#jollamobile log for Thursday, 2017-06-29

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caitlinbstill. no. blog.09:36
r0kk3rzcaitlinb: patience, the week isnt over yet09:39
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tadzikneither is June %)09:41
TMavicahttps://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/E5olAujy/Screenshot_20170625_001.png09:41
TMavicaAnyone have this problem ?09:42
TMavicaEver09:42
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MMoricaitlinb: yeah, they're really going to wait for the very last moment....10:05
LarstiQMMori: I'm fairly sure it's not people twiddling their thumbs till 5 minutes to July10:06
MMoriTMavica: nope10:06
MMoriLarstiQ: you sure about that? :D10:06
LarstiQMMori: fairly10:07
caitlinbThe thing is it’s going to be dissapointing, and if it’s not then I know i’ll get to it an hour too late and everything will have sold out and be 7 years on backorder10:07
inznot twiddling thumbs; they're laughin manically as we wither in agony10:08
caitlinbi nearly bought a one plus 5 impulsively just to take away the grinding agony of this10:08
MMoriLarstiQ: They're all by a pool drinking and eating strawberries while we're waiting to hear at least something ;)10:08
LarstiQMMori: I haven't had a strawberry in a while, nor a pool10:08
MMoricaitlinb: been there10:08
caitlinbalso, i will miss my jolla110:09
MMoriLarstiQ: You should, it's summer. :)10:09
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LarstiQMMori: public pool is closed, been rather cold lately10:10
Nicd-caitlinb: want to buy another one?10:10
LarstiQplus my vacation is weeks away10:10
Nicd-:P10:10
mornfalloh, the sony thing10:10
mornfallwell :)10:10
MMoriLarstiQ: That's dull. If it makes you feel any better my vacation isn't starting just yet either10:12
caitlinbprobably not, this one works ok10:12
MMoriI want a phone that can receive updates for apps and install new ones (play issues)10:14
mornfallMMori: you better get a play-equipped device then? :p10:14
MMorimornfall: starting to feel like that, yes10:15
mornfallreally, if you want google play, you should get google play10:15
MMoriI just happen to like the Sailfish OS10:16
mornfallit's never going to be supported on non-google phones10:16
MMoriWell it was working fine for years10:16
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MMoriuntil google changed the game10:16
mornfallyet it was never supported -- neither by sailfish nor by google10:16
MMoriyes that much I understand10:17
MMoriit doesn't change the fact that it was available though10:17
MMoriAnd it was a blast10:17
Nicd-the Moto Zs are pretty good phones :)10:18
MMoriNicd-: what makes Moto Zs good?10:18
Nicd-stock Android, good hardware, big battery (in the Play), mods like Jolla's OHs on steroids10:19
MMoriThen I must take a closer look, thanks :)10:20
Nicd-of course you have to sell your soul to Google unless you root10:22
MMoriNicd-: ;__;10:23
Nicd-that's how it is nowadays10:24
Nicd-I just installed W10 on my new PC and that was an annoying experience too. it wanted me to make an MS account so bad10:24
MMoriOne of the most frightning things nowdays10:25
MMoriGoogle, facebook, microsoft, they know us better than our family members10:26
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MMoriHow did we manage to stay alive 20 years ago I wonder.... ;)10:27
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r0kk3rzMMori: badly, obviously10:37
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MMorir0kk3rz: naturally! how else11:09
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r0kk3rzhttps://blog.jolla.com/sony-xperia-project-update/12:35
LarstiQ*twiddle*12:35
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r0kk3rzhmm, no real mention of distribution method12:39
caitlinbso it’s not coming preinstalled12:40
r0kk3rzlooks like12:40
r0kk3rznot too surprising, reselling xperia devices sounds like a terrible idea12:40
M4rtinKfrankly - quite a disappointment...12:40
LarstiQM4rtinK: which part?12:40
M4rtinKwould have expected more from half a year of work12:40
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r0kk3rzM4rtinK: have you tried porting a device before?12:41
LarstiQr0kk3rz: there is "so that we can start the delivery of the downloadable Sailfish OS to all of you"12:41
caitlinbI guess the fastest way to get to a running thing then is to buy an X and wait for someone to write a blog with some commands in it12:41
Jopewait for the blog first..12:42
caitlinbI waited long enough for *this* one :D12:42
r0kk3rzcaitlinb: the issue will be the AOSP image, which you're not supposed to distribute based upon Sonys license12:42
M4rtinKr0kk3rz: well, I still remember all those blog posts long ago about how a couple Jolla engineers can do a device port over night on a conference12:42
r0kk3rzotherwise flash AOSP > Flash SFOS > Done12:43
LarstiQM4rtinK: they can, given the right circumstances12:43
