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| wspilot | anyone knows where to find documentation about silica signals? | 08:17 |
|---|---|---|
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| GentSir | wspilot, I personally looked at the example stuff in the SDK. I found it much more enlightening that reading English documentation. | 08:19 |
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| wspilot | finding all component mebers/signals: give component an id type idname plus "." and qtcreator will list them | 09:04 |
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| loz | hello | 11:50 |
| loz | does sailfish use x or wayland now? | 11:50 |
| Nicd- | afaik X | 11:50 |
| loz | is there any plans for wayland? | 11:51 |
| loz | are* | 11:51 |
| Nicd- | no idea | 11:51 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | well, Wayland is the future | 11:51 |
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| Nicd- | what's better in wayland? | 11:51 |
| loz | dont know, just wondering | 11:52 |
| loz | how updates will come to sailfish? will it be something like android, where a few companies support few devices for a few years? | 11:53 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | loz: no idea | 11:54 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | Nicd-: what's better ? better perfs :) | 11:54 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | simpler architecture | 11:54 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | etc. | 11:54 |
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| Nicd- | perfs as in performance? | 11:57 |
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| TheBootroo | what a shame, on every jolla phone video i can find, the only few apps we can see are : gallery, message, clock, notes, calendar.... what about music player ? email client ? web browser ? are they ready already? and i saw great FB integration but what about G+ ? i hope we get at least basic integration of it, unlike in N9.... | 12:05 |
| loz | TheBootroo: i saw media app, google better | 12:06 |
| Yaniel | I caught a glimpse of Jolla Store too... | 12:06 |
| TheBootroo | loz: yeah i saw video player in fullscreen mode so no tip about controls | 12:06 |
| TheBootroo | Yaniel: really ? | 12:06 |
| TheBootroo | Yaniel: pics or it didn't happened :-P | 12:06 |
| loz | and official support of android apps is ok for beginning | 12:07 |
| yunta | TheBootroo: iirc, we've shown musicplayer already on slush, last year | 12:07 |
| Nicd- | G+ integration is hard because G+ does not have a write API | 12:07 |
| loz | TheBootroo: controls? jolla has guestures | 12:07 |
| TheBootroo | yunta: i hope it has been enhanced cause i didn't liked it that much, big squares with not fitted text in it, too much WP-like IMHO | 12:07 |
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| loz | TheBootroo: new G+ is too much WP-like too, lol | 12:08 |
| loz | nobody cares | 12:08 |
| TheBootroo | loz: there are necessarely some controls like position seeker, etc | 12:08 |
| TheBootroo | loz: new G+ has really better aesthetics | 12:09 |
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| sledges | nemo-qml-plugin-social will enable integration. I hope there's workaround for g+ API, though diaspora should be piece of cake (who uses that ?...) | 12:10 |
| TheBootroo | sledges: why should we need a workaround ? | 12:10 |
| sledges | TheBootroo, 13:07 < Nicd-> G+ integration is hard because G+ does not have a write API | 12:10 |
| Yaniel | http://www.iltasanomat.fi/digi/art-1288566945106.html around 00:41, bottom right corner corner of the screen | 12:10 |
| loz | TheBootroo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpddtwIH-_g player at 2:34 | 12:11 |
| Nicd- | sledges: have you tried asking Google btw? surely they have a non-public API for their own software | 12:11 |
| sledges | on the same note Nicd- : how did harmattan (Nokia N9) stock facebook app did not ask to enable a fb app before you started using it? | 12:12 |
| sledges | most probably Nokia had agreement with FB | 12:12 |
| Nicd- | probably | 12:12 |
| sledges | so there will be one in order for sailfish<->g+ to work | 12:12 |
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| TheBootroo | sledges: G+ is more and more used now, and i'm deleting my FB account very soon, i need G+ (posts, albums, chat, events) | 12:13 |
| Nicd- | would be cool if google ported their G+ app to Sailfish :) | 12:13 |
| sledges | :) over their dead body | 12:13 |
| sledges | looking at how google is becoming evil by dropping xmpp support for gtalk... | 12:13 |
| Nicd- | it's on iOS already | 12:13 |
| sledges | i'd cal that 'standing on the shoulders of two giants' :)) | 12:15 |
| sledges | but surely, stay positive; fingers cross(compile)d :D | 12:15 |
| sledges | if they opened their api , community would prop up a g+ social plugin in no time.. | 12:16 |
| Nicd- | yeah | 12:16 |
| Nicd- | sadly they're being stupid a bout it | 12:16 |
| Nicd- | about* | 12:16 |
| sledges | i wonder if that's possible in somehow semi-open way (like api works only with sailfish -- 13:11 < Nicd-> sledges: have you tried asking Google btw? ...) | 12:16 |
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| TheBootroo | in one of the videos with chief designer, i think i heard jolla will post new videos of their progress weekly ! is that for real ? | 12:20 |
| loz | any point in installing nemo in n900? | 12:20 |
| TheBootroo | (and when will it start ? next week ?) | 12:20 |
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| ottulo | TheBootroo: they said "weekly updates" and mentioned videos, but after that said they might not be weekly but monthly instead, depending on the progress | 12:21 |
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| TheBootroo | ottulo: :-( | 12:22 |
