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| zGrr | moin :) | 07:55 |
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| stephg | ningles! | 07:59 |
| dr_gogeta86 | guys good morning | 08:05 |
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| dr_gogeta86 | this morning are we ready or still sleep | 08:26 |
| dr_gogeta86 | ? | 08:26 |
| SK_work | ? | 08:27 |
| SK_work | morning dr_gogeta86 | 08:27 |
| dr_gogeta86 | hi SK_work | 08:27 |
| dr_gogeta86 | how do you do ? | 08:28 |
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| SK_work | fine | 08:34 |
| SK_work | bit tired these days though | 08:34 |
| dr_gogeta86 | don't say any | 08:36 |
| dr_gogeta86 | I've spent last 2h of my life advocating timestamping is not cheap talk | 08:36 |
| dr_gogeta86 | i hate programmer doens't follow/know conventions | 08:36 |
| dr_gogeta86 | especially RFC | 08:36 |
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| SK_work | +1 | 08:39 |
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| tortoisedoc | ahoi | 09:41 |
| tortoisedoc | what is the counterpart of jolla-settings? | 09:42 |
| tortoisedoc | in nemomobile I mean? | 09:42 |
| SK_work | tortoisedoc: nothing | 09:42 |
| tortoisedoc | (if there is such thing, that is) | 09:42 |
| tortoisedoc | aah :/ | 09:43 |
| tortoisedoc | a pity | 09:43 |
| faenil | tortoisedoc: the settings app is qmlsettings | 09:44 |
| tortoisedoc | faenil, SK_work : ok, not specifically the qml settings plugin, but the actuall "Settings" app (with sys settings etc) | 09:44 |
| tortoisedoc | (just doublechecking) | 09:44 |
| SK_work | tortoisedoc: IIRC, nothing | 09:45 |
| SK_work | no GUI exists | 09:45 |
| faenil | SK_work: qmlsettings?? | 09:45 |
| faenil | tortoisedoc: https://github.com/nemomobile/qmlsettings | 09:45 |
| SK_work | faenil: ha, missed this | 09:45 |
| tortoisedoc | faenil :thanks, found that, but was not completely sure if it was the relateive nemomobile counterpart, hence the need to ask | 09:46 |
| tortoisedoc | faenil: to you knowledge, does qmlsettings provide the "favorites" functionality too? | 09:46 |
| faenil | tortoisedoc: well, it's the qtcomponents app...there are no Glacier apps so far, as glacier components are not ready yet | 09:46 |
| faenil | tortoisedoc: I don't think so | 09:46 |
| tortoisedoc | faenil : thanks | 09:47 |
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| tortoisedoc | faenil_ : can you share more info on how the jolla-settings handles favourite events? | 09:50 |
| tortoisedoc | (I assume you know about it, sorry) | 09:51 |
| SK_work | tortoisedoc: this is not nemo related IIRC | 09:51 |
| tortoisedoc | SK_work : so? | 09:51 |
| tortoisedoc | asking is not a crime :P | 09:51 |
| SK_work | it is jolla settings related | 09:51 |
| SK_work | nemo-settings I meant | 09:51 |
| SK_work | :) | 09:51 |
| tortoisedoc | :D | 09:51 |
| SK_work | tortoisedoc: I think you need to either dig dconf, or dig .config to find your answer :) | 09:51 |
| faenil_ | tortoisedoc: my internship at jollas was almost a year ago :P sorry I don't know | 09:52 |
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| tortoisedoc | SK_work : I have done that already :P, and am interested to understand how jolla-settings uses that info :) | 09:52 |
| tortoisedoc | faenil_ : aaah ok :) | 09:52 |
| tortoisedoc | faenil : aaah ok :) | 09:52 |
| faenil | :) | 09:53 |
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| SK_work | faenil: did you hacked jolla-settings at Jolla ? | 09:56 |
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| faenil | SK_work: nope | 09:58 |
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| * tortoisedoc surprised how quiet it is around here.... | 09:59 | |
| * tortoisedoc update coming up? :P | 09:59 | |
| kimmoli | sounds like invitation to say something stupid - again | 09:59 |
| tortoisedoc | kimmoli : no need to, I just did | 09:59 |
| tortoisedoc | so that's taken care of | 09:59 |
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| dr_gogeta86 | tortoisedoc, you can answer this | 10:14 |
| dr_gogeta86 | how to keepalive after windows destroy how quickbar do | 10:14 |
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| faenil | at this right moment, my opinion is Update9 has been skipped as well | 10:18 |
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| faenil | tortoisedoc: ^ | 10:18 |
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| faenil | it's going to be update10, half october, or somethign | 10:19 |
| * dr_gogeta86 faenil, like a lightening | 10:19 | |
| dr_gogeta86 | in clear sky | 10:19 |
| faenil | lol | 10:19 |
| dr_gogeta86 | are you in pause ? | 10:20 |
| faenil | pause from what | 10:20 |
| dr_gogeta86 | thesis | 10:20 |
