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| claudenw | anybody here work with mer-mtp? | 11:11 |
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| claudenw | hello? are there any humans here? | 11:32 |
| Bostik | probably enjoying the holidays | 11:34 |
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| claudenw | do you know if anyone is working with mer-mtp? | 11:36 |
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| Stskeeps | you mean buteo-mtp? | 11:36 |
| claudenw | I am trying to find configuration / startup info (right buteo-mtp) | 11:37 |
| claudenw | I think I have the buteo-mtp ported to the Rasp. Pi A. (I had to add a couple of includes and will submit those back as patches as soon as I am certain that it all works) | 11:39 |
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| claudenw | where can I go to get help with buteo-mtp? | 12:29 |
| aard_ | claudenw: mtp is mostly used as plugin in msyncd (which I guess you're not using on the pi). there should be a shell script in the source tree for starting up mtpd standalone | 12:38 |
| claudenw | THX | 12:40 |
| claudenw | the only script I can find is start-mtp.sh and it wants a /dev/mtp/ep0 device. Are there any docs for how to install the dev? | 12:44 |
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| aard_ | claudenw: it's functionfs, in case of mtp as buteo plugin it can get loaded/unloaded if functionfs becomes available, working with usb-moded. in standalone operation you need to make sure that functionfs is mounted before you start the mtp server | 12:47 |
| aard_ | the source tree contains a mount configuration for systemd | 12:49 |
| claudenw | To verify that I understand what is happening.... what I want to do is expose part of the pi file system over MTP on USB. If I load the functionfs then start MTP I should be able to do this correct? | 12:51 |
| aard_ | yes | 12:52 |
| claudenw | Would this be much easier if I were to install the complete mer image on the PI? | 12:52 |
| claudenw | I can only find the wayback machine instructions for doing that. | 12:53 |
| aard_ | never used mer on pi. assuming your kernel has functionfs, and you got mtp compiled already it shouldn't be hard | 12:54 |
| claudenw | does mer support fuse? | 12:55 |
| aard_ | not sure if it's in the core repos | 12:56 |
| claudenw | OK. I'm runnig ArchLinux on the pi so I think I'm ok wrt functionfs. This should keep me busy for a bit. thx | 12:57 |
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| Victor | hi | 16:17 |
| Victor | can anyone recommend a few references about how to get started understanding mer from a development point of view? | 16:17 |
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| r0kk3rz | Victor, from what perspective? | 16:27 |
| Victor | r0kk3rz: I want to play with it, understand it, and eventually modify it | 16:28 |
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| Victor | as I'm not yet sure how much of jolla/plasma mobile/nemo is actually covered by nemo and how much is covered by the UI, and I don't really understand where the lines are draw, is not yet clear to me how useful/not useful it is | 16:28 |
| Victor | :) | 16:28 |
| Victor | s/by nemo/by mer/ | 16:28 |
| Victor | I've see some architecture graphs in the wiki, which mostly seems to describe a normal linux environment with X11/wayland on top | 16:29 |
| r0kk3rz | Victor, mer is a core and so doesnt do UI | 16:29 |
| Victor | but as i said, I'm not exactly sure what does it provide | 16:30 |
| Victor | r0kk3rz: yep, that I understand, but as linux unlike windows or the BSDs doesn't have the concept of "core os" is not clear to me where the line is draw. To put an example: the HW drivers are clearly part of the OS, but is the window manager part of it? is the telephony stack part of it? and if I wanted to develop a UI, what does mer provide for me? | 16:31 |
| r0kk3rz | sure its hard to draw a concrete line | 16:32 |
| Victor | r0kk3rz: do you have any recommendation about how to start understanding what mer does, what it does provide and how to build and test images based on it? | 16:34 |
| r0kk3rz | essentially mer gets you a kernel, and a toolchain to build images based on what you want to include | 16:35 |
| Victor | or maybe to put it more specific: | 16:35 |
| Victor | if I had some given hardware and wanted to use mer to build something on top of it. How should i start? | 16:36 |
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| r0kk3rz | Victor, https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Image_Creation_For_Beginners | 16:41 |
| r0kk3rz | not sure how up to date that is | 16:41 |
| r0kk3rz | you'll want to have an instaled mersdk for that | 16:42 |
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| Victor | so normal steps for playing with mer would be to download a mer sdk, create an image and start it under virtualbox? | 16:43 |
| r0kk3rz | that would be a good start | 16:44 |
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| Victor | I'll try with that and follow with more specific questions afterwards about the different components, libraries, etc | 16:47 |
| Victor | thanks! | 16:47 |