r0kk3rzM4rtinK: they can, but it will be super buggy12:43
r0kk3rzironing out bugs is non-deterministic, can take literally forever12:43
LarstiQand this device is a large jump12:43
LarstiQ64bit and android wise12:44
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malM4rtinK: basic port can be quite fast, getting everything working is another thing, especially since that was a 64-bit device, support for those is still maturing12:45
M4rtinKI guess the positive thing is that the blog post at least confirms flashing your own device will be supported12:45
r0kk3rzLarstiQ: no word on price?12:46
malbut a normal 32-bit qcom device can be done a few hours is you know what you are doing, with most features working12:46
mal*if12:46
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M4rtinKso people can start looking for cheap deals on the Xperia X12:46
LarstiQr0kk3rz: I'll ask12:47
M4rtinKso at least something12:48
M4rtinKbut I still think there should be an option to buy an Xperia with Sailfish OS already flashed12:49
M4rtinKno necessarily directly from Jolla12:49
r0kk3rzM4rtinK: someone from community can offer that service :P12:49
M4rtinKbut not all people are comfortable with flashing device firmwares12:49
M4rtinKthey just want to use Sailfish OS12:49
M4rtinKr0kk3rz: definitely12:49
M4rtinKbut warranty would have to be handled somehow - hopefully just with the original source of the devices12:50
M4rtinKstill, when speaking for myself, I do feel quite a disappointment12:52
M4rtinKI guess I was just expecting something more - something tangible once can actually use12:52
LarstiQr0kk3rz: decided closer to public launch12:52
M4rtinKeq. order a preflashed Xperia with Sailfish OS or at least grab an image & go buy an Xperia on Amazon for it12:53
M4rtinKI guess I would not mind some stuff not yet working in the port12:53
M4rtinKoh well12:53
LarstiQM4rtinK: would you be happy with a non-polished product?12:54
LarstiQor, how much "some stuff"12:54
r0kk3rzLarstiQ: still to be decided, ok12:54
M4rtinKmore frequent updates would likely alleviate such disappointment as less expectations & hype would build up12:54
* LarstiQ nods12:55
LarstiQM4rtinK: "expectation management"12:55
M4rtinKLarstiQ: I guess I would not mind that if its eventually fixed12:55
M4rtinKLarstiQ: & one can report bugs & they are fixed12:56
LarstiQM4rtinK: well, we don't know if there will be some unsurmountable problem yet12:56
LarstiQso, effort at eventually getting it fixed, but no guarantee12:56
M4rtinKthat sounds rather worrying12:56
LarstiQsomething about a Vietnam helicopter making music12:56
LarstiQM4rtinK: that's porting life12:57
M4rtinKI would expect rather some stability issues, some rough edges and possibly less important features missing at this point12:57
M4rtinKrather than not being sure some thing will work at all12:57
LarstiQdalvik12:58
LarstiQif you consider that less important, problem solved12:58
r0kk3rzmm dalvik with 64bit base, yeah that could be interesting12:58
LarstiQM4rtinK: it's most likely fine, but until it's done we don't know12:58
M4rtinKI guess I could live it not working at first12:58
M4rtinKbut it would be bad if it stayed that way12:59
LarstiQM4rtinK: then you'll have to wait a bit longer12:59
M4rtinKas I do have some android apps I want/need to use eventually12:59
mornfalli like the bit about arm64 being a challenge13:07
mornfallit's almost like jolla likes to inflict this on themselves, with the intel tablet and all13:08
malmost recent devices are 64-bit13:09
malat least anything not in the low end13:09
r0kk3rzmornfall: having an OS that can run on different arches is a good idea13:09
TMavicaHong Kong seem dont have single sim xperia x..all is dual13:10
LarstiQmornfall: it's becoming "no choice"13:10
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tadzikthe url to xperiax is ded13:48
tadzikhttps://www.sonymobile.com/global-en/products/phones/xperia-x/specifications/%2013:48
tadzik(on the blog post)13:48
phlixi_ohttps://www.sonymobile.com/global-en/products/phones/xperia-x/specifications/13:49
phlixi_ojust remove the %2013:49
phlixi_oits a url encoded space13:49
phlixi_ocommon paste error, my customers do that all the time :-)13:49
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tadzikah, right13:51
phlixi_othey do that usually when sending mails to their customers (bulk of course)  :-)13:53
phlixi_oJaymzz_ can you fix that?13:54
phlixi_oit probably should be fixeds13:54
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Jaymzz_phlixi_o: Done, thanks!13:57
merlin1991so whenever I open the browser it starts a download attempt for some pdf13:58
merlin1991and regardles if I canel it or leave it I get an entry in the transfer list (settings) about a canceled dl13:58
merlin1991and the next time I open the browser it repease13:59
merlin1991*repeats*13:59
merlin1991any Ideas how to get rid of this stuck download?13:59
phlixi_ohmm14:02