| faenil | I'm supposed to always work on it, but I waste my time here from time to time :p | 10:20 |
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| dr_gogeta86 | back to work | 10:21 |
| dr_gogeta86 | i'm slacking here while i'm finish a RedHat 7.3 p2v | 10:21 |
| dr_gogeta86 | using cpio | 10:21 |
| dr_gogeta86 | old tools for old things :-D | 10:21 |
| tbr | 7.3 was one of the first distros I used | 10:22 |
| dr_gogeta86 | this distro come out on 22 october 2001 | 10:22 |
| dr_gogeta86 | mine was 6.0 | 10:22 |
| dr_gogeta86 | but i begin with slackware 3.0 | 10:23 |
| dr_gogeta86 | at 11 | 10:23 |
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| dr_gogeta86 | i remeber that day I went to computer shop asking a linux compilation and I pop out with 2 boxes for free | 10:24 |
| dr_gogeta86 | one with and old slackware (3.0 ) and one with deluxe edition of OS/2 | 10:24 |
| dr_gogeta86 | the last before warp | 10:24 |
| faenil | hehe | 10:25 |
| tbr | lol, Warp wasn't even that bad. especially if you installed it over a windows, so that it enabled the win16 compat layer | 10:25 |
| dr_gogeta86 | and my mother you buyed all this things | 10:25 |
| dr_gogeta86 | i don't beleve those are free | 10:25 |
| dr_gogeta86 | at computer shop | 10:25 |
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| dr_gogeta86 | they said to my mother, I give out this things for free, his son deserves it ... because even to those who sell these things? | 10:27 |
| dr_gogeta86 | was mid 1998 | 10:27 |
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| dr_gogeta86 | guys have laugh | 10:30 |
| dr_gogeta86 | bash version 2.05a 2001 :-D | 10:30 |
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| lainwir3d | hi | 11:48 |
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| coderus | in jolla google password stored in plain text now, right? | 12:28 |
| coderus | i just forgot my password and want to remember it :D | 12:28 |
| Bysmyyr | I think no because there is that permission page | 12:29 |
| coderus | ah, oauth? | 12:30 |
| coderus | ok( | 12:30 |
| coderus | will reset it then | 12:30 |
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| kimmoli | luck for it.. | 13:08 |
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| tortoisedoc | dr_gogeta86 : sorry | 13:15 |
| tortoisedoc | dr_gogeta86 : <dr_gogeta86> how to keepalive after windows destroy how quickbar do | 13:15 |
| dr_gogeta86 | yes | 13:15 |
| tortoisedoc | dr_gogeta86 : you mean application should not quit after window is hidden? | 13:15 |
| dr_gogeta86 | yep | 13:15 |
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| King_DuckZ | hello, anybody knows when the next update will be released? They told me there is one every month, but I haven't seen any in the past 2+ months | 13:34 |
| Nicd- | King_DuckZ: there was the summer vacation | 13:35 |
| Nicd- | the september update has also been delayed "for a few weeks" so they can get Qt 5.2 stable | 13:35 |
| Nicd- | take a look at https://together.jolla.com/question/55909/official-annoucement-uitukka-is-just-around-the-corner-hold-on/ | 13:35 |
| tortoisedoc | dr_gogeta86 : use a c++ hide command | 13:38 |
| dr_gogeta86 | some public examples | 13:39 |
| tortoisedoc | dr_gogeta86 : iirc you should be able to use it from qml | 13:39 |
| tortoisedoc | -> google :) | 13:39 |
| King_DuckZ | "Now that the Finnish summer heat has cooled down" <-- this can't be serious, is it? | 13:40 |
| Nicd- | King_DuckZ: what? we had some hot days :) | 13:40 |
| King_DuckZ | Nicd-: come on, I've been in the UK for the past 2 years and haven't seen anything above 30 degrees at all... and finland is way up north from here... -_- | 13:42 |
| Nicd- | we had 30+ this summer too | 13:42 |
| tortoisedoc | Nicd- : SOME hot days? this has been the best finnish summer i've experienced since moving to this country | 13:42 |
| King_DuckZ | so Finland is warmer than uk during summer? | 13:43 |
| tortoisedoc | King_DuckZ : for like, 5 days? | 13:43 |
| tortoisedoc | (mostly not even in a row) | 13:43 |
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| tortoisedoc | and compared to "normal" european summers, summer feels like a real summer starting beg july - mid/end august | 13:44 |
| tortoisedoc | nothing like the may / oct of italy for instance | 13:44 |
| King_DuckZ | Nicd-: btw thanks, that's exactly the info I was looking for, I was hoping to get the update before my holidays on october, and apparently there is still hope - not that it would be a problem to wait until I come back | 13:44 |
| * King_DuckZ is used to italian summer - may to early october usually | 13:45 | |
| Nicd- | King_DuckZ: on average the UK is warmer but maybe you have had crappy summers | 13:45 |
| dr_gogeta86 | King_DuckZ, this year summer sucks a lot here | 13:45 |