| ottulo | so I wouldn't expect anything new until maybe 2-4 weeks from now at the earliest | 12:22 |
| TheBootroo | long waiting iznogood for heart/brain | 12:22 |
| ottulo | then again, I followed another company run a similar teaser/hype program before their product release | 12:22 |
| sledges | loz, it's still in alpha, but people use it. depends how jaded you are with maemo cssu (further discussion: #nemomobile pls ;) ) | 12:23 |
| ottulo | the closer we get to release, the more and more often they give out info :) | 12:23 |
| loz | do you plan that mobile manufacturers will make jolla devices? | 12:23 |
| loz | sledges: i have latest cssu installed) | 12:23 |
| loz | what for i would get n900 else | 12:24 |
| ottulo | loz: they've said ages ago that licensing the OS to use by other manufacturers is part of the business model | 12:24 |
| ottulo | so yes, there most probably will be other manufacturers' devices running Sailfish if it succeeds | 12:25 |
| loz | ottulo: im worry about updates support, wich is really pain with android | 12:26 |
| sledges | loz, doesn't cost anything to try nemo out | 12:26 |
| sledges | from sd card | 12:26 |
| loz | ottulo: and finally only goole updates theyr nexus properlu | 12:26 |
| sledges | know that it uses same mw as sailfish | 12:27 |
| loz | y* | 12:27 |
| loz | sledges: mw? | 12:27 |
| sledges | and perfect playground to develop system apps/social plugins/what not in the middleware layer whilst waiting for sailfish arm port | 12:27 |
| sledges | middleware | 12:27 |
| loz | hm, what middleware is there? i though its kernel -> X -> qt 5 ? | 12:28 |
| ottulo | loz: I don't know how they plan to push the updates, I remember hearing something about it in an interview but not much | 12:28 |
| ottulo | the idea I got was that the updates will be carrier independent, but I really am not sure | 12:28 |
| loz | hope they will really be | 12:29 |
| sledges | loz: kernel -> x -> qt4 -> qml - this is the UI path | 12:30 |
| loz | sledges: so what is middleware? | 12:30 |
| sledges | mw: kernel -> daemons(device state, power management)/messaging(dbus) | 12:30 |
| sledges | all the communication under the bonnet | 12:30 |
| sledges | between ui and hardware | 12:30 |
| loz | ok, got it | 12:30 |
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| sledges | scheduler to check your emails/social feeds, sw updates, media indexer, ... endless examples | 12:32 |
| loz | just demos i saw were a bit slow | 12:33 |
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| sledges | loz, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ga1dZ4vghY4 ? | 12:35 |
| sledges | latest | 12:35 |
| sledges | (sorry everyone else for the ongoing off-topic ;) ) | 12:35 |
| loz | sledges: i mean every app is starting for a long time, or its ok? | 12:36 |
| sledges | get the fastest sd card you can ;) | 12:37 |
| loz | hm, so on internal memory it will be nice? | 12:37 |
| sledges | haven't met anyone who tried to be that brave :) | 12:38 |
| loz | hehe, okey | 12:38 |
| sledges | app start time not overly optimised I think, so will feel a bit bottleneckish (i feel that on n9 or pandaboard) | 12:39 |
| sledges | but never been an issue personally | 12:39 |
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| loz | sledges: but sailfish is based on nemo, so realease should be soon, or not? | 12:42 |
| sledges | i thought they will release arm sailfish port together with sdk back in 2012 november slush event | 12:42 |
| sledges | but they didn't, I simply couldn't wait :D | 12:42 |
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| loz | sledges: is it possible to run android apps on nemo? | 13:03 |
| sledges | now not | 13:04 |
| sledges | but if someone adapted dalvik ;) | 13:04 |
| loz | but how sailfish runs them then? | 13:05 |
| sledges | is alien dalvik opensource? | 13:05 |
| sledges | loz, through ^ | 13:05 |
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| reindeernix | sledges, Dalvik is under Apache license | 13:09 |
| sledges | reindeernix, which means? (/me could never find "licencing explained in human language" tutorial :D) | 13:09 |
| loz | its open source, but what for alien dalvik is then? | 13:10 |
| reindeernix | sledges, It's free as in freedom and opensource :) | 13:10 |
| sledges | :D got ya | 13:10 |
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| sledges | loz, http://www.myriadgroup.com/device-solutions/device-software/myriad%20alien%20dalvik.aspx | 13:11 |
| loz | >no loss in performance | 13:13 |
| loz | dont they use a vm? | 13:13 |
| reindeernix | Dalvik engine is a VM | 13:14 |
| reindeernix | Or a part of it | 13:14 |
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| loz | so how can they say there is no loss in performance? | 13:14 |
| reindeernix | Well it has no loss in performance compared to Android | 13:14 |
| reindeernix | I think that's what they mean | 13:15 |
| reindeernix | Oh wait that's because it's compiled into bytecode or something | 13:15 |
| reindeernix | I think the Dalvik Engine runs the Java bytecode which is close to native performance or something | 13:16 |
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| sledges | those were early proof of concepts: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_URfbYOpx-s | 13:25 |
| sledges | http://pakesson.se/b/2011/05/paralleldroid/ | 13:25 |
| sledges | good old thanks to Stskeeps for digging those out | 13:26 |
| sledges | but i don't think that's anyhow related to what alien dalvik does | 13:27 |
| sledges | just a two year old effort sank in the sea unnoticed | 13:27 |
| sledges | maybe some ideas re-used.. | 13:28 |