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| r0kk3rz | Victor, https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Architecture | 16:55 |
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| Victor | that's the one I saw. The biggest problem is that this is mostly a standard linux environment | 17:00 |
| Victor | ie: I can't see much difference between a normal linux distro and mer according to those graphics | 17:00 |
| r0kk3rz | Victor, thats kinda the point really | 17:01 |
| Victor | r0kk3rz: so what's the value of mer? being it cross compiled for ARM? (no disrespect intended, just trying to understand it) | 17:02 |
| r0kk3rz | the toolchain and the patterns mostly | 17:02 |
| Victor | the patterns? | 17:02 |
| r0kk3rz | how you define what goes into an image | 17:03 |
| Victor | so oversimplifying it, one could say that mer is mostly something like a scripted linux from scratch that supports cross compiling to ARM and x86 architectures | 17:03 |
| Victor | would that be a reasonable simplification? | 17:04 |
| r0kk3rz | thats a fair description | 17:04 |
| Victor | and oversimplifying again, the device manufacturers/distro makers would just need to provide drivers for the given hw + a window manager and maybe some powerful libraries to ease development | 17:05 |
| Victor | is that correct? | 17:05 |
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| r0kk3rz | depends on the end product in mind, but yeah | 17:07 |
| r0kk3rz | hardware adaptation is the main thing | 17:07 |
| Victor | I see | 17:07 |
| Victor | nice, now I think I can understand digging into how things work and get a general idea of what's provided/not provided | 17:08 |
| r0kk3rz | wrt some of the not-provideds, thats where nemomobile comes in | 17:09 |
| r0kk3rz | providing a whole bunch of middlewares to create a mobile phone type device | 17:10 |
| Victor | seems that KDE mobile intends to achieve more or less the same thing and is also based in mer | 17:10 |
| Victor | is just not clear to me the differentiators between all of this projects. Ie: why jolla vs nemo vs kde mobile? | 17:11 |
| Victor | in the case of the last two versus the first one, you could say that OSS is a big selling point | 17:11 |
| r0kk3rz | plasma mobile isnt using mer at this point | 17:13 |
| r0kk3rz | they're using ubuntu touch as a base | 17:13 |
| r0kk3rz | nemo also doesnt have a full experience, but has packages that are useful for building a one | 17:14 |
| Victor | that's confusing. In the wiki of the mer project there are links to plasma mobile as a recommended end user package for testing mer | 17:14 |
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| r0kk3rz | Victor, it is confusing, they did release plasma active which was based on mer, but thats not the current stuff | 17:15 |
| Victor | I see | 17:15 |
| Victor | so at this point the main users of mer are jolla, tizen and nemo mobile? | 17:16 |
| r0kk3rz | not sure about tizen | 17:17 |
| Victor | I see | 17:18 |
| r0kk3rz | theres a bit of a stack with mer > nemo > sailfish | 17:20 |
| r0kk3rz | each one feeding the next | 17:20 |
| Victor | stupid question, but do you know why ubuntu mobile and kde active didn't decide to use mer? | 17:20 |
| Victor | s/ubuntu mobile/ubuntu touch/ | 17:21 |
| r0kk3rz | kdes partner blue systems have prior experience with ubuntu touch | 17:21 |
| r0kk3rz | and ubuntu are trying their best to become redhat | 17:22 |
| Victor | the second point seems to be easily fixable just by hiring current devs from mer and changing project directions | 17:23 |
| r0kk3rz | some of the community members here have been working towards getting the newer plasma mobile stuff onto mer | 17:23 |
| r0kk3rz | since all the building blocks are there afaik | 17:23 |
| Victor | I see | 17:23 |
| Victor | that sounds cool | 17:24 |
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| claudenw | how can I determine which linuxes have functionfs? | 17:29 |
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| Victor | r0kk3rz: do you know if there is any other place to fetch the mer source code than gitweb.merproject.org? (which seems to be down) | 17:37 |
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| r0kk3rz | Victor, git.merproject.org | 17:38 |
| Victor | awesome, thx! | 17:40 |
| Victor | do you know by chance how compatible is mer + libhybris with android HW for running nemo mobile? | 17:40 |
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| tbr | Victor: essentially the same as the sailfishOS HADK process | 17:42 |
| tbr | Victor: so looking at that PDF is a good start | 17:42 |
| Victor | I haven't heard about that, let me search for it | 17:43 |
| Victor | thx tbr ! | 17:43 |
| tbr | np | 17:44 |
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| Victor | closing for today. Have a good day and thanks for the help! | 18:27 |
| Victor | bye | 18:27 |
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| faenil | lbt: Stskeeps https://git.merproject.org/mer-core/zypper/merge_requests/4 | 21:45 |
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| faenil | fixed libsolv as well, and that should fix libzypp as a consequence | 21:54 |
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