| inte | north of germany: summer was great :)) | 13:46 |
| tortoisedoc | dr_gogeta86 : here is where? | 13:46 |
| dr_gogeta86 | italy anyone know where i come from | 13:46 |
| King_DuckZ | Nicd-: iono, they say it was the worst of the past century or something, but then the one before this they claimed it was scorching hot, and I still think it was too cold to go out of my flat without moving or heating up somehow | 13:46 |
| tortoisedoc | dr_gogeta86 : not me:P | 13:46 |
| King_DuckZ | neither me | 13:47 |
| dr_gogeta86 | know you know that | 13:50 |
| dr_gogeta86 | tortoisedoc, thnx for info | 13:50 |
| King_DuckZ | omg on vopium they don't even mention jolla in the list | 13:52 |
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| dr_gogeta86 | http://www.theverge.com/2014/9/22/6826051/nokia-saw-the-future-but-couldnt-build-it | 13:52 |
| dr_gogeta86 | another n9 epitaph | 13:53 |
| King_DuckZ | so what's the jolla phone's name? the other half? or is that the back cover only? | 13:53 |
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| SK_work | Jolla's phone is Jolla | 13:55 |
| SK_work | :) | 13:55 |
| SK_work | dr_gogeta86: yep, yet another | 13:55 |
| King_DuckZ | same name as the brand? 'cause I'm reporting it on vopium's website | 13:55 |
| dr_gogeta86 | so i was right | 13:55 |
| dr_gogeta86 | and some one sucks alot | 13:55 |
| King_DuckZ | if anybody with an account on vopium can do the same please, so maybe I will get the app at same point, thanks :) | 13:57 |
| zGrr | Does the Jolla have SIP integrated in the system like N900 and N9? | 14:03 |
| SK_work | zGrr: no | 14:04 |
| SK_work | not yet ? | 14:04 |
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| faenil | jusa_: ^ | 14:04 |
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| zGrr | REALLY? | 14:04 |
| zGrr | That's strange. | 14:04 |
| faenil | or tbr ^ | 14:04 |
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| faenil | zGrr: I think some parts of it work | 14:05 |
| tbr | there is a TJC item on it, please read it | 14:05 |
| faenil | I remember somebody trying | 14:05 |
| faenil | ah ok, there you go zGrr ^ :) | 14:05 |
| tbr | it basically works, but lacks integration, joll task | 14:05 |
| tbr | you can make calls but they come out upside down bottom speaker, top microphone and you can't reroute audio to headphones or bluetooth | 14:06 |
| tbr | also dialer goes crazy under certain conditions | 14:06 |
| zGrr | I see. Voip-in probably doesn't work too? | 14:07 |
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| tbr | zGrr: what's voip-in? | 14:08 |
| zGrr | Damn! I'll be stuck to my old good N900 forever. | 14:08 |
| zGrr | tbr: so you can receive Voip call onto your handset. | 14:09 |
| tbr | zGrr: that's the only thing that works. outbound would probably work somehow but you'd need to start it from terminal, as the dialer doesn't support it | 14:09 |
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| jusa_ | iirc getting routing to work is either really simple or horror | 14:14 |
| tbr | the latter probably prolog induced | 14:14 |
| jusa_ | maybe | 14:15 |
| jusa_ | *yes | 14:15 |
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| zGrr | Phone without SIP is not very useful for me :( | 14:17 |
| jusa_ | zGrr: how come? | 14:18 |
| chem|st | jusa_: cause people use SIP instead of GSM nowadays | 14:19 |
| dr_gogeta86 | people use skype and that frak of facetime ... due works better than skype | 14:20 |
| chem|st | ever since n900 my mobilephone was my 3rd handset at home or my virtual landline otg - so for now I have my N9 otg for navigation and SIP | 14:22 |
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| zGrr | I use SIP alongside two (2) SIP lines. | 14:38 |
| zGrr | I use cellullar alongside two (2) SIP lines. | 14:38 |
| zGrr | N900 is still my primary mobile phone. | 14:39 |
| zGrr | It has much better transceiver than N9. | 14:40 |
| zGrr | And FM transmitter useful in car. | 14:42 |
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| King_DuckZ | I never heard about this facetime, but on wikipedia I see there is no linux version | 15:21 |
| King_DuckZ | it doesn't sound very useful if it's locked to only one platform | 15:22 |
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| SK_work | King_DuckZ: well | 15:26 |
| SK_work | Apple style | 15:26 |
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| SK_work | there is no win version, just a mac and iphone version | 15:27 |
| King_DuckZ | meh | 15:28 |
| King_DuckZ | speaking of that, I never tried but does sailfish support voice chat on xmpp? | 15:28 |
| King_DuckZ | I remember the quality being very good last time I tried with pidgin, almost 1 year ago | 15:29 |
| SK_work | don't think so | 15:29 |