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| Sfiet_Konstantin | sledges: o/ | 14:30 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | speaking of social, I'm hacking it right now, and ... | 14:30 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | Facebook API is a PIECE OF CRAP | 14:30 |
| Yaniel | why me no surprised | 14:30 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | :P | 14:31 |
| TheBootroo | Sfiet_Konstantin: agreed | 14:31 |
| * yunta is happy he doesn't have facebook account | 14:31 | |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | nobody should be surprised | 14:31 |
| TheBootroo | Sfiet_Konstantin: Facebook -[A-P-I]- is a PIECE OF CRAP | 14:31 |
| TheBootroo | ;-) | 14:31 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | fortunately I have that generator that basically do all the job for me, writing boilerplate C++ / Qt code | 14:32 |
| Yaniel | SWIG? | 14:32 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | Yaniel: nope | 14:34 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | a custom python script I wrote | 14:34 |
| Yaniel | ah | 14:34 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | specifically tuned for generating code for the Facebook API <> Nemo Social bridge | 14:35 |
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| sailfishos | hey guys | 16:04 |
| Yaniel | o.o | 16:04 |
| sledges | 8D | 16:05 |
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| nemomobile | hello sailfishos ! | 16:06 |
| nemomobile | :)) | 16:06 |
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| Sfiet_Konstantin | thanks sledges | 16:08 |
| sledges | Sfiet_Konstantin, ? :) | 16:08 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | to be named nemomobile :P | 16:09 |
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| Sfiet_Konstantin | damn | 16:09 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | french don't translate well | 16:09 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | "thank you someone" in french irony implies "thank you for wasting our time doing something useless" | 16:09 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | :( | 16:09 |
| sledges | sorry for doing something useless, it was more of an answer to our fellow sailfishos :)) | 16:10 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | ah | 16:10 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | :) | 16:10 |
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| locusf | are there any example projects (either community or Jolla) about networking? I'm trying to use QSslSocket, I can write but can't read responses from the socket | 17:49 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | locusf: http://www.qtcentre.org/threads/34620-QSslSocket-example | 17:52 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | or http://doc.qt.digia.com/4.7/network-securesocketclient.html ? | 17:52 |
| locusf | Sfiet_Konstantin: thanks! I'll see if thats enough | 17:53 |
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| eccoecco | Ciao | 17:58 |
| eccoecco | Caz | 17:59 |
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| wspilot | devl list is very silent last days... are they all still partying? | 18:00 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | wspilot: if there is no questions, there is no answers : | 18:00 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | ) | 18:00 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | :) | 18:00 |
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| wspilot | i posted quite a pile.. | 18:01 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | well, a lot of questions might not be able to be replide | 18:03 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | replied | 18:03 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | without proper hw | 18:03 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | (especially the sensors ones for example) | 18:03 |
| wspilot | thru, but i am working on opengl, c++<>qml | 18:05 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | yeah, I remember | 18:05 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | but i don't remember your questions | 18:05 |
| wspilot | have some solutions, but not sure if they are valid | 18:05 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | the problem is that if you want QML + OpenGL, it might be better to use Qt5 | 18:06 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | with their awesome scenegraph architecture | 18:06 |
| wspilot | maybe a topic for the wiki | 18:06 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | but Sailfish is not Qt 5 yet | 18:06 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | (at least, silica is not) | 18:06 |
| wspilot | so, i am not sure which way to go; lot of c++ /gui to change to qml | 18:07 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | I think (personnal opinion) that QML is easier to use | 18:08 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | but never used a lot of C++ / OpenGL code in my apps | 18:08 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | though | 18:08 |
| wspilot | i now have QGLWidget slammed on top of silica page. It works.., but is that stable? | 18:09 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | no, if they migrate to Qt5 | 18:09 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | otherwise, yes | 18:09 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | it is the "way to do that" in Qt4 it seems | 18:09 |
| wspilot | ok. | 18:11 |
| wspilot | Lot to change when Qt5 is used (that is: Qt5.02+, lower 5 won allow qml + QGLWiget) | 18:11 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | well, you might want to use QtQuick 2.0 | 18:12 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | (you can still do that in a widgets based app) | 18:12 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | (+qtquick1) | 18:12 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | but using QtQuick 2, and trying to get perf, you might need to create a QQuickItem that integrates with the scene graph | 18:12 |