phlixi_oi would try to open an URL from barcode reader app.. in order to have something different then the pdf opened as first thing when started14:02
phlixi_omaybe that works14:02
phlixi_oof course does not have to be barcode qrcode reader, i guess could be anything, you get the idea14:03
phlixi_o...might work merlin199114:03
merlin1991nope it just opens and the dl trys again14:04
phlixi_o:(14:04
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louis_So today I went to a 2nd store. They had the Xperia X completely unused and still wrapped up at ~242€ with full warranty. Can't be found cheaper (as new) on ebay but I walked out without buying because I don't know if/when SFOS for it will be available for it fully functional. Don't know if that was a smart move.14:49
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louis_*2nd hand store14:49
^7heolouis_: it was a smart move.14:52
^7heolouis_: it was probably a refurbished one.14:53
^7heo242€ isn't that cheap for a refurb Xperia X14:53
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louis_^7heo: the salesman said it was new and the wrapper was still on incl. instructions on how to put sd card and sim card in. Prices are generically higher here in Denmark than rest of EU.15:11
^7heolouis_: well, I just got one, new, two weeks ago or so.15:13
^7heoMaybe 1 month.15:13
^7heoI had to return it; it wouldn't charge when turned on.15:13
LarstiQ^7heo: for how much?15:13
^7heo320 euros.15:13
louis_I'm really confused with all this. Don't know when a sfos image will be released, how well it'll function let alone this price of the image.15:16
caitlinbis the availability of the X in question then? are sailfish hoping to get people to move from an installed android base to sfos? rather than new sales explicity for sfos?15:17
^7heolouis_: that's why I'm waiting.15:17
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* attah orders an Xperia X16:44
mornfallisn't that a little premature?16:44
attahprobably :)16:44
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mornfallit'll probably take another 6 months before it is usable16:46
attahbut i'm betting that if the port doesn't arrive for the Xperia X it basically won't be available... so worst case i have a reasonable Android device for when mu JC craps out16:46
mornfalli'd definitely wait a bit to see if dual sim is going to be included or not16:47
attahAnd prices seem to be going back towards MSRP16:47
attahsure.. i personally just don't need that16:47
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mornfallalso, how much is SFOS going to cost? :P16:49
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attahi'll just sell my car xD16:50
mornfallseriously though... how much is half a tablet refund? the blog sort-of suggests that sfos for xperia is going to be in that ballpark16:52
attahthey were 200-odd €, right?16:52
mornfallcan't remember16:53
LarstiQmornfall: it doesn't suggest that16:53
LarstiQattah, mornfall: depends on when you pledged, and what perks you chose16:53
mornfallwell, I got the tablet in the end... but I vaguely recall it was closer to 100 than to 20016:54
LarstiQif you went for the Micro-distributor StarterKit it was $349916:55
LarstiQJolla Tablet for Early Sailors was $24916:55
attah239 for me it seems16:55
LarstiQJolla Tablet for First Sailors was $18916:56
mornfalldid anyone get that starterkit and is still waiting for a refund? that gotta hurt16:56
attahmaybe including case16:56
* LarstiQ doesn't immediately see them on https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/jolla-tablet-world-s-first-crowdsourced-tablet#/16:56
LarstiQmornfall: that I don't know16:56
LarstiQsome people also only paid $20 shipping and nothing else o . O16:56
attahI got the tablet.. so can't complain16:57
mornfallanyway, the blog mentions that sfos for xperia could be offered as an alternative for tablet refunds16:57
mornfallbut it's very vague about that16:57
mornfalland doesn't mention anything else that would suggest a price tag16:58
LarstiQmornfall: imo, that would only be partial16:58
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LarstiQbut that is on a personal note16:58
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mornfallit also doesn't mention whether preinstalled sfos xperias will ever be a thing (unless i missed that)16:59
phlixi_o[2017-06-29 18:47:10] <mornfall> i'd definitely wait a bit to see if dual sim is going to be included or not  <<- given jollas record for never negativly confirm anything that will never happen – always somthing like "we are thinking about it" instead of "no", you better do not bet much on the F5122, since this time jolla pretty clearly says "consider other models once F5121 is done16:59
LarstiQ(it doesn't make sense to say "1 xperia image clears all your tablet pledges, no matter if you pledged $20 or $3500")16:59
phlixi_owhich lcearly means "never"16:59
mornfallphlixi_o: well, I'd probably buy a new battery for jolla1 before considering xperia at this stage of the game17:00