| SK_work | as google killed their jabber with voice | 15:29 |
| chem|st | King_DuckZ: jabber support is limited to "you can text" | 15:29 |
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| chem|st | King_DuckZ: facetime was advertised as "the first video call on cell phones", I pulled my n900 and videocalled a friend to tell the obviously mis-advertisement | 15:31 |
| King_DuckZ | chem|st: it looks very well integrated to me, not something put there just because some dev was bored and hacked a few things together | 15:31 |
| chem|st | King_DuckZ: well integrated does not mean that it has more functionality than that atm | 15:31 |
| King_DuckZ | chem|st: apple is all about lies - they also claim a pc running macos is not a pc o.O | 15:32 |
| King_DuckZ | chem|st: sure | 15:32 |
| King_DuckZ | do you think they will add voice? or file transfer? I get it you can't send/receive files either | 15:32 |
| sjtoik | the wave addition was awesome though. | 15:33 |
| chem|st | I don't think there is anyone at jolla available for such a minor thing as xmpp | 15:33 |
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| chem|st | King_DuckZ: well... just because it wont run on other PCs... | 15:36 |
| King_DuckZ | minor? | 15:39 |
| chem|st | I am thinking about buying a ~new N9 as primary phone again, I was forced to using my Jolla by a failing modem though... | 15:39 |
| chem|st | King_DuckZ: that is what they think | 15:40 |
| chem|st | King_DuckZ: jolla needs to make a difference but first of all they need to get SFOS out of beta stage | 15:40 |
| King_DuckZ | idk why ppl keep on saying xmpp is not important, nobody uses it... I get this a lot, and almost everybody's got a gtalk account, or jabber, or I hear even facebook chat is based on xmpp | 15:41 |
| chem|st | King_DuckZ: gtalk will be turned off, facebook will be turned off... | 15:42 |
| chem|st | to be honest I have only a handfull of people with "real" jabber accounts | 15:42 |
| chem|st | $user does not want to care about such things as accounts, see whatsapp | 15:43 |
| King_DuckZ | chem|st: will they? I never heard of such thing | 15:43 |
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| faenil | VDVsx: ping | 15:44 |
| King_DuckZ | my co-worker tells me that google *might* be shutting down gtalk, as they are investing in hangouts, which is also xmpp-based he says | 15:45 |
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| chem|st | King_DuckZ: gtalk or now called hangouts does support thirdparty IM still... | 15:47 |
| chem|st | http://www.zdnet.com/google-moves-away-from-the-xmpp-open-messaging-standard-7000015918/ | 15:48 |
| chem|st | it is more like the outside world is now very limited... | 15:49 |
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| King_DuckZ | omg, everybody is trying to lock users in a network that is incompatible with every other netwrk... wth... | 15:50 |
| chem|st | King_DuckZ: google actually tried to NOT do that but all others did not follow the idea | 15:51 |
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| chem|st | so they cut it as this is something you need to maintain properly (needs manpower to stay alive when evolving other parts) | 15:52 |
| VDVsx | faenil, pong | 15:53 |
| chem|st | so now we have another 5 popular IM services, all incompatible | 15:53 |
| faenil | VDVsx: just a quick question, is the email client still useless when the connection indicator *thinks* (and it's wrong, because browser works) that there is no connection? | 15:54 |
| faenil | (I mean in the coming update) | 15:54 |
| Tofe | chem|st: yeah, welcome to 2004... | 15:54 |
| VDVsx | faenil, dunno, don't have such problems, nothing to fix in email side, that's network issue | 15:55 |
| VDVsx | but network stack is quite improved | 15:56 |
| faenil | VDVsx: let me rephrase, the connection tester is bugged, it shows an "!" to say that you're connected but there's no internet, but that's false | 15:56 |
| faenil | browser works, it doesn't ask to connect | 15:56 |
| King_DuckZ | chem|st: this sucks so much... if I want to chat to my jap friends I need to have LINE, but mac users will probably have this facelike thing, but not the americans, which will prefer skype, and then many seem to still enjoy whatsapp, viber, vopium, but if you're a gamer you will likely be on steam instead | 15:56 |
| faenil | would it be possible for the email client to behave the same? | 15:56 |
| King_DuckZ | chem|st: this is so fuc**d up | 15:57 |
| chem|st | Tofe: feels more like 1992 all over again | 15:57 |
| faenil | VDVsx: there's just an extra "if" in the email client that checks the "!" (not only if you're connected) | 15:57 |
| VDVsx | faenil, browser does some low level call afair for some other reason, doing the same is just going around actual bug | 15:57 |