| wspilot | sounds complex. think I'll stick to qtquick 1.1 + QGLWiget. | 18:14 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | wspilot: should not be that complex i think | 18:16 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | though i have no knowledge in Qt + OpenGL | 18:16 |
| locusf | hmm ssl errors | 18:16 |
| Yaniel | I'm interested in OpenGL on sailfish too | 18:17 |
| wspilot | the only widget is the qglwidget, rest is/will be qml | 18:17 |
| Yaniel | but fortunately I'm too busy to play around with it until the device is out :P | 18:17 |
| wspilot | my emulator has problems with opengl, possibly hardware-virtualbox issue | 18:19 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | wspilot: I think | 18:20 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | better develop it out of the emulator in desktop | 18:20 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | (develop only the silica specific code in emulator) | 18:20 |
| wspilot | it already works on desktop (as c++ widget program). Already asked for silica for desktop (for testing), but that is not available | 18:22 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | wspilot: yeah, not available | 18:23 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | then, I think the best is to wait | 18:23 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | (either device or better SDK) | 18:23 |
| wspilot | maybe best to stick to desktop with plain qml, replacing the latter later with silica (if not to much work...) | 18:25 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | wspilot: yeah, not a bad idea i guess | 18:25 |
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| afazekas | Where can I find the detailed specification of the https://join.jolla.com/en ? | 18:44 |
| Nicd- | there is no more info than that yet | 18:44 |
| afazekas | I am mostly interested in OTG, compass, (fast) GPS, Wifi | 18:49 |
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| HL_ | One dummy question. Is it possible to develop apps with pyside to sailfish and if so is there brief instructions how to get started? | 19:26 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | yes | 19:26 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | just like developing plain Qt apps in python with pyside | 19:26 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | just use the Silica components inside QML | 19:26 |
| HL_ | And the sailfish emulator understands python? | 19:28 |
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| locusf | the emulator does have python interpreter, so yes | 19:32 |
| reindeernix | locusf, Wait as standard? | 19:32 |
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| reindeernix | o: | 19:32 |
| locusf | but pyside. no idea | 19:32 |
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| locusf | reindeernix: ssh in and see for yourself | 19:32 |
| reindeernix | Hmm interesting | 19:33 |
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| locusf | and its another ball game to get it integrated to qt creator | 19:34 |
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| locusf | I'm actually developing a deluge client and I run python from qprocess to access rencode module | 19:35 |
| locusf | deluge == bittorrent software | 19:36 |
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| HL_ | Thanks for answers, seems that I have to begin practicing :) | 19:38 |
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| Sfiet_Konstantin | locusf: ping thomas perl (thp or thp4 on twitter) he is a sort of living god for everything related to PythonQt | 19:38 |
| locusf | Sfiet_Konstantin: ok, good to know | 19:39 |
| locusf | btw package request to SDK devs: python-devel | 19:40 |
| locusf | it would be much prettier for me to use python modules ISO qprocess call to python interpreter and then coding inline pythob | 19:41 |
| locusf | *n | 19:41 |
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| Sfiet_Konstantin | locusf: but I still don't understand, what's the problem with pyside right now ? | 20:05 |
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| locusf | Sfiet_Konstantin: nothing afaik :) | 20:42 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | locusf: :) | 20:42 |
| locusf | Sfiet_Konstantin: I mentioned that its probably not included in sailfish emulatpr | 20:43 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | locusf: it should be | 20:43 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | zypper is your friend | 20:43 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | zypper se side | 20:43 |
| locusf | ok | 20:43 |
| locusf | are the jolla repos open btw? | 20:43 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | what do you mean by "jolla repo" | 20:44 |
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| locusf | zypper repos | 20:44 |
| locusf | I'll check it out tomorrow | 20:45 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | well, the base is open | 20:45 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | "open" | 20:45 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | available | 20:45 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | like Mer / Nemo MW | 20:45 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | and also some HW adaptation | 20:45 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | but silica is not available from the repos | 20:46 |
| Sfiet_Konstantin | not is the Jolla plugin to mcompositor or the lipstick homescreen | 20:46 |
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| locusf | ok | 20:47 |
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