for nfi, made a typo, ended up here http://www.nfiu.gov.ng/ | 18:06 |
| r0kk3rz | oh | 18:07 |
| r0kk3rz | nfi = no fucking idea, in common australian parlance | 18:07 |
| kimmoli | i know that now .) | 18:08 |
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| qt_junkie | en jaEnEn | 18:27 |
| qt_junkie | oops, sorry. | 18:28 |
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| KingOfTheJews | Question | 20:03 |
| KingOfTheJews | Can install Sailfish on my Nexus 5 Without using a buggy and hacked together version yet? | 20:04 |
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| KingOfTheJews | o-ok | 20:06 |
| KingOfTheJews | Well have a nice day | 20:08 |
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| sandsmark | can someone think of some more useful features?: https://github.com/dicksonleong/Quickddit/pull/10 | 20:57 |
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| Nc_ | In case anyone was interested in seeing screenshots from my LIFX app (since the intersection between LIFX and Jolla appears to be ca 2 people, I assume most of you wouldn't get to see it): https://plus.google.com/u/0/+NielsChristian%C3%98rgaard/posts/SNUc4EAGRHD | 22:59 |
| M4rtinK | Nc_: interesting! :) | 23:06 |
| Nc_ | not exactly more professional UI, but functional, I think | 23:07 |
| M4rtinK | looks god on a quick look :) | 23:09 |
| M4rtinK | maybe add support for using volume keys for manipulating the light ? :) | 23:10 |
| M4rtinK | could be a nice touch :) | 23:10 |
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| Nc_ | M4rtinK, totally agree, if I knew how xD ... will take mental note of it, investigate once I've fixed a few things - and thanks :) | 23:11 |
| M4rtinK | let me know if you need any pointers :) | 23:12 |
| M4rtinK | I got volume keys working in modRana :) | 23:12 |
| Nc_ | Feel free to throw pointers at me - links to examples, documentation etc, and I'll add it to my list of stuff to get to | 23:13 |
| M4rtinK | Nc_: well, this is how I do that: https://github.com/M4rtinK/modrana/blob/master/modules/gui_modules/gui_qt5/qml/sailfish_specific/MediaKeys.qml :) | 23:18 |
| M4rtinK | that should more or less cover it :) | 23:19 |
| Nc_ | ...that looks VERY simple :p | 23:19 |
| M4rtinK | just note that it is of course not Harbor compatible :) | 23:19 |
| M4rtinK | like well about any useful API :D | 23:19 |
| Nc_ | my app requires changing low-level network settings, because Jolla thinks being a modern mobile-OS is too much of a hassle - pretty sure my app won't make it into Harbour any time soon :D | 23:20 |
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| M4rtinK | then no problem :) | 23:29 |
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| Nc_ | M4rtinK, mordant is confirmed to run on various platforms, but not Jolla? (reading the ReadMe.md) | 23:35 |
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| M4rtinK | modRana ? :) | 23:39 |
| M4rtinK | sure it does | 23:39 |
| M4rtinK | most probably just another stale README I forgot to update :) | 23:39 |
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| Nc_ | yeah, I really need to kill that autocorrect in xChat | 23:45 |
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