| Tofe | chem|st: ah, for me 92 was irc, so I didn't know icq and such, yet | 15:58 |
| King_DuckZ | chem|st: I might just come up with my own personal protocol, anyways if I want to chat with a new person I'm very likely missing the app he/she uses | 15:58 |
| faenil | VDVsx: yes, it's a workaround to avoid making everyone's client useless until the network indicator works properly :P | 15:58 |
| VDVsx | nop is something else | 15:58 |
| VDVsx | all other apps use the qt apis | 15:58 |
| VDVsx | so all will work same way | 15:59 |
| faenil | mm? | 15:59 |
| chem|st | Tofe: starting-all-over-again there was IRC but what-server-are-you-on? | 15:59 |
| faenil | VDVsx: alright...so, alternative solution: write "No internet" on top of the client? (where you write "sync failed") | 15:59 |
| chem|st | Tofe: I am connected to like 5 networks as every user-theme has its desired network | 16:00 |
| faenil | VDVsx: the current behaviour is, I tap on update, and the app just *ignores* it completely | 16:00 |
| Morpog_PC | faenil, I never had the problem you describe with email client | 16:00 |
| faenil | VDVsx: so, whatever you can do to improve this situation is appreciated :p | 16:00 |
| King_DuckZ | ah right, I forgot IRC | 16:00 |
| Tofe | chem|st: and how many clients ? one. | 16:00 |
| faenil | Morpog_PC: it's very easy to reproduce, but you need a captive portal which makes the connection tester thing you're not online when you actually are (because you logged in and everything is working) | 16:01 |
| chem|st | Tofe: yes one, now - I did not have a multi-network client in the 90s | 16:01 |
| Tofe | ah, well, I don't remember if mine did :) | 16:01 |
| faenil | VDVsx: or maybe you added an error message already? I don't know, I'm asking ;) | 16:02 |
| VDVsx | faenil, humm, so you mean, the dialog does not pop up again ? | 16:02 |
| chem|st | I stopped using IM for quiet a long time (5 years) and started all over again in 2003 | 16:02 |
| faenil | VDVsx: which dialog? | 16:02 |
| Morpog_PC | internet connection dialof | 16:02 |
| VDVsx | faenil, to connect to network ? | 16:03 |
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| faenil | VDVsx: it seems I wasn't clear :D | 16:03 |
| faenil | VDVsx: I *am* connected to a wifi network | 16:03 |
| Tofe | chem|st: I wasn't very active in my early years either | 16:04 |
| faenil | it's just that the network indicator shows "!" because even if I'm connected, it thinks it cannot surf the internet (wrong) | 16:04 |
| VDVsx | faenil, but probably connman says something else | 16:04 |
| VDVsx | faenil, can you get journal of that, connect to network make sure email client not open, open app, do the sync | 16:04 |
| chem|st | Tofe: nevertheless stupid people want stupid IM - something everybody is at and something you do not need to setup | 16:05 |
| faenil | VDVsx: ok sure | 16:05 |
| faenil | VDVsx: at the moment I'm not even logged in to the uni wifi | 16:05 |
| faenil | so I can do it | 16:05 |
| faenil | that's an example...you connect to wifi, but you need to login first, so the "!" appears | 16:05 |
| chem|st | Tofe: easiest way, have sms/mms worldwide free of charge and add browserclients to phones so you can use it from everywhere else too... | 16:06 |
| chem|st | that this is the worst I do not need to tell right? | 16:06 |
| Tofe | :) | 16:07 |
| Tofe | ah, iMessage, what a dream | 16:07 |
| VDVsx | faenil, ok, when you get it please send me by mail | 16:07 |
| VDVsx | thx | 16:07 |
| faenil | VDVsx: it's very short | 16:08 |
| faenil | Sep 22 18:07:51 dhcppc7 creen[20263]: [D] EmailAgent::executeCurrent:1018 - Current action not executed, waiting for newtwork | 16:08 |
| chem|st | I'd like to have email like services for IM - so combine ricochet with xmpp and I am all yours | 16:08 |
| faenil | that's what happens the "first" time I try to sync | 16:08 |
| faenil | the other times it just enqueues the action | 16:08 |
| VDVsx | faenil, see, network stack says that is offline, can't do anything there | 16:10 |
| faenil | VDVsx: what about displaying "No Network" !?!?! :D | 16:10 |
| Tofe | chem|st: well yes sure... but you'll be quite alone on that network :/ | 16:11 |
| faenil | doing nothing when the user presses a button is never the answer, imho :D | 16:11 |
| VDVsx | it just queues the actions, strange that dialog is not shown that's the bug | 16:11 |
| VDVsx | in those cases you should be boobed with the dialog | 16:12 |
| faenil | VDVsx: why should the dialog be shown? I'm already connected to a wifi network | 16:12 |
| faenil | VDVsx: ah, ok...well, it doesn't :D | 16:12 |
| VDVsx | well, network manager does think so | 16:12 |
| VDVsx | does not | 16:12 |