mornfallphlixi_o: i can wait another 6 months and see where it goes :p17:00
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phlixi_oi think f5121 is coming pretty soon. i already baought one^^ i am confident i ll get an image for that sooth(tm)17:01
mornfallwell, good for you :P17:01
phlixi_oi bet there wont be an official image for neither x compact nor f5122 in 201717:01
phlixi_oprobably never17:02
phlixi_osoon*17:02
mornfallok, comments clarify that 'possibility of us selling the devices is very close to zero'17:02
phlixi_o...or XZ or whatever...17:02
phlixi_oyea, sure17:02
attahI'm open to hosing a "SFOS flashing party"17:02
phlixi_o: - )17:02
attah*hosting17:02
rubdosattah: I join!17:03
rubdoswhere?17:03
attah.se17:03
mornfall(and the comments suggest there will be a price tag, but no reply on what it is going to be)17:03
rubdosHeck, if I need an airplane ticket for it,why not.17:03
rubdosetter fly to .se than to not have a device?:/17:04
phlixi_ogn8^^17:04
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rubdos"The possibility of us selling the device is very close to zero."17:04
r0kk3rzrubdos: it wont be that hard to flash your own17:05
rubdosI don't like that.17:05
rubdosI wanted to support Jolla17:05
rubdosI 've waited to support Jolla17:05
rubdosI could have ought a Moto G5+, port SFOS myself... Imma gra a decent keyoard.17:06
TMavicaI wonder want know, can I use the image in dual sim edition...but I wont use dual sim17:07
mornfallrubdos: don't worry, you are going to pay for the image :p17:07
mornfallTMavica: apparently not17:07
rubdosmornfall: sure?17:07
mornfallTMavica: (and it's very uncertain if there will be a version for the dual sim phone)17:07
rubdosBecause then we're back in the "Microsoft tax" thing, just to have the same with Google17:08
r0kk3rzrubdos: if you want to send jolla some money, im sure they will take it17:08
rubdosas long as I get a phone for it :P17:08
TMavicaIn my city, it should only got dual sim edition..17:08
mornfallrubdos: sure, it's not mentioned in the post, but cleverly hidden in the comments :p17:08
rubdosAh okay17:08
rubdosThat's something, I suppose.17:08
rubdosAs long as it stays open, and it comes with support, I'll be fine I guess.17:09
mornfallcould be $10, could be $10017:09
rubdos"open" can be relative here17:09
rubdosas open as Jolla1 is a good start17:09
attahSFOS seems to have no issues with the fact that something is dual sim and there is obviously firmware for it.. so i'm guessing the "glue" is the hard part17:09
mornfallin other words, pretty closed :P17:09
rubdosYeh :/17:09
rubdossadly17:09
rubdosIt's getting hard to defend the choice of Jolla though.17:10
rubdosharder*17:10
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attahrubdos: i thought so too until i tried using an android device...17:11
attahthe ergonomics are horrible not to mention the bloatware...17:12
mornfallwell, looking at the xperia lineup17:16
mornfalli certainly wouldn't get the X :p17:16
mornfalli usually like sony design, but the X is meh17:16
rubdosAt this point it doesn't even matter to me anymore. Just give me a friggin phone with sailfish so I can actually call again :/17:16
mornfallrubdos: life sucks17:17
rubdossometimes17:17
rubdosSo... I'll be using my Nokia brick for a while then17:18
fomg-optimizeI was interested in the Intex Aqua Fish as an excellent way to try out Sailfish incl. the android support, but other things came in the way and now they cost pretty much over 200 USD everywhere :/17:22
fomg-optimizeWhat is the cheapest way to have fully functional Sailfish hardware. Used is very much fine with me?17:22
rubdosSomeone knows whether there's a SFOS 2 image for Galaxy S3?17:23
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louis_mornfall: I agree. The X is kinda meh. Would've preferred the XZ(s) instead.17:41
r0kk3rzrubdos: not working very well afaik17:42
frieseah, finally some news :) so the wait begins - should i buy an xperia or not; that is the question :)17:45
friesei already jumped the gun on the fp2 in hope there would be an official port (don't get me wrong, the inofficial port by mal is also very nice, but no android :-( )...17:47
friesexphumm, is 299€ a good price for xperia x? just as luck has it, a major supermarket in germany seems to have it in store :)17:48
sakustar_friese: no since finland has em for 299 :D17:49
friesewalking to the nearest store is a bit more convenient than flying to finland though (even if i should really visit again, what a beautiful country :) )17:50
sakustar_eh, i thought germany was supposed to have cheaper electronics17:51
friesethings tend to be cheaper here, but not so sure about electronics in particular...17:52
sakustar_guess it depends17:52
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sakustar_your power tools are ~50% cheaper than here (from amazon) ;)17:54
friesewell, at least there's something :)17:55