| faenil | VDVsx: are you sure it should pop up the dialog if it's already connected to a wifi network (which requires a login though) ? | 16:12 |
| javispedro | there's a connman "issue" where it will fail to recheck for internet connectivity after it has decided the current network doesn't offer it | 16:13 |
| VDVsx | either show a dialog or report the correct state(connected) | 16:13 |
| javispedro | this was on a t.j.c post | 16:13 |
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| faenil | VDVsx: the thing is, I'm connected but there's no internet | 16:13 |
| faenil | javispedro: yeah that's the main issue | 16:13 |
| faenil | but now we're only discussing about email client UX | 16:14 |
| VDVsx | if everything was working properly that dialog would show, so no need for extra errors | 16:14 |
| Tofe | the possibility to force a network re-check would be quite fine, if the rest is problematic | 16:15 |
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| javispedro | assume the following scenario | 16:16 |
| faenil | VDVsx: are you 100% that if you're *CONNECTED* to a wifi network, which though requires a login so you don't have internet access BUT YOU'RE CONNECTED, the system is supposed to show the connection popup? | 16:16 |
| javispedro | you connect to an adhoc wifi network | 16:16 |
| faenil | I think the popup is only for when you're *not* connected to any network | 16:16 |
| javispedro | you're "connected" to a network but connman will never get the "online" status | 16:16 |
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| javispedro | if you ask Qt bearer for internet connectivity it will say "NOT online" | 16:16 |
| javispedro | but if you ask for the connection popup it'll fail to show up because you're already connected | 16:17 |
| faenil | VDVsx: ^ | 16:18 |
| Tofe | so, a network status mismatch, somehow | 16:19 |
| faenil | well, you cannot assume that you're on the internet only because you are connected to a wifi network | 16:20 |
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| Tofe | faenil: the check does... | 16:20 |
| VDVsx | probably a valid case, I don't remember how that connection ui works, but was mostly scrapped already, have to check | 16:20 |
| Tofe | faenil: ah sorry misunderstood your sentence | 16:21 |
| faenil | VDVsx: who can I ask? | 16:21 |
| faenil | Tofe: no problem :) | 16:21 |
| VDVsx | faenil, this guy :P https://github.com/nemomobile/nemo-qml-plugin-connectivity/blob/master/src/connectionhelper.cpp#L132 | 16:23 |
| faenil | lol | 16:24 |
| VDVsx | if the rest is working properly, a error can be easily added, just need to test it does not return some false positives again | 16:25 |
| faenil | VDVsx: that code is correct though | 16:25 |
| VDVsx | yes, but probably will just fail after in such case, and dialog never shown since is connected | 16:26 |
| faenil | VDVsx: I do agree that the dialog should NOT be shown...the dialog is only for when you're not connected to any network,imho | 16:26 |
| VDVsx | yes | 16:27 |
| faenil | so, it's okay that there is no dialog | 16:27 |
| faenil | the problem is just the email client should show "No network" | 16:28 |
| VDVsx | yup, just error should be there, when it fails to get valid route | 16:28 |
| faenil | just like the store app does, for instance | 16:28 |
| faenil | connman told you're not connected? good, tell the user :D | 16:28 |
| VDVsx | took note, will fix that when I've some time to work in email | 16:29 |
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| faenil | VDVsx: great, thanks! | 16:29 |
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| chem|st | Tofe: and that is a $user problem, so what I do is "no I won't join your IM network - write me an email!" | 16:30 |
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| ryukafalz | chem|st: I am perhaps lucky... the few people I talk to most are using pure XMPP | 18:30 |
| ryukafalz | and for a few others stuck in the past I have a gateway running to AIM | 18:30 |
| ryukafalz | that takes care of everyone I care about talking to on a regular basis | 18:31 |
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| ryukafalz | for others... everyone seems to like SMS a lot, which is... blech | 18:31 |
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| Acce | anyone here able to tell why the systemd timers won't wake up the system? kinda makes the systemd user timers useless | 18:37 |
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| kimmoli | if iconButton is highlighted, it doesn't follow changing icon.source. grr.. | 20:13 |
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| chem|st | ryukafalz: lucky that is, indeed - aks them if they want to be my friends too^^ | 20:25 |
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| ryukafalz | chem|st: Hah, well, it's only because I've managed to poke them into it :P | 20:26 |
| ryukafalz | We really need a really good chat system that takes very little effort to use | 20:26 |
| chem|st | Acce: read about it on tjc, seems a missing flag to be part of the alarmd sequence?! | 20:27 |
| chem|st | ryukafalz: xmpp is that system, teh problem is the clients for android are so immature that it doesn't help the cause | 20:28 |
| ryukafalz | chem|st: I would argue that yaxim is very mature | 20:28 |
| ryukafalz | and wish many of its features were available on sailfis | 20:28 |
| ryukafalz | *sailfish | 20:28 |
| chem|st | most people need _text_ and _files_ | 20:28 |
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| ryukafalz | hm, fair enough, but sailfish's messaging doesn't do that either afaik | 20:29 |
| ryukafalz | it's based on telepathy though so implementing it shouldn't be too bad | 20:29 |
| ryukafalz | in any case, the state of xmpp clients on iOS is even worse | 20:29 |
| chem|st | I tried clients on my tablet for my GF to find not a single one that is able to send files or if it can only send if encryption is on (chatsecure) | 20:29 |
| Acce | chem|st: I'm not very familiar with systemd's components.. but I think there wouldn't be harm allowing timers to wake up the system | 20:30 |
| chem|st | Acce: it actually does | 20:30 |
| ryukafalz | chem|st: I would argue that XMPP, while nice, isn't secure enough in current implementations | 20:30 |
| ryukafalz | and that we really need something serverless like Ricochet | 20:30 |
| Acce | hmm? what harm does it cause? other than making it possible for 3rd party apps to install their own timers? | 20:30 |
| ryukafalz | (preferably with limited relays for offline messaging) | 20:31 |
| chem|st | Acce: there is one daemon checking for waiting tasks and that got triggered just a little to often in update5 (iirc) that made the phone wake up so often that you recognized the powerdrain | 20:31 |
| chem|st | Acce: so what is actually happening is that you need some RTCalarm service (hardware) and that is very limited (for now) - please be aware I am a noob on this too, but afaiu it is pretty impossible to have a cronjob like behaviour on our jollas | 20:33 |
| Acce | hmm I see.. too bad if it can't be done in some good way.. the systemd timers are just much easier than making some code with libiphb everytime I want to do something regularly | 20:33 |
| Acce | and if that is the case, why is the libiphb any better, anyways? | 20:34 |
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| Acce | because it only checks for the one spesific interval, not all possible intervals? | 20:35 |
| chem|st | ryukafalz: xmpp -> the real one <- is undertaking a full SSL sweep-up server<>server AND client<>server encryption, what else do you need (apart from actual msg encryption and total metadata oblivion)? | 20:35 |
| ryukafalz | chem|st: Ideally? The server shouldn't be able to read the content of messages passing through it. There's a level of implicit trust in your server (and your friends' servers) that I don't like. | 20:37 |
| ryukafalz | But at the same time I want conversation syncing between devices, which is hard to do without server-side storage. It's a tricky balacne. | 20:38 |
| chem|st | Acce: I don't know what the interval is but it was too short once and recognized in powerconsumption, the only sane way would be to have access to when it wakes, I honestly do not get why you should have any wakeupinterval, plain rtcalarmtimer set when going to sleep | 20:38 |
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| chem|st | ryukafalz: so put pgp on top, I have that setup... and I am very sorry but most otr solutions just fail | 20:40 |
| Acce | hmm.. could the systemd be rigged in a way that it checks for registered timers before sleeping, and setting rtcalarmtimer if it finds some? | 20:40 |
| chem|st | Acce: out of my league | 20:40 |
| Acce | out of my league too, just throwing ideas out of my head, heh | 20:41 |
| chem|st | Acce: that would be the sane thing in my eyes, system checks least value to wake up and sets rtcalarm - done | 20:41 |
| chem|st | when it goes to sleep again it repeats | 20:42 |
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| M4rtinK | chem|st, Acce: it my opinion just properly supporting the systemd timers is the best thing | 20:43 |
| M4rtinK | rather than using hacks like a separate library | 20:43 |
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| M4rtinK | you have it all in one place, you can check which of them are scheduled at the moment, etc. | 20:44 |
| Acce | yes, I don't see what is the meaning of including the timer functionality at all, if the wakeups aren't working.. it's not that often that I happen to look at my phone when it's 15/30/45/00 | 20:44 |