friesei once remembered going to mcdonalds and paying about double the price as germany. well, afterwards i discovered hesburger and stopped worrying ;)17:55
rubdosPretty sure there exists better junkfood than mcdo18:00
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malfriese: help would appreciated to get anbox working on fp218:03
sakustar_rubdos: ive heard we now have burgerking18:05
sakustar_aint seent one yet18:05
attahi paid €287, which i think was fair18:08
rubdoslocal fastfood is better, sakustar_ ;-)18:08
rubdoslocal Turk with kebab18:08
rubdosthose even have veggies!18:09
LarstiQI think I've been to a burger king in Helsinki, but I don't remember which one or where18:09
LarstiQeh, when18:09
rubdosSo, onto the real question: when should I buy the Xperia X?18:09
LarstiQrubdos: that's a personal decision18:09
sakustar_why cant the x compact be 300 too18:11
sakustar_:(18:11
r0kk3rzrubdos: before everyone else buys them all18:11
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rubdosLarstiQ: yes, true. But when will it be worth it?18:15
LarstiQrubdos: well, how happy are you with buying it speculatively?18:16
rubdosI'd buy, put it in a closet until I can have an image :P18:16
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LarstiQrubdos: that's a valid choice18:18
rubdoswhat if it's doa?18:18
rubdoswouldn't even know18:18
LarstiQrubdos: test the android18:19
rubdosI wouldn't know whether it works :P18:19
sakustar_what if the images come out at the same time as half life 3?18:22
tbrand duke nukem forever! ... oh... wait...18:24
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r0kk3rzit'll be finished after star citizen18:33
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rubdossakustar_: while I suppose they'd be there before HL3, still, waiting six months would be plain stupid imo.19:27
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cehtehmhm .. will SFOS be available for the new nokia phones? *eg*19:29
maldo those have possibility to flash custom roms, if yes then we need to wait for someone to port for example lineageos for those to be able to port sailfish19:31
cehtehhaving sfos on the nokias would be like a big "F**k you" sign :)19:33
Nicd-to whom? :P Nokia is only tangentially related, MS not at all19:33
cehtehwell the current owner only got the brand and isnt responsible for the mess19:33
cehtehyes19:33
cehtehi know19:33
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cehtehwell looks like the hardware and price is attractive, but i have to read some reviews19:34
rubdosstill; I'd rather have a Moto G5 :P19:35
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cehtehi brought my wife a moto x style last year, also nice19:37
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cehtehoh nokia6 sux in daylight, next one19:37
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rubdosmoto x is also nice. But does it run SFOS?19:46
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r0kk3rzi think someone was working on motox19:47
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malrubdos: depends on which moto x19:52
malmoto x play seems to have a sailfish port19:53
rubdoswaaaait19:54
rubdosseems to be a one-week-project19:56
rubdoshttps://forum.xda-developers.com/moto-x-play/orig-development/sailfishos-lux-t3606670/page11 mmm19:56
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rubdoshow bad of an idea would it be to buy a moto x, and try to fix the bugs myself? Ranging from bad (0) to end-of-the-universe (10) ?20:05
rubdos(I might want to put this in #sailfishos)20:05
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malnormally it shouldn't be too difficult but I might be the wrong person to tell that since I have done porting a long time and know pretty much everything20:09
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MarzannaHow do I enable word suggestion on Inoi R7?20:27
MarzannaI can't find it in Settings20:27
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r0kk3rzmaybe it hasnt got it20:33
r0kk3rzthats also proprietary20:34
malMarzanna: maybe coderus knows if that is available or not20:35
coderusMarzanna: no xt9 license here...20:36
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coderusso, make your own :)20:36
Marzanna😞20:37
coderusMarzanna: i thought you know where to get one :D20:37
Marzannawhat to get?20:37
coderusMarzanna: xt920:38
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Marzannacoderus, even if I add xt9 repo, I cant find xt9 packages21:14
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coderusMarzanna: how that is possible? :)21:27
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Marzannacoderus, dunno. pkcon search name xt9 gives zero result21:31
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Marzanna- xt9                    ... https://store-repository.jolla.com/features/2.1.021:36
Marzanna.11/xt9/armv7hl/21:36
Marzannasorry newline21:37
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