| Acce | I guess the guys are just too busy with other stuff to think about it | 20:44 |
| M4rtinK | also I think the store does not support (?) custom units anyway, so the crippled Harbor compatible apps should be fine | 20:45 |
| Acce | and the lib just happened to be there and is working so they pushed it away for the time being | 20:45 |
| M4rtinK | sure looks like it | 20:45 |
| M4rtinK | it is funny how there are horrendous hacks being used for one thing | 20:46 |
| chem|st | M4rtinK: support them how? it is broken one layer below that... timers do work like they should, the powersaving-stanby is not working as you expect it to so you think the timer is bogus but its not | 20:46 |
| M4rtinK | but other much less problematic things are not allowed, at least in the store | 20:46 |
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| M4rtinK | chem|st: sure, I think systemd indeed does not expect the system to just suspend at random | 20:47 |
| M4rtinK | or to be more precise, if I for example suspend my laptop, I don't expect a systemd timer to wake it up (that would be actually a major problem) | 20:47 |
| M4rtinK | but Sailfish is the one having control over the it's suspend machinery | 20:48 |
| M4rtinK | and it shouldn't be that hard to check for pending timers before suspending and schedule a wakeup accordingly | 20:48 |
| M4rtinK | that would be actually rather elegant | 20:48 |
| chem|st | M4rtinK: I would expect a laptop to wake up from suspend by systemd-timer, why should it not? if that is your arguement then what you are asking from sailfish is void | 20:49 |
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| M4rtinK | well, if it wakes up in my bag, it will probably overheat & shorten the service life of the battery quite a bit | 20:51 |
| M4rtinK | and of course it will be out of energy when I might need it | 20:51 |
| M4rtinK | (if it was something other than a Thinkpad, the results might be quite a lot worse) | 20:51 |
| M4rtinK | on the other hand, the suspend used on Sailfish is quite a bit different | 20:52 |
| chem|st | M4rtinK: my system goes down to suspend2ram with a wakeup call after 24h to suspend2disk, the first attempts had me hibernate every time I woke it up... | 20:52 |
| M4rtinK | chem|st: oh, that's a rather nice idea | 20:53 |
| M4rtinK | I use my latopt quite a lot, so there is not much chance of the battery going flat during suspend before I plug it in again | 20:53 |
| M4rtinK | but your solution seems is pretty robust :) | 20:54 |
| chem|st | I have ~3days suspend2ram on battery, I had it set to hybrid before but closing the lid made it suspend so when I woke it up it went down again instantly as I suspended it in the middle of writing to the disk^^ | 20:54 |
| Acce | on a completely another matter (sorry), is it possible to change the system language on the emulator to test translations? | 20:54 |
| M4rtinK | race conditions FTW :) | 20:55 |
| M4rtinK | well, not really a race, but still funny :) | 20:55 |
| M4rtinK | export LANG=pt_BR or something ? :) | 20:56 |
| chem|st | M4rtinK: my windows XP did that when I activated hibernation the first time, as suspend is set to 15min and hibernation to 1h, it all for a sudden wakes up and hibernates... so I said to myself - good idea how does that work with my debian... | 20:56 |
| M4rtinK | could be a life-saver with a bad battery | 20:58 |
| M4rtinK | even better if it could trigger on battery level :) | 20:58 |
| chem|st | it is an rtc alarm+ timer, timer gets checked, if run out the system hibernates if not run out the timer gets reset | 21:00 |
| chem|st | and stopepd of course | 21:00 |
| chem|st | it is or at least wasn't as easy as it sounds, that rtcalarm needed to be stopped as well or funny stuff happens | 21:01 |
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| chem|st | so, question is, do we need rtcalarm or is there a way to tune the wakeup-service so that it sets a variable timer on each sleep cycle?! | 21:03 |
| Acce | M4rtinK: hmm.. I guess I should start lipstick with that environment? | 21:03 |
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| M4rtinK | M4rtinK: that might do it | 21:09 |
| M4rtinK | Acce: ^^^ | 21:09 |
| M4rtinK | also try to point xmlich02 once he shows up | 21:10 |
| Acce | doesn't seem to work.. I tried with localectl set-locale LANG="fi_FI.utf8" and killall lipstick | 21:10 |
| Acce | but nope | 21:10 |
| Acce | still english | 21:10 |
| M4rtinK | he is running the Czech translation project | 21:10 |
| Acce | maybe it needs a reboot? I guess localectl makes it permanent | 21:10 |
| Acce | ok, thanks | 21:10 |
| M4rtinK | no idea :) | 21:10 |
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